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OfflineNotBTeleVised17
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Registered: 07/06/17
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Last seen: 3 months, 8 days
Toad...is it worth it?
    #28666348 - 02/19/24 06:09 AM (4 months, 5 days ago)

So, recently I have come across some toad venom. I felt like it would be a worthwhile experience, seems like there are many users with spiritual experiences (not my intention to have, I'm more in the science/materialist mindset). For context I'm experienced in all of the classic psychs but the last time I did the synth 5-meo, I didn't truly get off maybe some euphoria afterward. Also it was half a lifetime ago; the anxieties I have now didn't exist back then. The other day I vaped up 10mg of the venom just to test and also taste the smoke and immediately felt the rush and power of it. It kept my left hand trembling for a day or two after. Reading more reports I see panic attacks, reactivations, bad nightmares/sleep paralysis, and the need for psychiatric support afterward. Is this an experience worth having? I have read that lower doses can cause more issues than higher but this could be psychedelic cheerleading; you'll never see the luminaries, gurus criticizing the psychedelics themselves. Any info and experience is appreciated. Thank you.

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OfflineShiroiTora
LBM
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/16/21
Posts: 764
Loc: South Africa Flag
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Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: NotBTeleVised17]
    #28667424 - 02/19/24 09:13 PM (4 months, 4 days ago)

I'd suggest mix it with synthed 5meo to bring down the strength.. I suspect bufotenine might be behind the "power" you speak of.

I remember reading about bufotenine in Tihkal and its nasty habit of opening up repressed traumas

Quote:

Listen to the account of one lady, following a rapid intravenous injection of bufotenine. “There was intense salivation. She could easily have drowned in her own saliva, and she had to be turned on her side. The pulse rate rose slightly during the period extending from the end of the injection until some 10 minutes later, but without much change in blood pressure. Responsiveness returned in about 23 minutes, at which time the patient was entirely lucid and, in response to a query related to a preinjection suggestion, spoke of a long repressed memory from the age of three years, when she came into the bathroom and saw her mother dying of a uterine hemorrhage. This was told without affect and had no therapeutic consequences.” HOLY COW! A schizophrenic victim volunteers a long-repressed memory of her mother’s traumatic death. And with the state of the healing art in the mental hospitals of that time, two physicians effectively ignore what today would be considered a dramatic break-through in therapy.



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OfflineWhoManBeing
PsychedelicYogi
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Registered: 09/01/13
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Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: ShiroiTora]
    #28667457 - 02/19/24 09:53 PM (4 months, 4 days ago)

Doesn’t sound appealing nor does the videos of shamanic practice with such south.


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Hip, hip... WhoRAy!!!

Eye was thinking the other day...  ahh, thinking never done me no good.


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OfflineNotBTeleVised17
Cardboard Warrior


Registered: 07/06/17
Posts: 79
Last seen: 3 months, 8 days
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: WhoManBeing]
    #28667606 - 02/20/24 01:38 AM (4 months, 4 days ago)

I'll have to read more about bufotenine but my impression was everything with the exception of the 5-meo was destroyed during the vaping process. Also I've seen those shamanic rituals. I don't know how much they put in the pipe but you see people practically convulsing, jaw chattering, eyes rolling back into their heads, and screaming. It looks disturbing and the safety thing is another issue, particularly people vomiting and having to be turned over.

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InvisibleCreonAntigone
Stranger

Registered: 05/30/21
Posts: 3,032
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: NotBTeleVised17] * 4
    #28667716 - 02/20/24 05:49 AM (4 months, 4 days ago)

So this drug carries physiological risks... yet there are tons of drugs popular here you can take even high doses and most certainly be fine - psilocybin, LSD, DMT...

My question is why you would want to do this when much safer options are available. Even if you could get high, you could also get high by huffing chemicals, and yet it would be an unacceptable risk:reward ratio.

I would just ask you to assess if this is really worth the risk. Because 'highs' are a dime a dozen, there are a million of them, and there's no guarantee any individual one will be enlightening in any way. If you wanted to go 'deeper' and get some more personal insight, wouldn't it be a smarter idea to use a higher dose of a proven-safe drug such as psilocybin?

I personally rate finding a new 'high' to be very low in value; it's much more worthwhile to do things more likely to have a positive effect. So why do this one that's a risk? I probably wouldn't do it.

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InvisibleCreonAntigone
Stranger

Registered: 05/30/21
Posts: 3,032
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: CreonAntigone]
    #28667826 - 02/20/24 08:08 AM (4 months, 4 days ago)

Having read more, I can now say with a more informed perspective that it's a really bad idea to try and do this. The reason is that toad venom does not just contain tryptamines that get you high, but also toxins. Toad venom contains compounds called Bufadienolides, cardiac glycosides - these are compounds that stress the heart and can be harmful or even fatal.

I suspected that there was other work at play here besides tryptamines from your descriptions - first you described tremors for days after taking it, which is a sign of a toxic reaction to a stimulant or convulsive agent, not a tryptamine. People don't usually describe tremors for days afterwards from mushrooms or DMT. Similarly, seizures, vomiting and uncontrolled salivations are also signs of toxicity to the human cells. The tryptamines, in combination with a cyto-toxin, sound extremely unpleasant; would you like to be high as hell while your body is actively being poisoned? To take a toxin along with your tryptamine is basically a way to guarantee a bad experience. Remember the frog makes this stuff for the purpose of killing/disabling other creatures.

