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OnlineCHeifM4sterDiezL
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: koods]
    #28502651 - 10/12/23 11:47 PM (7 months, 1 day ago)

That's honestly the best we can hope for is they go down and put down any resistance and the just occupy the area and its back to kinda business as usual.:shrug:

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OfflineKryptos
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: CHeifM4sterDiezL] * 2
    #28502657 - 10/12/23 11:57 PM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Quote:

B Traven said:
US politicians, including the president, loudly "Stand with Israel" for many reasons.

But one of them is that they're declaring sides in Israel's proxy war with Iran.

They're not moving carrier groups in to shell Gaza. They're doing it to warn all the neighbors to stay in their houses.

And like the cold war, neither side is particularly pressed about any atrocities or human rights abuses that their client states might perpetrate.

I bet it'll be a minute before Biden mentions his concerns about Israel's judicial reform again. Assuming he ever gets around to it.




Yep. This is a big factor. Iran/Syria/Hamas vs. Israel/SA/Egypt/Others. We are currently dividing the world into sides. Just expanding it further from Russia/The West. This worries me the most, TBH. We're starting to get that tangle of alliances that resulted in WWI and WWII.

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

Kryptos said:
NYT reporting the same.

Welp, now Israel is a genocidal apartheid state, not just an apartheid state.

SirTripALot: This is exactly what I meant by overreaction earlier. The UN is already calling this a humanitarian disaster.




This is going to be a slaughter. And no one in power will care.




Correct.

Quote:

koods said:
Yes exactly they are going to go in a kill anyone who hasn’t left. Apparently there is a lot of hidden and underground Hamas infrastructure and I think they intend to methodically clear it all out. I don’t think they’re going to indiscriminately destroy civilian infrastructure. They don’t want to leave millions of people homeless at the end of this process.




That's why it's not going to be carpet bombed. It will be occupied in door to door urban fighting between the IDF, whatever Hamas is left, and the old people/children that can't escape fast enough.

Quote:

CHeifM4sterDiezL said:
That's honestly the best we can hope for is they go down and put down any resistance and the just occupy the area and its back to kinda business as usual.:shrug:




I think this is probably the worst possible outcome, actually. It seems like a good idea, but that's exactly what the US invasion after 9/11 was. This would be a clear and undisputed victory for Hamas.

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OfflineKryptos
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kryptos] * 1
    #28502662 - 10/13/23 12:02 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

And the US Strategic Posture Center just released a report that the US should abandon the idea of fighting Russia and China one at a time, and should raise the military budget so that we can fight both China and Russia at the same time.

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InvisibleLynnch
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kryptos]
    #28502755 - 10/13/23 03:48 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

I urge all of you to watch the al jazeera live stream on youtube.. The amount of schitzo religious shit in the chat will make you lose faith in humanity, but comparatively makes our discussions here seem amicable and logical.

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Offlinekoods
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Lynnch] * 1
    #28502776 - 10/13/23 04:34 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

The right is expecting worldwide mass terrorist attacks and it’s not really panning out so far


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”

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OfflineKryptos
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Lynnch] * 1
    #28502782 - 10/13/23 04:51 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Quote:

Lynnch said:
I urge all of you to watch the al jazeera live stream on youtube.. The amount of schitzo religious shit in the chat will make you lose faith in humanity, but comparatively makes our discussions here seem amicable and logical.




That is true damn near everywhere right now. Pretty much every public discussion of this situation is just increasingly vicious calls for genocide, with the side depending on the crowd (but US-centric media is generally pro-Israel).

Nice thing about relatively close knit political forums is that the temperature may be set relatively high, but it also doesn't change much.

I don't remember even 2001 being quite so openly genocidal. But that might just be rose tinted glasses.

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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kryptos]
    #28502790 - 10/13/23 05:13 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Sounds like rose tinted glasses, albeit - depending on what all you were reading about and who was writing...idk.

Humanity itself, wrt human nature, hasn't changed much since '01 if i'm not mistaken. 

Depending on where you look, what you're looking at, and when - it honestly can go either way at an given time.

