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KingOftheThing
the cool fool
Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,397
Loc: USA
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#3079318 - 09/01/04 07:00 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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es?tab?lish?ment ( P ) Pronunciation Key (-stblsh-mnt) n.
The act of establishing. The condition or fact of being established. Something established, as: An arranged order or system, especially a legal code. A permanent civil, political, or military organization. An established church. A place of residence or business with its possessions and staff. A public or private institution, such as a hospital or school. often Establishment An established social order, as: A group of people holding most of the power and influence in a government or society. Often used with the. A controlling group in a given field of activity. Often used with the.
the republican party in texas has a line in it stating that Christianity is the official language of the USA. does that not go against the constitution?
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KingOftheThing
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Posts: 27,397
Loc: USA
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: Zahid]
#3079326 - 09/01/04 07:01 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Zahid said: I disagree with the U.S. constitution.
good thing you dont live here i envy you, you live in a more secular nation than i
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Zahid
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: KingOftheThing]
#3079331 - 09/01/04 07:01 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Nope, it's not ENFORCING. That's what it says, it's not my opinion. If I had my way, Americans would be subjected to Shariah.
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: KingOftheThing]
#3079344 - 09/01/04 07:04 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Apparently not against the Texas constitution. I haven't read it.
That doesn't change the fact that you're unable to show a seperation of church and state in the federal constitution. It doesn't exist.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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KingOftheThing
the cool fool
Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,397
Loc: USA
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#3079373 - 09/01/04 07:10 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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i guess me and almost all judges intepret that phrase differently
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
Registered: 11/29/01
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: KingOftheThing]
#3079398 - 09/01/04 07:15 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
the republican party in texas has a line in it stating that Christianity is the official language of the USA.
Bet you meant religion, not language. Doesn't matter. A party can put anything it wishes into it's platform. It's not a law and therefore doesn't have to pass constitutional muster.
A search of the Texas Constitution using the keyword "religion", brings up this.... Sec. 6. FREEDOM OF WORSHIP. All men have a natural and indefeasible right to worship Almighty God according to the dictates of their own consciences. No man shall be compelled to attend, erect or support any place of worship, or to maintain any ministry against his consent. No human authority ought, in any case whatever, to control or interfere with the rights of conscience in matters of religion, and no preference shall ever be given by law to any religious society or mode of worship. But it shall be the duty of the Legislature to pass such laws as may be necessary to protect equally every religious denomination in the peaceable enjoyment of its own mode of public worship. So the Texas Constitution is in line with the US constitution.
A search for the word "Christianity" and "Christian" brings up..... absolutely nothing.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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luvdemshrooms
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: KingOftheThing]
#3079404 - 09/01/04 07:15 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
KingOftheThing said: i guess me and almost all judges intepret that phrase differently
I'd imagine not those judges who can read.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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KingOftheThing
the cool fool
Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,397
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#3079410 - 09/01/04 07:17 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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whoops i dint mean the texas constitution, i meant the texas republican party platform
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Divided_Sky
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: Zahid]
#3079414 - 09/01/04 07:18 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Zahid said: Nope, it's not ENFORCING. That's what it says, it's not my opinion. If I had my way, Americans would be subjected to Shariah.
Hmmm...Texas republican party or Shariah...hard to choose. I'll go with the ones that don't have public executions, fatwahs, and make women wear burkas.
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KingOftheThing
the cool fool
Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,397
Loc: USA
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: KingOftheThing]
#3079421 - 09/01/04 07:19 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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last i head the alcu was going after them for that
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luvdemshrooms
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: KingOftheThing]
#3079437 - 09/01/04 07:21 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
KingOftheThing said: whoops i dint mean the texas constitution, i meant the texas republican party platform
You didn't say constitution. You said Republican Party.
I merely pointed out a party's platform has no bearing on law. I then out of curiosity checked the Texas constitution and added that to avoid heading down that road. Besides, I found it interesting.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
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Zahid
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: Divided_Sky]
#3079451 - 09/01/04 07:24 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Don't forget the jizya tax on Christians and Jews.
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Phred
Fred's son
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: deafpanda]
#3079530 - 09/01/04 07:44 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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deafpanda writes:
But blacks in the US are also poorer, on average, than their white countrymen, and crime is closely correlated with poverty.
Why is Sweden's crime rate so low, then? American blacks, on average, are wealthier than the Swedes, on average. Yet black crime rate is substantially higher than the Swedish crime rate.
pinky
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Anonymous
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: Phred]
#3079551 - 09/01/04 07:48 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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a damn good question.
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deafpanda
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: Phred]
#3079574 - 09/01/04 07:53 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Well, I'd say that being comparitively poor in the context of one's society would be more of a motive to commit crime than being objectively poor by the world's standards, but average in your country.
I don't know though, I'm just guessing.
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Anonymous
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: deafpanda]
#3079578 - 09/01/04 07:56 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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ah, so crime is not corellated with poverty, but envy...
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Zahid
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: ]
#3079583 - 09/01/04 07:57 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Crime is a result of seperation of church and state.
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RandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: Phred]
#3079651 - 09/01/04 08:11 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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What connection does Canada's crime rate have with Bush's remarks, by the way?
