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Anonymous

Counterfeiting
    #3037621 - 08/22/04 10:26 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

why should it be a crime to make copies of federal reserve notes?

if they represented a contract on behalf on the issuing agency to pay the bearer in bullion, or some other commodity, in exchange for the note (as paper currency should), then it would be something entirely different. they don't.

a federal reserve note is just a peice of paper printed by a private organization that doesn't establish any contract binding to that organization (as say... a concert ticket does).

why can't any of us print our own federal reserve notes?


Edited by Anonymous (08/22/04 10:45 PM)


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InvisibleEvolving
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Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
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Re: Counterfeiting [Re: ]
    #3037668 - 08/22/04 10:38 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Competition is bad, mmmkay. Only agencies duly authorized by the federal government should be allowed to profit from the production of fiat currency. It has something to do with the 'divine right of kings' (aka, 'the social contract').


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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OfflineBleaK
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Re: Counterfeiting [Re: Evolving]
    #3038393 - 08/23/04 03:18 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

what do you mean....?

you guys dont counterfit....? :wink:


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"You cannot trust in law, unless you can trust in people. If you can trust in people, you don't need law." -J. Mumma


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: Counterfeiting [Re: ]
    #3038394 - 08/23/04 03:18 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

yeah, as a matter of fact, I should be able to trade my crude pornographic stick figure drawings for goods and services.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Counterfeiting [Re: ]
    #3038848 - 08/23/04 10:22 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

> why can't any of us print our own federal reserve notes?

Copyright infringment? Of course, if it is federal government, it should be public domain... interesting question.


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Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineCyber
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Re: Counterfeiting [Re: ]
    #3038890 - 08/23/04 10:53 AM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

18 U.S.C. ? 471

Sec. 471. - Obligations or securities of United States

Whoever, with intent to defraud, falsely makes, forges, counterfeits, or alters any obligation or other security of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both





Note the intent to defraud. There are several cases where a person copied a 100$ bill and then while at a store explained to the manager that it was his "ART" and he would like to barter it for face value. Those cases have been ruled as the sale of art and not counterfeiting because there was no intent to defraud.

Also note that possession of a counterfeit bill is not illegal. Only trying to pass the bill as a real bill.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Counterfeiting [Re: DoctorJ]
    #3039103 - 08/23/04 12:23 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DoctorJ said:
yeah, as a matter of fact, I should be able to trade my crude pornographic stick figure drawings for goods and services.



http://www.commujism.com/


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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Anonymous

Re: Counterfeiting [Re: Cyber]
    #3040186 - 08/23/04 05:56 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Whoever, with intent to defraud, falsely makes, forges, counterfeits, or alters any obligation or other security of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both

federal reserve notes are not obligations or securities of the united states government (or anyone else).


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Anonymous

Re: Counterfeiting [Re: ]
    #3040461 - 08/23/04 07:32 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Interesting... why don't you print some counterfeit bills and get caught on purpose trying to use them. So when you go to court you can tell the judge it's not really against the law.

If 20 years in prison weren't on the line, someone actually might be able to do this. Oh well.


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OfflineCyber
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Re: Counterfeiting [Re: ]
    #3040619 - 08/23/04 08:08 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

mushmaster said:
Whoever, with intent to defraud, falsely makes, forges, counterfeits, or alters any obligation or other security of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both

federal reserve notes are not obligations or securities of the united states government (or anyone else).




No argument from me. I was just quoting the law.


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OfflineLearyfan
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Re: Counterfeiting [Re: DoctorJ]
    #3040768 - 08/23/04 08:53 PM (12 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

DoctorJ said:
yeah, as a matter of fact, I should be able to trade my crude pornographic stick figure drawings for goods and services.



:lol:


But seriously, if everyone counter fitted bills it would fuck up everything.

I was at a cigar shop the other day, and the guy at the desk told me that someone tried to use a counter fitted $1 bill. :lol: I said, well it does kind of make sense. Who looks to see if $1 bills are counter fit?





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