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Offlinetregar
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Registered: 08/30/04
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Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD * 3
    #28108398 - 12/22/22 09:22 AM (1 year, 1 month ago)

--> To those who experience anxiety on shrooms...If you take shrooms along with 70mg of pure thh or tetrahydroharmine, not only does it eliminate anxiety, add crystal clear clarity, increased euphoria, but the shroom trip is extended by an hour +, done it countless times myself, absolutely incredible gorgeous experience. Thh is a psychedelic sri not maoi found in cappi. Damn near perfect psychedelic combo....other than that mescaline is all ready the perfect psychedelic, drank cactus tea over 150 times over many years. I love that it lasts incredibly long allready.

Sabnock said:
"There may be some confusion surrounding THH for people. From my understanding, the form of THH found in the B. Caapi vine is purely a Serotonin reuptake inhibitor and ime it certainly feels that way, it doesn't have or at least isn't supposed to have MAOI properties, which that comes from the Harmine and Harmaline." Sabnock is a legend, read countless posts from him and he is indeed correct.

Bardy said:
Quote:

DMT-nexus says: Like other harmala alkaloids it is a RIMA reversible inhibitor of monoamine oxidase A. However, unlike harmine and harmaline, THH also inhibits reuptake of serotonin.
https://wiki.dmt-nexus.me/Tetrahydroharmine
Are you claiming these folks are wrong?


Yes, that information is incredibly vague or unclear. The sentence is very vague in that it does not tell you it would take a severe overdose of THH to inhibit MAO-A.

From Interprise chemical:
"THH is a fluorescent indole alkaloid extracted from B. caapi that inhibits MAO-A and MAO-B with much weaker potency (IC50s = 74 nM and >100 μM, respectively) compared to its companion harmala alkaloids: harmaline (IC50s = 2.5 nM and 25 μM, respectively) and harmine (IC50s = 2 nM and 20 μM, respectively)" https://interpriseusa.com/product/tetrahydro-harmine-10-mg/

Keep in mind, the lower the nM, the higher or stronger the activity. Reading those numbers, you would have to take 30 times the normal dosage of 100mg THH, or 30 x 100 = 3,000mg THH just to equal rima activity of 100mg of harmaline, and it takes at least 100mg of harmaline to activate DMT. That much THH would be an overdose and most likely kill a person. My max is 300mg of THH.

It takes around 150mg of harmine to activate DMT, that would require 5500 mg of THH to do the same.

--> If you remember 69ron, I was not around when he used to post, as I was at the mescaline king forum thenook.org for at least a decade (now extinct) he claimed that THH alone would activate DMT, this is completely un-true, this earned him or her a very bad reputation as people found out after his writing of this, that no such thing was possible.

Bardy said:
Quote:

So contrary to what you claim, THH is found in Syrian Rue, but in smaller amounts than Caapi.


When you compare 4.3% harmine and 5.6% harmaline to 0.1% THH, you end up with next to nothing in the seeds as THH.

There is absolutely no significant amount of THH in rue seeds, period...but you can make THH from harmaline in 1.5 hour. Even as a chemist, I spent months trying to make THH from harmaline without using exotic chemicals like TIHKAL, after months of failure, I went into a trance and was given a vision of how to complete the process I was stuck at using an over the counter chemical and explain how to make it simply in link below, I wanted humanity to know how to do this, as I feel it is extremely important.

Hallucinogenic Plants in the Mediterranean Countries, Ioannis D. Passos, Maria Mironidou-Tzouveleki, in Neuropathology of Drug Addictions and Substance Misuse, 2016:
Quote:

The content of dried seeds of the plant in harmine is about 4.3% w/w, 5.6% in harmaline, 0.6% in harmalol, and 0.1% in tetrahydroharmine.


https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/neuroscience/tetrahydroharmine

Older Caapi is becoming close to extinct as harvesters have to go further and deeper into the Jungle...hence the over hundred spiritual centers in South America are having to harvest younger cappi with much less tetrahydroharmine, here in link below is an alternative to help conserve while it grows over many years:

Traditional true Ayahuasca has always been (1) Caapi by itself or (2) Caapi with psychotria viridis or Diplopterys cabrerana.

12 reasons THH rocks and how to make her here: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28423951/fpart/all

Nillion, I'm not a vendor nor ever been, you might be thinking of 69ron, I am not 69ron. Lifelong chemist and researcher. Anyways, I cracked the code on how to make THH at home in only 1.5 hour, no exotic chemicals needed like in TIHKAL, more on this below.

Bardy said:
Quote:

We get it Tregar. THH makes shrooms better for you. You’ll find that it is a RIMA as well as being an SRI I think.


I'm a life long chemist, and know my chemistry, THH is 100% SRI and not a significant RIMA at all. Harmine is a RIMA, so is harmaline. THH is the 2nd highest alkaloid in caapi, in same family as ibogaine with a 10.5 hour half life with peak at 5.25 hours.

Be careful if you buy THH from china (liftmode) as there have been reports of it not staining blue under UV (like real THH) but green, indicating harmaline is still in it.  Dab a cue tip in vinegar, then take up a bit of your THH, smear on a paper plate, hold under uv light, if it glows blue you got pure thh, if any yellow or green it's contaminated with harmaline.

Freedom said:
Quote:

Its kind of odd that no one else seems to have any reports of THH combos, not on erowid or blue light as far as i can tell



Freedom, You will find no reports of THH + mushrooms or THH + LSD cause this is brand new cutting edge, but I've been doing it for many years, gorgeous experience, it's like taking a low dose of mescaline with you shrooms or acid.

THH or tetrahydroharmine is the best kept secret in the psychedlic world:

THH and how to make her (along with many trip reports of 300mg THH by itself):

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28423951/fpart/1/vc/1

More of my research (10 topics), on the cutting edge, and why dmt should always be taken with thh as found in true Ayahuasca:

https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

2 minute formed HPBCD DMT liquid very bioavailable sublingually under tongue & outperforms DMT salts orally by many factors in personal trials, combo with tetrahydroharmine, Ayahuasca.

Part 0: 12 reasons pure THH or tetrahydroharmine rocks (this post #1 in middle)
Part 1: HPBCD complexed DMT experimental dosage, effects & duration, over 44 sublingual DMT experiences over a year's time (this post #1 at bottom). Many times stronger than oral DMT. Updated 1-1-2022.
Part 2: Receptorome chart & explanation
Part 3: Tetrahydroharmine (THH) effects
--> Part 4: Tetrahydroharmine receptorome similarities to mescaline; potentiates cactus & safety note
Part 5: Chemist Patrick Arnold's HPBCD prohormones & bloodwork studies
part 6: Dr. Narang: "with sublingual" or "under the tongue" better than buccal, gingival & palatal, absorption of drugs through the sublingual route is 3 to 10 times greater than oral route and is surpassed by hypodermic injection.
part 7: a little bit on my 70 Ayahuasca experiences, doses & visions
part 8: New research: Morning glory contains 5 stimulating LSD-like drugs, soluble only in wine/alcohol, only sparingly soluble in water
part 9: 20 minute visionary visit from a dead Aztec Shaman
part 10: One way to make pure tetrahydroharmine
part 11: From the archives of DMT world: How to easily extract 2.3g DMT from 170g bark using a 2 liter Erlenmeyer flask
part 12: Out of print writings on the Divine Plant of the Incas, coca leaf visions...and writings on strong euphoria from coca leaf tea bags soaked in wine, forming orally active cocaethylene in the liver, discovered in 1994. Explains the popularity of Vin Mariani (coca leaf soaked wine) with both popes, Thomas Edison and countless celebrities.
part 13: THH + mushrooms report from JKW.
part 14: Multiple encounters with death & depression.

Northerner said:
Quote:

It's popular enough if you go and read on dmtnexus. Used with DMT orally though rather than shrooms, but it's very much a thing.


Thank you Northerner. I've been taking dmt with THH for many, many years, here is a compilation of my 50 + trip reports with many pics of the 150mg harmine + 70-300mg THH + 90mg dmt true Ayahuasca capsules:

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28189371/fpart/all

Since harmine has a half life of from 1 to 3 hours, I redose at the 1.5 hour to 2 hour point using only 75mg harmine + 90mg dmt in a single capsule again for a +4 moderately strong experience, as 1/2 the harmine dose is still active from the first dose. You don't have to add anymore THH since THH has a half life of 10.5 hours, peaking at around 5 hours. You can re dose as many times as you want, continues to work strongly.

This gives me a total 4 hour strong trip that is easy to handle, with hours of afterglow. Going beyond 120mg DMT is not recommended, see my trip reports on page 2. I recommend crushing the dmt freebase into fresh aloe vera gel from fresh leaf (*almart carries fresh leaf in grocery section or buy on line, store excess gel in freezer as it only lasts 1 week in fridge, defrost more when needed) only as the polysaccharides in the fresh leaf increase the penetration of the dmt into the intestines by many factors, for an experience that can easily reach +4 to +5 and is all encompassing and super colorful just like real Jungle Ayahuasca, I've noticed no difference in strength between these zero nausea Ayahuasca capsules and real Ayahuasca brew I've prepared from caapi and Hawaiian psychotria.

THH + mushrooms report from JKW:
Quote:


Tregar, just wanted to let you know that I finally tried 3 grams of cubensis with 180 mg of THH, and all I can say is WOW! Intense and beautiful like I've never had before, with a definite DMT edge to it.

I've always been a hard-head, needing 4.5+ grams to get anywhere interesting. I've done up to 9 grams, and never got near this intensity.

Just wanted to thank you for the tip. This is the way for me to go form now on.
I look forward to combining THH with DMT.

All the best, and take care.





--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Go to bottom of page 3 for an easy pan cyan estero strain grow similar to Asura's grow: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28108398/fpart/3

50 trip reports in this thread.

Modern research has determined that the pan cyan strain of mushrooms with their HIGH NORPSILOCIN + BAEOCYSTIN and related analogues content hit the adrenal receptors with as much force as MESCALINE or DMT, see chart below. Notice how just plain psilocin alone hits the 3 adrenal receptors (responsible for enhanced colors, euphoria, beauty and music enhancement) with lighter activity.



Attached: Structure–Activity Relationships for Psilocybin, Baeocystin, Aeruginascin, and Related Analogues to Produce Pharmacological Effects in Mice, ACS Pharmacol. Transl. Sci. 2022, 5, 11, 1181–1196:

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acsptsci.2c00177

by Grant C. Glatfelter*, Eline Pottie, John S. Partilla, Alexander M. Sherwood, Kristi Kaylo, Duyen N. K. Pham, Marilyn Naeem, Grant C. Glatfelter*, Eline Pottie, John S. Partilla, Alexander M. Sherwood, Kristi Kaylo, Duyen N. K. Pham, Marilyn Naeem, Vamshikrishna Reddy Sammeta Vamshikrishna Reddy Sammeta, Stacie DeBoer, James A. Golen, Elliott B. Hulley, Christophe P. Stove, Andrew R. Chadeayne, David R. Manke, and Michael H. Baumann.

Pan cyan vs P. cubensis

"They [Pan cyans] are so much cleaner! The trip is shorter but more intense. The visuals are just incredible. You feel very light compared to cubensis and the headspace is more manageable (at least at lower doses).

"Most intense, euphoric, neon colorful trip that introduced me to pan cyan, most unlike any cubes I have ever had. Way preferred these over cubes. So deeply euphoric and extremely visual with saturated tropical neon colors. From then on I was hooked."

"I didn't really expect how good the differences were from Cube to [Pan cyan] estero. The visuals weren't comparable at all and the euphoria was so wonderful. My 2g trip was literally the best substance experience of my life next to marriage and kids. 10 hours of pure bliss."

"I strongly agree with starting with one-half gram dry. It was a much better experience than any cubes I've tried even at higher doses."

"Cubes gave me mild nausea and made me feel 'shakey'. Not at all so with Pan cyans."

"Less cartoony than cubes. More crisp neon geometric patterns. The trip also feels less tiring."

"Copelandia [Panaeolus] cyanescens are far stronger than cubes and have a distinctly different feel."

"I've eaten pan cyans around the 1g dose - to me it was like 3g of cubies in strength with a different quality to it."

"IMO they [Pan cyans] are a lot better than cubes. No body noise and very intense and clear. More like LSD just a lot shorter. I don't cultivate many actives on a regular basis anymore, but out off all I have experienced to date, these are my favorite."

"Pan Cyan (and Trops) are very much worth the effort!!! I have never eaten any Cubes that were as VISUAL as these are. Not to mention a little goes a LONG ways. Gram and a half of these little fellers will blister your brain!"

"In my humble opinion, I think 1 gram of wet Panaeolus is even better than 1 gram of dry Cubensis, making them 10X more potent [?!?], in addition to the more positive and smooth experience, easier consumption due to amount and taste, and much less nausea."

"My first experience [with Pan cyans] was wonderful! I definitely noticed a big difference in potency and the mood of the trip. I still remember how clean, visual and surreal everything felt. I felt absolutely no body noise or anxiety. They felt very natural to experience, nothing felt wrong if that makes sense."

"Ok, so it's given that [Pan cyan] it's much stronger than cubensis. But I've noticed that there is a difference in the high. Why is that?"

"There's something about Pan Cyan that induces something special that no cube could ever bring, it isn't that it's a clean feeling either - it's something that must deal with happiness in general - so whether it stimulates serotonin production or a mixture of neurochemicals for the best experience, I have had consistently positive experiences with each trip both physiologically and psychologically. I wonder if it has to do with other alkaloids or absence of alkaloids vs cubensis."

"It is my personal view that Hawaiian Copelandia [Panaeolus] cyanescens offers the entheogen user a more enjoyable experience than the more easily cultivated Psilocybe cubensis. In fact I would place it in the premier cru of psychedelic plants, alongside the indigenous Liberty Cap (Psilocybe semilanceata) and the various DMT containing plants."

General comments

"They are the cleanest, smoothest, most peaceful mushroom vibe of all the species I have tried. Panaeolus cyanescens and tropicalis rank #1 in my book."