None. It looks as if I have unintentionally derailed the thread.
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RandalFlagg
Stranger
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: KingOftheThing]
#3079827 - 09/01/04 08:43 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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find stats for our neighbor to the north
You know, I just realized some things:
1. I cannot prove my hypothesis that the Left's rejection of things that support absolute morality(such as religion) has led to an increase in unsavory behavior. In any society, people's behaviors are going to be influenced by so many possible factors that no matter how many statistics I found, I would not be able to narrow down a cause for increased crime rates to one thing. Also, every society is different. Something that holds one society together might destroy another. So comparing them can be problematic. And lastly, the Left's influence and battles with organized religion would be near impossible to quantify into scientific data. My hypothesis is unprovable.
2. My belief in this hypothesis was based more on "perceiving" things in the world as opposed to examining factual data. This is just how I see things happening in the world today.
3. I believe that the extreme Left has a distaste for religion(or any type of established institution that exerts control and influence).
The threat of supernatural punishment, supernatural rewards, and an absolute unquestionable morality that is enforced by an omnipotent and immensely superior being are the only things that seem to keep people in line in the long run. Without such grandiose and powerful beliefs, people can allow their morals to wander, and bad things happen. I have no way of proving that. That belief is based upon my own thoughts which draw inspiration from the things I perceive around me.
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silversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
Loc: mndfreeze's puppet army
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Re: Bush Suggests War on Terror Can't be Won [Re: retread]
#3080192 - 09/01/04 09:39 PM (19 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
retread said:
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silversoul7 said: Yes, we shall see(or maybe we won't). Note that I never said I was against fighting the terrorists. I simply suggested that our tactics include a re-evaluation of our foreign policy in the Middle East(and elsewhere).
You said you were barely for the war in Afghanistan. What more justification should we possibly need for a war? Should we have said "Thats it you bastards, just for 9/11 we'll not attack you, let you keep your money, arms, training places, and violent theocracy in palce, and we'll move out of Israel and stop supporting them! Take that!". I see low sucess rates in that path.
Must you always twist my words and make such wild assumptions about what I believe? You are quickly turning into a right-wing version of Alex. I said I wasn't entirely against the War in Afghanistan. What I meant by this was that while I believe military action was justified, the results have not been so nice. The country has fallen to warlords, and we are still far from capturing Osama. Mission failed.
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First of all, what gives the UN the legal authority to give a piece of land already inhabited by other people to a bunch of newcomers, most of whom had never even visited that land before?
Are you expecting that I won't know that the land wasn't "Palestinean" territory before hand? That the british controlled it? Come on now, what is more prevalent throughout history than owning land due to military conquest. That was BRITISH land that they gave to the jews, and the arabs in trans-jordan etc. Seriously now.
Yes, the British really fucked that one up. In fact, I think most modern problems in the Middle East can be traced back to the British. If another country conquered the area you live in, then gave it to a group of people who had never lived there and allowed them to force you out of your home, would you support such actions?
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Second, how is it taking the moral low ground to stop using money forcefully taken from taxpayers to fund another nation's massive army?
That is a valid point.
Of course it is. That's why I made it.
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Third, why is it sensible to help Israelis live without suicide bombers, but not sensible to help Palestinians live without having their houses bulldozed and their families shot?
Israel doesn't target innocent Palestineans for random murder, Palestine does.
I wouldn't be so sure about that.
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Well, we didn't so much go into the beehive as much as we just smacked it with a baseball bat. We killed quite a few bees, but the others have dispersed, and they're pissed. Oh, and btw, unless you know something the rest of us don't, we have yet to find the queen bee.
I don't know exactly the percentage of Al Qieda camps, personnel or leadership that were destroyed. I know that analysing us NOT going into Afghanistan at all or the choice of going in with military force, the latter probably did much more damage to the enemy. I know that the personnel at Guantanemo Bay aren't going to bomb any buildings, I know that the jihadists in the caves that got bombed out of existance won't be hijacking any airplanes and I know that Afghanistan won't harbor terrorist training camps that put out people to execute non-combattants on video tape. We might not have won the battle in one fell swoop, but we put a pretty good hurting on them.
The ones held in Guantanamo Bay have provided endless opportunities for anti-US propaganda, the ones that were bombed in caves have become martyrs, and the training camps have simply been moved to other countries, making Al Queda all the harder to track down. The ones executing non-combattants on videotape are in Iraq. And we have only hurt them enough to piss them off. They are regrouping right now, and you'd better believe they've got something more up their sleeves.
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It is not the wrong thing to stop initiating force against taxpayers to fund the military of a nation that many of them oppose. I believe Thomas Jefferson said it best:
For that reason, I'll agree. My libertarian views make me think that it's wrong to use our tax dollars to fund another nation. However, don't we SELL them F-16's and the like? If we produce a product and sell it to them, even for zero profit, we aren't funding them with taxpayer loot, so I'd be ok with that. Are you?
We give them billions of dollars in foreign aid as well. Even if we didn't, it's taxpayer money that funded the creation of those F-16's, under the premise that it will be used by our own military as allowed in the Constitution, not sold to some foreign power.
-------------------- "It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire
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