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rxb
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looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors
#28435913 - 08/16/23 10:06 AM (5 months, 9 days ago) |
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propublica reporting that there were 3 other doners to justice thomas' extravigant lifestyle...
David Sokol, a former top executive at Berkshire Hathaway
H. Wayne Huizenga, a billionaire who turned Blockbuster and Waste Management into national goliaths.
Paul “Tony” Novelly an oil billionaire.
gifts included travel, club access, and other luxury items and experiences.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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lifeiswhatyoumake
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28437308 - 08/17/23 03:41 PM (5 months, 8 days ago) |
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Sounds good for the American people! /s
--------------------
  I dropped a trance track "Peace Love & Trance": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4uQBM-mRYU ;   
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The Ecstatic
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: lifeiswhatyoumake]
#28437555 - 08/17/23 07:59 PM (5 months, 8 days ago) |
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If he was actually doing something wrong our checks and balances would take care of it.
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rxb
n00b-sabot



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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: The Ecstatic]
#28437581 - 08/17/23 08:20 PM (5 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said: If he was actually doing something wrong our checks and balances would take care of it.
i cant speak to your personal definition of right and wrong.
i can say he is eroding the faith of the american people in the supreme court and all power is to the people. now because we are 250ish years into this experiment removing people from power isnt really something we are used to, but the novelty of a system that has worked for 250ish years can wear off and cause riots and rebellions when people count on a justice for protection and find out that people with business before the court were giving millions of dollars worth of gifts (read bribes) to a judge making those rulings it wont sit well.
and since the power is with the people they are not forced to just put up with it forever
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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The Ecstatic
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28437654 - 08/17/23 09:46 PM (5 months, 8 days ago) |
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I think we’re a ways off from any sort of breaking point.
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: The Ecstatic]
#28437887 - 08/18/23 07:06 AM (5 months, 7 days ago) |
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People can be angry about it, but no one is going to take to the streets over money wrongly put in the pocket of someone else. It takes someone dying, generally, for that to happen. Occasionally, when enough people have money taken out of their pocket, they'll take to the streets. I don't see anyone getting up in arms about shit like this, though.
We bombed the fuck out of other nations for decades, and rarely was there an actual protest about it.
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The Ecstatic
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil] 1
#28437927 - 08/18/23 07:38 AM (5 months, 7 days ago) |
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Iraq War protests were pretty expansive, but yeah, nobody is gonna do anything about corruption (however blatant) until it begins to meaningfully affect their material interests. Americans are far too wealthy and comfortable to give a shit.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28437933 - 08/18/23 07:48 AM (5 months, 7 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: People can be angry about it, but no one is going to take to the streets over money wrongly put in the pocket of someone else. It takes someone dying, generally, for that to happen. Occasionally, when enough people have money taken out of their pocket, they'll take to the streets. I don't see anyone getting up in arms about shit like this, though.
We bombed the fuck out of other nations for decades, and rarely was there an actual protest about it.
it absurd to me that anyone with any interest in our system of justice whatsoever would be flippant about bribery of a supreme court justice, even if the bribe wasnt accepted. but this has very likely been a factor in the execution of justice. and lives have infact been very effected.
landslide overturning of precedents have happened, reductions of protections have happened and all because someone got to hang out on a big boat.
i dont think THIS will cause a riot, but frankly if it wasnt for other corruption news i think the story would be world changing news.
but because trump is calling black people riggers its page 3.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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millzy


Registered: 05/12/10
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: The Ecstatic]
#28439906 - 08/19/23 09:11 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said: If he was actually doing something wrong our checks and balances would take care of it.
i think congress should have acted already, to impose ethics standards on the court as well as restrict the way they use the shadow docket and which kinds of cases they are allowed to preside over. otherwise, we will see a continuation of rulings that strip women and marginalized groups of rights, and institutionally enshrine christian white nationalism.
-------------------- I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy]
#28439916 - 08/19/23 09:19 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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How can they restrict the cases they rule on?
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millzy


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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28439922 - 08/19/23 09:26 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: How can they restrict the cases they rule on?
my understanding is that they used to have absolute control over their docket and the constitution empowers them to enact laws that can take certain subjects off the table for them.
just something i heard a jurist say recently; you're the lawyer between the two of us so i will not try to get in over my head.
-------------------- I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger
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SirTripAlot
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy]
#28439937 - 08/19/23 09:43 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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I think there are many reasons why the SC doesn't hear cases. Time is gotta be one.
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy]
#28439938 - 08/19/23 09:46 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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there is zero proof that any member of the shroomery is a lawyer.
the likelihood of someone on the internet saying they are a lawyer actually being a lawyer in any sense is about the same as anyone claiming to be god on the internet actually being a god.
the cross sectional plausibility of someone on the internet claiming to be both a god and a lawyer being either of the two is pretty low as well and as the sample size grows the likelihood approaches zero.
that being said i also cant figure out how to limit the supreme court from being able to rule on cases, unless you are saying they should have to go through every appeals process before being sent to the top with no fast track.
in which case i think they could probably do that and other potentially similar things to that.
but ultimately if a lower court does something wrong you have to be able to appeal upward to some final court ruling.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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millzy


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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28439947 - 08/19/23 09:55 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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i've been here awhile. i always thought enlil was an attorney. i guess i was mistaken about that.
the argument i've heard is that the constitution empowers congress to pass laws that impose ethical standards and set rules for the kinds of cases they can preside over. they can overturn judicial review if they want. i don't recall the details beyond that. but the jist is that congress can and should act to reign in our corrupt SCOTUS before it's too late.
