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InvisibleveggieM

Registered: 07/25/04
Posts: 17,501
OG Cultivator
Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: meta_mmxxii] * 12
    #28474856 - 09/19/23 11:12 AM (4 months, 6 days ago)

I don't know why people ridicule the UB Tek. The overwhelming majority of people who try it, even newbies, are able to produce the loveliest shades of blue without any trouble. That is the psilocybin and psilocin. Same as when you cut a magic mushroom it turns blue, showing you how strong and potent it is. The bags below are almost 100% psilocybin. Try and do that using a PF-Tek, almost impossible.

     

/s


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Registered: 08/04/12
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: Traveled] * 9
    #28475902 - 09/20/23 05:34 AM (4 months, 6 days ago)

Even if the bags were immaculately sterile, spore solution isn't. Syringes are not sterile, some are cleaner than others. Even if you inoculated an UB bag with clean LC or an agar wedge without having first cross contaminated the bag while opening it, you're still left with a bag filtered by micropore tape.

It can work, but why would you bother? Let's remember that this "tek" is used to produce spawn, unlike PF tek. Contaminated spawn becomes exponentially worse when introduced to bulk substrate, bacteria and mold love warm humid environments.

PF tek on the otherhand is designed for septic spore solution, it's designed with failure in mind. The nature of the PF recipe/tek is to fruit directly from the inoculated substrate, the granular rice flour keeps bacteria locked in place, allowing for the possibility of a small flush even when contaminated. Noobs do not appreciate the sheer simplistic genius of the PF tek. PF tek can be inoculated without a SAB or any consideration for aseptic technique, or previous experience.

PF tek doesn't require a pressure cooker; PF tek is inexpensive; PF tek is noob friendly; PF tek is designed for use with spore syringes; PF tek is designed to be run cheaply in volume, and is the only acceptable, reasonable introduction tek for new growers exploring the cultivation of many active species without the requirement for obtaining expensive equipment.

PF is a mush cult legend, who the fuck even started this nonsense? WillyMyco? :rofl:

I remember this emerging on the boards many moons ago as a novelty grow, and that's exactly what this is: Novelty.

Pssh!


Edited by Stipe-n Cap (09/20/23 07:52 AM)


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InvisibleBaba Yaga
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Registered: 09/13/20
Posts: 3,955
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: veggie] * 7
    #28476822 - 09/20/23 06:10 PM (4 months, 5 days ago)



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InvisiblefahtsterM
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: BeefSupremeJr] * 7
    #28478962 - 09/22/23 05:43 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Quote:

BeefSupremeJr said:
Why not frozen corn?  It already has the moisture in it.  omg. smelly, I think it's time for a new challenge!!




You musta missed my canned corn adventures… rinsed with boiling water… pc’ed for 45 minutes.  Worked but only in small jars.  It was still too wet.  Qts had waaay too much water after the pc but I grew mush with it


Edit: grew some mak 118 with Cc too lol


This was the qt after the pc


Edited by fahtster (09/22/23 05:55 PM)


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: PsillySeeEms] * 5
    #28478385 - 09/22/23 07:08 AM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Rice packs = spawn. Spawn is at least an intermediate level cultivation practice.

Rice packs = high rate of failure. This failure is largely due to the use of septic spore solution being introduced to a moist environment. Spawn is mixed at some point, whether it's directly after inoculation, during spawn run, or at very least just prior to spawning.

Bacteria has limited motility without the presence of sufficient moisture. Using too much spore solution will exacerbate bacterial infections due to increased bacterial motility throughout the medium; however, even when a single drop of MS-solution is used, the agitation of the rice prior to spawning blends the bacteria (or any other contaminant) globally throughout the packet, and then homogeneously throughout the bulk substrate at spawning. Bulk substrate is a water reservoir, contaminants love moist environments.

It's worth mentioning that any disruption of the mycelial colony via breakage will weaken the organisms ability to stave off infections, this is why spawn can stall out post shake. Stalling = contamination which has taken advantage of the weakened host. This also applies to the bulk substrate post spawning. Infected spawn will grow slowly, produce metabolites, Trichoderma, molds, and aggressive bacterial blooms.

