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 christopera
Stranger
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 Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA  [Re: koods]
#28177277 - 02/08/23 08:17 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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The height is the only reason that a balloon was needed. It's the cheapest way to get to those heights.
Since they are Chinese, they probably don't care about FAA regulations, especially if they are spy balloons.
I'm not sure what the military has called them, but it really doesn't matter much. If this is the best execution of aerial photography China has got then we don't have much to worry about.
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koods
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: christopera]
#28177328 - 02/08/23 09:06 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Idk by staying above 60,000 feet the balloon isn’t violating any FAA regulations, and isn’t a threat to civil aviation. That takes away a lot of justification for shooting it down.
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 1234go
Registered: 07/08/09
Posts: 56,788
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: christopera] 1
#28177331 - 02/08/23 09:08 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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"Spy balloon" is almost certainly just a buzzword to keep people watching...for whatever reason.
If you turn on the news, every time they run this story they're putting major emphases on "spy" every time they refer to it...saying it over and over again.
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Asante
Omnicyclion prophet
Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,330
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: 1234go] 1
#28177369 - 02/08/23 09:31 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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It would make total sense for China to experiment with hydrogen filled extreme altitude balloons for various completely civilian purposes.
its one of the frontiers of human endeavor.
But a nonrigid balloon the size of 3 buses being manouvred for spy purposes sounds like someone had his MAGA cap on a notch too tight 
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1234go
Registered: 07/08/09
Posts: 56,788
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: Asante]
#28177375 - 02/08/23 09:35 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Yeah, I mean...a spy craft would wanna go unseen. This thing was visible with the naked eye.
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Sugabearcrisp
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: koods]
#28177391 - 02/08/23 09:50 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
koods said:
The amount of force required to alter the velocity of a 200 foot diameter balloon even a couple miles per hour would be immense
Solar panels powering propellers applied over a long time would be plenty to steer within the atmospheric river it was traveling within.
Upper atmospheric currents are much more consistent and predictable than surface or even altitudes normally traveled by planes.
Quote:
koods said:
Presumably it would have a way to change its buoyancy, either through outgassing or the ability to compress and decompress the helium. At least it would have the capability to deflate so it could be recovered.
My theory is it has the ability to run a compressor, driven by those solar panels, and a tank to store compressed helium. That would give it the ability to change altitude moderately.
Recovery is not required. The balloon had a constant link to geostationary satelites above.
This is why the idea that we blocked its signal communication back is bullshit.
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gopher
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: christopera]
#28177400 - 02/08/23 09:59 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
christopera said:
The US can easily shoot down 300 of them. Or 3000 of them. The US has like 1500 fighter jets. It's not like the balloons fight back, they float and asides from whatever instrumentation they have, that is all they do. The US has also been tracking them for years. So it's a known quantity.
Like I say, the entire story doesn't add up. "Spy" is just a term the media used to sell advertisements.
Did anyone click my link, in the 90s a balloon evaded the canadian air force, they refused to use missiles though, they were only using bullets, but they couldnt shoot it down, you have to aim at the payload not the balloon with bullets, if you hit the balloon with bullets I hiess the hole is too small to do much, and the link said stationary targets are harder to hit with planes then moving targets
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durian_2008
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: budmanman]
#28177415 - 02/08/23 10:06 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Our colonizers (the CCP) posted a meme of a pixar movie with the house and balloons and said that American free speech was used for stupid purposes.
True enough.
Meanwhile, back on Earth --
China Just Opened Police Stations in Your Country - Episode #126
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 spirit_shadow
Beta Crypt 3
Registered: 08/15/11
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: durian_2008]
#28177508 - 02/08/23 11:14 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Never knows best.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011
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koods
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: spirit_shadow]
#28177524 - 02/08/23 11:25 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
This is why the idea that we blocked its signal communication back is bullshit.
You can block it by filling the frequencies it transmits on with an overpowering signal, ie jamming.
Quote:
Solar panels powering propellers applied over a long time would be plenty to steer within the atmospheric river it was traveling within.
