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shronoob88
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Heating a space
#28542786 - 11/14/23 02:45 PM (2 months, 12 days ago) |
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Hi all , I'm new to the forum and new to shroom cultivation. I have done a little research and looking to get something started soon..
Please forgive me if this has been done time and time again. And feel free to link me up to older threads where applicable.
Anyway, space is limited, and I plan to use some space at the top of a bedroom cupboard (double door) . The space is about 1350mm wide x 600mm deep x 400mm high.
I plan to use battery powered LEDs above boxes on ceiling and storage tubs for my substrate.
The room that the cupboard is in ranges between 15 - 22c . So I would imagine the cupboard will be slightly cooler as it is not directly heated by the radiator in the room as it has the cupboard doors in between .
So this is the issue I have , Heating the cupboard up during the day (safely) without drying the substrate out . I don't want to run the heating all day every day as it would cost a fortune and I've heard heat mats are dangerous.
Also FAE worries me , as its in a compact space at the top of the cupboard. Although this is easily sorted as I can easily fit some sort of ventilation to come on couple of times a day when necessary.
Any input would be greatly appreciated, many thanks Shronoob88
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Baba Yaga
♥ coir grower

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15C-22C sounds not too bad, I am growing in similar condition's atm, keep one of the doors cracked and see how much the LCDs will heat up the compartment as it will produce some warmth as well. What kind of grow are you thinking about?
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Way
The


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Your main goal is to heat the air around the jars or tubs, not the jars or tubs themselves.
That would mean a heater nearby that isn't directly blowing on the tubs. Or a heat mat near them but not touching them. Or a heat lamp facing away with a thermostat to regulate the temperature.
If you can keep your temps above 18c or so, but ideally 21-24 you'll be a bit better off. If you go too low it'll stop or slow growth but won't kill the mycelium so don't stress if you can't.
As for fresh air, I'm having a hard time imagining the size of the cupboard or whatever but leaving the door cracked would be more than sufficient. You don't want air rushing past the tubs via fans.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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shronoob88
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I was thinking of following the broke boi tek video I found on YouTube by philly GT . then using monotubs, maybe 2. Filled with coco coir, vermiculite and gypsum .
I don't have a pressure cooker at the minute , and struggling with what one to buy in UK as none I can find seem to work at 15psi.
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Way
The


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No PC needed.
You can also do all PC work at lower PSI levels. You just need to allow longer for sterilization. I use 12 psi and have no issues with my grain.
I'd really recommend you stay off YouTube when it comes to getting mycology information.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: Way]
#28543591 - 11/15/23 03:42 AM (2 months, 12 days ago) |
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Very informative post I'll be having a good read through all this tonight. Thanks
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: Way]
#28547357 - 11/18/23 03:53 AM (2 months, 9 days ago) |
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I've now got all the supplies for the 1st stage making the jars and colonising the jars .
I want to go with the water tub fruiting chamber method. The link provided doesn't actually have a part where it shows how to make the FC . can anyone provide a link for this please ? Many thanks
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MrJong
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Quote:
shronoob88 said: I've now got all the supplies for the 1st stage making the jars and colonising the jars .
I want to go with the water tub fruiting chamber method. The link provided doesn't actually have a part where it shows how to make the FC . can anyone provide a link for this please ? Many thanks
It's just a large box with water at the bottom and a way to lift the cakes off that water. So one of those oven grate things or even an upside down cup with your cake on top works fine.
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Way
The


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Re: Heating a space [Re: MrJong]
#28547706 - 11/18/23 10:00 AM (2 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
MrJong said:
Quote:
shronoob88 said: I've now got all the supplies for the 1st stage making the jars and colonising the jars .
I want to go with the water tub fruiting chamber method. The link provided doesn't actually have a part where it shows how to make the FC . can anyone provide a link for this please ? Many thanks
It's just a large box with water at the bottom and a way to lift the cakes off that water. So one of those oven grate things or even an upside down cup with your cake on top works fine.
 1-2 inches of water and then lift the cakes out of it somehow. A cookie rack works great.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: Way]
#28547742 - 11/18/23 10:44 AM (2 months, 8 days ago) |
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Right, quick question RE SAB. I will be sterilising my jars in the kitchen , my SAB has to be upstairs (2nd floor) , which means i have to carry them up 2 floors.
Now I know it's supposed to be as clean as possible for the inoculation part but in the tek it says to leave the foil off, and the lids have holes in anyway . So basically once it leaves the SAB isn't it very likely for it to get contaminated regardless?
I'm a bit confused with how much difference the SAB is going to make in my scenario ?
Cheers 👌
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Way
The