It's at this stage when the new grower must decide which tubs to purchase, what hole configuration, what brand of coir to use, how much water is required, do I need to pasteurize? Etc, etc, etc, up to and including never ending threads asking the same questions ad nauseum. This is when I say: have you ever heard of PF tek?

UB produces failure on a biblical scale. Loss should be factored into your pricing analysis, failure means: more spore solution, more packets, time wasted, etc.

PF Tek is not spawn, it's a type of "all in one" fruiting substrate. The entire life cycle is played out in one sterile container. The design prevents cross contamination, provides adequate filtration; The substrate remains intact throughout, limiting the scope of inevitable infections. By maintaining the integrity of your media your colony will have a greater chance of producing fruit even while threatened by aggressive bacteria. This is simply not the case with UB. The granular structure of the BRF/vermiculite combo further restricts bacterial motility.

You don't know what you don't know. This is basic and self evident to anyone with an understanding of cultivation practices, the mushroom life cycle, and a basic understanding of contamination.

PF requires a pot, water, brown rice flour, and vermiculite. The one time purchase of jars is just that, one time.
These jars can be truly sterilized, can be reused hundreds of times, they're capable of maintaining sterility, and are nearly fool proof.

New growers lack the requisite experience to identify problems with spawn. Spore solution to spawn will produce contamination, the same contamination will present itself in pf jars. UB packs restrict visibility, which makes identifying contamination difficult unless absolutely obvious, Trichoderma or some other mold would be an obvious indicator to some, while others confuce with bluing.

Contamination identification is an intermediate to advanced level cultivation skill. Even when bacterial, yeast, or mold contaminations are apparent to more advanced growers, the noob will ague as though their personal identity has been violated, then proceed to expand their rekt spawn.

PF is designed to allow maximum visibility when injecting spore solution down the face of your glass jars. This visibility allows the new grower to correlate outcome with growth patterns. They quickly learn which visual identifiers correlate to either outright failure or reduced fruiting performance without sacrificing downstream resources.

No shaking, no spawning, no requirement for ninja eyes. Even a highly infected cake can push a fruit or two.

UB= contamination expansion tek. Period.


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OfflineSmellyhobbit
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Registered: 04/01/22
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: Traveled] * 4
    #28475939 - 09/20/23 06:29 AM (4 months, 6 days ago)

Ah Uncle Ben, my oldest friend. You never age and you never change. May God shine his blessing down on your oily grains.


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
A Guide for New Growers
Growth 2023 - A Year In Review

Grow more shrooms. Eat more ass. :mushroom:



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OfflineHysteria
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Registered: 02/19/23
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: PsillySeeEms] * 4
    #28477138 - 09/20/23 08:45 PM (4 months, 5 days ago)

Just talked a friend out of trying UB for his first ever grow. Gonna give him some T3s and prints and he will start with agar instead.
If you can save just one person.....


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: Stipe-n Cap] * 4
    #28477423 - 09/21/23 08:12 AM (4 months, 4 days ago)

Quote:

Stipe-n Cap said:

PF tek doesn't require a pressure cooker; PF tek is inexpensive; PF tek is noob friendly; PF tek is designed for use with spore syringes; PF tek is designed to be run cheaply in volume, and is the only acceptable, reasonable introduction tek for new growers exploring the cultivation of many active species without the requirement for obtaining expensive equipment.

PF is a mush cult legend, who the fuck even started this nonsense? WillyMyco? :rofl:

I remember this emerging on the boards many moons ago as a novelty grow, and that's exactly what this is: Novelty.

Pssh!




PF tek is the only appropriate entry level tek. There is no comparison, there's no contention, there's no competition.

Uncle bens, or whatever you want to call those rice packs, fails on every single point of analysis; Failing to see this is either the result of incompetence, or intellectual dishonesty, probably both simultaneously.

