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OfflineGenesisCorruptedS
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: durian_2008]
    #28604707 - 12/31/23 03:08 PM (27 days, 15 hours ago)

Why do you keep not answering my questions in the wrong threads?

What are you hiding?


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OfflineFreedom
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: GenesisCorrupted] * 2
    #28604785 - 12/31/23 03:56 PM (27 days, 15 hours ago)

I think as long as one identifies with their beliefs, they will feel threatened when those beliefs are challenged....


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Invisibledurian_2008
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: Freedom]
    #28604827 - 12/31/23 04:13 PM (27 days, 14 hours ago)

During lockdown, I walked my dog, got suntanned, and focused on self improvement.

Some of my more activistic neighbors would objectively be threatening to my physical person, not just my philosophy.


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Offlinesyncro
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: GenesisCorrupted]
    #28605827 - 01/01/24 12:58 PM (26 days, 18 hours ago)

There's nothing wrong with helping others to help yourself, blessing others to bless yourself. It is exactly the law we need to see. One who does in spontaneity, more power to them. Who will be perfect? Very few which is the purpose and need in embracing the law, not worrying about insincerity or split mind. Following the law is the solution.


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Offlineblessed


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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: Freedom]
    #28615764 - 01/09/24 09:45 PM (18 days, 9 hours ago)

Quote:

loladoreen said:
Raised in a very strict religious family and I am the only non follower
I struggle to believe in a god so judgemental.
Yet tend to follow a lot of what I was taught.
I think organized religion inhibits people from thinking and being themselves.
I think things I was raised to believe as sin no longer makes sense to me.
Like premarital sex for example
I don't care who you have sex with or how
I do care if you lie, harm others and are judgemental
Religion caused me a lot of harm
But
I knew no different. I spent many years disliking myself for things I did
For years I was confused and thought I was damned for eternity
It really messes with you
It messed with me bad
The rejection is debilitating
When you're the non follower
I respect and understand others following
But I can't do it
I see so many unhappy people that stay in marriages they shouldn't and live an unfulfilled life so they can be eternally happy
Not for me




Quote:

Freedom said:
Quote:

blessed said:

Lastly to call the Bible and it's message (or the sharing of it) as terrorism is an very interesting take on where you stand concerning the Bible.  First of all, no one is holding a gun to your head saying believe or you're dead.





https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_trauma_syndrome

Quote:

RTS begins in toxic religious environments centered around two basic narratives: "You are not okay" and "You are not safe."[6] These ideas are often enforced by theology such as the doctrines of original sin and hell.[6]

The development of RTS can be compared to the development of Complex PTSD, defined as a psychological disorder that can develop in response to prolonged, repeated experience of interpersonal trauma in a context in which the individual has little or no chance of escape. Symptoms of RTS are a natural response to the perceived existence of a violent, all-powerful God who finds humans inherently defective, along with regular exposure to religious leaders who use the threat of eternal death, unredeemable life, demon possession and many other frightening ideas to control religious devotion and the submission of group members.[1]

Members of the LGBTQIA+ community are at particular risk of RTS and C-PTSD as they attempt, over an extended period of time, to alter their sexual orientation and gender identity to fit the expectations of authoritarian religious communities. The process of attempting to alter one's orientation can create emotionally abusive thought patterns that are prone to exacerbate the C-PTSD-like symptoms of RTS. Chronically living in fear of eternal damnation and lifelong separation from loved ones and religious communities if they fail to comply with sexual identity restrictions can induce long-term symptoms of RTS.[7][8]

Leaving
Leaving a controlling religious community, while often experienced as liberating and exciting, can be experienced as a major traumatic event. Religious communities often serve as the foundation for individuals' lives, providing social support, a coherent worldview, a sense of meaning and purpose, and social and emotional satisfaction. Leaving behind all those resources goes beyond a significant loss; it calls on the individual to completely reconstruct their reality, often while newly isolated from the help and support of family and friends who stay in the religion.[3][9][10]

In addition, when violent or threatening theology, such as a belief in hell, divine punishment, demons, and an evil "outside world," have been incorporated into the basic structure of an individual's worldview, the threats of engaging the outside world instead of remaining in the safe bubble of the controlling religious community can induce further anxiety.[1][7][9]

As individuals identify the harm they are experiencing in authoritarian religious settings, their concerns may be minimized by the religious group itself, but they can also be compounded by society's investment in positive views of religion.[3] Institutional betrayal, first at the hands of beloved religious communities, second at the hands of a world that upholds the utility of religion rather than the experiences of religious abuse survivors, can make symptoms of RTS worse.[3] People leaving religion can experience extreme hostility from their former co-religionists.[11]






Hello loladoreen & Freedom.

