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Offlinesos
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Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080?
    #3065615 - 08/29/04 03:15 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

Every church of latter day saints is a branch of the international LDS church. Other branches include Pepsi, Mariot, and blockbuster. In the year 2080 there is projected to be around 250 million mormons. The church is run like a corpration(it would be ranked above gap and nike on the fortune 500 list). Every church sends every penny of the tithed money to the corporate headquarters in salt lake city. there is a mandatory tithe of ten percent of all income for all members. zero tolerance for the non payers. Mormons(a branch of satan international?) will be the majority in about 60 years time. Prepare yourself for public mormon domination.


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god made pot who do you trust, yeh i stole that off a lighter, so what, you wanna fight about it?

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Invisiblequestion_for_joo
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #3065689 - 08/29/04 03:37 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

Scary. The mormon religion is so weird. They believe in this extra part of the bible that some 19th century dood found on some dinner plates buried underground. I think it's mostly cause some guys living in the Victorian era wanted to hump a different honey each night of the week though.

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Offlinesos
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: question_for_joo]
    #3065697 - 08/29/04 03:39 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

yeah i heard the highest part of mormon royalty is very deep into incestious relations.


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god made pot who do you trust, yeh i stole that off a lighter, so what, you wanna fight about it?

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #3065703 - 08/29/04 03:42 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

Where would us programmers be without Pepsi and Cheetos?

Guess I don't have to worry as I will not make it to 2080.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflineSigno
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #3065775 - 08/29/04 04:09 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

Ummm....so what is Catholicism? It has the same hierarchy, maybe the money doesn't funnel directly to the Vatican anymore, but your statement is somewhat spindled with hatred.

LDS are definately expanding, and indeed they do have secret rooms and rituals, qualifying them as a cult. What really scares me about LDS is that right now in tiny rooms across the world, someone who is a LDS is learning an obscure language so he can go tell a tribe about Jesus' second coming in North America. I just wish the secrets weren't involved.


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Correlation is not causation!

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #3065790 - 08/29/04 04:12 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

There are a lot of Mormon myths circulated here. I am not a Morman, but I have known many. Their religion is a community oriented Christian based religion. Most seem to be fine people with good morals and values. I don't want to be one, but there is nothing wrong with them. The bullshit I have read here is baseless propoganda. I guess hate can find it's way in anywhere.

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OfflineArchemetis
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #3066858 - 08/29/04 09:06 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

i grew up in a town in northern utah where about 95-98% of my high school was mormon. and its a very scary place i tell you. mormons are very strange people...i was actually raised in that church until i was 12. there is so much indoctrination that goes on in those buildings, especially towards the children. thank god my mind has been able to recover...(with the help of my good freind lsd) seriously though, these people are strange.

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Archemetis]
    #3066921 - 08/29/04 09:21 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

I have been friends with several who were very moral, kind, and generous people.

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Offlinesos
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3071861 - 08/30/04 11:56 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

to make a point i have a deep hatred for catholiscism also. they only thing the have done good for humanity is well the school girl skirt. I know ppl who were high up in lds there is alot of satanic things going on behind close doors. LDS is a cult. MAny seemingly christian establishments are fronts for unknowning perversion of Jesus. I have a direct link to cult activate. my parents met in a cult. my sisters were raised in a cult. it was called christian community chapel in des moines, wa google it. It was a fucking brothel. People would make connections WHich led to a sorta of date rape. twisting of the word of God to allow the Pastor to take advantage of simple loving christian people. A lady who went very deep into and then pulled out wrote a book which i believe is called Fallen Angels? anyways MOrmons perverted the Bible they are a cult! nuf said


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god made pot who do you trust, yeh i stole that off a lighter, so what, you wanna fight about it?

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Offlinecisole
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3071903 - 08/31/04 12:08 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

I agree Huehuecoyotl, one other thing I agree with is that none of the mormons get paid for what they do its all volunteer.... Even the Bishop of a whole ward isnt paid they have to still work a full time job and take care of the ward....

Talk about serious dedication!!!


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is it life that keeps us going, or us that keeps life going?

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Offlinesos
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: cisole]
    #3071911 - 08/31/04 12:10 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

yes such dedication sounds like ummm wait wait.... a cult!


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god made pot who do you trust, yeh i stole that off a lighter, so what, you wanna fight about it?

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Offlinecisole
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #3071943 - 08/31/04 12:22 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

something else to bother you SOS....

last years reports of all the churches said they are the second fastest growing churh in the world and next year the fastest...

thats a thought!


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is it life that keeps us going, or us that keeps life going?

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Offlinesos
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: cisole]
    #3071964 - 08/31/04 12:26 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

You think i would realize that they are growing at a seemingly cult like speed i did say that it is projected they would have 250 million members by 2080


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god made pot who do you trust, yeh i stole that off a lighter, so what, you wanna fight about it?

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Offlinecisole
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #3071997 - 08/31/04 12:36 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

true, my bad...


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is it life that keeps us going, or us that keeps life going?

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Offlinesos
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: cisole]
    #3072013 - 08/31/04 12:42 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

most mormons are very happy people. but it is an ignorant bliss. I mean the mormon bible is ercle(is that how you spell that guys name?) on an acid trip


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god made pot who do you trust, yeh i stole that off a lighter, so what, you wanna fight about it?

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OfflineTao
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #3072591 - 08/31/04 03:28 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

what are these 'satanic' and secretive things you say you've heard? first-hand from people directly involved?

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OfflineArchemetis
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Tao]
    #3073284 - 08/31/04 10:10 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

TaoTeChing said:
what are these 'satanic' and secretive things you say you've heard? first-hand from people directly involved?




thats the mystery...you have to be deadicated enough and have a recommend from a higher official to even enter the temple...and the rituals that take place are never talked about. they arent allowed to talk about them. so i have no idea and my parents are even mormon and went through all the temple ceremonies.

i know one of the rituals they do in their temple though, but this ones no secret, they do baptisms for the dead in a font surrounded by 12 lion statues i believe it is, or is it bulls? anyway... when i was 12 i was pretty much forced into this...(not literally but there was alot of pressure put on by my family and my community and church.) so your waste deep in this pool (esensially you are taking the place of a dead person to symbolise their baptism), and there is a guy readeng a prayer to an individual who is deceased....yadda yadda yadda...your dunked under the water and he moves on with another prayer for another individual passed on. this is one reason why mormons are really into geneioloy.
their reasoning behind these baptisms is that they believe you cannot enter the kingdom of heavon unless you have been baptised into this church...so all those passed on who never had the opportunity to be baptised in teh mormon church are in the after life waiting until their name is read off in that prayer and someone is baptised in thier place.

very strange if you ask me

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Invisiblewhiterasta
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Archemetis]
    #3073382 - 08/31/04 10:47 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

I am a former mormon and you folks don't even know the half.
1)mormons have one of the largest private computer data files in the world.It actually IS housed in acave in Utah.
2)of all religions or creeds more secret service men and FBI are mormon than any other group
3)my brother is the Bishop of his Ward and is as normal as you or I.
IMHO they are likely to become big players in world politics over the next few years.
WR:wexican:


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To old for this place

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OfflineArchemetis
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: whiterasta]
    #3073435 - 08/31/04 11:06 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

and for some reason they are buying more and more of downtown Salt Lake City....a few years back they even bought the mall, dont ask me why


from my expireince with mormons utah mormons are very different...it seems outside of communities where everyone is mormon, they are more open minded and "christian" like, for lack of a better term.

