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BeefSupremeJr
Detritivore



Registered: 11/02/11
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The OFFICIAL bone-yard of the debunked, obsolete, outdated, and white noise of mushroom cultivation. 21
#28473687 - 09/18/23 11:53 AM (7 months, 26 days ago) |
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edit 2/16/24 let sleeping dogs lie and let the dead bury their own. Ive revamped this OP because nothing much has changed, particularly with regard to my stalwart duty to filter reliable information.
Let us not befuddle our mission statement: We are here to help people grow mushrooms, not to dither endlessly in persuit of the absolute perfected and scientifically rigorously tested methods. Let us remind ourselves that what is good for the goose, is good for the gander. Let us be true in our deliberate effort to guide those who seek towards the path of least resistance.
Yes, the rules can and are presently being bent and broken, but i implore you friendos, keep it fucking simple for the masses for the power of the medicine is vastly of greater importance than our own hubris.
end edit 2/26/24 begin orginal thread
Its your old friend Beef again. for sure I have found several older pages that are similar in nature to this one but I thought it would be a cool community effort to try to pull together as much outdated and obsolete information as we can all in one place periodically.
I have tried helping several people get into this hobby and I can't tell you how much this still comes up. "but I saw on YouTube. But I read on reddit." or even "but I saw on the shroomery" (in a thread from 2004) for this reason, I almost refuse to teach anybody new. I hate fighting with friends but at some point it just always seems like they think they know better than I do.
"theres more than one way to do things, man"
Yeah but no not really. It's always the noobs who think there's 1000 ways to do things when there is little to no diviation from convention among those who know what they are doing. TC's seldom argue.
--βIn the beginner's mind there are many possibilities, but in the expert's there are few.β
yeah for sure, people use different grains, and different techniques to prepare it. But ultimately we all arrive at the same place. Some sooner than others.
for sure we use different tubs and bags but the surface conditions are the same. anyway.
I would love to be able to send people one link of "dont do's" for the betterment of all humanity.
just to name a few:
-regular misting -taping/painting tubs to reduce side-pins -fanning -closing off fae at spawning -closing off light at spawning -using grow lights or full spectrum bulbs -substrate additives like worm casings, gypsum, coffee, lime, etc. -when to introduce fae -sgfc -gloveboxes -no pc venting (its a thing and yes, you do need to do it) -invincible endospores (myth--as per stipes research)
I realize a lot of this is extremely outdated but fuck me, people are still doing it.
i'm sure everyone can think of many more, but please feel free to explain your opinion on why these things have become obsolete. I do think theres widespread consensus on convention around here so lets galvanize it for 2023. Convention is always in flux. Books never evolve.
Edited by BeefSupremeJr (02/26/24 04:25 PM)
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DharmaForKarma
Tub monkey


Registered: 04/24/20
Posts: 565
Last seen: 1 month, 29 days
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: BeefSupremeJr] 1
#28473727 - 09/18/23 12:41 PM (7 months, 26 days ago) |
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A perennial favorite is low temperature drying and its kin. Sun drying, blowing air with a fan, drying in the fridge, and more.
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MicroMycelium
Curious Optimizer


Registered: 06/06/23
Posts: 461
Loc: Probably at work
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: DharmaForKarma]
#28473735 - 09/18/23 12:46 PM (7 months, 26 days ago) |
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Quote:
DharmaForKarma said: A perennial favorite is low temperature drying and its kin. Sun drying, blowing air with a fan, drying in the fridge, and more.
I was under the impression sunlight and O2 exposure is what degrades actives so while temp is arbitrary, letting them sun dry/dehydrate isnβt optimal?
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BeefSupremeJr
Detritivore



Registered: 11/02/11
Posts: 7,605
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: MicroMycelium]
#28473754 - 09/18/23 01:03 PM (7 months, 26 days ago) |
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dehydrator. 24 hours (max) . 158 degrees. freeze drying looks rad but damn theyre expensive af.
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BeefSupremeJr
Detritivore



Registered: 11/02/11
Posts: 7,605
Loc: 29.9792Β° N, 31.1342Β° E
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: BeefSupremeJr]
#28473757 - 09/18/23 01:05 PM (7 months, 26 days ago) |
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i dried some apes in the sun a while back bc my dehydrator power switch broke. i dunno. theyre still trip your dick off.
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Floret
Unmodify everything

