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OfflineVinumSabbathi
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Registered: 10/07/12
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Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse)
    #28741911 - 04/18/24 04:47 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

I have a heart condition called Mitral Valve Prolapse. Many people go through their lives with a mild case of MVP, and it causes them no issues. In my case, mine has progressed into the 'moderate to severe' range, and I may have to undergo heart surgery sometime in the future to get the valve repaired. What is shows up as is fatigue and episodic heart palpitations (PVCs) which are generally harmless for the most part.

Just recently, I came across some information online - talking about a potential link between Psilocybin and heart valve damage. This surprises me. Over the years, it has always seemed like the general consensus is that they tend to be safe for the body, and the worst case scenario is a bad trip or mental issues being amplified.

I'd REALLY like to get more information on this - ironically enough, I'm partially drawn to shrooms to come to peace with the idea of potentially getting heart surgery.

Here is what I'm wondering:

Does anyone know if that psilocybin/heart damage link is potentially caused from rare single-use, or is it more of consequence of extended use (like daily micro dosing) causing serotonin overstimulation?

Also, has anyone here with a severe case of MVP done shrooms -- or has anyone experience any cardiac issues as a result?

Apparently serotonin (and SSRIs) can cause or worsen degenerative mitral regurgitation, BUT I'd like to know if serotonin-related cardiotoxicity is possible with very rare usage?

Thank you everyone!

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OnlineBardy
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Registered: 04/02/14
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: VinumSabbathi]
    #28742212 - 04/18/24 09:38 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Not a good idea to take shrooms with a heart condition.

A lady in Australia recently had a heart attack and died which could very well have been brought on by mushroom tea. Details aren’t clear yet though.

But there are other cases of people having heart attacks on shrooms.

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OnlineBardy
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: Bardy]
    #28742274 - 04/18/24 11:34 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

What I probably should have said is ask your doctor. Shrooms are pretty safe but they’re not completely risk free

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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Registered: 08/16/16
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: Bardy]
    #28742280 - 04/18/24 11:46 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Op, that's a serious health condition.  Speak with a physician that understands how these drugs work in the body with regard to your condition. 

Jumping the gun would be incredibly risky.

Even tripping while without any condition, at certain times, on some trips, I can for sure tell it has caused my heart to temporarily behave strangely in some way that goes beyond simple changes related to anxiety. 

So, please, do your due diligence carefully.


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps

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OfflineNorthernerM
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: The Blind Ass] * 1
    #28742422 - 04/19/24 06:26 AM (2 months, 6 days ago)

The damage concern is with 5ht receptor agonism. This is shown with some medications and is a possible outcome with repeated (daily) dosing of psychedelics over long periods. Though there's no case studies showing this outcome at this time.

Taking psychedelics with heart conditions is contraindicated.

You already knew all of this though. But there's nothing else.  :tongue2:


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The nearest we ever come to knowing truth is when we are witness to paradox.

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OfflineSkydoggy
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: Northerner]
    #28743235 - 04/19/24 09:56 PM (2 months, 6 days ago)

@Northerner, prompted by the OP’s post I did some reading and came across similar information. Although I couldn’t find any studies showing this outcome either, it has me wondering about micro dosing. I’ve been doing this for about 3 years and I am wondering if there is a long term risk. No way of knowing at this point in time.

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OfflineNorthernerM
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: Skydoggy]
    #28743307 - 04/20/24 12:21 AM (2 months, 6 days ago)

Yeah man, microdosing is still a pretty new thing. Personally I'd err on the side of caution and take breaks now and then, but that could be unnecessary caution. We just really don't know yet.


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The nearest we ever come to knowing truth is when we are witness to paradox.

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Offlinestone14
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: VinumSabbathi]
    #28743355 - 04/20/24 02:26 AM (2 months, 6 days ago)

I have heart disease. Regurgitating valves. I've started psilocybin trips and have had nothing that would indicate they effect my heart, no blood pressure increase no heart racing. They feel quite calming tbh.

The thing with studies is they can give what ever results they wish to promote.

Shrooms were untill recently these evil drugs that if taken you would lose you mind and not return, you would jump out of storey high windows and kill yourself or go and stab your friend to death.

Now because the government has decided to prescribe it as taxable medicine the whole of social media is jumping on the band wagon of how great micro dosing is for mental health improvement, and not madness inducing.

You will likely see warnings because the government only want you taking their version of it because they sell you it. Any other form or means will still be identified as wrong and bad and if you do it you're a criminal and will likely go insane or kill yourself.

There's no epidemic of people dying from shrooms trips yet Hans have taken them since before they evolved. What were the shrooms death levels during the hippy era? If no one knows it's likely because it was nonexistent. Plenty people have heart issues that are undiagnosed, unknown to them. I'm not convinced that shrooms trips will be detrimental to my life even with my condition.

However, Im taking these trips journeys because I desire to have the brain resetting abilities people talk about from the higher doses and lessons from trips. Not for recreational fun.

Edited by stone14 (04/20/24 02:31 AM)

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Offlinestone14
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: VinumSabbathi]
    #28743356 - 04/20/24 02:40 AM (2 months, 6 days ago)

I take three medications for my heart issues to give you an idea of the level I'm at

Daily
Ramipril 2x 5mg
Amlodopine 5mg
Bisoprisol 2.5mg

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OfflineNorthernerM
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: stone14]
    #28744773 - 04/21/24 04:24 PM (2 months, 4 days ago)

Maybe when your other medications wear off and the shrooms fry the fuck out of you you may feel differently. SSRI medications block 5hta2 receptor agonism, which is the potential cause of heart interference with psilocybin. It might pay to tread lightly.


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The nearest we ever come to knowing truth is when we are witness to paradox.

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OnlineBardy
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: Northerner]
    #28744841 - 04/21/24 06:07 PM (2 months, 4 days ago)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10243226/

Was just reading this. I need to go get checked up to see if I have hemachromatosis.

It would be nightmare fuel having a heart attack during a full on trip.

Edited by Bardy (04/21/24 06:09 PM)

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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Taking shrooms with a heart condition (Mitral Valve Prolapse) [Re: Bardy] * 3
    #28745066 - 04/21/24 11:20 PM (2 months, 4 days ago)

My father and grandmother died of heart disease,
my brother has had surgical interventions (he was a big exercise and sports nut in my opinion.) he is not a user of psychedelics and neither was my dad.
I am 72 a regular micro and mini doser for shrooms and lsd variants for over 55 years. I seldom take more than 50 mics acid or 2.5 gms penis envy.

I have developed a beta block in my ecg due to an iron treatment for haemochromatosis, and the iron treatment was an error in prescription by the MD and it was sustained for a decade leading to iron build up in the heart tissue, which causes the beta block or short circuiting and weaker ventrical response in the ecg.
I have never discussed psychedelics with my doctor, certainly she would say avoid at all costs, I do some yoga daily; I do not avoid but I use moderately.

It is unpleasant to think about 5-HTx receptors in heart muscle and valve tissue that can respond badly over time to psychedelics, but there are also gut receptors that do not contribute nicely to trips either, I have managed to live with that, and I live anyway with too much metal in my muscles and the shorting out that provides.

As regards to life span expectation, I say "fuck-it!", feed your head. There is no realistic expected life span except for less than we would like when we start out, but if you do not live in the moment, it does not matter how long you exist as an embodied zombie (living for the insurance companies' bottom lines). that's my 2 cents.


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:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

Edited by redgreenvines (04/21/24 11:29 PM)

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