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Dyerseve726
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What am I even growing?
#28579774 - 12/12/23 09:36 AM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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First timer. Started on agar. Everything seemed to be going well, but it's been six days since transferring to grain and I think I'm seeing some green in there. Am I even growing cubensis at all here? After reading the contamination section, I'm worried I haven't even been cultivating mushrooms at all, lol. Never got rope like mycelium in the agar, but it never turned color either, so I thought I did good. Is this just contam of normal cube mycelium or is this entire clump here the wrong thing entirely? The clump is one of the pieces of agar I threw in caked with oats. It did have blue food coloring in it. I've got four more agar dishes that I can use, but I don't want to continue if I'm just growing mold.
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Kinoko314
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It looks like cubensis myc to me, but I see that little green spot hiding behind it. I would assume it's mold also growing alongside cubensis.
You can wait to see what happens, but that jar is probably trash.
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Way
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Kinoko314]
#28579817 - 12/12/23 10:43 AM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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I think the color is the agar, Kinoko.
Looks like cube myc to me. Let it go. Give it a shake in a day or two and see what happens.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28579862 - 12/12/23 11:24 AM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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Thanks guys! I'll let em go for a few days and see what they get up to. Glad the mycelium looks legit though. I'd be sad if I was just growing mold the last few weeks, haha.
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Kinoko314
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28579922 - 12/12/23 12:34 PM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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Quote:
Way said: I think the color is the agar, Kinoko.
I hope you're right. If his agar didn't look like that I assume he would have said so, so you probably are right.
Sorry if I jumped to conclusions there.
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Way
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Kinoko314]
#28579938 - 12/12/23 12:49 PM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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I could be wrong as well. I just see the little blue speck and he said his agar was blue 
Guess we will know soon enough haha
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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HugheGRection


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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28579999 - 12/12/23 01:47 PM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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To me it looks blue, so fingers crossed its just a bit of leftover dye the Mycelium hadn't eaten. 6 days in it does seem a little slow for A2G, but that could be genetics or the variety. How did you prepare your grains?
-------------------- "The cost of Sanity, in this Society, is a certain level of alienation."
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Dyerseve726
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I thought it was slow also, but I had a rough go transferring. I wasn't aware of the practices most people use to get the pieces buried. Instead, I just dropped my pieces on top and, when I tried to shake to bury them, a lot of the pieces stuck to the sides and weren't touching grain at all, lol. Also, most of the blue dye has been consumed, which is why I assumed that blue/green dot was contam. I still assume it is.
As far as preparing my grain, I boiled the oats for 40 minutes with a little gypsum, strained, then spread out on a towel to cool. Placed in jars when they just left a tiny bit of moisture on a paper towel, then PC'd for two hours. I did notice some condensation in the jars after the PC, so I did wonder if I put them in too wet.
Edited by Dyerseve726 (12/12/23 05:28 PM)
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HugheGRection


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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Dyerseve726] 1
#28580330 - 12/12/23 06:18 PM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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When I drop an Agar wedge into a jar of grain, I rotate the jar in a way to get the wedge against the glass, but ideally with myelium side facing the grains. It's not much of a shake, more of a rotation or elliptical motion, when the wedge sticks to the lid or anywhere I don't want it to be, I'll shake it a bit to dislodge it.
I don't think there's an issue with your grain prep, seems youre following a pretty established tek for oats, I use Rye, so theres probably some slight differences, but I pretty typically will have some condensation after the PC cycle, what I do is shake the jars when they're cool enough to handle to redistribute all of the grains and they end up reabsorbing the moisture.
Still hoping its nothing, but maybe your culture wasn't as clean as you thought, or you just got a bad luck of the draw with the plate you chose to send to grain. It happens until it doesn't happen as often.
-------------------- "The cost of Sanity, in this Society, is a certain level of alienation."
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redchigh
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I've read in cases like this if the mycelium is growing faster than the green splot, it may be better not to shake. Something about mycelium being able to spread easily from grain to grain, and sure it might be from the agar. It temporarily stunts the mycelium but not other contams. Itll take longer of course, but higher chance of usable fruit.
Guessing it was a ss?
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Way
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: redchigh] 1
#28580598 - 12/12/23 09:59 PM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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It is true that shaking grains weakens the mycelium and can allow contamination to to flourish if present. However, the alternative it to let this jar fully colonize without shaking which seems unreasonable to me at this point.
If it fails to recover from the shake then you don't want to use it as spawn anyway. If it recovers slowly or recovers but fails the checklist you know to top fruit it or shoebox it.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: redchigh]
#28580608 - 12/12/23 10:07 PM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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I'm sorry, SS?
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HugheGRection


