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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Help me not feel like a nihilist
    #2977278 - 08/08/04 02:43 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I don't know how so many people feel better about their lives because of drugs. To some extent every chemical I've tried, and especially weed, (not so much mescaline) has shown me that everything is an illusion, nothing matters, nobody exists and that this is all there is. It really depresses me. I stay clean now and I have been working on building a positive state of mind, but I am afraid that it is all false. I feel like I am the only one smart enough to get the cruel joke that we are all just machines who imagine to exist, to have indepedence and freedom, but really we're nothing but meaningless numbers.
Somedays I will start feeline really happy, and then I remember it's all a dream. That one thought tears it all down and somehow overrides any other thought or emotion.
It's like on the absolute deepest level of my awareness I feel total confusion and a hole where my soul should be. Is there anything to believe in? Is there any sense to it all?


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Offlinecastaway
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2977486 - 08/08/04 05:48 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I think depression is a natural end in itself in that it forces us to the conclusion that life in all it's varied expanses just isn't enough.

Eventually we get to the point where we cant exist without the knowledge that there is something greater going on and that life isn't just pointless rambling.

So I guess depression can be constructive in that manner.(im not helping am I)


Edited by castaway (08/08/04 05:54 AM)


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Invisiblemycopsycho
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2977589 - 08/08/04 08:39 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

you don't sound like an aware person. if anything, trying all those substances should have shown you that there is more than this(after all, some of them instigate enlightenment).


--------------------
I Am The Sickness.

Diploid: I think adults have a right to make stupid decisions and it's nobody else's fucking business.


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Offlinecastaway
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: mycopsycho]
    #2977676 - 08/08/04 09:46 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I like your avatar


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OfflineHypnoToad
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2977729 - 08/08/04 10:48 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

To some extent every chemical I've tried, and especially weed, (not so much mescaline) has shown me that everything is an illusion, nothing matters, nobody exists and that this is all there is. It really depresses me.




Precisely.Drugs often give people a glimpse of truth.According to my personal beliefs and buddhism...The world is an illusion.An illusion created by the mind.The depression comes not from this fact but from the attachment to worldly things.One is not yet ready to give up such things yet the mind knows it is not real.The mind then becomes depressed.

You are definitely on the right path my friend.

And there is sense and purpose to everything.Even the tiniest bacteria have a noble purpose and duty.Everyone and everything has a purpose and duty and a place in life.

Quote:

Is there anything to believe in? 




That is for you to seek the answer to my friend.

Everything in essence is false.An illusion so naturally when one realizes this one worries that it really is false.

The confusion means you now need to do alot of "soul searching" and truth seeking.

In the end it will all make sense. :smile:


--------------------
"There is no fire like lust, no grip like hate, no net like delusions, no river like craving."



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Invisiblemycopsycho
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: HypnoToad]
    #2977817 - 08/08/04 11:49 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

thanks castaway!


--------------------
I Am The Sickness.

Diploid: I think adults have a right to make stupid decisions and it's nobody else's fucking business.


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2977869 - 08/08/04 12:13 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

HypnoToad, I just wish I could say there is something on the other side. It's like life as we know it is fake, but behind it is really just nothingness. It is a hard place to be in, nowhere you can really turn to for comfort. Hell, "you" and "comfort" are just appearences anyway. It is confusing.


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Invisiblevampirism
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2977883 - 08/08/04 12:19 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah.

but heres something that guided me down the right path: does it matter if and there IS anything? I chose no


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OfflineHypnoToad
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2978094 - 08/08/04 01:35 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Its natural for humans to want comfort.However is this world all comfort is truly an illusion and at a cost.Everything costs in one way or another and nothing is truly free.

In buddhist cosmology there are many planes....hells,heavens and other places altogether.This world is just one stopping point on the way.A learning place.A classroom for spirits so to speak.We learn our life lessons or dont and we either move on or come back here.Nothing can ever be truly destroyed it can only be transformed.So one can never really die in some senses.There is not one thing you can truly destroy in this world.

It is uncomfortable and confusing at first but in time that will go away in time.

As to your saying you wish you could say there is something on the other side...Did you not see it for yourself already?

Did you not already experience a plane other than here?


--------------------
"There is no fire like lust, no grip like hate, no net like delusions, no river like craving."



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Offlinebrowndustin
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: HypnoToad]
    #2978287 - 08/08/04 03:00 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

This is what I felt one time on mushrooms. It literally changed me just like that *snap*.

