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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,807
Loc: Canada
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: djbabyjesus] 7
#28497364 - 10/09/23 08:13 AM (3 months, 17 days ago) |
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Let’s all tone down the accusations and flaming please. This thread is actually interesting.
OP I like where you are trying to go here, good science should be repeatable and tested thoroughly. If you would like my two cents on the matter the first piece is that bio assay is very imprecise. The way I would skirt that issue for this test would be to find a clone or isolate that is very weak. Something almost bunk. Then see if the additives can increase the potency. This might be easier to measure than starting with already average or strong fruit.
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nektar61
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Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate 5
#28350008 - 06/06/23 07:11 PM (7 months, 18 days ago) |
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I know this is suggested here often for decades, but I actually did it, with clones, and with a control: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28349910
-------------------- -NEW? Start here.
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Yahra
Meow


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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: argenpills] 4
#28362195 - 06/16/23 02:28 PM (7 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
explain to us how we can make our mushrooms better in a cheap way with a simple element
Mushrooms don't need to be made better. They are perfect as they are.
Plain, pure nature. No need to mess around with it.
-------------------- Disobey
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: nektar61] 4
#28499369 - 10/10/23 08:20 PM (3 months, 16 days ago) |
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Yeah, I have doubts that dmt just converts to psilocin when introduced to the sub. I have no idea why he'd think such a thing, but maybe I'm wrong. I'm not a a famous drug chemist, or any kind of chemist, and I doubt he was much of a mycologist.
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Smellyhobbit
Actual Retard



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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: djbabyjesus] 3
#28495757 - 10/07/23 06:45 PM (3 months, 19 days ago) |
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Quote:
djbabyjesus said: I’m gonna ask you again since you avoided the question (another tell tell sign of deception lol)
Have you been posting this information on any other site than the shroomery?
*shines flash light into your eyeholes*
Idk, I thought the cop jokes were kinda clever and humorous…sorry to ‘creep you out’ or what ever lol
I felt it was an appropriate analogy to the situation. Even if you are infact being totally honest, there are people on here that aren’t. It just so happens to be revolving around the very topic you posted about. If it was an honest mistake on your part, then I apologize, it was an honest mistake on my part and you are free to go.
Maybe do another experiment to regain your street cred? I’d support that.
Hey bro this cop talk needs to chill the fuck out. People really don’t take kindly to those types of accusations and insinuations. Wouldn’t be surprised if your account gets put on ice if you don’t watch your language.
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: nektar61] 3
#28499669 - 10/11/23 06:03 AM (3 months, 15 days ago) |
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Psychoactive fungi are organisms which do not require many environmental resources, with the exception of water, to produce fruit and chemistry. The highest concentrations of these compounds are found in species growing in environments nearly void of resources other than decaying wood, grasses, and water.
I am inclined to believe that cereal grains by comparison are quite rich, and provides more than the organism can handle.

I'd be very surprised if it could be proven that supplementation beyond the addition of cereal grains would have any effect whatsoever, unless one could identify a gap in the provision supplied by any particular grain. Grains are rich in fats, proteins, amino acids, l-tryptophan, etc.
I would lean more in the direction of complex symbiosis with other organsms rather than direct feeding via supplementation.
Edited by Stipe-n Cap (10/12/23 07:51 AM)
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Land Trout
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: nektar61] 3
#28503752 - 10/13/23 08:36 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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Thanks for doing this stuff Nektar. It always baffled me that people could think adding stuff like that would change what the mushroom produces. If organisms worked like that the natural world would be very strange. And thank you to the mods for helping to keep things civil.
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: on_a_dventure] 3
#28549895 - 11/20/23 07:35 AM (2 months, 6 days ago) |
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Lol.
This is about boosting trypatamine content in fruit bodies by amending substrate with precursors like melatonin.
You appear to be talking about boosting tryptamine content in mycelium by amending LC with....whatever your amendments are. I have to say I'm a tad disappointed that you're addressing us with the shorthand of a 13 yo girl who's texting her besty for make-up tips, instead of proper English, which causes me to have doubts.
Perhaps you can provide a few more details? I'd be interested to hear how you're achieving this.
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nektar61
Into SporePlay



