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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Cuba [Re: thetruthsohelp] * 2
    #28274555 - 04/12/23 02:21 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

It’s true, Che and Fidel should’ve let the CIA dismantle their revolution that way nobody on a mushroom forum would have a negative opinion about them.


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Offlinerxb
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Re: Cuba [Re: thetruthsohelp]
    #28274559 - 04/12/23 02:22 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

canadians vacation in cuba alot.


--------------------
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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Cuba [Re: thetruthsohelp]
    #28274589 - 04/12/23 02:41 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:

thetruthsohelp said:
Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:
Quote:

thetruthsohelp said:
Quote:

Bigbadwooof said:

He was a man with the courage of his convictions.




So was Hitler.




Che was altruistic. It's no different than George Washington in my book.




I thought altruism was about love thy neighbor, not murder systematically my neighbors because they spoke out against thy new authoritarian regime?




I'm curious what you think of the French Revolution. Some 20,000 people executed... Hundreds of thousands imprisoned..


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Cuba [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28274629 - 04/12/23 03:14 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Those were bourgeois white people so clearly that revolution is good and violence was warranted.


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Cuba [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #28274637 - 04/12/23 03:22 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Those were bourgeois white people so clearly that revolution is good and violence was warranted.




Waaait a miiinute... I think most of the people that were killed were killed because of mass hysteria and essentially 'witch hunts' for counter-revolutionaries, just like the Cuban Revolution, although the Cubans were generally more justified in most of the killings they committed, and it was far fewer.

They weren't all bourgeois or even mostly.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


Edited by Bigbadwooof (04/12/23 03:22 PM)


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Invisiblethetruthsohelp
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Re: Cuba [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #28274657 - 04/12/23 03:37 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
It’s true, Che and Fidel should’ve let the CIA dismantle their revolution that way nobody on a mushroom forum would have a negative opinion about them.




Convenient that anyone who disagrees with an authoritarian communist regime is automatically a CIA agent or asset worthy only of extermination.:facepalm3:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Cuba [Re: thetruthsohelp] * 2
    #28274666 - 04/12/23 03:41 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

No not anyone, just most of the power against them.

There are always going to be people who favored the prior regime (the military dictatorship) and there are always going to be people who don’t want anything to change regardless. It’s true of every single revolution of history. It’s just a lazy way to condemn communism by saying “ah they were against the people they overthrew.” Yeah no shit.


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Invisiblethetruthsohelp
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Re: Cuba [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28274690 - 04/12/23 03:58 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:



I'm curious what you think of the French Revolution. Some 20,000 people executed... Hundreds of thousands imprisoned..




The French revolution was bloody as all hell. I don't think for a second that the amount of bloodshed and terror and utter insanity was worth it in the long run, for the purpose of getting rid of serfdom. After the Jacobins got into power in France, man was that even more fucked up. Revolutions are always bloody and its a rareity (The American Revolution being one of the very few that actually delivered liberty to the opressed) for the fight to be worth it, generally due to the ideological ferver and pathological powerlust of said revolutionaries.

But again we are comparing apples to oranges because of a really useful thing called *context*. The politics at that time of the French revolution was very different to this past century. As for its ideas, it was a mixed bag.

One thing is for sure though, when it comes to specifically communist revolutions, The Russian revolution is an excellent example of how a revolution against opressors can result in a much worse oppression for everyone in a country when that evil ideology is impposed. We should compare oranges to oranges. Every single communist revolution in history has an immense body count and results in nothing but tyranny and opression. Cuba is no different.


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Cuba [Re: thetruthsohelp]
    #28274714 - 04/12/23 04:14 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:

thetruthsohelp said:
Quote:



I'm curious what you think of the French Revolution. Some 20,000 people executed... Hundreds of thousands imprisoned..




The French revolution was bloody as all hell. I don't think for a second that the amount of bloodshed and terror and utter insanity was worth it in the long run, for the purpose of getting rid of serfdom. After the Jacobins got into power in France, man was that even more fucked up. Revolutions are always bloody and its a rareity (The American Revolution being one of the very few that actually delivered liberty to the opressed) for the fight to be worth it, generally due to the ideological ferver and pathological powerlust of said revolutionaries.




Interesting. I wasn't expecting this response. You might be right. Capitalism leads to the same situation as serfdom, eventually, anyway.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OfflineIce9
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Re: Cuba [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #28274754 - 04/12/23 04:53 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Those were bourgeois white people so clearly that revolution is good and violence was warranted.



This is precisely the opposite that you have said about Yemen and Ukraine.  So which is it?


