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Kizzle
Misanthrope


Registered: 08/30/11
Posts: 9,870
Last seen: 2 months, 8 days
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#19825896 - 04/10/14 09:40 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
-" optimal temperature for mycelium growth is 20 degrees Celsius"
Quote:
This suggest that temps lower than 65 degrees F will kill cobweb mold
You know 20C is 68F so I doubt both are true. I actually don't know of any fungus that is (cold)killed by temperatures above freezing. Most can even survive freezing. I believe what they're saying is it's prevalence dies out during the colder periods and disease occurs less often, not that the fungus itself is killed by those temperatures. Or in other words growing mushrooms or plants at those temperatures it would make them less susceptible but if you raise the temperature back up the effect isn't permanent.
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sparkle
Farmer



Registered: 07/28/11
Posts: 1,133
Loc: Philippines
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#19826318 - 04/10/14 11:55 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Unfortumately, it seems like it's cobweb. We tried this experiment...we mixed at 50:50 ratio, half colonized spawn and half pressure cooked grains. Although our method was sanitary, it was not asceptic. One of the 5 full bags showed a spot of cobweb but it was overcome by the mycellia and it colonized anyway. The bags that are only half-full, only 30% did not have cobweb. From your earlier facts, it seems that cobweb only grows in the casing layer. Does it mean it needs a high oxygen level? This will explain why they flourished only in the half-filled bags. We grow our mushrooms together and not once did I see cobweb on the casing nor on bulk substrate. In fact I've only seen cobweb on agar until we got the SacO2 bags and its probably the high oxygen. We case our bags together like this
and we get giants despite the apparent prevalence of cobweb..
 So Kizzle, do you think we can still do these giant spawn bags in less than asceptic conditions?
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Kizzle
Misanthrope


Registered: 08/30/11
Posts: 9,870
Last seen: 2 months, 8 days
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: sparkle] 1
#19826525 - 04/11/14 01:05 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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There's 2 reasons I know of that it grows in the casing layer but it's possible there are other reasons. 1. It grows easily across uncolonized substrate but not colonized substrate. 2. It usually doesn't start growing until pin formation begins, when the compost is already fully colonized. Any growth that occurred in the compost before pin formation, when it gets nutrients from parasitizing the pins to start growing like wild, would be nearly invisible and would eventually be inhibited by the overwhelming mushroom mycelium.
I'm not sure why there's such a difference in using mushrooms as a food source and the mycelium since mushrooms are made of mycelium but there seems to be. Same as with other mushroom pathogens like Verticillium and Mycogone.
If you got it in a bag of spawn it was probably a different mold. Anything containing uncolonized sterile grains needs to be kept completely sterile until the mushroom mycelium fully colonizes it.
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sparkle
Farmer



Registered: 07/28/11
Posts: 1,133
Loc: Philippines
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#19836147 - 04/13/14 03:33 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thanks for the thoughtful and learned answer Kizzle. I'm not sure if we have the same cobweb but it sure seems similar to your points on your post above. But we never had cobweb before on casing and bulk but this is what I did. I combined the contam bags into 2 full bags thinking that it will suffocate the cobweb. 2 days ago..and today ...http:// . Looks like the mushroom might win the low O2 challenge
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jngy2k
Peace Keeper



Registered: 08/29/16
Posts: 27
Last seen: 1 month, 28 days
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#23767460 - 10/24/16 04:43 PM (8 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kizzle said:
UPDATE: It's been a while since I posted this. I think I can say without a doubt now that actual Dactylium is not killed by 3% hydrogen peroxide. I have however discovered there are a couple Mucorale(pin molds) species that are when growing in anaerobic conditions. Or in other words they grow when gas exchange is lacking or when the substrate is oversaturated with water. They also do not sporulate under those conditions so if you're seeing the black pins they've establish themselves well enough to compete with the mushroom mycelium even after conditions are fixed and you've most likely already lost the opportunity to fix the problem.
Very interesting insight. What do you feel is the gold standard in treating cobweb? A 10% bleach solution is more than effective from my understanding. Bleach is alkaline and turns into a salt and skips the use of citric acid when using table salt over a wet paper towel. Citric acid when using lemons contain sugar a carbohydrate that may attract other organisms.
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midnightandyou
Stranger

