Home | Community | Message Board

Original Seeds Store
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Left Coast Kratom Kratom Powder For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3  [ show all ]
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
What is yoga? * 1
    #28606196 - 01/01/24 05:54 PM (26 days, 1 hour ago)

Some people have seemed to recently take offense by my recent shade towards yoga. For those who have been hurt by my words, I'm sorry. The issue I've faced in my life is that a lot of these spiritual things seem so stupid on the surface, that I can't take it seriously (again, at first blush.) One of those things was mysticism. I thought it was stupid until I actually did it and it "clicked". So, I'm just wondering if I'm doing it with my initial, biased thoughts against yoga? So... with that, what is yoga? What am I missing?:naturetrip:


--------------------
Chopin in Eternal Sonata: "I believe that I am somehow being tested. That I am on this journey to come to some realization. And in order to do so, I think I’m supposed to live my life to the fullest, even if it is in this muddled world of dream and reality."


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleNillion
Nobody

Registered: 04/14/22
Posts: 1,000
Loc: Terra Firma
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 3
    #28606214 - 01/01/24 06:08 PM (26 days, 1 hour ago)

The word Yoga means to unite the mind with the divine and manifest the divine within the being. In a manner of speaking it is an entheogenic tradition. However training the spirit, as it were, involves training the body and mind.

Japa Yoga is the use of mantras to train the mind

Natya yoga is the use of Karanas, Mudras and cadence to train the body to make certain motions that can be used in many ways, such as expressively, but even as a martial art.

Hatha yoga is the use of postures and breath to make the body and mind strong as well as do qi-gong like energy work.

Trantric yoga... well, you get the idea.

Neigong energy work like Dao Yin and several other qigong methods are often considered a type of Yoga as well.

Yoga is, in this fashion, not a specific individual practice but is any practice which unifies the practitioner with the divine. Painting could even be a type of Yoga, so can sculpting etc.

In the moderns sense Yoga is Asana or posture training, but even today one can find sacred yoga being practiced in several ways and in numerous cultures.

Here is the link to older definitions of Yoga:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoga#Definitions_in_classical_texts


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: Nillion] * 1
    #28606226 - 01/01/24 06:12 PM (26 days, 57 minutes ago)

That's fascinating. I'm definitely going to have to give that a read. If it's entheogenic in nature, count me in!


--------------------
Chopin in Eternal Sonata: "I believe that I am somehow being tested. That I am on this journey to come to some realization. And in order to do so, I think I’m supposed to live my life to the fullest, even if it is in this muddled world of dream and reality."


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 1
    #28606282 - 01/01/24 06:38 PM (26 days, 31 minutes ago)

From Nillon's reference, pretty much your words Solar. 'Yoga is the means of perceiving reality.'


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28606337 - 01/01/24 07:11 PM (25 days, 23 hours ago)

Wow! That's incredible. I'll have to look more into yoga, syncro and Nillion, ha. I'm curious what your all's thoughts are on this clip below? Someone posted it from r/NDE. You can read a little bit about it here: https://dowsers.com/walter-russell-books-descriptions-b/ ;  Interested in your thoughts.
redditmedia.com%2F&source_ve_path=MjM4NTE&feature=emb_title


--------------------
Chopin in Eternal Sonata: "I believe that I am somehow being tested. That I am on this journey to come to some realization. And in order to do so, I think I’m supposed to live my life to the fullest, even if it is in this muddled world of dream and reality."


Edited by solarshroomster (01/01/24 07:26 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster]
    #28606370 - 01/01/24 07:43 PM (25 days, 23 hours ago)

Nice. I am looking at his Iliad volumes and also found his Secret of Light book.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28606373 - 01/01/24 07:47 PM (25 days, 23 hours ago)

It looks pretty good. I was pretty impressed by the video. It seemed a little cultish (mostly due to length), but generally I thought it conveyed the message well.


Edited by solarshroomster (01/01/24 11:29 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster]
    #28606657 - 01/02/24 06:12 AM (25 days, 12 hours ago)

In my exposure to the yogas, in no particular order, though at the same time it seems appropriate to first mention Vasistha.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28606683 - 01/02/24 06:49 AM (25 days, 12 hours ago)

Usefulness in such old stories can be gathered in various ways, and among them came to mind was that these stories can be an example of the exoteric as it were, profound in itself.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28606699 - 01/02/24 07:20 AM (25 days, 11 hours ago)

I'm reading Nillion's reference. It's pretty good:

Yoga is the means of perceiving reality        "In this system, yoga is the union of the self and the Lord"            Yoga is said to be the oneness of one entity with another          The union of apana and prana, one's own rajas and semen, the sun and moon, the individual Self and the supreme Self, and in the same way the union of all dualities, is called yoga

How am I to distinguish actual yoga from the yoga presented in the popular media?