It's a sad reality of life that both your experience's happened, and worse that it happens as much as it does to so many people.

That being said, I would like to respond to you both on this subject next time I log on.


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OfflineAlyssa
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: blessed]
    #28615801 - 01/09/24 10:18 PM (18 days, 8 hours ago)

How much of a spiritual chance are you willing to take to avoid facing emotional trauma? How long are you willing to feel less than the ideal amount of comfort to be able to save someone else's soul? Are you willing to be martyred so someone else can have heaven instead of hell? If not, why are you so attached to your mortal life? It's going to last another 120 years max. Then you have a potentially infinite number of years in the reality where God can put your body back together with celestial matter manipulation technology (if you think of God as being able to do anything with the universe because he's outside it, it's not that difficult to believe in miracles). Don't push it!


--------------------
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I'm consecrated to the Immaculate Heart.
I don't want her to have to look at adultery to save my privileged living cells, so please keep it PG-13.


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Offlineblessed


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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: GenesisCorrupted]
    #28615802 - 01/09/24 10:18 PM (18 days, 8 hours ago)

Quote:

GenesisCorrupted said:
Babies are without sin.
There is no inherent evil inside of everyone.
Because everyone is capable of being an angel or a devil.
To seek out meaning and existence is inherent. It is part of our struggle here.
A baby that died. Is not going to hell because it wasn’t held under some water. Somebody who is mentally unfit and cannot attend mass. Is not damned for eternity.
I reject that notion.



If you reject what the Bible says is true then that's ok with me.  I strongly believe that each person has to make their own decision and choice when it comes to the Bible and what it says.  As you have rejected it, I think that our conversation on sin has naturally come to an end.

I will however based from your replies in this thread say this, I can't help but believe that you have a totally incorrect understanding of what the Bible actually says and more importantly, it's message.

One example: Absolutely nowhere in the Bible does it say that if a baby dies, that it is going to hell (as you say) "because it wasn’t held under some water."

Happy New-ish Year, and all the best. :thumbup:


Edited by blessed (01/10/24 05:48 PM)


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OfflineAlyssa
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: blessed]
    #28615807 - 01/09/24 10:22 PM (18 days, 8 hours ago)

Babies aren't without sin. How innocent is "innocent"? When a baby lashes out physically is she/he no longer innocent? God tests our souls from the moment of conception. He's the first to know if a fetus is likely to grow up to be a psychopath.


--------------------
I'm Alyssa.
I'm consecrated to the Immaculate Heart.
I don't want her to have to look at adultery to save my privileged living cells, so please keep it PG-13.


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OfflineGenesisCorruptedS
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: blessed]
    #28615831 - 01/09/24 10:53 PM (18 days, 8 hours ago)

According to the Bible.
You need to be baptized to go to heaven. If a baby isn’t baptized, it goes to purgatory. That’s the “good word” for ya.
Legitimately a happy New Year’s to you.
:cheers:


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Edited by GenesisCorrupted (01/09/24 11:47 PM)


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OfflineAnattaAtman
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: GenesisCorrupted] * 1
    #28615904 - 01/10/24 01:29 AM (18 days, 5 hours ago)

There is even a special word for the baby hell. It's called "Limbo".


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OfflineGenesisCorruptedS
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: AnattaAtman]
    #28615906 - 01/10/24 01:38 AM (18 days, 5 hours ago)

Quote:

AnattaAtman said:
There is even a special word for the baby hell. It's called "Limbo".



How sick is that right?
No babies go to hell. I don’t care what a book says. Babies are innocent. They don’t get punished.
That is just another attempt to terrify you into following their religion or else.


