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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: CreonAntigone]
#28531086 - 11/05/23 07:39 PM (2 months, 21 days ago) |
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My issue with Plato is very simple to explain. Are you homo sapiens? Are you the body of Karl Linnaeus, the creator of the term Homo sapiens and the (symbolic) taxonomic type specimen for Homo sapiens?
Quote:
Linnaeus's remains constitute the type specimen for the species Homo sapiens following the International Code of Zoological Nomenclature, since the sole specimen that he is known to have examined was himself.
If you are not the body, then how are you Homo sapiens?
The Platonic logic runs through this clearly.
It is semblance. It is probability. It is uncertainty. It is making uncertainty into a fraudulent certainty, an hypostatized 'certainty' that is only a thing treated as if it were certainty. It is like sorcery. It is as if it were reasonable to treat the sole fact of a negativity as a positivity. It is to treat darkness as a thing itself other than the absence of light, which is an illusion as a thing itself. The same thing is with 'cold.' The reality is only heat. The absence of heat makes 'cold,' but cold is not a positivity. To treat these 'negatives' as positivities is what I call the fraud of words of Platonic epistemology.
I'm not saying words have no meaning. I'm saying hypostatized singularities which are treated as truthfully efficacious, as actualities resembling realities, is an easy, manipulative game. And it is a fraud of reason. It is the worm of reason. It is the basis of reductionism. It is exactly what interprets what it calls 'paganism' as the thing called 'idol-making,' and 'polytheism.' These things are not able to be truthfully considered according to singular concepts. It is exactly that they must be conceived in their plurality that the Platonic epistemology must call crucial components, again, of what it only calls 'paganism' (with a singular word and concept), 'idolizations.' It is the soil that grows the very appearance of what are 'idols.' It strips them from their identity of part of a plurality and separates each component, isolates it and treats this as the reality, and it says it is self evident.
-------------------- ☆✮★⋆I ♡ the music, not the bling⋆★✮☆ https://rictornorton.co.uk/eighteen/1730news.htm 𝔦𝔫 𝔫𝔬𝔪𝔦𝔫𝔢 𝔟𝔬𝔫𝔦 𝔭𝔢𝔰𝔰𝔦𝔪𝔦 𝔪𝔞𝔩𝔬𝔯𝔲𝔪 𝔣𝔦𝔲𝔫𝔱 May I ask what your bud type is? ❂ LXIV⁶⁴AMOR ❂Profundæ lātissimæque vēritātēs amandæ sunt, sīc ideo necesse est: rēs maxima amanda est; pōtus sit is bene scīmus cum nōs id adeō explet, cum altō hīc movet īmus: rēs maxima omnis amor.
Edited by Blue_Lux (11/05/23 07:48 PM)
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: Blue_Lux]
#28532071 - 11/06/23 05:54 PM (2 months, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
It strips them from their identity of part of a plurality and separates each component, isolates it and treats this as the reality, and it says it is self evident.
And this is exactly what has happened to the spiritual collective we come from, from Greece and Rome. Democracy is a spiritual recognition. Platonism is at the core of what isolates people themselves, because they are considered prima facie individuals. The reality is the opposite. People are only individuals after the fact of a plural inner reality, which consists of other individuals - their parents, family, friends, inspirations. When I see inside myself to who I am I see many people. I see my brother. I see my spouse. I see my father, mother. Hell, I see Friedrich Nietzsche. I see Cicero. I see Walt Whitman. I see Jean Paul Sartre. I see jiddu Krishnamurti. I see all the words I have resonated with from others. All this added up makes 'who i am.' But "who i am" is not an object. There is never an actual object of myself as singular that EVER becomes necessitated in existence by any series of inferences concerning such a thing. This is the illusion of Descartes' cogito ergo sum, and exactly the basis of Kant's refutation of Leibniz' argumentum a contingentia mundi, which of course Sartre explicated in his phenomenology. The simple idea is as follows: words belong to everyone and nobody simultaneously. Notice, we are only individuals with words. This is why Terence Mckenna was always saying "The world is actually made of language." However, language can be hijacked, and the subject, the thinker, the I, can be subtly made into an object itself distinct from the phenomenality of the person themselves. This is an illusion. And this is furthermore why probably the most significant aspect of Platonism in a social sense is 'friendship.' The Epicureans were divided about what exactly friendship is. Martial, the famous poet, made a very interesting statement. He called the Roman society that of "cultus amicitia praetextata." I think this "worship of adolescent friendshup" is exactly part of what birthed neoplatonism in Rome.
