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Offlinefft2
journeyman

Registered: 06/15/04
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Last seen: 12 years, 24 days
Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points
    #2843713 - 06/30/04 03:32 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Bush's Rating Falls to Its Lowest Point, New Survey Finds
by Adam Nagourney and Janet Elder
Link to Article
President Bush's job approval rating has fallen to the lowest level of his presidency, according to the latest New York Times/CBS News poll. The poll found Americans stiffening their opposition to the Iraq war, worried that the invasion could invite domestic terrorist attacks and skeptical about whether the White House has been fully truthful about the war or about abuses at the Abu Ghraib prison.

A majority of respondents in the poll, conducted before yesterday's transfer of power to an interim Iraqi government, said that the war was not worth its cost in American lives and that the Bush administration did not have a clear plan to restore order to Iraq.

The survey, which showed Mr. Bush's approval rating at 42 percent, also found that nearly 40 percent of Americans say they do not have an opinion about Senator John Kerry, the likely Democratic presidential nominee, despite what have been both parties' earliest and most expensive television advertising campaigns.

Among those who do have an opinion, Mr. Kerry is disliked more than he is liked. More than 50 percent of respondents said that Mr. Kerry says what he thinks voters want to hear, suggesting that Mr. Bush has had success in portraying his opponent as a flip-flopper.

Americans were more likely to believe that Mr. Bush would do a better job than Mr. Kerry would in steering the nation through a foreign crisis, and protecting it from future terrorist attacks. Support for Mr. Bush's abilities in those areas has declined in recent months, but the findings suggest that Americans are more comfortable entrusting their security to a president they know than a challenger who remains relatively unknown.

Even so, the poll was scattered with warning flags for Mr. Bush, and there was compelling evidence that his decision to take the nation to war against Iraq has left him in a precarious political position.

As he heads into the fall election, Mr. Bush appears to have much riding on the transfer of power in Baghdad yesterday. The 42 percent of Americans who say they approve of the way Mr. Bush is handling his job is the lowest such figure in a Times/CBS News survey since the beginning of Mr. Bush's presidency in January 2001; 51 percent say they disapprove.

Over the past 25 years, according to pollsters, presidents with job approval ratings below 50 percent in the spring of election years have generally gone on to lose. Mr. Bush's father had a 34 percent job approval rating at this time in 1992.

Similarly, 45 percent said they had an unfavorable opinion of Mr. Bush himself, again the most negative measure the Times/CBS Poll has found since he took office. And 57 percent say the country is going in the wrong direction, another measure used by pollsters as a barometer of discontent with an incumbent.

Yet the survey found little evidence that Mr. Kerry has been able to take advantage of the president's difficulties, even though Mr. Kerry has spent $60 million on television advertising over the past three months.

Nationwide, Mr. Kerry has the support of 45 percent of registered voters, with Mr. Bush supported by 44 percent. When Ralph Nader, who is running as an independent, is included, he draws 5 percent, leaving 42 percent for Mr. Kerry and 43 percent for Mr. Bush

In the 18 states viewed by both parties as the most competitive ? and thus the subject of the most advertising expenditures and visits by the candidates ? the race was equally tight. Forty-five percent of voters in those states said they would support Mr. Kerry, and 43 percent said they would back Mr. Bush. Indeed, on a host of measures, the poll found little difference in public opinion between the nation as a whole and that of voters in the competitive states.

The tight race indicated by the poll reflects how aides to both Mr. Bush and Mr. Kerry have described the overall state of play for weeks. But other polls have, at times, shown Mr. Kerry or Mr. Bush bumping ahead. A CBS News poll taken last month found Mr. Kerry with a lead of 49 percent to 41 percent over Mr. Bush.

The nationwide poll of 1,053 adults, including 875 registered voters, was taken by telephone June 23 to June 27. It has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.

For all the signs of opposition to the war, Americans appear prepared to stay in Iraq until the situation becomes stable. The poll found that 54 percent of respondents said that the United States should remain in Iraq "as long as it takes," while 40 percent said the United States should withdraw "as soon as possible."

