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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ascetic values. [Re: sudly]
    #28247035 - 03/26/23 05:33 AM (9 months, 29 days ago)

I wish the dominance of duality between determinism and free will would fuck off.

we need to adapt to the understanding that we are in the midst of a contextually personal reflexive continuum. We can influence that by evaluating what we are attracted to and repelled from. Through that evaluation, plus practice, patience and tranquility we can navigate to a better place in our lives.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values. [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28248624 - 03/26/23 11:30 PM (9 months, 28 days ago)

I compartmentalised a significant portion of my weekend, and overall I had a fantastic time.

I like being able to choose to care.

I am an average normal human being.. I have faith in the Sun and an enclosed system of responsibility.

One not outside Earth or the moon.


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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



Edited by sudly (03/27/23 12:40 AM)


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values. [Re: sudly]
    #28248679 - 03/27/23 01:59 AM (9 months, 28 days ago)

I think the practice of compartmentalisation through cognitive refocus therapy can reduce cognitive arousal, sometimes through paradoxical intention.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ascetic values. [Re: sudly]
    #28248739 - 03/27/23 04:01 AM (9 months, 28 days ago)

isn't compartmentalization a formalized association approach
i say whatever provides a bit of transparency to the flux of mental contents is valid, so as long as every furry creature seen is not just another bunny, OK.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values. [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28250301 - 03/28/23 02:03 AM (9 months, 27 days ago)

Upon reflection,

Quote:

It sounds like you're describing a state of mindfulness where you are able to observe your thoughts without getting caught up in them or judging them. This can be a helpful way to stay present and focused in the moment without being distracted by irrelevant thoughts.

In mindfulness practice, this state is often referred to as "non-judgmental awareness" or "non-reactive attention." By observing your thoughts without judgment or attachment, you can create a mental distance between yourself and your thoughts, which can help you to focus on the present moment more effectively.

While compartmentalization typically involves setting aside thoughts or emotions to focus on a particular task, mindfulness practice involves cultivating a broader awareness of your thoughts and emotions and learning to observe them without judgment. So it's possible that another word or phrase, like "mindful observation" or "non-judgmental focus," might be more appropriate to describe the mental state you're experiencing.




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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ascetic values. [Re: sudly]
    #28250376 - 03/28/23 04:19 AM (9 months, 27 days ago)

Quote:

sudly said:
Upon reflection,

Quote:

It sounds like you're describing a state of mindfulness where you are able to observe your thoughts without getting caught up in them or judging them. This can be a helpful way to stay present and focused in the moment without being distracted by irrelevant thoughts.

In mindfulness practice, this state is often referred to as "non-judgmental awareness" or "non-reactive attention." By observing your thoughts without judgment or attachment, you can create a mental distance between yourself and your thoughts, which can help you to focus on the present moment more effectively.

While compartmentalization typically involves setting aside thoughts or emotions to focus on a particular task, mindfulness practice involves cultivating a broader awareness of your thoughts and emotions and learning to observe them without judgment. So it's possible that another word or phrase, like "mindful observation" or "non-judgmental focus," might be more appropriate to describe the mental state you're experiencing.






sort of, yes
If I were to think about saying that it would eventually look like this revised & edited snippet and commentary below
Quote:

if redgreenvines were to say what sudly quoted from someplace:
It sounds like you're describing a practice of mindfulness where you  observe your mental contents without getting caught up in them or judging them. This can be a helpful way to stay present in the moment without going off on a tangent.

In mindfulness practice, this is often referred to as "non-judgmental awareness" or "non-reactive attention." By observing your mental contents without reflexive judgment or defensive attachment, you do not identify with or defend them, leaving you in the present moment more effectively.

Mindfulness practice involves cultivating a broad relaxed awareness of mental contents and learning to observe them without associative judgment and tangential ramification. It is not exactly a mental state, since it is an attitude that can be practiced, and reflexivey effected in any mental state or physical posture that you may be experiencing.