-------------------- ☆✮★⋆I ♡ the music, not the bling⋆★✮☆ https://rictornorton.co.uk/eighteen/1730news.htm 𝔦𝔫 𝔫𝔬𝔪𝔦𝔫𝔢 𝔟𝔬𝔫𝔦 𝔭𝔢𝔰𝔰𝔦𝔪𝔦 𝔪𝔞𝔩𝔬𝔯𝔲𝔪 𝔣𝔦𝔲𝔫𝔱 May I ask what your bud type is? ❂ LXIV⁶⁴AMOR ❂Profundæ lātissimæque vēritātēs amandæ sunt, sīc ideo necesse est: rēs maxima amanda est; pōtus sit is bene scīmus cum nōs id adeō explet, cum altō hīc movet īmus: rēs maxima omnis amor.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: CreonAntigone]
#28532090 - 11/06/23 06:09 PM (2 months, 20 days ago) |
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The second to last time I did DMT I became convinced that people have already in their brains a neurological configuration ready to organize information from the senses in conformity with the potentiality of recogizing the existence of others. This is to say, our brains are equipped fundamentally to recognize others' existences. I believe furthermore that this can be shown neuroscientifically, but nobody has researched it. It means, essentially, solipsism is neurologically disproved. I think this is a crucial awareness. What made me see this was ... I was looking at these giants all around me, made of lines and shapes of different colors against a black backdrop of 3d space in the DMT experience. I cannot say exactly what made me think this, but it was an epiphany, and I want to know if it can indeed be verified with neuroscience. But I digress.
-------------------- ☆✮★⋆I ♡ the music, not the bling⋆★✮☆ https://rictornorton.co.uk/eighteen/1730news.htm 𝔦𝔫 𝔫𝔬𝔪𝔦𝔫𝔢 𝔟𝔬𝔫𝔦 𝔭𝔢𝔰𝔰𝔦𝔪𝔦 𝔪𝔞𝔩𝔬𝔯𝔲𝔪 𝔣𝔦𝔲𝔫𝔱 May I ask what your bud type is? ❂ LXIV⁶⁴AMOR ❂Profundæ lātissimæque vēritātēs amandæ sunt, sīc ideo necesse est: rēs maxima amanda est; pōtus sit is bene scīmus cum nōs id adeō explet, cum altō hīc movet īmus: rēs maxima omnis amor.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: CreonAntigone]
#28532129 - 11/06/23 06:35 PM (2 months, 20 days ago) |
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It could be something like a reflection as this that made Nietzsche sign his name when he was dying as 'Dionysus', because he embodied that logos.
-------------------- ☆✮★⋆I ♡ the music, not the bling⋆★✮☆ https://rictornorton.co.uk/eighteen/1730news.htm 𝔦𝔫 𝔫𝔬𝔪𝔦𝔫𝔢 𝔟𝔬𝔫𝔦 𝔭𝔢𝔰𝔰𝔦𝔪𝔦 𝔪𝔞𝔩𝔬𝔯𝔲𝔪 𝔣𝔦𝔲𝔫𝔱 May I ask what your bud type is? ❂ LXIV⁶⁴AMOR ❂Profundæ lātissimæque vēritātēs amandæ sunt, sīc ideo necesse est: rēs maxima amanda est; pōtus sit is bene scīmus cum nōs id adeō explet, cum altō hīc movet īmus: rēs maxima omnis amor.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: CreonAntigone]
#28535014 - 11/09/23 01:10 AM (2 months, 18 days ago) |
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I celebrate myself, and sing myself, And what I assume you shall assume, For every atom belonging to me as good belongs to you.
...
My tongue, every atom of my blood, form’d from this soil, this air, Born here of parents born here from parents the same, and their parents the same, I, now thirty-seven years old in perfect health begin, Hoping to cease not till death.
...
There was never any more inception than there is now, Nor any more youth or age than there is now, And will never be any more perfection than there is now, Nor any more heaven or hell than there is now.
Urge and urge and urge, Always the procreant urge of the world.
Out of the dimness opposite equals advance, always substance and increase, always sex, Always a knit of identity, always distinction, always a breed of life.
To elaborate is no avail, learn’d and unlearn’d feel that it is so.
...
Clear and sweet is my soul, and clear and sweet is all that is not my soul.