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Quote:
shronoob88 said: Right, quick question RE SAB. I will be sterilising my jars in the kitchen , my SAB has to be upstairs (2nd floor) , which means i have to carry them up 2 floors.
Now I know it's supposed to be as clean as possible for the inoculation part but in the tek it says to leave the foil off, and the lids have holes in anyway . So basically once it leaves the SAB isn't it very likely for it to get contaminated regardless?
I'm a bit confused with how much difference the SAB is going to make in my scenario ?
Cheers 👌
As soon as you take the jars out of the SAB they are sterile but can be exposed to open air due to the dry verm layer at the top protecting the BRF. It is basically like having a filter on the top of your jar, that is why it is so important not to disturb it. Not a big deal to move them around the house though.
Inoculating inside the SAB just helps keep the inoculation itself as sterile as possible.
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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BeefSupremeJr
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Re: Heating a space [Re: Way] 1
#28548050 - 11/18/23 03:01 PM (2 months, 8 days ago) |
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hey i made this heating system for little closets years ago
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25861119
this was before "inkbirds" cane out though so that would be even easier
edit: see the last post on my thread there. i just realized someone already literally put it together. easy peasy and safe.
Edited by BeefSupremeJr (11/18/23 03:02 PM)
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Kinoko314
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Quote:
shronoob88 said: I'm a bit confused with how much difference the SAB is going to make in my scenario ?
It's quite astute of you to realize the SAB isn't doing all that much for PF tek inoculations. You could get away with just doing it in open air. The risk is that something could land on the needle between flaming it and doing the inoculation and contaminate the jar. That's all you're trying to mitigate with the SAB.
SABs are more important and necessary when you're opening agar plates and grain jars etc.
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shronoob88
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While this looks like the perfect solution for me and I am quite eager to try using the TEK , it does worry me using it in my space I have in the top of the cupboard .
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shronoob88
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I understand now. Thanks. I will still use the SAB anyway as I have all the mats and might aswell utilise them .
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shronoob88
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I have everything I need for doing a BRF Tek , however I changed my mind since the yields were quite poor . So i decided I would buy the PC and use jars of grain then go grain to coco coir/verm substrate . However after more research , alot of people say to go spores to agar , then agar to grain then grain to substrate in monotubs .
My question, I would like to skip the spore to agar as I'm already over 230 quid lighter in the pocket and itching to get going . But how likely am I to fail due to contamination because of using a spore syringe to inoculate my grain jars ?
I'd like to learn agar at some point but not just yet .
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BrokenHeart
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The overwhelming opinion here is no spore to grain no matter what. Sure you might get lucky every once in a while but there are many many fails and shouts for help in this forum because of spores to grain. Agar is the path to grain, without PF it.
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Lithop
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Quote:
shronoob88 said: I have everything I need for doing a BRF Tek , however I changed my mind since the yields were quite poor .
Ahoy! Is this a theoretical 'yeilds were quite poor' or have you done a PF Tek and decided it's not worth your while? If the first option, you could always opt to run a load of BRF jars then shred them up before mixing into to bulk substrate in tubs. IME it did yeild less than grain to bulk but low yeild is better than no yeild. Plus at least then you get some experience on the go!
I really enjoyed doing PF Tek to bulk for a while, got a nice supply of fruits to keep me going till I moved on to other methods, just food for thought.