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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: argenpills] 2
#28362212 - 06/16/23 02:45 PM (7 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
argenpills said: Predicting what a biological organism will do is very difficult.
Agreed. Which is why I think that the lab standard pre-human trial technique of head-twitch response (HTR) using mice is a horrible indication of if a drug is psychedelic, or of how much, or in what way.
Sasha Shulgin believed this strongly, even though he'd cut his research teeth working for a large pharmaceutical company that did things like that. Sasha and his wife tested new drugs they created on themselves and on willing friends. His published one-short paragraph assessments of x amount of mg of each new substance say more than 20 pages of mouse results could.
Quote:
argenpills said: We have to consider the starting point, such as starting with spores and how long ago those spores were taken from the mushrooms. If we start with agar on a plate or in a liquid culture, we have to make sure the mycelium is not "old" (mycelium ages and loses potency)...
My shroom tests were grown the same way I grow all my shrooms, and I grow constantly. I grow much more than I ingest. I've grown so many that I'm tired of eating them. Other than these recent tests, I mostly just grow them.
These shrooms were grown from fresh spores I collected from previous grows, then put on agar, allowed it to sit about six weeks until it pinned on agar. I made a clone from a plin (plate pin, often the first one is a good candidate for a strong robust clone culture), and used T1 from agar of that to grow these shrooms. There was no senescence here.
They were grown on the same shelf next to each other. Kept at 70 degrees F. Given 6500 k light 12 hours a day once pins showed. Misted as needed.
I didn't explain that in my report because I'd been explaining it all in the forums here as I went along. Didn't include it because I wanted my report to be short enough for laymen to actually read it.
There was no difference in growing, except the two with additions of chemicals took a 3 to 5 days longer to pin. I explained that in my report. I'll link this post in my report, since it offers more information.
I didn't weigh yields, which was a mistake, but doesn't invalidate my experiment. I provided photos of each shoebox grow, they were similar. Dried weight would have been within 5 to 10 percent the same, as would be would be with any clone shoebox grow I grow.
I picked the shrooms once they opened, and dried the shrooms in a dehydrator at 180 F for 24 hours. This doesn't diminish the potency at all. I vacuum sealed the shrooms immediately after trying so there would be no degradation of potency until the up to 6 weeks later that I ingested them. Here's a link to more info on my drying and vacuum tek.
Quote:
argenpills said: The link I shared with you resolved many of these doubts for me but raised new ones that go beyond my current capacity for study. I don't think any of these guys here will join our conversation and explain to us how we can make our mushrooms better in a cheap way with a simple element...
I think Yahra's comment just above this is accurate; "Mushrooms don't need to be made better. They are perfect as they are."
Not sure I agree with the second part "Plain, pure nature. No need to mess around with it.", but I do in the sense of chemical additions, and my experiment was just to see if the suggestions from many noobs who've never grown a shroom of adding these substances had any merit. I'm convinced these two substances as grow additions have no merit.
We do "mess with it" around here, in the form of coming up with and selecting new varieties of mushrooms, usually cubes (Psilocybe cubensis). If hundreds of people hand't "messed around with it over the past 25 years (Shroomery is one of the longest-running sites on the Internet), there would be only one variety of magic mushroom, it wouldn't be very strong, and you'd have to go out into a cow pasture after a rain and risk getting caught or even shot to pick it.
I did that myself several times, near San Antonio Texasin 1985, didn't get shot, but did get caught and chased once. Other people I know had warning shots from shotguns blasted over their heads once.
Members of the Shroomery community do a lot of work with improving shrooms by selection, and risk prison to do it. Most popular "strains" (actually varieties is more accurate) of Psilocybe cubensis mushrooms were selected, named, and disseminated from this site. People here are the forefront of it.
I'm working on selecting for an improved, taller, stronger sub-variety of x7x cubes right now. That's a variety that was created by a member here who is in, interestingly for you, Argentina.
But I'm standing on the shoulders of giants, of citizen scientist / gardeners who are obsessed with this stuff.
I appreciate you replying and explaining your position. I hope you stick around and I will read that link you sent.
Katrina
-------------------- -NEW? Start here.
Edited by nektar61 (06/16/23 03:02 PM)
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x7x_x7x
x7x, my problem child.




