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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: TinTree]
    #3121549 - 09/11/04 09:33 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Once again from the wisdom of Frank:

The Mystery Man came over
And he said: "I'm outa-site!"
He said, for a nominal service charge,
I could reach nirvana tonight
If I was ready, willing and able
To pay him his regular fee
He would drop all the rest of his pressing affairs
And devote His Attention to me
But I said . . .
Look here brother,
Who you jivin' with that Cosmik Debris?
(Now who you jivin' with that Cosmik Debris?)
Look here brother,
Don't you waste your time on me

The Mystery Man got nervous
And he fidget around a bit
He reached in the pocket of his Mystery Robe
And he whipped out a shaving kit
Now, I thought it was a razor
And a can of foaming goo
But he told me right then when the top popped open
There was nothin his box won't do
With the oil of Aphrodite
And the dust of the Grand Wazoo
He said:
"You might not believe this, little fella, but it'll cure your Asthma too!"
And I said . . .
Look here brother,
Who you jivin' with that Cosmik Debris?
(Now what kind of a guru are you anyway?)
Look here brother,
Don't you waste your time on me
Don't waste yer time . . .

I've got troubles of my own, I said
And you can't help me out
So take your meditations and your preparations
And ram it up yer snout
"BUT I GOT A CRYSTAL BALL!", he said
And held it to the light
So I snatched it
All away from him
And I showed him how to do it right
I wrapped a newspaper around my head
So I'd look like I was Deep
I said some Mumbo Jumbo then
I told him he was goin' to sleep
I robbed his rings
And pocket watch
And everything else I found
I had that sucker hypnotized
He couldn't even make a sound
I proceeded to tell him his future then
As long as he was hanging around,
I said
"The price of meat has just gone up
An' yer ol' lady has just gone down . . . "
Look here brother,
Who you jivin' with that Cosmik Debris?
(Now is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho?)
Don't you know,
You could make more money as a butcher,
So don't you waste your time on me
(Don't waste it, don't waste your time on me


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: Swami]
    #3121856 - 09/11/04 12:33 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Modern Disicple: *Proposes a baseless and inconsistent hypothesis.*

Modern Master: *Deconstructs statements.*

Modern Audience: "Oooh, how abusive and uncaring the Master is!"






Shroomery n00b:  *posts rather essential question*

Shroomery veteran:  *lays it all down into waves of insight*

Shroomery audience: *completely disregards Shroomery veteran and together with n00b they swarm around and suck up to the one that had zip to contribute but happens to have won the popularity contest*


I find that on the Internet, even right here on the forums almost nobody wants to have their horizons expanded. The majority of response posts that hold content either want to see confirmed or acknowledged what they want to see, tell others why the other is -wrong- and genuine attempts at helping somebody often get disregarded by the one with the problem.
Some threads are jacked by the majority of posters sucking up to a popular shroomerite no matter what the degree of quality he contributed to that thread.

In a society where "everybody can be a Master" (which is true) we end up with everybody thinking they already ARE a Master and you end up with a bitching contest of Egos.

Swami: you in your Swami Swami Challenge thread offered to follow a three month regimen posted to you for spiritual growth. Even though we might disagree on some spiritual matters that was one of the extremely rare instances where someone offered their apprenticeship here on the Spirituality forum.
Everybody wants to lead and nobody wants to follow.

Just like one in fifty people qualifies as a  Genius one in fifty or so is a Master. I, for one, am one :smile: The Shroomery is swarming with Masters of all kinds, easily a dozen, but quality is ignored. People just see what they want to see, enhance their beliefs and crack down hard on anyone who remotely reeks of an authority figure.

I am serious in regard to Spacedragon's thread's claim because I believe that there actually are genuine Messiah's out there in the world, but that they're just shoveled under and leave it like that.
If the Second Coming of Christ happened, and if no sparks of miracle flew around, no established Christian Church would embrace their true Messiah. And if sparks flew all the Churches would shout in unison that it was all done with smoke and mirrors.

Spacedragon, regardless of the content of his own postings was vigorously and rudely persecuted and treated with hostile aggression like he was the confidence artist that had fucked everybody over in their private lives. He may be wrong or right in claiming his high quality as future world leader, but far more posts were actually whipping him through his thread, or sarcastically poking him for more ammo, then there were sincere respectful attempts to find out the truth.

