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Offlinekadakuda
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Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source?
    #3030812 - 08/21/04 01:28 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

What are all your opinions on Phalaris arundinacea? is it a worth while source for dmt? can it be smoked as a raw plant or is extraction need? I also cant seem to find what % is in the plant. erowid says 60mg per 100g (net gossip)<------that worries me a bit.

so if thats all right and true its about 1/3 teh amount of Psychotria (erowid says 200 mg/100g). so being totally ignorant im assuming you can just add 3 times as much? are there other chems in it that can cause problems?

so yeah if someone could help me out. i prefer this over psychotria as i can grow this in my yard 365 days a year and so far it seems easy to do.


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The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.


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Offlinekadakuda
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: kadakuda]
    #3030828 - 08/21/04 01:31 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

http://deoxy.org/smokedmt.htm

just found this site, seems pretty good.


edit.

im having a really hard time finding out what exactly it looks like as i want to id it around here. i have found many different looking pics all claiming it to be P.a.

http://www.agry.purdue.edu/ext/forages/grass_images/Reed_canary/Can3.JPG
http://www.boga.ruhr-uni-bochum.de/html/Phalaris.arundinacea.ja1.jpg
http://genevrier.be/poacees/Phalaris_arundinacea/Phalaris_arundinacea_0607-2002_2.jpg
http://www.kaaos.info/puutarha/kotisivukuvat/phalaris%20arundinacea.JPG

some of these plants that are labelled "Phalaris arundinacea" are as different as apples and oranges. anyoen got a good link to proper identification of Phalaris arundinacea?

thanks


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The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.


Edited by kadakuda (08/21/04 01:48 AM)


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OfflineAneglakya
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: kadakuda]
    #3031215 - 08/21/04 03:28 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

most people over at DMTworld (hosted by the lycaeum) will tell you its a waste of time but if its the only resource you have, I recommend pursuing it. I think its a nice, and easily propagated, addition to any garden but I would never dare pay for the stuff. Also understand there is a lot of contriversy about whether or not wild plants have been domesticated and hybridized not to contain tryptamine as they have been causing cases of "The Stagers Syndrome".


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OfflineHooty
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: Aneglakya]
    #3031241 - 08/21/04 03:37 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

i don't guess I'm familiar with that term, "The Stagers Syndrome", could you elaborate on that?


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OfflineAneglakya
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: Hooty]
    #3031276 - 08/21/04 03:46 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Cows or sheep eat the grass and go into a sort of stupor.

Some animals will start eating plants like Astragalus (loco weed) and become intoxicated, locoweed in particular is toxic and causes nerve damage (i believe its nerve damage) to the animal .. They will give up their normal palatable food diet to intoxicate and eventually kill themselves on these plants.

Animals and Psychedelics is an alright book... i dont like the layout and the author isn't nessessarily my favorite, but it does have some cool info. I have several extra copies if anyone wants to trade/buy one.


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Offlinekadakuda
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: Aneglakya]
    #3031355 - 08/21/04 04:07 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

wow, pretty interesting. i only read about it in sheep, does it cause any of the smae effects on humans?

i wouldnt pay for it either, its just everywhere im told. i see all teh grasses that apear in the pics, i just do not know which one it is. would doing a simple alcohol extract possibly get rid of whatever causes the "the staggers" or any other such problem?

from reading on the internet i was under the impression it was a nice easy fast growing source of dmt that is easily consumed. would you consider that to be true?

how much $ for the books?

edit: just found a really goodpage about iding them. apperently there are many (dozenish) varieties and can be very difficult to distinguish between native ones. Also explains how to id from other look alikes. heres the link, its a really good read.

http://tncweeds.ucdavis.edu/esadocs/documnts/phalaru.pdf


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The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.


Edited by kadakuda (08/21/04 05:01 AM)


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OfflineAneglakya
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: kadakuda]
    #3031634 - 08/21/04 06:54 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

well i thought the stagers was caused by the tryptamine content.

there are a lot of grasses that look like phalaris.. it IS extremely common, i've seen huge amounts along river banks in my area and confirmed that it is the correct species with a local botanist. I suggest, before you consider ingesting it (supposing thats your intention), to get a 100% POSITIVE ID. Just like with mushrooms. Also consider the fact that any pollutants in the soil or river can be obsorbed by the plant so you may be consuming toxic components if you decide to use this plant as some sort of ayahausca analouge.

if you are going to try an extraction with phalaris I believe you are suppost to simply follow the same A/B extraction method used for jumera and other tryptamine carriers.

IMO its not the best source of DMT as, i think, it also contains some other crappy chemicals like Gramamine or gramine or whatever. (I know arundo donax contains it too).