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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: argenpills] 2
#28370482 - 06/22/23 05:42 PM (7 months, 2 days ago) |
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man, meet your business.
all we know the foundations of scientific research and our attitude is light years the conception of reality and science the common people have. all we heard thousands of times speechs like yours, you point of view isn't new here and isn't new in every place were true research are doing. here, nobody have time to lost trying to please the standard establishment in psychological research. if you feel unconfortable here, leave this site peacefully. no one will go after you or question anything. This is simply not your place.
Quote:
argenpills said: I will gladly replicate it to see if anything happens "by eye." But the reality is that this experiment from the beginning is destined to have no results, and let me explain why...
It would be good to carry out this experiment involving more people who are interested and knowledgeable or capable of conducting a chromatographic analysis of the control strain that we will be exposing to tryptophan. Initially, it would be good to have a control strain where we only administer one type of grain, perhaps oats... After a few weeks or months, when it bears fruit, we would have to dissect them at a constant temperature that does not exceed 50 degrees and micronize them to make a powder of that control strain. Then we would have to conduct a chromatographic analysis to determine the presence of tryptamines in that strain with that grain. Once we have the report on what that strain can metabolize with that type of grain we provided for nourishment, we will have an average value of what we can obtain with just the grain. Then we would have to repeat the entire procedure, but this time adding tryptophan.
It is a lengthy process that can take months or years. The only way to verify it is with scientific data because you won't notice anything at first glance.
To determine the potency of your psilocybin mushroom bread, you would need to harvest them, dissect them, micronize them, and perform chromatographic analysis in a laboratory or with people who are interested in these topics and dedicated to field research (there should be many qualified individuals).
-------------------- cultivando en la miseria SuctoSpore® Pictorial Tek
 x7x_x7x@shroomery.org carl_jung_in_lsd@yahoo.com koh samui and oak ridge are my favourite strains
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Stipe-n Cap


Registered: 08/04/12
Posts: 7,623
Loc: Canada
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: nektar61] 2
#28499184 - 10/10/23 06:01 PM (3 months, 16 days ago) |
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There's plenty of l-tryptophan already present in cereal grains. Raw wheat berries contain roughly 450mg of l-tryptophan/100g of wheat, for example.
The biogenesis of neurotransmitters and hormones such as serotonin or melatonin begins with l-tryptophan, along with the prized 4-phosphoryloxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine.
On the otherhand, de novo biosynthesis from d-erythrose-4-phosphate and phosphoenol pyruvate requires 13 steps and 12 enzymes, with some unknown percentage of intact l-tryptophan potentially taken from the environment, but I'm not certain how much of the alkoloid content is produced de novo versus recruitment from the substrate, perhaps none, that is to say, other than the necessary amino acids.
I believe the chemistry is far too complicated to assume one generic precursor like l-tryptophan, added to what is essentially a swimming pool of already available l-tryptophan, would correlate directly to the production of more 4-phosphoryloxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine.
To be certain, this would require some serious equipment and training to ascertain. With the abundance of l-tryptophan already present in cereal grains, I have serious doubts regarding supplentation, much like bringing sand to a very sandy beach.
I'm not certain but my gut tells me that melatonin is not along the correct pathway to result in 4-phosphoryloxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong....

But I don't appear to be.
This seems like the most reasonable position, in my humble opinion.
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Icyurmt
Strange


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Posts: 1,625
Loc: 5a
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: nektar61] 2
#28499416 - 10/10/23 09:11 PM (3 months, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
nektar61 said:
Quote:
Stipe-n Cap said: Yeah, I have doubts that dmt just converts to psilocin when introduced to the sub. I have no idea why he'd think such a thing, but maybe I'm wrong. I'm not a a famous drug chemist, or any kind of chemist, and I doubt he was much of a mycologist.
Yes.
I think he might have tried it if shrooms were as easy to grow back then as they are now.
But the fact that he thinks there is something that would do it means someone might want to try different things.
When Shulgin was alive the psilocybin biosynthesis pathway and specific enzymes involved were still unknown. At that time it was believed that DMT was one of the metabolites/steps involved so it seems he was likely working off of what turned out to be a false assumption. The paper identifying the 4 enzymes and true pathway didn’t come out until 2017. Enzymatic Synthesis of Psilocybin
-------------------- 👁️ 🌊 why you are empty. Hunt for the habitat not the mushroom.
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nektar61
Into SporePlay



