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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380377 - 06/30/23 04:37 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

I recently was shocked at how much nutrition bran flour provided for cubes in a 2021 bag run

75% coir, field capacity, mixed with 20-25% brain or flour, if mixed properly, 0,1% below field saturation

will fruit terrificily for what you pay for the brain/coir

However, since you are adding nutrition to coir, they need time to colonize, and you will have to pasteurize/sterilize your sub


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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: smalltalk_canceled]
    #28380380 - 06/30/23 04:40 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

If you want to do jars - pf tek this way, its the same, it'll just be a lot of jars

The finished subs will be self supplied, they can just be fruited as normal pf tek, top fruit jars, or in a fruiting chamber

these days if im doing a fruiting chamber, i dont use a water holding material, i just have a few inches of clean, nutritionless water in the bottom. Your subs must not be in contact with this water, they must be suspended slightly above and in no way be standing in still water.


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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: smalltalk_canceled]
    #28380386 - 06/30/23 04:45 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

would bran or bran flour be the only options, or is there something else I could use? I simply don't know where I could get bran, and ordering it isn't an option for me currently. I also should ass that im a beginner and this will be my first time doing a shoebox grow, so anything overly complicated, or with a smaller margin for error than plain coco id prefer to avoid.

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380392 - 06/30/23 04:49 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

corn flour, any grain even rice flour will work

you cant grow on pure coir, because its basically nutritionless for what you are trying to grow

hell just post a picture of all the dry food supplies/items you have in your own kitchen, and i'll decide one for you


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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: smalltalk_canceled]
    #28380418 - 06/30/23 05:07 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)



only things I have in enough amounts to actually use. worth noting that the "gluten free flour" is almost entirely millet flour, and potato starch

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380432 - 06/30/23 05:15 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

ya got the flour of the king of grains, widely celebrated by the naked, lipid-stained, violent hooligans of shroomery

the millet flour is the supreme choice, for its Millet based Flour - so if its the main component, go for it

Potato starch/fiber, is however much less nutrition than millet flour, dont go for it

Both the gluten free and the cornmeal will do fine

Try to underhydrate your coir "5%", and add NO additional water for the flour.

That will help secure a good mix

Then just load to jars and PC normally


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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: smalltalk_canceled]
    #28380435 - 06/30/23 05:18 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

okay perfect thank you! would I also add it to a bulk substrate? or would I leave my bulk substrate alone and do 100% coco

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380447 - 06/30/23 05:24 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

When they are finishing colonizing, they are ready to fruit. Breaking them up when they are 1/5 flour and 4/5 "bulk substrate coir" serves no purpose. Your flour 'pf teks' are ready to fruit or be put in fruiting conditions when they are fully colonized - as normal.
Its not a widely different from rice flour + verm + coir, its similar.

For theese bran/coir you must just wide mouth jars, or you'll have to break up the colonies to spawn them.

Which probably works with clean good practise, but adds a vector for failing to a beginner which is already simplyfying things by using PF tek which foregoes


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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: smalltalk_canceled]
    #28380453 - 06/30/23 05:27 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

right right I see

my original plan was to use half of the successful jars for fruiting and half for a shoebox grow, that way I can grow some almost certainly, but also start learning more substrate based grows

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380481 - 06/30/23 06:04 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

You have to more solidly grasp what the function here is

Any of the flours you posed a picture of - they are nutrition

Vermiculite and coir, do not constitute carbohydrates->to energy by solo effort for many competitors. They are there to flesh out the substrate, create it, give it form, holes, texture, space - but most importantly - to hold water.

Nutrition + water holding material is already all they need to fruit

Your "flour" pf tek jars here would already be at 1:3 ratio in terms of nutrition mass to water holding mass, which is not something you'd expand to more "bulk substrate water holding material" - here - coir.

There's no faster fruiting way than inoculating a substrate like the one we are discussing here - because there is no secondary phase where it's forced to expand to more water or nutrition.


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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: smalltalk_canceled]
    #28380527 - 06/30/23 06:49 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

okay that makes sense! one small question though, how can you be sure the substrate won't be contaminated? no matter what it's going to be exposed to the air and get contaminations in it.

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380530 - 06/30/23 06:50 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

You sterilize it in a pressure cooker, inoculate in an SAB or in front of an LFH and wait for full colonization.


