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OfflineInnos
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Exploring Fermented Substrates: Bypassing Heat Sterilization * 2
    #28508609 - 10/17/23 07:16 PM (6 months, 28 days ago)

Hello everyone,

I've been lurking on this forum for a while and am excited to be making my first post! 😊 Lately, I've been diving deep into experimenting with the fermentation of substrates for mushroom cultivation. I was particularly inspired by Carsten's enlightening post on using lactic fermentation for grain (if you haven’t read his thread, please do, because a lot of stuff I will be doing here will be based on things discussed there), which can potentially bypass the need for a pressure cooker.

In this thread, I aim to document my experiments, and I sincerely hope that some of you will join in, share your insights, or even start your own related experiments. My goal is to manage the entire mushroom-growing process without applying any heat, meaning no pasteurization of spawn or bulk substrate. Furthermore, I'm keen on discovering cost-effective alternative substrates suitable for cultivating various mushroom species. By eliminating pasteurization or the need for heat, we can reduce energy consumption and work hours, which is something I'm eager to explore. Additionally, fermentation might potentially unlock the use of alternative substrates or substrate combinations that haven't been used before for cultivation.

Mushroom Species I'll Be Working With:
• Pleurotus ostreatus (oyster)
• Pleurotus eryngii (king oyster)
• Agaricus bisporus (portobello)
• Lentinula edodes (shiitake)
• cubes
Later on, I plan to include Hericium erinaceus (lion's mane) and potentially a few more, depending on the success of my initial experiments.

Here's a brief overview of my experiments so far and planned experiments for the near future:

1) Kombucha Fermentation: I've noticed faster fermentation when adding hydroponic plant nutrients to the tea kombucha. Interestingly, coffee kombucha, made from freely available spent coffee or fresh coffee, seems to hold more promise because the spent coffee later adds some nutritional value to the substrate and the fermentation is overall faster and looks to be more resistant to later contamination.
Further Investigation: Determining the optimal nutrient ratio to be added for the fastest kombucha fermentation. i need to experiment more in general with additives to the fermentation that will make it faster and more resh in bioavailable compounds for the mycelium.

2) Lactic Fermentation: I've initiated four experiments using different grains: rice, popcorn, white, and oats. I'm testing the impact of added hydroponic plant nutrients on promoting lactic fermentation and exploring whether pre-cooking the grain is necessary. Additionally, I'm keen on seeing if the addition of sourdough can enhance lactic fermentation. lactic fermentation is what Carsten did in his thread; I want to see if the process works for me the way it worked for him and try to experiment and possibly improve it if I can.

3) Wood Fermentation: Initial tests with lactic fermentation failed when flour or grains were added to the wood. However, acetic acid fermentation (via kombucha) yielded intriguing results. While softwood combined with tea kombucha didn't work(it did work somewhat but the pH drop wasn't good enough and it contaminated like hell, there is a possibility that some plant nutriants+extra sugar will work better..need to test this:confused:), a mix of wood and coffee kombucha did. The resulting wood was resistant to contamination while being loaded with coffee.
Next Steps: Testing wood with tea/coffee kombucha and adding hydroponic plant nutrients to optimize wood fermentation, aiming to produce an affordable, nutrient-rich substrate with promising yields.
4) Cardboard Fermentation: I'm exploring kombucha fermentation for cardboard to potentially enrich it with nutrients while enhancing its resistance to contamination. this might be a promising road, i didn't think on it too much..but i will formulate some experiments and try it..

5) Wood + Microgreen Waste: After successfully growing microgreens on softwood with a good yield, I'm left with a mixture of softwood, roots, and microgreen remnants post-harvest. I'm currently experimenting with fermenting this mixture using kombucha. If successful, this could be transformative, especially given the abundance of this waste material I have. so i will treat this mixture similar to regular wood.

The primary goal of my experiments is to reduce costs related to heat/sterility/work hours. Therefore, I'll be initiating all mushroom experiments from a tissue sample on cardboard TEK as a starting substrate.(without being too sterile)

Mushroom Digestion: Mushrooms are saprophytic organisms (with a few being parasitic or mycorrhizal). This means they primarily obtain their nutrients by breaking down organic matter, such as decaying wood or other organic substrates. They accomplish this through external digestion. The mycelium excretes enzymes into the surrounding environment, which break down complex organic molecules into simpler compounds. These simpler compounds are then absorbed by the mycelium to be used as nutrients.
Plant Nutrients: Plant nutrients typically contain a mix of macronutrients like nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium , as well as micronutrients like magnesium, calcium, and iron. These nutrients are in forms that plants can absorb directly from the soil. In contrast, mushrooms require complex organic matter that they can break down through their enzymatic processes.
Adding Plant Nutrients to Mushroom Substrate: If you add typical plant nutrients to a mushroom growth medium, you won't see a direct positive effect on the mushroom growth. Mushrooms don't benefit from simple mineral salts or nutrients in the same way plants do. In fact, excessive inorganic nutrients can be detrimental and may increase the risk of contamination in mushroom cultivation as unwanted bacteria or molds might thrive on these nutrients.
So why would I play with plant nutriants? Well..the fermentation process produces a variety of organic compounds and a large assortment of organisms, some of them die or are later killed by the mycelium and digested. I want to check if the fermentation will transfer the plant salt-based nutrients into organic matter that is available for the mycelium to use and boost its growth.

