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OfflineNorthernsoul
Your Reality

Registered: 11/17/01
Posts: 2,290
Loc: Inner Eye
Last seen: 5 years, 11 months
Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time.
    #3074934 - 08/31/04 07:07 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Its only been 60 years since the bombs been discovered, thats not very long ago and so far its gotten pretty bad. It would almost sound about right if we were to look back in history 1000 years from now and saw:" It was another 100 years untill the bomb was used again."

This scares me that in such a short period of time, we have had such a problem and so many close calls. Its just a matter of time untill something happens and that scares me.

Its like, do we wait untill N.Korea makes the first move, or move in and have them make the second move? Either way, some nuclear weapons will probably be used by N.Korea. Why just wait? Either way, millions of people are going to die in another war sooner or later.

Ah well, what can you do but pointlesly debate on shroomery about it :smirk:


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--------------------------------------------------------------

When it comes
I'll know, I know
Just take my clothes and leave
And I'll be gone




Edited by Northernsoul (08/31/04 07:09 PM)


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OfflineBleaK
paradox
Registered: 06/24/02
Posts: 1,583
Last seen: 3 years, 4 hours
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3075161 - 08/31/04 08:10 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Northernsoul said:
Its like, do we wait untill N.Korea makes the first move, or move in and have them make the second move? Either way, some nuclear weapons will probably be used by N.Korea. Why just wait? Either way, millions of people are going to die in another war sooner or later.

Ah well, what can you do but pointlesly debate on shroomery about it :smirk:




or we could leave Korea the fuck alone, and hope they do the same for us.

alll day long, on the news, from peoples mouths.

they talk about the dangers in the world.
NEVER, do they adress the causes.

people dont setoff nukes for no reason. OR BUILD THE FOR THAT MATTER, without a reason.


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"You cannot trust in law, unless you can trust in people. If you can trust in people, you don't need law." -J. Mumma


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Offlinewrong
Stranger
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 1,219
Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3075256 - 08/31/04 08:36 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

im not convinced north korea would make the first move without provocation
what makes you think they will inevitably use nuclear weapons at some point


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3075276 - 08/31/04 08:42 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

You can always dig a bomb shelter and live out the rest of your life without fear. Me, I don't live life looking around corners and worrying about what some radical country will do to the US. I accept the fact that there are people out there, radical and some not so radical muslims and other terrorists that hate me for who I am and what I believe. Rational thinkers would call that racism and many on the left close their eyes to it.

Quote:

Its like, do we wait untill N.Korea makes the first move, or move in and have them make the second move?




Why not let those countries that are next to them worry about it? It seems the world doesn't want preemptive attacks by the US and I'm all for that concerning Korea and other countries that don't directly affect the United States (as sorry as that sounds)


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America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 6 months, 5 days
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3075322 - 08/31/04 08:58 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I suspect that the Chicoms are more than happy to let the Kim with nukes problem ferment while the real prize for them is Taiwan. I suspect there is a real confrontation looming over that and if the Chinese can use Kim as a chip it will be much to their advantage.


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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #3075388 - 08/31/04 09:33 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

It's your government they hate.


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OfflineMushmonkey
shiftlesslayabout
 User Gallery

Registered: 09/26/03
Posts: 10,378
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Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Zahid]
    #3075623 - 08/31/04 11:07 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Really doubt the North Koreans would preemptively strike America

They know we're not going to strike first.. and they're not engaged in a crusade against our existance like the jihadist jerkwads. the problem is of course, would they sell one to them? :p but then again i'd be more concerned with the russian mafia raffling -their- nukes off


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InvisibletrendalM
point of inflection
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 19,378
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3075625 - 08/31/04 11:07 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

It'll happen, and it will be far worse than hiroshima or nagasaki. 15 kilotons and 20 kilotons did that...but now we have large multi-megaton warheads. The soviets popped off a 50 megaton bomb, the largest ever exploded. Hiroshima killed 80,000 people at once with 15kt. What would it take for a million, or several, to die at once?


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You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #3075638 - 08/31/04 11:10 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

China has said it would "not stand by" if North Korea is ever attacked.


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InvisibleGijith
Daisy Chain Eater

Registered: 12/04/03
Posts: 2,400
Loc: New York
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3075654 - 08/31/04 11:16 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I watched "Fog of War" the other day. Probably the best documentary I've ever seen. It's just a nice long interview with Robert McNamara. And I remember at one point he says "The indefinite combination
of human fallibility and nuclear weapons will destroy nations." Anyone who hasn't watched it should go out and rent it.


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OfflineTao
Village Genius

Registered: 09/19/03
Posts: 7,935
Loc: San Diego
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Gijith]
    #3076317 - 09/01/04 01:44 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

great documentary :thumbup:


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Magash's Grain Tek  + Tub-in-Tub Incubator + Magash's PMP + SBP Tek + Dunking = Practically all a newbie grower needs :thumbup:


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InvisibleDoctorJ
Stranger
 Arcade Champion: Frogger

Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 8,451
Loc: space
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #3076536 - 09/01/04 02:58 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I suspect that the Chicoms are more than happy to let the Kim with nukes problem ferment while the real prize for them is Taiwan. I suspect there is a real confrontation looming over that and if the Chinese can use Kim as a chip it will be much to their advantage.




I agree, the Taiwan situation is a ticking timebomb. Everyone's worried about arabs, I'm worried about the Chinese. They have 1.5 billion people, nukes, and not enough resources to live like we do. Sounds like a recipe for a real nasty conflict to me. Plus, their people have almost nothing to lose.


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peace, pot, and microdot!