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The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the unreasonable man. -- George Brenard Shaw


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: Cuba [Re: Ice9] * 1
    #28275047 - 04/12/23 08:48 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Ice9 said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Those were bourgeois white people so clearly that revolution is good and violence was warranted.



This is precisely the opposite that you have said about Yemen and Ukraine.  So which is it?




I’m being sarcastic.

The French Revolution, while good, was ultimately a bourgeois revolution of white Europeans, much like ours.

I’m not sure I’d classify either Ukraine or Yemen as a revolution, as they’re both basically civil wars.

I’ve said it before, but I absolutely think using violence to earn freedom is warranted. Pre-revolutionary Cuba was obscenely exploitative, they had slave plantations for God’s sake. Are we going to now condemn Harriet Tubman because she might have killed some slave patrollers on the Underground Railroad?

Of course not, because our history is pristine and dignified and a long arc bending towards justice and all that garbage. But we can’t say Cuba was wrong to overthrow a military dictatorship, so we have to say “oh well, the way they did it was wrong.” Bullshit.


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OfflineKryptos
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Re: Cuba [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #28275079 - 04/12/23 09:12 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Wait, there was a revolution in Ukraine?


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Cuba [Re: Kryptos]
    #28275114 - 04/12/23 09:38 PM (9 months, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Kryptos said:
Wait, there was a revolution in Ukraine?




Ukraine has 365 to 366 revolutions every year dude. Pretty radical, huh?


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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Offline336
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Re: Cuba [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28275919 - 04/13/23 01:45 PM (9 months, 10 days ago)

Just to brag, the top General of Cuba is my relative.

Corps General Abelardo Colomé Ibarra (born 13 September 1939 in Santiago de Cuba, Oriente Province, Cuba) was a Vice President of the Council of State of Cuba and the Cuban Minister of the Interior, serving in the latter position from 1989, until his retirement in October, 2015. Known as Furry he first laid the foundations of State Security in 1959.

Career
Ibarra was a founding member of the 26th of July Movement. Following the collapse of the Batista regime in Cuba, Ibarra attempted to organise Cuban military expeditions to help local revolutionaries overthrow the governments of Bolivia and Argentina.[1] In December 1975, he was named the head of the first Cuban military mission to Angola.[1] Ibarra reportedly drove to the Cuban and Angolan front lines to personally supervise the defence against National Union for the Total Independence of Angola (UNITA) forces, backed by invading South African troops.[1]

Ibarra is a member of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Cuba. He bears the title Hero of the Republic of Cuba, and holds the Order of Máximo Gómez in recognition of, in Fidel Castro's own words, "his extraordinary merits in the insurrectional struggle against the tyranny and the imperialist neocolonial domination, the struggle for the consolidation and defense of the socialist state, and the accomplishment of heroic internationalist missions."

Victory of the Cuban Revolution
At the victory of the Cuban Revolution, in April 1959 Abelardo was appointed Chief of the Intelligence Directorate of the Rebel Army. He was part of Fidel Castro's support after the visit of the United Nations Organization.

It is believed that it was Colomé Ibarra who informed Fidel Castro in Havana that Hubert Matos would take up arms. In 1961, Efigenio Ameijeiras requested his support for the National Revolutionary Police, where he assumed the leadership of the Motorized Police, the same with which he fought during the Invasion of the Bay of Pigs.

In 1962 he began to work in the Military Counterintelligence of the Armed Forces, fulfilling internationalist combat missions in Bolivia and Argentina, where he entered with a false Algerian passport to meet Jorge Masetti. In Bolivia, he bought a 4-hectare farm in Cochabamba, close to Emborozu, south of Tarijas and close to Argentina.

He fought alongside Samuel Rodiles Planas and Raúl Díaz-Argüelles in the Cuban military brigade in Algeria, participating in the same way in the preparation of the guerrillas that fought with Che Guevara in the Congo, former Zaire in addition to getting involved in the organization of guerrilla groups in Guinea-Bissau for the African Party for the Independence of Guinea and Cape Verde.

Colomé participated in the location of military and intelligence devices in South Yemen and Somalia, in addition to fulfilling infiltration and combat missions from Mexico and Central America to Venezuela.

He was Division Chief in the Eastern Army, participating in Operation Mambí in 1968. He organized the Northern Army Corps in Holguín until his appointment as Head of the Directorate of Military Counterintelligence. In 1972, he was appointed Vice Minister of the Armed Forces with powers to replace Minister Raúl Castro in his absence. In 1975, on the death of Raúl Díaz-Argüelles in Angola, he was sent to combat replacing him against South African forces and UNITA. In 1976 he was Military Chief of all Cuban troops in Angola.