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Offlineblessed


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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: GenesisCorrupted]
    #28622055 - 01/15/24 11:20 AM (12 days, 19 hours ago)

Quote:

loladoreen said:
Raised in a very strict religious family and I am the only non follower
I struggle to believe in a god so judgemental.
Yet tend to follow a lot of what I was taught.
I think organized religion inhibits people from thinking and being themselves.
I think things I was raised to believe as sin no longer makes sense to me.
Like premarital sex for example
I don't care who you have sex with or how
I do care if you lie, harm others and are judgemental
Religion caused me a lot of harm
But
I knew no different. I spent many years disliking myself for things I did
For years I was confused and thought I was damned for eternity
It really messes with you
It messed with me bad
The rejection is debilitating
When you're the non follower
I respect and understand others following
But I can't do it
I see so many unhappy people that stay in marriages they shouldn't and live an unfulfilled life so they can be eternally happy
Not for me



Quote:

Freedom said:
Quote:

blessed said:

Lastly to call the Bible and it's message (or the sharing of it) as terrorism is an very interesting take on where you stand concerning the Bible.  First of all, no one is holding a gun to your head saying believe or you're dead.





https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_trauma_syndrome

Quote:

RTS begins in toxic religious environments centered around two basic narratives: "You are not okay" and "You are not safe."[6] These ideas are often enforced by theology such as the doctrines of original sin and hell.[6]

The development of RTS can be compared to the development of Complex PTSD, defined as a psychological disorder that can develop in response to prolonged, repeated experience of interpersonal trauma in a context in which the individual has little or no chance of escape. Symptoms of RTS are a natural response to the perceived existence of a violent, all-powerful God who finds humans inherently defective, along with regular exposure to religious leaders who use the threat of eternal death, unredeemable life, demon possession and many other frightening ideas to control religious devotion and the submission of group members.[1]

Members of the LGBTQIA+ community are at particular risk of RTS and C-PTSD as they attempt, over an extended period of time, to alter their sexual orientation and gender identity to fit the expectations of authoritarian religious communities. The process of attempting to alter one's orientation can create emotionally abusive thought patterns that are prone to exacerbate the C-PTSD-like symptoms of RTS. Chronically living in fear of eternal damnation and lifelong separation from loved ones and religious communities if they fail to comply with sexual identity restrictions can induce long-term symptoms of RTS.[7][8]

Leaving
Leaving a controlling religious community, while often experienced as liberating and exciting, can be experienced as a major traumatic event. Religious communities often serve as the foundation for individuals' lives, providing social support, a coherent worldview, a sense of meaning and purpose, and social and emotional satisfaction. Leaving behind all those resources goes beyond a significant loss; it calls on the individual to completely reconstruct their reality, often while newly isolated from the help and support of family and friends who stay in the religion.[3][9][10]

In addition, when violent or threatening theology, such as a belief in hell, divine punishment, demons, and an evil "outside world," have been incorporated into the basic structure of an individual's worldview, the threats of engaging the outside world instead of remaining in the safe bubble of the controlling religious community can induce further anxiety.[1][7][9]

As individuals identify the harm they are experiencing in authoritarian religious settings, their concerns may be minimized by the religious group itself, but they can also be compounded by society's investment in positive views of religion.[3] Institutional betrayal, first at the hands of beloved religious communities, second at the hands of a world that upholds the utility of religion rather than the experiences of religious abuse survivors, can make symptoms of RTS worse.[3] People leaving religion can experience extreme hostility from their former co-religionists.[11]







Hello again.

Whether we like it or not, It's a fact of life that all parents can (and do) have a large an impact on their children lives.  This happens regardless of whether the parents are religious or not .  Every child is greatly impacted (as an adult) by how they were raised.  So my first point is this, both religious & non religious parents have for generations after generations poorly raise their children, so It is therefor incorrect to point the finger solely at parents who believe in the God of the Bible.  But as the subject matter is the life long scars and damage caused by religious parents as raised in this thread by both loladoreen & Freedom, I will now try to address this, but please do not forget that many, many, many non religious parents have also caused life long damage and scars to children (using a form of fear to keep their kids in-line or downtrodden).  My intention is to approach this problem from the point of view of what the Bible actually says.

But first, I'd like to start with my own parents who forced us (my brothers & sisters) to go to church from a young age.  Now while I feel that overall my parents did a poor job of raising us, I have to say that other then the forced going to church (which I'm now glad they did), the biggest issues that I actually have against my parents have little to nothing to do with their belief in God or how they used the Bible to raise us up.  Now my father did smack us on occasions, but this wasn't like every day or week, and when he did it was only after we did something wrong (9 times out of 10).  Despite this fact, I can honestly say I hold no grudge against him concerning his form of discipline.  I would like to add that my parents never ever used the fear of hell, to correct me or make me feel afraid of God, never.

Now for my second point, there is nowhere in the Bible that parents are instructed to treat their children in a, bad , abusive , demeaning , fear based ("you're going to hell if you don't eat your vegetables") , with verbal or physical attacks, or by treating them like scum.  Any parent that does raise their children in such manner is definitely sure to cause mental scars and life long struggles for a child, and to do so is wrong, but my point is this, there are no parents who could justifiably justify raising up a child like this and be able to quote from the Bible as the guide lines for such an poor upbringing.  It's 100% not biblical.


