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Pentacorn
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WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... 1
#28259140 - 04/02/23 12:50 PM (9 months, 21 days ago) |
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LONG TERM NEGATIVE EFFECTS
Hey guys, last season I found a bunch of gymnopilus luteus and decided to try it. Over a two month period I consumed dry 5g, dry 2g in tea, and dry 1g in tea. Around a week before I consumed the third dose I would have this daily head-pressure in the back of my head that wouldn't go away. I waited another two months before consuming any type of drug (including alcohol and caffeine) and the head pressure began to subside. I thought I must be crazy for blaming it on the G.Luteus so I took my 4th dose of dry 1g. The head pressure came back with sickening effect.
I can't be 100% positive that my ailment was caused by G.Luteus and I am too scared to give any to my friends to test my hypothesis in case I harm them too. So, I wanted to make this post as a warning to start slow with G.Luteus and if you have ever experienced this problem after consuming mushrooms from the Gymnopilus genus I would love to hear about it!
It has been almost three months since my last dose and the head pressure seems to have disappeared.
. . .
MORE INFO
The trip on 5g was NOT very psychedelic. It reminded me of about a 0.5 to 1g dose of psilocybe cubensis. HOWEVER, I could barely walk. It's like someone turned up the gravity 1000% and I just melted into my hammock. I didn't move a finger for almost two hours. I liked the feeling.
Perhaps the bitter taste comes from unknown (due to lack of research) toxins that we evolved to dislike? I imagine being paralyzed for two hours in a forest would have quickly weeded out any of our ancestors that thought this mushroom tasted good.
-------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- WILD LAWN PANAEOLUS - ACTIVE OR NOT? See discussion here: Panaeolus Identification
Edited by Pentacorn (04/02/23 12:51 PM)
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Thomas Envisio
Artist

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Posts: 1,662
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn]
#28259183 - 04/02/23 01:38 PM (9 months, 21 days ago) |
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I can only offer a few areas to investigate as hypothetical considerations.
1. Research the phrase "woodlover's paralysis" and similar spellings of that phrase. 2. Consider having the remaining collection or a future collection from the same locality for DNA sequencing. I would look into not only the Gymnopilus species, but also agaricicolous fungi and bacteria that may have been invisibly growing throughout the Gymnopilus. I would also sequence the substrate and look for multiple kingdoms/species. 3. You may have a medical condition that is instigated and revealed only by Psilocybin and related compounds, including MAOIs in Gymnopilus species. 4. This may be life's way of telling you not to consume magic mushrooms in a relatively gentle manner. 5. It is possible that you may also be sensitive to other drugs and even foods and beverages. You might benefit by developing more strict dietary constraints on yourself, including a permanent or long-term "staple diet." 6. Research the phrase Reversible Cerebral Vasoconstriction Syndrome (RCVS). Also, similar phrases. 7. You may benefit by abandoning most or all drugs and replacing them with exercise. Maybe mushroom hunting and long hikes would be a good alternative.
Note: Anyone taking 5 dried grams of Psilocybe cubensis is easily subject to temporary paralysis and intense immersion into altered reality. I realize you wrote this was a Gymnopilus species and the effects felt weak, but maybe part of your brain was activated, while another part was somehow "sober." That's a whole different area of research to consider.
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Longtimenosee


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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn] 1
#28259205 - 04/02/23 01:51 PM (9 months, 21 days ago) |
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Fascinating!
Gymnopilus species contain several chemicals that may have psychoactive effects, medicinal effects, and or toxic effects.
Several different chemicals have been isolated from extracts of Gymnopilus. They are 4,6-decadiyne-1,3,8-triol, Baeocystin, Bis-noryangonin, ergosta-4,6,8(14),22-tetraen-3-one, Gymnopilene, Gymnoprenol A9, Gymnopilin A10, Gymnopilin K, Hispidin, Ostopanic acid, Psilocin, and Psilocybin. Little is known about the exact percentage of these substances found in Gymnopilus or their pharmacological activity.
Also reported are Bis-noryangonin and hispidin, which are similar in structure to the active ingredients in the psychoactive plant Kava-Kava, they may be psychoactive but this is unproven and weather they are present in quantities sufficient to cause effects is also unknown. They are also known to be antioxidents.
Gymnopilene, Gymnoprenol A9, Gymnopilin A10, Gymnopilin K, Hispidin and Ostopanic acid, have all been shown to be cytotoxic to some types of tumor cells.
A lot of research is needed to determine which of these substances are of pharmacological significance. As well as what species contain what percentages of the primary active alkaloids.
Determining what chemicals are present and their percentage in G. luteus could lead to understanding what chemical may have been responsible for this effect.
Negative effects of Psilocybin mushrooms are rare but a real and interesting subject of study that could lead to new medicines or recreational drugs.