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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: Land Trout] 2
#28503889 - 10/13/23 11:32 PM (3 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
Land Trout said: Thanks for doing this stuff Nektar. It always baffled me that people could think adding stuff like that would change what the mushroom produces. If organisms worked like that the natural world would be very strange.
You're welcome.
These rumors (that adding something to shroom grow substrate makes more drugs or a different drug) are probably all based on that one short part by Sasha Shulgin quoted above.
It was in a book that was widely read, including by people who might have not understood the chemistry but that part they got.
It looks now looks like that part might have been a rare lapse from the empirical for Shulgin, considering the other info learned since, including the paper linked in Icyurmt's post here; https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28499416#28499416
The newbs who eternally say "But what if you add melatonin (or DMT) to the substrate?" are probably all quoting something on Reddit that's quoting someone's older stoner brother who's quoting his non-chemist friend who read Sasha's books and only understood that one part.
-------------------- -NEW? Start here.
Edited by nektar61 (10/13/23 11:43 PM)
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on_a_dventure
Goat raper

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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: Stipe-n Cap] 2
#28592087 - 12/20/23 10:43 PM (1 month, 6 days ago) |
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Sorry my English grammar isn't at ur masters level but thank u for calling me a highschool girl. I always wanted to b bubbly n a girl dream do come true !!!
Ps.. sorry I misunderstood that this wasn't bout lc
Edited by on_a_dventure (12/20/23 10:45 PM)
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sindromededow
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: nektar61] 1
#28358588 - 06/13/23 03:26 PM (7 months, 11 days ago) |
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Friend, I have been reading about the topic, but it's not clear to me since English is not my native language, and I am somewhat confused. Have you achieved anything positive by using tryptophan or melatonin in your substrates?
thanks!
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nektar61
Into SporePlay



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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: sindromededow] 1
#28359111 - 06/14/23 12:10 AM (7 months, 10 days ago) |
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Quote:
sindromededow said: Friend, I have been reading about the topic, but it's not clear to me since English is not my native language, and I am somewhat confused. Have you achieved anything positive by using tryptophan or melatonin in your substrates?
thanks!
I achieved nothing by using tryptophan or melatonin in my substrates. No gain in potency.
I'm inviting other people to repeat the experiment, but if you're looking to grow better shrooms, just learn to clone and clone ones that work well, because melatonin or tryptophan added to substrate didn't do anything noticeable.
To learn to clone, on this post: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=27646632&page=0&vc=1#27646632
read the links marked: --Learn sterile techniques.
--Learn to transfer away from contams (contaminations) on agar.
--Learn to clone.
-------------------- -NEW? Start here.
Edited by nektar61 (06/15/23 10:00 PM)
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nektar61
Into SporePlay