"They are far and above the cleanest clearest and most potent mushrooms I have ever encountered, tread lightly with these guys."

"SWIM has only consumed the Copelandia cyans (Hawaiian), and reputes them to be the best mushroom experience by far. Very clean trip, zero body load, clear head space."

"The highs real clean. It reminds me of the Felix the cat acid from the 80s. Just smooth. With little body noise and extreme visuals. A calm lucidity that is like a slice of heaven."

"First experience last night with Estero pan cyan. Truly mystical, amazing, and the most beautiful and gentle psychedelic experience to date. Truly a gift."

"I also noticed that cyans have a very smooth comedown and longer duration. What could be the reason for this?"

"Pans are no joke. Anyone who says LSD is more powerful than mushrooms has never done pans."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Other topics: Alchemy chemistry fun:

Compilation of pan cyan or panaeolus cyanescens or copeandia cyanescens trip reports, crown jewel of mushrooms:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28108398/page/1

How to extract 2.4g dmt from 170g bark using a 2 Liter erlenmeyer flask (heat and break resistant), post #15:
https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

Tetrahydroharmine or THH and how to make her, Caapi visionary feminine teaching spirit:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28423951/page/1

Zero nausea HPBCD or aloe vera enhanced penetration Ayahuasca capsules:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28189371/page/1

Cactus tea before waterpark to beat the heat:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28411312/page/4



How to make LSI or Lysergic Acid Isovaleraldemide (Greek Eleusis ancient LSD) at home from morning glory seeds (the priests used non poisonous claviceps paspali which grows on paspalum grass adjacent to Eleusis present day in the famous Rarian plane, same alkaloid profile as the sacred Mesoamerican morning glory):
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27850299/page/2

Make your own 1-acetaldehyde LSD at home from LSD, very similar to ALD-52 or the real orange sunshine:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28441105

LSD high dose trip: 20 minute visionary visit from a dead Aztec Shaman:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28451382

On my very first pan cyan mushroom trip, where I went to a house music club tripping with friends, I viewed laser light patterns on the floor of the club, where the women danced, I believe the mushrooms showed me how to form never before seen patterns, as went I went home, over the next several months, I built my own 6 channel audio generator that when these combined frequencies (3 on x channel and 3 on y channel) were sent to a laser x and y galvanometer, were able to produce brand new laser patterns such as collapsing circles and spinning lines 360 degrees which looked beyond belief in the fog as 3-d, I then went on to market these laser scanners to clubs on the strip, and they were a huge success...I owe this creative invention to the mushrooms which sparked new creative energies, way beyond thought, from a higher source where the mushrooms tap into. My love for house music stems back to those days of visiting many clubs as an entertainment laser lighting fixture creator and programmer and making friends with the many DJ's. Over the summer myself and friends were lifeguards at the local water park. But on the weekends we went to parties or house music clubs. 

https://soundcloud.com/discover
https://www.friskyradio.com/
https://jaytechmusic.podbean.com/
------------------------------------------------------
Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD, extremely visual, music enhancing & super euphoric.

myself:
----------
Very first pan cyan experience: 3 of us ate dried pan cyans on the way to a nightclub playing undergound house music. The road to the club turned into a rollercoaster of neon colors made of purple, yellow, green, super saturated, waving up and down in intense neon colors, just incredible. I looked at my left arm and it was covered in green Alien symbolic hieroglyphics, so wild!

I looked off to the side into the sky and saw 3 alein hyperdimensional beings, small in stature looking back at me, made of purple and yellow colors...we stopped to peak inside the store with crystals inside along the way, all of the crystals in the shop had alien heads in them with open mouths and penetrating eyes, staring back at us, we saw aliens in all of the crystals!

When we got to the nighclub, the woman collecting the $5 to get in, turned into a scary witch, we were all agasp, inside the club, we were some of the first to enter, so not crowded at all, the music sounded so bad ass, the videos playing in the addition rooms grabbed our attention. We each touched the girl's leg who went with us, who was tripping as well, felt like MDMA, the intensity of the touch was incredible. Most intense, euphoric, neon colorful trip that introduced me to pan cyan, most unlike any cubes I have ever had. Way preferred these over cubes. So deeply euphoric and extremely visual with saturated tropical neon colors. From then on I was hooked.

I grow these following Gordotek's simple method further below, when fruiting the spawned trays with the sterile casing layer, I just leave cake pan trays out on a small fold out table with a Kvol hd3 3.5 liter ultrasonic cool mist humidifier pointed at all 3 trays on a timer 1/2 hour on, 1/2 hour off, pointed at all 3 trays on a table close to window in small room that get's warmer than rest of house, fruit just fine in open air. Very simple, nothing elaborate needed. The monsoon is also a great humidifier.

I do use a flow hood however when transferring the grown out mycelium grain jars to the trays when mixing in with the pasteurized manure/straw (spawning stage), AND also later when removing the see thru cake lid covering the white mycelium grown out substrate in the cake pan when applying the sterile 1/4" casing layer. Picture at the very end of trays on table in open air for fruiting. They like a constant 77 degrees F from beginning to end, ie grain jar stage to fruiting stage.

Prefer keeping the 3 grain jars and the 3 cake pans during the lid closed "mycelium substrate grow out" and "open lid, open air fruiting stage" on top of a VIVOHOME 10 Inch x 20.75 Inch Waterproof Seedling Heat Mat with included 40-108°F Digital Thermostat Controller. You could also use a greenhouse Martha tent with controllable temp and a monsoon humidifier with stretchable hose that reaches as high as 66" to the top of the inside of the 63" tall tent to direct humidity downwards to all the trays, only have to refill the monsoon every 2 days.

Buy or make a Laminar flow hood, it's the best investment you will ever make.

*** You can take these pan cyan at the same time as taking 150 to 250mg of pure tetrahydroharmine (not an MAOI or RIMA but a psychedelic SRI or serotonin reuptake inhibitor) and it feels like "organic psilo LSD", powerful combination with super heightened euphoria and visuals and huge powerful music enhancement, stimulating like LSD in combo with the THH, as THH has numerous similarities to mescaline and LSD. I have done this combo numerous times, one of my absolute favorite trip experiences.

I can recommend pan cyans in combo with 150 to 250mg pure tetrahydroharmine, gives an experience that is extremely euphoric, intensely visual and spiritual, a lot like LSD when combined with the THH, one of my absolute favorites of all time.

THH + mushrooms report from JKW:
Quote:

Just wanted to let you know that I finally tried 3 grams of cubensis with 180 mg of THH, and all I can say is WOW! Intense and beautiful like I've never had before, with a definite DMT edge to it.

I've always been a hard-head, needing 4.5+ grams to get anywhere interesting. I've done up to 9 grams, and never got near this intensity.

Just wanted to thank you for the tip. This is the way for me to go from now on.
I look forward to combining THH with DMT.

All the best, and take care.



1) bridgesii 600 gram to 800 gram pieces from around the core tea, 350 to 450mg plus mescaline in the tea = 11 out of 10

2) panaeolus cyanescens mushrooms in combo with 150 to 250mg THH, 6 hour incredible experience = 11 out of 10

3) LSD with bridgesii cactus combo = 11 out of 10

4) oral 200mg harmine + 200mg oral THH + sublingual under the tongue DMT, can re-dose under the tongue dmt every hour up to 3 hours = 11 out of 10

Gordotek's pan cyan grow:

https://www.patreon.com/posts/new-simple-tek-44645256 (Gordotek)

https://mycotopia.net/topic/110495-a-simple-method-tek-for-growing-panaeolus-cyanescens-aka-copelandia-cyanescens-hawaiians-blue-meanies-pans-and-pan-cyans/page-2 (Gordotek)

https://www.shroomery.org/8695/Making-Panaeolus-Substrate-Pictorial (Panaeolus substrate pictorial)

https://www.shroomery.org/8421/Panaeolus-cyanescens-FAQ (Panaeolus cyanescens faq)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26836048/fpart/all (Blue Helix)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25987049 (Asura, Cultivating Panaeolus cyanescens)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27637997 (Panaeolus In Mono Tubs 2.0, Baba Yaga)

http://en.psilosophy.info/panaeolus_cyanescens_liquid_culture_to_fruits.html (Panaeolus Cyanescens -- Liquid Culture to Fruits)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25925194 (JOC TEK Panaeolus cyanescens)

https://mycotopia.net/topic/3295-waylits-pan-cyan-tek-plastic-jars/ (Waylit's Pan cyan Tek-- plastic jars)

https://www.shroomery.org/8695/Making-Panaeolus-Substrate-Pictorial (Making Panaeolus Substrate, Pictorial)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25248773 (Mary Fairchild panaeolus cyanescens Australian variety)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26235096/fpart/all (Pan cyan Martha tent set up thread)

How pure THH or tetrahydroharmine adds to the experiences, here are my experiences combining it with sublingual HPBCD DMT. What I do now is take 200mg of harmine and 200mg of pure THH orally, then 1 hour later once I feel the harmine and THH, I take sublingual HPBCD DMT (around 100mg) hold under tongue for 15 minutes, all dissolves, gives a 1.5 hour very strong extremely euphoric and visual experience, then I re-dose more sublingual DMT at the 1.5 hour point again, holding under tongue, continues to work at full strength, as the oral harmine has a half life of from 1 to 3 hours, continues to work for 3 hours to 5 hours.

I way prefer taking DMT under tongue instead of orally, as zero nausea, goes straight to brain, no dizziness, the only way I use it, very bad ass this way. None of the negatives of oral Ayahausca. There is something about DMT moving thru the stomach that makes it nausea prone, dizzy, and weird and strange, this is all avoided by using it under tongue. The harmine lowers MAO in the brain for 3 to 5 hours, so you can use the dmt under tongue with many re-doses, as it prevents the DMT from being zapped by mitochondria in the brain.

https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

https://mycotopia.net/topic/111979-one-shot-hpbcd-dmt-ayahuasca-and-sublingual-hpbcd-dmt-ayahuasca-absorbs-2-to-3-times-better-than-dmt-salts-masks-taste/

12 reasons pure THH or tetrahydroharmine rocks:
------------------------------------------------------------------

0. THH is not an MAOI or a RIMA but a psychedelic serotonin reuptake inhibitor (SRI) found in caapi with many similarities to mescaline. She is a feminine teaching spirit.

1. Part 10 of the first linked paper above: shows how to convert harmaline to pure THH in 1.5 hour for the first time (very fast) with 75% yield. TIHKAL THH entry also achieved 75% yield. Post also shows how to dip a cue tip in vinegar to wet, take up a bit of the THH, smear on a paper plate to check the blue glow under blacklight to make sure it is pure. Any green in the glow means you still have un-converted harmaline, but follow instructions and you won't have any unconverted.

--> Please do this UV check even if you source THH from China (liftmode paperwork indicates Chinese made), as there have been a few reports of it glowing green and not pure light blue with the vinegar swabbed UV check, indicating there is still harmaline in the THH, it would not be a good idea to take even light amounts of harmaline with shrooms, you want only pure THH...either make it yourself or source it from a reputable supplier. THH is an SRI and harmaline is a RIMA, completely different substances <--

1. Dennis Mckenna Ph.D: page 115:
Thus, tetrahydroharmine may prolong the half-life of DMT by blocking it's intraneuronal uptake, and hence, its inactivation by MAO, localized in mitochondria within the neuron.
In my experience, THH doubles the half-life of DMT, so when used sublingually or orally, you get a full strong 90 minutes out of it with long afterglow.

2. She is in the same beta-carboline family as ibogaine. She is the 2nd highest alkaloid in Caapi. She has a 10.5 hour half-life with peak at 5.25 hours.

3. DMT only colors are subdued and dark, but THH brightens the DMT visuals: out of this world impossible bright neon colors are a trait of high dose oral tetrahydroharmine + moderate dose 60 to 70mg+ sublingual or oral HPBCD DMT: neon red-greens, neon orange-blues, neon purple-yellows.

4. DMT does not block serotonin on it's own, but THH does...this results in not only stimulation but euphoria in combo with the DMT: and real Ayahuasca visions become apparent...important teamwork. Ibogaine, LSD, mescaline, shrooms, 5-meo-dmt, bufotenin in Amazonian snuffs, all block serotonin, THH blocks serotonin.

5. THH has numerous similarities to mescaline, she is like the beta-carboline version of mescaline, few people have used her over 100mg. I have seen the receptorome chart for THH vs. mescaline. She not only blocks serotonin like mescaline, but agonizes all 3 adrenal receptors A1-A3 associated with beauty and aesthetic enhancement, just like mescaline. Beauty enhancement is "over the top" when THH is included, she is diamondlike shimmering in her beauty.

Actresses on TV will look like dazzling glowing super-colorful cartoon versions of themselves (just like with high dose cactus tea) only if you include the THH. Researchers have called THH the "tryptamine of the beta-carboline world" and rightly so.

6. THH is found in average 150mg in a cup of Caapi based Ayahuasca tea, when 2 cups are drank by some of the more advanced members for evening at the vegetals (UDV, Santo Daime, Shuar Indian) people are consuming around 300mg of THH.

7. Music will only sound bad-ass incredible if you include from 150mg to 300mg oral THH with your sublingual or oral DMT. Listening to music on THH + DMT is like listening to music on high dose cactus tea: heavenly, infinitely beautiful music enhancement, every voice and instrument stands out on it's own, like hearing a song for the very first time.

8. This pure THH at 300mg all by herself is extremely visual, she's an isomer of a hormone like substance made in the brain naturally.

9. The entry in TIHKAL for 300mg THH is completely wrong, where the unexperienced person compares it to the effects of 100mg harmaline. She is nothing at all like harmaline, and like 69ron once said about the person's comment in TIHKAL, he or she would not be able to tell their ass from their elbow. I agree, what complete nonsense. Dr. Shulgin wrote that he never got the chance to try THH, but wrote that more studies on it are "badly needed."