Edited by Longtimenosee (04/02/23 01:55 PM)
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manOwar
Siphonophore


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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Longtimenosee]
#28259321 - 04/02/23 03:25 PM (9 months, 21 days ago) |
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I’ve had an effect that sounds very much like what you’ve described, apparently stemming from frequent consumption of Psilocybe cubensis, actually.
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Pentacorn
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Thomas Envisio]
#28259549 - 04/02/23 05:47 PM (9 months, 21 days ago) |
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This place never ceases to amaze me with its plethora of mycology, chemistry, and biology knowledge. Thank you guys so much for the detailed responses!
Quote:
Thomas Envisio said: 2. Consider having the remaining collection or a future collection from the same locality for DNA sequencing. I would look into not only the Gymnopilus species, but also agaricicolous fungi and bacteria that may have been invisibly growing throughout the Gymnopilus. I would also sequence the substrate and look for multiple kingdoms/species.
How? I recently was asked to send an entirely different mushroom to a Phd student for DNA analysis on MushroomObserver.com but I feel like it is an entirely different story for G.Luteus since this mushroom is technically illegal to possess.
Quote:
Thomas Envisio said: 7. You may benefit by abandoning most or all drugs and replacing them with exercise. Maybe mushroom hunting and long hikes would be a good alternative.
For posterity purposes, I'm truly an anomaly. I didn't touch drugs or alcohol until I was 30 years old (I was obsessed with fitness/nutrition) and only changed my mind on the subject due to severe depression and the suggestion to fix it with magic mushrooms. With that said, many of your points suggest that perhaps even my use of mushrooms should be brought to an end now that they have served their purpose. I truly appreciate your flow of thoughts. Thank you!
Quote:
Longtimenosee said:
Also reported are Bis-noryangonin and hispidin, which are similar in structure to the active ingredients in the psychoactive plant Kava-Kava, they may be psychoactive but this is unproven and weather they are present in quantities sufficient to cause effects is also unknown. They are also known to be antioxidents.
Gymnopilene, Gymnoprenol A9, Gymnopilin A10, Gymnopilin K, Hispidin and Ostopanic acid, have all been shown to be cytotoxic to some types of tumor cells.
Where did you learn this??? I would like to read more.
-------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- WILD LAWN PANAEOLUS - ACTIVE OR NOT? See discussion here: Panaeolus Identification
Edited by Pentacorn (04/02/23 05:48 PM)
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Icyurmt
Strange


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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn]
#28259572 - 04/02/23 06:05 PM (9 months, 21 days ago) |
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-------------------- 👁️ 🌊 why you are empty. Hunt for the habitat not the mushroom.
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Thomas Envisio
Artist

Registered: 12/28/22
Posts: 1,662
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn]
#28259938 - 04/03/23 12:03 AM (9 months, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
How? I recently was asked to send an entirely different mushroom to a Phd student for DNA analysis on MushroomObserver.com but I feel like it is an entirely different story for G.Luteus since this mushroom is technically illegal to possess.
Well, you need someone who has the right primers and expectations. Someone who wants to look for all possible points of cause. I would try to find someone who is really, really advanced at DNA sequencing. Someone who is comfortable pushing the envelope to exceeding expectations.
Regarding the legality, I would not worry at all about sending a collection off for DNA sequecing. Simply label it, "Unknown fungal sample for identification request" along with the Mushroom Observer observation number. Or label the bag saying "Unidentified Gymnopilus species / MO # zzzzzz". Include a letter saying someone anonymous experienced the following effects upon ingestion...
Regarding primers, you might find helpful literature using the following link . . .
https://www.google.com/search?q=Multiple-primer+DNA+sequencing+method&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
I wish I could elaborate and give you more information, but that's all I have at the moment. If I can acquire anything better to add, I'll post a new reply.
Would You Like To Perform DNA Sequencing?
https://wiki.counterculturelabs.org/wiki/DNA_sequencing
https://wiki.counterculturelabs.org/wiki/DNA_sequencing#Supplies_Needed
https://docs.google.com/document/u/0/d/13B9OSE_ar_vWWZnHZegr2FROnMak78qHZxEZXc1E9jk/mobilebasic
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the man
still masked