--------------------
Chopin in Eternal Sonata: "I believe that I am somehow being tested. That I am on this journey to come to some realization. And in order to do so, I think I’m supposed to live my life to the fullest, even if it is in this muddled world of dream and reality."


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 1
    #28606714 - 01/02/24 07:37 AM (25 days, 11 hours ago)

By your appeal or lack thereof. Visit some teachers if inclined (the same for books and such), and there you will need to trust your judgement according to what you seek. You can always learn from some for a little while and move on, or stay if you found something more significant.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28606740 - 01/02/24 07:56 AM (25 days, 11 hours ago)

We know this - of course, before we get smacked, your own silence is all you need, your Self is already there. But we also, many, need inspiration, confirmation, technique. I would seek initiation whether only internal or not. Ask for it internally, externally if you like. Initiation I think would need to come with some kind of instruction, even it is just the Song of Mahamudra, or one-liners that are all you need, or you may go for extensive teachings and tools, your choices to enjoy.


Edited by syncro (01/02/24 08:19 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28606763 - 01/02/24 08:13 AM (25 days, 10 hours ago)

Persistence in any one simple authentic teaching, or that in your own discoveries, will serve to purify you. One of the most valuable aspects of methodological teachings if you will, is getting means of purification.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleNillion
Nobody

Registered: 04/14/22
Posts: 1,000
Loc: Terra Firma
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster]
    #28607233 - 01/02/24 02:37 PM (25 days, 4 hours ago)

Saw this today and bookmarked it for addition to this thread:
https://oaks.nvg.org/hatha-yoga-pradipika.html


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: Nillion]
    #28607259 - 01/02/24 03:01 PM (25 days, 4 hours ago)

No luck on that page for me. First an apparent lack of SSL though I accepted the risk and continued, and then a 403 forbidden.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleNillion
Nobody

Registered: 04/14/22
Posts: 1,000
Loc: Terra Firma
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28607347 - 01/02/24 03:58 PM (25 days, 3 hours ago)

Quote:

syncro said:
No luck on that page for me. First an apparent lack of SSL though I accepted the risk and continued, and then a 403 forbidden.



Works using my bookmark but not the link.
That stinks

here, you can copy and then paste this after removing spaces

ht tp: //o aks. nvg. org/ hat ha- yoga-pra dipik a.h tml


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: Nillion]
    #28607402 - 01/02/24 04:38 PM (25 days, 2 hours ago)

:thumbup: It's works without the secure s, http without the s.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleNillion
Nobody

Registered: 04/14/22
Posts: 1,000
Loc: Terra Firma
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster]
    #28607685 - 01/02/24 08:28 PM (24 days, 22 hours ago)

Souka.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28608070 - 01/03/24 07:15 AM (24 days, 11 hours ago)

Quote:

syncro said:
Usefulness in such old stories can be gathered in various ways, and among them came to mind was that these stories can be an example of the exoteric as it were, profound in itself.




Imagine the strength and inspiration of people, love and unity, the hero. If there is love, then there is hero. You are a hero of those who love you, and they yours...

The exoteric in the yogas may be considered as bhakti, love and devotion. It may be for a timeless idea of a person, a name, but it becomes that for all as the all is what the ideal person represents. And you see that ideal in that which you love.

As the pro mystics that we are (a little sarcasm), we can knock exoterism, yet thinking about the yogas in my life, the other side of it came up. It returned to my mind and heart that bhakti is a most profound path and covers the rest, leaving nothing else needed, for bhakti moves into ecstasy, and that into vision, samadhis, profundity, unitive experience.

I am the beginning and the end. Love leads to Love, and that is all.


Edited by syncro (01/04/24 05:56 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro] * 2
    #28608268 - 01/03/24 10:26 AM (24 days, 8 hours ago)

Any spiritual practice, prayer, etc., is bhakti, for what is it without love? It is because of bhakti and for the sake of it.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28609440 - 01/04/24 12:27 PM (23 days, 6 hours ago)

"Give me liberty or give me death!"