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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #3074373 - 08/31/04 02:58 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

wait a minute pepsi is officially owned by mormon church??


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #3075183 - 08/31/04 06:15 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

So you don't like Catholics either. Well, my Grandmother was a Catholic and so is my Uncle. They have always been good people. If they are involved in a plot for world domination I don't know about it. Just because people from a particular religion, like the Mormons or Catholics, become successful, influential people it doesn't mean a thing...only that they learned some self dicsipline. This is the same type of argument that Hitler used against the Jews. Hate based on religious or racial grounds is one of the few true evils in our world.

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InvisibleKingOftheThing
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #3075688 - 08/31/04 09:23 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

of all the major religions i personally depise mormonism the most

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Offlinesos
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #3076005 - 08/31/04 10:29 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

i have no hate for anyone one i do have hate towards religions based on a series of lies catholiscism has come a long way but it is like a weekly chore for most. The pope is such a puppet. please.


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god made pot who do you trust, yeh i stole that off a lighter, so what, you wanna fight about it?

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OfflineWorf
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #3076075 - 08/31/04 10:47 PM (19 years, 6 months ago)

No mormons don't own pepsi. He was just saying that to say that its a big fucking corporation.

I've lived in Salt Lake City all my life and I can tell you that the LDS religion will take over the world one day. Slowly but surely. They have just bought Main street in downtown and also bought out another major developement to open up a huge mall. I mean it was the MAIN street and they just bought it for the sake of buying it. They have all the say on what the stores in the mall can do because they own the place. Currently, no store will be open on sunday.

I've met a lot of good people that were mormon, but it wasn't because they were mormon that made them good. Most Mormons are hypocritical bigots who think they are better than non-mormons. They think non-mormons are the immoral scum of the earth, but at the same time they never follow any of their rules. They think they are better than you and then you see them drinking caffeine (a no no), having sex (another no no), drugs, working on sunday, lying, cheating, etc.

Being a mormon definately has its benefits. For example if a mormon business only wants to hire mormons, they will call the church directly and they have an entire department that handles that. If you ever get in jail they will post bail. They will give you food and money when you are out of work. Get discounts at certain restaurants. Are favored by cops, teachers, and basically anybody with any sort of authority.

Thats why so many people pay the tithing. They SAY it is optional but I guarantee you, if you don't pay it they will hound you and you lose all of those benefits in addition to being stigmatized by the mormon community.

I could go on but I know I've written too much as it is.

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Worf]
    #3076979 - 09/01/04 04:48 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

There is a big difference between Salt Lake City and the world. They also don't only hire other Mormons either. My brother is a pipefitter who worked for the Mormon Church doing maintenance for a few years. He is not a Mormon either. As far a being bigots, the Mormons I have met were very compassionate and tolerant. If they were bigots they hid it well. Why so much hate against these religions. Several posts here cross a moral line into promoting religious intolerance. When you hate, you receive hate in return.

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OfflineWorf
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3077234 - 09/01/04 07:22 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

No they don't only hire Mormons, but they have the option and use it frequently. I have a lot of animosity towards them because it has been hard growing up here as a minority. In other states its a level playing field but here you always have to work up hill.

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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #3077790 - 09/01/04 11:36 AM (19 years, 6 months ago)

If im still alive i'll have my mormon beating club ready.


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"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks

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Offlinefungophiliac
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: barfightlard]
    #4019460 - 04/05/05 10:12 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

this post is a little old and seems dead or maybe just dormant but i wanna say somethin cause i live here.

the church didnt just buy main street. they traded some city council guy some indian burial land for it up in the canyons.

racism is built into the GREAT DOCTRINE in the form of a story about 2 brothers one black (evil) and one white (good of course) from which all colored people are descended. love your brother but kill every jew jap nigger sap around cause you and him aint brothers. thats hitler propaganda.

now i aint sayin that every mormon is hard core racist and bent on world domination, but i am saying that if the people that founded this religion were not pure (which they probably werent) then their corrupt values(not those of god) would also be seeded in their religion. alongside the part about not questioning the Divine Testimony is a tangled mess of unanswerable ill-logics. so if jesus is a sheperd then what does that make mormons? breed-em (brighim) Young's sheep.. baaa baaaa

just to be clear i personally dont hate mormons, i think they are a source of great amusement. there are so many peculiarities built into mormon religion and culture that would probably make a trained psychologist scratch his head at times.

for instance why does brighim young university have the highest anal std rate in the country. only mormons go there. i guess vaginal sex is the only big no-no. mormon porn. there is a market for it. i have a mormon fetish much like people have things for catholic school girls. but i tihnk mine is more of a desire for the unattainable like lesbians and shaved legs. buut hey.

all i can say is mormons are great as long as they dont try to talk to me about drugs, and i dont try to talk about religion politics or anything besides "good dinner, pass the mustard please" at least on one side of the family. a couple of my wife's brothers have taken to drinkin and parties one of her brothers and his mormon wife are now happy swingers by night, normal folk by day. aside from being like 30 year old teengers who have never had alcohol, they are pretty fun when drunk.

the point is mormon culture is domineering and bent on globalizationbut if you steer clear of the really self rightous ones its not bad..... you know let them believe they have a different heaven and thank god "he" is seperating us.

post script
THE WHOLE BABTISM BY PROXY THING PISSES ME OFF. KEEP YOUR FUCKING DOGMA OFF OF MY SOUL
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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why are there so many more horses asses than there are horses?

if you can't duck it, fuck it.
-the makers of duck tape


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InvisiblePsychoactive1984
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: fungophiliac]
    #4019596 - 04/05/05 10:44 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

:shrug:

More dogma created to support a lifestyle instilled with hatred, who's attempts are at gaining ground in the ever popular niche that is religion. :tongue:.

Mormons aren't bad, Christians aren't bad, liberals aren't bad, conservatives aren't bad.

No set group of people through their belief is anymore superior then another, especially if they suggest such through their doctrine. One's affiliation shouldn't be a determinate to "brand" an individual within the herd.

Look at Germany after Hitler was ousted... sure was a hell of a lot of shitty beliefs tied to his reign... Do we think any differently (beyond gross propoganda campaings at the time) about the people that went along with it?

What of the Third Reich's demise, and the people living a different lifestyle as a result of the destabilization of said government at the time?

People are sold on bullshit all the time... they follow it as well... that doesn't make them any worse, it's those that are orchestrating the bullshit that are at fault, not so much those that are mislead by it. Ignorance is the root of it all, as long as their is ignorance, their will be mindless peons following blindly.