The use of spawn is by definition more advanced than fruiting from PF jars, therefore PF is far less complicated, and far more noob friendly. Failure will be higher with UB when compared to PF, making PF the obvious choice for folks who want a hassle free, simplistic, inexpensive introduction to mush cult.

If you're the sort of person who views grinding brown rice into flour as a "hassle", you're a lazy fuck and should stop breathing out of your mouth, it's unhealthy. :lol:

If producing your own BRF with a coffee grinder is too much of a pita, pre-milled brown rice flour is widely available and very inexpensive. Hydrated brown rice flour mixed with vermiculite is the superior comparative media.


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OfflineBeefSupremeJr
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: Smellyhobbit] * 4
    #28478935 - 09/22/23 05:18 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

yeah I guess when you can't beat them join them.  Why fuck around with a nearly 100% success rate when you can just buy expensive shitty rice and turn it into slime most of the time?


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OfflineBeefSupremeJr
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: B Traven] * 4
    #28478943 - 09/22/23 05:27 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Holy shit.  um.  Do you want to be my business partner?  Dude trust me I have so many bad ideas that will kind of work.


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OfflineBeefSupremeJr
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: fahtster] * 4
    #28478968 - 09/22/23 05:47 PM (4 months, 3 days ago)

oh my God I can't breathe hahhaha.  and yet, I think I would try this before I did uncle Ben bullshit. 
that's amazing man.  I'm going to try a MorningStar corn dog.  Direct fruiting it. Nobody can stop me and only God may judge me


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: ibz] * 3
    #28474825 - 09/19/23 10:43 AM (4 months, 6 days ago)

My jelousy has been activated....


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InvisibleStipe-n CapMDiscord
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: meta_mmxxii] * 3
    #28474861 - 09/19/23 11:14 AM (4 months, 6 days ago)

Nah, we don't limit speech that runs contrary to sound doctrine. You are however free to critique.

Let's keep things civil and on topic, otherwise this thread will be locked.

@veggie:  good point :lol:


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Invisiblemeta_mmxxii


Registered: 08/03/23
Posts: 598
Loc: PNW
Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: Stipe-n Cap] * 3
    #28474901 - 09/19/23 11:31 AM (4 months, 6 days ago)

Thank goodness we have you guys that DO know what you are doing.
When I first started this endeavor I read a lot about this tek and almost tried it until I found this place and read all the horror stories and decided it was not a path I wanted to go down. As I wanted to be successful. Good thing I never tried. The tek looks good on paper to newbies but is seriously flawed way to go about it.
Thanks for all your contributions TCs! You guys rock!!!


--------------------
Lots of up-to-date Teks:
Trusted Cultivators Teks

The most comprehensive explanation of things I have read on the forums:
Ultimate Tek Compendium

Another very good read for new members:
The Hitchhikers Guide
              🅃 🄴 🄰 🄼    🄲 🄻 🄸 🄽 🄶 🅆 🅁 🄰 🄿


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OfflineB Traven
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: TheLiesUnderneath] * 3
    #28475770 - 09/19/23 10:39 PM (4 months, 6 days ago)

It's not that it doesn't work. It's just that the results are awful, inconsistent, and near-impossible to improve upon in any meaningful way.

I don't know if those bags could withstand a pressure cooker cycle or not. I'm guessing maybe they could, as they're designed to be microwaved. But now you've got a pressure cooker, so you might as well save a ton of money and just cook up your own grain at that point.

The entire thing rests on the assumption that precooked rice has already been sterilized, so UBtek acolytes also wouldn't have much interest in going that route. But it is a fundamentally flawed assumption, as aseptic packaging is not the same as the sterilization cycles we run when prepping grain.


--------------------
Beware of advice- even this.


Edited by B Traven (09/19/23 10:42 PM)


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InvisibleveggieM

Registered: 07/25/04
Posts: 17,501
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: TheLiesUnderneath] * 3
    #28476744 - 09/20/23 04:57 PM (4 months, 5 days ago)

Quote:

TheLiesUnderneath said:
Does anyone here know of any way to make the uncle ben's tek work?