But that which dies is not free. So yoga is dealing with the body. Yoga is freedom.

To me yoga is the same as spirituality-mysticism-religion. As yoga is union, it is understanding, knowledge, therefore yoga is also science.

Arguably, that which dies is not life. Life is not that which dies. Yoga is life. Elements take forms and change. Yoga uses the elements for its sake, as does life, magic, ...

"I am the Life.."
"My Father and I are one."
"Be still and know that I am God." These are yoga.

There is higher pleasure, but pleasure in that which dies also dies.

"Pleasure is a freedom song, but it is not freedom."

Suffering the pleasure of intoxicants etc, we see this. Entheogens are an interesting question around it as they are of the body, or, are physical things ingested. :shrugs: There seems to be exceptions. Find me a drink of soma, por favor. Right now I am drinking a little moderately cheap leftover port. It is better to invest a little more for quality, nevertheless, I was complaining to the ethers about the low quality intoxicants in this realm.

High quality intoxicants, of higher realms, are mental, spiritual.

The mantra is the shroomy, see? Shroomyites might quote and say that practices are not needed. As one who does not (often) use entheogens, I will say, if you say I don't need practices, you don't need entheogens.

Either of us can catch the flash in the moment of pointing at the moon, but the effort is in what, sustaining it, further exploration, the noble truths...


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFreedom
Pigment of your imagination
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 5,847
Last seen: 20 hours, 13 minutes
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28609521 - 01/04/24 02:31 PM (23 days, 4 hours ago)

I disagreed with you but didn't take offense (I think people often assume offence with disagreement, I just see it as people see things the way they see them because of their life experiences)

I don't know what yoga is, or anything is acutally lol. I can share some interesting expriences.

At one point I was meditating like 6 hours a day and also going to week long meditation retreats every 3 weeks. I was having some experiences where I started dissolving into the buzzing vibration of everything.  I also started doing yoga just to stretch my body out, since all the sitting was kind of tough on it. To my suprise, the buzzing disolving would be much more intense after doing yoga, and eventually that buzzing disolving led to the self completely disolving into infinity. I wasn't expecting any other effect than hoping i could be more physically comfortable.

At another point I was looking at the sense of there being a line between me and the world, or inside and outside. In meditation had times where that line diasapeared and it was like I was a continuous space throughout all senses. I did both qi gong and yoga at this point (someone just showed me qi gong one day). To my surprise both practices helped me integrate the experience of continuous space into my daily life.

At another point my pracice had fallen behind, I wasn't meditating daily but went to a yoga class on a whim. To my surprise again I fell into a unity state where there was still a sense of self but that self was everything. That happened regularly for a month or two.

I also used to be skeptic about chakras until I did these practices a lot. Chakras aren't part of my tradition so that was really a surprise. Also have had some kundalini type phenomena that was also surprising.

I've also beein looking at things energetically which is hard to describe, but all body pracices as well as diet, sex and other stuff effects the energetic system in my body.

I've never formally studied yoga and don't even know what the official stance on it is from the various traditions it comes from.


Edited by Freedom (01/04/24 02:36 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: Freedom]
    #28609596 - 01/04/24 03:46 PM (23 days, 3 hours ago)

Quote:

Freedom said:
I disagreed with you but didn't take offense (I think people often assume offence with disagreement, I just see it as people see things the way they see them because of their life experiences)

I don't know what yoga is, or anything is acutally lol. I can share some interesting expriences.

At one point I was meditating like 6 hours a day and also going to week long meditation retreats every 3 weeks. I was having some experiences where I started dissolving into the buzzing vibration of everything.  I also started doing yoga just to stretch my body out, since all the sitting was kind of tough on it. To my suprise, the buzzing disolving would be much more intense after doing yoga, and eventually that buzzing disolving led to the self completely disolving into infinity. I wasn't expecting any other effect than hoping i could be more physically comfortable.

At another point I was looking at the sense of there being a line between me and the world, or inside and outside. In meditation had times where that line diasapeared and it was like I was a continuous space throughout all senses. I did both qi gong and yoga at this point (someone just showed me qi gong one day). To my surprise both practices helped me integrate the experience of continuous space into my daily life.

At another point my pracice had fallen behind, I wasn't meditating daily but went to a yoga class on a whim. To my surprise again I fell into a unity state where there was still a sense of self but that self was everything. That happened regularly for a month or two.