Registered: 01/02/23
Posts: 275
Loc: underneath the water
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: BeefSupremeJr] 1
#28474303 - 09/18/23 09:16 PM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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Is this specific to cubes? Aren't substrate additives used for exotics.
-------------------- LAGM 2024
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CocaineBuffet
Stranger


Registered: 08/29/19
Posts: 3,758
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: Floret] 4
#28474306 - 09/18/23 09:19 PM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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Keeping grain in the dark until fully colonized
Waiting for the sub to be fully colonized before fruiting conditions
Uncle Bens!
Spores to grain
Spores to LC
Spores to penis
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JXAllen
Cannalyst


Registered: 08/06/21
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: Floret]
#28474358 - 09/18/23 09:54 PM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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I was going to say the same thing. Most of this seems like cube specific "outdated" or "never should have been" tek info. As far as I'm aware, SGFC is still the go to for Pan Cakes. And I don't know that I needed it, but worm castings and coffee are part of the Pan cake mix. I also still add gypsum to my Coco/verm. Is that not necessary or helpful? If not, why was it in there in the first place?
-------------------- There are only 10 types of people in the world, those that understand binary and those that do not. Cultures I'm workin on
 
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Eclipse3130
Servant of the Fungi



Registered: 10/06/13
Posts: 6,279
Loc: PNW
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: JXAllen]
#28474640 - 09/19/23 07:36 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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A lot of them still exist and are used today 
Pasteurizing coir is a big one a lot of people still use bucket Tek wasting their time boiling water
"Fruiting conditions"
People trying to be sterile making tubs
People that stay in low 70s degrees because scared of contams which is somewhat true, higher temps will help contam grow quicker - but if you're clean it's beneficial for cubes to be in tropical temperature and will also help them grow quicker, some strains like PE love to blob in low 70s as well.
"PCS Kill everything and any contamination is your fault" not true. A PC cycle will kill a large majority, different grains have different bio burden loads. Simple logic is higher bio burden load going in, higher load coming out. I've never had great luck with producers pride oats
List goes on
-------------------- "In The Material World One seeks retirement and grows Old In The Magical World One seeks Enlightenment and grows Wiser In The Miraculous World One seeks nothing and grows Lighter As we all tread the Homeward Path we will explore many Realms And one day... we will all Realize that all experiences are Simply Different ways in which The All-That Is Perceives Itself"
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Traveled
Wired



Registered: 08/23/23
Posts: 110
Loc: P2X-3YZ
Last seen: 1 day, 12 hours
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: Eclipse3130]
#28474646 - 09/19/23 07:48 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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As a noob I ll ask about the PC venting.
Beef in your list the mention "PC venting (do it)" I didn't fully understand the myth is about doing it or not doing it ?
CocaineBuffet +1 for the UncleBens, when you start scrolling the web about mush cult you find a lot of supporters for this pseudo tek and they argue the Shroomery is critical about it because of jealousy. I have tried it when I get my first MSS as well as a few grain jar and PF cakes, and suspense UB rice bags all contaminated but just one jar did and none of the cakes QED.
-------------------- Let's all love Lain BeefSupremeJr Hitchhikers Guide to the Shroomery π
π΄ π° πΌ π² π» πΈ π½ πΆ π
π
π° πΏ
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DERRAYLD
Constructus


Registered: 05/13/02
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: Traveled]
#28474649 - 09/19/23 07:51 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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You do realize we don't need to be jealous of failure right? I think most of us have multiple successful grows, way beyond what UB can offer.
Venting is not a myth, you need to remove the air in the PC and replace it with steam to allow the temperature to be reached throughout the pc.
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BeefSupremeJr
Detritivore



Registered: 11/02/11
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: DERRAYLD] 5
#28474674 - 09/19/23 08:14 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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Yes venting is a thing. Bod wrote a whole sciency thing on it.
Apparently PC'ing is a lot more effective than previously believed, stipe wrote a whole sciency thing on it i can barely understand.
SGFC still used fot pans? I thought the water tub pretty much replaced the sgfc because its just better at doing the same job.
yes Im talking sub additives for cubes. let us restrict our discussion to cubes, safely assuming most noobs are not going to take a shot at exotics and the majority of exotic growers have many cube grows undet their belt.
spores to penis is a thing i will never quit doing and is in fact, the only use for a spore print once youve made a successful germ plate with it.
Edited by BeefSupremeJr (09/19/23 08:42 AM)
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Traveled
Wired