-------------------- I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger
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SirTripAlot
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28439950 - 08/19/23 09:56 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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Working about 8 or 9 months outta the year, the SC would never have time to hear every case. You could double stack the court and it still wouldn't get done. Then you have the whole quantity over quality thing.
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
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millzy


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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: SirTripAlot]
#28439958 - 08/19/23 10:00 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
SirTripAlot said: Working about 8 or 9 months outta the year, the SC would never have time to hear every case. You could double stack the court and it still wouldn't get done. Then you have the whole quantity over quality thing.
we're talking about two different things. time is absolutely an issue for the court - this is a good reason to add seats so more cases can be heard.
i'm just talking about our lawmakers setting some rules for the court to stop the slow motion christian white nationalist coup we're seeing.
-------------------- I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger
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SirTripAlot
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy]
#28439967 - 08/19/23 10:05 PM (5 months, 6 days ago) |
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I must of misunderstood, I stand corrected.
What case do you consider white Christian nationalism?
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
Edited by SirTripAlot (08/19/23 10:06 PM)
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millzy


Registered: 05/12/10
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: SirTripAlot]
#28439978 - 08/19/23 10:17 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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the dobbs ruling is a recent example of the court acting in the interest of christian white nationalist groups.
but it doesn't stop there. there has been a huge, ongoing project to install theocrats since the civil rights and antiwar movements of the 60's and 70's.
-------------------- I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger
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Enlil
OTD God-King




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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy] 1
#28439981 - 08/19/23 10:21 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
millzy said: i've been here awhile. i always thought enlil was an attorney. i guess i was mistaken about that.
I am. It bothers some people i guess.
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SirTripAlot
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy]
#28439983 - 08/19/23 10:22 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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The Dobbs ruling was not based on white Christian nationalism, it was a result of the Legislature doing nothing and a shaky legal foundation of Roe v Wade.
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
Edited by SirTripAlot (08/19/23 10:25 PM)
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy]
#28439990 - 08/19/23 10:37 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
millzy said: the dobbs ruling is a recent example of the court acting in the interest of christian white nationalist groups.
but it doesn't stop there. there has been a huge, ongoing project to install theocrats since the civil rights and antiwar movements of the 60's and 70's.
It seems like you're suggesting that Congress could target specific areas that the SCOTUS can't review. First, that has never been demonstrated. It is a very risky proposition, too. Example:
Congress passes a bill stating that SCOTUS can't review cases regarding the First Amendment. Then Congress passes a federal law making it illegal for U.S. Citizens to speak negatively about any government official.
Now, that law is unconstitutional, but who cares? SCOTUS can't review it...Congress could even dissolve the circuit courts if it wanted and completely immunize the law from any constitutional scrutiny..
Does Congress have the power to do that? I don't think it does. I think any law limiting SCOTUS' ability to review federal law would be stricken down as unconstitutional violation of the separation of powers. It's never been tried, of course...so we can't know for sure.
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millzy


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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: SirTripAlot]
#28439998 - 08/19/23 10:45 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
SirTripAlot said: The Dobbs ruling was not based on white Christian nationalism, it was a result of the Legislature doing nothing and a shaky legal foundation of Roe v Wade.
while i agree that congress should have enacted laws to protect abortion access at the federal level, the dobbs decision was the outcome of christian white nationalist groups getting their people on the courts. justice barrett straight up lied about her views on abortion in front of congress. she was put there to strike it down.
-------------------- I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy]
#28440001 - 08/19/23 10:46 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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I'm not even convinced that Congress has the power to protect abortion access other than on federal lands.
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millzy


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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440004 - 08/19/23 10:54 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
millzy said: the dobbs ruling is a recent example of the court acting in the interest of christian white nationalist groups.
but it doesn't stop there. there has been a huge, ongoing project to install theocrats since the civil rights and antiwar movements of the 60's and 70's.
It seems like you're suggesting that Congress could target specific areas that the SCOTUS can't review. First, that has never been demonstrated. It is a very risky proposition, too. Example:
Congress passes a bill stating that SCOTUS can't review cases regarding the First Amendment. Then Congress passes a federal law making it illegal for U.S. Citizens to speak negatively about any government official.
Now, that law is unconstitutional, but who cares? SCOTUS can't review it...Congress could even dissolve the circuit courts if it wanted and completely immunize the law from any constitutional scrutiny..
Does Congress have the power to do that? I don't think it does. I think any law limiting SCOTUS' ability to review federal law would be stricken down as unconstitutional violation of the separation of powers. It's never been tried, of course...so we can't know for sure.
it would definitely be uncharted territory. if congress tried to reign in the court, the court would almost certainly not accept laws that restricted their power. but if congress has no check against the court, who does? even the concept of judicial review came from the court via marbury v madison.
i believe the potential for such a crisis is part of the plan for the groups behind these regressive decisions. at the end of the day, nothing changes for any member of congress regardless of what the law says. their access to abortion will remain unchanged. so they have zero motive to go after the court, and good reasons not to because it'll start a big fight.
-------------------- I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: millzy]
#28440350 - 08/20/23 09:25 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
millzy said: i've been here awhile. i always thought enlil was an attorney. i guess i was mistaken about that.
he says he is a lawyer and he says he is a god. if you choose to believe one you may as well believe the other but he is often wrong about simple legal concepts and when you do things like post videos of confirmed lawyers saying the opposite of what he does he either shuts up about it or deflects.. reciently he said a judge's legal opinion wasnt as good as his...etc.
some people are just this way... he isnt hurting anything but theres no good reason to believe he is a lawyer. many people including myself think he is not.