/end rant


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"Their is one overriding question that concerns us all: How can we get out of the fatal groove we are in, the one that is leading towards the brink?" Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
"We may not be capable of eradicating the corruption of reason, but we must nevertheless counter it at every instance and with every means." Dan Agin
"Politics is the best religion and politicians are the worst followers."
-It's ok to trip as long as you don't fall.
-Substance over Style.
-Common sense is uncommon.

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InvisibleJellric
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4019791 - 04/05/05 11:47 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

As far a being bigots, the Mormons I have met were very compassionate and tolerant.

Most cults will turn their nice face towards outsiders as long as they don't challenge them. Then you will see their dark side. That goes double for those in the cult who violate their rigid dogma. If they acted as they truly are no one would ever join them and they know that; In the same way that a wife beater will act nice when courting.

As an example of this behavior, my home state of Mississippi is/was known as the "Hospitality State" in the 1960's and earlier. As long as you were white that is. If you were an "uppity nigra" you might find yourself swinging by your neck from a tree. Not most people's idea of hospitality.


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I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.

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InvisibleVvellum
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #4019899 - 04/06/05 12:15 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

mormon girls are nice
but yet they are the borg

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Offlinesoulmotion
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Jellric]
    #4020006 - 04/06/05 12:49 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

OKAY,

I've been keeping a low profile for a while, but now I have to set the record straight, this is intolerable...

I'm a practicing member of "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints" a.k.a. LDS, a.k.a. "The Mormon Church".



1. The church does not own pepsi, or blockbuster, that is a myth that has been perpetuated forever (it seems). At one time I think the church owned a heavy stock in certain companies, but never "owned" private corperations. The Marriot hotel was founded by a member of the LDS church, but the church does NOT own the hotel chain (and I'm not even sure if the founder still owns it).

2. I can say with absolute certainty that there are NO satanic practices in the LDS church. The temple cerimonies are reguarded as "sacred", not "secret". Anyone is allowed to access to the temple, provided they qualify (meaning they enter the church and abide by the precepts, which are basic christian values). There is naturally alot of stigma reguarding the temple cerimonies, because of the privacy under which they are conducted, but the intention is not to exclude but merely to prevent people from mocking the ceremony, or from participating when they are unprepared/insincere.

3. In reguard to the epithet "cult" applied to the LDS faith;
Before Christianity was adopted by the Roman Empire, it was thought of as a cult. Almost every religion 'begins' as a cult; if the religion proves itself to be a sensible, practical way of life then eventually it works it's way into the mainstream. Why do you think 'Mormonism' is growing so fast? I expect some of you would respond, "because they brainwash people", to that I say: I was a missionary for the church for 2 years, and I know the proceedure for making converts; it's not easy! We (as missionaries) stress the importance of the prospective convert obtaining their own "witness" of the truth, and NOT relying on our words alone.This means that the person has to meditate, pray, read the material we provide them along with their own bible before they are able to be admitted into the church. There is even an interview that takes place before a person is baptised where all the conditions of membership are reviewed and and accepted by the prospective convert. It's not an easy process!!! I don't deny there may be a small percentage of converts who join for the wrong reasons, but they generally don't stay active for very long. MOST people join because they get a taste of the sweet, wholesome lifestyle that the church teachings provide, and they want that for themselves and their families.

4. It should also be remembered that 'Mormons' are just people! There are saintly 'Mormons', and there are hipocritical 'Mormons', and there is everything inbetween. It is possible for an organization to perfect ideals and still have imperfect people. Give them a break! If you or someone you know has been judged or wronged by a member of the LDS faith, then allow me to express my regret for their actions, but let me say also, if you judge them for judging you, YOU'RE the hipocrite.

edit: One more thing... the tithing thing. The "tithe" has been around since biblical times. In fact, the Old Testiment tells that Abraham, one of the oldest figures in the Bible, paying tithes to his spiritual leader. There have also been periods in biblical history where church members were expected to contribute all of their assets to the church, and to be distributed by the church as the leadership saw fit. In an idealized utopian society, everyone would share equally. That is the premise behind that higher statute known in LDS vocabulary as the "law of consecration". Although it sounds great in principle to share everything with everybody, it hasn't worked in practice in most eras. So a provisional law was made, i.e. the law of "tithing". A tithe is %10 of your gross earnings, like a tax. "The kingdom of God", like any government, has a tax for maintinence purposes. THERE IS NO PAID CLERGY IN THE LDS CHURCH!!! This means that all the tithe offerings paid to the church are NOT owned by any one person, (other than God) and those funds are used only for church operations, i.e. purchasing land, property tax on existing church property, maintaining church owned buildings, producing church materials and resources, ect. ect. Boring Stuff. Nobody is getting rich off of the membership except God, and I don't even think he needs the money.

Well, that's about all I have to say. I won't get into matters of doctrine, unless there is a few shroomerites that request a new thread...

Edited by soulmotion (04/06/05 01:50 AM)

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InvisibleJellric
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: soulmotion]
    #4020031 - 04/06/05 01:00 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I'm not a big fan of organized religion, but I'm not hostile to it either. I feel it serves a purpose for some people. You are quite correct in your description of what a "cult" is. That word is used as a perjorative- I use it to mean a small religion. Perhaps I should use the word "sect" instead.

You probably won't find many people friendly to your religion here, but hopefully everyone will remember to treat those who hold these beliefs with tolerance and respect.

We have a Mormon here so now's the time to ask any questions you may have about the Mormon faith..

I'll start: Were you born into the Mormon faith or did you join later?


--------------------
I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.

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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Jellric]
    #4020122 - 04/06/05 01:34 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Jellric said:
Were you born into the Mormon faith or did you join later?




I was brought up in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. I accepted it when I was young, but it didn't mean anything to me really. When I got into high school I was ashamed of my somewhat obscure religious heritage, so I stopped attending. My father and my father's father have both had a life-history of substance abuse. They were what you'd call, "Jack-Mormons", members of the church who didn't exactly live their religion. So, I was genetically disposed to substance abuse, but also maybe it was a little bit of "forbidden fruit" psychology that caused me to plunge into habitual drug use soon after abandoning my childhood religion.

I got into heavy drugs... I stole, I lied, I did all the bad things in the book, and by the time I was 18 my life was already really screwed up. I was at a crossroads. Many of my friends had already failed re-hab programs, and I didn't feel I should go down that road; it was dark, dismal, and worst of all, unpredictable. The alternative (or the only alternative I saw at that time) was to sober-up, start living a 'wholesome' life, get married, have a family and live out the typical suburban lifestyle. I decided to move to another state to live with my Grandmother to make the transition. It was a sucessfull transition. Along the way I decided to pick up my dusty Book of Mormon and start reading it again, this time with a new perspective. A recurrent theme in the book, and in the Mormon teachings in general, is to ask God to know if the Book is true, and if the teachings are real. It sounded simple enough. I got down of my knees and said a prayer for the first time in years, and I really meant it this time. I felt a unique feeling that was sweet, and pure, and VERY intense! I was certain that I had recieved my answer from God, and that the things I was reading were in fact true.