I also used to be skeptic about chakras until I did these practices a lot. Chakras aren't part of my tradition so that was really a surprise. Also have had some kundalini type phenomena that was also surprising.

I've also beein looking at things energetically which is hard to describe, but all body pracices as well as diet, sex and other stuff effects the energetic system in my body.

I've never formally studied yoga and don't even know what the official stance on it is from the various traditions it comes from.




Interesting... I like it! I still think entheogens are the way to go, but it sounds like there are other practices that can be valuable to others. Many people I know have vouched for meditation, but all I personally know from it is a broken back and boredom. I don't get it. I've never been able to attain anywhere close to a level of trance on them, but I'm not going to discount them be because I myself fail to get anything out of them.

Are people reliably having visionary experiences on meditation and yoga? What am I missing?


--------------------
Chopin in Eternal Sonata: "I believe that I am somehow being tested. That I am on this journey to come to some realization. And in order to do so, I think I’m supposed to live my life to the fullest, even if it is in this muddled world of dream and reality."


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: Freedom]
    #28609623 - 01/04/24 04:06 PM (23 days, 3 hours ago)

Oh, from what Solar said, you disagreed with me saying one man's mantra is another man's shroom?

~
No offense taken, but I'm curious what part you disagreed with. Needless to say I tend to over generalize. What is yoga? 'Well yoga is everything man.' But I think it's more valuable to say that with religion as it has been said, religion is simply what we do, what we follow day to day.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFreedom
Pigment of your imagination
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 5,847
Last seen: 20 hours, 13 minutes
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 2
    #28609633 - 01/04/24 04:12 PM (23 days, 2 hours ago)

For about 15 years I used psychedelics several times a year and valued them for the clarity they gave. Then I went to my first long meditation retreat. On the third day of the retreat the same clarity appeared, and suddenly I realized the point of what everyone there was doing was to learn to live with that in daily life. The prospect of living with that clarity in daily life became basically my highest priority. When I left the retreat that clarity lasted for a couple weeks, slowly fading out. I got to see the clarity function, relationships at work and home and even with strangers on the street changed in obvious ways.

I thought I would stabilize that state after another retreat or two :lol: :lol: :lol:

I am now less drawn to the big expansive states and am more interested in bringing life and joy and love to the little details of my life. Can I enjoy washing the dishes? Can I listen to my friend with my full attention? Can I find creative ways to respond to the weird political emails my dad sends me? Can I stay calm when the guy at work is frustrated and blaming me?

I'm finding lately that there is so much richness to be tapped in the normal everyday things.

Not to discount those amazing moments. The are part of the tapestry of life, and beautiful and inspiring. I think the thing with them is grasping at them is part of what blocks them, so there is natural feedback that stops the grasping for them.

It typically takes about 3 days of meditation for most people's minds to calm down and stabilize enough for things to start opening up. One thing you could try is meditating with marijuna or low doses of psychedelics that might give a little glimpse of someething.


Edited by Freedom (01/04/24 04:22 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFreedom
Pigment of your imagination
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 5,847
Last seen: 20 hours, 13 minutes
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28609635 - 01/04/24 04:13 PM (23 days, 2 hours ago)

Quote:

syncro said:
Oh, from what Solar said, you disagreed with me saying one man's mantra is another man's shroom?

~
No offense taken, but I'm curious what part you disagreed with. Needless to say I tend to over generalize. What is yoga? 'Well yoga is everything man.' But I think it's more valuable to say that with religion as it has been said, religion is simply what we do, what we follow day to day.




I don't remember that, if you're talking to me


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: Freedom]
    #28609642 - 01/04/24 04:18 PM (23 days, 2 hours ago)

I thought you were talking to me when you said you disagreed with something, but I wasn't sure what it was.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFreedom
Pigment of your imagination
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 5,847
Last seen: 20 hours, 13 minutes
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro] * 2
    #28609643 - 01/04/24 04:20 PM (23 days, 2 hours ago)

no, I disagreed with solar about yoga being just fun or entertainment or something, but thats just my opinion based on my limited experience.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: Freedom]
    #28609715 - 01/04/24 05:22 PM (23 days, 1 hour ago)

Okay, now I'm happy this topic of yoga and spirituality vs. mysticism was brought up. If I can, for the sake of learning, go back to my previous more oppositional attitude in this post... add: What's interesting to me is that your first paragraph

Quote:

For about 15 years I used psychedelics several times a year and valued them for the clarity they gave. Then I went to my first long meditation retreat. On the third day of the retreat the same clarity appeared, and suddenly I realized the point of what everyone there was doing was to learn to live with that in daily life. The prospect of living with that clarity in daily life became basically my highest priority. When I left the retreat that clarity lasted for a couple weeks, slowly fading out. I got to see the clarity function, relationships at work and home and even with strangers on the street changed in obvious ways.




