|
 Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
|
 MoneyAddyct
Picaro
Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 410
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
|
 First Time Grower--Should I Case? 
#3123821 - 09/11/04 09:05 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Hello. I've bought all the necessary items I need for the PF tek; it should be arriving shortly. This will be my first time growing. I've read that there are many benefits to casing rather than using the cakes alone. Since I've never grown before should I case or just use the cakes and case next time if I'm so inclined?
|
Spudz76
Got mycelium on the brain...
Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 391
Last seen: 14 years, 1 month
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3123844 - 09/11/04 09:10 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
If you do say 6 cakes, you could make a casing with half and do the other half as cakes. That way you get to experience more all at once. And if the casing goes wrong then you still have cakes going.
Many go directly to casing, but there are more variables to deal with then. And it's harder to see the life cycle of the whole thing so you may not learn as much.
|
MoneyAddyct
Picaro
Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 410
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: Spudz76]
#3123971 - 09/11/04 10:06 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
I bought 10 jars, so should I case five of them? Do I grow the cased "stuff" (don't know the proper term) in the same area that I'll be growing the cakes? (Most likely in a large plastic storage bin with perlite.)
|
Spudz76
Got mycelium on the brain...
Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 391
Last seen: 14 years, 1 month
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3124017 - 09/11/04 10:21 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Well if you somehow fail on the cleanliness/sterilization or you just have bad luck, you may lose a few of those 10 to contams in the incubation phase, or to any other issue (bad water content, mostly). Pretty much it's up to what size casing you make, it don't have to be in a 'turkey pan' or anything large it can be in a little container too just it helps if it has opaque sides (like aluminum pans). If you use something small you could make a 2 cake casing pretty easily, and learn how to get it right like that and then move up to larger pans by just scaling up. It helps some to keep track of how much water you use to wet the verm for the casing layer and other ingredients, like a recipe, since then it's easy to scale evenly and you spend less time fighting for the right water content, and such.
Yep if there's plenty of room then do it. Note the cakes need about 3 inches of space on all sides so the growth doesn't all run into eachother (crowding), and in case you have heavy ones or ones that otherwise feel like growing more sideways than up - but they do need a little space to come outward before they curve upward (look in pics section or the grow logs forum if you have trouble visualizing it, plenty of fruiting cake pics). Casings don't grow out the sides and so mostly things can only go up. so they can be edge-to-edge with eachother. Though you need to have enough perlite uncovered to allow for evaporation to the air or you could have low humidity problems (but then you can spray the walls or other workarounds for that).
|
MoneyAddyct
Picaro
Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 410
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: Spudz76]
#3124040 - 09/11/04 10:27 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Ok..Another quick question: As far as my plastic bin is concerned, I know I need to cut a hole in it to allow for light to come through. What's the best way to cover the hole--with saran wrap, glass, etc? Does the screen need to have holes in it? Do there need to be any holes in the plastic bin period? THANKS AGAIN.
|
Spudz76
Got mycelium on the brain...
Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 391
Last seen: 14 years, 1 month
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3124152 - 09/11/04 10:50 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
You can either make a window for light (and for peeking in on things without having to open it) or you can put lights inside on the lid, like LEDs work good for that. You don't need much light and it shouldn't be real strong light at that.
A window would be like a chunk of plexiglass and you can hot glue it or just use whatever other kind of glue you think would work. Or just lay it on the outside since gravity will hold it there, but it makes for slightly more annoyance if you need to take the lid off to fan or spray or inspect or... But plexiglass is best. You could get away with saran wrap too if you tape it on securely.
Screen? You mean the window? You confused me there.
The only other holes which might be beneficial would be "CO2 drain" holes on the sides of the bin as low as you can put them without of course having issues with water leaking out, stuffed with Polyfil or covered with a filter disc (to keep contams out as much as possible). It doesn't need a big hole, maybe two half-inch ones, one on each side. And it's not even necessary unless you're going for a fanningless (low interaction) setup. For example the poor man's pod (PMP), can benefit from these. And even then you probably don't need it.
|
MoneyAddyct
Picaro
Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 410
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: Spudz76]
#3124180 - 09/11/04 10:54 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Ok. Sorry about all the questions, just a few more. In order to case I read that you need to either crumble the cake or leave it whole, but cover it in a wet layer of vermiculite. I'll be putting these casings in with my cakes, which sit on a layer of perlite. So, basically, am I correct in saying that the vermiculite-covered casings are sitting on perlite as well? (Or on a jar lid, etc)
And yes, by screen I meant window. Thanks a lot.