Quote:
shronoob88 said: So i decided I would buy the PC and use jars of grain then go grain to coco coir/verm substrate . However after more research , alot of people say to go spores to agar , then agar to grain then grain to substrate in monotubs.
If you're still struggling for a PC that will reach 15 psi in Blighty, I'm allegedly a UK guy as well and use this modest one. Capacity wise, it is very small, so you will likely outgrow it- but it's still handy to get you going and hopefully won't break the bank.
Quote:
shronoob88 said: My question, I would like to skip the spore to agar as I'm already over 230 quid lighter in the pocket and itching to get going . But how likely am I to fail due to contamination because of using a spore syringe to inoculate my grain jars ? I'd like to learn agar at some point but not just yet .
I would NOT recommend shooting spores into a grain jar, I've had "success" in the early days noccing up grain bags but it's seemingly luck of the draw. The bag WILL be bacterial to some degree, but it will likely still fruit. Trying to blast spores into a jar through the SHIP, for example, seems like a bad time, really not ideal by any stretch of the imagination and certainly not endorsed by anyone who treats cultivation with care, IMO.
TLDR: OPTION A: perhaps running a deece amount of BRF jars and shredding them may suit you fine- this way there's no need for PC, as Way said, and if done with attention, high chance for success.
OR OPTION B: buy some prepoured agar plates to get you started for about 15 quid, go spore to agar to grain (which is really not intimidating once you get going in your SAB, it's a matter of care and attention) then get some wedges going in your grain jars! Best of luck dude.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: Lithop]
#28555850 - 11/25/23 09:14 AM (2 months, 1 day ago) |
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OK so I do actually have a Hawkins big boy pressure cooker now , MSS spore syringe, monotubs , half quart jars with lids , SAB , BRF, VERM, isopropyl bottle and sprayer. Sterile gloves .
I was saying about sub par yields simply because that's what I've read on here , and I just thought if I could, then I may as well bite the bullet and buy the PC and then be able to maximise yields by using grains . However I then read about the spore syringe being un sterile and to use Agar to grain.
So with regards to your reply , I'm understanding that you say I should still have a go at the PF tek so that I can dip my toe in the water then ?
So what is the difference between using the pf tek method as opposed to the spores to grain method ? As a total noob I would assume that if the unsterile part is the MSS then using a different tek would still be the same . What am I missing ?
Sorry for any stupid questions. And thanks for the help
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BrokenHeart
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I went pf tek for first go for 2 reasons, 1 Birthing and casing is more forgiving as sab is a learned skill and a peice of equipment. Bacteria has the upper hand durring shake. 2 Want some darn fruits! To do prints from to keep operating.
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Lithop
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^Good points.
Quote:
shronoob88 said: OK so I do actually have a Hawkins big boy pressure cooker now , MSS spore syringe, monotubs , half quart jars with lids , SAB , BRF, VERM, isopropyl bottle and sprayer. Sterile gloves .

Quote:
shronoob88 said: I was saying about sub par yields simply because that's what I've read on here , and I just thought if I could, then I may as well bite the bullet and buy the PC and then be able to maximise yields by using grains . However I then read about the spore syringe being un sterile and to use Agar to grain.
So with regards to your reply , I'm understanding that you say I should still have a go at the PF tek so that I can dip my toe in the water then ?
Absolutely, you've got the stuff for it already! It's a solid route to go. You can always think about improving yeilds later, IMO Better to have the hype of a succesful harvest and use that to inform future decisions.