Registered: 08/23/23
Posts: 110
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: BeefSupremeJr]
#28474698 - 09/19/23 08:40 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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Quote:
BeefSupremeJr said: Yes venting is a thing. Bod wrote a whole sciency thing on it.
Apparently PC'ing is a lot more effective than previously believed, stipe wrote a whole sciency thing on it i can barely understand.
SGFC still used fot pans? I thought the water tub pretty much replaced the sgfc because its just better at doing the same job.
yes Im talking sub additives for cubes. let us restrict our discussion to cubes, safely assuming most noobs are going to take a shot at exotics and the majority of exotic growers have many cube grows undet their belt.
spores to penis is a thing i will never quit doing and is in fact, the only use for a spore print once youve made a successful germ plate with it.
Yeah I was assuming venting is mandatory, but since you put it in a don't do list you made me doubt. (you did put (do it) so my bad)
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BeefSupremeJr
Detritivore



Registered: 11/02/11
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: Traveled] 1
#28474704 - 09/19/23 08:45 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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yeah I see how that could be confusing I will go back and edit it when I get a chance.
fans have no place in this hobby unless to assist drying grain.
humidifiers are equally worthless
Hydrogen peroxide. That shits not even good to clean out a wound as it basically does more harm than good.
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,843
Loc: Canada
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: BeefSupremeJr] 1
#28474734 - 09/19/23 09:12 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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UV-C; Peroxide; Ozone; Automated tubs; The idea that manure substrates are beneficial for cubes; The idea that higher nutrient content (ammendments/nootz) in substrate boosts performance/increases yield; Sugar LC 
I'll edit with a few more after I'm done stuffing my pie hole.
Pasteurization of coir/verm; Gypsum; Fanning; The idea that shroomery is jelous of noob stupidity  The idea that spawn is somehow super pasteurized instead of sterilized; Caramelized agar; Low temps (160Β°F/71Β°C) negatively effects potency; The distinction between fruiting conditions and spawning; The use of Lysol; Contaminated tubs destroying grow areas; Bluing signifies potency; Aborts are more potent than other fruit; Soaking fully colonized grain spawn before spawning; Wet grains cause bacteria (wet grains just exacerbate existing bacterial infection); Coffee grounds or liquid coffee as an additive.
Some are duplicates from your existing list. I'm sure I can get some more with a bit of thought.
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BeefSupremeJr
Detritivore



Registered: 11/02/11
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#28474736 - 09/19/23 09:15 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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ozone is a new one for me. what was the idea there?
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Traveled
Wired



Registered: 08/23/23
Posts: 110
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: Stipe-n Cap]
#28474744 - 09/19/23 09:23 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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Maybe manure is not better but it seem a good alternative to coco coir when you already have the horses in your garden.
Correct me if I'm wrong please.
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BeefSupremeJr
Detritivore



Registered: 11/02/11
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: BeefSupremeJr] 1
#28474748 - 09/19/23 09:27 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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heres one that come up on reddit constantly. its an elaboration on painting your tub with spraypaint to stop side pinning:
light having *anything* to do with side pins. I just read a comment where someone said "wrap your all-in-one bag with an ace bandage to stop the side pins. for fucks sake.
ill just say this a few times to get the point across:
side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. side-pinning has nothing to do with light. 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sidepinning is a result of fucked up tub settings.
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BeefSupremeJr
Detritivore



Registered: 11/02/11
Posts: 7,605
Loc: 29.9792Β° N, 31.1342Β° E
Last seen: 15 minutes, 40 seconds
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: Traveled]
#28474751 - 09/19/23 09:29 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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Quote:
Traveled said: Maybe manure is not better but it seem a good alternative to coco coir when you already have the horses in your garden.
Correct me if I'm wrong please.
cooking shit in your house is not a good alternative to convention no matter what. for outdoor grows id be all over it but thats just my opinion.
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,843
Loc: Canada
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Re: outdated and obsolete information 2023 edition [Re: BeefSupremeJr]
#28474757 - 09/19/23 09:33 AM (7 months, 25 days ago) |
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Quote:
BeefSupremeJr said: ozone is a new one for me. what was the idea there?
Used as a "sterilizing" agent.
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