In terms of pubby general discussions being highly 'us vs them' mentality.  Largely the result of general: eg. cultural, etc conditioning, + genetics, and biological structural anatomy imo - mankind's natural tendency towards overly simplistic dualistic thinking likely has a significant role to do with our brain being structured how it is - bicameral, in a manner of speaking (used to be the word for it, idk anymore, can't recall the modern term for it) - thus functioning like it does...playing hygge part in giving rise to what we now are seeing thanks to that tricksy dualistic-perception being basically ingrained.   

C'mon, Pink Floyd (and so many others since forever ago onwards up until this very day) pretty much elucidated the whole shebang and nailed it shut in terms of expressing the sheer stupidity/idiocy of that kind of broad strokes / black & white thinking ~ when viewing anything in and of the shared world of things.

eg. DSoTM's 'Us Vs Them' etc, etc.  :sadyes:

Hence, they really ought to have it internationally recognized that LSD missles and Psilocybin gas will be used liberally to restore primal non-dual awareness so that the silly thinking of 'us vs them' gets too blurred to mean anything anything meaningful anymore since everything's seen together in primordial unity or something, having superficial imputed differences become transparent to the mind's of those hit by the substances in sufficiently appropriate doses so that they simply no longer see the point in killing their fellow human family any longer over some dumb ape-man shit their ancestors did back in the day, and, relatives kinda kept doing on both sides up to the present day...look where it got them?

Point made.

Might as well drop those suckers before putting bullets in peoples heads and shit and blasting peoples' homes and businesses and whatnot...better than mandated fucking killing of people by retarded delusional insane government duders being blown by investors in the war business & whatever other vultures profit from direct blowing up of people and their shit and shit...

ffs, srsly, amirit or what?

Why the hell not? 
At the very least, if it doesn't go as i illustrated, they'd be largely incapacitated to the point of not being able to fight or do a damn thing anyways. :oldman:

:chefskiss::maybe:


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps

Edited by The Blind Ass (10/13/23 05:33 AM)

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OfflineMilleresque
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: The Blind Ass] * 1
    #28502796 - 10/13/23 05:27 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Hamas is claiming Israeli air strikes have resulted in the deaths of 13 hostages, both foreign and Israeli. As in as a direct result of—not in response to.

Here unfurls the fog of war for sure, but given Israel’s campaign so far, entailing white phosphorus and heavy bombardment which we have all seen, I wouldn’t be surprised if this had occurred.

That said, Hamas has also asked for Gazans to remain in their homes and hold out rather than flee, and even there I see both edges of the blade. It’s a prison and a nightmare, but people do scrape out faint edens for themselves and their children…and who amongst those who support the Ukrainians in their fight against an invading Russia, can for a second fault them for not leaving?

And then if they stay they’re likely to be blown to pieces, whether accidentally or not. And some would say as the shields for terrorists.

But it’s not so black and white. I’m forgetting the political arm of Hamas. The vote. Its not a black and white thing.

If EVER we could learn the lessons of the last two decades it is now. If there was EVER a reason for the United Nations, here is that reason.

And reason must prevail. Even if we left the age of reason lifetimes ago.


--------------------
“Develop an interest in life as you see it; in people, things, literature, music - the world is so rich, simply throbbing with rich treasures, beautiful souls and interesting people. Forget yourself.“

Henry Miller

Edited by Milleresque (10/13/23 05:31 AM)

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InvisibleLynnch
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kryptos]
    #28502799 - 10/13/23 05:33 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Quote:

Kryptos said:
That is true damn near everywhere right now. Pretty much every public discussion of this situation is just increasingly vicious calls for genocide, with the side depending on the crowd (but US-centric media is generally pro-Israel).

Nice thing about relatively close knit political forums is that the temperature may be set relatively high, but it also doesn't change much.

I don't remember even 2001 being quite so openly genocidal. But that might just be rose tinted glasses.



It's sickening.. a lot of shrieking and taking sides.. if you don't condemn X group, you are therefore fully supportive of Y group. Complete stupidity.

2001 was genocidal, the American public wanted blood, but I think it was more knee-jerk? The current moment is a reaction to all of that.. if anything it's softened by the USAs recent wars.