Things can and do feel really.. "empty". The only comforting thought that I can think of is that hey, I'm here, I might as well spend the rest of my life making myself better. That's something I can always embrace. On top of that, have fun. Yep. That's it... it's depressing and it's the only thing in my LIFE that's bothering me right now.
I'd love to do mushrooms right now too, but I feel that the emptyness might come back. A couple friends and I had a huge talk about this, but only one(and me) let it lead into a very bad trip.


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: HypnoToad]
    #2978584 - 08/08/04 04:51 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

HypnoToad said:
Its natural for humans to want comfort.However is this world all comfort is truly an illusion and at a cost.Everything costs in one way or another and nothing is truly free.

In buddhist cosmology there are many planes....hells,heavens and other places altogether.This world is just one stopping point on the way.A learning place.A classroom for spirits so to speak.We learn our life lessons or dont and we either move on or come back here.Nothing can ever be truly destroyed it can only be transformed.So one can never really die in some senses.There is not one thing you can truly destroy in this world.

It is uncomfortable and confusing at first but in time that will go away in time.

As to your saying you wish you could say there is something on the other side...Did you not see it for yourself already?

Did you not already experience a plane other than here?




In an intellectual sense I agree with you completely. I am also Buddhist, but lately it has been really hard not sliding into nihilism. Right now Buddhism really seems like nihilism and apathy, although I know (at least I hope) it is not. It seems like the only point to anything is to not be reborn into crappy lives anymore. When you reach cessation it seems like complete oblivion. I never thought Buddhism was really pessimistic, but from my recent experiences and from taking all of this to it's logical conclusion, it really is depressing. They say you are better off believing in absolute existence rather than non-existance, but to me impermenent and illusory existance is hardly any different than non-existance.

They say the true nature of Samsarra is suffering, but it least it seems pleasurable sometimes. In the Void there is nothing at all. No happiness or comfort, just silence.

I never saw anything on the other side. Just NOTHING. Like I was a mirror looking into another mirror and seeing nothing reflected back. Sure, I have felt cool sensations and seen pretty colors, or felt calm from meditation, but it all exists in the same tiny and impermenent continium. From my experience I can't say I have ever seen an other side, just a different view of this one that I'm trapped in.


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OfflineHypnoToad
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2978940 - 08/08/04 07:34 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

There is an other side.Buddhas are not reborn into this world but they do not cease to exist.They merely exist on other planes.They exist for many reasons including to help others in many ways.

Samsara is suffering because of pleasure and attachment.Pleasure is an illusion.All pleasure come at a cost sometimes a very great cost.Even if that cost is nothing more than the very attachment to that item.Attachment is the most ugly thing in any of the ten worlds.

I have seen other planes of existence and I assure you they are there.

Meditation,"soul" searching and prayer can bring more answers than anything I could ever say.

Right now you are in the "Dark Night of the Soul" stage.(Btw when I say soul is figurative speech refering to the innermost mind.Buddhists dont believe in souls.)

Now you will suffer great personal trial and great fear.You will worry like you are about everything being all wrong faith wise.You will wonder why,what is the point of it all.You will wonder many negative things.You will suffer much.

This is one stage on the path.But trust me once you emerge from this stage no matter how hard it is you will be happier than ever when you finally emerge.Have faith.It will be long and treacherous however like all things it is impermanent. :smile:


--------------------
"There is no fire like lust, no grip like hate, no net like delusions, no river like craving."



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OfflinePhishgrrl
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2981250 - 08/09/04 01:09 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

OMG I know how you feel.  I really do.  Interestingly, it was on the comedown of my last shroom trip when I felt this the most and was in utter fucking despair.  But when I went to bed, I just laid there in meditation and it was (for lack of a better way to explain it) like I saw the light at the end of the tunnel.

All around me was death, and destruction and despair, it was hell.  But In the middle of it all was a point of light.  And I realized that for that light to exist, there needed to be the Hell.  And I was overcome with peace because I truly knew the meaning of duality, and how for one to be, there needs to be the other.

I have felt this peace and beauty many times through meditation in the past also, but each day brings it's troubles and questions and it is essential to keep practicing meditation for me to be able to reconverge with the light.

It is something that is hard to conceive of with the rational mind, for me at least, and just something we have to trust in.  Not that we shouldn't try our hardest every day- to make the world a more beautiful loving place.  I still find it very very hard to accept the way things are- I struggle with it every day. And I am filled with hate and sorrow when I am confronted with images of our "leaders" and what they are doing to this world.  So I just try to keep away from that shit as much as possible, while doing my best to be an active bringer of peace and love to the world.

:heart: We are here for you, and know how you feel, and I really think that the Earth messengers, the mushrooms and sacred plants- are here to show us the truth, and the answers as well- if only we will listen and be open to them, and have faith in what they show us, we can and do change the world for the better. 