It’s a 200 ft, spherical object. There were no propellers. Nope
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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant
Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 17,739
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: spirit_shadow]
#28177529 - 02/08/23 11:28 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Their rebels are a special breed, who makes me feel ashamed of our cultural Marxists.
If refuseniks were persecuted for the China virus, I would tend to err on the side of defending their honor -- particularly, those who would believe in God for a real, literal, miracle, rather than using his name in vain like in the American, state church.
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant
Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 17,739
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: durian_2008]
#28177545 - 02/08/23 11:47 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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We are a spent democracy, at the end of the cycle.
Quote:
Tytler said:
From apathy to dependence;
From dependence back into bondage.
Chinese hopefuls are at the beginning.
Quote:
Tytler said:
From bondage to spiritual faith;
From spiritual faith to great courage
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christopera
Stranger
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: koods]
#28177614 - 02/08/23 12:47 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
koods said:
Idk by staying above 60,000 feet the balloon isn’t violating any FAA regulations, and isn’t a threat to civil aviation. That takes away a lot of justification for shooting it down.
I suppose you are right, I sort of missed your point. I think maybe they just wanted to have a look at what the balloon actually does? I have no idea what the rules are on shooting down unmanned flying craft. Are there any? It's not something I have ever considered.
The entire "giant balloon doing surveillance" theory is a joke though.
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Enjoy the process of your search without succumbing to the pressure of the result.
A Dorito is pizza, change my mind.
Bank and Union with The Shroomery at the Zuul on The internet - now with %'s and things
I’m sorry it had to be me.
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Sugabearcrisp
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: koods] 1
#28177657 - 02/08/23 01:07 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
koods said:
Quote:
This is why the idea that we blocked its signal communication back is bullshit.
You can block it by filling the frequencies it transmits on with an overpowering signal, ie jamming.
If you could produce a signal from the ground below strong enough to interfere with the baloons satelite uplink you would interfere with commercial and private aircraft above and probably cellular on the ground. Beyond that obvious fact it is just really hard to block something from 60,000 feet away sending something the opposite direction. 
Regarding the propellers wapo quoted officials as stating it had propellers so not my suposition.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/02/04/chinese-balloon-shoot-down/
The real question is why are you fighting so hard to minimize and obscure the reality of what happened?
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LogicaL Chaos
Ascension Energy & Alien UFOs
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 Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: christopera]
#28177767 - 02/08/23 02:27 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Perhaps China made the assumption that since it is a balloon, its harmless to the US and the US wouldnt down them.
I read in a previous news article that the balloon actually had some onboard navigation controls like propellers and rudders. Cant seem to find that article now thou.....
Quote:
The U.S. Navy and Coast Guard are currently working to recover debris from the downed Chinese craft. Ryder said nearby states had approved the DoD's deployment of divers and explosive technicians to disassemble and recover the thousands of pounds of equipment now at the bottom of the sea.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/china-has-a-lot-of-explaining-to-do-after-spy-flights-found-violating-sovereignty-on-5-continents-dod/ar-AA17gaHO?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=33e2d52c79a64610819fdabb0c5c7ccb
This seems so dumb. Couldnt there have been an easier way to "catch" or preserve the payload then having to send subs underwater? What about attaching airbags to the metallic payload before blowing up the balloon with a missile? The whole mission seems poorly thought out....
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koods
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: Sugabearcrisp]
#28177848 - 02/08/23 03:24 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Sugabearcrisp said:
Quote:
koods said:
Quote:
This is why the idea that we blocked its signal communication back is bullshit.
You can block it by filling the frequencies it transmits on with an overpowering signal, ie jamming.
If you could produce a signal from the ground below strong enough to interfere with the baloons satelite uplink you would interfere with commercial and private aircraft above and probably cellular on the ground. Beyond that obvious fact it is just really hard to block something from 60,000 feet away sending something the opposite direction.
Regarding the propellers wapo quoted officials as stating it had propellers so not my suposition.
