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Amazon Shop: ½ Pint Jars, Autoclave, HEPA Filter, Mycobags, Pressure Cooker, Rye Grain

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Invisibleohmatic
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Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions
    #2907576 - 07/20/04 06:05 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

hey there!

after being away from the shroomery for some time (im in england..)
im going to be home soon and want to try out spawnbags as soon as i am
back home.

i just read through a very nice faq that answered most of my questions
but still i just want to ensure i got everything right...

1.) fill the spawnbag with the desired ammount of water / rye grain

2.) impulse seal the bag wont the filter on the bag somehow 'disable' that all air will get sucked out?
also, given that the grain will expand during pc'ing since it sucks
in the water, i need to seal some space above the grain, right?

3.) pc with some mesh at bottom / at top in order to prevent bag to
shut down the steam escape vent

4.) take bag while still wam and shake to break up the clumps of grain
(is this necessary with spawnbags? used to shaking jars prior to inoculation
so the substrate breaks up from a solid junk to fluffy grains..)

5.) let cool overnight

6.) inoculate and close inoculation hole with some duckt tape / drop of
hot glue (2nd preferred)

7.) shake and incubate ..

8.) bla :wink:

sooo, did i get it all right? i hope so, btw the text i mentioned at
the beginning will be quoted at the end so here it is:

Quote:


Working with filter patch bags the easy way

Still many people think that it's impossible to sterilise sealed filter patch bags. They sterilise the substrate in an open bag and seal after spawning. This of course brings with it a great risk for introducing contaminants into the substrate.

We have had great succes with autoclaving sealed filter patch bags, however there are a few things you should know:

The bags expand during cooking which means that if the bottoms of the bags stand in water, they will push the water out of the cooker through the vent pipe. This can be prevented by placing the bags on top of a sturdy rack. The water level should be below the rack. This will mean that there is not much water in the cooker. Pressure has to be regulated precise so no excessive steam escape takes place.

Since the expanding bags may also block the vent pipe a rack of some sort should also be put on top of the bags to prevent this. If water comes out of the vent pipe this means that somehow there's too much water in the cooker and that the expanding bags can push the water out.

There should be enough bags in the autoclave. If the expanded volume of the bags is smaller than the volume of the cooker they will burst. Because they all expand during cooking they prevent each other from bursting.

As much air as possible is pushed out during sealing of the bags. This makes it easier to put them in the cooker and allows for better steam buildup.

Water and dry ingredients can be conveniently combined and sterilised for an appropiate time.

A good sealer must be used, poor seals burst during autoclaving.

Sterilsation time for bags is 1.5 - 2.5 hours depending on the single volume/weight of the bags.

After sterilisation the bags are removed and shaken. Shaking is not always possible because many bags will come out with little air in the bag. This doesn't matter since the bags will inflate during incubation and can then be easily shaken.

Since the bag is closed now, inoculation can only take place by liquid injection. For spawning purposes small amounts of substrate are sterilised in bottles and inoculated with the desired strain. Extra care is taken to ensure the purity of these master cultures.

When these master are completely colonised they can be used for inoculations. Sterile water is added to the master bottle and this is shaken by hand for 10 minutes. This broth is left to stand for 5 minutes after which the liquid can be poured back into the bottle that contained the water. This liquid is poured into a sterile container from which a 50 ml syringe can be filled.

This syringe is used to inoculate the bags. The injection site is cleaned with an alcohol soaked towel and then pierced with the needle. Liquid inoculant is injected into the substrate. The hole is shut with a drop of hot glue from a glue gun.

After the glue has hardened the bags should be shaken (again, if possible) and can then be incubated. Shaken can take place as soon as the bags have inflated (after some mycelial growth, often after a few days.)

Bags can be colonised in 10-15 days depending on many factors.





btw the text was from UNA.

peace ohm :mushroom2:


--------------------
:penis: MONOTUB tek :sun: HEATBOMB tek :penis:

RIP #cultivation! ....can't associate? well FUCK U !


Edited by ohmatic (07/20/04 06:30 AM)


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: ohmatic]
    #2907843 - 07/20/04 11:06 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Purchasing the spawn bags that are explicityly made to be sealed before sterilizing will greatly improve your chances of success with this.


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PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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Invisibleohmatic
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: mycofile]
    #2907940 - 07/20/04 11:36 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

mycofile said:
Purchasing the spawn bags that are explicityly made to be sealed before sterilizing will greatly improve your chances of success with this.




hi myco, thx for the answer i already guessed to recieve an answer
like this one..

but anyway, i simply have no source besids mycobag for the ones that
are made to be sealed before and they wont really ship me to europa
i guess, well they havent answered my mail yet.

if u know of any other distributor that sells them in europa i'd be happy
to get a link or something.


ALSO if i sterilize the bags prior to sealing them up, just
wrapped them around and stuff i think i wont really be able to seal
them without a HEPA without risking contamination will i?

because i could just pc them and seal them afterwards somehow,
but as i said no hepa here, thats also the reason why i ask if
sealing prior to pc'ing is possible at all....

peace ohm :mushroom2:


--------------------
:penis: MONOTUB tek :sun: HEATBOMB tek :penis:

RIP #cultivation! ....can't associate? well FUCK U !