10. professor8 (found here from 11/1/2010 he writes like a poet w/special powers of imagination & expression):
Quote:

A while back I read a very good explanation of the different effects of Harmalas that has stuck with me. I believe it was 69ron that said: ‘Harmine is the Coffee of the harmalas & Harmaline is the Weed and when it comes to THH (tetrahydroharmine) you have The Light.'

While very similar in molecular structure, THH has a completely different personality to Harmine & Harmaline. Calling it The Light of the harmalas is very appropriate. IMHO, it is the Holy Grail of The Harmalas. I have found Harmine very, very helpful in Meditation & Yoga. It energises your Light Body and allows you to see your Chakras & Auric fields; very helpful in a biofeedback sorta way.

Personally, Harmaline is too heavy & stony for me but I do respect its power and personality, kinda like a big shaggy & lovable dog.

Tetrahydroharmine (THH) has the ability to raise your vibration in a most powerful, yet subtle way. It brings a crystalline prismy texture to spice and adds a super clear watery dimension to Aya, like looking down through 10meters of shimmering Caribbean Sea on clear blue day. It brings a dimension of pure light to the entheogenic experience and encourages entities & intelligences of only the Highest Order. If one is not accustomed to perceiving these experiences with a spiritual perspective most of the nuances & subtleties THH brings on are overlooked and remain unseen and one would better enjoy Harmaline as a house painter chooses a roller over a brush, its about preference & choice..



Espiridion:
Quote:

Tetrahydroharmine is much more like mescaline.



11. Trips (from here on 12/2/2011):
Quote:

As to how the THH altered the experience -> I find rue extract+DMT to be very similar to mushrooms. I found the THH added to the rue+DMT to shift the experience to a state much closer to that provided by LSD. It was more clear, more energetic, more focused, and when confusion struck it was definitely more "acid-like".



The world is moving in the direction of the Left Brain: technology and science. What the world needs is to move in the direction of Right Brain development: empathy, spirituality, connectedness. Compounds like tetrahydroharmine in Caapi could be said to improve emotional intelligence. Is this component of caapi a smart-nutrient for the right side of the brain? you be the judge.

At 300mg of THH all by itself, there are heavy open-eyed tracers like lightening flashes, and hours of teaching closed eye visions that start with colored sparkles and fireworks (red, green, yellow, blue) that dart around and progress into full-fledged way-beyond 4k visions with eyes closed that are not only static but often animated like slow and high speed movies, but all one monochrome color like green or blue for me, when you add DMT, the visions then become colored and patterning on animals for example will display their associated colors, DMT also adds on to or builds on top the THH visions, expanding them, but the teachings and insights & visions are credited to the Vine, just as Gayle Highpine writes in linked paper:

12. Gayle Highpine (Ayahuasca researcher): http://www.ayahuasca.com/amazon/botany-ecology/unraveling-the-mystery-of-the-origin-of-ayahuasca/
Quote:

The vine carries the content of the message, the teaching, and the insight. The purpose of drinking Ayahuasca is to receive the message the vine imparts.



Page 154 of "Various Alkaloid Profiles in Decoctions of Banisteriopsis Caapi, 2005": https://kodu.ut.ee/~hellex/aya/kirjandus/keemia/Callaway2005.pdf
Quote:

The average ratio of THH to harmine in the vegetals (traditional brews) was consistently near 1:1, from all sources (table 2), while this ratio was closer to 1:5 in a large survey of source plant material. It is presently unclear whether harmaline is being chemically reduced to THH during the acidic process of decoction.



Dr. Callaway wrote in "The Entheogen Review":
Quote:

However, in a broad (as yet unpublished) survey of Banisteriopsis caapi, Psychotria viridis and subsequent teas, which included phytochemical analyses of all, plus subjective ratings of the teas, a strong correlation was found with teas that contained high amounts of THH and not DMT! This rating was from a large body of experienced users (regular União).



THH blocks serotonin, just like all the major natural oral psychedelics, serotonin blocking results in stimulation, breaking down of barriers and filters, direct access to divine spiritual world, increased visionary power, major beauty, color and music enhancement, euphoria in combo with the DMT. DMT does not block serotonin but requires THH in combo to do this, important teamwork.

5-ht1a agonism is inhibitory and results in serotonin blockage (over 80% of brain 5-ht). Thomas S. Ray's study shows a value of 3.57 at SERT for Ibogaine (4.00 is max). Ibogaine has been shown to inhibit serotonin transporter (SERT) noncompetitively, in contrast to all other known inhibitors, which are competitive with substrate. Ibogaine inhibits both serotonin and dopamine reuptake transporters, it is an SDRI or serotonin & dopamine reuptake inhibitor. THH or tetrahydroharmine also inhibits the serotonin reuptake transporter (SERT).

In contrast, as an example, Cocaethylene (coca leaf tea bags soaked in wine, the orally active & potent ingredient formed in the liver from cocaine + ethanol in the 1860's "Vin Mariani" wine popular with both Popes, Thomas Edison and scores of other famous people) increases the levels of serotonergic, noradrenergic, and dopaminergic neurotransmission in the brain by inhibiting the action of the serotonin transporter, norepinephrine transporter, and dopamine transporter. These pharmacological properties make cocaethylene a serotonin-norepinephrine-dopamine reuptake inhibitor [SNDRI; also known as a "triple reuptake inhibitor"].



Dr. Nichols (Purdue Scientist authorized to study LSD, from Heffter.org LSD paper): https://www.heffter.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/chap6.pdf
Quote:

LSD has very strong potency in blocking the action of serotonin. LSD is strongly "anti-serotonin". The morpholide lysergamide cousin had only about 1/10th the potency in blocking serotonin. Of the 5 diferent dialkylamides we studied LSD was the most potent and specific serotonin antagonist.5-ht1a makes up >80% of brain 5-ht receptors.



waylitjim (April 2005):
https://mycotopia.net/topic/3347-panaeolus-cyanescens-merged/
--------------------------------------------------------------
Ever wonder why many consider the Panaeolus experience incredibly unique?

"They are the cleanest, smoothest, most peacefull mushroom vibe of all the species I have tried. Panaeolus cyanescens and tropicalis rank #1 in my book."

"the highs real clean . its reminds me of the phelix the cat acid from the 80s . just smooth . with little body noise and extreme visuals . a calm lucidty that is like a slice of heaven"

"Pan Cyan (and Trops) are very much worth the effort!!! I have never eaten any Cubes that were as VISUAL as these are. Not to mention a little goes a LONG ways. Gram and a half of these little fellers will blister your brain!"

Psilocybin and psilocin are part of the tryptamine family. Their chemical structure bears close resemblance to that of serotonin.

"The occurrence of tryptamine derivatives in Panaeolus cyanescens, also known as Copelandia cyanescens, from Australia, Hawaii and Thailand were investigated. All 70 collections contained psilocin, serotonin and urea. Those from Hawaii were also relatively rich in psilocybin, whereas the species from Australia and Thailand were virtually exempt of this compound.

It is not unthinkable that the ability to biosynthesize psilocin in a number of Panaeolus is a consequece of a genetic accident: initially, these members of the genus probably produced more or important qualites of serotonin until a mutation conferred the ability to produce 4-hydroxylated tryptamines. So far, not other genus or species has been found to accomplish this feat!"

Partial reference from:
Stijve, T. (1992): Psilocin, psilocybin, serotonin and urea in Panaeolus cyanescens from various origin

waylitjim:
----------
Even with lower levels of psilocybin, Panaeolus are still more potent than Cubensis. Why? Because by weight psilocin is around 1.4 times more potent than psilocybin.

The primary active ingredients of psilocybe mushrooms are psilocybin and psilocin, and to a lesser extent baeocystin and norbaeocystin. The ratio of psilocybin to psilocin varies from species to species.

The primary difference is that psilocin is unstable and it breaks down in the presence of oxygen. If the mushrooms are dried correctly and kept cold, they should suffer very little psilocin break down. Psilocybin on the other hand has been found in a 115-year old mushroom sample.

It is believed that after injestion, psilocybin is easily converted into psilocin and that the pharmacological properties of both compounds are the same.

Asura:
-----
Pan cyans are faster than cubes and 3-4x more potent. 2g is a full on DMT-like, level 5 trip, so while your yield is less...your magic content is more...and the trips are insanely good. It's the most potent species anyone has a chance of doing indoors with significant yield.

They are harder to fruit but there are plenty of people killing it right now with low tech setups.

I would love to help out on the science...but I am not tripping right now. I could probably recruit some folks on the official pan thread, though.

The link in my sig details how I cultivate them, but an ideal time line is something like:
1. Agar wedge to LC. 5 days to grow out.
2. LC to substrate = 10 days to grow out
3. substrate to tray = 5 days to recover.
4. Case and fruit = 5 days until first pins.

So, wedge to first pins in 25 days. About 3-5 days to harvest. 2nd-x flushes will also be done in 3-5 days. If someone could figure
out how to get the yield and make it as easy as cubes, I'm pretty sure most people would grow these.

I am averaging about 32g dried for one tray (3 quarts substrate), which doesn't sound like much -  but that is 16 full on level 5 trips from that.

If I lemon tek 2g of pans it is overpowering. Like forced VR or something. My eyelids cease to exist and the inside of my head and the outside
of my head are one space. Time loops. Living 1000 life times. Alien landscapes. Vision quests. You name it. It's pretty fucking intense and scary
to be honest...I don't do it that often :lol:

A 1g dose is heavenly, though, and much more manageable. Tea makes it easier. Lemon tek is like taking a strong cube trip and compressing it. The
trip moves really, really fast. It's speeded up. The come up is very disorienting. Like not only are you are tripping hard, you're also in a barrel
going over Niagara Falls.

Gordotek:
---------
3 DIC 2020 A LAS 21:26
New simple method (TEK) for growing Panaeolus cyanescens (aka Copelandia cyanescens, Hawaiians, blue meanies, Pans and Pan cyans):

https://www.patreon.com/posts/new-simple-tek-44645256?l=es

Estero strain available here:

https://sporesfast.com/product-category/species-panaeolus-cyanescens/6cc-pan-cyan-syringe-kits/

Q: Can I buy a kit for this?

A: YES! See: https://www.patreon.com/posts/63406767 You will still need to buy a spore syringe and make grain spawn BEFORE buying the kit (or get a free spore print and make your own syringe or put the spores to agar). 

June 10 at 7:09 PM, https://www.patreon.com/posts/67621105

Comparison of Estero (Pan cyan) and Albino Penis Envy (Cubensis) mushrooms via Thin Layer Chromatography: https://www.patreon.com/posts/67621105
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I will create a video explaining how to do this type of analysis, but for now I just wanted to show everyone a comparison between these species.  Albino Penis Envy (APE) is widely considered to be one of the most potent cubensis cultivars, it was heavily represented in the latest psilocybin cup (if you want to see my comments/critique of the cup, click the link and scroll down to the bottom where comments are shown, to see comments on a phone you may have to tap settings (in chrome for example)->desktop view). 

So how does APE stack up against Estero (pan cyan)?

Each dot in the picture above represents a chemical compound (these are labeled on the left). They are in two vertical columns, so the left side from top to bottom is all Estero, right side is APE.  Starting with the two most important, look at the psilocybin and psilocin content - quantification is not precise, but you can estimate based on spot size and darkness, the Estero cultivar is approximately three times as potent as APE (and it would have easily blown all other entries out of the water had it been submitted to the psilocybin cup).  This should be a reminder to all to dose appropriately (pan cyan holds the record for most potent mushroom species in the world as per published research). 

If you normally take 3 grams of cubensis, try 1g of Estero.  It is always better to start with a lower dose and see how you respond before trying anything higher (you may want to start with just 0.5g).  There is NO PRIZE for taking the highest dose, in fact there is no documented benefit of any dose beyond about 35mg psilocybin equivalent, just more fear & anxiety for most people.

But there's more to it than just triple the psilocybin and psilocin, Estero also contains baeocystin (hard to see, but its there), urea (quite a bit), and serotonin.  None of these compounds can be seen at all in APE.  Could these be partly responsible for the difference in anecdotes from user experiences on Estero?

Here are some comments people have sent on this subject:
   
    "I strongly agree with starting with one-half gram dry.  It was a much better experience than any cubes I've tried even at higher doses."
   
    "Cubes gave me mild nausea and made me feel 'shakey'.  Not at all so with Pan cyans"
   
    "Penis Envy is and has been overrated. I think any other well sourced Cube is just the same. It’s that cultural conditioning at play."
   
    "lol who needs cubes when you can have Cyanescens!  I’ve blessed a few people with them and they are now believers lol."
   
    "When Estero kicked in, I wasn’t disappointed.  At one point I forgot I ate Cyanescens and thought I was on a DMT ride!  As often happens to me on DMT I was 'connected' to some kind of power cord or machine umbilical that was coming from my wall straight towards me and plugged into my third eye!  And I felt the presence of a cosmic nurse at my side. Like she had her hand in my shoulder reassuring me all was ok!  Then I was like “f*** I ate mushrooms this ain’t a DMT trip” :wink:
   
    "I've taken enough cubes to know Estero is different... 2 grams. Most amazing experience of my life. 10 hours. And another two hours of happiness watching TV and talking about my experience with my wife. In the end I just want to thank you. No comparison."
   
    "OMG, OMG, O. M. G. Had my first deeply religious experience on 2g [estero] yesterday. I have never felt anything like it in my life. It was truly incredible."
   
    "I ended up taking a 1 gram of Estero since I’m used to taking 3-4 grams of cubensis. Man…you were not kidding about the potency of these. 1 gram easily felt like 4-4.5 grams of cubensis to me.  These were by far the best visuals on mushrooms I’ve ever had.  Also, the euphoria was quite intense, and giggle sessions were uncontrollable.  All in all, I love pan cyans and they’ll likely be my go to. I’ll likely still grow cubensis for microdosing as well as less potency for sharing with others."
   