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Thomas Envisio]
#28260353 - 04/03/23 11:19 AM (9 months, 20 days ago) |
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hows your BP? got it tested lately?
there is a weird new virus going around that infects your brain causes systemic effects etc..
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6The6Despised6One
southern-fried eskimo



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: the man]
#28261070 - 04/03/23 06:52 PM (9 months, 20 days ago) |
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i cant remember where or what species but i did read something about a gymnopilus sp. maybe having some kind of substance that can have negative effects on the brain. but the same article was also saying whatever it was can also help fight alzheimers and tumors or something like that.
i did have a weird episode one time after consuming some luteofolious where i could physically feel something moving on my skin random places on my body but id look and there was nothing there. still not sure what that was about and it was very annoying, but not enough to stop me from taking them again lolz. i do think that even as real as it felt there was actually nothing there and it was all in my head. its called formication i think
after extensive searching online it seems like scabies is the only living thing that you could feel but not see mimicking my symptoms but i dont have scabies and you cant get them from mushroom hunting. (unless you have sex with someone who has scabies while your hunting of course)
that sucks about your head pressure though brother, cause i find gym trips extremely enjoyable and markedly different than cube trips. mushrooms can readily enhance any comfort/uncomfort your feeling drastically. especially if your worried about it happening. i had that crawling feeling come back a couple times after dosing with cubes which also leads me believe it wasnt the mushrooms in my case but rather my mind. now that ive convinced myself that, i rarely get that crawling feeling anymore
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Moria841



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: 6The6Despised6One]
#28261075 - 04/03/23 06:56 PM (9 months, 20 days ago) |
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This is just anectodal fear-mongering, hate to say it I empathize with you and your conditions man, i have chronic conditions that beat my ass too, but it wasn't the Gymns. There's other answers, talk to a doctor
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Pentacorn
Lover


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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841] 1
#28261154 - 04/03/23 08:07 PM (9 months, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
Moria841 said: This is just anectodal fear-mongering, hate to say it I empathize with you and your conditions man, i have chronic conditions that beat my ass too, but it wasn't the Gymns. There's other answers, talk to a doctor
Moria I have tons of respect for you and always appreciate your take on Gymns. With that said, I did not try to make this into anything other than an anecdotal report and my personal musings on evolution. As I stated earlier, I'd love to give the mushrooms out freely to my friends (there was ALOT growing on that log, haha) to test my hypothesis but, you know, it would suck if I hurt a bunch of people.
I WANT these mushrooms to be safe because I really liked how they made me feel.
EDIT: I really liked how they made me feel *while tripping.
-------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- WILD LAWN PANAEOLUS - ACTIVE OR NOT? See discussion here: Panaeolus Identification
Edited by Pentacorn (04/03/23 08:11 PM)
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Moria841



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn]
#28261223 - 04/03/23 08:44 PM (9 months, 20 days ago) |
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Was the log identified though? I'm sure that, like most mushrooms, Gymnopilus species could bioaccumulate toxins that cause head pressure as a symptom, especially if the wood was from a tree known for toxic compounds
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Icyurmt
Strange


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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841]
#28261468 - 04/04/23 03:05 AM (9 months, 20 days ago) |
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Not saying that its what caused op symptoms, but at least some gymnopilus sp seem to be producing potentially toxic compounds.
Neurotoxic oligoisoprenoids of the hallucinogenic mushroom, Gymnopilus spectabilis
-------------------- 👁️ 🌊 why you are empty. Hunt for the habitat not the mushroom.
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Pentacorn
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Icyurmt]
#28261718 - 04/04/23 08:57 AM (9 months, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
Moria841 said: Was the log identified though?....
The log and the stump were highly decayed. But based on the surrounding trees and the size of the log I'd guess it was a cottonwood. I suppose this is yet another path to delve into for potential toxins.
Quote:
Icyurmt said: Not saying that its what caused op symptoms, but at least some gymnopilus sp seem to be producing potentially toxic compounds.
Neurotoxic oligoisoprenoids of the hallucinogenic mushroom, Gymnopilus spectabilis
Thank you for the link! I am slowly making my way through all of the literature that has been posted here.
-------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- WILD LAWN PANAEOLUS - ACTIVE OR NOT? See discussion here: Panaeolus Identification
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Moria841