Many Shroomerites want a cheap snortable Guru to fill a boring saturday-night and if things get spiritual they chew a Klonopin. :frown:


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OfflineUnderTheRose
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: Asante]
    #3121981 - 09/11/04 01:11 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

You consider yourself a master?
Of what / whom are you a master?
What makes you different from non-masters?
What are your special characteristics / abilities?


I?d be (obviously) interested in your answers.

To what you have to say about the majority of forum users i agree with you.
Most are not at all willing to even accept the possibility of something which contradicts the mundane worldview.

I have to say so, that Spacedragons postings about him being the future worldleader are truely impossible to take serious.
Either he speaks the truth or is just a 14 year old having a great time. Come on, the coming savior of the world has nothing better to do than argue about his coming on the shroomery?

Besides, imho a literal savior in flesh&blood never was nor will be.


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: UnderTheRose]
    #3122134 - 09/11/04 01:57 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Damn there goes the popularity contest :grin:

My main mastery is that of voluntary consciousness-shifting.
I can plunge myself into full (somnabulistic) hypnotic trance within 30 sec and emerge at will. I can awake in my dream and go exploring. I can bring myself in a state of Rapture where I am smitten by Ecstasy (not the drug), leave my body behind and enter a visionary realm between the worlds, to return at will.

If one is a Master in the spiritual sense it usually boils down to being able to bring about and control a given state as well as being able to transfer it onto another, ie. teach somebody.

If I teach someone, a friend, they remain their own Masters, but I take responsibility over them so they won't meditate for twenty years to one time get the feeling of an Ecstasy tablet and be bitter ever after, as happens in the East as well.

I can do all that. Didn't read no book, I aquired this ability myself. And thats how it should be. Either a friend you esteem teaches you or you develop the trait from within.
In my view you shouldn't adhere to traditions but first drastically shed all traditions and then build new meaning for yourself.
Build your own house and it won't be haunted  :evil:


What makes me different is a ton of things that have nothing to do with spirituality but rather hardcore traumatic childhood, a supercharged brain I have to slow with major tranquilizers and some run-ins with real biological Death lately.
"Different" isnt always pleasant.

The differing part is that I am very serious even when I am wild with joy. Spirituality for me is a real thing and one of my prime motivators, but it is joyous (hedonistic) not solemn and self-denying. There is a gene in my family for being a rigid hard c*nt and I inherited that so i can be very obnoxious sometimes and come across aloof or dismissing when really intend no such thing.

Really: I'm just another guy, a bit clumsy and oafy-looking, and I happen to be a parking lot shaman too.

As to Spacedragon: theres no reason to generically assault him as is done throughout that thread. If he is wrong, thats bad luck for us all. He might also be on to something bigger then him (akin to Tetsuo in the "Akira" anime movie) which can lead to a breakthrough of the caterpillar-->butterfly kind.
He might in fact not be at the keyboard at all but accessing the Internet mentally while doing twenty other things to balance out the world. Or he might have popped a ball baring and the wheel of his mind screeches and sparks and thats too sad to have him chewed out by an entire community, no?

Science says there are Messiahs! If one in five is special, one in five hundred remarkable, one in five-hundred thousand utterly special.. Isnt it likely that one in five billion has such an odd life (even by mathematical coincidence) that so many things remarkably happen in his favor during his life that he does appear to spread miracle and wonder where-ever he goes?
So statistically there must be miraculous Messiahs :evil:


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: Asante]
    #3122159 - 09/11/04 02:02 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

"My main mastery is that of voluntary consciousness-shifting."
Yeah I have mastered that too...every night when I sleep my conciousness shifts. Tell us your wisdom Oh Master...


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3122263 - 09/11/04 02:32 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

*yawns*

My words really have no chance in Hell to bypass your pre-formed opinion of me, do they?


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: Asante]
    #3122691 - 09/11/04 04:52 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

really it is not about collecting kudos or qualifications is it? you may recognize a friend - the whole peek a boo thing really can get too serious


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3122974 - 09/11/04 06:41 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

really it is not about collecting kudos or qualifications is it? you may recognize a friend - the whole peek a boo thing really can get too serious




Saying with confidence you are good at something throughout western cultures often is regarded as blunt or rude.
It's really a shame: its with postings as it is with buying wooden furniture: people lose insight into quality and may end up with a bad buy.