After that I aspired to be a missionary and teach other people the path that I was following. I was priveledged to serve for 2 years as a missionary in New Zealand. I've been home for several months now. I love philosophy and spirituality. Those are two of my favorite subjects. I don't shy away from objective reasoning, and I admit, there are alot of things about Mormonism, and Christianity in general that any rational person would have a hard time accepting. But the thing that has kept me "in the faith" , so to speak, has always been #1 the sensibility of the fundimental LDS teachings, and most of all #2 the sweet feelings I get from striving to live a pure and wholesome life.

I'm not perfect by any means, but I believe in the ideal of perfection, and as long as I live I will reach for that ideal, or die trying.

P.S. in case you're wondering why I'm here at shroomery; I've done lots of hallucinogenics in the past, and I'd probably do them again if the opportunity presented itself. I really hate street drugs because of their parasidic effect on society (not to mention health and other problems associated with substance abuse), but I make an exception for hallucinogenics, because I believe they induce spirituality (without the typical side effects, i.e. addiction, or health risks).

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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: soulmotion]
    #4020135 - 04/06/05 01:39 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Why not cut the shit away from your life as it is and just live a pure, and wholesome life of sensibility based on what you learned from it?

If you yourself believe that it is hard to accept some of the thing that a rational person would have a hard time accepting... then why accept them?

It's good that your attempting to better yourself  :thumbup:. Yet, why die trying to obtain that impossible ideal? Mormon doctrine, as well as many other sects of Christianity suggest that man will never be perfect, with the primary exception being Jesus himself. With that stated, I in no way suggest you start revolting/rebelling against all your views, just lighten up and don't be so rigid in your beliefs. You don't need to have a religion to share the fundamental values that it contains.

I wish I was 17 feet tall... I'm not, no way in hell I'll ever be able to achieve my "ideal" height... yet, I'll strive to achieve it, and will more certainly then not lose out in actually living a life.

(Peer Pressure :tongue:) Come on man, be rational.... only the cool people do it.

If you find that offensive :shrug: not my intent.



--------------------
"Their is one overriding question that concerns us all: How can we get out of the fatal groove we are in, the one that is leading towards the brink?" Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
"We may not be capable of eradicating the corruption of reason, but we must nevertheless counter it at every instance and with every means." Dan Agin
"Politics is the best religion and politicians are the worst followers."
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Psychoactive1984]
    #4020278 - 04/06/05 02:43 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Psychoactive1984 said:
If you find that offensive :shrug: not my intent.





No offense taken, mon amie. I'm here at S&P because I like to debate spirituality and philosophy. You'll find that I'm always advocating the legitimacy of faith, and idealism, using the best logic I can muster. I don't generally take offense to those who oppose my views, although I do appreciate courtesy, and it is disappointing the way some shroomerites don't show more respect to their opponent(s).

Quote:


Why not cut the shit away from your life as it is and just live a pure, and wholesome life of sensibility based on what you learned from it? If you yourself believe that it is hard to accept some of the thing that a rational person would have a hard time accepting... then why accept them?




Well, for many reasons. I mentioned that I have skeptisisms about my faith, which means that there are some unsettled questions in my mind. In other words, it would be hasty to decide that the whole religion is untrue because of a few unresolved questions. If you think about it, faith thrives on uncertainty as much or more than doubt does. If I was certain that religion was false then I would've left it already, and we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Think about how faith applies to some of the most famous discoveries in history. Columbus and his shipmates weren't certain that they could reach another continent by sailing west. Many of them expected to fall off the edge of the world, but they had just enough faith to make it to land. Incidentaly what they found was not their original destination, but without faith, they wouldn't have even survived their trek. My expiriences so far with my faith have provided me enough certainty to chart a life-long course to an uncertain destination: Heaven. Another example; Einstien had faith that the 'book was not closed' on physics. It became his lifework to uncover new principles of physics, and he was rewarded for his efforts with monumental dicoveries. Later, Einstein's theories came into question with the advent of quantim mechanics, but his courageous work blazed a trail for future physicists to follow. In both examples, the seeker's discovery carried a twist.

My journey with religion has already seen many twists, and I have come to expect the unexpected. One conclusion I've settled on, however, is that I have very little to loose by targeting the unkown, and very, very much to gain. Religion is a hyphothesis, and what happens to me after I die will either prove or disprove this hypothesis. If I am disproven, I will never know it. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything by being religious; in fact, cerimony has a way of drawing out deep emotions which acctually adds meaning to my life.

One more...

Quote:


...Yet, why die trying to obtain that impossible ideal?...





How do you know that perfection is an unachievable goal? Yes, there is a doctrine held by some Christian denomonations that perfection is un-obtainable, however, the LDS faith does not subscribe to that doctrine; we simply say that Jesus was in the only person to live a perfect life, and that , though we can't achieve perfection in mortality, we will eventually achieve it in the next life. It might interest you to know that Mormon Doctrine teaches that when you reach the highest heaven that you continue your "eternal progression". So, I may be going out on a limb to assume this, but to me this implies that 'perfection' is a process rather than a finite achievement. I could explain my philosophy about perfection in more detail elsewhere, but I'm afraid this post is getting too long to continue...

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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #4020333 - 04/06/05 03:16 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

The upper mormons are not into incestuous relationships, I don't know where you get this bullshit.

I recommend reading Under the Banner of Heaven by Jon Krakauer. It's an excellent book, discusses both the Mormon extremist offshoots and the LDS church itself. They're really just another religion.

I'm seeing a lot of what amounts to ignorant bigotry in this thread, and that should mean a lot to you guys coming from someone who thinks all religions are bullshit.

Sure there are some silly things about the Mormon religion, but when it comes down to it, it's all just as silly as believing in a god, which plenty of you guys probably do. I'm guessing the Mormon bashers have never known any Mormons in real life.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4020345 - 04/06/05 03:28 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
So you don't like Catholics either. Well, my Grandmother was a Catholic and so is my Uncle. They have always been good people. If they are involved in a plot for world domination I don't know about it. Just because people from a particular religion, like the Mormons or Catholics, become successful, influential people it doesn't mean a thing...only that they learned some self dicsipline. This is the same type of argument that Hitler used against the Jews. Hate based on religious or racial grounds is one of the few true evils in our world.




Exactly. I can't believe I'm seeing people advocating violence in this thread, it makes me pretty sick to see that stuff.

Maybe if people were smart enough to actually read a bit before spouting off violent bigotry they'd realize that violent persecution tends to help secure people's faiths and gain sympathy for them. Hell, it already happened to the Mormons, a gang of idiots with a mentality not unlike some of the posters in this thread brutally slaughtered more than 120 Mormons for no particular reason back in 1838.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/mass/mtn_meadows/3.html?sect=8


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: soulmotion]
    #4020352 - 04/06/05 03:37 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

There are many individual Mormons who are great people... but in Utah, the Mormon Mob-Mentality can be overbearing for a non-Mormon.