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn]
#28261821 - 04/04/23 10:38 AM (9 months, 20 days ago) |
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All right, I admit I was baked last night, let me break down my argument a bit better:
For one, the bitterness from Gymns IN MY EXPERIENCE is highly anise-like, probably owing to anisaldehyde or similar compounds found in many different mushrooms, rather than unknown toxic compounds (which would almost certainly be found in non-tasteable quantities. Have you ever tasted the psilocin or psilocybin in Psilocybe species? I can't say I have)
For two, wild mushrooms always have the risks (and, on the same coin, the benefits) associated with growth in a non-controlled environment. Many different types of bacteria and other fungi in the wild are virtually invisible and come home with us on whatever we take from the wild. If these organisms produce toxins that don't degrade during the preparation process, then they will enter our bodies when the wild objects are consumed.
Further, as noted by manOwar, headaches can simply be explained by acute psychedelic experiences, and while we could just rule this out since your experience was long-term rather than accute, I believe that it is also important to note that many people who take psychedelics report receiving new insights into their emotional OR PHYSICAL health that they didn't realize needed to be addressed.
In my experience, one dose of a psychedelic immediately forced me to feel crippling long-lasting abdominal pain-- rather than blaming the psychedelic, I went to the GI doctor, and after reviewing my medical history we uncovered chronic constipation as the cause of the gas pain, and I have been managing it better ever since.
Finally, the gymnopilins highlighted by Icyurmt have not been shown to damage human cells in vivo; rather, most of these studies are interested in the destruction of tumor cells induced by gymnopilins. There is no evidence to suggest that these compounds are dangerous when consumed orally. On the other hand, kavalactone-like alkaloids such as bisnoryangonin have been isolated from some Gymnopilus species, which may have some psychoactive effects, but the safety profiles of kavalactones are generally well-established.
Thus, I urge us to approach this using deductive reasoning. Rather than asking "what unknown toxins in the Gymnopilus might have caused these symptoms," we should start by asking "what known toxins in the environment, or chronic health conditions, might have caused these symptoms,"
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the man
still masked



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841]
#28262997 - 04/05/23 02:47 AM (9 months, 19 days ago) |
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kavalactones are hepato toxic are they not? not a stretch to think certain folks may have negative sides. eitherway, good to note your experience perhaps others will come forward... wasn't long ago despite widespread use that folks didnt think woodlover paralysis was a thing and then only appeared in pockets...widespread use of gyms is very much more recent (was regarded as waste of time more or less until 6 years ago or so). so its very possible certain pockets of gyms have something similar, may depend on if dried etc
there also is a weird virus going around thats known now to infect your brain, nevermind inflammation...
no one can say with certainty one way or another, unfortunate but will just have to wait to see if others come forward...
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Moria841



