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My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone
    #28391451 - 07/10/23 03:36 PM (6 months, 15 days ago)

Second entry in what is likely to be a long psychedelic therapy journal where I'm dealing with my depression and maybe a coming divorce. I don't know if I'm writing mostly to share, or to journal my experience for myself. And as I'm sure all of you know: it is not possible to accurately or fully describe the experience. What I am writing is how I remember it now but there was MORE happening and there were also very COMPLEX things happening that I can't quite describe. So this report is just a flawed retelling of what happened.

Background. I'm a close to 40 year old man with a wife and two kids. I am an academic and work in a demanding job that pays well. Like many others I didn't marry my soulmate. Relationship is complicated. Torn between feelings of needing to take responsibility for my family and feeling that I would like to experience real love and shouldn't have committed to the first hot girl that came along just because I was lonely and desperate. We've had our ups and downs. Some good years, some really bad.

July 10th 2023

Today was a bad day for my mental health, which is an ongoing struggle. Barely functioning at work. Depression and anxiety through the roof. Almost on the close to psychotic level.

Around 4:20 pm I ate 1,47 grams dried cubensis. The first trip I ate them in chocolate bars, so this was the first experience of tasting them. I was surprised that they tasted good. I chewed and swallowed with some juice.

After one hour, nothing had happened. 90 minutes, nothing. I became frustrated. Angry. Had he sold me some grocery store mushrooms? I decided to take more, to determine if I had any shrooms at all or just ordinary mushrooms. The question was, which amount? One part of me was so frustrated that I was considering 5 grams extra. But I settled for 2 grams more.

Around 6:20 pm I shoved the handful in my mouth and chewed more properly this time. I chewed and chewed until it was all slime in my mouth. Then I swallowed. Laid on the bed and scrolled on my phone.

I think it was around 20 minutes after this that I felt that whoa, it's happening. I turned off my phone and put on my headphones with my carefully selected playlist. I closed my eyes and put a shirt on my face as an eye mask.

As I had learned from my first experience, I knew it comes in waves. It can undulate between ordinary life to complete bizareness in a fairly short amount of time. I went in with the intent to go along for the ride. I am not in control and that is OK. Just embrace all that's happening.

I saw geometric patterns and travelled through weird spaces. There was some synaesthesia, but not as strong as from my first trip. But while the first trip was more a chaos of colors, this time they looked more like geometric patterns and landscapes that made more sense. The landscape was shaped by the music, but not always in an immediately understandable way. it was more like each song set the overall mood/tone/background but then something would unfold in unpredictible ways.

I had time dilation and auditory hallucinations. One extremely odd and interesting thing that happened was that a song would create two different voices. I would hear first one voice in my right ear, and then the other voice would answer in the left ear. Completely bizarre. It was like this ordinary song was split up into two separate entities talking to each other on each side. One asking a question, the other answering. It was absolutely fascinating. There were also other weird auditory hallucinations that I can't quite describe. If I would try I would say that the shrooms altered the songs and put in completely new stuff in them that I hadn't heard before. It made me a bit afraid at first because I didn't understand what was happening but I reminded myself to just embrace the experience and soon the fear was gone.

But now to the more essential (for me) part. All this time still extreme anxiety. Extreme depression. My second trip and there was still no feeling of euphoria as they say shrooms give people. There was a CHAOS of negative emotions and thought inside me. I was reasoning, arguing inside. Trying to sort out my life, my relationship with my wife. Yes, new perspectives were open but soon something inside me pointed out that you're still doing what you're always trying to do. Analyzing, trying to identify and solve problems. The argument inside me was about my marriage and family. Should I get a divorce? Would that be selfish of me? Should I be true to myself and tell my wife I want a divorce, or live a lie so my children can grow up in a nuclear family home? I was thrusted back and forth between different perspectives... was I the victim? was I selfish? What is right and what is true?