Also, is there a special way I need to prepare my plastic fruiting bin as far as sterilization is concerned? I dont assume I could just buy it and go right ahead and place the cakes/casings in it without somehow sterilizing it first.
Edited by MoneyAddyct (09/11/04 10:59 PM)
|
McKennaFan
I like loudsilences
Registered: 06/30/04
Posts: 113
Last seen: 19 years, 7 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3124280 - 09/11/04 11:12 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
My friend for his first time just used a casting for dummies tek, you dont need the perlite, just used a bottom layer of verm inch inch and a half thick, moist not wet, if you pick up a handful and squeeze just a bit of water should drip out, then ad your cakes, crumble them up so the peices are about a inch or so in diameter then put on you final layer of verm about 1/4 to 1/2 inch thick. make sure your substrate layer and casting layer are very even and level. and thats it its good for beginers it will give you an idea of what to look for and what to work with, the real trick is getting a even level layer. GL and if you want to see the tek for your self, just look under the casing section under advance techniqes 
--------------------
Anything I might post on this site is fictional, the only knowledge I have is from reading post's on this site. I do not conduct any illegal activites whatsoever in any way.
|
MoneyAddyct
Picaro
Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 410
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: McKennaFan]
#3124311 - 09/11/04 11:20 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Ok. But I'll be putting the casings in with the regular cakes. Do those need to be on top of perlite or can I use only vermiculite and not perlite at all for the entire bottom of the storage bin? Also, how can I sterilize the storage bin (if needed)?
|
holio1
intense
Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 311
Loc: toronto son
Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3124343 - 09/11/04 11:27 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
OK this will probably be a long post seems like you need a good deal of simple info.
sorry for any typos but I am pretty fucked up right now.
First of all here is a picture of a small casing (probably a couple 1/2 pints)
It is outside of terrarium (where you keep your cakes and casings and such while fruiting) and probably is in some sort of larger air tight container (possibly with perlite on the bottom) and something providing light to it.
The 'stuff', crumbled cakes if taking from PF jars, goes in a container and then are cased with a layer or something (verm,coir,ect) usually about one quarter the depth of the layer of mycelium. This layer is there to provide extra moisture to the fungus and should not be colonized.
Do need use a screen or screen window completely unneeded. Make sure you window is air tight or close whatever it is. In my grow there were no other holes in my larger bin, and the light was inside. I opened it to mist and fan only.
For my first and only time growing I made 12 PF jars and they are had no contams, cased them all in one big casing with vermiculite and got 700g fresh off the first flush. The 'stuff' that is cased (mycelium, from the finished jars) was a layer about 2" thick in my grow and hte casing layer was 1/2" or so.
Personally I think you should do more research before you get going; know should shit. You can read my log (search in my posts for growlog or something) for an outline of what I did, as I didn't really use one specific tek (technique FYI). I would do one big casing if you decide to, it wont be very large with the number of jars you have.
Sorry if I don't make much sense in there, I don't feel like reading over it now, mabye I'll edit non-sensical shit tomorrow but I thinks it's pretty good. Hope this helps good luck
|
Spudz76
Got mycelium on the brain...
Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 391
Last seen: 14 years, 1 month
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3124420 - 09/11/04 11:46 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Uhh, you could probably just go read random posts or the things under "Mushroom Info" menu above more and find answers to all this, but I'm bored enough to keep answering them. It's like a quiz or something.  You will learn more by reading more, even if it seems unrelated - if you have the time, which you should.
Yeah you're right about the different types of casings, though the tray ones (crumble and set up in a flat layers, possibly mixed with more stuff like straw or dung, and reincubate for days or a week to get the layer to recover into a nice solid single piece again) are the only ones I call a casing. The "dunk and roll" and "double-ended casing" methods are simply modified cake methods which try to gain the advantages of a tray casing. You should do a dunk and roll or double ended always, with cakes. yeah the jar lid works pretty well but you can also use aluminum foil folded in half to make squares which the cakes will sit on. Tray casings obviously are in a tray already so those go directly on the perlite. There needs not be (and generally should not be) any direct contact between the substrate/mycelium/verm and the perlite. And the metal lids can and do rust eventually so it's better to leave them out and use aluminum foil.
