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Joh.Ke
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What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside)
#28611016 - 01/05/24 09:12 PM (22 days, 17 hours ago) |
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To me, the ability to come up with something that's both original and worthwhile, is the true mark of intelligence. When this happens to a very significant degree, it indicates genius.
Now, I want to talk about traits that most people think indicate intelligence, but actually aren't. Things like:
Having a very good memory Being very observant Having a big vocabulary Well-read Being very knowledgeable/knowing a lot of things, facts or info Quick reaction Having a quick wit Having been placed in a gifted program And in some cases, having a background in a STEM or computer field
I am not saying these things aren't valuable, obviously they are, however by themselves, they don't indicate true intelligence. Yes, truly intelligent people are usually the things mentioned above, however, just because you are these things, it doesn't necessarily mean you are intelligent. It could just mean that you are clever, or rather, not stupid.
Next, I want to talk about people who consider themselves smart. Needlessly to say, a lot of them are merely clever instead of actually intelligent. But that's not the worst part. The worst part is that they constantly make a showy display of their brain powers. This shows that they actually have low confidence in themselves and need constant validation from others in the form of praise. In other words, they have a real, desperate thirst for things like, "you are so intelligent!" and, "you are so smart, you almost constitute another species" (this last one really makes them cream their pants). They are always showing off how smart they think they are, not knowing how much this puts people off. My message to them: knock it off. Nobody likes a show off and furthermore, the world will not end if someone, somewhere, does not think you are smart.
Another thing: most people tend to overestimate their own intelligence. It's like, those of them who are not positively stupid all think they are smart. And those who have a little bit of smarts all think they are geniuses. This affects more men than women.
Further, I want to say to everyone who thinks they are intelligent: nobody gives a shit about how awesomely superior you think your brain power is. I only look at what you can add to human advancement or if you can't, which is fine cause it's a pretty tall order, I look at what you add to my life. Does your smart invent something that markedly improves my life? Or failing that, are you funny and likable? The latter has nothing to do with intelligence but is important. (Dubiously) intelligent people think by being smart they will impress people and this will make people (especially women) like them more. No. Only stupid people get impressed by intelligence. Sensible people look at what you can do to add to their life. Intelligence is not that different from other positive traits, so stop acting like you are the shit just because you know a few things about the computer or can balance equations or work for the CIA.
And just so that I don't inadvertently offend anybody here on shroomery: no, this thread is not inspired by what I see here. I have always had these thoughts swirling in my head for a long time, and the last straw was something I read on Quora when I tried to find information on intelligence. Some of the posts there were so egotistic, they almost made me puke. It was almost like people got on a huge stage upon which they mentally masturbated themselves for the whole world to see.
Edited by Joh.Ke (01/06/24 08:30 AM)
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420Botanist
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Joh.Ke]
#28611201 - 01/06/24 04:28 AM (22 days, 10 hours ago) |
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Intelligence can be dependent and subjective.
An expert in one field can be novice in another, I would argue they are intelligent people.
We are all intelligent to a degree, we all have the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills. Like learning to walk.
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loladoreen


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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Joh.Ke] 1
#28611256 - 01/06/24 05:34 AM (22 days, 9 hours ago) |
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I always found the more I learned the more I realized how little I know.
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420Botanist
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: loladoreen] 1
#28611264 - 01/06/24 05:40 AM (22 days, 9 hours ago) |
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Quote:
loladoreen said: I always found the more I learned the more I realized how little I know.
Albert Einstein 
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badchad
Mad Scientist

