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Offlineashfiken
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28551370 - 11/21/23 10:13 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

I don't know if it's part of the same "revitalization" plan but I have seen some  info online of Israeli desire to build a canal from west Bank/Gaza strip to the gulf of aqaba.
I'd be inclined to think that would be relative to this kind of plan/line of thinking as well as this conflict

https://frontierindia.com/all-you-should-know-about-the-israeli-ben-gurion-canal-project/

Seems it's been in the swirl for a couple years now. Wonder how much has actually been started or accomplished on this.


--------------------
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Edited by ashfiken (11/21/23 10:20 AM)


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: birdeatingspider] * 1
    #28551410 - 11/21/23 10:38 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

birdeatingspider said:
Not trying to derail, and haven't had my coffee/meds yet. Its a big thought I need to edit down for everyone's sake.

Just want to point out that translated doc I posted compares Gaza to Nazi Germany.
Which solidifies my view. From the very beginning, have been saying that this is a case of generational trauma for Israel (and Gaza).

The total overuse of weapons, not to mention they have their own ghetto cool.
This is payback they never got against the Nazis. Don't discount the power of validation.

Which circles me back to Trump saying vermin, a term we all know Hitler was affectionate for.
Is that worth concern, in comparison to both Nazi germany and now Israel's call for cleansing, or bush saying your with us or them, or when bin laden said all americans must die..

Are you saying this simply means they're serious, is all?
Mere saber rattling.

Trump quotes belong in that thread, but was trying to help clarify my parallels.  Can't say I did, okay.
mushboy said
Quote:

but whatever


nevermind.



Will forever recall vividly, seeing Bush jr delivering that message. Especially due to my proximity, everyone here really wanted blood, and perhaps i was a naive barely young adult, but I needed blood too.

It goes to show how influential the things around you can be. An open air prison lasting decades, being dependent on my captors as a child, adult, parent, growing up and having kids in same conditions.. I told my staunch pro biden father that I would be uprising. I would have initially voted hamas into power out of desperation.

And I'd like to know who wouldn't?




I think there’s certainly a degree of “vengeance” for the Holocaust that goes into Israeli calculus for how they treat Palestinians (and Arabs or Persians in general). But I think it has much more to do with Zionism. “We are finally returning to our homeland after centuries of oppression abroad, and we are surrounded by enemies. We are God’s chosen people on God’s chosen land and we will not be deterred.” This is a powerful narrative, one which the Holocaust and Nazi Germany play a part, for sure. The rhetoric about the Nazis and “never again” by Israelis mouthpieces is much more amplified than actual concern though, and it does Jews everywhere a disservice when Israel blunts the public concern over antisemitism by calling every criticism of their own war crimes as antisemitism.

Also, I could be wrong but I think mush only meant that the people using rhetoric like referring to people as vermin, that they are showing us who they are (fascists), and are serious about their plans of exterminating those they deem to be unworthy of humanity.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: ashfiken]
    #28551411 - 11/21/23 10:41 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

ashfiken said:
I don't know if it's part of the same "revitalization" plan but I have seen some  info online of Israeli desire to build a canal from west Bank/Gaza strip to the gulf of aqaba.
I'd be inclined to think that would be relative to this kind of plan/line of thinking as well as this conflict

https://frontierindia.com/all-you-should-know-about-the-israeli-ben-gurion-canal-project/

Seems it's been in the swirl for a couple years now. Wonder how much has actually been started or accomplished on this.




I’ve seen this as well, but it’s a much tougher proposition than offshore drilling in waters that Palestinians can’t even enter because of Israeli military.

I think it’s obvious there are considerations as to what happens to Gaza that aren’t solely couched in Israel’s bloodlust. Just like the settlements in the West Bank, Israel can make money off their ethnic cleansing, as most ethnic cleansers have done in the past.


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OfflineKryptos
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kizzle]
    #28551412 - 11/21/23 10:41 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

Kizzle said:
Quote:

Tulipslave said:
Quote:

Kizzle said:
Quote:

lifeiswhatyoumake said:
Yes, civilians are non-combat by definition.
And true, I'm sure some airstrikes have missed their target and hit civilians, unfortunately.