For the bin prep, just spray it down with Lysol until every surface inside (including the inside of the lid) is wet and then let it dry or wipe it out with paper towels. Or use a similar disinfectant cleaner like that you can put on a paper towel and wipe it out with it, like alcohol or bleach solution (NOT full strength bleach if you like your skin and lungs), and similarly let it dry. Lysol is easier and safer. And add a bit of H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) to the water you put in with the perlite, it helps keep bacteria away. And go the extra step and use the poor man's pod plans, with airstones and stuff. It's lots easier to deal with and once it's tuned right it can be pretty much unattended besides for watching for contams (no fanning/spraying all the time, etc).
|
MoneyAddyct
Picaro
Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 410
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: Spudz76]
#3124483 - 09/12/04 12:05 AM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Awesome. THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR THE INFO. Where can I find the plans for the poor man's pod with airstones, etc?
One last question..I promise. What about the utensils I use for mixing the substrate and verm (ie, the spoon, bowl, meas. cups, etc), how do I sterilize them (if needed.)?
Edited by MoneyAddyct (09/12/04 12:44 AM)
|
hawksapprentice
Yearns to Snowboard
Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 3,195
Loc: Oregon
Last seen: 10 months, 21 days
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3125032 - 09/12/04 02:39 AM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Hey for your windoe on the terrarium. If you go down to home depot you can get plexi glass thats pretty cheap. And they'll cut it to size.
For your utensils. Are you getting a pressure cooker? You dont need them to be sterile to mix them together in the beginning. Once they are mixed you sterilize the casing material. Sterlize a spoon along with this so you can scoop it out of what ever container your using.
--------------------
"I celebrate the Earth, my home, my mother, my grave, and as long as men are Man they must, if they would preserve the integrated being, do the same---[and preserve]--this rank casual hungry smelly sweaty lusting transitory body, my oozy pulpy liquid-bag-swollen body, bones, blood, hair glands, my bejeweled sex; I love and celebrate it all. never to let men forget that they are animals as much as gods---that is one thing I shall say."
Edward Abbey
Edited by hawksapprentice (09/12/04 02:41 AM)
|
Spudz76
Got mycelium on the brain...
Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 391
Last seen: 14 years, 1 month
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3125055 - 09/12/04 02:51 AM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
PMP plans are here and could be found using the black menubar above (Mushroom Info->Growing Mushrooms->Advanced Techniques->Terrariums). The link to the thread is on that page, and you should read that entire 20 page thread also (yeah 20 pages is a pain but there is lots of good info and clarifications in there which answer pretty much all questions you might have after reading just the tek itself).
|
 fastfred
Old Hand
Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3125108 - 09/12/04 03:27 AM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
MoneyAddyct said:
One last question..I promise. What about the utensils I use for mixing the substrate and verm (ie, the spoon, bowl, meas. cups, etc), how do I sterilize them (if needed.)?
It's a good idea to have some sterile utensils on hand. You don't need them until after your substrate is sterilized because it is nonsterile to start with.
Simply wrap your utensils in some tinfoil and then put them on top of your jars when you run your PC. If you aren't running jars with them then you only need to PC for 15-20 minutes.
-FF
|
MoneyAddyct
Picaro
Registered: 09/10/04
Posts: 410
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: fastfred]
#3125998 - 09/12/04 01:10 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
The jars I bought are semi-sterilized so as far as I know all I have to do is steam/boil them for an hour or so.
|
holio1
intense
Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 311
Loc: toronto son
Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
|
Re: First Time Grower--Should I Case? [Re: MoneyAddyct]
#3126894 - 09/12/04 07:26 PM (19 years, 7 months ago) |
|
|
There is no such thing as semi-sterilized. Something is either sterile or not.
They may have been cleaned and wraped, but this is not sterile.
But yes, with the PF tek all you need to do is steam/boil whatever for a bit. Note that you boil the jars once you have put the substrate materials and such inside, not before.
|
|
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Edit 
Reply 
LilMerlin
homebrew
upupup
1 2 all )
angryshroom
whyIdied