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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Joh.Ke]
#28611567 - 01/06/24 10:44 AM (22 days, 4 hours ago) |
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How do you determine if something is "worthwhile?"
-------------------- ...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge. It is an indellible experience; it is forever known. I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did. Smith, P. Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27. ...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely. Osmond, H. Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436
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420Botanist
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: badchad] 1
#28611572 - 01/06/24 10:48 AM (22 days, 4 hours ago) |
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That's a personal opinion. Something that you value might be completely worthless to me.
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yeahnahmate
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: 420Botanist]
#28611582 - 01/06/24 10:52 AM (22 days, 4 hours ago) |
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Massive rant incoming, skip to the last paragraph if you want any actual substance rather than background.
Yep. I went to a high school that was characterised in my city as being very intelligent — there was an entrance exam, we had multiple top scorers in the country each year, 99.6 percent of my graduating class went to university etc.
People thought we were intelligent just because we went there. When you mentioned what school you went to, anyone who was familiar with it would make a comment like “oh you must be smart then”, and in the traditional sense, they’d be completely right.
But looking from the inside, most students honestly weren’t. Obviously, we had more than our fair share of distinguished careers, but you wouldn’t tell it from talking to many of the students. We were all more preoccupied with getting munted on the weekends than meaningfully contributing to society. There was a certain lack of imagination there, and I’m not excluding myself.
The so called “smart kids” weren’t all that smart at all, so there must be a problem with the traditional definition.
I think your definition hits the mark extremely well. Much of my former classmates would be completely discounted by it as they never did any original work. They followed a plan set out by other people for them, and with a combination of hard work and genuine talent (they were absolutely gifted), turned it into good scores, good degrees and good careers. Any deviation from this plan was ridiculed as “only morons don’t go to uni”, and “anyone who gets a TER < 90 should just shoot themselves”.
I sound like a massive tosser, but we were pretty much crabs in a bucket. Any original contribution would be discouraged in favour of “tried and tested” methods. Even simple things like having a blog, drawing and creating (not playing) music were mocked. If your hobbies weren’t studying to get a high ENTER and getting blackout drunk in the city every Friday and Saturday, you were shit out of luck.
And we were seen as successes! Our ability to regurgitate information put us at the top year after year, as something to look up to!
At the end of the day, you’re stuck wondering why we see an intelligent person as someone who can regurgitate information well rather than someone who has expanded the realm of human knowledge, to our benefit.
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Joh.Ke
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: yeahnahmate]
#28611743 - 01/06/24 01:26 PM (22 days, 1 hour ago) |
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Well said sir.
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loladoreen


Registered: 05/25/20
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Joh.Ke]
#28612278 - 01/06/24 08:23 PM (21 days, 18 hours ago) |
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Very well said.
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spirit_shadow
Feature not a bug



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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: loladoreen]
#28612304 - 01/06/24 08:33 PM (21 days, 18 hours ago) |
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I don't know shit.
-------------------- ERROR 418 IM A TEAPOT.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011 Ban lotto
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Nillion
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Joh.Ke]
#28612378 - 01/06/24 09:36 PM (21 days, 17 hours ago) |
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To me intelligence is just the ability to process information well.
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420Botanist
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Nillion]
#28612573 - 01/07/24 04:24 AM (21 days, 10 hours ago) |
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Quote:
Nillion said: To me intelligence is just the ability to process information well.
That's an interesting view, I would go with that to a degree but add in 'new' information. Else that would mean pretty much any digital device or circuit is intelligent.
For example at a higher level our thermostats processes temperature information.
At a lower level, different frequencies, voltages, signals, resistors, relays, transistors, varistors, PWM signal, voltages, diodes, probes, sensors etc etc all work to receive and process information.
Similarly we could code a program to process information based on set conditions or logic.
Does that make the program intelligent or is it simply following set routines, comparisons and operations?

