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InvisibleSwami
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Psychedelic Religions
    #3038515 - 08/23/04 04:22 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Note: This is a spin-off from SillySimons' thread.

Herein lies the problem with most endeavors of this kind - and it will NEVER change. Anytime a group gets together for a single purpose, rules and ideas, whether written or implied, will be adopted. To be a part of the group, one MUST accept most of the general ideas or will not be allowed to participate. It may not be a physical barring, but a group vibe.

The ideas adopted will usually come from the strongest or most charismatic member(s).

Don't believe me? Spend a week on the Ayahuasca board (www.ayahuasca.com). One must practically bow before the vine. Go to a Santo Daime service and make up your own rules and see what happens. Spend time with Huichol Indians in a peyote ceremony.

Rules, regulations, and singular cultural identity will ALWAYS form.

Trip solo or with a few close friends and leave it at that, then come back here to discuss (because I need new material :smile:).


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Edited by Swami (08/23/04 04:52 AM)


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OfflinePsiloman
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: Swami]
    #3038522 - 08/23/04 04:35 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Well,thats the fate of all religions and churches...They start out nice and then they loose their purpose...

Rules and restrictions is what our minds fest on.Even the brain has its own "restrictions" in the sense that it has filters of many sorts!

Personally,i wouldnt undertake the task of being a "psychedelic Messiah".If some people get interested in mushrooms lets say its fine.Solo exploration can give many rewards sometimes.I believe its quite well understood that joining the churches forums and tribes you mentioned one has to follow rules,that why i wouldnt like to join actively.

On the other hand we embrace ideas and we obey rules and regulations in this forum as well...Oh MY GOD!!!! WE DO THE SAME IN SOCIETY AS WELL!!!!!


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Offlinesillysimon
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: Swami]
    #3038606 - 08/23/04 05:44 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

also note that the idea of starting a religion is soley anothers idea

i too find problems with this because it is using the same thing that i want to stray people away from and using it as a tool.. like swami said... trade one culture box for another...

i would not start a religion.. i would spread information.. i could deal with an organized meeting for people to be enlightend together.. but no rules or pamplets or hymns...( okay maybe a pamplet stating facts about psilocybin, but thats it!!!)


--------------------
In the dawn my toes are cold They spread their little trinkets on the ground In the hall By the closet door They creep into my bed without sound On a cube In a plastic egg A hundred fabric figures in a pile See them march Toward me And dance across the floor trippily Little faces keep no track of time Little faces speaking out in rhyme Little faces smiling in my mind Tiny doors For walking through sticky fingers clutch forbidden things the phone For talking through Sinking ships On a foamy sea That tumbles from the motion of filthy Little hands In the dark When eyes are wide listen to secrets that I tell In a ball On tiny beds Or beneath them where the shadow people dwell moon Beams split the night Leave bars of yellow pasted on their faces As they drift into a dream


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OfflineZoso_UK
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: Swami]
    #3039030 - 08/23/04 11:55 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Its the nature of religious people to form rules in order to give them a well-defined sense of purpose. Ultimately, to feel that one has and is fulfilling their purpose is one of the most satisfying parts of human experience.

I prefer psychedelic spirituality to religion since I believe that flexibility and freedom are necessary to development. Positive development at least. My purpose as I see it is to be constantly developing and changing.


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OfflineGazzBut
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: Swami]
    #3039192 - 08/23/04 12:57 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Anytime a group gets together for a single purpose, rules and ideas, whether written or implied, will be adopted. To be a part of the group, one MUST accept most of the general ideas or will not be allowed to participate. It may not be a physical barring, but a group vibe.





As long as you are aware of this and maintain your ability to see any failings in the ideas of the group you become a part of then I dont think that is a problem. How else are groups supposed to operate? Surely they require some form of structure to function.


--------------------
Always Smi2le


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: Zoso_UK]
    #3039327 - 08/23/04 01:35 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

to choose to play any kind of game one must be prepared to jump in, and one must be allowed to jump out.

Just a game:
"Time for dinner johnny!!"
"Phew!..."

wanna play church?


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: GazzBut]
    #3039776 - 08/23/04 03:43 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Surely they require some form of structure to function.

Good point and true to a degree, but here is where I differ.

When I stayed at Ananda, some American devotees adopted Sanskrit names. This is not a necessity; nor is using certain non-technical terms or cliquish phrases such as "So it is; so it shall be," or "Om Mani Padme Hum," nor is wearing orange robes or white shirts and black ties. This outward agreement to look and speak the same is hardly freeing. A group identity is not required for growth.

Let's take an ayahuasca group for instance. Surely we must have some purpose and agree to partake regularly at such and such a location and arrive arround the same time. These things are basic and necessary. But is it mandatory that I believe a spirit exists in the vine or that "la purga" is an integral part of the journey and not a bodily reaction to excessive tannins or be an outcast if I disagree ? A conclusion should be arrived at naturally on one's own and NOT be a result of dogmatic peer pressure. I have yet to see an example of this not happening.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineZoso_UK
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: Swami]
    #3039830 - 08/23/04 03:55 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

This state of affairs is certainly not unique to religions and can be just as common in many non-religious 'clubs'. I would say that psychedelic religions are less controlling/stringent than other religions but I'm not very well informed of them so perhaps someone else could say?


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: Zoso_UK]
    #3039887 - 08/23/04 04:06 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Of course. We love drawing lines around us and them. (See my new thread).


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinesillysimon
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: Swami]
    #3040545 - 08/23/04 07:50 PM (13 years, 1 month ago)

I feel like i erase lines by offering a new light.. (not a god damn religion) because when i promote love, besdies how i feel about a person inside.. rascism disintergrates.

dont take what others say in my thread and put the words in my mouth


--------------------
In the dawn my toes are cold They spread their little trinkets on the ground In the hall By the closet door They creep into my bed without sound On a cube In a plastic egg A hundred fabric figures in a pile See them march Toward me And dance across the floor trippily Little faces keep no track of time Little faces speaking out in rhyme Little faces smiling in my mind Tiny doors For walking through sticky fingers clutch forbidden things the phone For talking through Sinking ships On a foamy sea That tumbles from the motion of filthy Little hands In the dark When eyes are wide listen to secrets that I tell In a ball On tiny beds Or beneath them where the shadow people dwell moon Beams split the night Leave bars of yellow pasted on their faces As they drift into a dream


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InvisibleSwami
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Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
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Re: Psychedelic Religions [Re: sillysimon]
    #3042004 - 08/24/04 12:59 AM (13 years, 1 month ago)

Put words?????

I was crediting you with inspiring this topic for discussion. My bad.

DISCLAIMER: I RETRACT ANY ASSOCIATION OF THIS THREAD WITH ANY OTHER THREAD AND HERETOFORE...


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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