Quote:
millzy said: the argument i've heard is that the constitution empowers congress to pass laws that impose ethical standards and set rules for the kinds of cases they can preside over. they can overturn judicial review if they want. i don't recall the details beyond that. but the jist is that congress can and should act to reign in our corrupt SCOTUS before it's too late.
the legislative branch can enact laws. the supreme court can find them unconstitutional the president can veto them.
the president can issue a decree called an executive order, the legislature can overturn it and the supremecourt can rule it unlawful or unconstitutional.
the supreme court cant really create laws out of thin air, but can make judicial orders however for the most part they have no means to create laws. they do create policy for the courts and themselves.
the president could give an executive order governing the court and the legislature could enact rules or laws that effect the court but their only true power to stop the courts action would be through impeachment or the threat of it which requires a legislator far less divided than what we have.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
Edited by rxb (08/20/23 09:37 AM)
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440361 - 08/20/23 09:33 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: I'm not even convinced that Congress has the power to protect abortion access other than on federal lands.
by this, we would have no federal laws or regulations what so ever,
no regulation of firearms, no regulation of drugs, no protections of rights.... nothing from the federal level by your assessment
which is why its unlikely a lawyer would make such a statement as they would have taken many hours of study on federal laws, rights, and restrictions and would understand how they each separately work and how one would go about using any of the three to protect abortion rights federally.
now to say there are plausible arguments for striking those powers down because they step on states rights is a plenty worthy debate especially with a corrupt court.
but certainly a legal scholar wouldnt be confused about how such a thing could BE done... since similar concepts exist since the founding of the nation.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Registered: 08/16/03
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440371 - 08/20/23 09:40 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
rxb said:
Quote:
Enlil said: I'm not even convinced that Congress has the power to protect abortion access other than on federal lands.
by this, we would have no federal laws or regulations what so ever,
no regulation of firearms, no regulation of drugs, no protections of rights.... nothing from the federal level by your assessment
This is based on a clear lack of understanding of the powers of the federal government. Congress can't just pass any law they want and apply it to states. The Constitution specifically gives Congress power to regulate interstate commerce. That is why firearms and drugs are regulated federally. An abortion happens in a doctors office. Where's the interstate commerce?
Or perhaps you know of another clause that gives the federal government the power to regulate abortion? We already know that rape isn't a topic the federal government can regulate after U.S. v. Morrison. I don't see how abortion would be any different.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440375 - 08/20/23 09:45 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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we have federal laws that regulate medical practices
we have federal laws that regulate pollution.
we have federal laws that ban some medical procedures.
we have laws that regulate chemicals and drugs and what can be sold as a drug.
we have laws about what doctors can not do.
we have laws about what they can.
you are selectively ignoring the three types of laws. regulation prohibition and rights.
any of the three can be used to allow for and regulate abortions in the us.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440380 - 08/20/23 09:48 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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A bunch of claims without any examples or sources. Why am I not surprised?
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440384 - 08/20/23 09:50 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: A bunch of claims without any examples or sources. Why am I not surprised?
so you dont believe the federal drugs regulations exist? or you just mistook what type of conversation this is?
never heard of the epa? or... again just dont know what kind of conversation this is.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440390 - 08/20/23 09:52 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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I already told you federal drug regulations exist under the interstate commerce clause. What does that have to do with abortion? What does the epa have to do with abortion?
Can you cite a single example of a federal ban (or prohibition of a ban) on a medical procedure done in a local office by a local doctor?
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440401 - 08/20/23 09:57 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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extremely selective of you.
and its avoiding 90 percent of what i said before.
seems like something a spineless coward would do.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440409 - 08/20/23 10:01 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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So, you don't have an example? Got it. The federal government has limited power. They cannot just pass any law they want for the nation. It may very well be that they have the power to ban abortion, but I don't believe so. It might even be that they can ban a prohibition on abortion, but this is even less likely.
Now run off and find a lawyer who disagrees with me so you can claim that I'm wrong AND lying about being a lawyer. After all, if one lawyer says something, it MUST be true. Sidney Powell and Rudolph Giuliani are perfect examples.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440421 - 08/20/23 10:13 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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all of the above have examples. there are examples of the congress expressing things as rights.
there are examples of congress restricting behavior
and there are examples of congress prohibiting behavior.
the fact that you dont know so is concerning.
they have not done so with abortion
as an example of what could be done with abortion is that congress could pass a law where certain medical procedures for the area used for other purposes couldnt be barred due to pregnancy or potential pregnancy or require pregnancy testing before performing them.
that would be an example of prohibition of the state from putting up road blocks to the abortion.
they could enact privacy laws which would restrict the state from being able to gather information to make a case that a doctor was performing abortions...tho this would be risky but there are ways it could work this would be regulation, or prohibition and would be similar to hippa.
then there is making an amendment which wouldnt work, but what may work is expressing that someone already enumerated rights apply to abortion and doing so as an act forcing the courts to see the will of the people and rule in the proper way.
however there is nothing restrictive here... there are DOZENS of ways to accomplish it. using one or more of the 3 potential strategies that the legislature has.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440433 - 08/20/23 10:21 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
rxb said:
as an example of what could be done with abortion is that congress could pass a law where certain medical procedures for the area used for other purposes couldnt be barred due to pregnancy or potential pregnancy or require pregnancy testing before performing them.
Where in the Constitution does it give Congress this power?
Quote:
they could enact privacy laws which would restrict the state from being able to gather information to make a case that a doctor was performing abortions...tho this would be risky but there are ways it could work this would be regulation, or prohibition and would be similar to hippa.
Where in the Constitution does it give Congress this power?Quote:
then there is making an amendment which wouldnt work, but what may work is expressing that someone already enumerated rights apply to abortion and doing so as an act forcing the courts to see the will of the people and rule in the proper way.
