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redgreenvines
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: tekramrepus]
#28280347 - 04/16/23 10:23 AM (9 months, 8 days ago) |
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so you think that the brain and body are like a horse for a rider that is some other kind of thing like a soul.
many people might agree with that in spite of there being no evidence.
granted some mathematical transformations do occur in the 6 layers of the cerebral cortex, shunting signals around to support better perception of scaled and rotated objects, and suppressing image areas where no changes are happening, to better enable movement detection as examples of what kind of sensory post processing is happening.
but the bulk of the activity is memory formation and perceptive reflexes, and that is what is going on as you read and respond to these posts, as you move around in your world etc. Your experience to date is being accessed and taking over reflexively, not your soul.
there really is no such soul, however, your conditioned values prevail, and can help steer you towards moral action, and appreciation of beauty and kindness.
the brain is an organ that developed to help navigate to food sex and safety, and away from danger. it works on the basis of familiarity reflexes.
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: tekramrepus]
#28280771 - 04/16/23 04:04 PM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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I've had nights where I don't dream, or had them and don't remember.
But my own experience of being in a coma was not sleeping, it wasn't anything, it was a total absence of experience and a flat line of being.
There were no dreams, thoughts, or rumbles of anything to reminisce on, only the before and after waking up which are rather clear and exceptionally vivid to me.
I don't think you'll ever be able to effectively explain what you mean by having an outer body experience or entering another realm and having other people enter your dreams without taking full personal responsibility for the experience.
For my own experience of being in a coma I take full responsibility and can assuredly say there was nothing to it.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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BrendanFlock
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: sudly] 2
#28280959 - 04/16/23 06:14 PM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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So according to some teachings.. predominantly A Course in Miracles there is the idea that perceptions can be false and so can certain perceptions be true..
Perceptions are of course filters..
But the further teaching is that you can bring perceptions to truth and turn them into knowledge..
You see knowledge is unlimited and one can learn the base levels of existence!
But people don't start with knowledge they have to earn it.
So the first job is to have correct filters(perceptions) and then go closer and closer unto the ground state..(Brahman).. which is where God resides..
I certainly think it doesn't do humans justice to say we cannot understand absolute knowledge..
But the idea is that you have to work for it..
Yoga, meditation etc. Insight, thinking.. reading, learning etc.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: BrendanFlock]
#28281124 - 04/16/23 08:03 PM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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the words "absolute knowledge" smells bad to me.
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BrendanFlock
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: redgreenvines]
#28281342 - 04/16/23 10:14 PM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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Smells like Tao to me..
Something blue and black.. like an ocean...
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: BrendanFlock]
#28281543 - 04/17/23 04:45 AM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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tao with absolutes? wtf?
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: redgreenvines]
#28281554 - 04/17/23 05:02 AM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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If you know, you know.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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syncro
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: redgreenvines]
#28281564 - 04/17/23 05:19 AM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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Quote:
redgreenvines said: tao with absolutes? wtf?
Acceptance?
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,797
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: syncro]
#28281565 - 04/17/23 05:20 AM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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FOR THE GREATER GOOD!
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: syncro]
#28281588 - 04/17/23 05:57 AM (9 months, 7 days ago) |
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Quote:
syncro said:
Quote:
redgreenvines said: tao with absolutes? wtf?
Acceptance?
a poor substitute for awareness
I mean "presence" or being there
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Edited by redgreenvines (04/17/23 06:15 AM)
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BrendanFlock
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: redgreenvines]
#28282455 - 04/17/23 05:14 PM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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Being is absolute.. the "you" in being..
Contents may change..
One can know both self and contents..
Why would there be lack?
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: BrendanFlock]
#28282673 - 04/17/23 08:14 PM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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are you identifying with the unchanging stuff again?
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BrendanFlock
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: redgreenvines]
#28282697 - 04/17/23 08:22 PM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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I think so, yes..
The fact that you are you never changes.
You don't have to identify except vs obsession with the contents of your mind..
The idea that you are an object too!
If one person has more knowledge than another, then when does knowledge become limited?
Could it be possible for one to have 100% knowledge? What is the barrier..?
Why can't this be true?
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syncro
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: BrendanFlock]
#28282722 - 04/17/23 08:43 PM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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It depends on their appreciation.
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BrendanFlock
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: syncro]
#28282732 - 04/17/23 08:50 PM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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Could be a case of the placebo effect or power of belief..
If rgvs believes you can't attain perfect knowledge than he won't ever experience that..
I on the other hand can have a glimpse because I think it's possible!
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,530
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: BrendanFlock]
#28282858 - 04/17/23 10:11 PM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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if you have a point of view of the infinite, and your knowledge is from that point of view, and if there is also an infinite set of other points of view and of other versions knowledge, then none of them at all can be 100% complete due to the existence and difference of so many others.
we are limited to our points of view and so is our knowledge
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BrendanFlock
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: redgreenvines]
#28282917 - 04/17/23 11:18 PM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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I think I see what your saying..
You would have to literally BE everything to have absolute knowledge..
Unless there is honesty in the universe with regards to slack that would allow a single unit within it to be complete..
In that case it would only take the correct alignment of said individual.
Like taking a test or exam.. 100% is possible but extremely difficult to attain..
I keep my hope none the less.
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syncro
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: BrendanFlock]
#28282920 - 04/17/23 11:21 PM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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Because fractals though.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,530
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: syncro]
#28283234 - 04/18/23 06:32 AM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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fractals are groovy packages that unfold into larger groovy packages.
only a small subset of knowledge pertains to fractals
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syncro
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Re: I believe that humans never directly experience reality. This is why. [Re: redgreenvines]
#28283291 - 04/18/23 07:22 AM (9 months, 6 days ago) |
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I can't get my head around the flow effects, as we know the sets are static?, and seeming to back out while we know we are zooming in. I'm asking the data god but not to much satisfaction.
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