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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Milleresque]
    #28502806 - 10/13/23 05:45 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Human Rights Watch confirming Israel’s use of white phosphorus in Gaza and Lebanon:

https://x.com/hrw/status/1712573871596187916?s=46&t=NCHEHEdgn4yG76LKXrSTrw

Another war crime on to the pile, lads





White phosphorus is also used to mark targets, smoke screen, etc. It's not considered a chemical weapon although most often equate it to that. Just because it was used,  doesn't mean a war crime occured or didn't occur....it is the context. Good luck finding that out during a war.

I would rather take my chances around Willy Pete then be caught in the crossfire as a civilian.

Edited by SirTripAlot (10/13/23 05:57 AM)

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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Lynnch]
    #28502807 - 10/13/23 05:46 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

@ Miller

I hear you, big dawg, I really do.  It's so batshit insane I may as well go into the supermarket today and just get everything I can and walk out without paying, if they ask wtf i'm doing I'll just shit on the cash register like a retarded monkey ape man and act like everything's suddenly fixed, if they inquire further - i'll just point to Biden's comments about the decapitated baby briquet, the multiple wars going on right fkn now that are and were completely needless and are still stoppable - given that we're capable of intelligent thought, good sense, compassion, and reason.

Is it too i N s A n E...to DEMAND... as much that our *ahem* "so-called world leaders" exercise those mental faculties to the fullest in the thick of it no matter what, since...hey, do ur fucking job or gtfo... or employ those who do - wrt peace - and not death?  Srsly, we're pushing back Star Trek Earth by like 10,000 years with these kinds of multiverse-brain level tactics, albeit, these day's recent uberbrain moves are of the apeman variety hybridized with the warhawk/monger/ and their fellow amigos who make bank off all the death with their cool kill-you-tek and whatnot. 

Might as well, because that's how fucked this shit is.

Not to mention UA & RU's war, too.

All of it is.

Hi, UN? Anyone really... Do your god damn fucking jerbs (the beautiful *idealistic* way twas painted to the people of the world to be ever so gracefully as a force for wonderfully fluffy peace and love, mannng)...ffs.  :oldman:

I can't even, it's just so dumb. 
How a minority of asshats can manipulate a situation so as to fuck it up for so many people, knowing how many will die, be maimed, forever traumatized, and filled with hatred and other unwholesome toxic shit that can and does spread on from there...is downright sick and nutty as can fucking be. :smbfacepalm:


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps

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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: The Blind Ass] * 3
    #28502867 - 10/13/23 07:11 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

White House says calls for ceasefire and de-escalation “repugnant”



War is good you fucking losers


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OfflinePsilynut2
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #28502875 - 10/13/23 07:17 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

That certainly seems to be the opinion in the world of Muslims . A few hundred thousand people turned out in support of the Palestinian attack in Iraq today .



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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Psilynut2]
    #28502882 - 10/13/23 07:23 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Hamas decided to blow their load knowing full well what scale the retaliation of Israel would be. I mean, thats really caring and sound governance for the populace.


--------------------
“I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”

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OfflineB Traven
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: The Blind Ass] * 1
    #28502903 - 10/13/23 07:39 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Quote:

The Blind Ass said:
Sounds like rose tinted glasses, albeit.....internationally recognized that LSD missles and Psilocybin gas will be used liberally to restore primal non-dual awareness so that the silly thinking of 'us vs them' gets too blurred to mean anything anything meaningful anymore since everything's seen together in primordial unity or something, having superficial imputed differences become transparent to the mind's of those hit by the substances in sufficiently appropriate doses so that they simply no longer see the point in killing their fellow human family any longer over some dumb ape-man shit their ancestors did back in the day, and, relatives kinda kept doing on both sides up to the present day...look where it got them?

Point made.

Might as well drop those suckers before putting bullets in peoples heads and shit and blasting peoples' homes and businesses and whatnot...better than mandated fucking killing of people by retarded delusional insane government duders being blown by investors in the war business & whatever other vultures profit from direct blowing up of people and their shit and shit...

ffs, srsly, amirit or what?