An amendment is the only way, but Congress can't do that alone.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440446 - 08/20/23 10:28 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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im not going to do this all day.
you are wrong when you say congress cant do it.
and because there is a legal argument against every congressional act there WILL be one against any that do this.
which wont mean it wont get enacted and wont mean that it doesnt pass.
and because its an uphill climb and has massive consequences you can bet that the thought put in will be by better lawyers than you or i would make.
these people will dot their eyes cross their t's and get it done.
and when they do you will be there telling them why they cant and your opinion wont change the facts.
but you are asking for a phd thesis and im having a conversation
if you have something substantive to add other than asking me to write an act of congress and not make any mistakes while im doing it, i'll casually chat with you.
but you are just being childish at this point and i have other things i'd rather do than build the case for what we both know is doable...
but when you can lasso the moon you can ask me to. until then just stay in your lane.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb] 1
#28440452 - 08/20/23 10:31 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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I'm wrong because you say so? Got it. Your opinion has been duly noted.
Keep in mind that this started by me posting:
Quote:
I'm not even convinced that Congress has the power to protect abortion access other than on federal lands.
After your lackluster performance here, I'm still unconvinced. I do hope you enjoyed your literary masturbation in the process, though.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440468 - 08/20/23 10:41 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: I'm wrong because you say so? Got it. Your opinion has been duly noted.
Keep in mind that this started by me posting:
Quote:
I'm not even convinced that Congress has the power to protect abortion access other than on federal lands.
After your lackluster performance here, I'm still unconvinced. I do hope you enjoyed your literary masturbation in the process, though.
well, congress has the power to protect abortion the same way it protects your privacy with hippa, the same way it protects your environment with the epa, there are other ways that congress could protect abortion but in the current political climate it would be a hard fought uphil climb... maybe after the next presidential election is a referendum on abortion rights change will be made with a mandate from the people.
neither of us will be involved in the process.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440473 - 08/20/23 10:48 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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In other words, it can't protect abortion at all. Hipaa doesn't prevent a state from getting medical information for criminal investigations. The EPA doesn't apply to anything that doesn't involve interstate pollution. Since an abortion is performed in a local office, there is no interstate issue.
You've still offered not a single example of a law where a specific procedure, performed in a local office, is either banned federally or federally protected from a state ban.
What Congress COULD do (but won't) is protect a person's right to travel interstate to get an abortion.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440478 - 08/20/23 10:53 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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and you havent offered any proof that it cant be accomplished either you are just droning on and on like an old man pretending to be a lawyer on the internet would do.
your opinion wont matter abortion will be legal in the US in the future.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440479 - 08/20/23 10:54 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Abortion has been legal in the U.S. for decades, homie.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440489 - 08/20/23 11:03 AM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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abortion will regain its federal protected status HOMESLICE.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440561 - 08/20/23 12:08 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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It may. It's going to take some SCOTUS judges dying or retiring, though.
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440571 - 08/20/23 12:19 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: It may. It's going to take some SCOTUS judges dying or retiring, though.
no source? no examples?
pssh just because you say so?
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440574 - 08/20/23 12:21 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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The Blind Ass
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: CapSlinger]
#28440595 - 08/20/23 12:38 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440661 - 08/20/23 01:28 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
rxb said:
Quote:
Enlil said: It may. It's going to take some SCOTUS judges dying or retiring, though.
no source? no examples?
pssh just because you say so?
Since you didn't give any, I thought this was "talk out of your ass" time.
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440698 - 08/20/23 02:15 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
rxb said:
Quote:
Enlil said: It may. It's going to take some SCOTUS judges dying or retiring, though.
no source? no examples?
pssh just because you say so?
Since you didn't give any, I thought this was "talk out of your ass" time.
i didnt think i needed to in the context i was discussing but you sure seem to think people do.
but when its your turn you seem to have nothing but a lot of claims and nothing to back it up
what a shock.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440700 - 08/20/23 02:20 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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You repeatedly misunderstand the concept of burden of proof. You made the claim that abortion will be protected federally in the future. You didn't back that claim up with any support whatsoever. You haven't even offered a viable means by which that would be accomplished except for Constitutional amendment. I then opined that you might be right and offered another way that it could occur.
I never had the burden of proof on any of this. To whatever extent you want to back up your claim that the law will change, you're welcome to do so...If I disagree at that point, it'll be my burden to offer some kind of support.
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440789 - 08/20/23 03:52 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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You repeatedly misunderstand the concept of burden of proof. You made the claim that abortion will be protected federally only under certain specific conditions. You didn't back that claim up with any support whatsoever.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440809 - 08/20/23 04:17 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
rxb said: You made the claim that abortion will be protected federally only under certain specific conditions.
You need to read more closely. Nowhere did I say that.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440818 - 08/20/23 04:22 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: It may. It's going to take some SCOTUS judges dying or retiring, though.
You repeatedly misunderstand the concept of burden of proof. You made the claim that abortion will be protected federally only under certain specific conditions quoted above. You didn't back that claim up with any support whatsoever.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440822 - 08/20/23 04:24 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
You need to read more closely. Nowhere did I say that.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440836 - 08/20/23 04:37 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
Enlil said:
You need to read more closely. Nowhere did I say that.
maybe english isnt your first language idk.
i said that the US would return to having abortion protections..
and you agreed that:
Quote:
It may.
but added
Quote:
It's going to take some SCOTUS judges dying or retiring, though.
which in english means that in order for that to happen scotus judges (PLURAL) will have to die or retire. BEFORE there will be protected abortion throughout the US.
which is a narrow condition for that to happen which you have offered without any support what so ever
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
Edited by rxb (08/20/23 04:39 PM)
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440849 - 08/20/23 04:46 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Again... read more closely. You said it would "regain its protected status." It's protected status was based on an interpretation of the constitution. That only is regained by a new interpretation identical to the former one.