Synthetic bufotenine or 5-meo-DMT are probably fine with proper precautions; however, there is no telling what effect these cardiac glycosides could have. They could trigger palpitations and seizures, and could result in medical complications. A little reading on these Bufadienolides suggests to me that they can even be lethal. That's fire I wouldn't play with to get 'high'. So I would again encourage you not to mess around with this stuff.

Study describing the various components of the toxin, finding that it is toxic to human cells.

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OfflineNotBTeleVised17
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Registered: 07/06/17
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Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: CreonAntigone]
    #28667850 - 02/20/24 08:34 AM (4 months, 4 days ago)

I've read about the cardiotoxicity of the venom but I only thought that pertained to oral ingestion not vaporization. And it just really seemed like it could be a worthwhile experience, many described it as blissful. And I've never heard of an actual overdose or cardiac arrest incident from using this and by now that information would be there. I agree there's reason to be apprehensive

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InvisibleCreonAntigone
Stranger

Registered: 05/30/21
Posts: 3,032
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: NotBTeleVised17]
    #28667866 - 02/20/24 08:47 AM (4 months, 4 days ago)

I think it's unlikely that the poison isn't present in the smoke. First off all the signs you describe in the shamanic rituals suggest posion by a toxin, so it's likely in that smoke. And what evidence is there that heat would destroy/deactivate it?

I understand you want to go through with it nonetheless, of course that's your choice to do. But I'd suggest you treat it more like acclimatization to a position , rather than treating it like any other drug. If you are aware that there are potentially cardiac-toxic elements in the venom, and if there's a chance you're inhaling them, it's best to use more caution than you would otherwise. Use it only very occasionally and watch for concerning side-effects in the days after.

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OfflineNotBTeleVised17
Cardboard Warrior


Registered: 07/06/17
Posts: 79
Last seen: 3 months, 8 days
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: CreonAntigone]
    #28667900 - 02/20/24 09:08 AM (4 months, 4 days ago)

I'm probably going to hold off for now for a full break through kind of dose which of the venom is 40+mg. You're right for concern and thanks for all of the info. The main videos and I think there are some studies about the cardiotoxins being destroyed, I know Metzner says it in one podcast I heard. I can ask the fivehive but that forum looks dead.

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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
Bodhi
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Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 28,069
Loc: The Primordial Mind
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: NotBTeleVised17] * 1
    #28668066 - 02/20/24 11:38 AM (4 months, 4 days ago)

Toadally worth it to the Toad or to You?


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Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps

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OfflineNotBTeleVised17
Cardboard Warrior


Registered: 07/06/17
Posts: 79
Last seen: 3 months, 8 days
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #28668092 - 02/20/24 12:08 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Actually it's apparently painless for the toad, they regenerate that defense mechanism pretty quickly and they have multiple glands to milk from. The conservation is an issue though because people do take them from their natural habitats. I didn't inquire about the conditions from the friend I got it from. They may even have them indoors so they don't need it for defense. Apparently they do sell them as pets online so who knows.

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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
Bodhi
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 28,069
Loc: The Primordial Mind
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: NotBTeleVised17]
    #28668175 - 02/20/24 01:14 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Well, jsyk, You also could simply order the same substance you'd lick off a sentient being right off the internet and its toadally the same substance, minus robbing an innocent toad of its stash!  :oldman:

i kid, i kid - but rly, you can find it online nowadays, gl. :thumbup:


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Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps

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OfflineNotBTeleVised17
Cardboard Warrior


Registered: 07/06/17
Posts: 79
Last seen: 3 months, 8 days
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #28668219 - 02/20/24 01:45 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Well I couldn't find online vendors, I never used dark/clear net...and sentient being...I'm guessing you're vegan? Nothing wrong with it I eat that way as well. I've found functional work footwear, car tires and apparently tryptamines hard to replace though.

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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
Bodhi
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 28,069
Loc: The Primordial Mind
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: NotBTeleVised17]
    #28668222 - 02/20/24 01:48 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Idk, I'm happy without messing with the toad, but if you're going to then more power to ya, just use your best judgement.
Btwz...I'm one of those omnivore sentient beings.
I think I might even be human...maybe. :eek:


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps

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OfflineBardy
Male

Registered: 04/02/14
Posts: 3,129
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Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #28668274 - 02/20/24 02:23 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Yeah I can’t see why you’d want to try toad venom. Shit is toxic af.

Buy some pure 5meo, get some yopo seeds or something…

Trembling hands for the day after from a small dose should be a massive warning dude.. come on. It’s the venom that’s doing that, not the 5meo.

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InvisibleCookies
Female
Registered: 02/15/04
Posts: 1,508
Re: Toad...is it worth it? [Re: Bardy]
    #28678807 - 02/27/24 07:13 PM (3 months, 27 days ago)

I extracted some toad venom and let it sit and dry.

Wet


Dried and broken up

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