At some point, something inside me pointed out that at the core of all the analyzing, all the arguments, it's the ME ME ME. No matter the perspective I take, it's always with the me in center. I decided to just stop thinking. Stop trying to solve. Just live. But then what would be the point if I'm not doing this to solve my problems? I had no idea but decided to just float along in this accelerating mess.

Soon I found myself with the stronger and stronger feeling that I am not important. The "me" isn't important. My life isn't important. It doesn't matter what happens to me. I have to be willing to let go of everything, truly letting go, including of myself. Letting go of my family, my life, myself. I was rapidly sailing towards this absolute feeling that nothing truly matters and especially not me. That I had to be willing to disapear completely.

Sadly, at this point, something jerked me back into the "real world". For a moment I realized that the ultimate expression of me not being important could be suicide (which I didn't want). So at this point I started resisting the trip. I opened my eyes, afraid what would lie further down the road. What if I trip far out and end up killing myself? I was terrified. I got up and collected all the razorblades in the house and went outside to throw them in the trash. I contemplated calling the police and telling them I had taken shrooms and that while I was not suicidal, I feared that if my ego would dissolve further down the trip then maybe I would kill myself. I became angry at myself for deciding to trip without a sitter. What if I ended up killing myself and leaving my family behind? How reckless of me! Was this really such a good idea?

I ended up thinking I had done what I could by throwing out the razorblades. I went back to the bed and closed my eyes again. Sadly, from this moment on I did not give myself completely to the experience, but resisted it a bit as I was not willing to risk losing my life. So I clinged to my own self which I think killed the trip a bit, because I was just on the verge of something fantastic when I became fearful and had to reclaim a bit of control.

Anyways, the trip was still ongoing but I sensed that the peak was likely behind me. I wrestled inside with the thoughts and feeling about divorce... I thought, which is the RIGHT decision? There must be one right and one wrong, and if I just reason and think about it hard enough I will arrive at the RIGHT and CORRECT decision.

Something inside me explained. There IS NO RIGHT DECISION. Stay with your wife... leave your wife? Ultimately none of that matters. Decide what you wish but there is no "right decision". You can do what you want but neither alternative is more meaningful than the other. There is no correct way of living. You just have to decide what will you do. There is no sheet with correct answers to life written down. There is no right way to live. And that is so difficult for me to accept. I need everything to make sense.

I cried. I cried hard. I thought about what a mess everything is. I thought about how broken me and my wife are (both problematic childhoods). I realized that no matter if we ever were right or wrong for each other, we managed to create something together and that has to be worth something. Our children are genuinely happy, kind and performing well in school. Do I have the right to ruin all that just because the life we're living is not at all what I want in terms of what kind of city we live in and how our daily life works? Or was it precisely what I should do? Isn't a painful truth better than trying to live a "comfortable" lie? I had intense feeling about how I need to be honest. That no matter if we end up getting divorced or not, I have to tell my wife how I feel so that we're not living a LIE. But at the same time, I fear telling her I want a divorce because that would disrupt the stability of our everyday life. And that I would regret it and then there would be no turning back. Atleast now the family life is stable, even though I am a chaotic mess on the inside. What if I ruin life for everybody else and it ends up not helping me at all?

I ended up writing a message to my mother. I told her about my struggles in my marriage. I told her I love her so much. We don't talk about such things normally. It felt liberating.

I thought about if I should message my wife instantly and tell her I want a divorce. One part of me really wanted to do it. But I don't want to do it now during the summer. Ruining the kids school break. Ruining our time off from work. I thought that now is not a good time. Better wait until after the summer. But is it ever a good time to get such a message? I realised that if I don't send it now, I probably never will.

And I ended up not sending anything either. At the same time, I don't want to text her any loving sweet message. I don't want to be dishonest.

I am thankful that she has given me two beautiful children and that she is a good mother. But I don't know if I love her at all anymore. I am sad and bitter that I agreed to relocate to another city and that she refused to go back despite it throwing me into a suicidal depression. At the same time, she is bitter that I want to go back to a place where she was extremely unhappy.

In the end, whose needs matter most? I don't know. I feel like we will never both be happy. And in the middle are our children who ideally need both their parents to be happy.