It might get new federal protection from an amendment, but that isn't regaining anything. That's gaining a new protected status.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440865 - 08/20/23 05:05 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Again... read more closely. You said it would "regain its protected status." It's protected status was based on an interpretation of the constitution. That only is regained by a new interpretation identical to the former one.
It might get new federal protection from an amendment, but that isn't regaining anything. That's gaining a new protected status.
it could regain protections in a different way, and even to regain it from the scotus wouldnt require even a single judge to retire or die.
so basically none of what you said was true.
to regain protected status it only has to become protected again, through a law, an order, a judgement or any other potential method.
even for it to become protected in the same way it was before could happen if the court had a change of heart or if impeachments happened neither of which REQUIRES a retirement or a death.
go argue with choppy or something kiddo.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440869 - 08/20/23 05:10 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Protected could mean anything from protecring the right only in cases of risk to mothers life all the way up to protecting the right up until months after birth. You specifically talked about regaining the status it had.
Right now it's federally protected in very minor ways.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440872 - 08/20/23 05:12 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: Protected could mean anything from protecring the right only in cases of risk to mothers life so they eat up to protecting the right up until months after birth. You specifically talked about regaining the status it had.
yep and it wont require what you said it would even if it gained it the same exact way.
but i didnt say it would regain it the same way, just that it would be protected again...in all 50 states. and it will.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440873 - 08/20/23 05:13 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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And you've offered no source for that claim
You're boring the whole forum with this ax you keep grinding
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440876 - 08/20/23 05:15 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: And you've offered no source for that claim
a source for a claim about the future?
HAH, ok... pull the other one... if we ever meet in person you can lick my crystal balls if you want.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28440878 - 08/20/23 05:16 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440885 - 08/20/23 05:19 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:

you COULD offer proof for yours, my proof will come when it eventually happens and it will, and then it wont need further proof because it would have happened.
but what you said was wrong as what you said it would require isnt even required in the narrow case you wrongly put it into.
lots of lack of expertise in the law is likely to blame for your mistake its ok we recognize you arent very knowledgeable and we forgive you for your shortcomings.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440888 - 08/20/23 05:22 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:

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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440890 - 08/20/23 05:22 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
Enlil said:

hey if you dont want to defend your position thats ok by me.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28440893 - 08/20/23 05:23 PM (5 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
Enlil said:

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The Ecstatic
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441401 - 08/21/23 08:31 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Roe was always a deliberately shaky decision that allowed significant carve outs, to the point that abortion was functionally illegal in some states.
A return to Roe will bring us exactly where it brought us last time: here. We need a constitutional amendment, but that won’t happen anytime soon. The Democrats are still acting as though abortion rights are a secondary issue, with leadership endorsing anti-choice candidates like Cuellar in Texas. And why would they have urgency on the matter when it’s gifting them such a bump in nationwide polling? By all accounts Biden’s majorities should’ve been crushed in 2022, a la 2014, but they weren’t. They have Dobbs to thank for that, so why do anything else about it? The Dems’ calculus on these things is “if we solve the problem they won’t have a reason to vote for us,” rather than “if we solve the problem they’ll vote for us to solve more problems.” Probably because the former doesn’t threaten the ruling class as much as the latter.
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: The Ecstatic]
#28441409 - 08/21/23 08:37 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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I could be wrong, but I don't think the Constitution will ever be amended again. It just seems like the nation is so sharply divided that there will never be that kind of supermajority.
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441434 - 08/21/23 08:47 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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I agree. I don't ever see us making significant progress on our fundamental laws at the federal level again. Instead you will have to move to a state with the laws that best suit you. Not a great option for poor people who will likely end up in the poorest states. I.E., our current reality.
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The Ecstatic
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: christopera]
#28441501 - 08/21/23 09:31 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: I could be wrong, but I don't think the Constitution will ever be amended again. It just seems like the nation is so sharply divided that there will never be that kind of supermajority.
If I had to guess one way or another, I’d say you’re right.
Quote:
christopera said: I agree. I don't ever see us making significant progress on our fundamental laws at the federal level again. Instead you will have to move to a state with the laws that best suit you. Not a great option for poor people who will likely end up in the poorest states. I.E., our current reality.
Let the balkanization begin tbh
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gww
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: The Ecstatic]
#28441513 - 08/21/23 09:48 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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If the democrats address abortion, there will be the same backlash that the republicans are reaping now. They still should address it and I believe they will try. Ain't nothing free. The court with roe had it about right and it was not a decision made in a vacuum. There are not so many alive these days that remember being young before roe and so we are in the position of having to repeat history to end up in the same place again after whatever pain is felt that brought it on in the first place. This seems to be how the world works on most important issues.
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: gww]
#28441527 - 08/21/23 10:05 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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There are many people who believe Roe was wrongly decided regardless of whether or not they are pro-choice. Roe is based on a right to privacy that is dubiously found in the "penumbra" of the other rights. Plenty of rational people have never bought that argument.