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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: argenpills] 1
#28359654 - 06/14/23 02:01 PM (7 months, 10 days ago) |
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Quote:
argenpills said: I will gladly replicate it to see if anything happens "by eye." But the reality is that this experiment from the beginning is destined to have no results, and let me explain why...
It would be good to carry out this experiment involving more people who are interested and knowledgeable or capable of conducting a chromatographic analysis of the control strain that we will be exposing to tryptophan. Initially, it would be good to have a control strain where we only administer one type of grain, perhaps oats... After a few weeks or months, when it bears fruit, we would have to dissect them at a constant temperature that does not exceed 50 degrees and micronize them to make a powder of that control strain. Then we would have to conduct a chromatographic analysis to determine the presence of tryptamines in that strain with that grain. Once we have the report on what that strain can metabolize with that type of grain we provided for nourishment, we will have an average value of what we can obtain with just the grain. Then we would have to repeat the entire procedure, but this time adding tryptophan.
It is a lengthy process that can take months or years. The only way to verify it is with scientific data because you won't notice anything at first glance.
To determine the potency of your psilocybin mushroom bread, you would need to harvest them, dissect them, micronize them, and perform chromatographic analysis in a laboratory or with people who are interested in these topics and dedicated to field research (there should be many qualified individuals).
Obviously.
And I mention this in my report (did you read it?) and mention that I've saved vacuum packed shroom results and chemicals in case anyone with a real lab wants to analyze it. And that I invite others to replicate the experiment.
Only people I know of with a lab that can do real quantitative is Oakland people that do Psilo Cup, last year they told me that this year I could enter, and now they're not returning emails.
There are commercial labs in the US where you can pay to anonymously get something analyzed, but it's illegal in the US for a lab to tell someone how much of a substance is in a sample (would be too helpful to "druggies"), they can only tell you what substances are in your sample.
If there was a commercial lab in the US that did quantitative anon results and didn't cost an arm and a leg, I'd have done it.
As much as my experiment was lacking, I've never seen anyone here do a "try this to see if that" even as controlled as I did. That's part of why I did it. Alan does real science. He and others are even finding and ID new active species.
But I haven't seen anyone "try a this vs that" real experiment using a CLONE and a CONTROL group.
People do great work with stabilizing varieties, but not that's not really an experiment, it's not scientific method.
There is a lot on this website where people say they did an "experiment" but don't even come close to the bare minimum I did. I'm not majestic, I'm just pointing out no one really does an actual experiment here.
It's usually "I grew some multispore shrooms and added oxygen from a welding tank, and they're bigger than the last batch I grew without oxygen", so EXPERIMENT SUCCESSFUL. Mission Accomplished! SCIENCE, BITCHES!
If I'm wrong and someone here has done this, please post the link, I'd love to see some, and I can't read this whole website every day.
Welcome.
-------------------- -NEW? Start here.
Edited by nektar61 (06/15/23 03:44 AM)
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nektar61
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: argenpills] 1
#28361334 - 06/15/23 06:27 PM (7 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
argenpills said: Many of these experiments are conducted at "Oakland Hyphae" where they perform chromatographic exams on all participating strains. We should get in touch with those people to conduct tests like the ones mentioned above.
You're posting things and asking questions here. I'm replying in detail, but I think you're not reading my replies, or not reading them very carefully.
That is weird, because it looks like you made an account on Shroomery just to comment on this thread (did you see it on Reddit?). You made your account yesterday, and have only posted on this thread. I don't mind if you did come here just for this, not at all, but if you're going to ask me questions and I answer in detail, please read my replies to your questions carefully before asking more questions I've already answered.
For instance, I replied to you in a post above, before you asked about Oakland Hyphae:
"Only people I know of with a lab that can do real quantitative is Oakland people that do Psilo Cup, last year they told me that this year I could enter, and now they're not returning emails."
Maybe you read that but don't know that Oakland Hyphae runs the Psilo cup. Even if you didn't know that, I also wrote above before your follow up:
"There are commercial labs in the US where you can pay to anonymously get something analyzed, but it's illegal in the US for a lab to tell someone how much of a substance is in a sample (would be too helpful to "druggies"), they can only tell you what substances are in your sample."
"If there was a commercial lab in the US that did quantitative anon results and didn't cost an arm and a leg, I'd have done it."
The two people I have talked with at Hyphae Labs are not responding to my emails, and this email that used to be the Psilo Cup email is now bouncing: psilocybincup@hyphaelabs.org
Also, Did you even carefully read the experiment thread linked in the first post? I'm not sure you did, based on some of your replies here.
HOWEVER: I do think my tests, even using self bio-assay instead of a lab, has strongly indicated (if not proven) one important thing: if there is any additional psychedelic substance produced by adding either of these substances to a grow, it's not substantial.
So this experiment went a long way to debunk the many noobs who've asked here, Reddit, and elsewhere something like "I have an idea for an experiment someone should do. Someone should add Melatonin, or Tryptophan to shroom substrate. It might make stronger shrooms."
It does not make shrooms significantly stronger. If it did I would have tripped hard of a gram. I did not trip hard off a gram.
I invite anyone to duplicate this experiment, USING A CLONE ONLY, and having a control group, and doing it more than once as I did, and see if any of them make you trip hard off a gram, or trip much harder off the same amount.
THAT is science. Even without a lab.
I've seen that so many times.
-------------------- -NEW? Start here.
Edited by nektar61 (06/15/23 07:06 PM)
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argenpills
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: nektar61] 1
#28361891 - 06/16/23 09:24 AM (7 months, 8 days ago) |
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Regarding my account on this forum: I created my account specifically to comment on your thread. I'm from Argentina and I have been researching psychedelics for over 15 years (more focused on the synthetic side, particularly MDxx). It seems like not many people care about your thread, but it caught my attention, which is why I'm here, my friend.
I read through the thread, but I didn't quite understand your original post about the conclusions you had reached. English is not my native language, as I mentioned before. However, you explained your results in a simpler way here.
I am also conducting experiments on this subject, and I am confident that the questions that you and I have today already have answers. Someone has already conducted these experiments and knows well what happens. The thing is, those people are not hanging around internet forums, enlightening newcomers who want to play "Breaking Bad" with biological organisms (although it would be good if it happened, LOL).
Predicting what a biological organism will do is very difficult. We have to consider the starting point, such as starting with spores and how long ago those spores were taken from the mushrooms. If we start with agar on a plate or in a liquid culture, we have to make sure the mycelium is not "old" (mycelium ages and loses potency), so we need to regularly sexualize it with spores and allow it to create diploid mycelium.
The link I shared with you resolved many of these doubts for me but raised new ones that go beyond my current capacity for study. I don't think any of these guys here will join our conversation and explain to us how we can make our mushrooms better in a cheap way with a simple element...
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djbabyjesus


