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InvisibleLithop
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28400693 - 07/19/23 12:16 PM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

syncro said:
I reckoned it. :oldman: I thought you're saying you left that position of the nine, though a moving line, as in original, and took the transformation which to me seemed to confirm it in the hexes in the upper right corners of the cards. Only the fourth from the bottom was changed, whereas I figure the nine corresponds to the third from the bottom which was not transformed. :crazy2: As well I'm not clear on how you are identifying moving/changing lines from the numbers.



Ok, I feel you.
So when throwing coins, you throw them as a group of 3, 6 times.
This gives you your 6 lines that comprise your hexagram.

One side ofthe coin is ascribed value of 2 and the other 3, let say 2 for tails and 3 for heads.

So in this case the cast was:
First throw: 2, 2 and 3 for 7 IE __ (Stable/ young Yin).
Second throw: 2, 2 and 3 for __ again.
Third throw: 3, 3 and 2 for 8 IE _ _ (Stable / youngYang).

FOURTH THROW 3, 3 and 3 for 9 IE -o- (moving/changing/ Old Yang)
^see how the fourth line up is the first changing or 'unstable' line?

Then the last 3 (oops my bad) 2 throws gave a numeric value that doesn't signify a changing line.

If it looks fucking complicated I'm sorry :lol:

Quote:

syncro said:
since sometimes we don't get changing lines, and also we may not consider the transformation even if we do have changing lines.?




If you get changing lines it's my understanding that you have to consider the transformation and how it leads to the 2nd created hexagram but if you threw, say, all 7's then there would be NO TRANSFORMED hexagram- as there were no 'unstable lines' so you would only get one hexagram that you would have to glean all information from (until you look at more complex castin methods... but lets not :lol:)

Hope that makes sense dude, I'm aware it reads like some real Pepe Silvia shit :lmao:
:nyan:

:EDIT: some numerical mistake about 'other 2, not 3' throws cleared up... and yin/ yang shit.... Sorry man, doh


Edited by Lithop (07/19/23 12:32 PM)


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: Lithop]
    #28400717 - 07/19/23 12:40 PM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Ok, so my previous assumption was off and I see the 4th row change. Why is 3+3+3=9, changing?


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InvisibleLithop
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28400736 - 07/19/23 01:09 PM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

syncro said:
Ok, so my previous assumption was off and I see the 4th row change. Why is 3+3+3=9, changing?




I'm not 100% sure on how/ why in some sense but from lowest value to highest, 2+2+2 equalling 6 is changing, anything equal to 7 or 8 is stable and 3+3+3 is 9 and thus changing/unstable.


I can't really explain why because I don't know how to/ don't remember why, the best I can offer is that it's about being able to get the full range from stable Yin and Yang to unstable Yin and Yang energies expressed in the cast.

Apologies that I can't clear that up any better man:shrug:


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: Lithop]
    #28400898 - 07/19/23 03:50 PM (6 months, 6 days ago)

The wiki and iching online go into the working with different probabilities created by the various methods, the yarrow stalk method having old yang more likely than old yin, etc.


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28400917 - 07/19/23 04:02 PM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

At I Ching Online we use the 3 Coins method, where the chance for an Old Yin is equal to that for an Old Yang, but with the yarrow stalk method, the chance for an Old Yin to appear is three times more rare than for an Old Yang.




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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28400930 - 07/19/23 04:13 PM (6 months, 6 days ago)

3 Coins method  Yarrow Stalk method
old yang        1 / 8          3 / 16
young yin      3 / 8          7 / 16
young yang      3 / 8          5 / 16
old yin        1 / 8          1 / 16


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InvisibleLithop
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28401353 - 07/20/23 02:56 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

syncro said:
Quote:

At I Ching Online we use the 3 Coins method, where the chance for an Old Yin is equal to that for an Old Yang, but with the yarrow stalk method, the chance for an Old Yin to appear is three times more rare than for an Old Yang.






Quote:

syncro said:
3 Coins method  Yarrow Stalk method
old yang        1 / 8          3 / 16
young yin      3 / 8          7 / 16
young yang      3 / 8          5 / 16
old yin        1 / 8          1 / 16




Interesting, I wonder why.


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: Lithop]
    #28401371 - 07/20/23 04:01 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Yang more likely to becoming, Yin more to being?

I wonder if the other versions changed it for convenience or other. Checking the wiki again I see that most methods listed do appear to retain the probabilities of the yarrow stalk method. Modified three coin method, two and four coins methods retain them.