Much love to you. :heart:


--------------------
Once in awhile you can get shown the light

In the strangest of places if you look at it right...



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OfflineGrav
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2982473 - 08/09/04 06:05 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I tripped on mushrooms yesterday for the first time in a year.

I've experienced great loneliness and despair while tripping before. Like I pulled back the curtain to life and there was nothing there... only heartless gears, turning and turning.

But yesterday I met again with the hidden honor of being a human. The beauty of this place is indescribable and I think is like the Sun. If you get to close to it, than you'll burn up. The divinity is mind-shattering.

Everything is 'okay'. You know? Like it's a mess, but that's how it is. You are X years old and you've been here on this planet tooling around, doing whatever. Life is good, life sucks, life goes on. Dreams are born and destroyed everyday - but you just have to play your cards.

Maybe you need to confront something you feel you've failed in.
Maybe you need to kill a part of yourself.
Maybe you have to say something you've been holding in for a long time.
Maybe you need to reach out and take something for yourself.
Maybe the answer your looking so deep for, is really right under your nose.

in any case, you're not where you want to be, so you have to find a way out.
you gonna let a little negativity end the game?


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OfflineHypnoToad
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Grav]
    #2982858 - 08/09/04 07:42 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Maybe you need to confront something you feel you've failed in.
Maybe you need to kill a part of yourself.
Maybe you have to say something you've been holding in for a long time.
Maybe you need to reach out and take something for yourself.
Maybe the answer your looking so deep for, is really right under your nose.






One must kill the attachment to impermanent things.Alot of one's suffering is caused by attachment to impermanent things.

One holds all the answers the only thing missing is the right question.And then when one finds the right question,contemplation will bring the answer out from the deep recesses of one.

The fear of nothingness comes from attachment to the world.When one gives up attachment to the world...there is no sorrow for lost items,no sorrow if there is nothing.If one is not attached to this world the next world or plane of existence will not matter to one.

As for nihilism...Destructive behaviour will incur bad karma (kamma) which will need to payed in this life or the next if you do not escape the cycles of birth and death.Destruction while it has its purpose is not desireable to commit.And it certainly does not feel right.Only do what feels right.

There is no real duality.Creation and destruction are one cycle or even circle.Something is created,then it must be destroyed to make room for something new that was created and so goes the cycle for an unmeasurable number of great kalpas.(1,343,800,000,000 years equals one great kalpa.)

It is how it goes.It is the cycle.One should cast away destruction and ill deeds and strive to attain buddhahood if not sainthood and try to help other beings whether from this plane or not.

Ill thoughts are best avoided.Ill thoughts not only hurt your self but they hurt the entire world.As buddha said,

"We are what we think.
All that we are arises with our thoughts.
With our thoughts we make the world.
Speak or act with an impure mind
And trouble will follow you
As the wheel follows the ox that draws the cart."

Does this not make sense?In a time filled with great negativity, we have the most killing and the worst impurity.


--------------------
"There is no fire like lust, no grip like hate, no net like delusions, no river like craving."



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OfflinePhishgrrl
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: HypnoToad]
    #2985237 - 08/10/04 11:14 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

:thumbup:


--------------------
Once in awhile you can get shown the light

In the strangest of places if you look at it right...



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OfflineUncleMike
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2988504 - 08/10/04 11:06 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I have to stay away from drugs. Drugs kept me in another world. a different state of mind. I think about them everyday I used to be depressed all the time. Now I'm not. I actually love my life now. I am lucky to have my life back without something other than myself controlling it.


--------------------
Live each day like it will be your last, tomorrow my never come.
SporeSmart


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OfflineHypnoToad
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Re: Help me not feel like a nihilist [Re: UncleMike]
    #2988662 - 08/10/04 11:39 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

I have to stay away from drugs. Drugs kept me in another world. a different state of mind. I think about them everyday I used to be depressed all the time. Now I'm not. I actually love my life now. I am lucky to have my life back without something other than myself controlling it. 




(Nods)Drugs are just bad for some people.Also drugs arent meant to be used regularly or very often at all.Most people who use drugs use them way more than they should and it causes negative effects as a result.As long as the user is in control drugs can be positive but as soon as that control is lost it becomes very nightmarish very quickly.I personally feel drugs should only be used with a purpose and not just getting a high.Thats not really what tey were meant for.

Im glad you love your life.Very few people seem to love life anymore. :frown:


--------------------
"There is no fire like lust, no grip like hate, no net like delusions, no river like craving."



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