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In the context i assume he means "Spore Solution" or "Spore Syringe", which are notorious for causing issues for people who use them to inoculate grains or substrate bags
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Edited by HugheGRection (12/12/23 10:25 PM)
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Dyerseve726
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Ah, yeah, spore syringe. But my agar dishes look clean clean clean (both the first gen from spores and the agar to agar transfers). Almost certain any contam happened during the transfer. It was the first part of this I felt like I was fumbling around. Agar kept sticking to my scalpel so I had to use the edge of the jar to get it off and I think that's where I went wrong. I had a good feeling I'd effed it up. I think the spores were clean.
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Dyerseve726
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Alright, so whatever might be causing that green/blue color has not progressed. In fact, it's mostly gone. The mycelium that's there looks healthy to me now in all five grain jars and looks like a majority of the jars will be colonized enough to shake in another day or two. It's still moving slowly, but I think that may be due to a few things: I shook my jars like an idiot before they were ready. My temps are averaging around 74°F. I'm reading now that most people keep their spawn closer to 80°. And lastly, I feel like I either didn't boil my grain long enough and actually put it in too dry, or I did the opposite and put it in too wet...I have no idea which,lol, but I'm just guessing the environment is not ideal and that's the main issue here, not contamination.
I'll add a pic in another couple days to see what yall think, but I'm starting to feel more confident. Thanks for your help!
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CultiV8
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where are you reading that 80°F for spawn is recommended? 74 is perfect. to worry less about grain prep, try following an established tek to the letter
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shakology
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Quote:
Dyerseve726 said: Ah, yeah, spore syringe. But my agar dishes look clean clean clean (both the first gen from spores and the agar to agar transfers). Almost certain any contam happened during the transfer. It was the first part of this I felt like I was fumbling around. Agar kept sticking to my scalpel so I had to use the edge of the jar to get it off and I think that's where I went wrong. I had a good feeling I'd effed it up. I think the spores were clean.
the scalpel was flame sterilized, the edge of the jar was pressure sterilized, I don't think that's the problem. Happy to let someone more knowledgeable correct me, but I think you're good there. I've had that trouble too, usually just tap the scalpel handle against the side of whatever I'm transferring into to dislodge the agar chunk
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: shakology]
#28583517 - 12/15/23 06:48 AM (1 month, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
CultiV8 said: where are you reading that 80°F for spawn is recommended? 74 is perfect. to worry less about grain prep, try following an established tek to the letter
I'm trying my best, but there's dozens of how to's and most of them vary in some way. I see some that say low 70s, others say high 70s to 80°. One said to boil the oats for 30 minutes. One said 45 minutes. Another said open them up and see how gelatinous they are. It's a lot to take in all at once.
Quote:
shakology said:
the scalpel was flame sterilized, the edge of the jar was pressure sterilized, I don't think that's the problem. Happy to let someone more knowledgeable correct me, but I think you're good there. I've had that trouble too, usually just tap the scalpel handle against the side of whatever I'm transferring into to dislodge the agar chunk
You may be right. I worried about the edge of the jars mostly because it was tough getting the lids off. I was wearing gloves that had been doused in rubbing alcohol, but I know that's not 100%.
Here's a few pictures of where things are now. These are two of the better looking jars, but even these I am now concerned about. Am I correct in that condensation in the jar near where stuff is growing is generally bad? Usually some kind of bacterial activity causing heat, yes? I'm still gonna let these go for a while, but I'm losing hope again, lol.