I think I will tell my wife I want a divorce. But it will have to wait until after the summer. When the kids are back in school. It doesn't have to end in an actual divorce, but maybe it will set in motion something that can turn into a better life for both of us. Maybe it will open her up to the realization that for a relationship to work, both have to be happy with where we live. And who am I to say that? I lived for 6 years extremely happy while my wife was sad and depressed and begged me that we should move. Which we eventually did, and now we're here... what a mess.

I don't know what the solution is. But I think honesty could be a part of it.

Around 9:30 I could tell the trip was over. So pretty much 2,5 hours after I started feeling the effects.

Conclusion and thoughts about the future:

I feel better now than I did earlier today. Not good, but a bit liberated in some way. Was it a 3,5 gram trip or a 2 gram trip? I don't know. But it is weird that I didn't feel anything at all from the first 1,5 grams.

It seems trips for me are short and intense. That chaotic really interesting part comes on early, and then when the visuals and audio is gone there is still a moment of a very special emotional and mental state. But overall it seems that it all is over within 3 hours. Similar to my first trip. Overall, this trip felt weaker than my first trip. At the same time, there were moments where it was INTENSE and I approached a sense of ego dissolution, which I did not do the previous time. So overall a slightly weaker trip, but I don't want to compare them to much. They were both unique in their own ways.

I liked tripping alone. The only thing that scared me was the prospect of me hurting myself. That is a problem. I want a stronger trip next time, but I realise I need someone as a safety or else I will not be able to relax into the experience. If I know that someone will prevent me from hurting myself, then I can go all the way. If I am alone and again begin fearing that I could hurt myself, then things could go very wrong.

I also suspect that I have a high tolerance to psychedelics. Today I took 3,5 grams on an almost empty stomach and I feel there is still a long way to go to have that complete mind blowing psychedelic experience. Next time I would like to try 5 or maybe 6 grams, but it has to be with a sitter. But I suspect that to go really deep I will have to dose even higher. But around 5-6 grams is probably suitable for next time.

As I said, there is absolutely nothing about tripping alone that scares me other than the possibility of me hurting/killing myself. So I need to have someone close by just to make sure I don't do that.

I also felt that I would like to trip with my mother and/or wife as there are definately things we need to work out and I think shrooms could tear down the barriers there.

Overall I feel shrooms are not a quick fix. But they seem to me like therapy on steroids. I am looking forward to go deeper next time, but it has to be with a safe person.


Edited by newaccounts (07/10/23 03:48 PM)


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Offlineorphee
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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: newaccounts]
    #28391661 - 07/10/23 07:17 PM (6 months, 15 days ago)

if i were you, i would keep experimenting at "normal" doses for a bit.

how can you suspect to have "high tolerance for psychedelics" on your second trip?


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: orphee]
    #28392431 - 07/11/23 12:55 PM (6 months, 14 days ago)

Quote:

orphee said:
how can you suspect to have "high tolerance for psychedelics" on your second trip?




Well maybe not a high tolerance but I'm definitely not on the sensitive side.
I say that because I feel like on 3,5 grams it should have been a stronger trip.

I still haven't got that "kidnapped" feeling, except for very short moments. I feel like I can at any time open my eyes, get up and perform daily tasks. I would like to go into that completely otherwordly state for longer moments and without being able to abort it at will.

---

It is interesting how the shrooms show me what really letting go feels like. I approached that state where I truly understood and felt what it means to let go completely, to be willing to leave everything. My relationship, my family, my own life, reaching a state where I could accept that if I die now then it's ok. I felt that for a short moment before I started resisting since I realized I was not willing to die or leave my children.


Edited by newaccounts (07/11/23 12:58 PM)


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: newaccounts]
    #28393429 - 07/12/23 11:20 AM (6 months, 14 days ago)

When the effects hit the first song in the playlist was "Anton Firtich - Rain over the ocean". It is a very strong and melancholic trance song:


I remember that during the breakdown of the song, I could sense that the music was shaping the visions ´behind my close eyes. But everything was pitch black. it was a complete darkness. Then as the buildup progressed, this pitch black darkness morphed into a beautiful black geometric web. A black web of sadness. The sadness of my life. And then gradually as the melody and song builds up for the drop, colors came in. But overall, all colors were very muted and dark (despite the full palette of colors being used). It's like all the colors are there, but they are on the dark side, not very bright.