Quote:
shronoob88 said: So what is the difference between using the pf tek method as opposed to the spores to grain method ? As a total noob I would assume that if the unsterile part is the MSS then using a different tek would still be the same . What am I missing ?
Rather than THE difference, it's a combination of factors. Some good discussion around the varying opinion on these factors in "Spores to Grain: Why it's discouraged & Recommended Alternatives". A read of that should hopefully shed some light on the potential chances for failure in putting MSS straight to grain.
Quote:
the_chosen_one said: You need to know what the corners are before cutting.
Quote:
shronoob88 said: Sorry for any stupid questions. And thanks for the help
 It's all good, once you get going you'll come to understand the process a lot better from practical experience. Have fun man and good luck!
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Kinoko314
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Quote:
shronoob88 said: So what is the difference between using the pf tek method as opposed to the spores to grain method ? As a total noob I would assume that if the unsterile part is the MSS then using a different tek would still be the same . What am I missing ?
The difference is that PF tek was designed to be used with spore syringes. Bacteria is unable to spread across the vermiculite as it would on grain. It gets stuck while your mycelium can keep colonizing the verm with no problem.
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starvinghooker
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PF is different because of the structure of the mixture you're shooting into. The loose grains of verm with BRF are good for mycelium growth while simultaneously helping to stop bacteria from spreading as easily, therefore favoring the myc giving it a much better chance to outpace the nasties.
I'd never tell anyone they can't do something, but please do not inject spores directly to grains. If you insist on using your syringe, use PFtek, or take the time to learn and use agar. Once you use agar, you will never look back.
Good luck!
Edit: if I'm gonna continually be stupid enough to post answers to questions that have already be answered, I should probably take a break
-------------------- Grab life by the balls and yank on 'em til everything you want comes gushing out in thick, creamy ribbons Noob like me? Start here! Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery
Edited by starvinghooker (11/25/23 09:48 PM)
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B Traven
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The room I grow in runs significantly colder than the range you mentioned. I'm not gonna quote numbers because the whole conversion factor thing just gets too wonky, but suffficed to say that it's a larger open space with rather anemic heating vents for its size, and windows that allow a ton of heat to escape.
People have different preferences. I always opt for colder over warmer (within acceptable parameters), for a number of reasons. I set my peak growing times for the colder months on purpose.
The one thing I'd advise you to keep in mind is that mushrooms are hererotrophic organisms with an exothermic metabolism. They generate their own heat, just like we do. This is often something that people fail to adequately factor in when thinking about supplemental heat.
-------------------- Beware of advice- even this.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: B Traven] 2
#28556830 - 11/26/23 07:54 AM (2 months, 1 day ago) |
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All solid advice and cleared up alot of confusion for me . Thank you All very much , I will be doing a pf tek next weekend and I will start a thread once I do to keep you all updated to how I get on. I will also get soke agar plates and get this show properly on the road .
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shronoob88
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I've been reading up on agar, I'm going to get going with it pretty soon and want to make an inoculation loop. When I inoculate the plates , I burn the loop , will the heat on the metal damage the spores that I squirted from my MSS to the shot glass ? Or how long do I leave it to cool ? Seems like a silly question but I thought that the quicker I do it the less chance of contam happening, but don't want to do it too quick if it'll kill the spores .
It's an absolute rabbit hole all this 🤣
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Kinoko314
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Usually you would cool the loop by sticking it into an agar plate. I haven't used a shot glass like that, but I would assume if you just stick the loop into the spore solution hot it will cool it without killing a significant amount of spores. That could be a bad assumption though. Sticking it in agar first would be safer.
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B Traven
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Nice!
It's kind of a gray area, really. For instance, when we flame a blade for cutting into agar, we typically quench it right in the agar. The understanding is that we'll probably kill some myc around the edge of the wedge when we make the cut, but we'll also wnd up with a nice contaminant-free transfer.
In the case of an inoculating loop going into sterile water, I typically just go for that initial hiss, maybe a second, and then have at it. But it's worth playing around with a bit to see what works for you.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: B Traven] 1
#28563911 - 12/01/23 02:45 PM (1 month, 26 days ago) |
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Well, that's the brf cakes sterilised successfully. However , my SAB technique was clunky , unorganised and basically a disaster. Forgot to heat the needle for 1st 2 jars , 2 jars tipped and I forgot to bring a marker and now they're mixed up . Total disaster. However I did learn a lot from my pathetic attempt.
It's very surprising how something that looks so simple on videos (and probably is) , turns into an absolute dogs cock when done by a 1st timer in a flap. Nevermind we will see how it goes . I'm gonna have another attempt very soon . Need a bigger SAB, a proper desk and a more organised approach.
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BrokenHeart
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I am finding in my case SAB is a learned skill and a piece of equipment. with the skill being the most important part. My SAB moves look like they are out of the 3 stooges films not matrix
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Way
The


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Quote:
shronoob88 said: Well, that's the brf cakes sterilised successfully. However , my SAB technique was clunky , unorganised and basically a disaster. Forgot to heat the needle for 1st 2 jars , 2 jars tipped and I forgot to bring a marker and now they're mixed up . Total disaster. However I did learn a lot from my pathetic attempt.
It's very surprising how something that looks so simple on videos (and probably is) , turns into an absolute dogs cock when done by a 1st timer in a flap. Nevermind we will see how it goes . I'm gonna have another attempt very soon . Need a bigger SAB, a proper desk and a more organised approach.
Like everything, proper aseptic procedure is a skill the grows with use. My first SAB experience went about the same.
Every time you get better. Once your brain stops thinking about every move you make and it becomes second nature. Keep plugging along!
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That's the way she goes, boys. Sometimes she goes, sometimes she doesn't, cause that's the fuckin way she goes.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: Way]
#28579779 - 12/12/23 09:40 AM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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Update , 11 days have passed since unocculation and not much happening in my jars. I think I have the start of the mycelium growing, but at this rate it will be months before they colonise. .. Temps inside the cupboard as I suspected are not warm enough . Generally about 16c - 18c. The problem is that the room doesn't really get passed 21c and the cupboard is on a gable end so the wall of the cupboard is cold . Which in turn makes the space inside the cupboard cold.
Today, I have added a heat mat underneath the jars with a gap above and a slightly raised platform and the jars are now sitting pretty at a steady 21c- 23c .
I have included pictures of basically nothing for anyone interested to see basically nothing . 🤣