Edited by syncro (07/20/23 04:04 AM)


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InvisibleLithop
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28401373 - 07/20/23 04:04 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

syncro said:
I wonder if the other versions changed it for convenience or other. Checking the wiki again I see that most methods listed do appear to retain the probabilities of the yarrow stalk method. Modified three coin method, two and four coins methods retain them.



All certainly seem more convenient than bone crack method :lol:


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: Lithop] * 1
    #28401378 - 07/20/23 04:17 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

"The oracle bones bear the earliest known significant corpus of ancient Chinese writing" Interesting.

"No one can know how many oracle bones, prior to 1899, were ground up by traditional Chinese pharmacies and disappeared into people's stomachs."


Edited by syncro (07/20/23 04:18 AM)


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28401386 - 07/20/23 04:35 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

I did an inquiry: Yang more likely to becoming, Yin more to being?

And got Enthusiasm becoming Stagnation.

Perhaps Yang losing its becoming has reflection in modern times. Or in the transformed hex,

Heaven and Earth move away from each other.
In the ensuing void, the small invade where the great have departed.
There is no common meeting ground, so the Superior Person must fall back on his inner worth and decline the rewards offered by the inferior invaders.


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28401392 - 07/20/23 04:40 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Admittedly that was unfair in general to the three coin method that lessens Yang's becoming relatively.


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28401397 - 07/20/23 04:56 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Two changing lines in the transformation.

Compulsive enthusiasm can be set right if it learns from its mistakes.

Thorough self-diagnosis of his own affliction keeps him safely from the brink of fatal error.


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OfflineBuster_Brown
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28401418 - 07/20/23 05:34 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Cyclical patterns may be evident



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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #28401477 - 07/20/23 06:26 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Repulse the Monkey (Taijiquan Movement)





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OfflineBuster_Brown
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28401491 - 07/20/23 06:46 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

...and yet duplication is expected, perhaps not to the extent of monoculture.


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #28401521 - 07/20/23 07:37 AM (6 months, 6 days ago)

Inquiry: Can the world improve, or is it just a monkey (karma) factory?

The Caldron

Fire rises hot and bright from the Wood beneath the sacrificial caldron:
The Superior Person positions himself correctly within the flow of Cosmic forces.

Supreme Accomplishment.

SITUATION ANALYSIS:
Your needs are coming into harmony with the requirements of the Cosmos.
Blending brilliantly with the Dance of Life, you are becoming an actual element of Cosmic Law.
Your goals will now be realized because you no longer cut against the Cosmic grain; you are no longer swimming against the flow of the Tao.
You are acquiring an intuitive sense of what can and cannot be, and aligning your efforts accordingly.


One changing line:

Tip over the caldron and get rid of its stagnant contents once and for all.
He marries a woman to give her children a home.
Blameless.


Transformed hex is to Great Treasures

The Fire of clarity illuminates the Heavens to those below:
The Superior Person possesses great inner treasures -- compassion, economy, and modesty.
These treasures allow the benevolent will of Heaven to flow through him outward to curb evil and to further good.

Supreme success.


Edited by syncro (07/20/23 07:42 AM)


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OfflineBuster_Brown
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: syncro]
    #28401578 - 07/20/23 08:52 AM (6 months, 5 days ago)

Well that certainly upstaged Preston & Child's Pendergast.


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Onlinesyncro
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #28401603 - 07/20/23 09:27 AM (6 months, 5 days ago)

Inquiry: What of the problem of not having read the Pendergast series?

Following

Thunder beneath the Lake's surface.
The Superior Person allows himself plenty of sheltered rest and recuperation while awaiting a clear sign to follow.

Supreme success.
No mistakes if you keep to your course.

SITUATION ANALYSIS:
Thunder from the Lake -- the lulling, rhythmic roar of the faithful tide, eternally wearing away the stone of the shoreline, forever obedient to the phases of the moon.
The pull of the moon on the tide is the Following called for now.
As mighty as the tide is in its own right, it is ever the puppet of the invisible, irresistible gravity of the moon.
What cyclical forces pull you along?
Are you futilely attempting to resist a natural attraction?


No changing lines.


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OfflineBuster_Brown
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Re: I have aTarot deck with a Mind of it's own [Re: Lithop]
    #28402512 - 07/21/23 05:42 AM (6 months, 5 days ago)

Re: "proper" and "half assed"

Perhaps Yeats' "the center cannot hold" refers to the mule headed human predilection towards standards of conduct, by which half assed can be considered a compliment in disguise.


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