Edit: Your answer still has me thinking... with the advent of ML (machine learning), processing new information is possible but still relies on data models to exhibit intelligent behaviour.
Edited by 420Botanist (01/07/24 05:08 AM)
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Northerner
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: 420Botanist] 1
#28612625 - 01/07/24 05:53 AM (21 days, 9 hours ago) |
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Intelligence by definition could be applied as the ability to understand. That applies to so much more than maths and English. Socially and naturally intelligent people are indeed gifted as well.
But how could an intelligent person act less intelligent anymore than a dumb person could act dumb? By being disengenuous and deceptive?
The dunning-kruger effect is super interesting, but when we take the next step about self belief, people with higher intellect have poorer emotional and psychological outcomes. More suicide, more depression, more drug addiction.
In your fkn face egotistical intellectuals can go suck a dick tho... those guys suck. But I don't think that's the majority of high intellect individuals. They're just trying to get by and feel loved and safe like everyone else.
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RainbowKittyAttack
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Joh.Ke] 1
#28613983 - 01/08/24 10:53 AM (20 days, 4 hours ago) |
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Intelligence to me is knowing there's always more you could learn, have drive/willingness to self educate, take a course, ask questions... and have the ability to accept contrary evidence/ideas and then change your mind. Otherwise you'll never be any smarter or aware than when you stopped trying. Everyone trying is intelligent and evolving in their own right. Toxic ego though doesn't discriminate, it presents in every group.
Edited by RainbowKittyAttack (01/08/24 10:54 AM)
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durian_2008
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: RainbowKittyAttack]
#28614011 - 01/08/24 11:17 AM (20 days, 3 hours ago) |
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I feel that free agency and contrition are higher orders of intelligence than rote memorization, parroting, and calculations.
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Nate em All
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: durian_2008] 1
#28614025 - 01/08/24 11:32 AM (20 days, 3 hours ago) |
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Adaptation
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Nillion
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Joh.Ke]
#28614033 - 01/08/24 11:37 AM (20 days, 3 hours ago) |
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Sometimes it can be difficult for me to tell if we are discussing intelligence as an opinion or as an aspect of function.
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durian_2008
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Nillion] 1
#28614034 - 01/08/24 11:41 AM (20 days, 3 hours ago) |
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There are believed to be different levels of intelligence, when the medical textbooks discuss human, psychological development.
Although adaptation / innovation might been seen as something that can be triggered by external stimuli, I feel that it is limited by our inherent capacity for change.
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Pscientist
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: durian_2008] 1
#28614354 - 01/08/24 06:05 PM (19 days, 20 hours ago) |
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In my opinion,
Intelligence has different forms, with the most basic being physical intelligence (olympic athletes) and intellectual intelligence. Physical intelligence can exist in an individual without substantial intellectual intelligence and vice versa. People have considerable amounts of both tend to be the high performers in athletics. I have had friends with high physical intelligence but low desire to study academically.
I think most people tend to think of intellectual intelligence when they think of the concept of intelligence in general, which I also think have several forms but maybe two major ones would be logical and emotional intelligence. Again these intelligence can be mutually exclusive, but I think they tend to correlate with each other for the most part, spare exceptions like sociopaths.
Emotional intelligence is the ability to see alternative perspectives in high degrees of accuracy, and complexity and direct behaviours on the basis of these multiple perspectives.
Intellectual/logical intelligence is hard to quantify, as they all are, but I think it tends to correlate with the ability to solve problems, synthesize information from multiple sources, evaluate complex data and consider data within contexts that others may not. I think there is some degree of obsessiveness that also correlates with this, and the desire or thirst to understand more, and acquire more information, solve complex problems.
These are all my own thoughts though. I never really understood what intelligence was but this is what I have figured out so far.
-------------------- Any information posted on this website from this account is hypothetical and only to be used for legal purposes.
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Nate em All
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Pscientist] 1
#28614674 - 01/08/24 11:12 PM (19 days, 15 hours ago) |
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Quote:
Pscientist said: In my opinion,
Intelligence has different forms, with the most basic being physical intelligence (olympic athletes) and intellectual intelligence. Physical intelligence can exist in an individual without substantial intellectual intelligence and vice versa. People have considerable amounts of both tend to be the high performers in athletics. I have had friends with high physical intelligence but low desire to study academically.
I think most people tend to think of intellectual intelligence when they think of the concept of intelligence in general, which I also think have several forms but maybe two major ones would be logical and emotional intelligence. Again these intelligence can be mutually exclusive, but I think they tend to correlate with each other for the most part, spare exceptions like sociopaths.
Emotional intelligence is the ability to see alternative perspectives in high degrees of accuracy, and complexity and direct behaviours on the basis of these multiple perspectives.
Intellectual/logical intelligence is hard to quantify, as they all are, but I think it tends to correlate with the ability to solve problems, synthesize information from multiple sources, evaluate complex data and consider data within contexts that others may not. I think there is some degree of obsessiveness that also correlates with this, and the desire or thirst to understand more, and acquire more information, solve complex problems.
These are all my own thoughts though. I never really understood what intelligence was but this is what I have figured out so far.
Really well fucking put actually. Summarizes a good amount of the intelligence debate
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Nate em All
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Re: What is true intelligence to you? (warning: rant inside) [Re: Nate em All]
#28614704 - 01/09/24 12:31 AM (19 days, 14 hours ago) |
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I think your issue is with respect @op
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