Abortion should be government funded and universally allowed all the way up until birth, but that doesn't mean we should rely on 9 unelected people to make law up out of thin air to accomplish that.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441543 - 08/21/23 10:15 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: I could be wrong, but I don't think the Constitution will ever be amended again. It just seems like the nation is so sharply divided that there will never be that kind of supermajority.
this is an extremely short sited perspective. you hypothesis might be right if the political makeup of the government remains the same.
but we are in a bizarre position where we have minority rule. a minority of citizens are right wing non-progressives and they are controlling government for the most part, making progress in their direction or stagnating. either way for that sector its a win.
but overtime when you suppress the will of the majority it has a rebound effect. the 14th amendment means that without permission from any governing body any state in the union can simply not put trump on the ballet, or anyone else the board of election decides may have been involved in insurrection. those candidates can sue to get back on the ballot but its not that likely to succeed as there is ample legal opinion to support keeping trump from running.
eventually this will make the extremes calm down again and consequently it would have the potential to have a completely different temperament of government.
right now it looks bleak but really that means we are either bound for having a completely different country or fixing the one we have and the bandaids arent holding the corpse together so well.
nothing is the same it was 10 20 30 40 50 years ago.. every decade is unique. the only thing that remains unchanged is that nothing stays the same.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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gww
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441544 - 08/21/23 10:16 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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There are many people that faced medical or life decisions and made those decisions based on their best thoughts personally and made decisions that they still want to outlaw for others who might be facing the same thing. Those who don't find the right to privacy usually don't find it for others and do find it for themselves. The ones finding such usually have resources to boot. Plenty of rational people from the founding till now believe that privacy was the foundation for all the other rights like due process and freedom of speech.
Edited by gww (08/21/23 10:18 AM)
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: gww]
#28441550 - 08/21/23 10:22 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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The right to freedom of speech didn't even apply to state governments until 1931. In other words, a state could silence dissent at will. Due Process rights did not become a state requirement until 1868. Sure, some people probably thought that there was some right to privacy inherent in being a human, but that was never a part of the legal framework of this nation until long after its inception. The right to privacy didn't even exist until the 20th century.
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gww
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441559 - 08/21/23 10:28 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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We have been though this before. It is no different at the constitutions inception then it is today. They gave a constitution, then they passed laws, then those laws were tested though enforcement. It was the testing of the constitution that garnered the meaning as was intentioned at its inception cause it is the only way it could have been done by the procedures that are the constitution. If you say this did not happen till and this did happen after, that is the nature of the beast that the constitution is and was meant to be.
Edited by gww (08/21/23 10:31 AM)
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: gww]
#28441574 - 08/21/23 10:42 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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You're missing the part where the bill of rights was tested against state laws, and it was found to be inapplicable to state law. In other words, the test happened, and then the Constitution had to be changed to make the first amendment and due process apply to the states.
What evidence do you have that the general public, or any significant portion thereof, believed that the Constitution, at inception, protected them from intrusions of privacy from state governments?
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441579 - 08/21/23 10:46 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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first amendment applied.
some states found loopholes and abused them.
was fixed to better fix the spirit of the law.
not that no one had it within states until it was fixed. but it had to be fixed after some states abused the original application.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441585 - 08/21/23 10:48 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
rxb said: first amendment applied.
Source?
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441587 - 08/21/23 10:50 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
rxb said: first amendment applied.
Source?
my interpretation of original intent but there are others, like the arguements for the fix.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441589 - 08/21/23 10:52 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441590 - 08/21/23 10:52 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Well, the SCOTUS disagreed with you. I'm gonna go with the real judges on this one.
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gww
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441591 - 08/21/23 10:54 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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First let me say in my arguments, I am no scholar or history buff and just go by perception earned though living and thinking with out making it a passion of digging.
The bill of rights were argued against and ended up being a compromise to get buy in of enough votes to pass the constitution. The intended meaning could be as I say with the legal meaning ending up as you say through the testing of what they had done. We are a gov of checks and balance including states views of the constitution and the willingness to test those through the legal process. That they had to test it and get that ruling shows the question we are on. After the ruling, the 14th shows the adjustment to the side that took my position in the first place.
Edited by gww (08/21/23 11:09 AM)
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441594 - 08/21/23 10:57 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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.Quote:
Enlil said: Well, the SCOTUS disagreed with you. I'm gonna go with the real judges on this one.
The Court held that prior restraint on publication (censoring newspapers in advance) in Minnesota was “the essence of censorship” and the heart of what the First Amendment was designed to prevent.
prior intent is what the scotus ruled in 1931... its you they dont agree with.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: gww]
#28441597 - 08/21/23 10:58 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
gww said: First let me say in my arguments, I am no scholar or history buff and just go by perception earned though living and thinking with out making it a passion of digging.
The bill of rights were argued against and ended up being a compromise to get buy in of enough votes to pass the constitution. The intended meaning could be as I say with the legal meaning ending up as you say through the testing of what they had done. We are a gov of checks and balance including states views of the constitution and the willingness to test those through the legal process. That they had to test it and get that ruling shows the question we are on. After the ruling, the 14th shows the adjustment to the side that took the position in the first place.
you, me and the 1931 supreme court all agree that was the original intent.
enlil is wrong.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: gww]
#28441600 - 08/21/23 11:01 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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If you look at the purpose of the Constitution, your interpretation doesn't make sense. The Constitution was about bringing together 13 sovereigns into one government. They wanted the unity but didn't want a federal government that was going to change their ways of life. In fact, many of the colonies had official religions, which would have been illegal had the first amendment applied to those colonies. The idea was that none of the colonies wanted the federal government intruding.
For example, read the first amendment. It starts with "Congress shall make no law..." If it applied to the state legislatures, why did it specify Congress?
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441601 - 08/21/23 11:03 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: If you look at the purpose of the Constitution, your interpretation doesn't make sense. The Constitution was about bringing together 13 sovereigns into one government. They wanted the unity but didn't want a federal government that was going to change their ways of life. In fact, many of the colonies had official religions, which would have been illegal had the first amendment applied to those colonies. The idea was that none of the colonies wanted the federal government intruding.
For example, read the first amendment. It starts with "Congress shall make no law..." If it applied to the state legislatures, why did it specify Congress?
youll have to take that up with the scotus.
no one seems to agree with you.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441605 - 08/21/23 11:06 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
rxb said:
Quote:
gww said: First let me say in my arguments, I am no scholar or history buff and just go by perception earned though living and thinking with out making it a passion of digging.
