Home | Community | Message Board


Magic-Mushrooms-Shop.com
Please support our sponsors.

General Interest >> Political Discussion

Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Jump to first unread post. Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | Next >  [ show all ]
InvisibleKingOftheThing
the cool fool
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,389
Loc: USA
fiscal conservatism
    #2939817 - 07/29/04 11:30 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

does it work? name a country it has worked in. show me some facts.where has it worked in real life, not just on paper?


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2939852 - 07/29/04 11:43 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Even if it did benefit the citizens more, it would be at the expense of other peoples lives and well being. The rich get richer while the poor keep on getting poorer.

It's about time people woke up and realised we are all floating through space on the same ball of mud and no longer exist in isolation on our individual Islands. Decisions made in one country globally impact upon other countries.


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinest0nedphucker
Rogue State
Male
Registered: 04/17/03
Posts: 1,047
Loc: Wales (yes it is a countr...
Last seen: 8 years, 4 months
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #2939866 - 07/29/04 11:46 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Even if it did benefit the citizens more, it would be at the expense of other peoples lives and well being. The rich get richer while the poor keep on getting poorer.




Do you have anything that substantiates this or do you base it on what you have been fed?

I'd like to some see figures showing this or at least you can explain your opinion.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: st0nedphucker]
    #2939876 - 07/29/04 11:48 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

It's a well known fact that the western civilisation exploits poor countries, we have stolen all of the wealth from the land - why do you think the world is so out of balance?


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleKingOftheThing
the cool fool
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,389
Loc: USA
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #2939879 - 07/29/04 11:49 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

exactly, differences between classes would be so great that there would be revolution


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #2939880 - 07/29/04 11:49 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

And I don't base it on what I've been "fed", I base it on what I observe, it doesn't take a genius to figure out.


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2939882 - 07/29/04 11:50 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Who said revolution was a bad thing? :smirk:


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineAncalagon
AgnosticLibertarian

Registered: 07/30/02
Posts: 1,364
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2939884 - 07/29/04 11:51 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Economic Freedom of the World

An annual study performed by the Cato Institute of the United States, the Fraser Institute of Canada, and more than 50 other Think Tanks around the world.

Economic freedom is strongly related to prosperity and growth. Countries that are economically free tend to grow faster and be more prosperous. New research in the 2004 report finds that economically free nations attract nearly $11,000 of investment per worker, 12 times more than the $847 investment per worker in unfree economies. Moreover, the productivity of investment is 70 percent greater in economically free nations than in unfree nations.

Nations in the top fifth of economic freedom have an average per capita income of $26,100 compared to $2,800 for nations in the bottom fifth. Economic freedom benefits the lives of all people including the poor. In nations in the top fifth of economic freedom, the average income of the poorest 10 percent of the population was $6,877 compared to just $823 in the least free nations.


Economic Freedom and the Millennium Challenge Account

Economic Freedom and Economic Growth

Many economists have long argued that economic growth and poverty reduction require an economic policy that encourages economic freedom. This report provides plenty of empirical evidence of that.

For example, countries with the highest levels of economic freedom in 2002 had growth rates 1.5 times those of all the others on average in the last decade. Those with the lowest levels of economic freedom actually had negative economic growth ? a shocking statistic during a period in world history of relative calm and prosperity.

Rising Living Standards and Better Policies

Not only does greater economic freedom go hand in hand with economic growth, it benefits people in immediate and tangible ways. Comparing the countries whose economic freedom places them in the top fifth with the countries in the bottom fifth:

- incomes are nine times greater;
- life expectancy is more than 22 years longer;
- adult literacy is almost 17 percentage points higher;
- infant mortality is nine times lower; and
- people are 36 percent more likely to have access to treated water in countries with high economic freedom ratings.

This report also shows real progress in improving economic freedom: There has been an overall increase in mean economic freedom scores over the last twenty years, with specific improvements around the world. For example, there are:

- more stable monetary policies with lower inflation;
- lower marginal tax rates;
- fewer foreign exchange controls;
- fewer capital market and interest rate controls; and
- lower barriers to international trade.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
It has been proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that on average, the more economically free a country is, the more prosperous it will be. I would like to know, what makes you think this trend would reverse as government gets its hands off an economy more and more?


