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Offlineww972
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Grain question
    #28172335 - 02/04/23 05:23 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Hello guys,

I have a quick question about my grain jars:

I am using a mix of grains (55% wheat, 20 barley, 20% corn and 5% oats). On my first batch i cooked them for 30 min and got a bit of a mushy result that still worked out pretty well.

On my second batch of 6 jars i cooked for 15 minutes but i notice than on all jars (3 from clean agar culture and 3 from spore syringe) a few grains of oats, maybe 5 or 6, on each jar, are not colonized.

Could it be that the oat grains are not cooked enough or is it just bacteria? Again it's always oats.

Thank you :smile:


Edited by ww972 (02/04/23 05:25 PM)

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Offlinefiddle_head
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Re: Grain question [Re: ww972]
    #28172344 - 02/04/23 05:28 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

That looks very sus mate. Bacteria is it if I had a gun on me but I'm not going to rule out other possibilities.
I have to ask, why such a complicated grain mixture? Did you read this somewhere to do that? What tek are you following...
Also, didn't you just post this same thing a day or two ago? Maybe you could add this to that post.


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Offlineww972
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Re: Grain question [Re: fiddle_head]
    #28172360 - 02/04/23 05:41 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fiddle_head said:
That looks very sus mate. Bacteria is it if I had a gun on me but I'm not going to rule out other possibilities.
I have to ask, why such a complicated grain mixture? Did you read this somewhere to do that? What tek are you following...
Also, didn't you just post this same thing a day or two ago? Maybe you could add this to that post.





Hey,

I just bought the grain mix at the pet store to try, it is cheap and easy to get for me and seems to work well. I PCed the jars for 90 minutes.

The other post was from my previous jar batch which serves as a diary for my first grow, that's why i made a new one.

Then if it's bacterial it could only come from my agar transfers but all of them seemed healthy without any coloration. The only weird thing was 2 plates (no pour with a very thin agar layer of about 2mm of agar) had thick mycelium growing.

Edited by ww972 (02/04/23 05:42 PM)

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OfflineCrackatoa
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Re: Grain question [Re: ww972]
    #28172371 - 02/04/23 05:50 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Do you have pics of those plates?


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Offlineww972
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Re: Grain question [Re: Crackatoa]
    #28172395 - 02/04/23 06:05 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Crackatoa said:
Do you have pics of those plates?





This was taken a week before transferring to grain. it's 2mm on the middle as the bottom is rounded


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OfflineCrackatoa
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Re: Grain question [Re: ww972]
    #28172413 - 02/04/23 06:18 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

That looks sus, do more transfers next time


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Offlinehazyhorse
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Re: Grain question [Re: ww972]
    #28172420 - 02/04/23 06:24 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

a 15 minute cook time seems too short to properly hydrate oats at the very least, unless there are grain teks im not privy to, grains like oats need a fair bit of time in a hot soak or at a full boil to hydrate well. i could be wrong there tho. there are also a lot of people that have problems with oats being funky, so that may not be helping things. i know you got this pre mixed, probably best to stick to one type of grain per jar before using blends just to rule anything out. wild bird seed (WBS) is a really accessible & frequently used mix of grains i’d recommend trying out if you can’t find pure wheat or millet or whatever.

also, what was your sterilization procedure for the jars once they were loaded with grain?


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Offlineww972
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Re: Grain question [Re: hazyhorse]
    #28172512 - 02/04/23 07:07 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

hazyhorse said:
a 15 minute cook time seems too short to properly hydrate oats at the very least, unless there are grain teks im not privy to, grains like oats need a fair bit of time in a hot soak or at a full boil to hydrate well. i could be wrong there tho. there are also a lot of people that have problems with oats being funky, so that may not be helping things. i know you got this pre mixed, probably best to stick to one type of grain per jar before using blends just to rule anything out. wild bird seed (WBS) is a really accessible & frequently used mix of grains i’d recommend trying out if you can’t find pure wheat or millet or whatever.

also, what was your sterilization procedure for the jars once they were loaded with grain?




I hope it's just the cooking that was too short to hydrate the oats... I have found some here but a bit pricey, I'll probably try WBS next yes :smile:

Sterilization was 90 minutes in the PC with lids loosely screwed and covered with aluminium foil

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Offlinehazyhorse
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Re: Grain question [Re: ww972] * 1
    #28172559 - 02/04/23 07:33 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

WBS is sick! i highly recommend if you can source it. some people love oats but they are notorious for not working well for other people.

90 minutes should be fine as long as you’re venting for 15+ minutes

if crack is saying your agar looks sus that’s definitely something to look at. never hurts to do a few extra transfers to be safe


--------------------
you're not the first to set foot here, just another
===================================
i love glass petris & you can too!!
posts i constantly refer back to
new to mushroom cultivation?? read this!!
===================================

πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Offlineww972
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Re: Grain question [Re: hazyhorse]
    #28172995 - 02/05/23 05:44 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

hazyhorse said:
WBS is sick! i highly recommend if you can source it. some people love oats but they are notorious for not working well for other people.