Edited by shronoob88 (12/12/23 09:58 AM)
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Kinoko314
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Assuming you started with spores, they would take 3-10 days to germinate. Considering you have visible growth on day 11, I'd say you're right on track.
I think it's still a little sketchy to have the mat underneath, even if spaced. Why not put the mat against the cold wall?
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shronoob88
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[url=https://files.shroomery.org/files/23-50/24001
I hadn't realised that was how long it took ! I thought it was really slow and I was running to low a temp .
In what way do you mean sketchy ? Like dangerous? Or ruin the cakes ? I didn't really want to introduce the heat mat but like I say the jars were never getting above 16- 17 c
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Skropi
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16-17C is ok, slower for sure, but from what I've read here, it is not a problem. The heating mat is risky because you may overheat parts of your cake, better to heat all your space equally.
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Changed


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Re: Heating a space [Re: Skropi]
#28580182 - 12/12/23 04:32 PM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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Are those full pint jars? PF Tek calls for 1/2 pints, as a full pint can cause the myc to stall out on the taller cakes...
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: Changed] 1
#28580724 - 12/13/23 02:36 AM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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They're 16oz /450ml , there's only actually 350 ml of BRF cake , rest is dry verm . Hope I'm OK 🤞
I didn't realise it was strictly half pints . Although I did read that it was necessary to only use half pints if not using a PC.
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Skropi
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I am not sure, but I think even the shape of the containers matters, not just the volume. I've noticed that my glass jars do take a bit longer to colonize than my plastic jars, and the only difference is that they are a bit taller. It could be any other reason of course, but my sample is 8 plastic and 8 glass jars, so it does look like a pattern. Everyone here is using the short jars, and I think that is the reason.
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PBJ710
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Re: Heating a space [Re: Skropi] 3
#28580917 - 12/13/23 07:36 AM (1 month, 15 days ago) |
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Pint jars and tall 1/2 pt jars have a tendency to stall out due to compression. They can work but they are not as consistent as the short 1/2 pt jars.
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Kinoko314
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Quote:
shronoob88 said:
I hadn't realised that was how long it took ! I thought it was really slow and I was running to low a temp .
In what way do you mean sketchy ? Like dangerous? Or ruin the cakes ? I didn't really want to introduce the heat mat but like I say the jars were never getting above 16- 17 c
I just mean that it could cause problems. If the bottom of the jars isn't getting overheated, then it won't be a breeding ground for bacteria, so that's good. Still, though, if you make the jars hotter than the space then you're going to be losing more water, and they'll dry out. You'll probably get more condensation too, so you could have a situation where it looks wet, but really it's drying out.
Heat the space or insulate the wall that is your problem if you want the best results.
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shronoob88
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A few more update pictures . Starting to colonise nicely now. I think the pic with 3 jars are jedi mind fuck as looks to be growing differently and slower aswell. The other jars are GTs. Just need to be patient now I think is the key here . How many more weeks in the jars do you guys reckon ?