Your typically psychologically sound Tribe has got some 40-60 members which includes a shaman/master/spiritual guide and healer. It is good to be humble but many put those on such a high pedistal that they lower themselves and prevent their true colors from ever showing because they chronically unworthy.
If you do something you can either succeed gloriously or fail miserably. If you "more or less do something" you get "more or less results".

If I were out to get credits or acknowledgements it would've been a dumb move to go out and violate a taboo that demands modesty.
I did that (and risked my neck) to add to the discussion in a clear manner, a differing view to help it along.
And "parking lot shaman" does not sound holier-then-thou, does it? :wink:

When i signed up for a yoga course the Master did not nearly look as a Master is expected to. He was very down to earth. But the yoga course regulars who joined absolutely treated him like shit. They didn't think they themselves amounted to much and they treated him like one of them.

Yoga was a social gathering for them. Because I from the start behaved like a proper student to a Master, showing due respect, I immediately became target to their digs (that went in all direction, but also interrupted him)

Now he was a true Master. Yoga was in his body and soul. But he was the permissive Ned Flanders type of Master and this prevented him from elevating his students to their potential.
I had a great talk with him, student to Master, but told the group atmosphere was unpleasant to me and we parted.
He had all the qualities but his western upbringing had scrubbed every "Now listen up!" from his character.

A bitchslap as Swami suggested would be one thing, but there needs to be a degree of Great Ape dominance display along with the Spirituality to impose respect on your fellow monkies if you are to help them, just like a school teacher, the best of whom are Masters of Knowledge, and fopr instance Science is one of the Magicks too.

Holier-then-thou types have all the right stuff, the gemstone for every occasion, an incantation for a big toe itch and very strict rules as to how things should be done.
To each their own but for me it would feel itchy to have to get everything "just right"

Mother Nature is at the heart of my Spirituality, but when the situation called for it I once cast a circle on a deserted parking lot using a can of spraypaint I found in the bushes :grin:
Spirituality is timeless and of all times and that includes the 21th century urban jungles :heart:


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: Asante]
    #3125294 - 09/12/04 08:58 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

on the path you meet many teachers
you may even forget some of the best.
some of them may not even be human beings
but situations, or your own echo or progress.
a teacher that really matters is connected to
everything else as well.

sounds like you did not feel too much respect for
the soft yoga master and his lazy coven.

the student and the master are equals, you can find out which thing you have entered by observing either the teacher or the students.

As progress is made you will probably find more satisfaction from the population you are immersing in.

The same thing goes for materialism as for spiritual progress, a social element is in both. one has more pretense and the other more naturalness. One hides the inner the other exposes it.


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3125361 - 09/12/04 10:07 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

I respected the yoga teacher to a high degree. His students of this particular one of his groups however did not seek spirituality but merely recreation. He got interrupted many times and clearly did not like that as it hindered his getting the message across.

Most group communication was lacking in respect in all directions.

He had much to give but their attitude reduced his efforts to provinding a recreational excersize with a deeper message.

I observed the Teacher: he had great skill.
I observed the Students: thew wanted little more then cheap gymnastics.
The Teacher bore this one group of his like a cross, but he did it with dignity and provided what they could handle: a toned-down shallowed version of the wisdom he could bestow onto them.
He let it be like it was but how it was was not for me.

In school terms: there should be respect for the Teacher and a willingness to study and be tought. The student sits at the feet of the Teacher and not on top of him. In school terms the paper airplanes and paper balls flew across the room and the teacher was ridiculed behind his back and because I was the new kid who wanted to actually learn instead of "hang out" i was elected nerd.

Great as the Teacher might have been in his yoga: the behavior of the class was detrimental to my personal growth. Had they been lazy or ignorant I could've synergized to stimulate their awakening unnoticed in the background but they were actively sabotaging thing and not caring and that would've been detrimental to my growth as well as caused more unbalance in that group.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: Asante]
    #3125822 - 09/12/04 01:49 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

well good luck finding something more suitable for your quest.
one can only worry so much about the teacher who cannot share his discipline


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Invisiblebandaid
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Re: Ancient Master / Modern Master [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3128776 - 09/13/04 10:34 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

hey swami, just curiouse as to the image your trying to give off, if your trying to help ppl out why do you ignore my PMs regarding my questions?, is it because you dont have an audience to watch you disassemble a post its not worth responding to?

your the only person on this board whos ignored my questions, funny how that works out huh


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