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: the man]
#28263049 - 04/05/23 05:57 AM (9 months, 19 days ago) |
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Right-- and regarding WLP, most hypotheses centered around simply having high levels of tryptamines, causing uncomfortably strong body highs, while other theories suggested bacteria and their toxins as a cause (such as botulinum toxin)
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Pentacorn
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841]
#28263621 - 04/05/23 12:48 PM (9 months, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
Moria841 said: ...the bitterness from Gymns IN MY EXPERIENCE is highly anise-like, probably owing to anisaldehyde or similar compounds found in many different mushrooms, rather than unknown toxic compounds (which would almost certainly be found in non-tasteable quantities. Have you ever tasted the psilocin or psilocybin in Psilocybe species? I can't say I have)
"The Dorito Effect" is a book where Mark Schatzker discusses the idea of nutritional wisdom which he backs with a bunch of intriguing research. For most of us on this forum his thesis will seem intuitive: if we taste something (good or bad) there was an evolutionary pressure in our past to make us seek out those compounds or avoid them. Whatever the terrible flavor in Gymns comes from I'd GUESS it is something that we probably shouldn't eat in large quantities. So if it was the anisaldehyde or other compounds I'd wonder why we are naturally inclined to avoid them?
Personally, I love bitter foods like brussel sprouts but the bitterness of G.Luteus was nearly impossible to swallow. Again, I'm just thinking out loud. The real issue for me is finding out if I should blame my headpressure on G.Luteus or if I should start handing them out to anyone brave enough to try them, haha.
Quote:
Moria841 said:
Thus, I urge us to approach this using deductive reasoning. Rather than asking "what unknown toxins in the Gymnopilus might have caused these symptoms," we should start by asking "what known toxins in the environment, or chronic health conditions, might have caused these symptoms,"
I understand. Having worked in the medical field for many years I dread the idea of dumping a bunch of money into a doctor to diagnose my incredibly vague symptom of head-pressure. Haha. But you have me convinced that this is a good idea.
-------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- WILD LAWN PANAEOLUS - ACTIVE OR NOT? See discussion here: Panaeolus Identification
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Moria841



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn]
#28263810 - 04/05/23 03:32 PM (9 months, 18 days ago) |
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Yeah that's a good point, I feel you there bro-- the medical system in the States is pretty out of whack
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Thomas Envisio
Artist

Registered: 12/28/22
Posts: 1,662
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841]
#28264334 - 04/05/23 09:46 PM (9 months, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
the medical system in the States is pretty out of whack
I would call it criminal on multiple levels.
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Moria841



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Thomas Envisio]
#28264395 - 04/05/23 10:25 PM (9 months, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
Thomas Envisio said:
Quote:
the medical system in the States is pretty out of whack
I would call it criminal on multiple levels.
Cheers to that one
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kochab
Fractal burning minimalist

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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn]
#28277711 - 04/14/23 04:28 PM (9 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
Pentacorn said: [ I'd love to give the mushrooms out freely to my friends (there was ALOT growing on that log, haha) to test my hypothesis but, you know, it would suck if I hurt a bunch of people.
If you have friends that would enjoy them give them away with the disclaimer and let them know what concerned you upfront. Recommend that they are tested with a MICROdose if they are gonna try em. Maybe limit them with a sample of same size you already partook in(so as to make sure they don't partake too heavily)
You might just verify that you are the oddity in the equation here....? Otherwise without further scientific testing on those specific specimens everything is just speculation.
Bummer to hear of your troubles but at least the conversation brought up a ton of material for us to go dig through and soak up now🧐
-------------------- Those looking at images of early man, assuming they are much higher up, are still primordial in thought.
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Notwhouthink
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841]
#28497211 - 10/09/23 12:56 AM (3 months, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
Moria841 said: This is just anectodal fear-mongering, hate to say it I empathize with you and your conditions man, i have chronic conditions that beat my ass too, but it wasn't the Gymns. There's other answers, talk to a doctor
Hello. First of all, nice pics everyone who is finding these.
I believe the OP is correct.
Ive experimented with this mushroom a few times and Gymnopilus luteofolius and wanted to comment. I too get the head pressure thing, and more intensely from Gym luteofolius which would make sense since I believe they are a bit less potent on average, possibly because of growing conditions (they tolerate dryer habitat)
I have never felt any effect so aweful that I would otherwise report it as a toxin. Its almost kind of in the back of my eyes feeling and maybe a slight hangover the next day but no more than the feeling of drinking a six pack.
I think some people are just more sensitive to different things. I've always wondered about this.
There is even rumors about nasty allergic reactions I have heard from people eating this family of mushrooms so its a good idea to be careful with new mushrooms that you have never tried before.
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Typerwritermonky
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Thomas Envisio]
#28497444 - 10/09/23 10:03 AM (3 months, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
Thomas Envisio said:
Quote:
the medical system in the States is pretty out of whack
I would call it criminal on multiple levels.
You'd be hard pressed to find a doctor to actually help you. 9/10 would immediately discount your symptoms and chalk it up to drug use. I mean if you told most doctors that you go mushroom hunting in the woods and pick and eat mushrooms that have psychedelic and potentially toxic effects, he'll just write that down and that'll be that. Maybe he'll try and stick you on some anti depressant or other drug they collect a kick back for signing your a prescription for.
It's unfortunate, but I've found that 9/10 doctors i've met with I need to lie too. It sucks, because the level of care crashes down, but so it goes. I've only ever found one good doctor who was incredibly intelligent, wise, and understanding.
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Pentacorn
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Notwhouthink]
#28497526 - 10/09/23 11:39 AM (3 months, 17 days ago) |
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Quote:
Typerwritermonky said:
It's unfortunate, but I've found that 9/10 doctors i've met with I need to lie too. It sucks, because the level of care crashes down, but so it goes.
Ya man, all the doctors I used to work with were so overwhelmed with patients that they couldn't possibly find the time to read through research papers discussing the potential benefits of psychedelics. Instead they just write a prescription for a medication and move on to the next patient.
Quote:
Notwhouthink said:
Quote:
Moria841 said: This is just anectodal fear-mongering, hate to say it I empathize with you and your conditions man, i have chronic conditions that beat my ass too, but it wasn't the Gymns. There's other answers, talk to a doctor
I believe the OP is correct.
Ive experimented with this mushroom a few times and Gymnopilus luteofolius and wanted to comment. I too get the head pressure thing, and more intensely from Gym luteofolius...