Later on I will also experiment on mixing softwood with cardboard in the fermentation process different substrates can provide a broader range of nutrients. While cardboard primarily offers cellulose, softwood introduces different lignins and other organic compounds. softwoods contain resinous compounds that can be inhibitory to some mushroom species, I hope some of those resinous compounds can be eliminated in the fermentation process
My theory is the following: Carlson managed to make grain spawn with lactic fermentation and later on, transform it to fermented straw. I hope that the acetic acid fermentation (via kombucha) will let me use a wider variety of substrates. acetic acid is sometimes more problematic for mushrooms than lactic acid to deal with, so we will see how it will go.


Later experiments include:

Fermentation Duration: Determining the optimal fermentation time for each substrate. Too short might not yield the desired effects, while too long could degrade the substrate excessively.

Post-Fermentation Rinse: After fermentation, I will run a control group where I rinse one batch of the substrate to remove excess acids and compare it with another batch where I don't rinse. This could influence the mycelium's ability to colonize.

Nutrient Additions Beyond Hydroponics: While I'm already considering hydroponic nutrients, I'm also curious about other organic supplements like diluted molasses as potential additives to the fermentation process.

I envision this thread as an evolving experimental log, documenting the essence of my journey. My ultimate aspiration is to develop a cost-effective, nutrient-rich substrate that doesn't require heat, making it a viable option for mushroom cultivation.

if you have any ideas for me to try please post it below, and when some of the experiments are done i will post here all my results with pictures

Innos


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"All fungi are edible. Some fungi are only edible once." - Terry Pratchett

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OfflineTiamo
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Re: Exploring Fermented Substrates: Bypassing Heat Sterilization [Re: Innos]
    #28509459 - 10/18/23 12:46 PM (6 months, 27 days ago)

I want to follow along. Good luck!

:threadmonitor:


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If you have used a Miraculix Psilocybin QTest, could you please share your results?

Shipping free Ps. natalensis spore prints to any address in The Netherlands, just :pm:

:mushroom2: Mush love :mushroom2:

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OfflineInnos
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Registered: 10/15/23
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Re: Exploring Fermented Substrates: Bypassing Heat Sterilization [Re: Tiamo]
    #28514472 - 10/22/23 05:01 PM (6 months, 23 days ago)

I will try to summarize the experiments I ran in the last week or so and plan my next move for some of them.

Grain Fermentation: I ran a lactic fermentation on popcorn, wheat grain, rice, and oats (flaked).

Popcorn: It's cheap for me and has the best consistency among all the grains. The kernels stayed firm, and it was really easy to filter the water at the end of fermentation. However, for some reason, fermentation failed for me in all 4 jars (it smelled like sewage, and the pH dropped only to 5.48).
Next Experimentation: Add some water from a well-fermented grain to try and establish lactic acid fermentation right from the beginning.


Wheat Grain: It had a good consistency. Some kernels burst even though the cooking was only for 5 minutes, so probably no cooking will be done next time. Filtering the water was easy as well. A problem that arose during fermentation was green mold on the surface of the liquid. It took me time to scoop it out, and I ended up scooping out the yeast as well to prevent mold growth. The end pH after 1 week of fermentation was 3.70.
Next Experimentation: Add a layer of canola oil on top of the jar to discourage mold and make the fermentation process more anaerobic.



Rice: Probably the best-smelling fermentation and the lowest pH of all the grains (pH 3.3 after 1 week of fermentation). There was a lot of material floating, but no mold in any jar. It's also the cheapest grain for me. The rice was cooked for 2 minutes before fermentation. Problem: After I filtered the liquid, I was left with a rice mash with the consistency of a thick paste.
Next Experimentation: Don't cook the rice. I'll also try different types of rice; maybe a different kind will remain firmer.


Oats: The cheapest of them all but the worst result. It turned to jello after the water was drained. There was a lot of material floating during fermentation, but no mold.
Next Experiment: Maybe if I add something to hold it all together, it might work, like wood shavings. This will likely be added and mixed with the oats after fermentation has started and the lactic microbes are well established.

Kombucha Fermentation: I used "Advanced Nutrients Sensi Grow Professional Series" hydroponic nutrients and added them to a fresh batch of black tea kombucha (70 ml of starter from a previous batch of kombucha was added to achieve a final volume of 1L for each jar). The initial pH of all the jars after the starter was added was 3.9. Here are the pH results after 4 days of fermentation:

Jar number 1: 0 gr/l nutrients pH 3.33
Jar number 2: 0 gr/l nutrients pH 3.27
Jar number 3: 0.3 gr/l nutrients pH 3.46
Jar number 4: 0.5 gr/l nutrients pH 3.04
Jar number 5: 0.6 gr/l nutrients pH 3.07
Jar number 6: 0.8 gr/l nutrients pH 2.95
Jar number 7: 1 gr/l nutrients pH 2.89
Jar number 8: 1.4 gr/l nutrients pH 2.92
Jar number 9: 1.6 gr/l nutrients pH 2.88



A couple of caveats: I filled the jars too much, and the SCOBY on top in some of the jars stuck to the filter, which probably affected some of the results. I will redo the experiment, but we can clearly see that the addition of nutrients to the fermentation helps and speeds up the process.

Next Experiments: Ferment the grains with kombucha instead of lactic fermentation. Also, ferment other materials with kombucha to see if mushrooms will grow on the fermented substrate and check for contamination.

Materials for future Kombucha Fermentation tests: grain, cardboard, softwood, softwood + microgreen waste, softwood + coffee grounds.

I will run more experiments(the ones I propose here and some new ones). and update here every couple of days on the results.
so far it's the early stage, I don't know if the Kombucha fermented substrate would even work and if the mushrooms will even be able to colonize it. i made some cardboard jars and set them to colonize, so when the kombucha and lactic fermentation is ready i can try and inoculate it with the cardboard.


--------------------
"All fungi are edible. Some fungi are only edible once." - Terry Pratchett

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