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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: smalltalk_canceled]
    #28380532 - 06/30/23 06:51 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

Quote:

smalltalk_canceled said:
havent several people become banned, martyrs or outcasts by chasing the mad dream of the paper, wood, cardboard type of cube nutrition theory?

i never visited this outside trying 2-3 pure sawdust jars spawned to coir, and it failed miserably.

if there were fruits they were mini
or singular

-

Now, usually the situation outlined above, comes from people being unable to

a) source coir
b) source coir-verm (autism demanding completeness or nothing)


If you have coir, you can add any carbohydrate you can consume to it, and the cubes will use it as nutrition. Think: any grain flour, corn, rice, maybe not potatoe

Fats, protein, are generally to be avoided, they should not make up the large part of the water carrying bulk sub or nutrition for cubes.

Pure ground up bran, 15-20% to rest straight coir, would work. Inoculate with whatever. However the substrate itself will need to be pasteurized or sterilized.

Starch water from boiling grains saturating sawdust would work, but be shitty material for a whole sub to be composed of, but a competent grower could pull it off with almost no preparation or reading.

But i dont know of anything coming close to the properties of uncontaminated coir, when it comes to casing, supplying water, and generally being close to 0 nutrition for most fungi and competitors - when composed of pure coir and nothing else

If you cannot source coir or succeed by yourself in for example, adding a proper amount of nutrition to a soil based substrate, hydrating and sterilizing it, successfully inoculating and colonization, followed by spawn and fruits,
which is harder than grains to coir but still the same principles,

or any of the 1000 other variants,

then soak paper in starch water, mix it with relevant manure, and call it a thesis






Well, yeah if you wanna use wood as the source of nutrition but pretty sure Workman actually has a sawdust substrate tek for cubes


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:pm:Ask about free prints: Ps tampanesis, subtropicalis, cubensis(ESS) and Pan cyanescens:pm:
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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: SirPsycho]
    #28380533 - 06/30/23 06:53 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

are we still talking about bulk substrates? like the kind that goes into a shoebox grow?

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380536 - 06/30/23 06:55 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

What STC is suggesting is similar to pf tek and needs sterilization. IIRC Workman's sawdust tek was a traditional sub tek that gets mixed with colonized grain like coir in open air


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:pm:Ask about free prints: Ps tampanesis, subtropicalis, cubensis(ESS) and Pan cyanescens:pm:
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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: SirPsycho]
    #28380541 - 06/30/23 06:58 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

right right.

but in a typical shoebox grow you'd do 1 quart colonized PF tek jars and 3 quarts of pure hydrated coir?

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380542 - 06/30/23 06:59 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

No, don't break pf tek into bulk. It defeats one of the major purposes of pf tek


--------------------
:pm:Ask about free prints: Ps tampanesis, subtropicalis, cubensis(ESS) and Pan cyanescens:pm:
Balance in life is like running on ice.

  πŸ…‘πŸ…žπŸ…£πŸ…£πŸ…›πŸ…” πŸ…–πŸ…πŸ…πŸ…–

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: SirPsycho]
    #28380543 - 06/30/23 07:00 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

wouldn't that provide more yield though? I understand there's a risk with it, thus doing have my pf tek jars normally and half in a shoebox.

is it IMPOSSIBLE to do a shoebox grow with PF tek jars or is it just not the usual method.

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: mystictherapy]
    #28380547 - 06/30/23 07:04 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

Quote:

mystictherapy said:
wouldn't that provide more yield though? I understand there's a risk with it, thus doing have my pf tek jars normally and half in a shoebox.

is it IMPOSSIBLE to do a shoebox grow with PF tek jars or is it just not the usual method.



Not much of a difference.

You can just bury pf cakes whole in coir. Just put as many as you can fit next to each other in a bin and fill in with coir. Top layer about 1/4"


--------------------
:pm:Ask about free prints: Ps tampanesis, subtropicalis, cubensis(ESS) and Pan cyanescens:pm:
Balance in life is like running on ice.

  πŸ…‘πŸ…žπŸ…£πŸ…£πŸ…›πŸ…” πŸ…–πŸ…πŸ…πŸ…–

"Mist your balls and fan your asshole" - Pandaskis, 2023

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Re: Wood and cubensis [Re: SirPsycho]
    #28380558 - 06/30/23 07:17 PM (1 year, 6 months ago)

is crumbling the cakes up and colonizing that way not advised?

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