Colomé was Head of the 10th. Directorate of Military Intelligence. He was in charge of the espionage carried out between the socialist countries and members of NATO. Colomé Ibarra was in charge of carrying out the investigations and arrests in the case of General Arnaldo Ochoa Sánchez. After the trial against General José Abrantes, he was appointed Minister of the Interior until October 26, 2015, when he requested his resignation, in a letter sent to President Raúl. The Council of State agreed to award him with the First Degree Order for the Service to the Fatherland for his standard career.


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Cuba [Re: 336]
    #28276977 - 04/14/23 07:54 AM (9 months, 9 days ago)

Wow, that's really cool man! I have a lot of respect for revolutionaries, even if things do go wrong! I love the spirit of it.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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Offline336
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Re: Cuba [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28280795 - 04/16/23 04:21 PM (9 months, 7 days ago)

yeah sadly they ran the country into the ground from what I have seen / heard. at least for the majority of people, perhaps not the rich and the tourists. instead of true communism it seems all the people of Cuba got was a different form of dictatorship and monopolization.


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OnlineBigbadwooof
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Re: Cuba [Re: 336] * 1
    #28281674 - 04/17/23 07:35 AM (9 months, 6 days ago)

Quote:

336 said:
yeah sadly they ran the country into the ground from what I have seen / heard. at least for the majority of people, perhaps not the rich and the tourists. instead of true communism it seems all the people of Cuba got was a different form of dictatorship and monopolization.




They have better healthcare outcomes, longer life expectancy, less infant mortality than the US. Just sayin.


--------------------
"It is no measure of good health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society," - Jiddu Krishnamurti
FARTS
"There is no need for conspiracy where interests converge" - George Carlin
Every one of you should see this video.
"If you bombard the earth with photons for a while, it can emit a roadster" - Andrej Kerpathy


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OfflineSulfurshelfsean
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Re: Cuba [Re: Bigbadwooof] * 1
    #28281942 - 04/17/23 11:04 AM (9 months, 6 days ago)

I used to hang with a bunch of Cubans. Shit got dramatic in that friend group but it was cool to hear varying degrees of approval and disapproval of their govt. The one dude I knew claimed his father was a general during the revolution. He loved it in Cuba, felt like everything was provided for you etc. His current wife also said she loved Cuba but you weren't aloud to learn anything outside of what they wanted you to and although your basic needs were covered there was very little mobility for those outside of what sounded almost like a cast system to me.its all give and take I suppose.


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Offline336
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Re: Cuba [Re: Bigbadwooof]
    #28282957 - 04/18/23 12:02 AM (9 months, 5 days ago)

@Bigbadwooof; check this video and then tell me Cuba is doing great


That said, from what I can tell there are very luxurious places for tourists and the rich. Not sure how that fits into Communism... Sure does fit in with dictatorship though...

@Sulfurshelfsean yah Cubans are dramatic as fuck. trust me, my family is crazy. lmao. but yah one of my aunties went back and asked people about our last name and she said some people said it meant "face of an ass", which probably has something to do with their dislike of General Colome Ibarra and the regime in general.


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Offlinerxb
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Re: Cuba [Re: 336] * 1
    #28283204 - 04/18/23 05:48 AM (9 months, 5 days ago)

i wouldnt put alot of credit into videos showing poor conditions in cuba, the people that make them ALSO have agendas.

poverty exists everywhere, you could take video of the USA that looks worse in any state.

that isnt to say that cuba is doing great, just that the camera only films what its pointed at take a camera to mississippi or texas and you can see abject poverty and starvation too, it doesnt mean anything about the situation as a whole.

across from nathans famous original coney island spot, 10 years ago were buildings which were in HORRIBLE shape being squatted in by homeless, looking worse than those buildings in cuba in many cases, we have laws against that kind of stuff and city ordinances against letting buildings get like that, but none the less they were in really rough shape, across from an iconic landmark in the capital of the world.

i think sometimes people put blinders on to stuff like this. i used to seek out old abandoned building to photograph models in, i liked the contrast of a young beautiful nearly naked (sometimes very naked) fresh faced beauty queen against the backdrop of urban decay, what you learn is that its easy to find the decay, and frankly its easy to find the beauty too.


--------------------
->$10 FLOW HOOD ALTERNATIVE <-

. i cleaned a mold contaminated live culture and saved it. (might have useful applications)

[quote]Enlil said:
I'd be the guy with thousands of minions doing my bidding and all of the hot women locked in a cage for my use.[/quote]


Edited by rxb (04/18/23 05:57 AM)


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