Can be contrasted against your subsequent paragraphs

Quote:

I am now less drawn to the big expansive states and am more interested in bringing life and joy and love to the little details of my life. Can I enjoy washing the dishes? Can I listen to my friend with my full attention? Can I find creative ways to respond to the weird political emails my dad sends me? Can I stay calm when the guy at work is frustrated and blaming me?

I'm finding lately that there is so much richness to be tapped in the normal everyday things.

Not to discount those amazing moments. The are part of the tapestry of life, and beautiful and inspiring. I think the thing with them is grasping at them is part of what blocks them, so there is natural feedback that stops the grasping for them.




To be honest, and, again, with no offense meant (trying to learn here), this is precisely why I'm skeptical towards yoga. I don't think it's really suited to what I see as "mysticism". Let me explain, so you can then help tell me where I'm perhaps mistaken.

When I say that these two sections of your writing can be contrasted, it's because they characterize the very different qualities of experience that I meant in my previous post about spirituality vs. mysticism.

You write that you are "now" "less drawn to the big expansive states and am more interested in bringing life and joy and love to the little details of my life. Can I enjoy washing the dishes? Can I listen to my friend with full attention? etc.

To be honest, yeah, I wouldn't consider that mysticism. And I think it's a conflation to associate "big expansive states" with pro-social things, like "can I find creative ways to respond to the weird political emails my dad sends me? Can I stay calm when the guy at work is frustrated and blaming me" and feel-good things like "washing the dishes".

Not to discount those earthly moments.

But they are not otherworldly. In this sense, I'm left more convinced than I was before that mysticism is very distinct from spirituality. I was criticized in my last post, but I think I raised a good point. These two ideas, although perhaps "cousins" of one another, are distinct categories of thought.

What concerns me is this... and, again, please point out where I'm wrong... I've noticed a trend. People use psychedelics, start feeling connected to the "Source", and then at some point stop, perhaps because they think "they get it" and that (wrongly) "the message" can never be lost, they then go full Alan Watts and feel that they need to "hang up the phone when you get the message", stop taking the mystical medicine, and then find joy in things like yoga and quiet meditation. I note now that you are less interested in "big expansive states" but more interested in "the little details". Something is obviously just not "clicking" with it for me. I'm not interested in the little details, but only interested in "big expansive states". To me, that's mysticism. Although, to be fair, it does seem like your early retreat days did give you full blown mystical feelings.

Are you currently taking psychedelics?

I think there's this thing called "spiritual amnesia" that we suffer with. "Spiritual amnesia" is the forgetting of mystical knowledge after "returning" from psychedelics, when the medicine "wears off". Psychonauts, myself included, make the mistake that the knowledge in mystical experience, once gained, is impossible to lose, but surely by the next morning, the experience is just a distant memory. What concerns me is when people aren't aware of this. Essentially, what I'm saying is a very pro-drug message. Psychedelics treat spiritual loss, just as antipsychotics treat psychosis. They're tools to altering the mind. I don't think there's any substitute for them. A lot of people insist on meditation and yoga, but if your statements about interest in the "little things" and not "big expansive states" are to be weighed, I'm not convinced meditation or yoga is a sufficient treatment for spiritual amnesia. I think a better treatment for spiritual amensia would be occasional (not frequent) use of entheogens.

Where am I mistaken?


--------------------
Chopin in Eternal Sonata: "I believe that I am somehow being tested. That I am on this journey to come to some realization. And in order to do so, I think I’m supposed to live my life to the fullest, even if it is in this muddled world of dream and reality."


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 1
    #28609725 - 01/04/24 05:31 PM (23 days, 1 hour ago)

"Are people reliably having visionary experiences on meditation and yoga? What am I missing?"

I think a foundation is made in times of urgent need which I did in my thirties. I knew I needed or had certain desire to meet a yogi in person and take initiation, and continued with retreats with them for about a decade. I was having experiences from following books before that as well.