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metaneuralnetwork
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I don't buy into the 'heating pads are a fire risk and therefore should not be used' line of thinking. The seedling mats I see on Amazon are 17.5w (labeled as 20). so like .15A
That will not get hot enough to start anything on fire.These things barely exceed 100F. You'd require a short for that which isn't going to happen unless there was damage to the unit or some wonky electrical placements in your setup. But the pad is all non moving parts. Worst thing about a heating pad is overheating and high temps messing up your grow.
If your system was a no touch setup I might be inclined to change my position. But for a fruiting box that you're fanning everyday, occasional misting? I'd try heating pads. Just be careful about getting any substrate or cakes too warm.
Spend a little extra and get a temp controlled one.
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shronoob88
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I forgot to mention actually, I have ditched the heat mat and added in a ceramic heat lamp and inkbird stat controller that I can control remotely on my phone . Jars are sitting at a constant 21c - 21.5c temperature.
The mat was sat a few inches below the jars anyway with 3x storage box lids above it with the jars on top. I was checking the temp with a decent IR thermometer regularly and they were never getting above 24c . However I did agree that heating the space was a better idea than a heat mat so pulled the trigger on lamp and stat . .
I have put probably 300 quid into this hobby so far and I sincerely hope I get some fruits for my efforts.
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shronoob88
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Update on my journey . I managed to use pastywhites agar no pour tek . 1st run was a failure as although the 1st load of pots (20 of them) held up in the PC , the lids sort of melted around the rim so now I have 20 pots of agar fully prepped but the lids are not removable easily so I think they're for the bin unless someone can tell me if they're any use of not.
Anyhow the 2nd run the pots held up so I'm happy with that. I now have 9 agar plates ready to innoc and get some clean agar to make some decent whole oats ready to go . Hoping the condensation isn't too much of an issue. 
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KnowlesKnows
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Quote:
shronoob88 said: Update on my journey . I managed to use pastywhites agar no pour tek . 1st run was a failure as although the 1st load of pots (20 of them) held up in the PC , the lids sort of melted around the rim so now I have 20 pots of agar fully prepped but the lids are not removable easily so I think they're for the bin unless someone can tell me if they're any use of not.
Anyhow the 2nd run the pots held up so I'm happy with that. I now have 9 agar plates ready to innoc and get some clean agar to make some decent whole oats ready to go . Hoping the condensation isn't too much of an issue. 

If you have excess condensation and water pooling flip them upside down, won’t hurt it. I’ve been looking into a ceramic heater bulb as well. Does the inkbird work well?
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shronoob88
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Well it certainly does a great job of regulating the temperature in the small space I have to grow in . I'm happy with it for my purposes
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BeefSupremeJr
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Quote:
shronoob88 said: I forgot to mention actually, I have ditched the heat mat and added in a ceramic heat lamp and inkbird stat controller that I can control remotely on my phone . Jars are sitting at a constant 21c - 21.5c temperature.
The mat was sat a few inches below the jars anyway with 3x storage box lids above it with the jars on top. I was checking the temp with a decent IR thermometer regularly and they were never getting above 24c . However I did agree that heating the space was a better idea than a heat mat so pulled the trigger on lamp and stat . .
I have put probably 300 quid into this hobby so far and I sincerely hope I get some fruits for my efforts.
glad to hear this. did you calibrate the inkbird? using a good mercury thermometer will give you an accurate reading.
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shronoob88
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Update , i lost a jar due to green mould today . Anyway other 6 looking good .
I now have an x acto knife tool thingy and a bunch of metal inoculation loops for it. But all I have is a MSS ,what tek should I use for getting a couple of plates going ? Using the MSS . should I drop straight on the plate or am I better off using the loops with some MSS solution in a shot glass ?
I used the last of my GTs MSS in another 5 BRF jars and forgot to leave some for my agar , so now I only have JMF to make agar plates which I'm not happy with myself about . What a plonker .
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BrokenHeart
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for a few plates, a simple drop from syringe on plate and then a z streak with fresh or flamed loop would be method I choose. Keeping the variables to a minimum is my play. I would do shot glass if I were having to noc up 30 plates to search for aggressive genetics.
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shronoob88
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Got my plates going today with my JMF. The BRF jars are still not at full colonisation yet. Getting there though . Hoping another week or so and they'll be ready . Getting impatient now . Looking forward to getting some decent plates on the go and switching to some grain jars . And making some big tubs . Really enjoying the hobby so far .
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shronoob88
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shronoob88
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Update , jars still colonising, seem to just have little patches what don't seem to be colonising . I also lost another jar due to Trich. That's 2 out of 7 so far . Out of interest can anyone tell me how many of these brf jars are likely to become contaminated ? Like is it pretty normal to lose 2 out of 7 ? Or have I done a bad job ?
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PBJ710
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Typically if the MS syringe is bad they will all fail, so it's likely something on your end. Where the jars are failing will tell you how the contam got into your PFTek mix. If it's at some of the inoculation sites, it came in on a dirty needle. If it's happening at the tops of the jars, the contams made it past your dry verm layer. If the jars are randomly contaminating all over, it's likely how they were sterilized or prepared.
The compaction aspect of the tall jars may be playing a role as well...
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shronoob88
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This is the jar I'm talking about . Is there anything to salvage from this or do I toss ?
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PBJ710
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It looks like uncolonized dry verm layer to me (albeit a very thick one)? If you're referring to the blue spot just remove it with the dry verm layer and spawn it.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: PBJ710]
#28611468 - 01/06/24 09:15 AM (21 days, 22 hours ago) |
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The other side of the jar is nowhere near colonised
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PBJ710
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Not being colonized doesn't necessarily indicate contam. PFtek doesn't always grow from all inoculation points so sometimes it takes a while to get the jar fully colonized from 1 or 2 of the inoculation sites. Likewise if you injected it into the dry verm layer instead of the PFtek mix it may not germinate at that site. You can use a sharpie to draw an outline of the growth on the jar to see if it's still progressing or if it truely has stalled. Although PFTek is resistant to bacterial contams, it's not a 100% guarantee of success if your MS is slightly contaminated or if you introduce it during the inoculation.
Show some pics of the side with issues if you want feedback on that part of the jar.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: PBJ710]
#28611531 - 01/06/24 10:14 AM (21 days, 21 hours ago) |
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The Last picture with the spot of contam is the jar I'm referring to. The side pictured is colonised but the other side isn't at all
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420Botanist
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Quote:
shronoob88 said: The Last picture with the spot of contam is the jar I'm referring to. The side pictured is colonised but the other side isn't at all
You could give it some more time, draw outlines as suggested or just for fun and experience with your SAB...you could try and take some transfers to agar plates. You might get some contaminations but then it's good experience chasing them out!
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shronoob88
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So I could leave that jar to colonise fully around the other side and just hope the trick doesn't continue to grow ?
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PBJ710
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Take a better pic of what you're calling trich. Trich normally shows up as bright white growth that turns green, not blue.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: PBJ710]
#28613065 - 01/07/24 02:21 PM (20 days, 17 hours ago) |
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Better pic and this is the same jar on the other side of the jar .

