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Offlinekoods
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #28404169 - 07/22/23 04:36 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

koods said:
Mueller specifically noted that their investigation into Manaforts Russian contacts was stymied by lies and obstruction by witnesses and Manafort himself.



What does Manafort have to do with the Trump campaign conspiring or coordinating with the Russian government in its election interference activities?




That’s what they were trying to figure out. Why was he sharing campaign data with Russian agents? Why did he remibe support for Ukraine from the Republican platform? Why did he lie about his Russian contacts?


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Offlinegww
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: koods]
    #28404176 - 07/22/23 04:44 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

Fw
Do you realize that people in america can and have been convicted in conspiracies with out having coordinated with each other? 

I was not responding to your first post though my response, in my mind would fit, and is factual.  Especially since I took the position that regardless of the spoken communication between them not being as important as the actual out come for america that both worked towards.  Using each other if you will.
Cheers
gww


Edited by gww (07/22/23 04:46 PM)


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: koods]
    #28404177 - 07/22/23 04:44 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

Quote:

koods said:
That’s what they were trying to figure out. Why was he sharing campaign data with Russian agents?



To show that Trump was a serious contender.

Quote:

koods said:
Why did he remibe support for Ukraine from the Republican platform?



Why should he support Ukraine over Russia if he believes in world peace?

Quote:

koods said:
Why did he lie about his Russian contacts?



Tell me what you're referring to and maybe I can explain.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #28404181 - 07/22/23 04:47 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

Because Russia is the aggressor


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Offlinegww
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #28404194 - 07/22/23 04:58 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

Quote:

To show that Trump was a serious contender.




If trump is not colluding with russia, why does it need to know he is a contender during an election?  They would figure that out if he won.
Quote:

Why should he support Ukraine over Russia if he believes in world peace?



Why have you supported that russia should win and had no choice but to invade?  If Ukraine won and the fighting stopped there would be peace.  If russia had not invaded there would be peace.  Wanting russia to win is only war like and in no way a position that is only about peace.  You pick a winner whether anyone likes it or not and that is peace?  Your winner invades and that is peace?
Cheers
gww


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: gww]
    #28404197 - 07/22/23 05:02 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

I'm sure death brings peace.  Russia has been responsible for a lot of deaths, both russian and Ukrainian....in that way, Russia has brought some peace to some people.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: gww]
    #28404201 - 07/22/23 05:05 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

Quote:

gww said:
Quote:

To show that Trump was a serious contender.




If trump is not colluding with russia, why does it need to know he is a contender during an election?  They would figure that out if he won.
Quote:

Why should he support Ukraine over Russia if he believes in world peace?



Why have you supported that russia should win and had no choice but to invade?  If Ukraine won and the fighting stopped there would be peace.  If russia had not invaded there would be peace.  Wanting russia to win is only war like and in no way a position that is only about peace.  You pick a winner whether anyone likes it or not and that is peace?  Your winner invades and that is peace?
Cheers
gww




I do not want this to delve into what is already being discussed in the Ukraine war thread, any Ukraine war references here should have multiple, non-state funded or affiliated sources.


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Edited by sudly (07/22/23 11:47 PM)


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Offlinekoods
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #28404386 - 07/22/23 07:49 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

koods said:
That’s what they were trying to figure out. Why was he sharing campaign data with Russian agents?



To show that Trump was a serious contender.

Quote:

koods said:
Why did he remibe support for Ukraine from the Republican platform?



Why should he support Ukraine over Russia if he believes in world peace?

Quote:

koods said:
Why did he lie about his Russian contacts?



Tell me what you're referring to and maybe I can explain.




He went on meet the press or one of those Sunday shows and was asked about his connections to Russia and he said he had none. One of the reasons he was fired as campaign manager is because that statement was revealed to be a lie



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Invisiblebudmanman
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: koods]
    #28404407 - 07/22/23 07:57 PM (6 months, 3 days ago)

"Trump refuses to listen to anybody"

And that is why he is the best candidate.


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Everything I have ever said is total bogus bs I am full of crud therefore everything I say should never be taken literal.

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Invisiblenooneman
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: budmanman]
    #28404650 - 07/22/23 11:49 PM (6 months, 2 days ago)

Trump wants to be president forever. Permanently.


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Invisiblebudmanman
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: nooneman]
    #28404657 - 07/23/23 12:08 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

As any good president who loves his job would want.

Most get their ass worn out and hated it and come out the other end of being president looking like aged milk



But trump Aged like wine


--------------------
Everything I have ever said is total bogus bs I am full of crud therefore everything I say should never be taken literal.