:smile:


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OnlineLearyfan
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: fft2]
    #2843823 - 06/30/04 04:04 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

It's going to keep dropping. By November Nader will have a better shot at the Presidency.





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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
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Registered: 02/09/01
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: fft2]
    #2843841 - 06/30/04 04:07 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I saw on the news last night were it said that no matter how low Bush's rating gets, Kerry just can't seem to beat him. Doesn't really matter who wins, they're both going to drive the voters off of a cliff. The only difference will be the speed.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

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"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: fft2]
    #2845171 - 06/30/04 10:58 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Kerry's quite annoying, sad that he was the one chosen as the democratic canidate. I don't know whether or not he has strong views, but he definitely hasn't shown any. He constantly changes his opinion and won't assert a strong viewpoint on anything. I would be willing to bet that if he were strong in his viewpoints and opinions, he would have no trouble beating Bush, but right now most people are voting for him because, well, he isn't Bush

My vote goes to Nader


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Offlinejong21
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Registered: 05/28/03
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: Ravus]
    #2845221 - 06/30/04 11:08 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

A vote for Nader is a complete waste. Either Bush or Kerry will be president next year. Pick the lesser of two evils (whichever you believe that to be). In my opinion, voting for Nader just means you don't want to be a real part of the American political process.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: jong21]
    #2845249 - 06/30/04 11:14 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Why should I vote for the lesser of two evils? Neither of them reflect my opinions at all, both will continue the War on Drugs, will continue to take away our rights. Kerry, while I hate to say it, is a waffler, and while I would rather have him than Bush in office, he hasn't nearly earned my vote. It's possible I will vote Kerry if he finally steps up and states some actual opinions and I agree with them , but as it is right now he can't even do the first part of that

Not to mention I know my state's democratic, definitely won't be a swing state, so I might as well help Nader and his opinions receive more attention


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Offlinejong21
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Registered: 05/28/03
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: Ravus]
    #2845272 - 06/30/04 11:20 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I guess if it was me, and I would rather have Kerry in office than Bush, because it comes down to those two, I'd vote for Kerry.

I do respect your reasons though. What annoys me more is when people throw away votes for the sole reason that they don't like the two candidates, because that ignores the reality of the situation. I live in California, I know my vote doesn't matter, but I still feel like I need to vote between my two realistic options, even if it is only symbolic.

Our political system is two-party, and that's the way it is going to be for a long time.


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I either talk about my friends in the first or third person, but I never, ever talk about myself on this website. Except that last sentence.


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Invisiblez@z.com
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Registered: 10/13/02
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: fft2]
    #2845380 - 07/01/04 12:02 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

That poll was taken right before the transfer of power in Iraq. I wouldn't doubt it if those numbers no longer hold true.


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineSkikid16
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Registered: 06/27/02
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: z@z.com]
    #2845762 - 07/01/04 02:39 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

z@z.com said:
That poll was taken right before the transfer of power in Iraq. I wouldn't doubt it if those numbers no longer hold true.


True, for now. But Iraq will still be a hotbed for terrorism, that won't change, and the american people will still see that Bush had little to no planning for a post-war Iraq, and more people will die, and his numbers will slip.

The sad part is, its the dems election to loose, and I have a feeling they will.

The populace for this country is so ignorant.


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Re-Defeat Bush in '04


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OfflineAhronZombi
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: fft2]
    #2845802 - 07/01/04 02:48 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks to immportant people that arent afraid to stand up for what is right(ex: Howard Stern, Michael moore) bush will be gone. Maybe you dont like bush but clearly kerry is the only alternative. a vote for anyone else is a vote for bush no matter what you want to think. i voted nader last year and regret it. we have to be patiant and get away from bush first if we ever want a independant like nader elected


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OfflineSkikid16
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: AhronZombi]
    #2845830 - 07/01/04 02:57 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

i voted nader last year and regret it.


Oh yeah, I remember those elections of last year.
Quote:

we have to be patiant and get away from bush first if we ever want a independant like nader elected


That's a huge supposition to make man.

Honestly, I know you're fighting the good fight, but don't sound like such a dim wit whilst fighting, you sound just as biased and rhetorical as the right wingers.


