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OfflineMushyPeaz
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Spawn bags won't colonize on top
    #27226449 - 02/25/21 06:58 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Hi all I'm trying to create some spawn grain with small bags but the top always seems to dry up and the mycelium doesn't colonize it. I've tried shaking it up but that doesn't do anything than to cause the already colonize kernals that make their way to the top dry out and become dormant.

Has anyone else experienced this, do I need to add less grain?



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InvisibleMycelium Juice
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: MushyPeaz]
    #27226487 - 02/25/21 07:29 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Are those .5 micron filters?  Try .2 if so


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OfflineMushyPeaz
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: Mycelium Juice]
    #27226984 - 02/26/21 04:42 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

I'm not sure about these bags specifically because the vendor didn't say on its website. It was advertised as spawn bags so I guess it might be 0.2.

On my other bags which I know I'm getting 0.2, this is happening also


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Invisiblemyc_ousin_vinny
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: MushyPeaz]
    #27227009 - 02/26/21 05:35 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

MushyPeaz said:
Hi all I'm trying to create some spawn grain with small bags but the top always seems to dry up and the mycelium doesn't colonize it. I've tried shaking it up but that doesn't do anything than to cause the already colonize kernals that make their way to the top dry out and become dormant.

Has anyone else experienced this, do I need to add less grain?






I saw this with similar products. It seems as though these grains dry out due to excess moisture loss from the over-sized filter patch. Of course, it could be contamination. Hard to tell with these bags unfortunately.

If it was me (and it's not) I would make sure it's colonized as much as possible then spawn... but spoon off the top dry grains with a sterile spoon before dumping it out. I'm a n00b tho /shrug.

I've heard that the filter patch is even kind of unnecessary because the excess air in the bag is enough for colonization in some instances. This is hearsay though so take with a grain of salt.

How long has it been colonizing?


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Offlinebw86
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: myc_ousin_vinny]
    #27227582 - 02/26/21 01:11 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

So, I have had this happen with clean spawn with both the .2 and .5 bags. I scrape the uncolonized top off and only used the colonized portion as long as it smells great.
In my scenario I think its a combination of Under-hydrated grains and or Unevenly dried grains.
In conjunction with never massaging after the original g2g.
Im interested to hear what others say.


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OfflineMushyPeaz
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: myc_ousin_vinny]
    #27228029 - 02/26/21 05:48 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

They reached that state in 3 weeks which is normal I think. They've been sitting like that for a further week with no further progression


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OfflineMushyPeaz
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: bw86]
    #27228035 - 02/26/21 05:52 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

That's interesting. I wonder how some people keep the top hydrated. How do you g2g with those? I can imagine scraping the top with a sterile spoon would be awkward in a sab and prone to getting unwanted spores on the spawn.


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Offlinetombosley8
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: MushyPeaz]
    #27228106 - 02/26/21 06:29 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

not for g2g just for spawning. if g2g the dry grains shouldn't matter since it's all sterile so no need for any dirty spooning in your SAB. for spawning I scrape them dry ones off in open air with my bare hands.

I just cut off the top of the bags and tilt it on it's side and scrape downward until I see myc which is just under the first single layer of grain. then just flip it upside down and dump it out into the trash.

try to hydrate your grain a little more and don't keep your bags in a drafty area. But this is not too big of an issue.

I spawn bags with a little dry grain on top all the time without scraping as I can see the myc has colonized the grain from the underside.

I have also noticed this sometimes happens with slower growing or weaker myc because it doesn't have time to colonize that surface layer before it dries out.


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Edited by tombosley8 (02/26/21 06:34 PM)


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OfflineMushyPeaz
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: tombosley8]
    #27228187 - 02/26/21 07:36 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks for the clarification.

When you use the spawn without scraping do you mean if the myc has colonized the dry grain but left the top of each kernel exposed because the bottom is more hydrated than the top? If so should you be worried that the exposed half of the kernels would get contam when spawning to bulk?


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Invisiblemyc_ousin_vinny
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: MushyPeaz]
    #27228471 - 02/26/21 10:50 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah.... I don’t know why I said SAB. Derp.


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Offlinetombosley8
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: myc_ousin_vinny]
    #27228642 - 02/27/21 04:29 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

For bags that are just a little bit dry, as long as your spawn is strong and clean the minimal amount of uncolonized(or at least visibly uncolonized) grain on the surface has shown no issues. I think the inside of the grains are colonized and just that surface where the air hits is the only uncolonized spot.

I used to save all the dry grain I scraped off and spawn it and I'd still get a decent flush before mold hit.


Also one last thing, the .2 micron filter bags help with drying out a lot.


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Edited by tombosley8 (02/27/21 04:31 AM)


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Offlinebw86
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: tombosley8]
    #27228697 - 02/27/21 06:13 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

I wasn't saying use them for G2G I said that happens to me in conjunction with the other factors when i knock bags up g2g and don't massage after.
I would Not suggest to use one of these the for g2g Or bags for g2g in general.
I would like to hear from others who might think they know why this is happening.

I have colonized bags starting upside down for 48-72 hours in the beginning then turned them over. This  seemed to help.
Other than that. Just massage your bags around 50% and it also resolved the problem.
@ mushypea how did you knock those bags up? When did you massage them ?


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Offlinetombosley8
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: bw86]
    #27230763 - 02/28/21 01:54 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

are you denying or just disregarding my thoughts on this or what? I have a ton of experience with this issue. literally a thousand bags.

I see no problem g2g with spawn that has dried out a bit on top. And G2G from bag to bag is a real struggle but I have seen it done successfully many times. It's just all about your technique.

there is only two conclusions I can come to with dried grains on the surface of spawn bags:
1. the grain was not properly hydrated
2. the Bags were left in a drafty area while colonizing.

3. the only other reason I can think of is you let your bags sit for a long time before inoculation so the grain had dried out some.

Maybe add a humidifier to the room where you store your spawn. Or curtain off your shelf where you keep your spawn to reduce air movement around the filters.


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Invisiblemyc_ousin_vinny
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: tombosley8]
    #27233126 - 03/02/21 04:33 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

I have inoculated about 6 different vendor made bags and they all did this on some level. Not bacterial. I bet if I had broken up/re-distributed and inverted them they would have "looked fully colonized".

They are super rhizo in a tub right now.

My 2 cents and that ain't much :-)


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Offlinetombosley8
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: myc_ousin_vinny]
    #27233187 - 03/02/21 06:14 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

temp fluctuations could be a factor as well. forgot to mention that originally. realized that when I saw my bags all condensating when the room cooled down tonight.


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OfflineDERRAYLD
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: tombosley8]
    #27233205 - 03/02/21 06:36 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Flip the bags to get the last bit colonized.


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OfflineRacRivRam
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Re: Spawn bags won't colonize on top [Re: MushyPeaz]
    #28632100 - 01/23/24 12:31 PM (4 days, 19 hours ago)

Bring your humidity up to 80% in your colonization chamber or whatever you use to control temperature as the .2 micron filter ebs and flows the moisture in the air. I put a large glass bowl of warm water in my chamber to help with this.


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