The bill of rights were argued against and ended up being a compromise to get buy in of enough votes to pass the constitution. The intended meaning could be as I say with the legal meaning ending up as you say through the testing of what they had done. We are a gov of checks and balance including states views of the constitution and the willingness to test those through the legal process. That they had to test it and get that ruling shows the question we are on. After the ruling, the 14th shows the adjustment to the side that took the position in the first place.
you, me and the 1931 supreme court all agree that was the original intent.
enlil is wrong.
Have you even read that case? It's based on the 14th amendment which didn't even exist until 1868.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441607 - 08/21/23 11:07 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said:
Quote:
rxb said:
Quote:
gww said: First let me say in my arguments, I am no scholar or history buff and just go by perception earned though living and thinking with out making it a passion of digging.
The bill of rights were argued against and ended up being a compromise to get buy in of enough votes to pass the constitution. The intended meaning could be as I say with the legal meaning ending up as you say through the testing of what they had done. We are a gov of checks and balance including states views of the constitution and the willingness to test those through the legal process. That they had to test it and get that ruling shows the question we are on. After the ruling, the 14th shows the adjustment to the side that took the position in the first place.
you, me and the 1931 supreme court all agree that was the original intent.
enlil is wrong.
Have you even read that case? It's based on the 14th amendment which didn't even exist until 1868.
i quoted above where scotus ruled in favor of neem because of intent of the first amendment.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441608 - 08/21/23 11:11 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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I don't see anything close to a quote saying that.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441609 - 08/21/23 11:11 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
The Court held that prior restraint on publication (censoring newspapers in advance) in Minnesota was “the essence of censorship” and the heart of what the First Amendment was designed to prevent. Even in cases where printed statements could be punished after the fact (libelous statements, for example), neither federal nor state governments could stop the publication of materials in advance.
not the 14th, but the first... and not starting at 1931 but the court HELD that this was the first amendment was D E S I G N E D to prevent.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441612 - 08/21/23 11:14 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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That quote isn't from the case. You made that up or quoted someone else who did make it up. Those are not the words of the SCOTUS. These are the words of the SCOTUS:
Quote:
For these reasons we hold the statute, so far as it authorized the proceedings in this action under clause (b) of section one, to be an infringement of the liberty of the press guaranteed by the Fourteenth Amendment
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gww
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441616 - 08/21/23 11:18 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: If you look at the purpose of the Constitution, your interpretation doesn't make sense. The Constitution was about bringing together 13 sovereigns into one government. They wanted the unity but didn't want a federal government that was going to change their ways of life. In fact, many of the colonies had official religions, which would have been illegal had the first amendment applied to those colonies. The idea was that none of the colonies wanted the federal government intruding.
For example, read the first amendment. It starts with "Congress shall make no law..." If it applied to the state legislatures, why did it specify Congress?
The constitution, If I have it right, was to replace the articles confederation which did as you say. The reason was to make a stronger federal gov over the states to stop turf wars between them and have a central army and trade.
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: gww]
#28441618 - 08/21/23 11:20 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Certainly stronger than the Articles of Confederation. Not so strong, however, that the colonies lost their sovereignty entirely. That's why Congress is given so limited power in the Constitution.
Do you have any explanation why the first amendment only specifically mentions Congress' ability to make laws?
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SirTripAlot
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: christopera]
#28441621 - 08/21/23 11:24 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
christopera said: I agree. I don't ever see us making significant progress on our fundamental laws at the federal level again. Instead you will have to move to a state with the laws that best suit you. Not a great option for poor people who will likely end up in the poorest states. I.E., our current reality.
I agree, and its a shame...say what you will about the framers/ founders, the Constitution was specifically designed to be an evolutionary document. The Amendment process was put in there for that reason, as they knew times change. I blame us, the voters for not voting in people that can form a concensus.
It can have its pitfalls, like the 18th Amendment but a correction with the 21st.
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
Edited by SirTripAlot (08/21/23 11:26 AM)
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: SirTripAlot]
#28441624 - 08/21/23 11:28 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Unfortunately, more votes are gained by pointing out how different one is from the other guy than pointing out the places where they agree. This inevitably leads to people taking positions just so they can differentiate themselves. Over time, this is where it leads. Half the nation thinks the other half are idiots for believing what they believe.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441626 - 08/21/23 11:30 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Writing for the Court, Chief Justice Charles Evans Hughes started by confirming what the Court had decided six years earlier. The First Amendment freedom of the press is one of the liberties, or freedoms, protected by the Fourteenth Amendment from state interference. This means that all states, including Minnesota, must obey the freedom of the press.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441629 - 08/21/23 11:36 AM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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all the writings on the case (i cant find the opinion letter for whatever reason) point to the majority claiming that the point of the first amendment was to keep things like this from happening, and while the decision was made BY WAY of the 14th amendment it seemed to be the opinion of the court that was the founders intent.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441649 - 08/21/23 12:00 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Do you have any explanation why the first amendment only specifically mentions Congress' ability to make laws?
Point for you. My contention is privacy was the foundation for the bill of rights of the federal gov. I will add this though. Most states at the time had constitutions prior to the federal gov getting one and most contained bill of rights. It was the thinking at the time and whatever meaning comes with that. Secondly, it is a mute point after the 14th amendment and if my contention is that privacy was the foundation of the bill of right were correct for the federal then it is now for the states. I always fall back on the right to self defense is not specifically spelled out in the constitution but is implicitly guaranteed by it just like privacy. You get the point that prior to the 14th, the states were not bound by the bill of rights in the us constitution.
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441650 - 08/21/23 12:02 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
14th amendment it seemed to be the opinion of the court that was the founders intent.
