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OfflineHerbanShaman
I am the Walrus

Registered: 07/15/04
Posts: 233
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!!
    #2894009 - 07/15/04 06:24 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

It has been 10+ days since I cased my colonized rye grain in a 50/50 peat/vermiculite casing pH adjusted with hydrated lime. My mycelium have showed tremendous growth and appear on the surface in spots poking out in a "Ice Crystal" fashion. I have tried temperature shock (65 and 75F), and increased fanning. They are put under grow light 12hrs per day. What's gone wrong, where are the primordia? Normally by now, with no casing I'd have fruit. Am I an idiot to worry so soon? Am I an idiot to use my casing (it has worked before, maybe pH is off). I'd like any feedback people have to offer, soon... I'll resort to refrigerator shock.


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InvisiblePsychoslut
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2894337 - 07/15/04 07:56 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

you are prolly good to go, just keep some fresh air going, and give it time.

what part of illinois you from anyhow, im in macon county.


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[quote]KristiMidocean said:
Good now thats clear.WHO FUCKING CARES. If I am fat u all keep pointing it out like its suppose to be a secret.LIke u really have nothing better to do then make fat jokes. If o know its like I do I know yall can come up with NEW AND BETTER SHIT . This shit is old and boring . I left in the first place cause this shit got boring not because of the fat jokes . Fat jokes dont bother me but seriously its old[/quote]


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Offlineonelyte
Strange? Notme!!

Registered: 02/26/04
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: Psychoslut]
    #2896489 - 07/16/04 11:46 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

wee christian co here:)


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OfflineHerbanShaman
I am the Walrus

Registered: 07/15/04
Posts: 233
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: onelyte]
    #2896818 - 07/16/04 01:52 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I'm in Coles county here - its eastern university campus, east central IL-- Where's macon?


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"There is a world beyond ours, a world that is far away, nearby, and invisible. And there is where God lives, where the dead live, the spirits and the saints, a world where everything has already happened and everything is known. That world talks. It has a language of its own. I report what it says. The sacred mushroom takes me by the hand and brings me to the world where everything is known. It is they, the sacred mushrooms, that speak in a way I can understand. I ask them and they answer me. When I return from the trip that I have taken with them, I tell what they have told me and what they have shown me."
-- Mazatec shaman


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OfflineDrMambo
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2897037 - 07/16/04 02:56 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Would they happen to be Amazonians? I've heard that those often faulter with casings. Not saying that I absolutely believe it, only that I've heard it.


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"Yeah, he's a professor...... OF BEING A DOG!"


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OfflineCryogeniczV
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: DrMambo]
    #2897106 - 07/16/04 03:14 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

*Deleted*


Edited by Cryogenicz (11/05/09 11:35 PM)


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OfflineQandA
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Registered: 05/19/04
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: Cryogenicz]
    #2897443 - 07/16/04 04:49 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

What's your humidity like?? Are you misting daily? Water and fresh air are main triggers for fruiting as temp. Your temp seems okay. So, Im betting that if you have a prob, then it's with one of the other. You may not have a prob though, just wait a few more days and see what happens. Good luck! :grin:


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I'm not crazy...crazy.


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OfflineHerbanShaman
I am the Walrus

Registered: 07/15/04
Posts: 233
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: QandA]
    #2899409 - 07/17/04 10:50 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

My humidity seems to be close 100% at least in the microenvironment below the soil. I don't mist daily because I'm afraid that I'll cause my non-visible pins to abort lol. what do you think about this. I have actually only misted twice when the surface of the soil seemed to be drying out. I took care not to spray too much. BTW some very small pins have formed in one of my containers, but are not yet growing. Strangely enough, this is the casing that has the least amount of mycelium growth; odd.
Also, in a lot of cases mushrooms fruit in response to water stress, not extra water. I have wondered if this is the case for mine, or if psilcybes are an exception, which research tends to indicate. I encourage experiments for people who can afford to lose a small batch in the name of science.


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"There is a world beyond ours, a world that is far away, nearby, and invisible. And there is where God lives, where the dead live, the spirits and the saints, a world where everything has already happened and everything is known. That world talks. It has a language of its own. I report what it says. The sacred mushroom takes me by the hand and brings me to the world where everything is known. It is they, the sacred mushrooms, that speak in a way I can understand. I ask them and they answer me. When I return from the trip that I have taken with them, I tell what they have told me and what they have shown me."
-- Mazatec shaman


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OfflineQandA
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Registered: 05/19/04
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2899458 - 07/17/04 11:23 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

In my foaf's experience it's best to mist. He always mists lightly 1-2 day and stops when he sees hyphal knots. Misting is usually critical for a good flush because not only does it trigger pinning, but it also provides water for the casing. You really want you casing to have as much water as it can get without flooding it. Otherwise, your little mushies will be thirsty. Air exchange, misting, and patience and I think that you'll be fine. If you are seeing hyphal knots though, do not mist as it will cause aborts.