--------------------
?When Alexander the Great visted the philosopher Diogenes and asked whether he could do anything for him, Diogenes is said to have replied: 'Yes, stand a little less between me and the sun.' It is what every citizen is entitled to ask of his government.?
-Henry Hazlitt in 'Economics in One Lesson'


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleKingOftheThing
the cool fool
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,389
Loc: USA
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #2939889 - 07/29/04 11:52 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

yes we talk about that in my Cultural Anth class. we are using so many of the world's resources that "delveloping" countries will never be able to "develop" and live at the same level of consumption and comfortability as us. There isnt enough to go around, its just a matter of time before people get sick of our corporations raping their people. paying someone 25 cents a week for 40hours of manufacturing work in not right.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleKingOftheThing
the cool fool
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,389
Loc: USA
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: Ancalagon]
    #2939893 - 07/29/04 11:54 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Ancalagon said:
Economic Freedom of the World

An annual study performed by the Cato Institute of the United States, the Fraser Institute of Canada, and more than 50 other Think Tanks around the world.

Economic freedom is strongly related to prosperity and growth. Countries that are economically free tend to grow faster and be more prosperous. New research in the 2004 report finds that economically free nations attract nearly $11,000 of investment per worker, 12 times more than the $847 investment per worker in unfree economies. Moreover, the productivity of investment is 70 percent greater in economically free nations than in unfree nations.

Nations in the top fifth of economic freedom have an average per capita income of $26,100 compared to $2,800 for nations in the bottom fifth. Economic freedom benefits the lives of all people including the poor. In nations in the top fifth of economic freedom, the average income of the poorest 10 percent of the population was $6,877 compared to just $823 in the least free nations.


Economic Freedom and the Millennium Challenge Account

Economic Freedom and Economic Growth

Many economists have long argued that economic growth and poverty reduction require an economic policy that encourages economic freedom. This report provides plenty of empirical evidence of that.

For example, countries with the highest levels of economic freedom in 2002 had growth rates 1.5 times those of all the others on average in the last decade. Those with the lowest levels of economic freedom actually had negative economic growth ? a shocking statistic during a period in world history of relative calm and prosperity.

Rising Living Standards and Better Policies

Not only does greater economic freedom go hand in hand with economic growth, it benefits people in immediate and tangible ways. Comparing the countries whose economic freedom places them in the top fifth with the countries in the bottom fifth:

- incomes are nine times greater;
- life expectancy is more than 22 years longer;
- adult literacy is almost 17 percentage points higher;
- infant mortality is nine times lower; and
- people are 36 percent more likely to have access to treated water in countries with high economic freedom ratings.

This report also shows real progress in improving economic freedom: There has been an overall increase in mean economic freedom scores over the last twenty years, with specific improvements around the world. For example, there are:

- more stable monetary policies with lower inflation;
- lower marginal tax rates;
- fewer foreign exchange controls;
- fewer capital market and interest rate controls; and
- lower barriers to international trade.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
It has been proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that on average, the more economically free a country is, the more prosperous it will be. I would like to know, what makes you think this trend would reverse as government gets its hands off an economy more and more?




we have a BALANCE in this country, not total economic freedom...you have no idea what would happen if we did.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: Ancalagon]
    #2939894 - 07/29/04 11:54 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I think ancalagon is missing the main point, in order for a country to prosper it will affect the rest of the world as a whole and send it hurtling into an even more out of balance injust world.


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2939899 - 07/29/04 11:57 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

You've got that right, only it is a fact that there ARE enough resources in the world to go around and give everyone a decent standard of living if the wealth was distributed equally. Unfortunately, as long as capitalism still exists, there will always be deperately poor people and a small minority of filthy stinking rich people.