I found a bunch more (same log) this fall and unfortunately have to agree with my initial assessment. According to my journal I didn't take G.Luteus for over 8 months and had basically forgotten about the head pressure. After finding a bunch this fall I was super excited again and I took a 1.5g dose. My head pressure is back. Coincidence? Maybe. But it is enough for me to wait until this species is studied more before I consume more of it.
-------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------- WILD LAWN PANAEOLUS - ACTIVE OR NOT? See discussion here: Panaeolus Identification
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Lignicolous
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Pentacorn]
#28512435 - 10/20/23 10:47 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Warning: the following post contains anecdotes and conjecture.
Headaches after consuming Gyms is a real thing. It hasn't happened to me, but my girlfriend gets them consistently. It only seems to happen when she consumes Gyms (but not Psilocybe), and appears to be independent of dosage.
Based on reports from those who have experienced this type of reaction to Gyms, I would categorize this as a non-toxic, non-immune-mediated, hypersensitivity reaction. Meaning that it does not seem likely that the reaction is due to toxicity from psilocin or other intoxicating tryptamines present in Gymnopilus, nor do any of the described symptoms correlate with IgE-mediated immune responses (no flushing, dyspnea, hypotension, or other signs of anaphylaxis).
Whatever is causing these effects is at least somewhat water soluble, because preparing the mushrooms as a tea does not prevent the headaches. Only a subset of the population seems to experience these symptoms, and I'd estimate that percentage as being around 10%. However, consuming Gymnopilus does seem to reliably trigger reactions for those affected by this hypersensitivity, while those who are not experience no ill effects.
This is looking a lot like the hypersensitivity reactions to red wine or chocolate that are attributed to polyphenolic flavonoids and tannins. All species of Gymnopilus are known to produce the styrylpyrone-class polyphenols bis-noryangonin and hispidin. These polyphenols (along with others) contribute to the yellow-orange pigmentation, unique aroma, and bitterness indicative of many Gymnopilus species. Although these substances are generally regarded as non-toxic and potentially beneficial to health, it is quite probable that they may also trigger hypersensitivity reactions for some part of the population.
It should also be noted that polyphenols are known to interfere with the metabolism of certain classes of drugs. This is why people who take statins are told to avoid grapefruit juice, for instance. If you currently take any medication that carries a warning about potential interactions with polyphenols, you should probably consider that before consuming Gymnopilus.
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Moria841



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Lignicolous]
#28512615 - 10/21/23 07:24 AM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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To be perfectly honest, I get some sort of headache probably 50% of the time I take any psychedelic, including from Gymns, Ovoids, Cubensis, etc. etc.
I find your analysis interesting though and I'll look into the matter further myself.
If anyone else has personally experienced Gymns, contribute here, or you can DM me if you're more comfortable with that, and give a brief overview of your experience(s), species consumed, habitat/conditions, dosage, preparation, duration of side-effects (if any), and any other info you feel is important so that we can collect more data. This is something I've been meaning to do for a while anyways.
Also, I would wonder if anyone has tried non-bluing, non-psilocybin Gymn species and had any negative (or positive) effects from those since we still don't know the full chemical profiles of Gymns-- the polyphenols indicated are produced by a very wide range of fungi and plants, and we DON'T know for sure if they are produced by ALL Gymnopilus species. Only one or two studies have published findings of those chemicals in "G. spectabilis," before the species complex was revised. They also mentioned psilocybin, leading me believe the species actually tested was G. orientispectabilis
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Dandurn777