There's talks of a ceasefire potentially coming to fruition any hour... https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/white-house-says-israel-hamas-hostage-deal-closer-than-before-2023-11-21/



It's not that the strikes are missing. It's that there are civilians at the places they're attacking. Hamas doesn't keep their weapon caches confined to bases. They stash them in civilian areas to deter them from being destroyed. The only way to win a war is to destroy the weapons so there are going to be a lot of deaths because of this.






Has there been undeniable proof of this?

Or is this something else Israeli officials/IDF are claiming?



No proof is undeniable to someone who wants to deny it. Do you deny that Israel tries to evacutate these areas before they attack? Because there's massive evidence of that happening. This isn't because of their great love for the Palastinean people or anything but because Israel isn't stupid. They know civilian deaths cause them to lose support and encourage attacks from other powers and they genuinely try to avoid them.




Israeli rhetoric is one of ethnic cleansing. They have told people to evacuate, and then bombed the refugee camps that people evacuated to, claiming that Hamas operatives were among the civilians. When called out on it, they shrug. When asked if they have killed the hamas members in those strikes, they dodge the question. Then they go ahead and announce that photographers and journalists must have known about the attacks and are now valid targets.

Israeli "notice to evacuate" rings about as true as Putin saying "no idea how that novichok got there" with a wink and a nudge.

The most generously pro-Israeli version of their events is that the IDF is extremely undisciplined in their use of force. A more realistic appraisal, in my mind, is that they fully intend to kill Palestinians civilians, and are doing the bare minimum to sow doubt as a propagandistic show of force.

The fact that IDF strikes in the West Bank (not ruled by Hamas) have ramped up so significantly that the yearly average jumped from 3 attacks per day before 10/07 to 7 attacks per day (still annual average, that means they did an entire year's worth of violence and change in less than 2 months) also says their goal is extermination.


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Offlineashfiken
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kryptos]
    #28551422 - 11/21/23 10:58 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

The whole actions speak louder than words adage


--------------------
hmm...

"I'm naked and fearless... And my fear is naked."

"life isn't worth living without the threat of death"

"I got my plans in a ziploc bag, let's see how unproductive we can be"

"nobody lives their lives fully except for bull fighters"

My Trade List


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Invisiblebirdeatingspider
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: ashfiken]
    #28551433 - 11/21/23 11:10 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

They found oil in gaza? :rofl:
How convenient.

https://twitter.com/Seamus_Malek/status/172697002174498428c
Circumcision by force, neat.


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Onlinelifeiswhatyoumake
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: birdeatingspider]
    #28551450 - 11/21/23 11:32 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

"The first Palestinian, identified only as having been apprehended inside Gaza on November 12, told interrogators that these terrorists–dressed in civilian clothes–would use the hospitals as a base for attacks. They would also disguise themselves as medical staff while hiding in the hospital."

https://organiser.org/2023/11/21/207155/world/gazans-confirm-terrorists-hide-in-hospitals-dress-up-as-medical-personnel/
https://nypost.com/2023/11/20/news/hamas-captives-spill-secrets-about-operating-from-hospitals-we-became-their-human-shields/


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: ashfiken]
    #28551451 - 11/21/23 11:32 AM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

ashfiken said:
I don't know if it's part of the same "revitalization" plan but I have seen some  info online of Israeli desire to build a canal from west Bank/Gaza strip to the gulf of aqaba.
I'd be inclined to think that would be relative to this kind of plan/line of thinking as well as this conflict

https://frontierindia.com/all-you-should-know-about-the-israeli-ben-gurion-canal-project/

Seems it's been in the swirl for a couple years now. Wonder how much has actually been started or accomplished on this.




Yeah... They want to build a canal as a shipping lane for trade... I saw some guy saying the United States had talked about potentially using nuclear bombs to create the channel...

I don't have sources for that... sorry fellas.


--------------------
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OfflineGenesisCorruptedS
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28551566 - 11/21/23 01:18 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

I don’t see why we’d have to go nuclear.
We could just use bunker Busters on that. Those bombs are more than powerful enough to make a canal.

Maybe a set of like eight in a row kind of like a carpet bombing pattern.
Get some good penetration on it.
Then the water would flow through the canal and push most of that silt and crap out.
We would just have to scoop out some rocks. Done.
Am I wrong?
It would, of course, depend on soil composition of the area. But I don’t see why we would have to go to the maximum first.