The problem with SLC is there is little to no separation between church and state. All citizens, LDS or not, have to abide by a predominantly Mormon State Government. However, as it grows, Salt Lake City has grown up quite a bit.

I am constantly amazed by laws that pass in Utah. The State doesn't trust its citizens to CHOOSE to act like good Mormons, so they create laws to insure ALL THE CITIZENS OF UTAH appear to be good Moromons. The majority moust not have a problem with it... they keep voting the same way.

Most Utahns just blindly follow whatever their leaders tell them to do. Respect for authority and seniority is intrinsic in the LDS religion. This isn't a bad thing... except few Utahns per capita actually question authority... and Utah Govt. monopolizes on it. That's the type of passive acceptance led to Utah's Porn Czar, or attempting to disallow FREE SPEECH on MAIN STREET in Downtown SLC, and Utah's rediculous alcohol laws.

This can be very alienating to a non Mormon. Utah is a weird place. White Non-Mormons are minorities... it is simply easy to mask... but if you are a non Mormon in SLC, you WILL know it.

Hinkley was a very effective President... but I wonder why LDS Presidents are considered to be the profit? Why is that? Doesn't a profit speak FOR God with God's voice? How can a man be promoted to Profit by other men? Don't a bunch of old men sit around until one says God told him he should be president?


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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Rose]
    #4020360 - 04/06/05 03:45 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

If I'm not mistaken, there are actually a lot of prophets in the mormon religion, unless that has changed now. The president isn't the only one. It's a level that you attain through years of devotion to the faith, not simply being elected.

And I certainly agree about the laws passed by the mormons, I'd hate to have to put up with that nonsense if I lived in SLC or something.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Phluck]
    #4020368 - 04/06/05 03:57 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Now as for Bigotry... this is an odd topic. The LDS is one of America's most persecuted religions, but at their core, the LDS church is arguably, more racist and sexist than most Christian Faiths. It kinda' balances out. Many Mormons are innocently racist, just like much of the country is racist towards the LDS.

Most people think baptisms for the dead are creepy, I think they're cool. I like the idea of being baptized "Just in case". Free heaven insurance... plus you get to drink, smoke and use condoms! And I don't even need to be there, or even alive, to be baptized!

I'm much more concerned about other aspects of the church.

Utah is the only state in the Union that has an American Fort pointed at it. Lincoln built Ft. Douglass to make sure Utah didn't secede during the Civil war. He had good reason for concern. Abe Lincoln was never given a Baptism for the dead by the Mormons, all other dead presidents have recieved one. Utah, like Texas, always wanted to be its own country. Also, Mormons did not respect blacks.

The LDS church would not allow black priests for a very long time (if I remember correctly, they just started doing so on a very limited basis within the last 20 years).

The Mormons believe Cain (Adam and Eve's kid) was marked by God (by becoming BLACK) when he killed Abel(his brother). That is a pretty racist way of looking at the story... especially since the Bible is quite vague about the matter. The Bible simply says Cain was marked. I always figured Abel scarred him during the struggle. But the LDS faith teaches that Cain was marked by becoming black. Thus, all blacks are descendants of the FIRST MURDERER. Ironically, this sounds like a popular belief in the pro slavery early 1800's... when Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, either by being a creative, eccentric thinker, or by being handed golden plates by God, which he could read by using his Prophetic superpower of translation.

Oh yeah... Smith was a profit too... there have been quite a few. Brigham Young... and every other President of the Latter Day Saints.

Mormons believe a woman is good for making babies, cooking and cleaning. After death, she will sit by her husband's side in Heaven, pumping out babies for the planet her husband presides over as God. Yup, she gets to make babies for her God for all eternity.

Read that one a few times to get it ^^^.

Many SMART Mormon women aspire to simply marry in the temple... have kids... and nothing else. At its core, the LDS faith is hobbling its women... even w/o polygamy!

I have to say, the Book of Mormon, what I've seen of it, reads like a bad novel from the early to mid 1800's. I prefer Sam Clemens. I haven't read all of the Book of Mormon, let's just say I can't get out of the Shire.


--------------------
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Phluck]
    #4020380 - 04/06/05 04:16 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Phluck said:
Hell, it already happened to the Mormons, a gang of idiots with a mentality not unlike some of the posters in this thread brutally slaughtered more than 120 Mormons for no particular reason back in 1838.
http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/mass/mtn_meadows/3.html?sect=8




Sure Mormons left Illinois for Utah because they were being forced out, and their leader, Joseph Smith, was killed.

However...

If you keep reading your link, you will read about when the Mormons killed a bunch of innocent people, for no apparent reason. THAT'S RIGHT, TWENTY YEARS LATER, THE MORMONS DID THE KILLING. Mormon's killed between 128 and 137 pioneers from Arkansas on... get this... 9-11-1857. It is the largest act of terrorism on American soil until Oklahoma City. The highest levels of the LDS church were connected to the massacre. So were the Ute indians. Mormons admire Native Americans, in part, because they believe Eden was in North America. The Mormons and Indians worked together to kill some AMERICAN pionerers. Pioneers who likely, knew little to nothing about Mormons.

Not many people know about the Mountain Medadow Massacre.

Talk about an eye for an eye... these folks were just passing through.

I wonder if the victims recieved baptisms for the dead...

Check some of these links, it is a fascinating story.

http://www.rotten.com/library/history/mountain-meadows-massacre/

http://www.mazeministry.com/mormonism/mmmassacre/mmm.htm

http://www.religioustolerance.org/lds_mass.htm

http://asms.k12.ar.us/armem/brondel/

http://www.cesnur.org/testi/morm_01.htm


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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #4021358 - 04/06/05 11:27 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

What happened to religious tolerance? The one place where all religious thought should be tolerated...a forum devoted to religion...is missing that very quality. It shows that hate gets in wherever it can.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

Edited by Huehuecoyotl (04/06/05 11:45 AM)

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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: soulmotion]
    #4021411 - 04/06/05 11:45 AM (18 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

soulmotion said:
How do you know that perfection is an unachievable goal?




In terms of subjective influence it is more then achievable... absolutely achievable though... not a chance in hell.

I'm perfect to myself at this point in time... other's might not feel that I have the perfect idealogy, views, and lifestyle... it doesn't matter to me, it works for me and is perfect.

I'm just saying that one shouldn't attempt to achieve an ideal as it is fruitless and others will find fault with it regardless of how perfect you are. Is it a form of self validation or something else entirely?

Perfection is an image... look to Sprite?, they have the answer I'm getting at.

Either way, if your happy with your faith, if your happy with your life, and if you can adhere to it without contradiction and hypocrisy congrats.