In Jim dekorne's book, Psychedelic shamanism, he seems to think you can make a "smokable extract" from the grass by doing a simple alcohol extraction but this guy doesn't really know shit and most of the people i've talked to about it disagree with him.

Now there is one guy that posts here in the ethnogarden, RussCan or something like that, he seems to think that there are strains of phalaris that are highly potent and smokable in raw form. If one was lucky to come across such a strain I believe it would be worth it to send it in to a lab and have them measure the content of various tryptamine, then proceed to propagate the plant in bulk for good marketability (I dont mean to turn over a profit, i mean that everyone should have access to said plant) .

A good ID book with pictures of various phalaris species in it is Weeds of the West. Its a rather expensive book but has several psychoactive plants and extremely detailed photographs. Deff. one of my favorites.


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OfflineHooty
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: Aneglakya]
    #3032429 - 08/21/04 02:08 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

I never got any results from a bioassay of the strain RussCan was talking about. Of course I didn't try too much of it either...it's like burning hay.


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Without love in the dream
It will never come true


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OfflineAneglakya
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: Hooty]
    #3032496 - 08/21/04 02:32 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Neither did hooty. At least he was nice enough to send a sample, i had my doubts though. Could have been our method or something, but i didn't get much from it at all. Some people have allies, and some people are VERY sensative to plants that are otherwise inactive to other people. I happen to be very sensative to california poppy and prefer it to most other smoking herbs while others dont get anything from it. This is what I love about entheogens, we all have our allies and this is an excellent way of learning from each other. Russ knew things about phalaris that I never would have dreamed of.


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Offlinekadakuda
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: Aneglakya]
    #3034956 - 08/22/04 02:26 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

I'm all gung-ho about this and have been at the library looking in books (too poor to afford all teh books and shit i want) and i think i may have id down, or i hope. i'll still check in at the university before ingesting fo rsure!

My main hold back, and i am very seriously concerned, is about these other chemicals. i realise all plants have potential draw backs such as this, but it is somthing i am not will to risk.

Do the "Gramamine" and other nasty chems get extracted with alcohol? if so is there anyway of spereating them from the dmt?


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The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.


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Invisibleutopianglory
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Registered: 07/20/02
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: kadakuda]
    #3034984 - 08/22/04 02:36 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Arunidinacea does not have buffetinine (whatever the spelling is), but aquatica does. You can OD on the buf so you have to be careful.

I was the one who did that silly old message board archive on dmtworld. Never did manage to get the finished product though.

Infact I never really managed to do a positive ID on arundinacea.


Edited by utopianglory (08/22/04 02:38 AM)


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Offlinekadakuda
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: utopianglory]
    #3035031 - 08/22/04 02:55 AM (12 years, 6 months ago)

do you have any other info about other chems in this plant? i am almost ready to give up as its starting to get me paranoid.


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The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: kadakuda]
    #3036895 - 08/22/04 07:09 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

Personally, I would like to grow bundle flower, and not ALL acacia  are endangered, and I have heard about someone in the UK growing one :laugh:

The UK, the west coast of canada share similar weather, as they are part of the "banana belt".

Heres the point........

"My acacia maidenii is now taller than I am, and will no longer fit in my greenhouse without some pruning. I'm in the UK, and wondering if this plant would survive frost if I was to plant it outside ?"


http://forums.spiritplants.com/index.php?showtopic=12860&st=0&#entry92608

I dont know if the DMT in this tree is in the leaves of the bark, but I have read list of plants that contain DMT and there are MANY, and certain acacia tree species and bundle flower(Desmanthus illinoensis) seem like the best options for this part of the world.


http://www.erowid.org/plants/d_illinoensis/d_illinoensis.shtml)


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: kadakuda]
    #3036919 - 08/22/04 07:17 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

and heres one more thing to think about

http://www.b-and-t-world-seeds.com/a1.asp?title=Acacia+Seeds&List=27 :laugh:

I am not sure if all of those trees have DMT,does anyone know how many do???, I read "sources of tryptamines" , or something with a similar name, but I cant find it right now.......anyway, the Acaia family is one of the best options, I just wish I could find the list of "active" trees.


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Offlinekadakuda
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Re: Phalaris arundinacea, worth while source? [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #3049645 - 08/25/04 07:36 PM (12 years, 6 months ago)

thanks man. lots of stuff to digest in there. i have now given up on it and am in search of other plants for this purpose. i was at one point going to have a planter of this and try growing shrooms in it. anyway time will tell but its not for me right now i guess.


--------------------
The seeds you won't sow are the plants you dont grow.


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Amazon Shop for: Astragalus, Portable Greenhouse

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> The Ethnobotanical Garden

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