And here's all of them. You can see the ones where I wasn't able to bury the agar at all, lol. It's just growing on top, but I'm hoping now that I've left them alone for a few days, there's more going on that I can't see yet.
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Way
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Dyerseve726] 2
#28583769 - 12/15/23 10:23 AM (1 month, 12 days ago) |
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Those are looking good so far. A small bit of condensation by itself isn't that worrying. It's when it presents with other symptoms of contaminated spawn that you worry.
Temp wise, you're right, people are all over the place. When I learned, it was that fruiting temps were low 70s and incubation was closer to 80.
I'd try not to worry about a few degrees and it's better to keep things a bit cooler than warmer as bacteria loves warmer temperatures.
I do my incubation and fruiting between 70-75f with no issues. I've found no need for separate temps or to go warmer.
Cubes aren't that picky when it comes down to temps.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28583831 - 12/15/23 11:02 AM (1 month, 12 days ago) |
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Phwew! Glad you think they're lookin alright. I'm hoping they really take off now that they're starting to get established.
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Dyerseve726
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I have no doubt now, I jarred my grain too wet. The more they colonize, the more condensation fills the jars. Can barely see through a couple of them. Lesson learned. Still looks clean to me, but sloooow.
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Dyerseve726
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Alright, so my jars looked 25-30% colonized, so I shook the hell out of them about a day and a half ago to the point where all the mycelium looked gone. I read that if they recover in less than two days, jars are probably clean. Well, they are recovering! Probably clear from the pics that the grain is wetter than ideal, but pretty sure the jars are clean and gonna make it.
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Dyerseve726
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I'm in the clear! This jar is a little ahead of the others, so I've placed it in a cooler location, but the others are right behind. I'll be able to go to substrate in another couple days. Thanks for all the help!
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Way
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I'd like to see those jars at 100% before I say they arent bacterial for sure personally.
Regardless though they are coming along nicely and will likely be nice enough to spawn to bulk.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28591538 - 12/20/23 03:18 PM (1 month, 7 days ago) |
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That's pretty close though, isn't it? It's moving fast now. I assumed it'd be at 100% in 48 hours or less. It got to this point about 36 hours after a second shake. I just shook up the others for the last time today. Felt like it just took a minute to get going.
Edited by Dyerseve726 (12/20/23 04:20 PM)
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Way
The


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For sure. Should be fully colonized within a few days.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28597528 - 12/25/23 12:18 PM (1 month, 2 days ago) |
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Welp, not sure how well this is gonna go. They all reached a certain point and appeared to stop, so definitely could be bacterial. However, I see no off colors and each jar is a solid mass that I can't break apart with regular shaking. I am planning to go to bulk tomorrow regardless, haha. Just doing bucket tek in an old cooler with coir and verm. Before I started making my substrate, I popped open a jar and gave it a sniff. Didn't really smell like much of anything, which I assume is good. Wish me luck!
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Dyerseve726
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Everytime I do one of these steps for the first time, it's hilarious to me the little things I hadn't thought of. I put my coir and verm in my cooler and dumped boiling water on it. Waited until it all cooled down and then sanitized the inside of my tub and liner. I then sat there looking at the tub and looking at the cooler and back again. How the heck do you get the substrate from the cooler to the tub, lol? I'm working in a closet, so I can't really pick up the cooler and dump it in gracefully. So, I just gloved up, sprayed my gloves with alcohol, and scooped it in by hand. I probably contaminated the living crap out of everything, hahaha. How long before I have some sign either way? Also, what temp should the room be at to colonize the substrate?
Edited by Dyerseve726 (12/26/23 01:26 PM)
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Way
The