So if the Bible isn't instructing parents to raise their children in such a harmful way, what then could be the possible reasons for this sad reality to occur?

A few possible reason.

First I say that no parent does a perfect job, and when you add the dynamic of different children with different types of personality,  I think it's safe to say that no matter how hard any parents try to raise their kids correctly, there is always going to be some form of hurt or emotional scar that will affect the child growing up.  Now another reason is that when children are raised by religious parents, they will typically be raised by a certain type of parent (please see below).  Now the type of religious parent a child has will usually determine the likelihood of RTS (religious trauma syndrome).  But because of the complexities of family life this is not always the case.

Religious Parent Types

Parent Type A:  These parent themselves had bad parents and upbringing and this is unconsciously carried out through in how they raise their children (monkey see, monkey do).  Now these types of parents will typically handle or treat situations primarily from the poor lessons they learned by being raised by their own parents.  Now regardless of if these people do (or come to) believe in God, without being corrected, they will by default treat their children like they were treated.  This was the fact for both of my parents, and I recognize that their poor upbringing directly negatively affected mine, but I want to add that what the Bible has to say had nothing to do with my poor upbringing and that it was a result of my parents having worse parents themselves.

Parent Type B:  These parents while not having been raised poorly have (for whatever reason) decided to have religion in their life (maybe it's the family's religion).  Now for these parents their religion is more about a socializing then actually truly believing in God and taking up their daily cross to follow him.  These people will typically be in churches that do not hold to the true teaching of the Bible, but instead offer a replacement religion that still give the follower a belief in God and  a community to be part of.  The problem with religion/churches like these are that they don't require said believer/parishioner to actually believe and obey the Bible.  It's more about keeping a seat warm once a week (or a year) and following a couple of simple rules and that with the occasional confession and prayer (especially just before passing away), is all they need to do to have their salvation assured (nothing could be further from the truth).  The parents who most likely fits this type will be Catholics or similar churches like the Church of England.

Parent Type C:  These are the parents that for whatever reason follow extreme teachings and will typically be parts of what some would consider cults or fanatical fundamental churches.  Now there can be many reasons why people join cults but for those that join religious cults I am 100% confident that none of them read the Bible and just from that was, lead to join such extreme cults or churches.  My argument is that there has to be another factor that makes them want to join extreme religious places.  Now here's were things get ugly, when these parents have children they inevitably will raise their children in the extreme teachings.  This is the one of the worst possible thing for a child to experience and grow up in, as it will most likely affect their life (usually for the worst).


My Conclusion.

Both (B & C) types of parents are not true Christians according to the Bible own standards and so, while they may be able to quote some Bible verses here and there, when it comes to raising a child, they (the parents) by rejecting the truth of the Bible and subsequently taking verses out of context, will very likely raise a child in a poor harmful manner and therefor it's not surprising that people experience upbringings like loladoreen did.  Sorry to tell you this loladoreen, but your parents aren't true Biblical Christians.  Is it any wonder why such parents incorrectly quote the Bible and use fear (instead of love) and put downs (instead of uplifting encouragement) when it comes to raising their children.  It is these types of parents that do the majority of all of the damage and abuse that children are subjected to growing up when it comes to religious parents.

Freedoms post about RTS (religious trauma syndrome) is therefor I believe a direct result of religious parents B & C, and as these parents ain't true Christians, to use it against the God of the Bible as if he and his book is the cause of the problem is sorry, bullcrap.  Now I'm not saying that the trauma that children face is bullcrap, but the attempt to blame God and his book when the actual cause is because of fake ass numbnuts, pretending to be Christians but like the Bible refers to such people, they are cups that are clean on the outside but dirty on the inside.

Now I wanted to share from the Bible's perspective on how God deals with children (now adults) that (for whatever the reason) have a poor or wrong, or even a fearful understanding of the God of the Bible, and how he deals with that fact, including that they now want nothing to do with him.  Can God save/reach someone so damaged by fake religious parents and bring them (the hurt and damage child/adult) back to a right and true understating of him and the Bible?, according to God's words, yes he can (Romans 8:35-39).

I'll end with a question.