Lack one lacks both, and the unseen is proved by the seen, Till that becomes unseen and receives proof in its turn.
... Has any one supposed it lucky to be born? I hasten to inform him or her it is just as lucky to die, and I know it.
I pass death with the dying and birth with the new-wash’d babe, and am not contain’d between my hat and boots, And peruse manifold objects, no two alike and every one good, The earth good and the stars good, and their adjuncts all good.
I am not an earth nor an adjunct of an earth, I am the mate and companion of people, all just as immortal and fathomless as myself, (They do not know how immortal, but I know.)
...
A child said What is the grass? fetching it to me with full hands; How could I answer the child? I do not know what it is any more than he.
.....
Oxen that rattle the yoke and chain or halt in the leafy shade, what is that you express in your eyes? It seems to me more than all the print I have read in my life.
My tread scares the wood-drake and wood-duck on my distant and day-long ramble, They rise together, they slowly circle around.
I believe in those wing’d purposes, And acknowledge red, yellow, white, playing within me, And consider green and violet and the tufted crown intentional, And do not call the tortoise unworthy because she is not something else, And the jay in the woods never studied the gamut, yet trills pretty well to me, And the look of the bay mare shames silliness out of me.
...
What is commonest, cheapest, nearest, easiest, is Me, Me going in for my chances, spending for vast returns, Adorning myself to bestow myself on the first that will take me, Not asking the sky to come down to my good will, Scattering it freely forever.
....
A learner with the simplest, a teacher of the thoughtfullest, A novice beginning yet experient of myriads of seasons, Of every hue and caste am I, of every rank and religion, A farmer, mechanic, artist, gentleman, sailor, quaker, Prisoner, fancy-man, rowdy, lawyer, physician, priest.
I resist any thing better than my own diversity, Breathe the air but leave plenty after me, And am not stuck up, and am in my place.
... These are really the thoughts of all men in all ages and lands, they are not original with me, If they are not yours as much as mine they are nothing, or next to nothing, If they are not the riddle and the untying of the riddle they are nothing, If they are not just as close as they are distant they are nothing.
This is the grass that grows wherever the land is and the water is, This the common air that bathes the globe.
... There is that in me—I do not know what it is—but I know it is in me.
Wrench’d and sweaty—calm and cool then my body becomes, I sleep—I sleep long.
I do not know it—it is without name—it is a word unsaid, It is not in any dictionary, utterance, symbol.
Something it swings on more than the earth I swing on, To it the creation is the friend whose embracing awakes me.
Perhaps I might tell more. Outlines! I plead for my brothers and sisters.
Do you see O my brothers and sisters? It is not chaos or death—it is form, union, plan—it is eternal life—it is Happiness.
...
The past and present wilt—I have fill’d them, emptied them, And proceed to fill my next fold of the future.
Listener up there! what have you to confide to me? Look in my face while I snuff the sidle of evening, (Talk honestly, no one else hears you, and I stay only a minute longer.)
Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes.)
-Walt whitman, song of myself
-------------------- ☆✮★⋆I ♡ the music, not the bling⋆★✮☆ https://rictornorton.co.uk/eighteen/1730news.htm 𝔦𝔫 𝔫𝔬𝔪𝔦𝔫𝔢 𝔟𝔬𝔫𝔦 𝔭𝔢𝔰𝔰𝔦𝔪𝔦 𝔪𝔞𝔩𝔬𝔯𝔲𝔪 𝔣𝔦𝔲𝔫𝔱 May I ask what your bud type is? ❂ LXIV⁶⁴AMOR ❂Profundæ lātissimæque vēritātēs amandæ sunt, sīc ideo necesse est: rēs maxima amanda est; pōtus sit is bene scīmus cum nōs id adeō explet, cum altō hīc movet īmus: rēs maxima omnis amor.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: CreonAntigone]
#28536548 - 11/10/23 03:18 AM (2 months, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
Medeæ fuga , P. Ovidius Naso
Tandem vipereis Ephyren Pirenida pennis contigit. Hic aevo veteres mortalia primo corpora vulgarunt pluvialibus edita fungis. Sed postquam Colchis arsit nova nupta venenis, flagrantemque domum regis mare vidit utrumque, sanguine natorum perfunditur impius ensis, ultaque se male mater Iasonis effugit arma
At last on dragon wings she arrived to the fountain of Corinth. Here the ancients divulged to all mortal bodies for the first time by rising mushrooms from the rains.
