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Anonymous

martha stewart
    #2896994 - 07/16/04 02:42 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

was sentenced today to 5 months in prison. this all started when, knowing a little "insider info" she dumped about 3,000 shares of stock right before it fell. this saved her $51,000 and conversely cost $51,000 to the suckers who trusted her.

for essentially defrauding people out of $51,000, she recieved 5 months in a cushy minimum security prison. way to set an example.  :thumbdown:


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OfflineRedo
CTA

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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2897053 - 07/16/04 03:01 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

sucks dosent it, small $20 dollar crack crimes get you 5 years or so, but $51,000 theft is 5 months.


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2897121 - 07/16/04 03:20 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

just think, Lay might get 10 months and 100k in fines...


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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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InvisibleEvolving
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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2897128 - 07/16/04 03:21 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Can you explain how Martha Stewart defrauded people. From my understanding she was convicted of lying to the Feds about the circumstances surrounding a stock sale. She was not convicted of fraud, she was not convicted of insider trading. She was however, a supporter of the Democrats in the last election...

Why can't we convict federal agents of their greater and more harmful lies? When cops lie to people, why is that not a crime? When George Bush lies to people why is that not a crime?

If a person has information that leads him to believe that he will lose money on an investment if he doesn't sell his interest in it, should he sell or not sell? Should he make the knowledge public, then sell (losing money in the interim)?


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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Offlined33p
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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2897131 - 07/16/04 03:23 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Unfortunately it will cost us about $10,000 to have her in that cushy prison.


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I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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Offlined33p
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Re: martha stewart [Re: Evolving]
    #2897138 - 07/16/04 03:25 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Evolving said:
Why can't we convict federal agents of their greater and more harmful lies? When cops lie to people, why is that not a crime? When George Bush lies to people why is that not a crime?




Its simple: they need to have been under oath when they lied. Her crime was perjury.


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I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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InvisibleEvolving
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Re: martha stewart [Re: d33p]
    #2897149 - 07/16/04 03:32 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

No, she was not convicted of perjury. She was not convicted of lying under oath.

Tell me, (hypothetically) if Sam Waksal (the CEO of ImClone) had called you up, because you?re friends, and told you to sell your shares of ImClone because the government was about to adversely effect the stock price, what would you do?


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: martha stewart [Re: d33p]
    #2897150 - 07/16/04 03:32 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

> Her crime was perjury

Her real crime was insider trading... but your point is well taken, and correct in the given context.


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Just another spore in the wind.


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InvisibleEvolving
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Re: martha stewart [Re: Seuss]
    #2897154 - 07/16/04 03:33 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

No, her 'crime' was not insider trading. She was not convicted of insider trading.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: martha stewart [Re: Evolving]
    #2897215 - 07/16/04 03:45 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

> No, her 'crime' was not insider trading. She was not convicted of insider trading.

...and OJ is innocent.

She got a tip from somebody at ImClone (directly or through a third party) that led her to dump her stock before the public was given the same information... insider trading... then she lied about under oath... perjury...

Just because they only tried and convicted her of the perjury does not mean that she didn't also do the insider trading bit...

Quote:

Tell me, (hypothetically) if Sam Waksal (the CEO of ImClone) had called you up, because you?re friends, and told you to sell your shares of ImClone because the government was about to adversely effect the stock price, what would you do?




I would realize that if I sold my stock before the annoucement was made public that I would be violating the law and participating in insider trading, which is illegal in the US and could land me in jail for 20 some odd years... therefore, I would wait until the public was told and legally dump the stock as quickly as I could after the public announcment.

In case you missed it, here is the definition of insider trading:

Quote:

Insider Trading is the trading in a security (buying or selling a stock) based on material information that is not available to the general public. It is prohibited by the US Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) because it is unfair and would destroy the securities markets by destroying investor confidence.




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Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineJesusChrist
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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2897263 - 07/16/04 04:02 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I always wanted to ball her really bad. She is so wholesome on camera and is said to be a major league bitch in real life. I would treat her like the pig that she is. I wonder how she likes it. I bet she is a dirty little girl when the lights are off.