If you were to write a teaching/instruction book (on anything) and some of the readers of your book didn't correctly follow your instructions which led to them (and those around them) experiencing problems of various sorts, would it be your fault or that of the one who did not correctly follow your instructions/teaching?  In addition, would you gladly accept criticism or complaints by those who did not correct follow your teaching/instructions, or would you reject their complaints as you know it's not your teaching that caused the problem, but that the fault lies with those who didn't follow the instructions correctly?

............

TLDR

Please stop blaming the God of the Bible for the things dumb, stupid, 2-faced c@nts, lying, sick, depraved, evil sacks of poops (aka people/humans) do!!!!!!


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InvisibleNillion
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: blessed] * 1
    #28622073 - 01/15/24 11:38 AM (12 days, 19 hours ago)

Quote:

blessed said:
Now for my second point, there is nowhere in the Bible that parents are instructed to treat their children in a, bad , abusive , demeaning , fear based ("you're going to hell if you don't eat your vegetables") , with verbal or physical attacks, or by treating them like scum.




Deuteronomy 21:18-21

Quote:

If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them: Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place; And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard. And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.




It literally says that if your kid is not obedient then take them before the elders and make false accusations about them being gluttons and drunkards so that they will be stoned to death.

The Bible is so fucked when it comes to parenting that it's not even funny.

The loyalty test of telling Abraham to kill his son is an example of that.

And then you have to realize it comes from Judaism, which traditionally is NOT child friendly. Find any copy of the Babylonian Talmud and look up Mishnah Niddah 5:4. It's about how a man can become betrothed to female child who is 3 years and one day old by having sex with her. If she is younger than this, it says it doesn't count, same  if she doesn't bleed.

Both the Bible and Judaism treat children horrifically.

The exception to this are the Teachings of Jesus, but he was baptized a Mandaean, he wasn't a practitioner of Judaism in any way shape or form. He abandoned it quite early in his life when he was in Egypt. In fact his family had a Rabbi traveling with them when this occurred and in the Talmud, again, they talk shit on him for this and say he became a brick-worshiper. His teachings have nothing to do with Judaism.

In fact, in the Bible there is a quote about what he actually thought about Judaism. It is John 8:44-45:

Quote:

You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me.





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InvisibleNillion
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: GenesisCorrupted]
    #28622227 - 01/15/24 01:59 PM (12 days, 17 hours ago)

I always hint that I have more but don't share it. Well, I'm sharing a bit of the life of Jesus now. Here's a synopsis of the real story:

In some other ancient texts and accounts, which Catholics used to murder people for having after the vote at Nicaea, the story of the man we call Jesus today is very different.

Jesus’ mother was in the line of hereditary succession for both the throne of Judea and the position of high priest. She was also betrothed to a man from an early age, she was not given a choice in this.

When she was young, she fell in love with a man and had a child with him. This man was not the one she was betrothed to.  According to Judaic law she was to be stoned to death while pregnant. She knew that forcing little girls to marry people was wrong and that there is no sin in love. This is why it is said she bore Jesus without sin. Not because she never had sex or because he was half deity, but because there is no sin in a woman determining the course of her own life. Judaism historically,  however, says otherwise.

A man was trying to gain control of Judea by marrying into the royal family. He sought to have all the male heirs to the throne killed, this allowed him to marry a woman from the royal line and it was his hope that this would legitimize his rule over Judea in the mind of the people, who were mainly Jews. His name was Herod.  The woman we call Mary had already gone into hiding when pregnant and had concealed that there was a child. That was until three men entered the kingdom asking where the kid was, not because the saw a magic star that guided them, but because they heard from other human beings about how she had given birth and her son was legitimately in both the line of royal succession and in the line of the high priest succession. Herod was furious because this child had been hidden from him and he sent people out to kill the kid. This caused the family to go to Egypt. It was there in Alexandria that Jesus was initiated into the scribal tradition and learned to read and write, among other things.

And get this, she ended up marrying the guy she was betrothed to in the end and he was like a father to Jesus and considered his wife without sin. He wasn’t a bad guy at all.

Eventually Herod died and they returned thinking things were cool. Jesus became a Nazarene, which is the name of the Mandaean priests. This is why he was called Jesus of Nazarus.  The title meant literally that he was a priest of that religion, baptized by John the Baptist. Eventually Jesus went out teaching and developed an enormous following, he was very intelligent and kind and well loved. He also preached things like forgiveness, which is basically blasphemy to old school Judaism. When his travels took him to Jerusalem he caught the attention of the authorities and he was identified as the son of his mother, he was considered living proof of her adultery. In Jerusalem he had few followers and the Jews captured him and brought him to Pilate and Pilate found him innocent of any crimes.  However the Pharisees were furious, they bribed Pilate with 30 pieces of silver and he turned Jesus over to them. They stoned him to death and then hung his body on a cross shaped like an X, Pilate was disgusted and knowing that Jesus was literally Judaic royalty had his soldiers put a sign on the corpse that said basically “this is what Jews do to their Kings” and the Jews kept taking the sign down and Pilate kept having his guys put one back up. Then the corpse disappeared and was never seen again.