Boredom is part of it in concentration in the beginning, and repetition bears fruit where earnestness is possible. Sometimes there won't be sincerity, and people say there must be. I think it is quite valuable to have the will to persist even if there is neither good concentration nor much sincerity.

A most valuable time imo is persisting in those moments you feel you are done as that is when patterns are formed among the tendencies most likely to obstruct them. On the other hand, it is good to be pretty clean, like not hung over or something. If I've had too much coffee, or got stoned, I tend to avoid formal practice.

Here's an example that happens to me and similarly I believe with others, especially if it's been a while since practicing. I begin things and am challenged by a sense of unworthiness, and depending on how bad I've been, a sense of futility and ridiculosity, then like biting the bullet and taking the punishment from the guilt and crap, and persisting nevertheless, because there is no judgement in the temple as it were.


Edited by syncro (01/04/24 05:35 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28609754 - 01/04/24 05:55 PM (23 days, 1 hour ago)

I don't feel I integrate well with life, socially too much, but I have always been pretty easy going and get along with people. Practice for me is profound and is hard to balance.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisibleconnectedcosmos
Neti Neti
Male User Gallery


Registered: 02/07/15
Posts: 7,426
Loc: The Pathless Path
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro] * 1
    #28610479 - 01/05/24 12:40 PM (22 days, 6 hours ago)

Yoga is me attempting to quit nicotine using all the techniques in the bag ... chanting , introspection , philosophy - hellacious amounts of cannabis

It's not easy :lol:

Day 2


--------------------


54. The true nature of things is to be known personally , through the eyes of clear illumination and not through a sage : what the moon exactly is , is to be known with one's own eyes ; can another make him know it?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: connectedcosmos]
    #28610664 - 01/05/24 03:15 PM (22 days, 3 hours ago)

Luck to you! I'm needing to do that myself, again.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28610726 - 01/05/24 03:56 PM (22 days, 3 hours ago)

Good luck to you as well connectedcosmos. Hang in there. My Dad was a smoker for 20-some years; it's possible.


--------------------
Chopin in Eternal Sonata: "I believe that I am somehow being tested. That I am on this journey to come to some realization. And in order to do so, I think I’m supposed to live my life to the fullest, even if it is in this muddled world of dream and reality."


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 1
    #28610772 - 01/05/24 04:48 PM (22 days, 2 hours ago)

It needs to be replaced with something purifying, ideally. I'm confident I can do it increasing practices, but work is going to be heavy in the coming days (excuses). I've done it before with a weight training program which included running - smoking when younger. Now it's tobaccoless pouches at least, just with the carcinogenic flavor additives etc.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinesolarshroomster
Wonderer
 User Gallery


Registered: 11/01/13
Posts: 506
Last seen: 3 days, 11 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro] * 2
    #28610888 - 01/05/24 06:51 PM (22 days, 19 minutes ago)

Look, sorry, to anyone again who I offended by throwing shade on meditation and yoga. It does seem like there's enough evidence to suggest that they can lead to powerful states of consciousness. To me, my ignorance was that enthogens expand my mind so much, that I can't conceive of anything expanding it more. I would be shocked if it can just be cultivated by sitting in a certain posture and performing some ritual, but the fact is that a decent number of people have come to me and told me about their experiences in meditation and, I'm glad to concede that it can cause mystical experience. So, I can't just discount because I myself have not gotten such an experience from it. I'll personally be sticking with entheogens, but I mean no disrespect towards anyone who gets mysticism through other means.


--------------------
Chopin in Eternal Sonata: "I believe that I am somehow being tested. That I am on this journey to come to some realization. And in order to do so, I think I’m supposed to live my life to the fullest, even if it is in this muddled world of dream and reality."


Edited by solarshroomster (01/05/24 06:51 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFreedom
Pigment of your imagination
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 5,847
Last seen: 20 hours, 13 minutes
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 5
    #28611027 - 01/05/24 09:45 PM (21 days, 21 hours ago)

What you're missing is that the mundane is not separate from the mystical. That bringing love and kindness into daily life is both a practice and a fruit of 'the mystical'. Through practice, the 'mystical' becomes ordinary, and the ordinary becomes mystical. It becomes obvious, everything is a miracle.

What blocks it is preconceptions. A psychedelic can give you a glimpse because it temporarily blocks your preconceptions, but once the drug wears off, they come right back.

The difference between taking a psychedelic and walking a path of practice is like the difference between visiting a beautiful temple once in a while vs turning every atom of existence into a beautiful temple.