In particular, I am steering away from "state" as a target term, since nothing is static. However what is practiced will become reflexive. I am also widening the term "thoughts" to mental contents which includes all experience or phenomena that may naturally associate into memory such as sensations, perceptions, thoughts, and overall feelings. Even awareness itself (reflection) has a mental content aspect to it. One can know that one is reflecting on the whole gestalt: it comes down to reflecting what is, at the same time as reflecting what is personally known, without troubling.

Finally I am avoiding the term "compartmentalization", which is not the de facto other option to mindfulness, although it could be an individual habit in some people.

If I were to analyze compartmentalization, I would have to suggest that it is in itself a noble kind of awareness practice that is is strict about which associative category each noticed thing might be part of, and this process, by being time consuming, defeats the reflection of ongoing experience in the moment due to the involvement with judgemental tangents of thought - assessing how best to associate that which seems significant. The idea of a compartmentalization practice is usually that it is the most sane way to be - i.e. sanity depends on efficient compartmentalization. (which is absurdly impossible but usually taken to be true.)

Instead of referring to compartmentalization as the alternate way of being, I might simply refer to our bumbling ordinary way of avoiding detailed reality, while trying to be analytical about it when we get the chance. In any scenario (eg compartmentalization, mindfulness, emotionalism, or addiction, etc.), all mental contents which are not sensation are associative reflexes. That should make it easier to determine which way to go at any contemplative crossroads.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28255603 - 03/31/23 02:00 AM (9 months, 24 days ago)

What examples are there of how mindfulness can be practiced in daily life?

Y'know, how to apply the concept of mindfulness in various contexts.

I hear to breathe, to go for a walk, to make some dinner or cook. To sit cross legged in a quiet room holding you arms up with pinched fingers ensued.

What my own mindfulness experiences have been were sitting in a deck chair looking over the balcony and mindfully practicing holding on to less for longer.

It's an experience to say the least, a step outside my comfort zone but one that seems to bring me comfort in the long term or in the end.

Another mindfulness practice I've done is drawing upon an idea or phrase with crayons then colouring it in and coming up with a creative art attempt.

Sometimes I sit by the computer with guitar in hand practicing finger muscle memory and mostly the technique of finger picking.

I drive to informative podcasts and plan the timing, the location and cost of the journeys and weekend travel I do.

I went 4 hours South to the base of a mountain range last week with no reception to fossick for sapphire gemstones, then went to a gem fest 2 days later an hour drive from home to value the found goods.

I was honest about what I wanted and what I didn't want and I went on a date Wednesday with an interesting beautiful lady.

I didn't expect to have things go saucy from the get go, I wanted to and want to get to know her, and it takes time to setup and build good communication.

Practice doesn't make perfect, it fuels progress.


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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



Edited by sudly (03/31/23 02:53 AM)


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: sudly]
    #28255671 - 03/31/23 04:18 AM (9 months, 24 days ago)

Quote:

sudly said:
...

I hear to breathe, to go for a walk, to make some dinner or cook. To sit cross legged in a quiet room holding you arms up with pinched fingers ensued.





I must say this is weird. disconnected residue. see below.


Quote:

sudly said:
What my own mindfulness experiences have been were sitting in a deck chair looking over the balcony and mindfully practicing holding on to less for longer.




this is too conceptual

Quote:

sudly said:
It's an experience to say the least, a step outside my comfort zone but one that seems to bring me comfort in the long term or in the end.

Another mindfulness practice I've done is drawing upon an idea or phrase with crayons then colouring it in and coming up with a creative art attempt.

Sometimes I sit by the computer with guitar in hand practicing finger muscle memory and mostly the technique of finger picking.




while these have some potential for perfecting arts, by immersing one's mind moments into the pursuit of excellence or just immersion, they are really for more advanced meditators.