--------------------
"Their is one overriding question that concerns us all: How can we get out of the fatal groove we are in, the one that is leading towards the brink?" Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
"We may not be capable of eradicating the corruption of reason, but we must nevertheless counter it at every instance and with every means." Dan Agin
"Politics is the best religion and politicians are the worst followers."
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4021477 - 04/06/05 12:00 PM (18 years, 11 months ago)

I don't see it as hate... I just require an explanation as to the benefits of following a patch ascribed by a religion versus living for your own desires.

:shrug: Provided you're a productive member of society... better yet, provided you aren't a detriment to others, I don't see much of an issue.

You don't need a religion to mandate a design for how one chooses to live, to live as a devout believer of said religion lives. You just need to adhere to what suits you without qualification of whether a god/government implies it to be moral in respects to the the context of your actions

I drink coffee, I smoke cigarretes... I couldn't be a Mormon with a good conscience on the basis of disavowing and selectively choosing the tenants that I find applicable to the way I choose to live. Nor would I ever endeavor to.


--------------------
"Their is one overriding question that concerns us all: How can we get out of the fatal groove we are in, the one that is leading towards the brink?" Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
"We may not be capable of eradicating the corruption of reason, but we must nevertheless counter it at every instance and with every means." Dan Agin
"Politics is the best religion and politicians are the worst followers."
-It's ok to trip as long as you don't fall.
-Substance over Style.
-Common sense is uncommon.

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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Psychoactive1984]
    #4161123 - 05/11/05 08:49 AM (18 years, 10 months ago)

what gets me is that most of the fundamentals of LDS thought did not need to be shown to me by a member iof the church or by joseph smith's book. i figured it out sitting at home by myself. or as the doctors tell me. i dont feel i was alone but thats a differnet story. my problem is that i do not need a church to tell me about the latter days. when i "talk" with "god" i get the same answers(mostly) that smith got, except for the idea of all colered people being descendant from murderers, i dont know where that came from. anyway i have no problem with the eccentric beliefs of the church. i am just as eccentric. what i have a problem with is that i have to give my spirituality to a group of men to be decided if i am on track or not. and if i dont give my package over for a complete inspection, well i will just have to pray that one of those mormmons will babtise me when i am dead to make sure i dont go to a "lesser" heaven


--------------------
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Swami]
    #4161457 - 05/11/05 10:34 AM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Where would us programmers be without Pepsi and Cheetos?

Don't forget Hot Pockets for those 3am coding marathons... :grin:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: fungophiliac]
    #4165221 - 05/12/05 02:34 AM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah, I think the LDS believe in seven layers of heaven... each better than the last... and they have a purgatory too, I believe.


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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #4165921 - 05/12/05 10:05 AM (18 years, 10 months ago)

As ridiculous as I find the premise of the Church of the LDS, I really haven't read or seen any proof of some hidden agenda of world domination. Besides, at least they aren't Scientologists, who truly qualify as a cult. Now THOSE people scare me.....

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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Diploid]
    #4166231 - 05/12/05 12:18 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

http://www.snopes.com/cokelore/mormon.asp

The LDS doesn't own Coke, or Pepsi, nor are these companies run by mormons. They also don't own Blockbuster, but I think the guy who started it was a mormon... of course that's not the same as it actually being owned by the mormon church in any way.


--------------------
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Phluck]
    #4166705 - 05/12/05 02:14 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

one thing i find interesting about all the conspiracy theories i've seen relating to relgious/cult groups, is that people often seem to forget those of us who don't follow an organised religion. We don't by any means all believe the same things - some being atheists, etc. - but there are a hell of alot of us. You think the mormons are gonna be able to "strong-arm" everyone from other religions as well as those of us who don't follow an organised religion?
I'd like to see them take on the Muslims and Catholics and Hindus and Jews.
They may be secretive, but it's more through a want of being able to have a little exclusivity in their religion. All major religions do this to some degree. Not least of which the Freemasons.

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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Phluck]
    #4166742 - 05/12/05 02:19 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

The LDS Church owned a great deal of Coke a Cola STOCK... for quite some time. They did not own the company, but owning stock in Coke is a bit hypocrytical since Coke contains caffiene.

They also, own/owned a couple media outlets (KSL tv... SLC NBC affiliate, and KSL1160... its radio sister station, also they own a SLC PBS station.)


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Rose]
    #4167299 - 05/12/05 04:22 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

The LDS Church owned a great deal of Coke a Cola STOCK... for quite some time.

Yeah, you heard it from a friend of a friend, right?  :smirk:


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Phluck]
    #4169372 - 05/13/05 01:27 AM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Mormonism has a revolving door. They gain lots of converts, but they also lose alot as well. Anyway, most of the time they are pretty moral so I'm not really afraid of Mormons owning major corporations.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Phluck]
    #4169532 - 05/13/05 02:06 AM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Naw, my extended family (in Utah, everybody's extended family)... Mormons... they owned/ran a Coke bottle company... in Utah. There's good money in soda. :wink:

But, now that I think of it... how the hell would my family know where their church invested their money? They may have heard the same rumor, and embraced it, 'cause Coke was their trade. :smile:

But, I didn't say Mormons owned all of Coke, I said they have invested in the company. I did say the LDS church owned Stock in Coke, and I am sure (but I can't prove it) that Coke stock passed through their hands... but that likely is more innocent than it sounds.

I admit, I may have overstated the scope of LDS involvement in Coke a Cola Co. My bad.

Where did this rumor start? Perhaps my extended family donated some stock to their church and it was sold off. Perhaps someone died and willed their estate (including Coke stock) to their church...

It may have been Utah Mormons, investing in local Coke distributors... and eventually the story grew to an outrageous size... or something...

I'm pretty sure there's some hidden truth in this wive's tale. There was a lot of pre-decaf cola in rural Utah. And in rural Utah, if something is sold, its a safe bet the Mormons have a hand in it. Can I prove it? Nope... but rural Utah Mormons could walk to the corner store, and buy a Coke. The Coke was bottled locally. At some point in time and to this day, in Utah at least, Mormons bottled and sold Coke, to Mormons. That much I can prove.

The LDS church is very wealthy, and invests in many things. They own several malls, media outlets and a section of Downtown SLC sidewalk. And let's not forget Utah's very own Porn Czar!

But, I digress... I imagine, and have heard, the LDS investments are often changing (to earn better interest)... I wouldn't blame the LDS for investing in Coke, especially during the cola wars of the 1980's (When this wive's tale seemed gather new momentum). It would have been a wise investment.

The LDS church, like most, is a business, to be a Mormon, you REALLY should tythe 10% of your $$$, so the LDS Church gets more $$$ per-capita than most churches. That Money is often quickly and wisely, invested.


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OfflineDruginduced
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #4172182 - 05/13/05 06:36 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

sos said:
there is a mandatory tithe of ten percent of all income for all members. zero tolerance for the non payers.




I was raised a mormon, i have been "inactive" for going on three years. I have not paid a tithe for over 4 years. I am still considered a member. You are not as informed as you think you are... Do a little more research please before spreading false information.