    "Experienced people do sometimes doubt ones sanity trying to explain just how deep Estero gets on what some call a "micro dose" the pan experience for me is the most rewarding substance I've ever ingested and half reduced my dose and frequency of use to fine tune the benefits, plus stopped using synthetic drugs completely and have been experiencing recovery i didn't really know I need but pretty sure i do."
   
    "I didn't really expect how good the differences were from Cube to estero. The visuals weren't comparable at all and the euphoria was so wonderful. My 2g trip was literally the best substance experience of my life next to marriage and kids. 10 hours of pure bliss." [Gordo note: 2g is too much for most people, be cautious]
   
    "Funny because I went to an Ayahuasca ceremony in May and the Shaman told me to start growing pans... he said, “Cubes are for the people. Pans are for the elevated.”
   
    "First experience last night with Estero pan cyan. Truly mystical, amazing, and the most beautiful and gentle psychedelic experience to date. Truly a gift."
   
    "There's something about Pan Cyan that induces something special that no cube could ever bring, it isn't that it's a clean feeling either - it's something that must deal with happiness in general - so whether it stimulates serotonin production or a mixture of neurochemicals for the best experience, I have had consistently positive experiences with each trip both physiologically and psychologically. I wonder if it has to do with other alkaloids or absence of alkaloids vs cubensis"

One of this years funniest/best psychedelic reveals was the guy who actually came up with Penis Envy (the best selling cubensis cultivar of all time), when interviewed by Hamilton Morris essentially said (my paraphrase) 'Eh, it's still just a cube, and cubes don't do it for me. I find the Cyanescens far superior (they have entities)!'

Haha. So the guy who created the most popular cubensis cultivar in the world doesn't even like cubensis.  Eventually I think most in the grower community will come to prefer other species.  I would still like to see some reputable published research comparing user experience by species (this is challenging to do but worth a try).  As an aside, if you listen to that Hamilton interview, the PE guy says a lot of "out there" things that deserve to be challenged, every so called claim of "supernatural powers" has always failed rigorous testing and he is no exception. 

The psychedelic community has a long history of nonsense associated with it, and as far as I'm concerned, its time to do things differently, and I will always call out the nonsense.  I have plenty more to say about Casteneda, astral projection, and more, but don't want to get side tracked.

Love life, stay strong, and be well.

https://www.patreon.com/posts/22774475
gordotek FAQ

https://www.patreon.com/posts/63406767
New "Grass Lover" mushroom grow kit (for pan cyan or any other grass lover species)

https://sporesfast.com/product/spore-print-panaeolus-cyanescens-multiple-varieties-copy/
estero syringe

March 5 at 8:40 AM
New "Grass Lover" mushroom grow kit (for pan cyan or any other grass lover species)

I'm really excited about this because I have been trying to get a vendor to make kits suitable for my pan cyan TEK for more than a year and no one seemed able or willing to do it, people have been asking me where they could buy the substrate, etc. and I had no good source UNTIL TODAY!  Midwest grow kits finally put together a kit that matches my recommended specifications.  As far as I know, they are the ONLY vendor out there that is selling a kit like this.  I'm also very pleased with where they priced it (currently just $35).  Their kit includes properly pasteurized manure/straw based substrate (3 hour hot water immersion bath pasteurization process) with separate casing mix and the kit even includes the cake pans with clear lids.  So with this kit, all a person will need is the grain spawn and a humidifier (note that they even sell a pretty cool looking humidifier with a long bendable hose that has great reviews so if you need a humidifier you might consider that too).

Midwest set me up with an affiliate link which I am very grateful for, any sales that happen after clicking my link help support this channel but I'm not promoting this just because I have an affiliate link, this is genuinely the only kit of its kind on the internet that I know of and the price is unbeatable too.

https://midwestgrowkits.referralrock.com/l/1GORDOTEK90/GrassLoversKit

If the link doesn't take you directly to it, type "grass lover" into the search bar (the humidifier and grain jars should show up at the bottom of the grass lover kit page as well if you want those items).

Note:  I wouldn't promote this without testing it first, they sent me an early version of the kit, I will probably make a full video review of the kit and add to this post when I have more to share, but for now I'll just say that everything looks fantastic!  There was enough substrate in the kit to make 3 standard size cake pans, and the Estero cultivar RIPPED though this substrate reaching full colonization in  4-5 days with no signs of contamination.  Looks to me like they got it right.

So someone who wanted to simplify the process of growing pan cyans could just order some sterile grain jars (Midwest also sells those),  order a spore syringe (as far as I know, only one vendor sells Estero spore syringes) just inject the grain jars, wait for colonization, order the grass lover kit, dump the substrate from the kit into the cake pan that also comes with the kit, dump the colonized grains on top of that, mix, cover with clear lids, wait for colonization (preferably in warm temps 75-85F), then remove the clear lids and add the casing mix from the kit,  humidify on a timer or spray down heavily several times per day, and you should get nice yields.  Couldn't be much easier than that.


Edited by tregar (01/21/24 09:43 AM)


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Offlinetregar
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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28108400 - 12/22/22 09:23 AM (1 year, 1 month ago)

joedirt:
--------
It is well worth the effort. It took me a while to get it right and the yields are no where near what I can do for cubes.
However, Pan Cyan's are a MUCH smoother trip IMHO. I don't notice much of the dark anxious come up that I typically go through with cubes.

Cubes are an old ally, but once I finally procured pan cyan spores and grew them it was a game changer.

Also another think I really like about Pan's Cyan's. They are small mushrooms. I measure dose size by the number of shrooms.

1-3 threshold.
3-5 solid trip.
5-8 hard trip. (Have not done, just my estimate)
8+ heroic dose. (Have not done. Just an estimate)

I like to just toss 1-2 pan cyan caps into a batch of aya instead of MHRB.

Yeah man I'm guessing you will love Pan Cyans.

https://inoculatetheworld.com/pan-cyans-vs-cubensis/
------------------------------------------------------
To learn more about the cultivation of these mushrooms, please refer to Jake Oncid’s “Jok Tek” on the Shroomery.

https://www.reddit.com/r/PsilocybinMushrooms/comments/rycjsa/effects_of_pan_cyans_vs_cubes/

7456312589123698741
--------------------
Cyans are definitely more potent. I have repeatedly experienced ego death from doses around 2.5g while an eighth of cubes just gave me cool visuals.

free the weed:
-------------
Cyans are more potent by a large margin. When grown indoors on a proper substrate I never take more than 1.5g of potent panaeolus species. 0.75 to 1g is my comfort zone.

TheNotoriousBIIIG
------------------
They are so much cleaner ! The trip is shorter but more intense. The visuals are just incredible. You feel very light compared to cubensis and the headspace is more manageable ( at least at lower doses). Weird thing about them is that they contain serotonin. Maybe that can explain the difference in effects ?

A bit harder than cubes but not by much ! They require precise temp ( higher than cubes and they almost can't survive under ~22°c). They also require manure and a casing. But other than that it's basically the same as cubes in terms of difficulty. The mycelium is way more agressive so they're actually faster to grow

Samwise2512
-----------
I would recommend trying them for yourself and making up your own mind. In my experience, different species definitely seem to have their own distinct flavour or character, and this seems to be the general consensus from experienced growers and psilonauts as well as Mexican indigenous groups who have used numerous species.

I know of multiple growers who refuse to consume Cubensis having sampled Pan cyans for themselves, and there is likely a reason for this. For myself, the Pan cyans are one of my favourite mushrooms, and in fact I rate them among the best drug experiences I have ever encountered.

Consistently really beautiful and blissful, I find them to induce a really clear, clean, lucid, crystalline experience, with really detailed and colourful shimmering visuals and deep euphoria, and they seem smoother on my mind and body than Cubensis, despite their much greater potency by weight. I don't get any body load or noise when I ingest Pan cyan...they hit like organic psilo LSD.

By comparison, Cubensis can sometimes feel a bit muddy/foggy, and can be a little more emotionally unstable or darker in nature and just not as clear and I tend to feel more 'drunk' on them. Pan cyans being more potent feel like a purer and more distilled psilocybin experience to me. I can sometimes feel a bit more weighed down with Cubensis while Pan cyans don't have this effect.

Because you only need a gram and upwards dried of Pan cyans for a really immersive psychedelic experience, I think the fact you don't need to eat as much actual fungal material makes it easier on your guts and system, and this in turn influences the feel of the trip because of the lack of distracting body noise or load.

So yeah I highly recommend them. Also if you can grow Cubensis from scratch you can definitely grow Pan cyans. I've also found Psilocybe semilanceata, Psilocybin azurescens, Psilocybe hoogshagenii, Psilocybe mexicana and Psilocybe cyanescens to have their own flavour or character that to me appears to be consistent across sessions - i.e. I don't feel the differences are all entirely down to external set and setting factors.

I concur 100% with this! I think people who think psilocybin mushrooms are all the same have never sampled Pan cyans...the induce a much higher order experience than P. cubensis, IMO. For me the "Hawaiian" strain of Pan cyan reliably and consistently yields a much cleaner, clearer, lighter, more lucid, colourful, crystalline, visionary and blissful, serene state of bemushroomed consciousness, while being very smooth on the body, than P. cubensis, with a much easier coming up period, and much less of a body load than the latter, which tends to produce a foggier, muddier, more lethargic experience, more likely to induce mental turbulence, dark trips and weird alien archetype experiences.

It is worth noting that P. cubensis tends to be shunned for shamanic use by indigenous Mexican psilocybe using groups. Of all the species I've sampled so far (P. cubensis, P. semilanceata, P. cyanescens, P. galindoi, Pan cyanescens), the latter are definitely my favourite.

Other species held in very regard by indigenous Mexican shamans for their experiential qualities include P. mexicana, P. hoogshagenii, P. caerulescens and P. zapotecorum which I think are also worthy of exploration.

Regarding the higher reported serotonin levels, serotonin cannot pass the blood brain barrier so will not have a pharmacological influence on one's trip. However trypotophan and other serotonin/psilocybin precursors in the mushroom may be bioactive to some degree, and amounts and proportions of these are going to vary with species (and other factors) alongside the psilocybin/psilocin/baeocystin/norbaeocystin levels.

I suspect the presence of these other compounds could modulate the mushroom experience to some degree, alongside the main active compounds. More potent mushrooms like Pan cyans seem consistently cleaner, clearer, more distilled in essence than P. cubensis, which to me feels a little diluted and more foggy in comparison, possibly due to effect of other secondary compounds, which you are consuming in relatively larger amounts given the mushroom's lower potency.

An interesting and relevant study on Panaeolus cyanescens mushrooms you may well already have encountered:

http://repository.naturalis.nl/document/569927

I largely agree, and you're right about the serotonin. However trypotophan and other serotonin/psilocybin precursors in the mushroom may be bioactive to some degree, and amounts and proportions of these are going to vary with species (and other factors) alongside the psilocybin/psilocin/baeocystin/norbaeocystin.

I suspect the presence of these other compounds could modulate the mushroom experience to some degree, alongside the main active compounds. More potent mushrooms like Pan cyans seem consistently cleaner, clearer, more distilled in essence than P. cubensis, which to me feels a little diluted and more foggy in comparison, possibly due to effect of other secondary compounds, which you are consuming in relatively larger amounts given the mushroom's lower potency.

I've only sampled the Hawaiian strain of Pan cyan, but I think they're fantastic. Definitely at least 2x as potent, but also very smooth and easy on one's system compared to Cubensis which can have more of a body load, I think the fact you don't need to eat as much actual fungal material makes it easier on your guts, and that alone changes the feel of them. Closer to LSD in this regard, but obviously with the earthy feel of the mushroom.

Pan cyans for me have consistently yielded a really beautiful and blissful bemushroomed state, I find them to reliably induce a really clean, clear, crystalline experience, and much more colorful than Cubensis with really detailed shimmering visuals and deep euphoria.

By comparison Cubensis can sometimes feel a bit muddy/foggy, more prone to dark-tinged experiences (sometimes without an obvious reason; things can just feel off), and just not as clean/clear feeling and I tend to feel more 'drunk' on them. I can sometimes feel a bit more weighed down with Cubensis while Pan cyans don't have this effect. Great mushrooms I can definitely recommend highly.

u/Cuck_Liddell
---------------
5 years ago, trip Report: Panaeolus Cyanescens are the true Magic Mushroom. I'm never growing or consuming Cubensis again.

So a bit of background: For the past 5 months I've been depressed and unemployed, and I've had nothing but bad trips on Cubensis in that time, where I feel extreme dread and hopelessness, ruminating on what a piece of shit I've been my whole life, and sometimes being borderline suicidal. I'd been growing shrooms since I already had the materials, and wanted to occupy my time. Despite being depressed and supposedly knowing better, I'd trip hoping to gain some new insight, only to have yet another extremely harsh, difficult experience. Repeat this at least 6 times.

Then I had my first harvest of Jamaican Panaeolus Cyanescens. For those that don't know, these are considered by many experienced members of the psychedelic community, including one of the oldest and most prolific spore suppliers (Ryche Hawk of mushrooms.com and previously thehawkseye.com), to be the highest regarded psilocybin mushroom. They are much more potent than Cubensis, with reports of being 3-7 times more potent, and also contain serotonin, which is unusual for psilocybin mushrooms. People describe them as having a smoother, more positive trip than Cubensis, and cause much less nausea due having to consume less.

Anyway, despite knowing it was probably a bad idea due to only having bad trips for the past 5 months, I decided to consume my entire harvest of Pans, 24.2g fresh in a lemon smoothie. I just had to test them and see if they would really give me a different, and hopefully positive experience. They tasted much better than disgusting, funky, musty Cubensis, and didn't make me gag like cubes do. I watched a short 30min film (The Man Who Planted Trees) to wait for them to kick in. I began to feel the familiar heavy body feeling and after the movie, I turn off the lights and lie down and close my eyes to see and think and feel what is to come.