Quote:

sudly said:
I drive to informative podcasts and plan the timing, the location and cost of the journeys and weekend travel I do.




skillful means in life makes sense.

I had a long series of back and forth communication with Pinky on this forum about going into the moment - in the council of elders thread - this is a good place to start: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28113771#28113771

as for posture, any posture is fine - sitting, lying down, whatever.
if you want to do counting that is ok.
no nose pinching, that is pranayama, not core to the issue of being present, observant, and calm.

if there is anything to remember it is to be present, honestly attentive to any sensation or idea or feeling, and relaxing. everything ramifies from that.
Note when the awareness falters and return to the breath and the relaxing awareness lightly - without frustration.

It is not suitable to do the practice while driving or operating machinery, however, being present and relaxed is very suitable for any activity - this may be years away, or it may set in tomorrow (you are training a reflex to be honestly aware of mental contents and not flinching).

make distinctions between practice and ordinary awareness efforts in life - practice is done during a time set aside to get a good connection with relaxing and observing mental contents at ~10 content changes per second -I use 40 minutes in half lotus on the floor.

you cannot practice(*) if you are in a conversation or driving or making pictures, but you certainly can benefit from a relaxed, informed, and honed awareness in those circumstances.

(*) Mendicant Monks may practice through every action and pause in every minute of their day following detailed instructions that are not applicable to ordinary western life or even ordinary eastern life. It is a monastic immersion after total renunciation of ordinary life. They have a routine for eating, pissing sleeping etc. I know nothing about those details.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28256980 - 04/01/23 12:50 AM (9 months, 23 days ago)

The mental fortitude for planning sure has an interesting chime to it.

Perfecting isn't my goal, practicing is.

Because I recognise the long term benefits of it and find a sense of enjoyment and fulfillment from a lot of my daily activities, when I can clearly see the progress I've made and the efforts I've put in to achieve what I had at that point.

But the cycle rolls on and life continues and as I recall it, I'm still improving, so whatever method there is to this madness, I keep experiencing that it is effective.


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InvisibleRahz
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: sudly]
    #28257626 - 04/01/23 12:59 PM (9 months, 23 days ago)

It's not something I do any more but I meditated daily for 5 years. Highly recommended. The ability to calm the nervous system becomes quicker with practice and is retained.

Early on I remember having laid there for about 15 minutes, thinking I was fully relaxed. Then I saw my foot tilt slightly letting go of the tension that was holding it in place. I was not aware that tension was there until the movement.


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rahz

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"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: Rahz]
    #28257650 - 04/01/23 01:12 PM (9 months, 23 days ago)

I find that while some absorption seems to begin immediately, that it takes around 20 minutes to build up to an sustainable meditative "state".

in a way it is like riding a bicycle, you do not forget how; but if not practiced, you wont use it as regularly as you could, and you will miss it.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28258605 - 04/02/23 03:59 AM (9 months, 22 days ago)

I've just been practicing moderation mah man. Apparently lots of 20 minutes are a good amount of time to absorb information.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: sudly]
    #28258635 - 04/02/23 05:11 AM (9 months, 22 days ago)

we may be writing about the same thing, although:
a. we are in a continuum of absorbing impressions into memory (not information) all the time - including meditation.
b. we are also in a continuum of perceptively reflexing to the impressions (what they signify, and how to react) all the time - including meditation.
c. we are not necessarily aware of all this as mental contents; so what is required is more calm gestalt perspective - observing reflexes in the mind, which are powerful and motivating, that not necessarily be what you want them to be:
  • first you have to see them in action
  • then you have to attend with tranquility (or vice versa - the same result in the end - association with a calm center)


there should be a difference between a meditation practice, and just coasting free - lah dee dah.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: sudly]
    #28264500 - 04/06/23 12:14 AM (9 months, 18 days ago)

I'm trying to learn what a Polyamorous relationship is and how it can work with effective communication about hard boundaries, soft boundaries, kinks, dominant and sub preferences, as well as highlighting trends of reactive or spontaneous arousal and the importance of enthusiastic consent and relaxed body language.