"Although Ovid enjoyed enormous popularity during his lifetime, the emperor Augustus exiled him to Tomis, the capital of the newly-organised province of Moesia, on the Black Sea, where he remained for the last nine or ten years of his life. Ovid himself attributed his banishment to a "poem and a mistake", but his reluctance to disclose specifics has resulted in much speculation among scholars."
-------------------- ☆✮★⋆I ♡ the music, not the bling⋆★✮☆ https://rictornorton.co.uk/eighteen/1730news.htm 𝔦𝔫 𝔫𝔬𝔪𝔦𝔫𝔢 𝔟𝔬𝔫𝔦 𝔭𝔢𝔰𝔰𝔦𝔪𝔦 𝔪𝔞𝔩𝔬𝔯𝔲𝔪 𝔣𝔦𝔲𝔫𝔱 May I ask what your bud type is? ❂ LXIV⁶⁴AMOR ❂Profundæ lātissimæque vēritātēs amandæ sunt, sīc ideo necesse est: rēs maxima amanda est; pōtus sit is bene scīmus cum nōs id adeō explet, cum altō hīc movet īmus: rēs maxima omnis amor.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,796
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: Blue_Lux]
#28573722 - 12/07/23 11:32 PM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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The ancients took shrooms, that's pretty well noted throughout history due to availability and idols of worship etc.
Where's the revelation in that?
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: sudly]
#28573729 - 12/07/23 11:39 PM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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Feel free to read.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: Blue_Lux]
#28573732 - 12/07/23 11:41 PM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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As the author of this thread you should be able to provide some sort of concise summary on what the revelation behind recognising historical societies use of psychedelics like psilocybin are?
Or share whatever post has the context.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: sudly]
#28573733 - 12/07/23 11:43 PM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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Random instances mean nothing. Western significance means something much greater. and all that is written in this thread and in this one. We speak a Roman language, not Aztec.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28207631
This is more than a summary. Summary is nonsense. Details are what matter.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: Blue_Lux]
#28573734 - 12/07/23 11:50 PM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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So Romans and Greeks prolly did shrooms too, and ataraxia or serenity is one possible aspect of such experiences.
Are you simply promoting or suggesting mass shroom consumption?
While I agree on their potential, I think that in modern times their benefit is most profound to new users in therapeutic environments where they can be trip sat and guided through the experience so as not to misinterpret their drug induced experiences.
Giving 1000 people shrooms who have never had them before would surely lead to beneficial results for many, a majority even, but not all, because awareness of things like LD 50s and the importance of environment and support of anyone in the scenario are vital to be aware of for a good experience.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: sudly]
#28573735 - 12/07/23 11:51 PM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: sudly]
#28573736 - 12/07/23 11:53 PM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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" The kykeon ceremony was to bring people together and establish a sense of community with more hope in life and death, as Cicero states in De Legibus "cum spe meliore moriendi," for "dying with better hope." "
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: sudly]
#28573738 - 12/07/23 11:56 PM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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Benjamin Franklin cited Cicero as the inspiration behind the Declaration of Independence. What was Cicero inspired by? The greatest achievement of the Athenians, Eleusis.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: Blue_Lux]
#28573741 - 12/08/23 12:03 AM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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I mean fair, Kykeon probably had ergot in it.
Quote:
What were the Eleusinian Mysteries?
Eleusis is a town just northwest of Athens, Greece, an agricultural society out in the countryside, and a setting ripe for a cult to Demeter, the goddess of the harvest and the bringer of a bountiful crop. More importantly, it’s a place where wheat or barley likely grew, which are the probable sources of the psychedelic substance in the kykeon, the psychedelic drink consumed during the Mysteries.
Meaning “to stir, or mix” in Greek, the kykeon was thought to have contained an ergot fungus from the barley plant, a substance similar in structure to today’s LSD. There is some debate as to whether the kykeon was psychedelic or not, but famed chemist Albert Hofmann, most known for discovering LSD, makes a strong case for the ancient Greeks having access to this psychedelic fungus.
https://pappaspost.com/psychedelics-in-ancient-greece/
Quote:
Analysis of Lolium tenulentum in my laboratory and an extended botanical, chemical, and pharmacological investigation by |. Katz* showed that the plant itself contains no alkaloids nor does it possess any pharmacological activity. But the Lolium spe cies (L. tanulentum and L. perenne) are notoriously prey to the Claviceos fungus. The psychotropic
reputation of darnel must therefore be attributed to its parasitic infection by ergot. Samples of ergot grown on L. taenulentum and L. perenne collected in Germany, France, and Switzerland showed large variation in their alkaloidal composition. Some contained substantial amounts of ergonovine together with alkaloids of the ergotamine and ergotoxine group.° A species of ergot growing on darnel may have existed in ancient Greece that contained mainly hallucinogenic alkaloids of ergot such as we have found in ergot of Paspalum.