Mushroom visuals are always different and impossible to describe, so I'll skip trying for the most part, though they were impossibly beautiful. What came first was a sense of the energy of the universe taking me in on a wonderful cosmic journey. During my previous bad trips, I'd always felt like I wasn't good enough, but here I was being shown emphatically that I was, and everything that worried me didn't matter. I felt extreme awe and gratitude at not just the journey I was on, but just being alive, just existing. Soon, just the act breathing deeply became an exercise in loving myself. After a while of being in awe at The Other Side, I opened my eyes to see my dark room covered in geometric fractals.

It was like the universe was saying, "How dare you even think of having any remotely negative thought? Let me show you how wonderful and beautiful everything is." Throughout the trip, I was laughing and smiling more genuinely than I ever have in my life just to exist and be alive. Even the terms "laughing" and "smiling" don't do any remote justice for what I was doing. I was in an absolute fit of love and joy at the beauty of existence. I was able to forgive myself for what a piece of shit I'd been and everyone who had wronged me. Even as I puked painfully into a tote I wisely put down beforehand, I was grateful for even the experience of puking. This bliss continued for several hours. This was my second true breakthrough, the first being one where I took 28g of Cubensis in tea and unfortunately lost control and made a huge insane ruckus, flipping my mattress, trashing my room, and waking the neighbors. Learning a valuable lesson from the first time, I was able to just take in the experience in a more controlled way. Despite being my second breakthrough and taking possibly the highest regarded species, the experience exceeded my wildest expectations.

I began to return to normal, and before going to sleep and after waking up, there was quite an afterglow and I could enjoy mundane things in an extent that I normally wouldn't in the weeks before. Though Cubensis also gives such an afterglow even after harsh, negative trips, both the afterglow and the trip quality and positivity of Panaeolus Cyanescens completely blows Cubensis out of the water. They're not even in the same league, and compared to Pans, Cubes are fucking garbage. I'm finishing growing the Cubensis trays I've already colonized and tossing my 32 quart jars of Cubensis with some coir outside in a completely half assed outdoor patch, only for experimentation and because I hate waste. From now on, I'm never growing or consuming Cubensis again. I can see now why the native Mexicans regarded Cubensis as the least desirable psychedelic mushroom. Cubensis are just the easiest psilocybin mushroom to grow, but Panaeolus are the true Magic Mushroom.

Random Notes:

-There are other contenders for the highest regarded psilocybin mushroom, like the woodlovers Psilobybe Cyanescens and Azurescens, which have a higher raw potency, and Psilocybe Mexicana, the sclerotia producing species known as Teonanacatl, or "Flesh of the Gods." Mexicana were the highest regarded by the native Mexicans, and it's possible Cubensis and even Paneolus weren't as highly regarded because, being dung lovers, they were a possible invasive species and reminder of European conquest. Woodlovers, while being extremely potent, are well known to have the side effect of temporary paralysis.

-The all encompassing forgiveness doesn't dramatically change yourself for the rest of your life and for me it wore off for the most part within 2 days. Still, it was quite an amazing feeling and I don't want to downplay it too much.

-Though I managed to keep it together this time, it's very easy to imagine someone losing their shit during a breakthrough, as I did during my first. Take extreme caution. The first time, I'm very lucky I didn't hurt myself, break anything, or get arrested or committed to the mental hospital.

-I'm not entirely sure if my positive experience was due to the fact that I took the much stronger, serotonin containing Pans. Before this, I thought I'd need to get my life together or at least be on the right path in order to have a good trip. I've had equally intense visuals on Cubensis as this Panaeolus trip, but had a bad trip, so I don't think it was the sheer amount of actives I consumed that gave me such a great experience. I'm eager to do more research and testing.

-Though I now consider it the best experience of my life, trumping my previous breakthrough where I tripped even harder and was generally happier with life, it was not completely without negatives. It was more like a crash of emotions, but wasn't anywhere near as negative or dreadful as the feeling Cubensis gave me. More like an honest, but more gentle assessment of my life. This much more manageable mindset only lasted about an hour towards the end of the trip, and I was happy again. I've still heard people can have bad experiences on Panaeolus Cyanescens, but it surprised me to have such an amazing trip at the end of a particularly bad day. It's possible my negativity was all tapped out, IDK...

-In my humble opinion, I think 1 gram of wet Panaeolus is even better than 1 gram of dry Cubensis, making them 10X more potent, in addition to the more positive and smooth experience, easier consumption due to amount and taste, and much less nausea. Of course, it's a bit unfair to compare wet to dry, and it's also possible my Cubensis just suck due to genetics, growing conditions, skill, etc.

w0rdnerd
---------
I haven't tripped on Panaeolus Cyanescens in years! You're totally right that the experience blows cubes outta the water. I'll always love cubensis, but Panaeolus Cyanescens Hawaii and Mexicana are by far my favorite species to explore.

Thanks for the detailed trip report, I'm inspired to start to some plates. My last Pan Hawaiian and Pan Cambos plates tammed out or didn't ta

w0rdnerd
--------
You're so right about the come up and body load with Pans! It's one of the reasons why Pan Cyans and Mexicana are my favorites to explore! Cubes always make me feel so heavy and I often find myself myself having to lay down until the come down starts.

Umaiqi
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It looks very introspective. I like the details ! Do you know about serotonin effect ? I didn't read anything about it, do you have the source please ?
Speaking about potency, copelandia/paneolus cyanescens looks to have around more than .7% of psilocybin and more than .6% of psilocin (http://www.agiati.it/UploadDocs/35_art11_gartz.pdf) while cubes have .6 of each (https://www.erowid.org/plants/mushrooms/mushrooms_info4.shtml). I don't know the influence of other substances ?

jimmy_luv
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They are electric! Very different feelings. The ceiling is way higher.. like I can't eat too many cubes but I could definitely eat too many pans. The comedown is clean too. Visuals are way more pronounced and color saturation is at a max. Really wonderful fruits.

Fartz_McKenzie
---------------
The chitin isn’t as robust on pan cyan as with cubes allowing for easier digestion. As for headspace I’d say its my favorite space. I feel most consider pan cyan to be 2-2.5x stronger than cubes. And they taste waaaay better. When fresh they taste like a raw button mushroom.

Samwise2512
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I would recommend trying them for yourself and making up your own mind. In my experience, different species definitely seem to have their own distinct flavour or character, and this seems to be the general consensus from experienced growers and psilonauts as well as Mexican indigenous groups who have used numerous species. I know of multiple growers who refuse to consume Cubensis having sampled Pan cyans for themselves, and there is likely a reason for this.

For myself, the Pan cyans are one of my favourite mushrooms, and in fact I rate them among the best drug experiences I have ever encountered. Consistently really beautiful and blissful, I find them to induce a really clear, clean, lucid, crystalline experience, with really detailed and colourful shimmering visuals and deep euphoria, and they seem smoother on my mind and body than Cubensis, despite their much greater potency by weight. I don't get any body load or noise when I ingest Pan cyan...they hit like organic psilo LSD.

By comparison, Cubensis can sometimes feel a bit muddy/foggy, and can be a little more emotionally unstable or darker in nature and just not as clear and I tend to feel more 'drunk' on them. Pan cyans being more potent feel like a purer and more distilled psilocybin experience to me.

I can sometimes feel a bit more weighed down with Cubensis while Pan cyans don't have this effect. Because you only need a gram and upwards dried of Pan cyans for a really immersive psychedelic experience, I think the fact you don't need to eat as much actual fungal material makes it easier on your guts and system, and this in turn influences the feel of the trip because of the lack of distracting body noise or load.

So yeah I highly recommend them. Also if you can grow Cubensis from scratch you can definitely grow Pan cyans. I've also found Psilocybe semilanceata, Psilocybin azurescens, Psilocybe hoogshagenii, Psilocybe mexicana and Psilocybe cyanescens to have their own flavour or character that to me appears to be consistent across sessions - i.e. I don't feel the differences are all entirely down to external set and setting factors.

PanfriedCyan
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Growing pans is definitely easier if you live in a region where they naturally grow. If you're not in the tropics then you've got to keep your temp and humidity very steady, and they're definitely manure lovers.

The high they give you is second to none. I've only ever felt true euphoria on pan cyans. Not just euphoria, but true love. That's the only way I can describe it.

The visuals were like I was walking through layered films of stars and planets with a geometric translucent blanket making waves on the ceiling. It was like I was seeing the entire universe, but I was too big to notice the finer details.

louisbell:
---------
Hi, to introduce myself to the community I thought I would share an experience I had last night. Psilocybin is beautiful.

Dose: 2.8g Panaeolus Cyanescens Powdered in lemon juice left to sit 15 minutes. Lots of cannabis and THC oil.

As the sun went down I prepared my dose, taking slightly less than I had planned, due to the fact that these mushrooms were incredibly potent and I had not had such a large dose in years. I chopped up 2.8 grams of very dry, very well preserved Panaelous Cyaneascens, more than twice as strong as cubensis, and let them soak in lemon juice for 15 minutes. I tend to plan a trip and then postpone it more often than not, and the second I threw the mushrooms in, all doubts and anxieties faded. I was doing this, and it was going to be beautiful.

I said goodnight to my family and chugged the mushroom concoction down in one, washing it down with some honey green tea.

Having tripped on a lower dose 72 hours before, I wasn’t entirely sure I would trip any harder. The come up was slow and smooth, and it didn’t take long for the lights and movie to become a distraction, and that mystical mushroom feeling to start bubbling inside me.

A big fan of THC, I had melted some incredibly potent honey oil onto some weed flowers and chopped it up, packing a pipe and a bong. Once the dizzy almost “drunken” feeling became more and more pronounced, I put my headphones on and let the psytrance play. Cannabis always pushes me over the edge on a come up, and hitting the bong I felt a wave of relaxed euphoria and reassurance.

After about 45 mins of ingesting the dose, I was tripping enough to be seeing colours floating around and intensifying closed eye visuals began. I smoked more and more until I had my fill and lay down on the bed doing some breath work.

I hadn’t kept track of time, turning my phone off for the trip, but I decided to sneak a peak at the time, as I was attempting to judge how much more intensity to expect. The fact that I was already having full-fledged psychedelic CEVs so soon was a nice surprised, and I embraced the fact that I was in for something exceptional.

As the mushrooms continued to intensify, I studied the visuals and noticed that they were constructed out of infinitely rapidly changing strings of colours composed of tiny hyper-complex symbols. Blue triangles that unfolded into orange hexagons and purple spinning squares, alongside millions of similar strings of complex shifting symbol strings. As the trip intensified further I opened my eyes occasionally and noticed that in the darkness these strings of colour were now visible in the air in front of me.

I held my hands in front of my face and played with my fingers, dancing with the energy. As I focused I was able to draw by spinning my fingers in the air, generating beautiful and complex ribbon like patterns of colour on a tiny scale that I could see perfectly.

Thoroughly enjoying this new state I had discovered, I decided to take off the headphones and sit cross-legged in darkness, meditating and breathing. To my surprise, the darkness actually intensified the experience, and this beautiful visual experience became entirely all encompassing. Wherever I looked I was surrounded by intense psychedelic patterns and it felt as if my field of vision had somehow widened.

The effects lasted for several hours, and as I came down I turned my phone on. I made a few sound recordings to draw from, ensuring I captured the experience. I then attempted a game of online chess, feeling very mentally sharp. This was a tad boring and I stopped soon, and resorted to just laying down and enjoying the last of the trip with closed eyes. I felt very social, very empathetic, and full of love and joy.

This variety of mushroom, for whatever reason, had a particularly nice afterglow. For hours I lay in bed, meditating on the feeling of one-ness and love I could feel radiating through my tired body. I took the occasional bong rip, and at first it brought the trip back a few times, and then I was left with just a slightly altered visual perception and an intense body high. The afterglow was spent repeating this process of smoking cannabis and meditating on the feeling, trying hard to carry it out of the trip. I was quite successful in doing so, and laying there the last 2 hours felt almost like a perfect dose of mdma but straight from mother nature.

Do you guys feel that psilocybin tolerance is exaggerated? I have been finding that two nights off, one night on is enough to reset me. This is a special "trip month" for me, I'm using mushrooms to help with anxiety, depression and quitting alcohol, and have had great success. I feel like a new person.

For those who can relate to this post, what's the "next level" like? I could see adding a gram producing even crazier effects.

This is the first time I've been overwhelmed by beauty and been so able to interact with my trip, yet I had my full sense of self the whole time. Is ego loss inevitable at some doses? What is that like and is it enjoyable to most experienced trippers?

Long story short, that was a next level for me. Using the "level" system I would guess somewhere just shy of level 4, but beyond level 3.

I still have 5.5g of these and I can't wait to dive deeper.

depopulator:
------------
Level 4 trip: 1.5 g Panaeolus cyanescens, Lemon tek, SSRI and folklore
    #23277323 - 05/27/16 12:14 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

I moved up into the mountains above the valley of San José, the capital city of Costa Rica. The region is famed for its long history of witches and witchcraft. Some of the highest peaks, which stand within a mile of my home, have protruding rocks which were said to be the abode of a famous local witch of yore. It is said that this witch, that went by the name of Zarate, had met a spirit called El Dueño del monte (The Lord of the Mountain), and that this spirit had introduced her to Lucifer.

    I had read about María Sabina, the original curandera in México, who introduced the first ethnomycologists into the mushroom experience, and figured that Zarate, the witch, was probably an aboriginal curandera that used traditional medicine and shamanism and was therefore demonized by the local catholic community. It seemed logical to me that the Dueño del Monte spirit, was probably a psychedelic plant, of which there are several in the surrounding area (psilocybe and panaeolus mushrooms, bufo toads, datura and brugmansia, etc.). The descriptions of the Dueño del monte is that it is a large man with scraggly long hair and fur, covered in fireflies and that it is said to protect the mountain from poachers and other destructors of nature. In this sense, the spirit is similar to the Wendigo, Bigfoot or Yeti figures of other latitudes. The introduction to Lucifer seemed to me the description of a psychedelic experience where Lucifer would identify with the great god Pan, ruler of nature, with nature itself, then, as an alien other in contrast with humans.