Not to mention how to handle and approach jealousy if it inevitably comes into the picture. Accepting inevitable outcomes can be a difficult idea to comprehend or come to understandable and comfortable terms with.

So I don't blame people not seeing eye to eye with me, and I try to separate my emotions from being judgmental, favouring reflective analysis instead.

I do regular health checkups too. I'm in good health. Even my triglycerides are 1.2 instead of 3.6. I've cut my triglyceride level 3 times from 3.6 to 1.2. It's down 300% in 6 months. My sugar consumption is down maybe 90% in the last 3 month's. And I've lost around 7kg.

I'm very comfortable with myself and generally pretty confident in my day to day being, but that I am still discovering what I do and don't want from intimacy, friendship and sexual relations.

Especially coming out of a 5 year relationship that ended amicably late last year.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28264503 - 04/06/23 12:16 AM (9 months, 18 days ago)

Quote:

there should be a difference between a meditation practice, and just coasting free - lah dee dah.




The blend is hard to see.

Can't I be learning in lah dee dah, or when I'm meditating separately?

Can't we meditate while using a brush cutter for 2 hours without music?

Or shaping a piece of balsa wood on the bench grinder?

Reflective analysis and whatnot, practice of.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: sudly] * 1
    #28264557 - 04/06/23 02:57 AM (9 months, 18 days ago)

Meditation can be a bit like ASMR.
Brush cutter asmr might be a thing.

Truthfully anything you do for 5 minutes straight without interruption becomes a kind of mental standing wave, and that modifies your state of mind - an effect that is common in meditations of all kinds.

Mindfulness meditation, however, stays close to natural breathing and a relaxed non-reactive observation of the arising and passing of mental contents.


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OfflineBrendanFlock
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28265230 - 04/06/23 01:02 PM (9 months, 18 days ago)

Just a thought..

Men compartmentalize based on logic and associations.

Women compartmentalize based on emotional associations?


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: sudly]
    #28266227 - 04/07/23 12:16 AM (9 months, 17 days ago)

I am a beginner at mindfulness meditation then I might add.

I have gone to several classes, and did take home the analogy of to think of thoughts as leaves flowing down a stream. They will come, but you can let them pass by too.

I had a complete ASMR top to bottom spine shiver after I read the comment of, 'Brush cutter asmr might be a thing.'

And this was a few minutes after learning or remembering what asmr even was.

I've had them before from thoughts of tangy or sweet food.

Front the thought of dragging an icypole across my two front teeth, from the sight of crushed HWBR infront of me.

Not quite like a cold shower shiver, but a building wave that smoothly crashes down my spine from the cerebellum to just above the tail.

I think it's out of my control but I do recognise it. 

It is somewhat pleasant at times.

Although I could be mixing pavlov responses in there :shrug:


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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.



Edited by sudly (04/07/23 12:23 AM)


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: sudly] * 1
    #28266314 - 04/07/23 04:35 AM (9 months, 17 days ago)

@sudly
by definition,
we are all beginners at mindfulness, no matter where we are at.

there is no rank at all in it.


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Invisiblesudly
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Re: Ascetic values and mindfulness [Re: redgreenvines]
    #28266323 - 04/07/23 04:50 AM (9 months, 17 days ago)

Philosophically I just find myself feeling beholden to the Sun and nature as a whole. Not with services, but mere gratitude.

Im still learning about how I come off to people in my life as I further blend persona and action into experience.

A lot of these thoughts I don't actively verbalize to people or get into the details of. I reflect on a number of them.

Self development and theory development have always been the goal of Shroomery for me, and over the years I've learnt to integrate a lot of the lessons I've taken from the shroomery into the experience of my own life and how I understand and comprehend the world around me.

:toast:


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