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OfflineZahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: DoctorJ]
    #3076559 - 09/01/04 03:13 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

China and the U.S. will join hands in their war on Islam.


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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 Arcade Champion: Frogger

Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 8,451
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Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Zahid]
    #3076582 - 09/01/04 03:33 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

no, the war on islam will fizzle out when arab terrorism is redirected towards the crooked Arab governments which have been misappropriating oil profits for the past 50 years. I'm sorry, but if the muslims really wanted to do something for their people, they would be attacking the royal Saudi family, with its huge palaces that have been built with the blood of the common arab worker.

the US and China's differences, however, are not so easily reconciled. We depend on their cheap-ass labor in order to enjoy our high standard of living, and I dont know how much longer they are going to take it before they realize that there's more of them than us, and they have an enormous population whose standard of living is so low that there is potentially a HUGE army of the the willing.


--------------------
peace, pot, and microdot!


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OfflineZahid
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Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
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Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: DoctorJ]
    #3076664 - 09/01/04 04:12 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Actually, that's one of the main reasons most Muslims hate the West - from Pakistan to Northern Africa, far from the Zionist and American occupations; the support the U.S. has for it's 'allies' in Muslim world - those Muslim states are repressive states, and human rights abusers; while they have Muslim rulers, they are secular and abusive to the basic rights of Muslims and non-Muslims.

Bin Laden's main grievance with the United States is the presence of U.S. (kufr) soldiers on the Holy Peninula, the home of Islam and the Prophet Muhammad; which is automatically entwined with Saudi Arabia and the al-Saud royal family being apostates. There is an on going insurgency of sorts in Saudi Arabia, although it doesn't seem as obvious because the militants are targetting Westerners - the back bone of the Saudi government, as oppossed to the royal family, whom invited the U.S. military presence in the first place to originally protect them from Saddam Hussein, and moreso these days against Al Qaeda's attempt to over throw the royal family.

Most other Muslims consider the al-Saud's apostate dogs and puppets of the West. OBL himself used Saudis for the 9/11 attack to drive a wedge between the two allies. The conlift with Islam and the West is very omplicated, and has a history alot longer than 3 or 55 years. In the Muslim world the crusades are still ripe in memory, and today it's only now exploding. Fascist states, Communist states, Marxist states... while North Korea and China can pack a punch, China itself is currently dealing with a growing Muslim insurgency in the Western regions of the country, that is slowly growing to be another Chechnya; another front I forgot to mention.

It's an all out war on Islam, from the Zionists in Palestine, the Imperialist Americans in Iraq and Afghanistan, the godless Russians in Chechnya, the Communists of China in Xinjiang, and ultimately, a massive occupation by proxy with puppet regimes throughout the Muslim world - with the al-Suads leading the pack. The Munafiqeen royal family, the dogs of the state, as they are referred to as.

It doesn't have to be this way, the West can just stay the fuck out of our business for starters. Until then, soldiers will continue to fall one by one in Iraq - the New Afghanistan (not 2001, but the 1979-1989).

Our only real set back is Al-Qaeda, because they target civilians and this is not Islam. Muslims have a front to fight the American dogs in Iraq and Afghanistan now - moreso Iraq, so they are loosing support among 'swing' moderate Muslims with each operation carried out against obvious civilian targets. When some off shoots in Al Qaeda do something really stupid, like bombing a Shia Mosque or slaughtering a dozen or so Muslims to do some symbolic damage to an embassy or consulate, Muslims are so emberassed that they blame the Mossad or CIA for it.


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Edited by Zahid (09/01/04 04:27 AM)


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OfflineNorthernsoul
Your Reality

Registered: 11/17/01
Posts: 2,290
Loc: Inner Eye
Last seen: 5 years, 11 months
We are just too soft as American citizens these days [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #3078532 - 09/01/04 05:36 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Well, its just a matter of time. A hundred years is nothing when you look at it. We've only had this great of a country for 50 years or so. With all the disposable income and quality of life. We're pretty lucky to be alive now, but I'm not to sure about my grandkids, theyll definately look back and see how lucky we were I think. The next real big war will be pretty damn nasty I think, and it will be such a shock to us soft americans, we are so damn soft its not even funny. We have a hard time coping with one amber alert, never mind having our relatives and families wiped out by one bomb. We would totaly freak and go into some paranoid neurosis because we are so damn soft.


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
Re: We are just too soft as American citizens these days [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3078541 - 09/01/04 05:40 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

MAD will prove to keep nukes out of conventional warfare for hundreads of years to come. I am afriad of the use of tactical nukes though.


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I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: We are just too soft as American citizens these days [Re: d33p]
    #3078580 - 09/01/04 05:51 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

d33p said:
MAD will prove to keep nukes out of conventional warfare for hundreads of years to come.


Unless your opponents like the idea of passing on to partake of virgins in heaven...


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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Offlinebarfightlard
tales of theinexpressible
Male

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Registered: 01/29/03
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Re: Nukes are still pretty young. Give them time. [Re: Northernsoul]
    #3078607 - 09/01/04 05:57 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

I wish A-Bomb stood for Asshole-Bomb. They could just drop a some of those and only take out the ashsoles. Problem solved.


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"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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Offlined33p
Welcome to Violence

Registered: 07/12/03
Posts: 5,381
Loc: the shores of Tripoli
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
Re: We are just too soft as American citizens these days [Re: Evolving]
    #3078718 - 09/01/04 06:41 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Evolving said:
Quote:

d33p said:
MAD will prove to keep nukes out of conventional warfare for hundreads of years to come.


Unless your opponents like the idea of passing on to partake of virgins in heaven...




Which is one of the many reasons leading me to dislike theocracies.


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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