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Nillion
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Registered: 04/14/22
Posts: 1,000
Loc: Terra Firma
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Re: Advanced Morning Glory LSA Cold Water Extraction Method [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
#28603189 - 12/30/23 10:15 AM (28 days, 10 hours ago) |
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How are the clavine alkaloids being separated from the LSA? From: Extraction and Identification of Clavine and Lysergic acid Alkaloids From Morning Glories by Witters in 1975:

From Clavine and Lysergic Acid Alkaloids in Varieties of Morning Glory by Vining, Taber and Heacock in 1962:

I'm familiar with a CWE prep method where fresh fruit of Ipomoea species, which are not fully ripe, are mashed with a fork and then covered with water, just a bit and mixed for maybe 30 seconds to a minute and then the material is poured through a sieve to remove the seed material. Then it can be ingested, if that is the goal. Whole prep takes 5-10 minutes. Unripe fruits tend to be stronger than dried ripe fruits.
The version of this for dried material, like with Hawaiian baby woodrose, which is rarely available fresh, is to use a coffee grinder to grind the material more finely into a powder and then do a quick soak and shake as well. Alternatively the seeds can be soaked in water to germinate them or begin the germination process and they can then be treated a bit more like the fresh seeds and just mashed with a fork or something.
I'm kidding about removing the Clavine alkaloids.
I'd wager that LSA and LAH aren't responsible for the psychedelic effects of morning glory seeds, that clavines are. Without chromatography there is no way that any of the known extraction methods can actually separate the clavine alkaloids from their breakdown product lysergic acid. In fact, some studies show clavine alkaloids at their maximum before seeds are ripe and dry and that they decrease over time and lysergic acid increases, as their breakdown product. This results in a decrease in potency over time. It is widely reported by users that aged seeds are far less active than fresh. So, contrary to popular belief, the anecdotal evidence and the chemical data both indicate that the molecules responsible for psychedelic effect are the clavine alkaloids. Ergot fungi also produce clavine alkaloids, several of which, as mentioned, break down into lysergic acid over time. It is likely that Kykeon's psychedelic effects are due to the clavine alkaloids as well.
I'm not aware of anyone taking isolated Lysergic acid and getting off. As far as I know it is a sedative that makes people sleepy. Fresher seeds are much more stimulating and like most psychedelics they tend to interfere with sleep rather than promote it.
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Nillion
Nobody

Registered: 04/14/22
Posts: 1,000
Loc: Terra Firma
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Re: Advanced Morning Glory LSA Cold Water Extraction Method [Re: LogicaL Chaos] 1
#28604731 - 12/31/23 03:24 PM (27 days, 5 hours ago) |
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Agreed.
Cold water is highly effective. The seeds contain purgative resins, the whole family does for the most part. One of the traditional uses for numerous members of it is to cause purging. Even Ipomoea tricolor has these resins to some degree.
One of the methods of making the purgative medicine from various seeds is to use alcohol to extract first and then add water until the resins are no longer soluble and they crash out of solution. They aren't soluble in cold water. This allows the resin to be taken instead of the seeds. One can read more about this by searching for info on the use of Pharbitis Semen, which is the old term used for seeds of Ipomoea nil.
Some of the members of this family are actually dangerous, Merremia tuberosa was used as a purgative medicine, for example, and fatalities have occurred from ingestion of excess material. Pooping yourself to death is not a pleasant way to go, to say the least. Lucky for us none of the known psychoactive species are able to do this.
It makes perfect sense that a cold water extraction would produce good effects and little to no nausea. Tradition, chemistry and anecdotal evidence all support that.
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