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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: budmanman]
    #28404683 - 07/23/23 01:02 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

Not really a place for whatever you're implying, if you have policies you'd like to bring up or address, go ahead.


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Offlineshivas.wisdom
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: sudly] * 1
    #28404768 - 07/23/23 03:40 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

He's implying that Trump is sexy.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: koods]
    #28404776 - 07/23/23 03:58 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

koods said:
Why did he lie about his Russian contacts?



Tell me what you're referring to and maybe I can explain.



He went on meet the press or one of those Sunday shows and was asked about his connections to Russia and he said he had none. One of the reasons he was fired as campaign manager is because that statement was revealed to be a lie





No, Manafort had ties to Ukraine.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #28404796 - 07/23/23 04:30 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

If you want to make claims like Manafort has ties to Ukraine after saying that you can explain, please do so and reference where possible from non state or non state affiliated sources.

E.g. here it is claimed that Manafort had ties to Yanukovych and pro Russian political parties within Ukraine. That he lied on his interactions with Kilimnik, and that Kilimnik was suspected of being an intermediary for the Russian military intelligence operation to hack into Democratic emails.

Quote:

Manafort set to work rebranding the party with poll-tested messaging and improved stagecraft. Before long, the Party of Regions was in power in Kyiv. One of his key aides in Ukraine was, allegedly, a Russian spy.

The Senate Intelligence Committee report on Trump and Russia said Konstantin Kilimnik was both “a Russian intelligence officer” and “an integral part of Manafort’s operations in Ukraine and Russia.

”According to the Senate report, Manafort met Kilimnik twice in person while working on the Trump campaign, messaged with him electronically and shared “sensitive campaign polling data” with him.

Senate investigators wrote in their report that they suspected Kilimnik served as “a channel for coordination” on the Russian military intelligence operation to hack into Democratic emails and leak them.

The Senate intel report notes that in about a dozen interviews with Special Counsel Robert Mueller, Manafort “lied consistently” about “one issue in particular: his interactions with Kilimnik.”

Manafort didn’t make it to Election Day on the Trump campaign. In August 2016, The New York Times revealed that handwritten ledgers recovered from Yanukovych’s estate showed nearly $13 million in previously undisclosed payments to Manafort from Yanukovych and his pro-Russian party. Manafort was pushed out of his job as Trump’s campaign chairman less than a week later.

After Trump won the election, the Senate report says, Manafort and Kilimnik worked together on a proposed “plan” for Ukraine that would create an Autonomous Republic of Donbas in separatist-run southeast Ukraine, on the Russian border. Manafort went so far as to work with a pollster on a survey on public attitudes to Yanukovych, the deposed president. The plan only would need a “wink” from the new U.S. president, Kilimnik wrote to Manafort in an email.

https://www.propublica.org/article/lets-recall-what-exactly-paul-manafort-and-rudy-giuliani-were-doing-in-ukraine




All in all, if he obstructed justice it worked, because he took the fall for financial crimes but was inevitably pardoned by Trump.

Thus the interactions between Manafort and Kilimnik are not clarified, and the specifics of what ties Manafort may have within Ukraine are a bit clearer.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: sudly]
    #28404812 - 07/23/23 04:57 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

Yanukovych was Ukrainian, and Manafort was a tax cheat.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #28404823 - 07/23/23 05:10 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

Are you implying anything with that or just saying it for the sake of saying it?


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: sudly]
    #28404866 - 07/23/23 06:14 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

Koods claimed Manafort "was asked about his connections to Russia and he said he had none. One of the reasons he was fired as campaign manager is because that statement was revealed to be a lie."

Manafort didn't have connections to Russia, he had connections to Ukraine.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineSulfurshelfsean
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #28404878 - 07/23/23 06:26 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

koods said:
No need to interpret anything. I said exactly why trump makes the US look bad - he’s a moral degenerate.



Ok, so I was right - you weren't responding to my video, you were just making a random 'Trump's a big fat poo poo head' post.




There's the twisting of the words and the confirmation bias again...


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Offlinekoods
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Re: Definitely not Russian propaganda or conspiracy theories [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #28404883 - 07/23/23 06:33 AM (6 months, 2 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Koods claimed Manafort "was asked about his connections to Russia and he said he had none. One of the reasons he was fired as campaign manager is because that statement was revealed to be a lie."

Manafort didn't have connections to Russia, he had connections to Ukraine.



His Ukrainian connections were Russian spies


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