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OfflineScourge
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: ohmatic]
    #2909133 - 07/20/04 05:31 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I always use the bags that are not intended to be sealed before steralization. It has always fored fine for me and I have always sealed before puting in the PC.


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OfflineGr0wer
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: Scourge]
    #2909322 - 07/20/04 06:21 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

get the medium bags, i recenlty bought there large bags and its a thinner plastic. I think its diffrent plastic too because the medium bags are more heavy duty smoke colored and these are clear and seem more breakable.

The water level must be below the bags so put your bottom rack on shot glasses or some kind of spacer.

Make sure you have at lesat 3 bags per layer so they can all puch agains each other so they prevent eachother from poping. I should be trying pre sealing tomorrow so ill know if the large bags with the shitty plastic work. I doubt you'll be able to shake the bags hot out of the pc, allow them to cool and fill with air overnight then try shaking before innoculation. Inject and tape.


Edited by Gr0wer (07/20/04 06:23 PM)


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InvisibleUna
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: ohmatic]
    #2909351 - 07/20/04 06:31 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

.) take bag while still wam and shake to break up the clumps of grain
(is this necessary with spawnbags? used to shaking jars prior to inoculation
so the substrate breaks up from a solid junk to fluffy grains..)





You can't shake them, since they will come out of the cooker with almost no air inside.


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InvisibleMeat_Log_Smurf
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: Gr0wer]
    #2910940 - 07/21/04 02:04 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

damn grower how many layers did you have and were they placed side by side or were they placed more in a circular pattern? Sorry for all the ?'s.


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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: Meat_Log_Smurf]
    #2911299 - 07/21/04 06:28 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

hey

so thx to all of u for the great input,
i got a good idea of how to use them bags now.

i will order some very cheap looking bags from a vendor i
dug up that is quite close to me for my first tryouts with the
bags.

heres a pic of the bags:

as u can see they are VERY basic with just the filterpatch and they
are for 5 liters of substrate, i am somehow concerned by the nearly
perverted cheap look of them, but who knows they should be alright i guess..

if there's anything further i should know, feed me with input :smile:

so far

peace ohm :mushroom2:


--------------------
:penis: MONOTUB tek :sun: HEATBOMB tek :penis:

RIP #cultivation! ....can't associate? well FUCK U !


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OfflineGr0wer
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: ohmatic]
    #2911605 - 07/21/04 10:27 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Yea those are the large bags i have, medium bags are much thicker.

I put them in a circle, one layer its only a 18Q PC.


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Invisibleohmatic
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: Gr0wer]
    #2911735 - 07/21/04 11:25 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

hmmm well gr0wer these are the only ones i can get as i stated above.

so u practically fill ur pc up with the bags in a circle so they cant take away
too much space while expand and wont blow up right?

well ill od the same thing then since i also just got a small pc that
will maybe fit like 2 or 3 bags i guess? at absolute maximum ..

so, do u seal urs prior to sterilisation or afterwards?
ill just give it a shot with pre-sealed ones and see if they blow,
if they dont ill be happy enaugh.

oh yeah one more thing, really imporatant, i just throw my grains and
the desired ammount of water in the bag and pc it then right?
or does the grain have to be simmered already since when using jars
just mixed the grain and the water inside the jar and pc'd them this way ..

just to make sure i ask for everything that might be a prob :smile:

peace ohm :mushroom2:


--------------------
:penis: MONOTUB tek :sun: HEATBOMB tek :penis:

RIP #cultivation! ....can't associate? well FUCK U !


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OfflineGr0wer
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: ohmatic]
    #2912986 - 07/21/04 06:36 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

yep just pack the pc so they push against eachother and dont plug the vents.

Mycobag.com has 100 mediums for $30+5 S&H if you want thicker bags. Ill be buying the mediums next time since 3 larges are too big and 3 mediums fit perfectly with ~3Q spawn ea in my pc.

This is my first time pre sealing, i just cooked up 30 lbs to make 9 bags. Ill be PC'ing the bags all day tomorrow in 3 runs.

I like to precook and rise my grain first but im sure it would work if your ratios and volumes are right. The grain will expand so leave room. You should know how much it expands from you jars if you noted that. Dont you have starchy grain with no precook or soak with a rinse?

Just checking but you know it has to be raised above the water level on a good rack on shot glasses or some sort of jack.


Edited by Gr0wer (07/21/04 06:38 PM)


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Offlineragadinks
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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: Gr0wer]
    #2921234 - 07/23/04 06:18 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

You also can get plastic bags that can be sealed before sterilization here in Europe:
http://www.antenna.nl/spore/Plastic%20bags.htm
I am just trying them out. They seem to be ok.


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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: ragadinks]
    #2921513 - 07/23/04 07:39 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

"autoclave for six hours at 262oF(125oC). " man thats overkill


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Re: Spawnbag (Filterpatchbag) Usage Questions [Re: Gr0wer]
    #2923128 - 07/24/04 09:57 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah, you are right.
I autoclaved mine for 90 minutes at 125 degrees Celsius and they seem to be fine after about 12 days.


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Amazon Shop: ½ Pint Jars, Autoclave, HEPA Filter, Mycobags, Pressure Cooker, Rye Grain

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