It does work, in a way, just very poorly, with an extremely high failure rate. Many people have tried to improve it or 'make it work', as you say, over the past 18-20 years on here, and still getting similar results to what folks on reddit and youtube are getting now. That is why this so called 'tek' was abandoned ages ago on the Shroomery, although we do still get questions about it.

I think what you are actually wanting an answer to; Are there easy ways to grow mushrooms at home with a high success rate?

Yes, of course there is. There are thousands of cultivation posts on here that contain the word 'tek'. That doesn't mean there are thousands of ways to grow cubes. In my opinion, there are just three main* ways:

Agar to grain: The traditional method, high success rate. Needs a pressure cooker, SAB (or flowhood/FFU).

PF-Tek (BRF): The 'Psilocybe Fanaticus' method, High success rate, easy, foolproof, lower yield. Needs a spore syringe, SAB preferred, PC optional.

Or a combination of those two utilizing both BRF and agar.

* There are also bottle teks and ziploc bag teks that will work great as well.

Pick a popular, highly rated, successful tek and follow it. You'll end up with plenty of mushrooms!

When choosing a tek, use common sense. Don't go with one that is highly controversial or has fallen out of favor, or doesn't work. Use the same logic that you use when buying off Amazon or Ebay, check the ratings, so to speak.

The only times a newbie fails usually, using proven teks, is they don't use sterile technique, don't follow the directions, or improvise and take shortcuts.

Some common improvs I've seen: Couldn't find 8oz wide mouth jars for PF, so used a quart jar. Instead of oats, used oatmeal. Instead of vermiculite, used perlite (they rhyme), Didn't have ffu, so taped t-shirt to box fan, etc. Little things like that will ruin a grow.

Just pick a proven tek and follow it.


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OfflineB Traven
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: blackout] * 3
    #28476844 - 09/20/23 06:26 PM (4 months, 5 days ago)

Funny, I mainly picture Americans trying to get everything they need at Wal-Mart so they can go home and noc up some drugs.

I really don't know what to say about the rest of it, except I don't give a shit about supporting peoples' slide into justification for being lazy and incompetent. Especially when the outcome is more single-use plastic waste. And yes, I'm referring to eating those stupid pouches, too. If someone can't be assed to figure out how to make rice, then I can't be assed to humor them and answer their questions.

I'm perfectly fine with there being somewhat of a barrier to entry. And not entirely comfortable with the idea of someone growing "just a little bit" of completely unknown potency, with no hope of ever achieving a calibration.

It's not at all hard to understand, but it's also something I have no interest in encouraging.


--------------------
Beware of advice- even this.


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OfflineB Traven
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: PsillySeeEms] * 3
    #28477092 - 09/20/23 08:26 PM (4 months, 5 days ago)

I used to go hard with the dehydrated refried beans. Boiling water, mix, immediately add a giant chunk of cheddar. I'd just eat it like that.

That's also how they prepare them at Taco Bell (minus the cheese part).


--------------------
Beware of advice- even this.


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OfflineB Traven
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: fahtster] * 3
    #28479499 - 09/23/23 06:14 AM (4 months, 3 days ago)

Yeah, it's cool to experiment and see what's possible, but being a pioneer with microwaveable rice bags is kind of like being those Berkeley students who developed the recipe for making crack lol


--------------------
Beware of advice- even this.


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OfflineSmellyhobbit
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Re: Uncle Ben's Tek-If you ==-+ haven't tried it yet, stop what you're doing [Re: Tiamo] * 3
    #28479817 - 09/23/23 11:26 AM (4 months, 2 days ago)

I think you could reasonably improve on the “established tek” by using a good LC and using a red hot needle to penetrate the bag.

But if you can make clean LC you’re already so far past the point of UB that it would be a waste of your time in every way.


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
A Guide for New Growers
Growth 2023 - A Year In Review

Grow more shrooms. Eat more ass. :mushroom:



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