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Re-Defeat Bush in '04


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OfflineAncalagon
AgnosticLibertarian

Registered: 07/30/02
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: AhronZombi]
    #2846414 - 07/01/04 08:59 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Maybe you dont like bush but clearly kerry is the only alternative. a vote for anyone else is a vote for bush no matter what you want to think.



Bullshit. I don't like Bush and will not be voting for Kerry. About time people realize that when you vote for the lesser of two evils, when the smoke clears, evil remains. I'll be voting for the person that I actually believe will take this country in the right direction, Michael Badnarik the Libertarian Candidate.

Quote:

voted nader last year and regret it.



Sorry to hear that.

Quote:

we have to be patiant and get away from bush first if we ever want a independant like nader elected



Bullshit. What if Jeb Bush runs for President in 2008, will we hear the same tired fucking argument, "JUST THIS ONE YEAR VOTE DEMOCRAT, WE CAN'T HAVE THIS EVIL MAN IN OFFICE, NEXT TIME YOU CAN VOTE FOR WHO YOU WANT..." I don't buy it. Vote Democrat if you think the Democrat's would be best for this country, DON'T buy into the lesser of two evils argument. 'If you have a 50% chance of lethal injection, a 45% chance of the electric chair, and a 5% chance of escape, do you take the injection because it is the most popular?'


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?When Alexander the Great visted the philosopher Diogenes and asked whether he could do anything for him, Diogenes is said to have replied: 'Yes, stand a little less between me and the sun.' It is what every citizen is entitled to ask of his government.?
-Henry Hazlitt in 'Economics in One Lesson'


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
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Registered: 02/09/01
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: Ancalagon]
    #2846422 - 07/01/04 09:02 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

'If you have a 50% chance of lethal injection, a 45% chance of the electric chair, and a 5% chance of escape, do you take the injection because it is the most popular?'




good analogy.  :thumbup:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineGazzBut
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: jong21]
    #2846461 - 07/01/04 09:30 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

voting for Nader just means you don't want to be a real part of the American political process.




Do you feel really empowered and proud of your freedom when you mark an x in a box once every four years? Aint democracy neat?


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Always Smi2le


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: GazzBut]
    #2846475 - 07/01/04 09:36 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I guess we could always get a Queen. :smirk:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: fft2]
    #2846548 - 07/01/04 10:15 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

"A vote for Nader is a complete waste."

actually, for every vote the green party gets, the more funding they will have for next election.


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No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.


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OfflineAhronZombi
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: Ancalagon]
    #2846591 - 07/01/04 10:31 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Bullshit. I don't like Bush and will not be voting for Kerry. About time people realize that when you vote for the lesser of two evils, when the smoke clears, evil remains. I'll be voting for the person that I actually believe will take this country in the right direction, Michael Badnarik the Libertarian Candidate.




well your not following your own beleifs then because your vote will goto bush and either way evil will still remain if you look at it your way. all you people voteing wrong are impatiant, you need to get rid of bush in order that your ideas will ever even have a chance in america. then we can work towards whats right for america. you just want a quick fix and throughing your vote away hurts your cause way more than it helps, the only thing your vote will help is hitler im mean george bush


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Offlinest0nedphucker
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: AhronZombi]
    #2846615 - 07/01/04 10:38 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

....

Are you even American?, if so I take it English isn't your first language.

:tongue:


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OfflineAncalagon
AgnosticLibertarian

Registered: 07/30/02
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: AhronZombi]
    #2846640 - 07/01/04 10:57 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

well your not following your own beleifs then



My belief is that the best person for the job is the Libertarian candidate. As such, I am following my own beliefs quite strictly.

Quote:

because your vote will goto bush



My vote will go to Michael Badnarik. How do you figure it will go to Bush?

Quote:

nd either way evil will still remain if you look at it your way.



True, the democrats and/or republicans will still have the presidency when November 2nd passes. I'm voting for the long haul however, NOT for instant gratification.

Quote:

all you people voteing wrong are impatiant



All YOU people telling ME that I'm voting wrong are ignorant and moronic.

Quote:

you need to get rid of bush in order that your ideas will ever even have a chance in america.