    Enticed by this folkloric interpretative run I decided to venture into the mountain and try to find the Dueño de Monte. First trip: within an hour of entering a pasture at the end of the road in the higher reaches of the mountain I start spotting clusters of panaeolus cyanescens in cow paddies. I collected maybe 30 mushrooms.

    I brought them back and dried them with a fan blowing over them for a day. I then invited my girlfriend, who is currently taking Altruline, a Serotonine Selective Reuptake Inhibitor, to try them and steeped 3 grams (1.5g per each of us) in lemon for half an hour, as suggested in the lemon tek recipe. We then drank the lemon with some pink lemonade chasers and waited. Within 15 minutes I was feeling stoned and heavy limbed, she reported only the mildest sensations.

  Within one hour I was tripping extremely hard: the lights from the city seemed to coalesce themselves into brilliant scintillating shapes of tigers and rise from the ground, geometry in my room started to fall apart, all lines standing on their own as if flowing in space, the floor turned a glowing golden mother of pearl hue and tiger shaped patterns etched themselves into them. This was a very intense trip, I had not expected this from 1.5grams and I started to panic and seek comfort in embracing my girlfriend which kept complaining that she could barely feel anything. She could tell how intense my trip was from the way my eyes were wide open and my jaw kept dropping at everything I looked at.

    At some point the city lights raised themselves into an ancient, colossal protrusion of coral shapes made of light. It seemed perfectly clear to me this was some sort of alien city, using alien here not as extraterrestrial, but as deeply, perturbingly strange. The plants out in front had massed themselves into strange ominous creatures part insects part Geiger like aliens and I could feel that the filters we normally use to interpret what we see and reduce it to simple concepts had fallen and that I could now see the truly strange life forms that surrounded me in everyday life in their true otherworldly guise.

    This was proving to be too much for me so I decided to close my eyes and it was at this point that a new "space" opened up where I could see an helicoidal spiral, much like the dna structure, and from it a serpent-insect lifeform uncoiled itself, as if it had been hiding there for a very long time and started speaking to me in a language not of this earth. I then could see this creature being given birth too, writhing with multiple conical tentacles and uncoiling from itself and expanding.

    The long and short of it is that I freaked out, started sweating profusely and gagging and decided that I was having a bad trip so asked my girlfriend to come down to the TV with me and put on some Katty Perry videos. That seemed to cut the crazy stuff short and the rest of the trip resolved itself into a mellow happy dancing and giggling fest. I have to say I was greatly relieved to get away from this creature that I now am convinced inhabits the nether regions of my psyche.

    Thinking back on it I would have to classify this as a level 4 trip, very very intense. My girlfriend on the other hand, could not get past some mild color changing and distortions. She thinks she got a level 1 trip. She even went down and ate another gram to see if she could launch off properly, but nothing happened. We have speculated that the SSRI either blocked the psilocyn or made so much serotonin available that there were fewer receptors for the psilocyn to attach to.

    I am also convinced that my interpretation of the local witches and spirit folklore is correct. I have come out of the trip with a great and renewed respect for the strangeness and profundity of nature and of our own constitution and difference as humans. Make no mistake about it, we are the aliens.

    Additional to this I keep thinking about the information I seem to have received. Is it possible that we as humans are different because somehow a mutation in our dna, possibly involving a virus or some dna altering organism, fused information into our constitution that is absolutely alien to the larger natural matrix of the world?  I have no hard answer for this, but that is what I gather from it.

  Finally, I seriously think the lemon tek is unnecessary, there might be some sort of appropriateness to the fact that psilocybin takes a while to metabolize in the body, so you come up slow and easy. Lemon tek can unless the experience on you too suddenly, causing great anxiety. I say: respect the mushroom, it has evolved thus and really needs no tampering with.

discozone:
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Thank you for your trip report.  I also live in San Jose and picked some pan cyans from a local field a few days ago. Dried, they came out to be about 4 grams.

HB (42,528 posts):
---------------------
if they are true blue cyanescens, i think half to 3/4 eighth is good if you want a high level 3 or so, and a full eighth for your world to just disappear :smile: be careful an eighth of cyanescens is FUCKING POWERFUL.  make sure you are truly ready for a journey where you really will be stuck in that little void in space where time does not exist in any shape or form.  when i dosed a full cyanescens trip time STOPPED at 2:12 am for about, lemme see, a few days (in shroom terms -- I felt like I was gone for just about forever)

let me put it this way -- when ONE minute went by, my friend and I would become ecstatic.  at points I was almost positive time was going back and forth, and that all the clocks were going at different speeds.  we were listening to Meddle, and I "knew" that the cd was playing in the same void as we were in, because the cd seemed to be playing back and forth and stopping, at times.  god that was a fuckin trip.  if only we did it outside ...

be ready, this isn't an easy trip.  cyanescens will emotionally and mentally blow your mind to pieces like no other shroom that I have taken -- the visuals usually are quite small but detailed and quite animated, almost like acid.  but it is all about the mindfuck, that's where this shroom stands tall

chuck.hntr:
--------------
First time eating Pan Cy's 1g.
    #26894015 - 08/22/20 06:05 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Hi Shroomery, I wanted to share this experience, it would be great to hear your comments and responses. As posted in the title this was my first Panaeolus cyanescens trip from a few nights ago.
Fist off I had not eaten anything for 7 hours and had been thinking about this trip for 3 days eating healthy and not drinking alcohol.

I went to a local canyon and posted up on a large rock outcropping(see pic). I squeezed 2 limes in a glass and put the mushrooms in mashed them around and then added some water to cover them and let sit for 15min stirring occasionally.
I ingested the liquid and mushrooms at 6:10pm

At 6:30 only 20mins after ingesting and they started to come on hard and fast.

They came in strong in waves, when a wave would roll in my vision would lock into whatever I was looking mostly sections of the rocks near me. While locked into these viewpoints a few phenomena would occur, if I was looking a rock in closer proximity, my vision would very slowly zoom into the frame, every small form and texture would develop incredibly full forms and appear to not only be alive but embedded with ancient human like entities.

In the beginning these waves were brief and when I would break from it I would have a sip of water, I would also get waves of fear and panic, wondering how I would get home, how intense is this going to get? Did I do too much? Also feelings of doubt, I shouldn’t have done this, I’m stuck here, I need to leave immediately. How long will this last for I think I've had enough of this.

These are the feelings that in the past have spiraled out and lead to a dreadful agonizing long experience. When they would come on I would take deep breaths and say, I am safe, there is actually no where I need to be, this state is temporary, let these feeling wash over me. This time and trip is a gift to myself there is no rush to be anywhere. All these feeling recurred 5-6 times but I was able to breath through them and let them subside in relatively short time.

As the wave periods got longer so did the intensity of the visions. The large rocks began to look like craggy eggs that I could see into. Almost as if the were snow globes, the scenes inside were dense tightly packed with entities almost like transformers but organic rather than mechanical, their coloring was similar to the exterior coloring of the rocks and the rough shapes appeared to be beings crouched or curled up in them. During these heavy waves I felt paralyzed I knew I was in my body but could not feel it, all I had was my vision which was tethered to the current fixed viewpoint.

Overall the trip was amazing I was shocked how it peaked so early but then lasted for many hours at a great manageable intensity. I'm curious if other people often feel like they cannot move and are paralyzed at times during a trip? The beginning of the trip was the heaviest experience mushroom experience I've ever had. Thx for reading. 

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25925194

JOC TEK Panaeolus cyanescens

milligrams:
------------
1g of CCs has had me tripping harder than anything, I've never done Cubensis, but I've done 2c-e (18mg), 2c-i (25mg) , LSD (~300 mics) and 1g Copelandia Cyanescens with copious weed had me tripping harder than any of em. I should think 1g of CC's correlates to more than 2-3g of cubes. Probably a ++++ experience for some of it, but I'm not too sure what that means? I couldn't make sense of who I was or where I was, I felt "lost in time", everything was just swirling psychedelic colours, I had no perception of anything except how beautiful this state was, also that was the strongest euphoria of my life.

I've done half g's of them twice before, once without weed, which gave me a subtle but really philosophical and euphoric trip, and once with weed which gave me the same thing but with quite strong visuals and more confusion.

Oh don't underestimate the Hawaiians! They're damn good shrooms, and if you smoke weed on them, expect the psychedelia to increase ten-fold.

.5gs will be a good fun dose that you wont regret. You could probably afford to go up towards 1g seeing as you're experienced with 2c's but don't expect as little as some people in this thread have been saying. I wouldn't reccomend more than 1g unless you have done big doses of the 2c's.

Length is about 6hours, peaks from 1.5-3hrs, takes about 30 mins to start feeling it. Then another 30 mins to really start. (if you're going to smoke weed, do it at about 45 mins in! Makes the trip SO good, if you do it too early it wont boost the trip as much, and if you do it too late... well you just wont be able to smoke after like.. 1.5 hours in :p

Thomas Davie:
--------------
snowydaytoday.....I've never had Pan Cyans (so please take this with a grain of salt)....just Cubes, but many times

If I dose once every 6 0r 7 days, I could stay at as little or as much as I want and not suffer any kind of tolerance issue.
If I dose 2 days in a row, I need approximately twice as much the second days.
If I dose day 1 and 3, about 1.8 times as much
Day 1 and 4, about 1.5-1.6 as much
Day 1 and 5 (what you're doing), approximately 1.4 times as much.

Unless I go 6 days between trips on shrooms, the newest trip seems to lack a certain sparkle. The OEV's are the first to go, and the CEV's for me change from bright flourescent pastels to darker colours. I'm 6ft, 180 lbs.

If I took 2g on Saturday, I would take ~2.8g on a Thursday, but only if no work on Friday. Cubes though.

Bancopuma:
--------------
In my experience, Copelandia/Panaeolus cyanescens mushrooms consistently provide a much higher order experience than P. cubensis...for me the "Hawaiian" strain of Copelandia cyanescens reliably yields a much cleaner, clearer, lighter, more lucid, colourful, crystalline, visionary state of bemushroomed consciousness, while being much smoother on the body, than P. cubensis, with a much easier coming up period, and much less of a body load than the latter, which tends to produce a foggier, muddier, more lethargic experience, more likely to induce mental turbulence, difficult and dark trips and weird alien archetype experiences.

(I appreciate I may come across as a mushroom snob a bit here, but I still have a deep fondness and reverence for P. cubensis and have had many amazing experiences with them in the past...these days though personally I'm more concerned about the quality as oppose to quantity of mushrooms I ingest). I'm definitely not alone in having this perspective, and the majority consensus from people who have consumed both species is that Pan cyan provides a superior experience to that of P. cubensis (which is not a species held in particularly high regard by indigenous Mexican psilocybe using groups).

...there are plenty of threads on the Shroomery and other mycology forums making comparisons regarding the experiential differences between Pan cyans and P. cubensis, and by far the majority consensus from people who have experience with both species is that Pans provide a superior, cleaner, higher order experience than P. cubensis, and this reflects my own experience too.

Dosage wise, 0.5g of dried Pan cyan mushrooms will be sufficient for a good experience (particularly if you are sensitive, which you appear to be), whereas 1g dried would provide a deep water psychedelic experience for most people (some dosage advice in the Copelandia cyanescens grow guide linked below).

If you are considering other species widely considered superior to P. cubensis in experiential quality (by indigenous Mexicans groups and growers alike), you may want to research P. hoogshagenii 'Semperviva' and P. mexicana, with the added bonus these may be easier species to grow than Copelandia cyanescens with the right grow setup.

Pic 1: After the substrate is fully colonized, it will look almost completely white, uncover and add your casing layer.

Pic 2: Had success just growing on a table top with humidifier sitting on same table with timer set to 1/2 hour on, 1/2 hour off, with around 95% humidity, directing the mist toward the cake pans, no more misting!

Pic 3: Final fruiting pic

Pic 4: 300mg of pure tetrahydroharmine or THH at very top of pic in weigher to take with the pan cyan.

Pic 5: One of my favorite woman house DJ's: Music sounds infinitely beautiful with the combo of pan cyan + THH



Edited by tregar (12/26/22 09:09 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar] * 1
    #28110671 - 12/24/22 05:23 AM (1 year, 1 month ago)

I enjoyed reading this, thanks for sharing.  I have been successful with the pans and am very grateful for GordoTek and the Estero’s.

I have not tried THH and am curious to do so with the pans.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar] * 1
    #28112057 - 12/25/22 12:36 PM (1 year, 1 month ago)

Good read. Thanks for compiling all of this and posting it.  I have wanted to sample pans forever, but haven't had the opportunity.

:peace:


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: 4HO-DMT]
    #28112687 - 12/26/22 08:02 AM (1 year, 1 month ago)

Thank you kindly timestop and 4HO-DMT.

I have since used pan cyan's countless times in combo with 150 to 250mg tetrahydroharmine (not an maoi or rima, but a psychedelic SRI), all experiences 11 out of 10, one of my absolute favorite trips of all time.

Pure THH is the best kept secret in the psychedelic world, if you love mescaline, you will love THH.

I love LSD and find this combo very similar, like an organic form of LSD, extremely euphoric, visual, stimulating like mescaline or LSD, and very music enhancing, spiritual and divine with incredible healing powers, open eyed beauty is way over the top and insane, love, love! Closed eye real visions for hours and angular type geometrics and fractals, super fine and animated like with LSD, super saturated tropical colors.

Trips (from here on 12/2/2011):
Quote:

As to how the THH altered the experience -> I find rue extract+DMT to be very similar to mushrooms. I found the THH added to the rue+DMT to shift the experience to a state much closer to that provided by LSD. It was more clear, more energetic, more focused, and when confusion struck it was definitely more "acid-like"



So very true, take with your mushrooms at the exact same time, you will find the trip stimulating like mescaline, greatly heightened euphoria, crystalline clear, zero confusion, open eyed beauty is way over the top like with mescaline, music is incredible, powerful spiritual insights and closed eye visions, can't say enough good things about the combo. Start with 100 to 150mg of THH.