Why the hell not? 
At the very least, if it doesn't go as i illustrated, they'd be largely incapacitated to the point of not being able to fight or do a damn thing anyways. :oldman:

:chefskiss::maybe:




We know that the human brain doesn't fully develop until the mid-20's. It could be argued that most rank-and-file recruits around the world are effectively child soldiers. And I realized something recently about getting older, vis a vis employment situations: I'm more capable than I ever have been, and could do just about any job I've ever held. But I've also seen and been through enough in my life that I wouldn't listen to most bosses, or take most of the shit jobs out there. Been there, done that. The Red Baron died in combat at 25. Went from cavalry to the messenger corps when cavalry units were deemed obsolete. Wanted to be "in the shit" so to speak, and got moved to the new flying corps. Imagine trying to get a 40-year-old airline pilot to run in dogfights over Belgium.

I have a friend who joined the army in the 1980's, for typical "I'm gonna go do badass shit and be an army man" reasons. He got stationed in Berlin, and promptly started dropping acid and whatnot. Then, walking around on leave in East Berlin, he saw some Russian soldiers on leave. He told me he realized that these were the guys he was there to maybe fight, and that the whole thing no longer made any sense to him. Filed as conscientious objector shortly after.


--------------------
Beware of advice- even this.

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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: SirTripAlot] * 1
    #28502906 - 10/13/23 07:42 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Quote:

Psilynut2 said:
That certainly seems to be the opinion in the world of Muslims . A few hundred thousand people turned out in support of the Palestinian attack in Iraq today .






Quote:

SirTripAlot said:
Hamas decided to blow their load knowing full well what scale the retaliation of Israel would be. I mean, thats really caring and sound governance for the populace.




Yeah if only the Palestinians had simply asked nicely for self determination and an end to the Israelis occupation, they would’ve gotten it.


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Offlinegww
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #28502918 - 10/13/23 07:54 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

If part of your charter for even being is to kill jews, me being just one of those simple thinkers mentioned above.  Simple is to remember that it only takes one to make war.

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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #28502919 - 10/13/23 07:57 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Probably not.

I also don't believe the premise that every ill whether it be economic or social is all Israel's fault. As I stated before, the Palestinians have a tendency to become unstable by getting kicked out of numerous other countries.

To say that a rational response to this is to actively target a civilian populace in order to meet their end of self determination is ridiculous. Hamas already knew this, and didn't care. They have a fat chance in hell now because of this action.


--------------------
“I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”

Edited by SirTripAlot (10/13/23 07:58 AM)

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OfflineB Traven
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: SirTripAlot]
    #28502926 - 10/13/23 08:04 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

Quote:

Lynnch said:
Quote:

Kryptos said:
That is true damn near everywhere right now. Pretty much every public discussion of this situation is just increasingly vicious calls for genocide, with the side depending on the crowd (but US-centric media is generally pro-Israel).

Nice thing about relatively close knit political forums is that the temperature may be set relatively high, but it also doesn't change much.

I don't remember even 2001 being quite so openly genocidal. But that might just be rose tinted glasses.



It's sickening.. a lot of shrieking and taking sides.. if you don't condemn X group, you are therefore fully supportive of Y group. Complete stupidity.

2001 was genocidal, the American public wanted blood, but I think it was more knee-jerk? The current moment is a reaction to all of that.. if anything it's softened by the USAs recent wars.




In 2001, Americans just really really wanted a country to go to war with. I know a lot of people who joined the military after 9/11, like it was their Pearl Harbor moment. They all told me that the bullshit they were assigned to do in Afghanistan and the Middle East quickly disillusioned them of that narrative. While the invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan involved lots of killing, destruction, and the usual menu of assymetrical warfare atrocities on all sides, I don't think most people in the US saw it that way. They legitimately thought we were going over there to get the bad guys and free the locals.

This honestly feels more openly genocidal. Like yeah, OK, we got a couple million stateless people who have been a real pain in the ass, nobody's gonna miss em.

Quote:

SirTripAlot said:
I also don't believe the premise that every ill whether it be economic or social is all Israel's fault. As I stated before, the Palestinians have a tendency to become unstable by getting kicked out of numerous other countries.




Case in point. Is there some essential difference between the Arabs who managed to get Israeli citizenship, the ones who managed to get citizenship in a neighoring country, and the ones who are stuck with an address in Gaza or the West Bank? Is there some essential difference between the residents of Gaza and the residents of the West Bank? You're falling prey to confirmation bias here.


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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: B Traven]
    #28502929 - 10/13/23 08:07 AM (7 months, 1 day ago)

What's my confirmation bias?


--------------------
“I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”

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