How exactly will John Kerry create an atmosphere that is more conductive to Libertarian ideas? He voted for the war in Iraq and the Patriot Act. There is ABSOLUTELY ZERO CHANCE of him dramatically or even moderately changing US drug policy. He will increase government spending on failed and horrible social programs. I'm wondering how I will actually benefit by voting for this guy?

Quote:

then we can work towards whats right for america.



Why wait? Maybe if John Kerry had a plan that I felt was at least visually better than George's plan, you'd have something of a point. In truth he does not, he offers nothing but the fact that he is not Bush. That is not the kind of candidate I would EVER vote for. As I said in another thread, it is very telling that a candidate would run on a few months spent in vietnam over a few decades spent in the US Senate.

Quote:

you just want a quick fix



I WANT A QUICK FIX? What is this nonsense? YOU'RE the one whose voting for a candidate just to get George out of office, despite the lack of anything that might resemble quality in said candidate. I on the other hand am voting for a candidate who though he will not win, will further the cause of liberty and constitutional government that America so desperately needs.

Quote:

and throughing your vote away hurts your cause way more than it helps



I am of the opinion that Kerry and Bush are by no means leagues apart with regard to the cause of overall liberty. As I said before, Kerry voted for and supported the patriot act(I'd like to also add that he voted for it, like all other congressman who did, WITHOUT EVEN READING IT). He voted for Iraq and truth be told, I fear a draft more from him than from Bush. Voting for Kerry is throwing your vote away if you desire change in America. The status quo will remain so long as a Republican or a Democrat are in the oval office.

Quote:

the only thing your vote will help is hitler im mean george bush



You think in the wrong mindset. You think, "he is voting for this Libertarian guy instead of John Kerry who is the only chance to get Bush out of office." I THINK, "I'm voting for this Libertarian guy because he is the right choice for this country." You need to stop thinking in terms of the other candidates. I am not voting for Badnarik INSTEAD of John Kerry...I had no intention of EVER voting Democrat so the wasted vote argument does not apply.


--------------------
?When Alexander the Great visted the philosopher Diogenes and asked whether he could do anything for him, Diogenes is said to have replied: 'Yes, stand a little less between me and the sun.' It is what every citizen is entitled to ask of his government.?
-Henry Hazlitt in 'Economics in One Lesson'


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Offlineblu3
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Registered: 03/06/04
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Re: Bush's Ratings Falls to its lowest points [Re: Ancalagon]
    #2846899 - 07/01/04 12:27 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Here's some other interesting change of ratings taken June 20th.

"Perhaps the most interesting finding is this: for the first time in this poll, a majority of Americans (54 percent to 44 percent) now say that the United States made a mistake sending troops to Iraq. Less than three weeks ago, the public was still saying, by 58 percent to 41 percent, that sending troops was not a mistake."

"Just 37 percent now say that the war has made us safer, compared to 55 percent who say it has not; when Gallup last asked this question in mid-December it was 56 percent to 33 percent the other way."

That's a huge change.


"Bush's overall approval rating, compared to Gallup's last measurement three weeks ago, is down 1 point, to 48 percent. His rating on Iraq is up 1 point, to 42 percent, while his rating on terrorism is down 2 points, to 54 percent."

"Gallup poll, voters still favor Kerry over Bush (53 percent to 40 percent) on which candidate can better handle the economy."

"Turning to the horse race, as ever we must, Kerry leads Bush by 4 points (49 percent to 45 percent) among registered voters (RVs). That approximates Gallup's early June result when Kerry led 49 percent to 44 percent."

"Of course, there's bound to be confusion about this, since Gallup and its clients tend to highlight the likely voter (LV) rather than RV results, which, in this case, actually show Bush ahead by a point (49 percent 48 percent). And then some media outlets tend to report the Kerry-Bush-Nader results, rather than the Kerry-Bush results, which further clouds the issue."


http://www.americanprogress.org/site/pp.asp?c=biJRJ8OVF&b=105682

It's a really long article I don't know if its worth the read, but probably worth a skim. Theres some interesting numbers.
I didn't read it


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