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shronoob88
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These are the other jars , are they ready for fruiting yet ?
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PBJ710
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If the discolored area is spreading, I'd wash off any uncolonized substrate and fruit whatever remains and hope for the best. Otherwise see if you can get the rest to colonize before fruiting it.
The solo jar has some whispy looking mycelium that may be mold but it could also be weak mycelium. I'd let it go a few more days to see how it progresses.
The first 3 look ready to me in the last pic, but the last jar still needs a bit IMO.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: PBJ710]
#28620524 - 01/14/24 05:07 AM (14 days, 2 hours ago) |
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My jars have started pinning in the jar ! What do I do ??!! Are they knackered? 😬
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B Traven
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Quote:
shronoob88 said: My jars have started pinning in the jar ! What do I do ??!! Are they knackered? 😬
If they're fully colonized, then no, not necessarily. It happens to me a lot when I have a culture that readily pins and I leave my jars for too long. I just pick out the fruits/pins (and eat them!) and proceed with spawning.
Pinning before full colonization usually indicates contamination issues. The uncolonized area is fucked enough to appear "off-limits" the myc, sending a signal that full colonization has been achieved. And/or the myc is fighting for its life against a bacterial infection, and trying to throw out spores as one last attempt to do something for future generations.
Edited by B Traven (01/14/24 09:11 AM)
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The Tao
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I don’t birth cakes until I see pins. The pins survive the dunk and roll. The hard part is usually just getting the cakes out without damaging the pins. Post a picture.
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B Traven
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Re: Heating a space [Re: The Tao]
#28620769 - 01/14/24 10:13 AM (13 days, 21 hours ago) |
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Quote:
The Tao said: I don’t birth cakes until I see pins. The pins survive the dunk and roll. The hard part is usually just getting the cakes out without damaging the pins. Post a picture.
Ohhh duh, I forgot we were talking about PF jars lol
Yeah, as The Tao said, that's exactly what you want to see.
-------------------- Beware of advice- even this.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: The Tao]
#28620780 - 01/14/24 10:21 AM (13 days, 21 hours ago) |
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I have circled the biggest ones and the rest us very hard to see from the pics with the flash on . But there are hundreds of tiny white pins in one of the jars and scattered about on rest of jars . The pictures taken is 4 jars in total , from different . 








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The Tao
Look at the flowers.