Registered: 01/31/19
Posts: 4
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#25804233 - 02/10/19 06:06 PM (5 years, 11 months ago) |
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Greetings! I may have pictures that would contribute, but I'm not sure what it is
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silave
Theoretical Researcher

Registered: 10/12/18
Posts: 23
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damn the cobwebs on the already fruited mush seem like they would be hard to spot with the naked eye, especially for a noob like me
-------------------- Looking to cultivate and master legal mushroom! Also interested in microscopic research on psychoactive shroom compounds.
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midnightandyou
Stranger

Registered: 01/31/19
Posts: 4
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: silave]
#25814627 - 02/15/19 01:26 PM (5 years, 10 months ago) |
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Okay thanks for replying! I think it's doing what it's supposed to do.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,916
Loc: Milky way
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: jngy2k]
#25816581 - 02/16/19 11:44 AM (5 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
jngy2k said:
Quote:
Kizzle said:
UPDATE: It's been a while since I posted this. I think I can say without a doubt now that actual Dactylium is not killed by 3% hydrogen peroxide. I have however discovered there are a couple Mucorale(pin molds) species that are when growing in anaerobic conditions. Or in other words they grow when gas exchange is lacking or when the substrate is oversaturated with water. They also do not sporulate under those conditions so if you're seeing the black pins they've establish themselves well enough to compete with the mushroom mycelium even after conditions are fixed and you've most likely already lost the opportunity to fix the problem.
Very interesting insight. What do you feel is the gold standard in treating cobweb? A 10% bleach solution is more than effective from my understanding. Bleach is alkaline and turns into a salt and skips the use of citric acid when using table salt over a wet paper towel. Citric acid when using lemons contain sugar a carbohydrate that may attract other organisms.
Gold standard is toss and don't get it the next time
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5pac3C4d3t
Stranger
Registered: 04/15/19
Posts: 2
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#26024170 - 05/31/19 02:00 AM (5 years, 7 months ago) |
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Log in to view attachment
Hello all,
Not sure if this is the best place to post this.. but I’m worried I’m having an outbreak of this spiderweb/cobweb mold... hopefully I can get some insight on this... thanks
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Fonzino
Lurker.



Registered: 11/10/19
Posts: 30
Loc: South of Heaven.
Last seen: 4 years, 9 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#26368720 - 12/08/19 09:59 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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Thank you for the great info posted here!
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Klblack
Stranger
Registered: 09/11/19
Posts: 1
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Fonzino]
#26376750 - 12/12/19 08:28 AM (5 years, 1 month ago) |
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so I'm " placing a damp paper towel over the growth and pouring salt over it" to control the mold. how long do I leave it on for?
I'm growing copelandia and it's on my grain spawn just before casing... very tiny spots but need to kill it
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Vylie
The more you know

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#26566442 - 03/30/20 03:14 AM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
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...
Edited by Vylie (02/11/21 02:17 PM)
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poisoned
untitled



Registered: 04/17/13
Posts: 1,738
Loc: Yurop
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Vylie]
#26566493 - 03/30/20 03:57 AM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
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I guess they didn't like banana or mango. Looks bacterial to me
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Vylie
The more you know

Registered: 03/11/20
Posts: 463
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: poisoned]
#26567490 - 03/30/20 02:41 PM (4 years, 9 months ago) |
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...
Edited by Vylie (02/11/21 02:17 PM)
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Spaghettio73
Instigator



