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OfflineZahid
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Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3070747 - 08/30/04 09:32 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I'd figured as much that you would conform to such racial and religious generalizations.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: BleaK]
    #3070818 - 08/30/04 09:57 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

So Bleak,

you are saying it is wise to kill other people 'them" by killing yourself in the manor I questioned, so your people "us" have a chance at liberation from "them".

If I have you correctly, I only see wise war strategy of it by your example.

I am looking for the wisdom in Zahids comment that some people find it wise to regard death as a final liberation. This hasn't been answered yet as he says it's not related to war or society divisions.

Zahid,
In your reply, you equated the wisdom of death with reward after death. I see reward and liberation as being two separate things unless the reward is liberation, what is it death liberates one from making it wise to beleive so?


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3070826 - 08/30/04 09:59 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I didn't say 'reward'.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3070909 - 08/30/04 10:20 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Okay, you said provisions. Recieving provisions is not liberation from anything.

I am sincerely looking to understand the wisdom of why some people deem it wise to regard death with liberation.

You see, in my book, the goal is to bring higher vibrations of spirit light into dense matter for greater levels of experiential self realization...........the bigger plan. I realise some people have smaller plans of their own within it.



I still would appreciate an answer to my question to gain in my understanding and also wonder what can be provided for in the after life that can not be provided for here in the physical. Whatever the answers are, thats what I want to work at pulling into this experiential physical reality as well.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3071036 - 08/30/04 10:49 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I'm talking about a final return home. Death is home. What comes after death is where we came from.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3071131 - 08/30/04 11:02 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Okay, I understand that. They believe it is wise to liberate oneself from the physical life so they can return home. 

Still not sure about the wisdom in that based on my beleifs that home is in my heart right here and now and that I can recreate the essense of it right here and that is my ultimate purpose for being here I beleive.

Wisdom itself is even relative in this case and I will leave it at that.

Peace! :heart:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3071186 - 08/30/04 11:10 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Life is sacred. The taking of life is only a last resort. One's own life is sacred as well and one should preserve it where it is practically possible. The idea of committing suicide to exterminate others is a barbaric practice not a sacrifice. It is also not a core belief of ANY mainstream religion. To give one's life to preserve others is a sacrifice of the highest order. To kill oneself in the hopes of taking others with you is a mortal sin before any civilised society.

If you believe this nonsense about "liberation" why are you still not yet liberated?


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3071204 - 08/30/04 11:14 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Good argument. There is wisdom in the preservation of life and the dispensation of mercy. Don't let those who harbor evil intent ever convince you otherwise.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3071208 - 08/30/04 11:15 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

What does that have to do with anything I said in terms that death is liberation?

You are utterly racist and bigoted, as nothing I have ever said pertains to somehow supporting what Muslim terrorists are doing.


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Invisiblepsyka
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3071222 - 08/30/04 11:18 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

"Responsibility is as heavy as a mountain, death is as light as a feather."

---edit (twice): kept inversing it X


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As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.



Edited by psyka (08/30/04 11:19 PM)


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3071223 - 08/30/04 11:18 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I wasn't looking to argue anything. I was looking to understand the wisdom in his comment and i still don't because he never explained why it was wise after asking a few times so I gave up on it.

He left me to understand it as being a wise war strategy and now, a means for going home to those who lost their way into the heart of love.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #3071247 - 08/30/04 11:22 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Death is the return to one's Original Being.

I suppose Hue will try spin that into something political.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3071268 - 08/30/04 11:27 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I am talking to you and Bleak. Both of you seem to have a questionable regard for life. You are pushing death as liberation and Bleak is promoting destructive suicide...no politics involved here I just think both points of view are crazy. Don't twist my words to your purpose. I mentioned no politics...only religion.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3071297 - 08/30/04 11:31 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Heh, BleaK comes from a different school of thought...

For me death is where I return to God - complete awareness, fullness of being. BleaK is leaning towards unconsciousness and sleep. Suicide is unconsciousness.

I'm not twisting your words, you're the one that started ranting how it's wrong to kill one's self while taking other human beings with you (in reference to Muslim terrorism) - which is fairly obvious, so why mention it. I'm talking about eternal love after death and you're talking about politics.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3071313 - 08/30/04 11:34 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah, but do you you want to return to God before it is necessary...that is my point. Our lives DO have value. Too much focus on the afterlife removes this value. Our lives are too precious to wish them away.


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OfflineZahid
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3071337 - 08/30/04 11:37 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

One would have to put quality on this life if they love the Creator.

Statistically, suicides aren't very religious people at that. Suicide is regarded as unconsciousness and benightedness by every spiritual school.


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OfflineBleaK
paradox
Registered: 06/24/02
Posts: 1,583
Last seen: 8 years, 8 months
Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3071591 - 08/31/04 12:36 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

checking......................................................................OK

at no point did i promote anything.

unless, you consider my offering of my opinion of what their rationalization is, a promotion.


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"You cannot trust in law, unless you can trust in people. If you can trust in people, you don't need law." -J. Mumma


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OfflineStrumpling
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Registered: 10/11/02
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Re: Heaven & Hell [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3072132 - 08/31/04 03:19 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

"Speak for yourself there."

I always speak for myself, dude. Who the fuck else would I be speaking for? Read my sig..

Anyways to further express MY PERSONAL OPINION, you can be totally happy daily but the entire world can be falling apart around you. If that were the case, what would that say about the person who was happy? Either that they were ignorant or that they wished the whole world would fall apart, IMO.


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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OfflineBleaK
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Registered: 06/24/02
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Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3072194 - 08/31/04 03:46 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Zahid said:
BleaK is leaning towards unconsciousness and sleep. Suicide is unconsciousness.





:thumbdown:


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"You cannot trust in law, unless you can trust in people. If you can trust in people, you don't need law." -J. Mumma


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Invisiblezorbman
blarrr
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Registered: 06/04/04
Posts: 5,952
Re: Heaven &amp;amp;amp;amp;amp; Hell [Re: Zahid]
    #3072247 - 08/31/04 03:58 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Please explain why you are calling someone racist when you have a cartoon depicting an armed jewish figure with the phrase "born to kill"?


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