Registered: 11/13/13
Posts: 341
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Re: Melatonin added to substrate, and also Tryptophan added to substrate [Re: nektar61] 1
#28490553 - 10/03/23 03:03 AM (3 months, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
HOWEVER: I do think my tests, even using self bio-assay instead of a lab, has strongly indicated (if not proven) one important thing: if there is any additional psychedelic substance produced by adding either of these substances to a grow, it's not substantial.
So this experiment went a long way to debunk the many noobs who've asked here, Reddit, and elsewhere something like "I have an idea for an experiment someone should do. Someone should add Melatonin, or Tryptophan to shroom substrate. It might make stronger shrooms."
It does not make shrooms significantly stronger. If it did I would have tripped hard of a gram. I did not trip hard off a gram.
I invite anyone to duplicate this experiment, USING A CLONE ONLY, and having a control group, and doing it more than once as I did, and see if any of them make you trip hard off a gram, or trip much harder off the same amount.
Hey 👋🏼, I think u need to dig a little deeper into how adding precursors to substrates works….
First of all, tryptophan and melatonin wouldn’t be what you would use to increase psilocybin content in the actual mushroom. The mushroom only uptakes the molecule it usually makes. Otherwise you will have to extract from the mycelium/substrate. So of course you didn’t notice any difference in effects.
If you want to increase indole content in cubensis, you would have needed to use tryptamine or dimethyltryptamine as a precursor. Something that will become 4HODMT with the simple addition of a Hydroxyl group at the four position. Then you will see results.
You could possibly use bacillus subtillus as it is rumored to increase psilocybin content due to additional enzymes. That hasn’t been proven, it just my educated guess and something I’ve been working on. May only increase psilocybin and not overall indole content. (It has additional kinase enzymes that aid in adding phosphate groups crucial to psilocybin production.)
Gartz showed that adding DET to the substrate produced 4-HO-DET and 4PODET. However a lot of people read this and mistakenly confuse the two ideas. You can make novel psychedelics in the MYCELIUM of the mushroom but you won’t make a mushroom with novel psychedelics. You can increase the psilocybin content by adding the right precursors.
The melatonin would have created something like 4,5-Methoxy-N-acetyltryptamine.
The tryptophan would have made 2-Amino-3-4-hydroxy(1H-indol-3-yl)propanoic acid.(not sure how to write the exact name smh)
Have either of those have been shown to be active? Either way, in both cases the products would be found in the substrate.
Science.
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