It was at least for sure ben franklins intent.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: gww]
#28441658 - 08/21/23 12:07 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
gww said:
Quote:
14th amendment it seemed to be the opinion of the court that was the founders intent.
It was at least for sure ben franklins intent.
dont tell enlil it will shatter his world views
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441695 - 08/21/23 12:34 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
rxb said: all the writings on the case (i cant find the opinion letter for whatever reason) point to the majority claiming that the point of the first amendment was to keep things like this from happening, and while the decision was made BY WAY of the 14th amendment it seemed to be the opinion of the court that was the founders intent.
You're right about the founders' intent vis a vis the contours of the first amendment right. You're just wrong about whether the founders intended the first amendment to restrict the state governments, though.
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: gww]
#28441712 - 08/21/23 12:48 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
gww said: My contention is privacy was the foundation for the bill of rights of the federal gov.
Let's unpack this a little bit, though. If we agree that the bill of rights was only intended as a limitation on the federal government, then what is this right to privacy that was intended by the bill of rights?
The fourth amendment literally talks about a privacy interest, although it doesn't use the word.
Quote:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects,[a] against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized
I think we both agree that this is a clear protection of a privacy interest. If the founders meant something broader, however, why wouldn't they have written that?
Also, you'd agree that at the time of ratification, citizens were subject to all kinds of rules about private matters. Who they could marry, who they could sleep with, what sexual acts were allowed...all of these were subjects of state law at the time.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441731 - 08/21/23 01:04 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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this is pretty far off the topic of finding ways to stop the supreme court from taking bribes and converting them into judgements.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb] 1
#28441736 - 08/21/23 01:07 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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That isn't the topic of the OP. Maybe you meant it to be but failed to clearly spell it out. It seems to me that the overturning of Roe V. Wade is on-topic insofar as gww opines that it is because of SCOTUS corruption. Offering competing explanations for that overturning is equally on-topic.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441758 - 08/21/23 01:20 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: That isn't the topic of the OP. Maybe you meant it to be but failed to clearly spell it out. It seems to me that the overturning of Roe V. Wade is on-topic insofar as gww opines that it is because of SCOTUS corruption. Offering competing explanations for that overturning is equally on-topic.
the original topic is about the fact that a supreme court justice is being bribed by 4 billionaires.
and the fact that it played a role in overturning roe was indeed on the table but you are guiding this down a tangent of a tangent of a tangent and its pretty far off that. try to get it back on track enlil you are breaking forum rules.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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gww
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441766 - 08/21/23 01:23 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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I am not quite that deep. I just saw comment that interested me enough to make my own comment. My comment that started this and after others was that I do believe the democrats would try and fix abortion if given the chance and not just hold it out there for votes. And that they would face a back lash for it but I think would do it anyway. Be honest, I usually go from last comment wherever it takes me. I am not good at staying on topic. I am not purposeful in this but it is just the way it is.
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lifeiswhatyoumake
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441767 - 08/21/23 01:23 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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It's extremely messed up how many reports are coming out about how corrupt Justice Thomas (and others on the SC) is. It's mind boggling and seems like a gigantic "fuck you" to every single person in the USA.
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441769 - 08/21/23 01:25 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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If you believe so, you should report it to the authorities.
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441780 - 08/21/23 01:30 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: If you believe so, you should report it to the authorities.
that was your warning.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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rxb
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: lifeiswhatyoumake]
#28441784 - 08/21/23 01:32 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
lifeiswhatyoumake said: It's extremely messed up how many reports are coming out about how corrupt Justice Thomas (and others on the SC) is. It's mind boggling and seems like a gigantic "fuck you" to every single person in the USA.
not only that but it seems like they are throwing it in the face of the people that they are above the law because they are the ultimate authority.
which is down right criminal imo.
-------------------- ->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <- . i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications) [quote]Enlil said: I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: rxb]
#28441841 - 08/21/23 02:16 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Can you cite the relevant criminal statute?
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lifeiswhatyoumake
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28441852 - 08/21/23 02:26 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Perhaps the federal bribery law.
Perhaps it's 18 U.S. Code § 201 - Bribery of public officials and witnesses.
Justice Thomas and others haven't been reporting all their donations or whatever that they've received that cross the threshold amount for reporting, which they are supposed to do.
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Enlil
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: lifeiswhatyoumake]
#28441885 - 08/21/23 02:54 PM (5 months, 4 days ago) |
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Maybe. I haven't seen any evidence that any money has been paid for purposes of inducing any official act. I don't know what you mean by donation threshold, though. Justice Thomas isn't running for any office, so I don't see how he gets donations that would apply to reporting limits.
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SirTripAlot
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Enlil]
#28442609 - 08/22/23 10:02 AM (5 months, 3 days ago) |
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In the end, I think it comes up to the Justices' not even giving the appearance of impropriety / conflict of interest.
At the very least, Thomas conduct does raise unnecessary doubts regarding this, IMO. I don't think hand crafted legislation would nesscarily fix this; and in fact, politize the SCOTUS more than it already is.
If the Supremes' can't police or take it upon themselves to do this, being there are no political campaigns in their mode, the institution would fall down on its own and have less respectability. I don't think it's at that level, yet.
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Sulfurshelfsean
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: SirTripAlot]
#28448080 - 08/27/23 07:11 AM (4 months, 29 days ago) |
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si=6hkJBf-GhTyHI05q
Apparently this Leonard Leo guy has been donating the supreme Court billions...
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Sulfurshelfsean
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Re: looks like justice thomas had 3 other billionaire benefactors [Re: Sulfurshelfsean]
#28448088 - 08/27/23 07:24 AM (4 months, 29 days ago) |
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Sorry he helped funnel the money...
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