Starting drama may be a way for you to subconciously (or conciously) convice yourself you have participation and purpose in this world, but please ask yourself if it is really worth it when it involves harming the reputation of others that you know nothing or very little about.

Quote:

sos said:
Mormons will be the majority in about 60 years time. Prepare yourself for public mormon domination.




Judging by what I know of the mormon community (which is a lot, since I attended the church for about 18 years of my life), I would rather have mormons as the religious majority than any other form of christian religion as the religious majority. And make sure you notice i said "christian religion". There are other religions that are not considered Christian that I would prefer to be the religious majority in western civilization.


Before creating this post... I am wondering why it has a "flame" symbol next to it when viewed from the listing of topics in Spirituality and philosophy... this user is obviously trying to just create drama in a forum where topics of more consequence usually reign (in my experience viewing this forum which i will admit has not reached the status of "veteran" yet.).

ban or ignore this user.

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OfflineDruginduced
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: question_for_joo]
    #4172198 - 05/13/05 06:40 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

question_for_joo said:
Scary. The mormon religion is so weird. They believe in this extra part of the bible that some 19th century dood found on some dinner plates buried underground. I think it's mostly cause some guys living in the Victorian era wanted to hump a different honey each night of the week though.




They are not more "weird" than any other religion out there. ( and I consider all forms of organized religion to be bullshit at this point in my life)

Joseph Smith was the first prophet of the modernday mormon religion, according to mormonism he found the book of mormon (what you refer to as the extra part of teh bible) buried in the hill Cumorah written on golden plates. You can consider a 'plate' to be the equivalent of a piece of paper that would not decay as quickly as paper.

I strongly doubt that your final assumption in your post has any relevance whatsoever.

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OfflineDruginduced
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: sos]
    #4172201 - 05/13/05 06:40 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

sos said:
yeah i heard the highest part of mormon royalty is very deep into incestious relations.




false, yet again.

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OfflineDruginduced
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: Archemetis]
    #4172216 - 05/13/05 06:43 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Archemetis said:
there is so much indoctrination that goes on in those buildings, especially towards the children. thank god my mind has been able to recover...(with the help of my good freind lsd) seriously though, these people are strange.




i agree that a lot of brainwashing occurs with young children in the mormon church, i grew up in it and i am slowly but surely recovering from it. "these people" are no more strange than any other group of religious zealots in the world, which there are many.

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OfflineDruginduced
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #4172263 - 05/13/05 06:53 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

KingOftheThing said:
of all the major religions i personally depise mormonism the most




Why? I strongly doubt you have any significant reasons to justify this statement.

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OfflineDruginduced
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Worf]
    #4172363 - 05/13/05 07:10 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

outputrotation said:
Most Mormons are hypocritical bigots who think they are better than non-mormons.  They think non-mormons are the immoral scum of the earth, but at the same time they never follow any of their rules. 




Most People are hypocritical bigots. They say one thing and do another.

Quote:

outputrotation said:
For example if a mormon business only wants to hire mormons, they will call the church directly.  If you ever get in jail they will post bail. Get discounts at certain restaurants.  Are favored by cops, teachers, and basically anybody with any sort of authority.





The business thing is complete bullshit, my father is a devoted mormon, a member of the bishopbric (sp?) he owns his own company and knowing him, he would have only mormons work for him if possible. He favors mormons over other people. He has a bunch of non mormons working for him, always talking about drinking on the weekends and going to strip clubs (which are against mormon rules).

They will NOT post bail if you get in jail. My little brother was sent to jail for shoplifting and my parents had to bail him out, and pay for a lawyer for him.

The discount thing may be possible, but no different than if you have personal friends yourself that own a restaurant. you would most likely get a discoutn as well.

The last sentece of your above quote is just silly... I have personal experience with being pulled over multiple times in UTAH and the cop knowing that i was mormon still gave me a ticket ans showed me no mercy everytime. I have never gotten out of a ticket. I was even arrested for "reckless burning" in which the cop knew i was mormon and he showed me no favor. I received a punishment that any other person would receive.

Quote:

outputrotation said:
Thats why so many people pay the tithing.  They SAY it is optional but I guarantee you, if you don't pay it they will hound you and you lose all of those benefits in addition to being stigmatized by the mormon community.




So many pay tithing because of their devotion to the religion. It is just like any other religion really.  They will not hound you if you dont pay tithing. You will not be stigmatized by the mormon community because your bishop will not tell the mormon community that you dont pay tithing.

So much bullshit in this thread. I will be back later to point more of it out. :thumbdown:

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OfflineDruginduced
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Jellric]
    #4172712 - 05/13/05 08:52 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Jellric said:
As far a being bigots, the Mormons I have met were very compassionate and tolerant.

Most cults will turn their nice face towards outsiders as long as they don't challenge them. Then you will see their dark side. That goes double for those in the cult who violate their rigid dogma. If they acted as they truly are no one would ever join them and they know that




Wow... this is just absurdly rediculous. You think that there is some sort of huge conspiracy among mormons to act one way around nonmembers and then act a compltely different way any other time? I consider my self a very paranoid person, but I think you may be lightyears beyond any levels of paranoia that i have attained. If you "violate their rigid dogma" you wont receive any crazy punishment or consequence as you tend to think.

I attended BYU for three years and some of my friends there were discommunicated (kicked out) from the church for various reasons (drugs, sex). These friends were not subject to any sort of punishment besides being unable to participate in certain mormon activities. They were still welcomed to attend church and members even encouraged them to attend still.

You should see a psychologist/psychiatrist/counselor.

I am currently seeing a psychiatrist, so my statement above is realy not biased. If you find a good one they could help you through some of your issues.

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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Druginduced]
    #4172995 - 05/13/05 10:31 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

RydawgSupreme said:
I attended BYU for three years...




I went to the U of U and graduated. Good football team this year. :smirk:

I'd love to discuss your theology with you.

Quote:

RydawgSupreme said:
...and some of my friends there were discommunicated (kicked out) from the church for various reasons (drugs, sex).




Don't you mean EXcommunicated for drugs and/or homosexuality?

Druggies and homosexuals are about the only people (other than the ones who denounce their faith) who get the boot from the Mormon Saints of the LD.

OK, I noticed you haven't addressed any of my posts, yet... and I have a few questions, most of whitch I have discussed in more detail, in earlier posts.

Here's a few new questions...

What happens in the temple? What is hidden from non-members? Durring marraige, why are crotches sometimes grabbed?

And a few old ones...

What do you think of the woman's role in the LDS church?

Does the LDS church teach that Cain became black after killing Abel? And are all black people related to the first murderer?

Are garments just cloth, or are they magic underwear?

How does a man become President of the LDS church, and when exactly does he become prophet? Before or after God tells him he's President? How does this make him a profit? Am I missing something?

Your thoughts on free speech on Main Street SLC?

And, for the South Park fans...

Why couldn't Prophet Smith translate that golden plate a second time? How exactly is this proof he wasn't full of shit?

And finally, out of morbid curiosoty...