--> I just wanted to touch briefly on #2 on post #1 concerning cactus:

Now days I just make a tea using bridgesii, 600 grams of fresh skins cut from around the core makes a tea equivalent to 600/2 = approx 300mg mescaline and 800 grams of fresh skins cut from around the core make a tea equivalent to 800/2 = 400mg mescaline, I've drank cactus tea over 100 times, and find this approximation quite accurate for myself.

They are so precious and rare that I typically only drink before I go to the waterpark down the street to enjoy nature and the bikini scenery all morning and afternoon long. 11 out of 10 experience, can't rate highly enough, much of the time I'm just like "woooahhhhh" just incredible. I rate these trips as some of the best of my entire life, always a +5 Shulgin level experience, I tend to take a 900grams tea trip at the waterpark, equivalent to 450mg of mescaline, mind-blowing good time.

To make the tea, I peel and boil the skins from around the core, reduce down to 150grams per oz, put a 6oz or 900g tea (1/2 pint tall jar holds 6 to 7oz) away in the fridge for 2 days, all the nauseating to the intestines green gunk (less than 1/4" layer) will fall to the bottom, decant and drink only what is above the green gunk, zero nausea, I freeze and put away additional jars of tea for the summer waterpark. No filtering needed this way as the fridge decantation takes care of all that. Very simple and effective.

--> Concerning #4 on post #1 (sublingual HPBCD DMT):

And if you have not tried the sublingual under the tongue HPBCD DMT (formed in 2 minutes on a spoon) in combo with 200mg oral harmine + 150 to 250mg of oral THH, (take the sublingual DMT 1 hour after you take the oral harmine + thh, and hold for 15 minutes under tongue) you don't know what you are missing, Ayahuasca without all the negatives....and you can re-dose every 1.5 hour up to 3 more times...link in post #1 https://mycotopia.net/topic/111979-one-shot-hpbcd-dmt-ayahuasca-and-sublingual-hpbcd-dmt-ayahuasca-absorbs-2-to-3-times-better-than-dmt-salts-masks-taste/ includes 6 of my experiences that I recorded over a year's time, where I took it over 50 times in a year (includes the 2nd re-dose at the 1.5 hour point). All +5 Shulgin level trips as well, just as powerful as oral Ayahuasca but without the nausea, dizziness, weirdness. See the trip reports from L-dreamer on post #2 as well.

*** Please don't forget to read the paragraph about how to test your THH to make sure it is pure and not contaminated with any left over harmaline, see "12 reasons THH rocks" on 1st post, this is important.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28116134 - 12/29/22 09:19 AM (1 year, 29 days ago)

Questions asked lately:

1) How can you make THH ?
2) Is there a video on pan cyan?

I've easily made pure THH or tetrahydroharmine for many years in only 1.5 hour from harmaline, directions on post # 13 here: https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

Pics of the pure THH can be seen here: https://mycotopia.net/topic/111979-...to-3-times-better-than-dmt-salts-masks-taste/

If you have not tried the sublingual under the tongue HPBCD DMT (formed in 2 minutes on a spoon) in combo with 200mg oral harmine + 150 to 250mg of oral THH, (take the sublingual DMT 1 hour after you take the oral harmine + thh, and hold for 15 minutes under tongue) you don't know what you are missing, Ayahuasca without all the negatives....and you can re-dose every 1.5 hour up to 3 more times...link above includes 6 of my experiences that I recorded over a year's time, where I took it over 50 times in a year (includes the 2nd re-dose at the 1.5 hour point). All +5 level strength trips as well, just as powerful as oral Ayahuasca but without the nausea, dizziness, weirdness. See the trip reports from L-dreamer on post #2 as well. The only disadvantage is that there is menthol like mild sting under tongue while it dissolves, does not bother me but others may not be able to tolerate as well.

If you buy your THH on line please don't forget to read the paragraph about how to test your THH to make sure it is pure and not contaminated with any left over harmaline, see "12 reasons THH rocks" on 1st post, this is important.

All you need to make THH is harmaline, vinegar, 10% janitorial ammonium hydroxide from hardware store, zinc dust.

Video on panaeolus cyanescens: https://odysee.com/@GordoTEK:1/GTEK-PanCyanTEK1080Compressed3500kbps:1

The combo of THH + pan cyan is highly euphoric, energizing like mescaline, intensely visual, vision producing & colorful, highly music enhancing ie just like an organic form of LSD with extraordinary healing powers. Additional benefits: zero anxiety, zero confusion, crystalline clear like mescaline or LSD. Can't recommend highly enough.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28117862 - 12/30/22 06:29 PM (1 year, 28 days ago)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22216410/vc/1 (official copelandia/panaeolus thread)

Fantastic Mr.Fox:
-----------------------
Experience: 
I still cant believe how far 1G of these guys will take you! I was full-blown tripping for 7hrs straight!!

The colors and patterns were so different than I am accustomed to!

At one point everything around me was like the ocean!
Waving up, and down, up and down..
I mean wayyy uppp!!!
So I laid and stared at the clouds..which has a mind of its own.LOL
The clouds were morphing into so many shapes and colors, && i swear I saw 2 fire breathing phoenix come towards me.
Then I was trapped in a cyclone. The clouds were spinning around me but I was in the peaceful center.

Remember when I spoke or moved I could see "waves" or "vibration" coming off my body!!

Lol once we got home I looked at myself in the mirror and it was game over,
My dreads turned into snakes and were slithering on my head. I almost had a heart attack/panic attack!!

The trip was far more visual than Cubensis, I dont think Ill ever eat cubensis again unless its of the PE variety.

The body load is like no other!! Almost MDMA likee..

All in all I'd say this was a great run!

I still have a few fruits that I need to harvest, but I'll have the final dry weight posted soon!

DMT Lexus:
----------------
There are a lot of different panaeolus shrooms and I definitely recommend to grow them.
Panaeolus Tropicalis or Panaeolus Cambodginiensis are easier to grow and they giving the trip most similar to LSD and DMT, without body load. Panaeolus Cyanescens from Florida are also easier to grow and has quite more body load and are a little bit darker. But anyway it gives you a nice trip with vivid geometric visuals and strong souly effect.
I've grown and tried them, so lovely shrooms.
Definitely you should try them and to grow them is not as difficult as it seems.
I can recommend this tek: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27637997 (Panaeolus In Mono Tubs 2.0, Baba Yaga)
Feel free to ask if you'll have some further questions.

Pan Cyans contain high amounts of baeocystin and its dephosphorylated cousin norpsilocin which also seem to be associated with anecdotes of better trips: 



Video on panaeolus cyanescens: https://odysee.com/@GordoTEK:1/GTEK-PanCyanTEK1080Compressed3500kbps:1


Edited by tregar (12/31/22 07:29 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28125375 - 01/05/23 07:35 AM (1 year, 22 days ago)

In a great mood (strong afterglow) this morning after having a +5 Shulgin level experience last night with a tea I made from 750 grams of home grown very potent bridgesii chunks from around the core boiled into a tea. Drank the tea first, then 1 hour later took 5 hits of LSD, also drank a morning glory seed solution in sherry wine made from 25g (875) seeds. I took the MG seed wine at same time as LSD. The MG seed wine adds divine spirituality, infinite beauty & euphoria, incredible dimensions, extreme saturated color & music enhancement to the experience along with the mescaline. Absolutely amazing experience all night long. Highly recommend. I do this at least once a month.

How to make the zero nausea morning glory wine: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27850299

Salvinorin HPBCD Cyclodextrin Complexation for Sublingual Administration: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28125373


Edited by tregar (01/05/23 11:44 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28125538 - 01/05/23 10:06 AM (1 year, 22 days ago)

The lurker:
-----------
Fucking wow..who here has some experience with these mushrooms? and how would you say they compare/differ from cubensis in terms of effects?

My friend and I like too refer to them as “acid mushrooms” as they have some weirdly similar effects to lsd, but with more dmt esque visions/experience.

They seem to last a bit longer than cubensis does for me, but I’m not positive. The actual “trip” experience at least. I took .6 g of them last night at around 4:50 on an empty stomach along with a small amount of cannabis and Lemon Balm tea. (have a tolerance cause microdosing) and at around 6:15-6:30 (I’d be coming down on cubensis at this point I remember texting my friend about the experience, it wasn’t too much at first, and I felt like I should’ve take more, and I thought I was coming down. Nope! I wasn’t even peaking yet.

I didn’t peak until 7-7:15, 2-2.5 hours after ingestion. This absolutely never happens for me. For cubensis, I usually peak at around an hour (they kick in super fast for me) and noticeably the experience starts to gently drift away, this was not like that.

The comedown felt loooong, but very enjoyable. I was still tripping around 8-8:30, and around 9-9:30 didn’t even feel down enough to drive yet.

This is not scientific at all, but I’m almost 100% there’s something else going on besides differing potency of the 3-4 known alkaloids in mushrooms, they do not have the “drunken” feeling cubensis do.

Going further into my non scientific whole of oblivion that is this post, to me cubensis feel much more “teachy” where every little thing that happens under the influence of them is a huge lesseon, and it’s like honestly looking at yourself is a forced thing, none of these are negatives to me at all. But the Cyanescens feel much more pointed in going deep, it feels like the experiential aspect is the most important part versus cubensis like slamming you with insights/enhanced perceptions of yourself and reality.

So these mushrooms are super cool and I’m very excited to up my dosage. Can anyone else relate to anything I’m saying about them? If not how would you describe your experience with them comparing to cubensis?

Fantastic Mr.Fox:
-----------------------
Experience: I still cant believe how far 1G of these guys will take you! I was full-blown tripping for 7hrs straight!!

The colors and patterns were so different than I am accustomed to!

At one point everything around me was like the ocean! Waving up, and down, up and down..
I mean wayyy uppp!!! So I laid and stared at the clouds..which has a mind of its own.LOL
The clouds were morphing into so many shapes and colors, && i swear I saw 2 fire breathing phoenix come towards me. Then I was trapped in a cyclone. The clouds were spinning around me but I was in the peaceful center.

Remember when I spoke or moved I could see "waves" or "vibration" coming off my body!!

Lol once we got home I looked at myself in the mirror and it was game over,
My dreads turned into snakes and were slithering on my head. I almost had a heart attack/panic attack!!

The trip was far more visual than Cubensis, I dont think Ill ever eat cubensis again unless its of the PE variety.

The body load is like no other!! Almost MDMA likee..

All in all I'd say this was a great run!

I still have a few fruits that I need to harvest, but I'll have the final dry weight posted soon!

Logical Chaos:
--------------
Pan cyans (the alternative name) is one of my favorite species of all time. The trip is very gentle, naturalistic, surreal, pleasant, natural feeling. Love it.

I gotta start growing it. Its worth it.

Asura:
------
I have a fair amount of experience with them. It's pretty much all I grow. And I trip on them fairly regularly.

It was an accidental pan cyan trip (took 2g first time) that pretty much sparked my interest in cultivating them.

When you get into the higher doses like 2g+ it is a little less unicorns and rainbows.
To me it can be scary af because it starts getting into the "anything goes" territory.

My last trip was pretty great though. I mixed 1.5g cyan with 2g RW and it was great.
Cyans have almost no body load, so it can be nice to mix in one of the cube strains
that give off an ecstasy-type body feel.

Yeah that was 30g fresh. The difference between 1.5g and 2g is just unexpected. Exponential. I like the 1.5g range a lot, actually.

One of my first posts ever was a trip report where I lemon tek'd 2g...not really understanding
that pan cyan is different than cubes. Thought I was taking a light dose. It was my first trip
in over 20 years.

https://www.shroomery.org/11678/I-went-to-infinity

I mean that report doesn't even cover 1/100th of what happened. It was nuts.

@Puduwoke start with 1g fo real. That will be a good trip and not too much. Even 1.5g is pretty great.

@lurker, sounds like you already know what I'm talking about :lol: I was flying around these crazy alien landscapes. It
was like I was popping into a new dimension every few seconds. Giant structures that looked like thorny vines, but
mechanized.

I mean I was scared shitless to be honest because I didn't know what I was getting into. And yeah, there was a "haha we got you now, motherfucker" kind of vibe to it. Don't call em meanies for nothing. That trip lasted around 7 hours total. Even on the comedown I was tripping harder than I ever had in my life. If I had seen a human shaped shadow like you describe, I would have shit myself.

I found my first post on Shroomery. It was on the lemon tek thread. I kept my promise...

I'm more clear headed on cyans than cubes. Cubes give me a drunk type body feel or something similar to ecstasy. Cyans have almost no body load at all. Lots of crazy OEV's, too.

On a recent trip my living room kind of crack open like an egg. It was as if the 3rd dimension split
open and I could see the higher dimensions behind the crack. A giant golden hand reached through the crack and put a glowing red gemstone in my chest. Then the ground opened up (I can feel my body lying down but my spirit body is standing up) to reveal a lush green landscape. There was a guy there that looked like Groundskeeper Willy and he said - in an Australian accent - "Are ya ready to grow God's veggies?" I said yeah and the feeling I got was that it was a done deal...like what this guy was talking about was being woven into the very fabric of this universe.

I mean I just don't get that kind of shit from cubes :lol:

And the weirdest trip I had was no visuals or head stuff or anything. I was just perfectly present in the moment, with no thoughts of the past or future...for like 2 straight hours. I never know what's gonna happen.

The lurker:
----------
Actually i have had a similar experience, not nearly as in depth, or intense as yours sounded however. It was in my very early psychedelic days Lemon Tek’d Cyanescens were the thing that really showed a very young and naive me the potential of what psychedlics can do.

I had no idea what the dosage was I didn’t weigh it, I gathered as many fresh specimens growing In the wild as I could find, lemon tek’d them, ate the mush leftover and all. I remember maybe 10% of this experience. Haha wow I’m actually remembering more as I type this haven’t thought about his in a long time.

d0urd3n:
---------
I had Alex grey type visuals at the peak on 1.2 grams. Assuming my chocolates were mixed evenly. It was too much for me but I think I also have a low tolerance. I would say go .5 grams first time to be safe unless you're pretty experienced with cubes.