Based on what I remember, looking at my playlist, I can tell that from the onset until the trip was over was not even 2,5 hours! That sure seems fast compared to the typical 6 hours people talk about. I wish it would have lasted longer. I guess lemon tek is out of the question for me since I do not wish to shorten it even further.


Edited by newaccounts (07/12/23 11:21 AM)


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Offlineorphee
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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: newaccounts]
    #28393755 - 07/12/23 05:43 PM (6 months, 13 days ago)

I'd still be wary, you haven't talked about the material itself, people are gobbling golden teachers left and right, they're also leaving them in their sock drawer for a year or two.


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: orphee]
    #28408085 - 07/25/23 03:38 PM (6 months, 20 hours ago)

Yeah, they might have been weak. I don't know. They were vacuum sealed when I got them though and I kept them in a dark drawer in room temperature before using.

The odd thing is 1,5 grams did nothing, not even after 2 hours. Then after ingestion of another 2 grams it was only 20 minutes to takeoff. Either the first shrooms I ate did not have any active stuff in them, or else there must be some kind weird treshold rule at play here (a treshhold below which nothing at all is felt).


Edited by newaccounts (07/25/23 03:40 PM)


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Offlineorphee
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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: newaccounts]
    #28409243 - 07/26/23 03:45 PM (5 months, 30 days ago)

you got them online?


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: newaccounts]
    #28410617 - 07/27/23 04:28 PM (5 months, 29 days ago)

people who have everything can certainly make themselves miserable.
and to make things worse they want to share their confusion.

as a super intelligent 40 year old Dad, let me remind you that we are all aging rapidly.
the main victims in divorce are the kids.

otherwise you must realize there is no perfect package, perfect wife, perfect husband, perfect mom, so unless there is something ongoing undermining your ability to be a good father, stop fucking around about a divorce.

use the mushrooms to learn how to appreciate the amazing progress you have all made together so far, and find ways to make that story a good one, and live your good story.

That musical hallucination you described was really cool, you have a flair for media. (and melodrama)


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28411138 - 07/28/23 01:23 AM (5 months, 29 days ago)

let it be


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28413596 - 07/30/23 07:20 AM (5 months, 27 days ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
people who have everything can certainly make themselves miserable.
and to make things worse they want to share their confusion.

as a super intelligent 40 year old Dad, let me remind you that we are all aging rapidly.
the main victims in divorce are the kids.

otherwise you must realize there is no perfect package, perfect wife, perfect husband, perfect mom, so unless there is something ongoing undermining your ability to be a good father, stop fucking around about a divorce.

use the mushrooms to learn how to appreciate the amazing progress you have all made together so far, and find ways to make that story a good one, and live your good story.

That musical hallucination you described was really cool, you have a flair for media. (and melodrama)




I have had an insight recently that might be a step in healing. I have not realized it before but I have clear borderline personality disorder (BPD) elements in my personality. I am a high functioning person, but I have always had somewhat of an instabilty about my emotions towards others, my identity, personal values etc.

However, there have been times in my life when I was relatively stable. And that is generally when I feel that I am free and working towards meaningful goals according to my values. I recently had a 6 year period that was the most emotionally stable I have ever been. Could have been the happiest 6 years of my life.

I have just the other day realised that the life crisis that made me depressed has exaggerated my BPD. It swings more often, more unpredictably and I have also become emotionally unstable even towards people I normally never have to question my feelings for. When I was younger I still had these swings, but they were slower and not as extreme. Since I became depressed it has been swinging like crazy.