Your thoughts on the Mark Hofmann bombings and documents?


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Rose]
    #4173641 - 05/14/05 04:04 AM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Cervantes said:
How does a man become President of the LDS church, and when exactly does he become prophet? Before or after God tells him he's President? How does this make him a profit? Am I missing something?




It will make him a profit if he uses his position as a President/prophet to intimidate others into taking part in high-stakes tupperware transactions. :grin:

:lol: Sorry, couldn't resist. :wink:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:


--------------------
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Like being here
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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 2080? [Re: sos]
    #4175862 - 05/14/05 07:08 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

In the year 2080 there is projected to be around 250 million mormons.




theres already alot more morons than that...


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OfflineDruginduced
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Re: Mormons internation tyrant cult of our nightmares in 208 [Re: Rose]
    #4176108 - 05/14/05 08:22 PM (18 years, 10 months ago)

I will answer your questions to the best of my ability, i must say that i have been spending a lot of time in the past 5 or so years trying to forget about my upbringing in the mormon church. And also trying to break my mind from social stigmas imposed upon it by the lds church. What has worked best so far is smoking a lot of marijuana... hehe  :smile:.

I will also note i had been drinking heavily before, during and after the time my posts in this thread were made. I am also drinking right now. Im kind of an alcoholic. oh well.

Quote:

Cervantes said:
Don't you mean EXcommunicated for drugs and/or homosexuality?




Reading over what I wrote, I meant to say '"disfellowed" from the church'. None of my friends were excommunicated. Two friends were disfellowed, one for having  sex (with a woman if you were wondering) in a dorm room and another for doing to many drugs not covering his tracks sufficiently.

In addition to homosexuality and drug use, i have heard stories from church officials (who were of higher status than a bishop) of people being excommunicated for adultery. Still I have never known anyone who has been excommunicated first hand, and I don't like spreading rumors. That story could possibly just be made up..

Quote:

Cervantes said:
What happens in the temple? What is hidden from non-members? Durring marraige, why are crotches sometimes grabbed?




The furthest I have been inside a temple is for doing baptisms for the dead. The post made earlier in this thread about what goes on during a baptism for the dead is quite accurate so i will not go into detail about it. About the other things that happen in a temple... I have also been kept in the dark. They are well kept secrets! I am pretty sure that it would only take me 15 minutes or so to search on google and find out all the secrets if i was inclined to do so. I suggest you try that if you really want to know! But i really do doubt that anything of much interest happens in there.

As for the crotch grabbing thing, i have never before heard anything about that.

Quote:

Cervantes said:
What do you think of the woman's role in the LDS church?




The biggest difference about male and female roles in the church is that men can hold the priesthood while women cannot. Though I always heard in sunday school that in marriage, women can somehow utilize the powers of priesthood through their husband. But i am not completely clear on the details of that. Male preisthood holders are still the only ones who can give 'blessings' to the sick, or to those who feel they need them.

Other than having zero tolerance for women to hold the priesthood, the role that women play in the lds church is really not that different from the role that women play in america, which is for the most part very socially accepted these days. Women dont hold very high positions in the lds church, and neither do they hold very high positions in american government.

I can say from experience that no blatant sexism occurs in the church in this day and age. Women are treated with the same respect as men by church leaders (bishops, etc) and even average members.


Quote:

Cervantes said:
Does the LDS church teach that Cain became black after killing Abel? And are all black people related to the first murderer?




I have never heard it stated exactly like that. There is a story in the book of mormon about a tribe of Lamanites who were marked or cursed (i cant recall what it actually says) because they were so evil. Although it is never actually taught verbatim in sunday school, if you ask any lds member who puts a lot of time and effort into study of church doctrine they would most likely say that the mark/curse was black skin. And i have heard it from more than a just a few members, including my father.

Quote:

Cervantes said:
Are garments just cloth, or are they magic underwear?




Stories are always circulated amongst church members of the protective power of garments. I have heard stories told during church 'sermons' of lds members caught in burning buildings. supposedly they were burned on their legs and arms, but no burns were any where the garments covered their body. It is implied that garments will protect you if you follow the word of god. I never wore garments so I don't know if they tell you more about them when you are about to receive a pair.

Quote:

Cervantes said:
How does a man become President of the LDS church, and when exactly does he become prophet? Before or after God tells him he's President? How does this make him a profit? Am I missing something?




I think that it takes blind faith to believe in prophets. In my opinion no man is favored by god any more than another man. No one receives special privleges from god that others will never have teh possibilty of obtaining.

As for the answer to your question, I can say that 90% of mormons would not know the inner workings of choosing the prophet and when exactly a man becomes a prophet. From my experience with the mormon church, i would guess that it involves a lot of prayers and talking among the apostles when the current president of the church dies. Prophets are always (as far as i know) chosen from one of the twelve apostles. I think it generally goes in order of who has been an apostle the longest. Who ever has been an apostle the longest usually becomes prophet. New apostles are usually chosen from the Quorum of the Seventy.

The difference between a prophet and an apostle is very minimal however... Once again I don't know the exact details, but if i recall correctly, apostles are only missing one 'key' of the priesthood that makes them unable to be a prophet.  And the word prophet in mormon terms means that you are capable of direct communication with god and jesus.

Quote:

Cervantes said:
Your thoughts on free speech on Main Street SLC?




Im not really sure why you would want my thoughts on this as I don't think this question relates to the mormon church very much, but more to my personal ideologies and beliefs. I think free speech should be the same on any street in any city. Organizations and religions should not have the power to regulate where the constitution applies and where it does not.

I drove down main street in SLC a number of times while attending BYU, blasting music in my car with language that would be considered obscene by most mormons. I also saw a lot of homeless people roaming SLC and a few even right on main street. One of them talked to me when I was stopped at a red light and wanted me to run the red light for soem reason. i didn't do it if you were wondering! The point of this random story is that people generally arent hasseld by police or mormon militia on main street of SLC any more than you would be in another city...

I attended the mormon church's General Conference a year or two ago. their conference building is very close to main street. I took a trolley down main street to get to the conference building. Lining the sidewalks and streets outside of the conference building were tons of anti-mormon protesters hold signs and yelling, saying that mormons were the devil and what not. Theres no way you can say that freedom of speech was restricted in this situation...


Quote:

Cervantes said:
(south park question)

Your thoughts on the Mark Hofmann bombings and documents?




I saw the south park episode about mormons and it just tried to make mormonism look foolish. its no more foolish to be mormon than it is to devote yourself to any other religion.

I have never before heard of mark hoffman or his bombings or documents. I read up about it just now. It is really no surprise to me that his documents fooled church leaders. as i said earlier, In my opinion no man is favored by god any more than another man. Mormons (even those attending BYU) who say one thing but do another are a dime a dozen. and further more, people in general who say one thing but do another are a dime a dozen.  You cant really blame the organization for trusting one of its affiliates when this affiliate was really seeking to cause them harm. it has happened a countless number of times in the history of the world and it will happen a countless number yet to come.

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