90 minutes should be fine as long as you’re venting for 15+ minutes

if crack is saying your agar looks sus that’s definitely something to look at. never hurts to do a few extra transfers to be safe




Thank you guys for all your inputs πŸ™
I wi definitely follow your advices. Good thinks is that i still have transfers from my previous plates. Everytime is use one i transfer some to new plates to keep it growing :smile:

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Offlinefiddle_head
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Re: Grain question [Re: ww972]
    #28173273 - 02/05/23 10:55 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

I might be the only one but I cycle my oats for 150 minutes, but thats all im using just plain oats.


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Invisibleruawakeyet
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Re: Grain question [Re: ww972] * 1
    #28173292 - 02/05/23 11:15 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Using a mix of different grains will give you problems because not all grains will hydrate at the same rate. Corn is notorious for being difficult to fully hydrate, so it's not going to match what is needed for the smaller grains.

I would guess that the wheat, barley and oats would have similar requirements, but I can't speak from experience.

The milo and millet in WBS seems to work well, despite being different sizes. The millet is much smaller, but also has a really hard outer shell. I also like that it doesn't need extensive time to dry the outside after hydrating, unlike oats.

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OfflineExcess Taters
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Re: Grain question [Re: ruawakeyet] * 1
    #28173359 - 02/05/23 12:01 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Penningtons has the optimal WBS according to most folk on this forum.  It doesn't have cracked corn in it, which is apparently problematic.  Walmart has bags for $25 or whatever, and a bag is enough for like 50-100 quarts or so.

As it stands, I'd try to stick with one thing in particular, rather than making mixes or blends.  Then master that shit specifically and if you want to adjust things go for it.


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If you've never grown mushrooms before, here's how you start.  First, follow the Updated PF Tek, put 4 holes in jar lids not 1, and use a water tub! 
The next move is Shoebox Tek. After that you move onto grains, agar, monotubs.  Agar is easy, just do it.
Other useful links - Picture guide for how things should look and proper surface conditions guide
Growing APE or PE?  P9 pseudo casing tek

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OfflineOldManRiver
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Re: Grain question [Re: fiddle_head] * 1
    #28173389 - 02/05/23 12:24 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fiddle_head said:
I might be the only one but I cycle my oats for 150 minutes, but thats all im using just plain oats.




I use oats with great results. They aren't as cheap as they used to be, the last bag I got was 50 lbs for $32 (previous one was $14 a couple years ago), but that's still probably less than 50 cents a jar. 

I start by hydrating them through covering them with water, about 3 times the volume of the dry oats.  I bring them to a boil, and then reduce to a bubbling simmer. It's important that the cooking be slow.  I set a timer for 30 minutes, and then start checking the grains every five minutes.  When I start to see a few bursting, I pour into strainers, then into pans with newspaper or paper towels on the bottom, and let them dry for 3 or 4 hours.  Then I jar or bag them and PC at 15 psi for 120 minutes.  This gives a good fairly dry grain that doesn't clump too much.

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Offlinefiddle_head
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Re: Grain question [Re: OldManRiver]
    #28173848 - 02/05/23 06:56 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

OldManRiver said:
Quote:

fiddle_head said:
I might be the only one but I cycle my oats for 150 minutes, but thats all im using just plain oats.




I use oats with great results. They aren't as cheap as they used to be, the last bag I got was 50 lbs for $32 (previous one was $14 a couple years ago), but that's still probably less than 50 cents a jar. 

I start by hydrating them through covering them with water, about 3 times the volume of the dry oats.  I bring them to a boil, and then reduce to a bubbling simmer. It's important that the cooking be slow.  I set a timer for 30 minutes, and then start checking the grains every five minutes.  When I start to see a few bursting, I pour into strainers, then into pans with newspaper or paper towels on the bottom, and let them dry for 3 or 4 hours.  Then I jar or bag them and PC at 15 psi for 120 minutes.  This gives a good fairly dry grain that doesn't clump too much.




Sounds like you've got your process down pat. I always roilling fucking boil for 35-38 minutes and they come out perfect al dente every time on my gas range. I dry with a box fan on liners as I believe there should be as little grain surface moisture as possible. Cycle for 150-180 and boom clean oats every time no matter what.


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OfflineOldManRiver
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Re: Grain question [Re: fiddle_head]
    #28174008 - 02/05/23 08:57 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fiddle_head said:
Sounds like you've got your process down pat. ... Cycle for 150-180 and boom clean oats every time no matter what.




Nothing wrong with a longer PC'ing, I just get clean jars/bags every time at 120 minutes.

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