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OfflineRedo
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Registered: 04/13/04
Posts: 1,296
Last seen: 18 years, 7 months
The Patriot Act
    #2872933 - 07/09/04 01:03 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Since many of you think this is the worst thing ever to happen in our country, I would like to know.

How has the Patriot Act effected you personally? What freedoms are you denied now that it is place? Because nothing is different from my end, maybe im blind though.

Edited by Redo (07/09/04 01:25 PM)

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2872969 - 07/09/04 01:12 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Why would it have to affect you personally?

Isn't the fact that it tramples on your rights enough?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/08/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2872977 - 07/09/04 01:14 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

what if it affects your neighbor?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Innvertigo]
    #2872987 - 07/09/04 01:16 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Id like to know then, out everybody on this board, it surely must effect somebody with how violating it is.

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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873007 - 07/09/04 01:18 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

If it has personally affected anyone on this board...they would not be allowed to TELL us that it has affected them or they'll go straight to jail (do not pass Go, do not collect $200) :smirk:


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873014 - 07/09/04 01:19 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

It has the potential to affect everyone. Why that isn't enough for you is a mystery to me. Or are you saying you don't think the potential is there?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: trendal]
    #2873015 - 07/09/04 01:19 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

  So its a big conspiracy then? :-p, If it effects somebody, they never are heard from again!!! :smile:

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2873024 - 07/09/04 01:22 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
It has the potential to affect everyone. Why that isn't enough for you is a mystery to me. Or are you saying you don't think the potential is there?




It effects terrorists, and maybe an innocent or two get investegated, thats all the potential I see.

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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Registered: 02/08/01
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873034 - 07/09/04 01:24 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

It violates my right to live free from governmental intrusion. It hasn't affected me but what if someone decided to tell the wrong people i'm a terrorist sympathizer?

I really don't care if it affects me personally directly. If it affects an American citizen then it indirectly affects me because I will now fear my government that much more.

I had to give up personal iinformation in order to by a fucking boat, why?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873035 - 07/09/04 01:25 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Perhaps then, this country isn't the place for you.

Frankly, your take on this stuns me.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Innvertigo]
    #2873037 - 07/09/04 01:26 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Innvertigo said:
I had to give up personal iinformation in order to by a fucking boat, why?




You have to do that with a car too

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Innvertigo]
    #2873038 - 07/09/04 01:26 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

...in order to by a fucking boat

A boat specifically designed for orgies?  :cool:


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2873043 - 07/09/04 01:27 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Perhaps then, this country isn't the place for you.

Frankly, your take on this stuns me.




Why isnt this the place for me?? Im defending the patriot act, it seems to be one more reason why im fit here.

And why does it stun you?

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Innvertigo]
    #2873046 - 07/09/04 01:28 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

I had to give up personal iinformation in order to by a fucking boat, why?



The same info you give up to buy a house, car, get a credit card or secure a loan?

Or different info? Please elaborate.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873053 - 07/09/04 01:29 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

And why does it stun you?



Because anything that tramples our rights is contemptable.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Registered: 02/08/01
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Swami]
    #2873058 - 07/09/04 01:30 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

A boat specifically designed for orgies?




I'll let you know this weekend :thumbup:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2873060 - 07/09/04 01:31 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

What rights is it trampling? I fail to see any violations

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Innvertigo]
    #2873062 - 07/09/04 01:31 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Innvertigo said:
Quote:

A boat specifically designed for orgies?




I'll let you know this weekend :thumbup:



I thought this weekend just you and I were going out on your boat?


Hey! Wait a minute!

:blush:


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Posts: 34,247
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873064 - 07/09/04 01:32 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

*sigh*


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Registered: 02/08/01
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2873076 - 07/09/04 01:35 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Or different info? Please elaborate.




I'ts different because she told be the form was new since the patriot act came out. I tried to call my loan officer a couple minutes ago but she was out. I'll find out the specifics, she wasn't happy about asking people to fill it out.

i'll get more details.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2873078 - 07/09/04 01:36 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Hey! Wait a minute!




SUCKER!! HA HA HA :evil:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Innvertigo]
    #2873079 - 07/09/04 01:37 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Did you ask for the boat model with the built in machine guns?

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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873092 - 07/09/04 01:40 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

it only had a grenade launcher.... :rolleyes:sheesh what's the big deal.....it also had lasers on the bow. :laser:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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InvisibletrendalM
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Registered: 04/17/01
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873107 - 07/09/04 01:43 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

"First they came for the Communists, but I was not a Communist, so I said nothing. Then they came for the Social Democrats, but I was not a Social Democrat, so I did nothing. Then came the trade unionists, but I was not a trade unionist. And then they came for the Jews, but I was not a Jew, so I did little. Then when they came for me, there was no one left to stand up for me." --  Martin Niem?ller

The choice to stand aside while others are oppressed simply because those others aren't you eventually leads to your own oppression :wink:


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2873185 - 07/09/04 02:01 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Ok here's the dealio about the Boat patriot act thing.

Due to the patriot act any purchase of great expense (she didn't give me an exact amount) like a Car, Boat, House (aything expensive) et.  A special form has to be filled out as a "promise" that you are not using this purchase to fund terrorism. :rolleyes:

personally I don't feel that it's any of their fucking business as to the why i'm doing anything legal.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: trendal]
    #2873254 - 07/09/04 02:19 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

trendal said:
The choice to stand aside while others are oppressed simply because those others aren't you eventually leads to your own oppression :wink:




But there is no great oppression going on.

Innvertigo, that is kinda dumb. I dont understand why they would have you promise your not going to use it to fund terrorism. It probably means that you get heavier charges if you do get caught funding terrorism with that item.

At least somebody was effected some how :wink:, but it isnt that bad.