You can't chase states either way though. Tollerence builds too fast to be tripping in a mystical state all the time. Grasping and seeking mystical states will keep them away.

So I learn to appreciate them when they appear, and appreciate what else appears when it appears. Even difficult things become an opportunity to learn and to let go of the habits of mind that block seeing things clearly. And yes, I still take psychedelics.

Most people don't want to let go of what needs to be let go of. Which is everything. The funny thing is you never had it to begin with... :smile:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 1
    #28611169 - 01/06/24 03:09 AM (21 days, 16 hours ago)

With all the wonderful facets and means, it comes down to ceasing/subduing conceptual thought.

Stillness, silence has levels. This is commonly seen in moments of wonder.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineBrendanFlock
Stranger
Male

Registered: 06/01/13
Posts: 4,216
Last seen: 1 day, 19 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro] * 1
    #28611260 - 01/06/24 05:37 AM (21 days, 13 hours ago)

Yoga is the understanding of all things.

Esoteric Binah. Scratch the woods. Insifil.

Leaves and extensions.

Esoteric numerology.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: BrendanFlock] * 1
    #28611292 - 01/06/24 06:25 AM (21 days, 12 hours ago)

I ran across Burroughs', 'Language is a virus from outer space.' lol

Not to knock the language we use here in trying to reach beyond it. Why are we trying to reach beyond it? Open question.

Because engaging in concepts is generally dukkha, not of peace, our natural state?

I had started a post around observations in agency. In that I had noticed that fearlessness can tend to remove the sense of it. It was going into the love or fear principle.

Also into the matrix, Matrika, which is the alphabet, and the creatrix.


Edited by syncro (01/06/24 06:28 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28612499 - 01/07/24 01:45 AM (20 days, 17 hours ago)

Or it wasn't so much that fearlessness in that moment brought non-agency, but that the latter, I am not the doer, brought fearlessness, and non-attachment, and they did not imply a non-enjoyer, but enjoyment freed up, opened.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28612547 - 01/07/24 03:24 AM (20 days, 15 hours ago)

We may wonder why it is we do what we do, and if sitting in that emptiness thing, I observed myself, the body and external life going about its business without 'me'. Contemplating agency is very weird.


Edited by syncro (01/07/24 06:57 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro]
    #28612765 - 01/07/24 08:40 AM (20 days, 10 hours ago)

I happened upon a live q&a, satsang, with Swami Tadatmananda, and was on the fence to put it on, and when I finally did, he was addressing a question on agency. :lol:

He mentioned that Brahman has no agency but is only the pure undifferentiated consciousness, and said his teacher would joke that 'Brahman is good for nothing' that is, in a worldly sense.

This is turning out pretty good.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineFreedom
Pigment of your imagination
Male User Gallery


Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 5,847
Last seen: 20 hours, 13 minutes
Re: What is yoga? [Re: syncro] * 1
    #28612770 - 01/07/24 08:46 AM (20 days, 10 hours ago)

It's a great relief, although can be scary too

also it seems we have to relaearn motivation, that a lot of our activity in the world relates to this imaginary thing at an imaginary center ("me") and when that loses its grip then what is the motive?


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What is yoga? [Re: Freedom]
    #28612811 - 01/07/24 09:39 AM (20 days, 9 hours ago)

And yet there is some great motive of life as it appears, including that which is of the Guru or Bodhisattvic nature, and the nature of the disciple to meet it. From a perspective, all our desires are doing that as all of them seek freedom, in ignorant ways or not, and their motivations are to address them, fulfill or complete them.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Onlinesyncro
Registered: 01/14/15
Posts: 2,696
Last seen: 50 seconds
Re: What are the yogas? [Re: syncro]
    #28613162 - 01/07/24 03:34 PM (20 days, 3 hours ago)

I hijacked the title a bit as yoga can have an unfortunate, superficial connotation, and there are various branches. Better would be, what is sanatan dharma, what is sadhana...?

Quote:

Yogapedia Explains Sanatana Dharma

The concept of spiritual freedom is an integral part of sanatana dharma. The term isn't exclusively applied to the Hindu religion: Rather, it is a set of timeless values that help us fulfill our potential and understand the flow and order of the universe. Sanatana dharma places spiritual experiences above religious issues and uses yoga practice to reach moksha.