Registered: 03/13/20
Posts: 167
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#26879384 - 08/13/20 11:19 PM (4 years, 5 months ago) |
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Cobweb?
No one has been able to identify it. Reading this post felt like you were there with me on several occasions to see this unfold.
So I started seeing these after germinating a spore syringe from someone not a member here. The spore syringe was a variety/ strain with witch I was unfamiliar. Mistakenly I opened a plate in front of the flow hood. If I understood correctly Cobweb spreads by fragmentation or heat large spores. Some of what you described fits perfect here. I later began to see them on clones taken after the first flush. Flushes from tubs where I was testing out casing types and Teks. I assumed it was aerial mycelium and perhaps I am getting the two confused. That said the clones just did not act right on agar. Rather than fuzz up and begin spreading out the base or head would sprout spikes. Or it would fuzz up then the top and base would spike. Sometimes followed by whispy takeover of the dish over night. One even had bright orange and green section under blacklight.
Warm pour, sandwich, plain water agar, antibacterial agar almost nothing helped. I did have luck with biopsy transfers from the leading edge of a transfer where I raised the temperature to 84-85 on low nutrient agar. Seemed to cause the mycelium to grow fast and I could get a sample before the little cactus showed themselves.
Anyway I had it pop up in a few plates where it definitely should not have been. The thought occurred to me OMG it is on the mushrooms and the dehydrator is spewing it everywhere! So I had a meltdown and started bagging things up and tossing them out. I tossed tubs with full to partial grows in them, plates, slants, tools, supplies, grains, lids, polly, ships, filter disks, HEPAs, LCs, all and anything used and waiting to be PC's. Every third day for a week I put bleach water in a garden sprayer to spray everything ceiling to floor in all rooms. I tested the carpet and it did not bleach out so it got a misting as well. Including remote controls, spray bottles, toothbrushes, the a/c unit and closet, counters, cabinets I mean everything.
So far so good. Now I wear gloves and face mask before I enter the grow space. I switched mostly to bleach water where I used to use Iso, but not for everything. Looks like it is gone. Every plate gets its own blade unsheathed only when ready. Transfers are done in sets according to variety. Switched to modified monos to keep the tubs closed. Fans, purifiers, and a/c are stopped any time anything needs to be opened. Misting is done outside. Not one contam in weeks. But I'm expecting one playing with grain jar slurries.
Recklessness from drinking and cultivating will cost me every time!
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Spaghettio73
Instigator



Registered: 03/13/20
Posts: 167
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#26879403 - 08/13/20 11:45 PM (4 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kizzle said: Despite my best efforts I've been unable to find any pictures of Cubensis with a visible sporulating cobweb mold infection nor have I been able to isolate any cobweb species from Cubensis showing any of the possible symptoms. I'm really starting to doubt the occurance is anything but rare on Cubensis. It's pretty well known that it's uncommon on some mushrooms like oysters, so frankly it wouldn't surprise me if that were the case.
How about these?

This next one was third or 4th flush. I had almost tossed these because there was growth on the stumps. I cleared off the old casing and spread a thin layer of vermiculite only on top followed by misting. I left it be for almost a week and came back to this. Looks in the lower left corner on those stumps.

Found these pics from when it started to show up in grains. That top area you can see the webbing on grain. I had pitri pics somewhere showing a center ring moving out from the center of decimated mycelium. As the mycelium reached the edge of the dish the center half looked dead flat slightly powdered or dry and barely a trace of where the mycelium made tracking radiating outward. Eventually the entire plate would go fuzzy and the ring of death moved out to the edges. Condensation on the lid showed it did not dry out and remaining food color meant the nutrients had not been depleted.


Edited by Spaghettio73 (08/14/20 03:35 AM)
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LightOfZyon
Alien
Registered: 11/08/21
Posts: 5
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
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Re: The Truth About Cobweb [Re: Kizzle]
#28392356 - 07/11/23 11:26 AM (1 year, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kizzle said:
However I confirm in cases where cobweb disease is present it can be controlled by placing a damp paper towel over the growth and pouring salt over it, and by removing mushrooms showing spotting symptoms. Some may be hesitant to try this, just keep in mind you're salting the casing layer, the damage to the mushroom mycelium is relatively small and there plenty of other areas for mushrooms to develop. That's part of the reason BTW Trichoderma almost always reoccurs once it's been growing in the spawn, Trich originating on a casing layer is much easier to treat.
Hi Kizzie,
I appreciate this is an old post and if it’s been updated anywhere please let me know.
I wanted to ask about the salt treatment for this mould? I seem to have a batch of spider mould growing across a freshly planted batch of mycelium rich grain spawn.
It has worked wonders at treating the mould and has been on for 24hours. There is still a little left it seems but I wondered how long you would recommend leaving this on for and at what point I let it breathe again. I don’t want to take it off too early but also don’t want to leave it and damage the mycelium as it’s already started to sweat.
Many thanks, Z
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