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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873383 - 07/09/04 02:40 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Redo said:
But there is no great oppression going on.




Not yet...


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: trendal]
    #2873397 - 07/09/04 02:42 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Tell me when it happens.

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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873419 - 07/09/04 02:46 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

I doubt I'll be able to tell you anything at all, if/when it happens :wink:


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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OfflineBlue_Apocalypse
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Registered: 07/08/04
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873804 - 07/09/04 04:55 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Hmm, well for one thing it allows the FBI to use the Carnivore system which allows all users of an ISP to have their internet activities indiscrimately monitored. You use the internet, right?

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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Blue_Apocalypse]
    #2873812 - 07/09/04 05:05 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

If not Carnivore...you've got to worry about the NSA and Echelon :wink:


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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OfflineJPZ
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2873879 - 07/09/04 05:29 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Redo said:
Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
It has the potential to affect everyone. Why that isn't enough for you is a mystery to me. Or are you saying you don't think the potential is there?




It effects terrorists, and maybe an innocent or two get investegated, thats all the potential I see.




If the Patriot Act "effects" terrorists, it should be destroyed, am I right?

:grin:


--------------------
I do declare, I can float in the air.

"If carrots got you drunk, rabbits would be fucked up."

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OfflineEd1
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: JPZ]
    #2873969 - 07/09/04 06:07 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Nothing has changed for me. I'm sure you had to give personal information when you buy a boat before September 11th 2001. Without it a bigger boat can run you over, kill people in your boat and get away with it.

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Invisiblesir tripsalot
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2874013 - 07/09/04 06:25 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)



--------------------

"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.

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Invisiblenewuser1492
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2874227 - 07/09/04 07:42 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

Amendment VIII

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.


I've never personally used those rights afforded me by the Bill of Rights. So by your logic they could be repealed since I've never used them.

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: newuser1492]
    #2874837 - 07/09/04 11:40 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

I am very away of Zombi's experience, this post would be a way to bring it out to everybody attention that there IS something wrong that is real.

cb, the 2nd Amendment is hardly our right as it reads. I forgot all the specifics, but the right for the people to bear arms is limited to the national guard I believe? Whats this have to do with the Patriot Act.

And whats the 8th have to do with anything? I need more specifics.

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OfflineAncalagon
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2874886 - 07/09/04 11:58 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

cb, the 2nd Amendment is hardly our right as it reads. I forgot all the specifics, but the right for the people to bear arms is limited to the national guard I believe?



Absolutely wrong. The word militia at the time referred to each and every adult(male?) citizen and 'well regulated' meant well prepared. Forgetting the 2nd amendment completely, read the 9th amendment. Even if the bill of rights did not address gun ownership specifically, the 9th would protect it.


--------------------
?When Alexander the Great visted the philosopher Diogenes and asked whether he could do anything for him, Diogenes is said to have replied: 'Yes, stand a little less between me and the sun.' It is what every citizen is entitled to ask of his government.?
-Henry Hazlitt in 'Economics in One Lesson'

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Ancalagon]
    #2875021 - 07/10/04 12:47 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

I meant present day.

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Offlinepsikooz
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Innvertigo]
    #2875248 - 07/10/04 02:28 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

The patriot act effects me because it exists.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2875476 - 07/10/04 06:43 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

I forgot all the specifics, but the right for the people to bear arms is limited to the national guard I believe?



:rotfl:


Yah, the founding fathers were able to look forward in time and predict the creation of the National Guard years in the future. If only I could look forward 125+ years.

And how could the phrase "the right of the people" refer to anything but the people?

:rotfl:


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2875479 - 07/10/04 06:47 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

I dont know how we got to talking about the beginning of the USA, this has nothing to do with the past, rather present times.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2875483 - 07/10/04 06:49 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

I'm more curious as to how someone who claims to be conservative can be so obviously not.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2875485 - 07/10/04 06:50 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Id like to know why you think that

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2875490 - 07/10/04 06:55 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Your lack of concern about the patriot act and your lack of knowledge of the 2nd.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2875493 - 07/10/04 06:56 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

This is why I ask questions, and one or two opinions does not void me of the title of a conservative, which I dont even know if I really am. They are just the better choice always (except Mayor Dailey =b)

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2875497 - 07/10/04 07:00 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

It may not void you of the title but it shows me something.

That you don't fit the title.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #2875500 - 07/10/04 07:03 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

I dont own a gun, nor do I need one, but I love them. So why do I need to know the laws? And why would lack of concern about hte patriot act make me any less of a conservative? Theres two ways to look at it, I look at it from the prosecuting terrorists side.

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Offlinest0nedphucker
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2875504 - 07/10/04 07:08 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

How many terrorists have been arrested, charged and convicted as a result of the Patriot Act?

If you're going to defend something then at least provide some reasons why, i'm also curios aswell.

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OfflineRedo
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: st0nedphucker]
    #2875507 - 07/10/04 07:10 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

This was about how the patriot act has effected people, I have no idea how many terrorists were caught because of it.

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Offlinest0nedphucker
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Re: The Patriot Act [Re: Redo]
    #2875516 - 07/10/04 07:21 AM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Ok lets turn it around then how many innocent people have been imprisoned as a result of the Patriot Act?

------------------
Terror Arrests in the UK since 9-11 ( As of April 2004)

Arrested  :548
Charged    :98
Convictions:6
------------------

Hardly a stunning success 1.09% of arrests lead to a conviction.

"I'm not a terrorist, I have no need to worry"

:handth:

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OfflineRedo
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Last seen: 18 years, 7 months
Re: The Patriot Act [Re: st0nedphucker]
    #2877052 - 07/10/04 11:37 PM (19 years, 8 months ago)

Good, 6 less terrorists, and thats the UK

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