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineAncalagon
AgnosticLibertarian

Registered: 07/30/02
Posts: 1,364
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2939901 - 07/29/04 11:57 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

The links I provided are for the entire world, not for this country alone. They show that economic freedom and prosperity/growth are directly related. You have yet to answer my question: Seeing as the studies I have posted are absolute fact, and as economic freedom increases so does the prosperity of a nation, what leads you to believe this trend would reverse at Point X? What is point X?


--------------------
?When Alexander the Great visted the philosopher Diogenes and asked whether he could do anything for him, Diogenes is said to have replied: 'Yes, stand a little less between me and the sun.' It is what every citizen is entitled to ask of his government.?
-Henry Hazlitt in 'Economics in One Lesson'


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleKingOftheThing
the cool fool
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,389
Loc: USA
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #2939902 - 07/29/04 11:57 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

without regulation, corporations would rape the people. look how conditions were in the early 20th century.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2939906 - 07/29/04 11:58 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Haha, corporations already DO rape and exploit the people.


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleKingOftheThing
the cool fool
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,389
Loc: USA
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: Ancalagon]
    #2939909 - 07/29/04 11:59 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Ancalagon said:
The links I provided are for the entire world, not for this country alone. They show that economic freedom and prosperity/growth are directly related. You have yet to answer my question: Seeing as the studies I have posted are absolute fact, and as economic freedom increases so does the prosperity of a nation, what leads you to believe this trend would reverse at Point X? What is point X?




im not exactly sure what point X is. but im telling you its there...people have a breaking point. total economic freedom would divide the classes and cause class warfare.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2939915 - 07/29/04 12:00 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

The classes are already very much divided.


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisibleafoaf
CEO DBK?
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/08/02
Posts: 32,665
Loc: Ripple's Heart
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: KingOftheThing]
    #2939921 - 07/29/04 12:01 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

what does corporate malfeasance have to do with
what Ancalagon is saying?

does 'economically free' imply ZERO market oversight
or legal regulation?

I don't think it does.


--------------------
All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerogue_pixie
faerydae
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/28/04
Posts: 3,830
Loc: UK
Last seen: 1 hour, 33 minutes
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: afoaf]
    #2939928 - 07/29/04 12:02 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Corporations have everything to do with the economy, they practically run the world.


--------------------
'It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.' ~ J. Krishnamurti


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleKingOftheThing
the cool fool
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/17/02
Posts: 27,389
Loc: USA
Re: fiscal conservatism [Re: afoaf]
    #2939929 - 07/29/04 12:02 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

i thought that was part of a totally free economy, free from regulation...let the market decide


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Jump to top. Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | Next >  [ show all ]

General Interest >> Political Discussion

Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Physical Conservatism Demon 2,466 9 10/02/03 01:56 PM
by Demon
* Stephen Harper's Neo-Conservatism lonestar2004 897 5 07/09/06 12:05 PM
by Luddite
* Obama's fiscal stimulus phi1618 429 1 12/20/08 03:45 PM
by Seuss
* Germany faces up to fiscal disaster lonestar2004 291 0 10/31/05 03:34 PM
by lonestar2004
* Bush Administration Yanked PBS Cartoon for Showing Lesbian Couples
( 1 2 3 4 all )
StonedShroom 5,070 62 06/14/10 08:44 PM
by husk
* Compassionate Conservatism JesusChrist 426 5 09/03/04 12:34 PM
by afoaf
* Awesome Step - Social Security Reform
( 1 2 all )
Ancalagon 1,697 25 07/26/04 05:49 PM
by zappaisgod
* Christian group charged with HATE Crime ------ (because they protested a Gay and Lesbian Rally) lonestar2004 397 6 01/12/05 09:36 PM
by d33p

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Prisoner#1, Enlil
3,200 topic views. 3 members, 2 guests and 3 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Toggle Favorite | Print Topic | Stats ]
Search this thread:
Crestline Sales - MycoPath
Please support our sponsors.

Copyright 1997-2016 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.073 seconds spending 0.002 seconds on 16 queries.