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Looks good to me. How many cakes do you have? What happened to the blue area?
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: The Tao]
#28620841 - 01/14/24 11:05 AM (13 days, 20 hours ago) |
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Quote:
The Tao said: Looks good to me. How many cakes do you have? What happened to the blue area?
On the 1st attempt i made 7 cakes in total, lost 1 due to contam , the one with the blue has been put to one side and looks like it's been covered in mycelium. 1 is stalled out I think . And the remaining 4 are the ones that I have just posted .
Of the 7 cakes it's the only 3 jedi mind fuck jars that have had issues . The other 4 are GTs and they're the ones that are pinning.
I also have another 4 which I made on 26/12 , and they look tremendous so far which I haven't posted on here as yet .
So getting back to these 4 that are pinning , should I just birth them ,dunk over night and then roll in verm then leave to fruit as per pf tek instructions? In the pf tek instructions they don't mention leaving the jars to pin before dunk and roll and I don't know what to do.
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The Tao
Look at the flowers.


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I birth and dunk for 24 hours, roll in vermiculite and put put them in a water tub. I leave the tub sealed for a day before I spray the cakes with water. The wait seems to help the vermiculite adhere to the cakes. The nice thing about birthing with visible pins is you’ll usually see the pins grow out of the vermiculite coating in a few days. There are a number of PF teks around with variations in the method. Seeing pins on a 4-5 week old cake that appears healthy is what I look for.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: The Tao]
#28621016 - 01/14/24 01:05 PM (13 days, 18 hours ago) |
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Quote:
The Tao said: I birth and dunk for 24 hours, roll in vermiculite and put put them in a water tub. I leave the tub sealed for a day before I spray the cakes with water. The wait seems to help the vermiculite adhere to the cakes. The nice thing about birthing with visible pins is you’ll usually see the pins grow out of the vermiculite coating in a few days. There are a number of PF teks around with variations in the method. Seeing pins on a 4-5 week old cake that appears healthy is what I look for.
OK great thanks for the advice , I will birth and dunk them tonight amd get me water tub ready for tomorrow night 👍
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Skropi
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I also think that it's better to wait for pins in the jar than in the fc, but is it generally considered to be a better approach? I will personally try it in the next grow.
-------------------- Ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, Μοῦσα, πολύτροπον
Edited by Skropi (01/14/24 01:20 PM)
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The Tao
Look at the flowers.


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Re: Heating a space [Re: Skropi] 1
#28621069 - 01/14/24 01:49 PM (13 days, 18 hours ago) |
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I wait for pins because it’s a good indicator that a healthy cake is consolidated. Members who estimate colonization and consolidation often wonder where the mushrooms are and why their cakes are taking so long to fruit. Little baby pins, nothing too large. If the pins are growing in the dry vermiculite layer they’ll probably fall off. Those are snacks or put them in the fridge and wait for the cakes to flush. Little pins.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: The Tao]
#28621210 - 01/14/24 03:46 PM (13 days, 16 hours ago) |
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One of my agar plates , most of them look like this .. I am going to take some transfers on Friday. Things are moving along nicely now .
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shronoob88
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I got my water tub sorted and cakes put in there last night .
Also took transfers from my 1st ever agar plates yesterday . Looking forward to seeing results from that .
Once again thanks to all the people who have helped me along to this point so far . 🙌👍👌
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NoviceCultivator
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What's an SAB?
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shronoob88
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Quote:
NoviceCultivator said: What's an SAB?
Still air box
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metaneuralnetwork
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These are pint sized jars? In case someone hasn't mentioned it - you want to use 1/2 pint for this tek, preferably the wide mouth ones.
If someone did mention it, please accept my humble apology for not reading every single post
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shronoob88
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Update, 1 week today since I put cakes into the water tub. Only one or 2 shroom popping up so far and can't really see any pins .
How long before these start fruiting do we wthink now ? Hope I'm not gonna get 1 shroom after all this 🤣


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The Tao
Look at the flowers.


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You’re at the wait and see part. Cakes look good and pins are starting. Leave the tub alone, repeatedly opening and peeking defeats the purpose of the water tub maintaining conditions. Put your attention on your other projects.
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shronoob88
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Re: Heating a space [Re: The Tao] 2
#28634531 - 01/25/24 01:42 PM (2 days, 18 hours ago) |
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Finally got some growth 🙌
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metaneuralnetwork
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I'm tempted to simply rinse and take a huge bite out of the cake sometimes. Probably all kinds of very good reasons not to do that but the smell is tempting. Sorry if that's weird.
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LogicaL Chaos
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Have yer cake and eat it too
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shronoob88
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So am I ok misting when it looks dry ? Or should I stop misting ?
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