Indeed, it could be said that yoga offers a practical and consistent means of adding sanatana dharma to anyone's life. It is considered to be more rooted in experience than belief or ideology, and inclusive of all because of its applicability to people in all places and at all times.

Some see the term sanatana dharma as a more accurate term than Hinduism, in part because the sanatana dharma is without sectarian or ideological divisions. It is, therefore, still used by some Hindu leaders to refer to Hinduism, portraying it as the unified religion of all.



Quote:

The term sadhana comes from the Sanskrit root, sadhu, meaning “go straight to a goal”. Routinely applying mind, body and spirit in the pursuit of a spiritual goal is the most natural and efficient way to surrender the ego, to find relief from suffering and to attain peace.

For this reason, sadhana is the cornerstone of the discipline of yoga. Yoga provides a huge variety of tools for this purpose, ranging from physical practices, such as asana (postures) and pranayama (breathing techniques), to more introspective applications, such as svadhyaya (self-study) and meditation.




Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineAnattaAtman
Mad Bodhisattva

Registered: 09/25/21
Posts: 377
Last seen: 15 days, 16 hours
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster]
    #28613920 - 01/08/24 10:09 AM (19 days, 9 hours ago)

Quote:

solarshroomster said:
So... with that, what is yoga?




I think Yoga is a path to enlightenment. Akin to martial arts, most people in
the west seem to practice for fitness. That is very sad indeed, because that
is entirely not what it's about. The highest bullshit practice of that kind
is called "Power Yoga".

Check out Aleister Crowley's take on Yoga:

https://hermetic.com/crowley/eight-lectures-on-yoga/index


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblespinvis
Stranger

Registered: 09/15/20
Posts: 586
Re: What is yoga? [Re: solarshroomster] * 1
    #28628178 - 01/20/24 06:49 AM (7 days, 12 hours ago)

Quote:

solarshroomster said:
Some people have seemed to recently take offense by my recent shade towards yoga. For those who have been hurt by my words, I'm sorry. The issue I've faced in my life is that a lot of these spiritual things seem so stupid on the surface, that I can't take it seriously (again, at first blush.) One of those things was mysticism. I thought it was stupid until I actually did it and it "clicked". So, I'm just wondering if I'm doing it with my initial, biased thoughts against yoga? So... with that, what is yoga? What am I missing?



I. K. Taimni, Iqbal Kishen; Patañjali - The Science of Yoga: The Yoga-Sutras of Patañajli - SECTION I. SAMĀDHI PĀDA;
Quote:

Atha Yogānuśāsanam.

now; herewith (of) Yoga expounding; exposition (teaching).

1. Now, an exposition of Yoga.




Highly recommended (The Yoga-Sutras of Patañajli) reading material btw! Also you could for example check the following thread by yogabunny called Yoga 101

Next to that maybe check out

Quote:

History of Yoga, the Path of my Ancestors is a 6000 year journey into origin, evolution & development of yoga. The story explores the elements of Yoga in Harappa Civilization, Veda, Jainism, Buddhism, Sufism, Hath-Yogic practices of medieval times & other peripheral doctrines. The film ends in 19th century where modern science acknowledges the potential of yoga in a new light.




Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3  [ show all ]

Shop: Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder   Original Sensible Seeds Autoflowering Cannabis Seeds   Bridgetown Botanicals Bridgetown Botanicals   Left Coast Kratom Kratom Powder For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Yoga
( 1 2 3 all )
Platinum 6,033 59 02/20/10 04:13 PM
by nowwhoutthink
* I Decided On Yoga appleorange 1,194 14 04/04/08 11:39 AM
by eve69
* Raja/Astanga Yoga ChiefGreenLeaf 1,224 8 08/16/07 09:42 PM
by tekramrepus
* Qigong & Yoga appleorange 1,355 8 04/12/08 03:18 PM
by fazdazzle
* Yoga Nidra leery11 783 3 09/06/06 10:21 PM
by leery11
* I Love Yoga! Chronic7 1,210 17 03/04/10 03:24 PM
by deff
* Bhakti Yoga leery11 1,366 16 08/06/08 02:51 PM
by lines
* Yoga, A science channeled by shrooms? Slapux 1,731 12 11/26/08 09:04 PM
by jonathanseagull

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, Shroomism, Rose, Kickle, yogabunny, DividedQuantum
521 topic views. 0 members, 4 guests and 5 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.03 seconds spending 0.008 seconds on 14 queries.