This was so horrific, brutal and evil that it caused a massive political movement that totally changed Judea and Jerusalem, not that long after his murder the number of followers Jesus had vastly increased. There were several sects, but eventually as a way to control the political issue Rome converted to Christianity by renaming all things Roman as Christian and then making it punishable by death to practice any other form of Christianity. This happened under Constantine, who after his so called conversion killed far more Christians than he did when he was a pagan. Rome kept the same location, rites, days of worship and more of their Pagan ways. They changed the doctrine to reflect the Roman pagan claim that Gods mate with humans and made Jesus a new form of Hercules.
Eventually we get to Nicaea and the Nicene Creed when the neopagan Catholics voted on what they thought was true in regard to Jesus and came up with the version we have in the bible today.

I know more about this than any Christian I have ever met, because they just assume the Bible is true and don’t look for other accounts and records of the life of Jesus and his mother. 

And as for Q source, Tatianus didn’t combine the synoptics into a harmony, that was the original work, it had 3 perspectives together in one tale and then later to flesh the material out more they were separated into 3 books, which were 80% verbatim because of their origin. Justin, Tatianus’ teacher, wrote the book we call John. The rest were Pauline inventions from later.  I’ve thought about writing about this, but I keep a lot to myself and just keep learning.  This isn’t even the detailed version of these events. There are more details and aspects, like about the trial where Pilate found Jesus innocent before the bribe.

Christ taught salvation through good conduct, he never taught that he was magically going to make it so that sinners who accepted him as master were immune from the consequences of sin. He also never taught that he was the son of the God of the Jews. That’s all stuff that came later from organized religion that perverted his teachings into a way to control people and make money from them while doing it.

Christians today think that we know almost nothing about the life of Jesus Christ, but that isn’t true, they just reject the truth because it doesn’t fit their magical narrative of a Jewish God making his son a human sacrifice for the good of all mankind.

At least, this is what I've learned about the matter through years of study. I'm not sharing this synopsis here to offend Christians, Jews or Catholics, but so that people have a chance to hear the historically accurate account rather than the one told by religions that want their money. Naturally, I've not written of this in public before and may even delete this post at some point. I generally keep things like this private out of respect for the beliefs of others but perhaps some here can appreciate that Jesus was real, he isn't made up, but the real story is far more fucked up and sad than the bible version is.

Anyway, if this offends you feel free to add me to your ignore list.


Edited by Nillion (01/16/24 07:56 AM)


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InvisibleNillion
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: GenesisCorrupted]
    #28622246 - 01/15/24 02:13 PM (12 days, 16 hours ago)

Incidentally the synoptic gospels were based on accounts of Jesus' teachings (logoi) and life and though they were messed up by the Catholics they still contain some direct teachings such as the two christian commandments and more. Much of the sermon on the Mount contains actual teachings of Jesus, though not every word is accurate.


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OfflineFreedom
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Re: The Priest vs the Saint. Are you religious, or just afraid of consequence? [Re: blessed] * 2
    #28622372 - 01/15/24 04:19 PM (12 days, 14 hours ago)

Quote:

blessed said:


Please stop blaming the God of the Bible for the things dumb, stupid, 2-faced c@nts, lying, sick, depraved, evil sacks of poops (aka people/humans) do!!!!!!





I was responding to this statement :

Quote:

First of all, no one is holding a gun to your head saying believe or you're dead.




My point was that things aren't all one way. I've met a lot of people, especially Catholics, that had various degrees of trauma because of the way their families but beliefs on them.

The idea of the devil terrifies a lot of people. For a long time the idea of hell was so absurd to me I didn't think anyone could actually believe in it, but it was people who were terrified and shared their terror with me that convinced me they actually did believe.

There is nothing innately good or bad about squiggles of ink on paper bound together in a book, how those squiggles are interpreted and how that interpretation affects people that's important. This also can't be separated from all the other aspects of the religion and culture, in terms of main stream religion.

Over the centuries the bible has been interpreted in many different ways and used to justify or vilify many different things.


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