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Yeah it definitely gets easier every time.
Spawning a tub is not a sterile procedure at all. Your coir and grain spawn is covered in mold spores and airborne bacteria the minute it is exposed to open air. If you get contamination, it didn't come from you touching the coir with your hands. Contamination usually comes from dirty spawn.
I scoop with a measuring cup or a clean quart jar.  I'll also use my hands if I don't have either of those on hand.
You should see some growth on the sides of your substrate through the tub within a couple of days. It will take longer for it to pop out of the top. Full colonization within a couple of weeks usually in my experience.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28598774 - 12/26/23 04:25 PM (1 month, 1 day ago) |
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Quote:
Way said: Yeah it definitely gets easier every time.
Spawning a tub is not a sterile procedure at all. Your coir and grain spawn is covered in mold spores and airborne bacteria the minute it is exposed to open air. If you get contamination, it didn't come from you touching the coir with your hands. Contamination usually comes from dirty spawn.
I scoop with a measuring cup or a clean quart jar.  I'll also use my hands if I don't have either of those on hand.
You should see some growth on the sides of your substrate through the tub within a couple of days. It will take longer for it to pop out of the top. Full colonization within a couple of weeks usually in my experience.
Thanks for the info!
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Dyerseve726
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So far, so good. Day five in the bin. Starting to feel hopeful.
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Dyerseve726
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I think I did good! Day ten since it went to the tub and I went ahead and opened up the bottom air holes to start fruiting. I used a casing layer and read you should start fruiting at 80% colonization. Hopefully I didn't start too soon. Either way, I'm feelin real good about the potential outcome here!
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Way
The


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Pretty much all of us go to fruiting conditions when spawning now. Separating fruiting and colonization periods is kind of an older technique.
You're fine.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28608525 - 01/03/24 02:44 PM (24 days, 17 hours ago) |
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Quote:
Way said: Pretty much all of us go to fruiting conditions when spawning now. Separating fruiting and colonization periods is kind of an older technique.
You're fine. 
I can't keep up, lol. Every question I have I just Google it + Shroomery. I'm bound to get some old info.
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Way
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Yeah it's constantly evolving. Try to keep to the past 5 years or just post in the quick questions thread, nobody minds.
The site search isn't too bad and allows you to filter by TC posts and date ranges as well.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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Mvlted
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28608774 - 01/03/24 05:55 PM (24 days, 13 hours ago) |
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Thank you for your post, questions and pictures plus thank you to all the patient vets who take the time to help us new to the field/hobby. the confidence some reassurance gives us or even insight into our mistakes shouldnt be underestimated.
-------------------- New, please be patient! Open to advice!!
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way] 1
#28612005 - 01/06/24 05:11 PM (21 days, 14 hours ago) |
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Aww, here we go! They're so cute, lol.
Edited by Dyerseve726 (01/06/24 05:13 PM)
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Dyerseve726
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Everything is looking amazing. Super exciting. My one question I have right now is, at any point, should I add more moisture? There's still a good deal of condensation on the walls and top, but less than earlier on. My bin has six two inch holes low and two high, all covered in filter patches. Do I just rehydrate after a flush and otherwise leave it alone?
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Way
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After your "flush" and your harvest you should rehydrate. You need to replace the lost water from the weight of the harvested mushrooms. To do this I'd suggest either heavy misting for a couple days or bottom watering.
Heavy misting would be spraying the surface until water starts to pool and then leaving it alone until the next day. Repeat it the next day. If on the third day it is still dry, you can give it some more but it is probably fine.
Bottom watering is pouring a cup or two of water down the side of the tub in between the substrate and the wall. You leave it there for a few hours and then pour off the excess.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Way]
#28613125 - 01/07/24 03:02 PM (20 days, 16 hours ago) |
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Quote:
Way said: After your "flush" and your harvest you should rehydrate. You need to replace the lost water from the weight of the harvested mushrooms. To do this I'd suggest either heavy misting for a couple days or bottom watering.
Heavy misting would be spraying the surface until water starts to pool and then leaving it alone until the next day. Repeat it the next day. If on the third day it is still dry, you can give it some more but it is probably fine.
Bottom watering is pouring a cup or two of water down the side of the tub in between the substrate and the wall. You leave it there for a few hours and then pour off the excess.
Thank you!
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Dyerseve726
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I've noticed that a lot of the condensation has actually traveled down the walls of my tub and underneath the liner. The whole cake is basically floating in there, lol. Is that something to worry about? I assume it woulda been ideal to have that moisture reabsorbed by the substrate. Or is this maybe an indication that I had too much moisture to begin with? I'm thinkin maybe next time I should cut small holes in the corners of the liner to let water back in.
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Dyerseve726
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And my controller screwed up and my Shroom room went down to 65 overnight. Hope that's not too big of an issue. Back to 71° average.
I'm getting lots of little clusters, but my pinset was not remotely even. What can I do to improve this? Better mixing of the grain with the sub? I also assume I should just pull them off as they finish, since they're all gonna be done at different times? Hoping the second flush comes out more even.