In conclusion | now answer W asson’s question. The answer is yes, Early Man in ancient Greece could have arrived at an hallucinogen from ergot. He might have done this from ergot growing on wheat or barley. An easier way would have been to use the ergot growing on the common wild grass Paspalum. This is based on the assumption that the herbalists of ancient Greece were as intelligent and resourceful as the herbalists of preC onquest M exico.
Albert HOFMANN
https://archive.org/details/albert-hoffman-the-road-to-eleusis-unveiling-the-secret-of-the-mysteries/page/11/mode/2up?view=theater
Regarding your comments,
Quote:
THE REASON WHY THE SECRET OF KYKEON IS NOT PUBLISHED AS ULTIMATELY, CONCLUSIVELY PSYCHEDELIC MUSHROOMS IS DUE TO THE FOLLOWING: THE NECESSARY CONSEQUENCES ARE FACTS TOO GREAT TO AFFIRM; THAT EVERYONE HAS BEEN LIED TO AND THAT THE CRIMINALIZATION OF PSILOCYBIN CONTAINING MUSHROOMS IS A CRIME AGAINST HUMANITY. IT OUGHT TO BE PROTECTED UNDER THE 1ST AMENDMENT OF THE USA, FREEDOM OF RELIGION AND SPIRITUALITY CLAUSE IN THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES. THE REAL REASON THIS HISTORY IS NOT TAUGHT IS BECAUSE IT EXPOSES THE LIE OF CHRISTIANITY AND THE LIES WE HAVE ALL BEEN TAUGHT ABOUT ANCIENT ROME, GREECE, PAGANISM, OUR WESTERN HERITAGE, BIRTHRIGHT, SEXUALITY AND PLACE IN HISTORY
I don't think religion really has the ultimate say in why it's banned because it's the pharmaceutical lobbyists that don't want it around, one, things like THC replace a miriad of opiate based medications and would undercut their manufacturers share of the market, and two, the antiaddictive effects of psychedelics like psilocybin can cessate the use of nicotine, undermining the monopoly of ciggarette companies.
Modern problems have modern causes, and here I think it's frankly the case that medications like THC and psilocybin or ergot would outcompete or hold strong competition to the market against over the counter and prescription drugs.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: sudly]
#28573743 - 12/08/23 12:09 AM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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"If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants"
What you have posted is debunked. I prefer the words of people who actually gave a shit.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: sudly]
#28573744 - 12/08/23 12:12 AM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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Kykeon most certainly was psilocybin mushrooms. Just because I do not have some corrupt university owned by oligarchs does not mean logic and rhetoric now gets to be thrown out the window because it wasn't carefully curated and posted in some censored journal.
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Blue_Lux
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: sudly]
#28573747 - 12/08/23 12:15 AM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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I'm not responding to you anymore, because you are not serious and you clearly don't actually care. I already answered everything you are saying. You're just picking now like a psychopath. Kykeon will change that. Without it we would not have America. It is still the only answer, as Terence Mckenna spoke until his dying breath.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,796
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: Blue_Lux]
#28573751 - 12/08/23 12:19 AM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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I mean, what difference does it make if Kykeon was ergot or psilocybin?
I agree that psilocybin use should be a first ammendment right across the world, I just think that some of the reason behind it being unavailable is profit driven lobbying from pharmaceutical corporations that pay off legislators.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Kiwi89
Stranger
Registered: 06/16/20
Posts: 648
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Re: Concise version of Psilocybe ser. is Kykeon - Evidence [Re: Blue_Lux] 1
#28573772 - 12/08/23 01:01 AM (1 month, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
Blue_Lux said: I'm not responding to you anymore, because you are not serious and you clearly don't actually care. I already answered everything you are saying. You're just picking now like a psychopath. Kykeon will change that. Without it we would not have America. It is still the only answer, as Terence Mckenna spoke until his dying breath.
So I am guessing mushroom consumption has enabled you to keep this level headed calm communication style. Is this what you want from your brave new society, so much for mushroom enlightenment.
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