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I'm not crazy...crazy.


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OfflineHerbanShaman
I am the Walrus

Registered: 07/15/04
Posts: 233
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2899553 - 07/17/04 12:41 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Ok, thankyou for your advice of the misting, it allayed some of my fears. The main thing I worry about are the delicate mycelium that brance off the rhizomorphs, when you spray they lose thier fluffyness. I think this is what people talk about when they say misting kills. Although, dead tissue turns blue, and the rhizomorphs never do after spraying, they just appear less fluffy.
I have been spraying the edges, the only areas that seem to really get very dry. I let water seep down the edges and leach out to the rest. It seems to work fairly well I'm just wondering what the physical effects of the spraying could be.
My next experiment will involve a pyrex casing container; allowing me to see mycelial growth through the side.


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"There is a world beyond ours, a world that is far away, nearby, and invisible. And there is where God lives, where the dead live, the spirits and the saints, a world where everything has already happened and everything is known. That world talks. It has a language of its own. I report what it says. The sacred mushroom takes me by the hand and brings me to the world where everything is known. It is they, the sacred mushrooms, that speak in a way I can understand. I ask them and they answer me. When I return from the trip that I have taken with them, I tell what they have told me and what they have shown me."
-- Mazatec shaman


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2899571 - 07/17/04 12:51 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

here's the deal... when you first remove the cover from your casing.. you want to mist gradually.. lightly.. but building up the moisture content of the casing layer over several days. Give it a light, very fine mist.. several times a day.. do this for several days (with fanning) until you begin to see pins forming. I emphasize LIGHT misting because you don't want to overwater it - you'll probably get green mold or bacterial infection that way, but you don't want to underwater it either - no pins. Don't use a high velocity spray on your casing layer either.. come on now.. think about a light mist in the air. That's what you want.
So the best way to go about it is use your common sense. Mist lightly several times a day.. don't flood it. When pins are starting to form, you can still mist, just be very careful.. you want to use as fine a mist as possible, and try not to spray directly on the pins. Fan at least twice a day. Mist, fan, mist, fan, mist, fan.

As for using a pyrex container to see the mycelium growth in the sides.. don't. That will just cause shrooms to grow in the sides and bottom where you will have to basically destroy your casing to harvest.


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OfflineQandA
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Registered: 05/19/04
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2899583 - 07/17/04 12:57 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

The myc will get fluffy again. My foaf usually sees a knot or 2 along the edge first, then he quits misting. The myc will begin to get fluffy again. Then more knots appear within a couple days. He mists very lightly and holds the bottle a good distance from the casing. This is so they do indeed get a mist instead of a squirt. What are you doing for air exchange??? This may be the reason that you arent seeing pins yet.


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I'm not crazy...crazy.


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Invisibleno-tone
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2899695 - 07/17/04 01:59 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

"BTW some very small pins have formed in one of my containers, but are not yet growing. Strangely enough, this is the casing that has the least amount of mycelium growth; odd. "

Possibly the ones with more mycelium are overlayed?


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Man thinks. God laughs. - Jewish Proverb


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OfflineHerbanShaman
I am the Walrus

Registered: 07/15/04
Posts: 233
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Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: no-tone]
    #2899723 - 07/17/04 02:15 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Thankyou for all of the advice. I will start misting gently. I fan all the time. Besides fanning I have filter patches on the dome. Others have expressed the concern for overlay. So now I need help on making sure that's what my problem is. The growth appears alive and well. Fluffy and crystaline, occupying all valleys an much of the surface. Its presence it thin but thorough. -- I just hope its not overlay... eeek never experienced that. Maybe this will be an unplanned experience. Just help me save my babies...


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"There is a world beyond ours, a world that is far away, nearby, and invisible. And there is where God lives, where the dead live, the spirits and the saints, a world where everything has already happened and everything is known. That world talks. It has a language of its own. I report what it says. The sacred mushroom takes me by the hand and brings me to the world where everything is known. It is they, the sacred mushrooms, that speak in a way I can understand. I ask them and they answer me. When I return from the trip that I have taken with them, I tell what they have told me and what they have shown me."
-- Mazatec shaman


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OfflineQandA
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Registered: 05/19/04
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2899922 - 07/17/04 03:57 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

If it's still alive and fluffy, you're probably alright.