As for her jail time, I would have given her more time. Until we get tough on white collar crime, people will continue to do it with reckless abandon. It is a cost/benefit thing. We can rarely catch them and if we actually do we don't hit them hard. I doubt they will become easier to catch, but we can at least hit them hard when we have them cornered.

Screw her. If I broke into your house and stole 10,000 I would be up the river for a long time. She stole more than the American median household income for a year by the stroke of a pen and she gets 5 months? I say fuck that.


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Tastes just like chicken


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OfflineRedo
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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2897522 - 07/16/04 05:05 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

she wasnt convicted of her crime, she was convited of lying about her crime.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: martha stewart [Re: Redo]
    #2897616 - 07/16/04 05:41 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

> she wasnt convicted of her crime, she was convited of lying about her crime

Correct.  (Scarry.. I am agreeing with you... time to go home :wink:)


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Just another spore in the wind.


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Invisibleadrug

Registered: 02/04/03
Posts: 15,800
Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2897720 - 07/16/04 06:34 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

A federal judge sentences Martha Stewart to five months in prison and five months of home confinement for lying to investigators about a stock sale. The sentence, stayed pending appeal, also includes two years of probation and a $30,000 fine.

http://www.npr.org/features/feature.php?wfId=3461039

She will be whisked away to a glamorous state holding facility where she will teach butch-dykes to make drink coasters out of dried leaves, flower stems, and plexiglass.


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InvisibleEvolving
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Re: martha stewart [Re: Seuss]
    #2897928 - 07/16/04 07:55 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
Just because they only tried and convicted her of the perjury does not mean that she didn't also do the insider trading bit...



She was NOT convicted of perjury. Basically, she was convicted for professing her innocence to investigators. She WAS NOT convicted of lying under oath in a court of law (perjury). If she was guilty of insider trading, why didn't the feds attempt to prosecute her for that crime?

What this case tells all of us is that if you tell cop that you were not growing mushrooms, or you do not have pot, then you can be charged with trying to keep yourself out of jail even if not convicted of the crime you claimed you did not commit. I realize that in our age of envy that it is quite popular to bash the successful and to cheer their demise, however what we forget in our orgies of celebration is that the tactics of law enforcement will be used against poor people as well. Case laws are based on precedents. You can be sure that these precedents will be applied increasingly to the little guy and do not bode well for the average man.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


Edited by Evolving (07/16/04 08:07 PM)


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Invisiblesir tripsalot
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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2898148 - 07/16/04 09:16 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

She can sell her poop for more than $50,000. Anybody know what conditions are like in a female minimum security prison?


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"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.


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Anonymous

Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2898165 - 07/16/04 09:23 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

actually i really don't care about this at all. i think i was bored or something when i made the post.

:shrug:


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OfflineMAGnum
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Re: martha stewart [Re: adrug]
    #2898248 - 07/16/04 10:10 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

adrug said:

She will be whisked away to a glamorous state holding facility where she will teach butch-dykes to make drink coasters out of dried leaves, flower stems, and plexiglass.




Nah, she'll go in jail and snap out like Beacher. She'll come out with new products such as the "Prison Bitch Garrote Set" and a whole new line of prison made, gorrilla styled dildos made of shaved and smoothed metal prison bars.


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Invisiblevampirism
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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2898331 - 07/16/04 10:53 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

She is a very bad example to use..

she did have some insider information and acted on it. This saved her the 51k, but that is an absolute peanuts amount of money as far as corporate pigs go.

Someone called her up and told her - what was she supposed to do? A friend called her, how could she be absolutely sure it wasn't advice? considering who it was, yes, he probably knew something. But I see everyone jumping on Martha Stewart rather than the person who gave her the info.



And JC - wtf?. '''''''I hear shes a major bitch in real life!@!!!#!!'''''''''

" I would treat her like the pig that she is. I wonder how she likes it. I bet she is a dirty little girl when the lights are off."

a) you don't know her at all
b) you're jumping on the bandwagon
c) even if she is a bitch, it's her own damn choice. At least she is hardworking and committed. She wasnt born a preppy corporate bitch, like G-dub


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Invisiblez@z.com
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Re: martha stewart [Re: ]
    #2898658 - 07/17/04 01:28 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I want to see how she decorates her jail cell.


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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