Some days I feel like life is good and I can be happy where I am. Most days, I feel like I'd rather leave my wife and start anew and avoid making the same mistakes that made me depressed to start with. I am the kind of person who must have things my way, and I think the BPD is a big part of that. It sounds sad, but I am a person who must not compromise on matters that are important to me. That is what got me depressed in the first place (I made a great sacrifice for my wife).

But I guess the most constructive thing to do would be to kill off the part of me that wants to leave and let the person who can be happy here grow stronger. But it is difficult. We will see if shrooms can help. Last time I took them I had strong impulsed that I have to let go of my emotional attachments to my family to become truly happy again. And that would certainly make my wife and kids miserable...


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: newaccounts]
    #28413627 - 07/30/23 07:44 AM (5 months, 27 days ago)

Also, I'm pretty sure my mother has BPD as well.

I have also thought about this thing about the story/narrative that we are all living in. I know we should not confuse our personal narrative with the real world, but that is the default way of thinking for most people. The narrative is the reality. I'm working on reinterpreting my personal narrative and simultanously trying to realise that the narrative in my head is not objective reality. The world/universe is much greater and more wonderful than the limited and flawes conceptions I have.


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: newaccounts]
    #28414907 - 07/31/23 09:48 AM (5 months, 26 days ago)

you do not have to kill off anything.

each part of you is valid.

all your emotions are valid even if you have not accepted the naturalness of them as triggered responses, or if you have come to doubt yourself because of emotional susceptibility - we all have it.

Emotion is something I keep learning about and working to relax around, and working to recover from quickly and gently.

In fact, emotion actually produces a beneficial shift in mental resonance as if you have suddenly become stoned, and can see things in an altered perspective, but also suddenly afflicted with a kind of body load, through tears, sobbing, laughter, fright or whatever.

Owning your emotional experiences is a wonderful thing, just do not take them seriously or literally as having specific meaning other than you had a reflex response to some triggering mental contents.


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28418382 - 08/03/23 08:49 AM (5 months, 23 days ago)

Beautiful post.

I also sometimes get that suicidal scare. Very scary.

I would advise telling your wife about your trip. Trip with her on lower doses. Tell her about your BPD. Trust your wife. Share with your wife. Go to couples therapy. Be honest. Spill the beans. Open up. Maybe it will lead to divorce. Maybe it will lead to a happy marriage. Maybe nothing will change at all. Communicate with your wife.

Instead of taking shrooms for an isolated experience, see your wife as the mushroom and she is the drug and get high on a conversation with her.

Good luck :smile:


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: Soul Flight]
    #28427237 - 08/09/23 02:27 PM (5 months, 16 days ago)

Death aspects have been part of several of my trips, or perhaps most of them and coming to terms with it seems to have been the best way to handle it in my case. Once I even tried to entertain the thought of killing myself or otherwise dying to see where it goes but then it didn't get anywhere at all and at the same time took away the fears so I could get onto the more interesting parts of a trip.

Sounds like you are between a rock and a hard place. I hope there's a way to at least get rid of the rock without disrupting things too much...


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Re: My second trip: 3,5 grams dried cubensis alone [Re: MindMeower]
    #28428733 - 08/10/23 04:49 PM (5 months, 15 days ago)

I think the wife needs to be in on this.  She needs to know how her actions are affecting you and you need to get your emotions out in the open.  I think it would be healthy for both of you.

I agree with the suggestion to trip together.  There could be something special, cathartic, even, about going in together and just letting the trip take you where its going to take you, together.  There might be a special kind of bond that develops through a mutually-shared experience of wonder. Or of crisis.  You might find that you share even just one very special moment.

I don't speak from personal experience, but I've read a LOT of trip reports on here and there certainly seems to be a bonding that can happen and actually last.  Not like MDMA or alcohol where its a temporary feeling, but a genuine 'growing together.'  I know cannabis has had a deeply positive impact on my relationship and has brought us to understand and care for eachother in ways we didn't previously.  I expect more of the same with mushrooms and cactus/LSD if we ever can acquire/decide to go that route.

Just my $.02.  You know your situation best, but I think it bears consideration.


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Love is everything
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