--------------------
I'm not crazy...crazy.


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OfflineHerbanShaman
I am the Walrus

Registered: 07/15/04
Posts: 233
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: QandA]
    #2899971 - 07/17/04 04:29 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

<http://www.shroomery.org/images/23449/overlay.jpg>

bad news all -- although its still alive and fluffy - it looks much like this picture. I've started to prepare casing to put above it. The ingredients ate 4cups 75/25 peat/perlite with one tablespoon hydrated lime. This seems to balance it out ok. Note that I'm broke and working with materials i have (premixed leftover casing). If I just sterilize a fork and drag it across, then scatter the new casing over the top - should I leave the whole thing in fruiting conditions (temp/misting). The mycelium have extensive networks now reaching from top to bottom of casing, I do not see need for further mycelium growth. Perhaps allowing it to recover perhaps. Let the people speak. Note I'm not going to case for another day or two, I'm going to try to be patient and see if they pin. The tissue is not dead, I took a small sample and checked it out under microscope. Definately still alive. Just overgrown? What should I do guys?


--------------------
"There is a world beyond ours, a world that is far away, nearby, and invisible. And there is where God lives, where the dead live, the spirits and the saints, a world where everything has already happened and everything is known. That world talks. It has a language of its own. I report what it says. The sacred mushroom takes me by the hand and brings me to the world where everything is known. It is they, the sacred mushrooms, that speak in a way I can understand. I ask them and they answer me. When I return from the trip that I have taken with them, I tell what they have told me and what they have shown me."
-- Mazatec shaman


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OfflineQandA
wanderer

Registered: 05/19/04
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2899978 - 07/17/04 04:35 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I wish I had a camera, I'd show you my foaf's current casings (which are pinning). They make yours look like nothing but a walk in the park. But if they dont pin in couple days, then I guess try scratching them, but I think they'll pin if you mist them. Take a look at this pic.


--------------------
I'm not crazy...crazy.


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OfflineQandA
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Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: QandA]
    #2900021 - 07/17/04 04:53 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)



--------------------
I'm not crazy...crazy.


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OfflineHerbanShaman
I am the Walrus

Registered: 07/15/04
Posts: 233
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: QandA]
    #2900444 - 07/17/04 07:02 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

What is the white stuff in the bin, mycelium? I know that sounds stupid but it almost looks like cotton balls. A new casing lol? Seriously though, that looks like extreme overlay and you still got plenty of fruit. That helps me worry less. I'll keep misting and fanning. I have temp at 75F.


--------------------
"There is a world beyond ours, a world that is far away, nearby, and invisible. And there is where God lives, where the dead live, the spirits and the saints, a world where everything has already happened and everything is known. That world talks. It has a language of its own. I report what it says. The sacred mushroom takes me by the hand and brings me to the world where everything is known. It is they, the sacred mushrooms, that speak in a way I can understand. I ask them and they answer me. When I return from the trip that I have taken with them, I tell what they have told me and what they have shown me."
-- Mazatec shaman


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OfflineHerbanShaman
I am the Walrus

Registered: 07/15/04
Posts: 233
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
Re: My peat and vermiculite casing will not fruit!!!! [Re: HerbanShaman]
    #2903090 - 07/18/04 06:43 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Just posting my mushroom progress.  The primordia in the 3rd bin are growing slowly but surely.  They seem to be draining the moisture available to them fast and the area around them is drying out a bit.  Can I drip water in to moisturize the area and then let osmosis move it to the mushrooms?  As for the other two containers, they looked a bit dry today so I misted them.  They seem almost saturated now but you can tell they are "drinking" much of the liquid as they incorporate it into thier tissue.  I hope this means they are building energy to fruit :smile:.  My tanks are now staying at 75-65 (rare, but some nights).  Will cold nights 70-65F hurt my mushrooms?  I appreciate any advice you guys can spare. I've been learning much.


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"There is a world beyond ours, a world that is far away, nearby, and invisible. And there is where God lives, where the dead live, the spirits and the saints, a world where everything has already happened and everything is known. That world talks. It has a language of its own. I report what it says. The sacred mushroom takes me by the hand and brings me to the world where everything is known. It is they, the sacred mushrooms, that speak in a way I can understand. I ask them and they answer me. When I return from the trip that I have taken with them, I tell what they have told me and what they have shown me."
-- Mazatec shaman


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