As for
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/02/04/chinese-balloon-shoot-down/
The real question is why are you fighting so hard to minimize and obscure the reality of what happened?
The notion that it’s capable of hovering over a location is absurd. It’s absurd that it would be capable of any significant ability to steer itself for many the reasons as stated elsewhere.
There’s also the fact that it didnt exhibit any ability to steer itself while over the US, because it ended up exactly where the winds indicated it would end up.
To jam a signal all you would have to do is send a jamming signal to the satellite from a directional antenna on the ground. It wouldn’t have to be in between the balloon and satellites. You could easily overpower the signal being sent by the balloon. Blocking the signal from satellite to balloon wouldn’t be necessary. The intel would br going from balloon to satellite.
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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
Edited by koods (02/08/23 03:31 PM)
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PatrickKn
Registered: 07/10/11
Posts: 20,716
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: koods]
#28177863 - 02/08/23 03:32 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Doesn't need to radically change its trajectory, just needs to be able to hover over a military base or city longer than, and collect more data than a satellite much further away might.
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Sugabearcrisp
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: koods]
#28177972 - 02/08/23 04:40 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
koods said:
Quote:
Sugabearcrisp said:
Quote:
koods said:
Quote:
This is why the idea that we blocked its signal communication back is bullshit.
You can block it by filling the frequencies it transmits on with an overpowering signal, ie jamming.
If you could produce a signal from the ground below strong enough to interfere with the baloons satelite uplink you would interfere with commercial and private aircraft above and probably cellular on the ground. Beyond that obvious fact it is just really hard to block something from 60,000 feet away sending something the opposite direction.
Regarding the propellers wapo quoted officials as stating it had propellers so not my suposition.
As for
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/02/04/chinese-balloon-shoot-down/
The real question is why are you fighting so hard to minimize and obscure the reality of what happened?
The notion that it’s capable of hovering over a location is absurd. It’s absurd that it would be capable of any significant ability to steer itself for many the reasons as stated elsewhere.
There’s also the fact that it didnt exhibit any ability to steer itself while over the US, because it ended up exactly where the winds indicated it would end up.
To jam a signal all you would have to do is send a jamming signal to the satellite from a directional antenna on the ground. It wouldn’t have to be in between the balloon and satellites. You could easily overpower the signal being sent by the balloon. Blocking the signal from satellite to balloon wouldn’t be necessary. The intel would br going from balloon to satellite.
I said nothing about hovering. It followed the prevalent and predictable winds at the macro level but was able to hit all those bases by steering with sideways force. Similar to how a spacecraft in orbit or on a trajectory can navigate with small and well timed thruster inputs. We're not talking about abrupt turns, but slow course changes that turn into miles one way or the other lateraly over miles.
Regarding the jamming; antenas don't work like you describe. It is not a laser. Even if it was which it isn't and you could overpower the beam headed up the chinese have hundreds of satelites to pick up the signal and you can't shine your magical directional antena at all of them at the same time. Then there is the logistics of needing multiple magical directional antennas on the ground.
Best case would be to fly a sr71 or the black project replacement in the area and jam while it was near the base. But that would be easily circumvented with storage caching until comms are restored.
Maybe the bases went silent or sent false signals. But even that would be problematic, you can't turn off comms to your deterent forces because a balloon goes overhead. What if they use that time to attack and your base is on radio silence?
I suppose you could have flown between the baloon and the base and blocked your own signals going up to the baloon but they still get imaging and radar.
Should have shot it down over alaska
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spirit_shadow
Beta Crypt 3
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: Sugabearcrisp]
#28177981 - 02/08/23 04:49 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Biden vs Winnie the pooh MMA match of the year 
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Never knows best.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011
Ban lotto
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koods
Ribbit
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Re: Chinese spy balloon floating across USA [Re: Sugabearcrisp]
#28178001 - 02/08/23 04:58 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Parabolic reflectors work exactly the same way for radio waves as they do for light waves, and are highly directional.
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NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”
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