Registered: 12/09/19
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841]
#28512710 - 10/21/23 08:50 AM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Could it be substrate based? Certain toxins or something in certain kinds of hardwood substrates?
-------------------- Prying open my Allenii
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Lignicolous
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Dandurn777]
#28512751 - 10/21/23 09:09 AM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Dandurn777 said: Could it be substrate based? Certain toxins or something in certain kinds of hardwood substrates?
Much more likely to be a secondary metabolite produced by the fungi.
This looks very much like an intolerance reaction rather than one caused by a toxin, as it does not affect everyone. I drank the same tea as my girlfriend, she gets the headaches straight away, and I've never experienced them, regardless of dosage.
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Lignicolous
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841]
#28512802 - 10/21/23 09:50 AM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Moria841 said: Also, I would wonder if anyone has tried non-bluing, non-psilocybin Gymn species and had any negative (or positive) effects from those since we still don't know the full chemical profiles of Gymns-- the polyphenols indicated are produced by a very wide range of fungi and plants, and we DON'T know for sure if they are produced by ALL Gymnopilus species. Only one or two studies have published findings of those chemicals in "G. spectabilis," before the species complex was revised. They also mentioned psilocybin, leading me believe the species actually tested was G. orientispectabilis
I totally agree with what you're saying here. Just so you know where I was coming from with the statement that, "all Gyms contain bis-noryangonin and hispidin," I was basing that largely on Rees, Bettye J. (1996), which is admittedly old and focused on Australian species. However, I believe 37 Gymnopilus species were shown to contain those styrylpyrones, and the conclusion was that presence of those pigments was a reliable way to distinguish Gymnopilus from Galerina.
I believe supplements containing hispidin are available, generally marketed as "Black Hoof Mushroom Extract" or "Phellinus linteus", even though the actual species being provided may be up for debate. We could see if taking that triggers headaches in those that demonstrate the intolerance reaction to Gyms.
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XnMe
Somth'n of a Somth'n



Registered: 06/23/16
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Moria841]
#28556647 - 11/26/23 01:34 AM (2 months, 1 day ago) |
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Quote:
Moria841 said: To be perfectly honest, I get some sort of headache probably 50% of the time I take any psychedelic, including from Gymns, Ovoids, Cubensis, etc. etc.
I find your analysis interesting though and I'll look into the matter further myself.
If anyone else has personally experienced Gymns, contribute here, or you can DM me if you're more comfortable with that, and give a brief overview of your experience(s), species consumed, habitat/conditions, dosage, preparation, duration of side-effects (if any), and any other info you feel is important so that we can collect more data. This is something I've been meaning to do for a while anyways.
Also, I would wonder if anyone has tried non-bluing, non-psilocybin Gymn species and had any negative (or positive) effects from those since we still don't know the full chemical profiles of Gymns-- the polyphenols indicated are produced by a very wide range of fungi and plants, and we DON'T know for sure if they are produced by ALL Gymnopilus species. Only one or two studies have published findings of those chemicals in "G. spectabilis," before the species complex was revised. They also mentioned psilocybin, leading me believe the species actually tested was G. orientispectabilis
Moria I still eat those Gymnopilus liquiritiae I posted on you're gymn. thread.
And I'll grab 2-3 quarter size or so caps and the accompanied stem with a few beers and its great. Not particularly crazy trippy but I haven't been bold with like 10g's. I get the giggles and a good few times will literally laugh my ass off by myself for no freakin reason, and I mean like belly aching laughing, eyes watering, barely breathing shit(literally like 2-3 times this vacation lol) Definitely would love to find somewhere to send samples to find out the bio-actives, and do a bold dose with just them by themselves an see. Cause it's like a really nice serotonin boost. I actually found these yesterday, definitely way past there prime. And been soaked and frozen multiple times as the temp fluxion. First time I found a dense cluster of them too.