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28551612 - 11/21/23 01:55 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Quote:

ashfiken said:
I don't know if it's part of the same "revitalization" plan but I have seen some  info online of Israeli desire to build a canal from west Bank/Gaza strip to the gulf of aqaba.
I'd be inclined to think that would be relative to this kind of plan/line of thinking as well as this conflict

https://frontierindia.com/all-you-should-know-about-the-israeli-ben-gurion-canal-project/

Seems it's been in the swirl for a couple years now. Wonder how much has actually been started or accomplished on this.




Yeah... They want to build a canal as a shipping lane for trade... I saw some guy saying the United States had talked about potentially using nuclear bombs to create the channel...

I don't have sources for that... sorry fellas.




Wikipedia page about the proposed canal:cookiemonster:


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: GenesisCorrupted] * 1
    #28551672 - 11/21/23 02:40 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

GenesisCorrupted said:
It would, of course, depend on soil composition of the area. But I don’t see why we would have to go to the maximum first.




Because we're America, son...


Doiiii!


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28551686 - 11/21/23 02:55 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

The alsheefa hospital story has changed a bunch. From a Hamas base under the hospital, to a node, outside the hospital, that may lead to it but is unknown.


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OfflineKryptos
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: sudly]
    #28551703 - 11/21/23 03:04 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Well, it's sorta known. It's an Israeli bunker. Israel built it. Then they used it as an excuse to bomb the hospital.


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OfflineBigbadwooof
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kryptos]
    #28551794 - 11/21/23 04:24 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

Kryptos said:
Well, it's sorta known. It's an Israeli bunker. Israel built it. Then they used it as an excuse to bomb the hospital.




Premeditated hospitol bombing... they've been planning on bombing the hospitol for fucking decades..

Now that's fuckin evil.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OfflineKryptos
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Bigbadwooof] * 1
    #28551799 - 11/21/23 04:27 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Nah, I think it just means IDF intel is spottier than they claim. They didn't find a Hamas command center, they just assumed it would be there.


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InvisibleTulipslave
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kryptos]
    #28551824 - 11/21/23 04:58 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

Kryptos said:
Nah, I think it just means IDF intel is spottier than they claim. They didn't find a Hamas command center, they just assumed it would be there.





What about some yellowcake uranium?


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Onlinelifeiswhatyoumake
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28551836 - 11/21/23 05:16 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Premeditated hospitol bombing... they've been planning on bombing the hospitol for fucking decades..

Now that's fuckin evil.





If Israel is right and the hospitals are used as Hamas military bases/headquarters, then how would it be evil for Israel to take them out after Hamas attacked them on October 7?


--------------------
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OfflineGenesisCorruptedS
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: lifeiswhatyoumake]
    #28551840 - 11/21/23 05:19 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

He is commenting on the theory. That Israel built the bunkers underneath the hospital. In preparation to bomb them in the future.

Which would be diabolical.
But is as yet, unsubstantiated.

I think it’s far more likely that there was an opportunity to use the tunnels underneath the hospitals. Which was taken. I don’t think the tunnels were built intentionally to have a hospital get blown up in the future.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Tulipslave]
    #28551850 - 11/21/23 05:24 PM (2 months, 5 days ago)

Should see the BBC vid on alsheefa hospital. There 1 ak some boots and a vest, then next segment the pile is different with 2 aks. Etc.

All journalist videos have to be vetted by IDF too, pretty lazy propaganda really.

Quote:

Israeli forces are still searching for the tunnels beneath the hospital that they believe Hamas fighters may have withdrawn to, perhaps with some of the hostages.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67436154.amp




In one bbc video they're gathered around a ladder entrance outside the hospital, they put a camera bot in and the tunnel is fine. Showing that whatever bombing they did didn't destroy the tunnel anyway. Which was kind of the whole point.

There's the BBC version at night with commentary on this video somewhere.





Edited by sudly (11/21/23 05:32 PM)


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OfflineKizzle
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Re: The Official Israel/Hamas War Thread. [Re: Kryptos]
    #28552150 - 11/21/23 09:02 PM (2 months, 4 days ago)

Quote:

Kryptos said:
Nah, I think it just means IDF intel is spottier than they claim. They didn't find a Hamas command center, they just assumed it would be there.



The US also had intelligence that it was being used for military purposes. The tunnels would have made it possible to move stuff out of there so who knows.


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