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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Dyerseve726]
#28618414 - 01/12/24 07:37 AM (16 days, 14 minutes ago) |
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I cut a few out that finished early, and there's still more in the tub finishing up, but this is my first big haul! I'm pleased. Will pins stop coming up when it's ready for more water? Or should I just choose a day to pull everything regardless of how finished they are and rehydrate?
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Daeda1us
Not Dave



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more pins will pop up. pick before they get too mature. some tubs i took half one night & let the rest finish up overnight.
great job
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Daeda1us]
#28619204 - 01/12/24 09:12 PM (15 days, 10 hours ago) |
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Quote:
Daeda1us said: more pins will pop up. pick before they get too mature. some tubs i took half one night & let the rest finish up overnight.
great job

Thanks! Right now, they just keep rolling out. I pick more every twelve hours, but no signs of slowing down.
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Dyerseve726
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: Dyerseve726]
#28629487 - 01/21/24 07:26 AM (7 days, 26 minutes ago) |
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Is it normal for the second flush to have way bigger mushrooms? My first batch had all the veils tear when they were still really short. This one right here is bigger than anything I grew last flush and I think that I even pulled it a little early. 10g wet. Is this too early to pull? That ruffley area around the edge of the cap tricked my eyes a little. Didn't realize how solid the veil was until I pulled it out.
Edited by Dyerseve726 (01/21/24 07:26 AM)
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SFS96
AstroMan



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I would have let that one go a little longer  Yes it is normal to get larger mushrooms after the first flush. Iv had huge 100 gram monsters grow on the third or fourth flushes.
-------------------- How I make and preserve tea
Consuming consumes a man That was never a purpose of life To only crave for material joys Is believing the lie - Mellow Mood
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Dyerseve726
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Registered: 12/12/23
Posts: 33
Last seen: 2 days, 14 hours
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Re: What am I even growing? [Re: SFS96]
#28629723 - 01/21/24 10:54 AM (6 days, 20 hours ago) |
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Quote:
SFS96 said: I would have let that one go a little longer  Yes it is normal to get larger mushrooms after the first flush. Iv had huge 100 gram monsters grow on the third or fourth flushes.
Hundred gram!? Holy crap lol. And thanks, I'll let them go a little longer. I only pulled the one and then second guessed after seeing the veil up close.
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Dyerseve726
Stranger
Registered: 12/12/23
Posts: 33
Last seen: 2 days, 14 hours
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Let them go another day...wow! It's not 100 grams, but it's the biggest one yet. 17g wet. I still can't even imagine what a 100g mushrooms looks like, lol. Harvesting a few big ones is so much easier than a million small ones.
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