 And these again found to late. A month ago maybe.


And how they look young and dry ish..







--------------------
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kochab
Fractal burning minimalist

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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: XnMe]
#28557351 - 11/26/23 02:54 PM (2 months, 18 hours ago) |
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Anybody else get the effect that viewing a bunch of gym pics, makes them wanna go home and brew gym tea? I've been doing some reading today and that's been the effect on me. Lol
Though the heat flush I occasionally experience from this particular species I have now isn't really so desired. Only report I've read of it came from another user here, not surprisingly also within my same state, and working outdoors as I do. I won't consume them when working anymore as I will small doses of other mushrooms. A furnace inside you with no high limit thermostat and no way to shut it down, sucks horribly. Only time I've ever had real concerns of being near a heat stroke...
Likely caused by the species being weak or near inactive since I have to take such a high dose. 5 grams dry was a threshold dose of the species if I remember when first finding it. As I like to partake often, it got to be no ordeal for me to consume 11grams dry when I've got no plans on walking. Never any cev or oev from them but the most hellacious body buzz from anything I've found safe to ingest. And they came in plenties for quite a while.
Sitting on about 30g dry now chewing a hole in my consciousness from afar now that I'm outta town. If finances left from family's cancer diagnosis and trying to get treatment started weren't so fucked up I'd deposit some into an herbarium for the scope work. But thus is life
-------------------- Those looking at images of early man, assuming they are much higher up, are still primordial in thought.
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XnMe
Somth'n of a Somth'n



Registered: 06/23/16
Posts: 1,272
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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: kochab]
#28557498 - 11/26/23 04:54 PM (2 months, 16 hours ago) |
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Cool info/research done on gymnopilins, found in none psilocybin containing gymn type in Japan.
Had me interested of the activities in the pc12 adrenal cromaffin cells in rats. As well as the receptors they say are targeted deal with motor control amongst other things, fun stuff.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/260043066_Gymnopilins_a_product_of_a_hallucinogenic_mushroom_inhibit_the_nicotinic_acetylcholine_receptor
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anonimushi
Stranger

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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: XnMe] 1
#28558798 - 11/27/23 07:46 PM (1 month, 30 days ago) |
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I'd like to share my 2 cents, I've had Gymnopilus subspectabilis on 5 occasions of those I've experienced a slight headache maybe 40% of the time. I seem to experience it at the peak and then it goes away at the end. I've only experimented with dosages around 2 - 2.5g but even doses that low they still provide you with quite a euphoric body buzz that lasts around 4 hrs. I also feel it gives you this state of absolute calmness/peace, like the total absence of anxiety.
Edited by anonimushi (11/28/23 10:13 AM)
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Bardy


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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: anonimushi]
#28559021 - 11/28/23 02:17 AM (1 month, 30 days ago) |
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So 1.75 times out of 5 you’ve had a headache 😉 lol
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anonimushi
Stranger

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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: Bardy]
#28559286 - 11/28/23 10:14 AM (1 month, 29 days ago) |
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Quote:
Bardy said: So 1.75 times out of 5 you’ve had a headache 😉 lol
Meant 40% my bad lol.
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6The6Despised6One
southern-fried eskimo



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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: anonimushi]
#28563435 - 12/01/23 08:16 AM (1 month, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
6The6Despised6One said:
one of the most intense trips ive ever had was from about 110-ish FRESH grams of gymnopilus luteofolious maybe? (could have been 2 different varieties, one was real dark purply the other was super bright yellow. it was made into tea and split in half between me and my girl (one tall cup each). the trip also lasted almost 2 days, you can definitely tell theres other things than just the psilocybin in them. i usually feel a slight speedy/amphetamine boost from gyms. also expect some vividly realistic strange dreams that you can remember.
on the flip side though there has been a time or two where we used like 80-ish fresh grams and only felt it mildly. er on the side of caution though from my experience gyms can vary wildly
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Bardy


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Re: WARNING! Gymnopilus Luteus negative effects after consumption... [Re: 6The6Despised6One]
#28564360 - 12/01/23 07:55 PM (1 month, 26 days ago) |
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That’s really interesting. I wonder if anyone has done analysis on Gymns and detected any other unique tryptamines or something?
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