Within 15-20 minutes I remember coming back into my room, and the opened eyed “morphing” visuals were the most intense I’ve ever experienced. I remember my bed getting comically large and growing to the ceiling.

Around this point, I turned on some Tibetan throat singing music for whatever reason, and this totally opened up the floodgates. The next thing I remember, I’m laying in my bed (I think I was 16 or 17 :lol:) absolutely floored by what I was seeing, which was everywhere I looked was like a different, super complex alien landscape. Lots of purples and browns, I remember seeing this structure, almost like some temple that was for some reason of utmost importance to me at the time.

It was during this experience I remember looking at my wall, seeing this human shaped shadow, and watching it float over to me and lay down on top of my body and sink in to me. I wasn’t scared at all, I was just watching in astonishment, there was nothing I could’ve even tried to do :lol: sadly nothing crazy after this that I remember happened, just an odd occurance.

SkulletteDemystifi:
-------------------
I always have awesome intense visuals every time with pans. And they are more in depth and focused.  Where cubes are a hit or a miss for me. Sometimes i get great visuals but other times I just feel it in my body and just get the giggles. I also have a hard time with depth perception with cubes. The visuals jist seem cleaner with pans.

The sense of euphoria is more intense with pans too. I've spent 2 hours rolling around in bed with my gf because the sheets felt indescribably amazing. More than once haha. Orgasms on pans are extremely intense as well.

It's hard to describe but they do have a more earthy and natural feel to them unlike cubes. I, personally, get this sensation that I have cool water running through my body just underneath my skin. I've felt this with every trip I've had using them.

The come down feels different as well. Usually with cubes I feel exhausted and ready to call it a day. (But like I said I wonder around a lot on cubes) With pans I'm usually a little wired after the peak. Not like bouncing off the wall; more like I drank a cup of coffee. But when your done; you're done! There aren't as many residual effects with the pans like there are with cubes. It's nice for when you need to drive home later.

PSA: Do NOT take 3.5gs unless you are ready for a dose that high. Things after 4gs can turn really dark really quick. Always start with the recommended dose of 1g and work your up when you are ready. Know your self and know your dose. Pans deserve and must be respected.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Best book I've ever read on sacred mushrooms:

Sacred Mushroom Rituals: The Search for the Blood of Quetzalcoatl Paperback – October 4, 2018 by Tom Lane:

https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/42204164-sacred-mushroom-rituals



Edited by tregar (01/05/23 10:43 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28128842 - 01/07/23 05:37 AM (1 year, 20 days ago)

1) Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28108398

2) How to make the zero nausea morning glory wine: Zero nausea morning glory LSH tincture based on 2022 LSH study, natural LSD: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27850299

3) HPBCD DMT sublingually active under tongue: https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

4) One-shot hpbcd dmt ayahuasca and sublingual hpbcd dmt ayahuasca, absorbs 2 to 3 times better than DMT salts, masks taste: https://mycotopia.net/topic/111979-one-shot-hpbcd-dmt-ayahuasca-and-sublingual-hpbcd-dmt-ayahuasca-absorbs-2-to-3-times-better-than-dmt-salts-masks-taste/

5) Salvinorin HPBCD Cyclodextrin Complexation for Sublingual Administration: https://mycotopia.net/topic/112080-salvinorin-hpbcd-cyclodextrin-complexation-for-sublingual-administration/


Edited by tregar (01/07/23 05:52 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28130376 - 01/08/23 09:38 AM (1 year, 19 days ago)

on average how much does a pan weigh when dried?


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: danto]
    #28131922 - 01/09/23 09:18 AM (1 year, 18 days ago)

Lots of comparisons between pan cyans and cubes. Any comparisons between pans and nats?


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: BlueAndOrange]
    #28139115 - 01/14/23 07:41 AM (1 year, 13 days ago)

danto said:
Quote:

on average how much does a pan weigh when dried?



Blueandorange said:
Quote:

Lots of comparisons between pan cyans and cubes. Any comparisons between pans and nats?




Great questions danto and BlueandOrange. A typical small dose of Copelandia cyanescens is around 2.1 grams of fresh mushrooms, or about 0.2 grams dried. The weight of a single dried pan can vary considerably. In the trip report I give on post #1 at top, I had a level 5 experience with only 1 large cap + 1 small cap. No comparisons I know of between pans and nats.

Copelandia cyanescens typically contains 2.5% psilocybin and around 1.94% psilocin by weight. Pan Cyans contain high amounts of baeocystin and its dephosphorylated cousin norpsilocin which also seem to be associated with anecdotes of better trips: These two alkaloids hit the adrenal receptors a2a-a2c with greater activity than psilocin, more in the range of DMT or mescaline, in the high range, and they also hit the 5-ht2a receptor much harder than psilocin. This is important for added euphoria, tropical color saturation, spirituality, visuals, aesthetics and empathetic like feelings. Teamwork is what is important here between all the various high levels of alkaloids.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28143997 - 01/17/23 06:07 AM (1 year, 10 days ago)
Log in to view attachment

Attached: Structure–Activity Relationships for Psilocybin, Baeocystin, Aeruginascin, and Related Analogues to Produce Pharmacological Effects in Mice, ACS Pharmacol. Transl. Sci. 2022, 5, 11, 1181–1196:

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acsptsci.2c00177

by Grant C. Glatfelter*, Eline Pottie, John S. Partilla, Alexander M. Sherwood, Kristi Kaylo, Duyen N. K. Pham, Marilyn Naeem, Grant C. Glatfelter*, Eline Pottie, John S. Partilla, Alexander M. Sherwood, Kristi Kaylo, Duyen N. K. Pham, Marilyn Naeem, Vamshikrishna Reddy Sammeta Vamshikrishna Reddy Sammeta, Stacie DeBoer, James A. Golen, Elliott B. Hulley, Christophe P. Stove, Andrew R. Chadeayne, David R. Manke, and Michael H. Baumann.



Edited by tregar (01/17/23 06:13 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28147039 - 01/19/23 06:48 AM (1 year, 8 days ago)

Last post: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27850299/fpart/10

I love LSD and MG wine extract too, and although a bit off topic, would love to share my trip reports:

3 x 100ug LSD + 15g to 30g zero nausea morning glory wine (525 to 1050 seeds, along with 150 to 250mg of pure home made THH or tetrahydroharmine. Way beyond normal LSD, adds incredible dimensions to the normal LSD experience, like greatly enhanced color, euphoria, beauty, music enhancement and some pretty awesome 3-d visual effects. I can listen to music for hours as it is just heavenly in combo, just as awesome as listening to music on mescaline.

So like Logical Chaos, I love the effects of all the various lysergic acid amides in the seeds, but I take it one step further and always combine with LSD, have done this at least twice a month for 10 months now.

I love cactus tea too but save it to take usually when I go to the waterpark during the summer months (which we visit around once a week as it is right down the road). But I will say that even if you do a tea on just 450g of fresh bridgesii chunks cut from around the core, will give you 450/2 = around 225mg mescaline, I use this along with the triple combo above sometimes by taking the cactus tea first, waiting one hour then taking the thh + lsd + mg wine with mint added. You can really stretch your cactus out this way, and it is damn good even at 225mg mescaline...I can make 3 x 12" long bridgesii last for 2 months this way, only taking on two Fridays of the month with the combo above.

TIP: after you brew or boil your bridgesii cactus tea for 1 hour, strain it thru a wire strainer, boil down to 4oz, then put tea in fridge for 2 days, at the end of 2 days, a 1/4" layer of green gunk will form at bottom of 1/2 pint tall jar you put the tea into, simply decant and drink ONLY what is above this tiny layer of green gunk, guarantee zero nausea this way, have been using this method for 2 decades. This is how I can take it at the waterpark and have zero nausea.

Pic 1: LSH molecule or Lysergic Acid Hydroxyethylamide from morning glory seeds, page 187 "Plants of the gods"

Pic 2: LSD molecule, page 187 "Plants of the gods"



Edited by tregar (01/19/23 01:06 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28177226 - 02/08/23 07:41 AM (11 months, 12 days ago)

Update 2.8.2023: Other subject you may be interested in:

1mg LSA + new aldehyde molecule discovery results in effects similar to 100ug LSD:
   
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27850299

Update 2.17.2023:

Sublingual Ayahuasca, my psychedelic of choice: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28189371

hxxps://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28189371 (change hxxp to http to link)


Edited by tregar (02/17/23 06:12 AM)


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OfflineCrackeddoor.77
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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28289670 - 04/22/23 10:33 AM (9 months, 1 day ago)

hello... does anyone have a recipe for making thh? Im pretty sure tregar posted it but i cant find it anywhere now


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OfflineEva radke
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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: Crackeddoor.77]
    #28393627 - 07/12/23 03:41 PM (6 months, 13 days ago)

craceddoor.77 said:
Quote:

hello... does anyone have a recipe for making thh? Im pretty sure tregar posted it but i cant find it anywhere now


Yes I've seen tregar post it here on post #13 this link, it takes 1.5 hour once you have harmaline: https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

Does anyone have any pan cyan experiences they would like to share?


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: Eva radke]
    #28399499 - 07/18/23 08:50 AM (6 months, 7 days ago)

Over 50 Pan cyan trip experiences re-counted in this thread.

From "Pollock 1974, a novel experience with panaeolus, a case study from Hawaii":

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ggSiumPZgdhiwG1TB_dwB0IJQKVwXCWe/view

Quote:

The Experience:

I ingested twelve washed mushroom caps early that evening. They were quite tasty and I considered them a delicacy. Two of the service men had ingested fifty mushrooms apiece that afternoon and the other two had also ingested a considerable number. The others present did not care for the taste so they consumed their mushrooms on bread with fruit preserves. They each consumed about a dozen mushrooms.

With in an hour I became acutely aware of alterations in visual perceptions. Three dimensional flashing patterns of colored lights were superimposed over images, and I felt as if I were perceiving stimuli traveling through multifocal space warps.

Furthermore, I experienced stimulation which seemed to involve both a psychic and a somatic component resulting in a pleasant sense of wellbeing. No one present expressed any feelings of dysphoria or unpleasant somatic disturbances, and no adverse reactions were observed through out the evening even in those who had ingested fifty mush-rooms.

When looking out the window some of us perceived moisture and felt as though it were raining, but when David and I went outside later in the evening, we discovered that it was in fact quite dry. We concluded that the robust sound of cicada may have given us the impression of rain and that perhaps we had experienced perhaps hallucinatory synesthesia. The ocean was vividly glowing in the distance, the clouds blowing across the sky were magnificent, and the entire setting produced a truly spectacular feeling of being alive.

About seven hours after the effects were first noticed, I felt drowsy and had no difficulty falling asleep (about 2 :00 AM) despite a brilliant collage of images. Those who remained at the house also displayed drowsiness and likewise went to sleep.

The next morning everyone awoke refreshed and went about his business. Both David and I ingested six refrigerated mushroom caps. Although l experienced no noticeable effects (apparently due to a subthreshold dose), David soon felt "spaced out." I experienced an apparent increase in auditory acuity and an alteration in his sense of time. In addition he had a feeling of decreased ability to voluntarily move his extremities.

This resulted in surprise as he discovered that he was in fact moving his limbs with out difficulty. Furthermore, he felt a slight impairment of short term memory but only had a trace of "visuals." These effects disappeared within several hours.




------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How the chemistry differs: https://www.patreon.com/posts/67621105

Each dot in the picture above represents a chemical compound (these are labeled on the left). They are in two vertical columns, so the left side from top to bottom is all Estero, right side is APE.  Starting with the two most important, look at the psilocybin and psilocin content - quantification is not precise, but you can estimate based on spot size and darkness, the Estero cultivar is approximately three times as potent as APE (and it would have easily blown all other entries out of the water had it been submitted to the psilocybin cup).  This should be a reminder to all to dose appropriately (pan cyan holds the record for most potent mushroom species in the world as per published research).  If you normally take 3 grams of cubensis, try 1g of Estero.  It is always better to start with a lower dose and see how you respond before trying anything higher (you may want to start with just 0.5g).  There is NO PRIZE for taking the highest dose, in fact there is no documented benefit of any dose beyond about 35mg psilocybin equivalent, just more fear & anxiety for most people.

But there's more to it than just triple the psilocybin and psilocin, Estero also contains baeocystin (hard to see, but its there), urea (quite a bit), and serotonin.  None of these compounds can be seen at all in APE.  Could these be partly responsible for the difference in anecdotes from user experiences on Estero?

Here are some comments people have sent on this subject:

"I strongly agree with starting with one-half gram dry.  It was a much better experience than any cubes I've tried even at higher doses."

"Cubes gave me mild nausea and made me feel 'shakey'.  Not at all so with Pan cyans"

"Penis Envy is and has been overrated. I think any other well sourced Cube is just the same. It’s that cultural conditioning at play."

"lol who needs cubes when you can have Cyanescens!  I’ve blessed a few people with them and they are now believers lol."

"When Estero kicked in, I wasn’t disappointed.  At one point I forgot I ate Cyanescens and thought I was on a DMT ride!  As often happens to me on DMT I was 'connected' to some kind of power cord or machine umbilical that was coming from my wall straight towards me and plugged into my third eye!  And I felt the presence of a cosmic nurse at my side. Like she had her hand in my shoulder reassuring me all was ok!  Then I was like “f*** I ate mushrooms this ain’t a DMT trip” :wink:

"I've taken enough cubes to know Estero is different... 2 grams. Most amazing experience of my life. 10 hours. And another two hours of happiness watching TV and talking about my experience with my wife. In the end I just want to thank you. No comparison."

"OMG, OMG, O. M. G. Had my first deeply religious experience on 2g [estero] yesterday. I have never felt anything like it in my life. It was truly incredible."

"I ended up taking a 1 gram of Estero since I’m used to taking 3-4 grams of cubensis. Man…you were not kidding about the potency of these. 1 gram easily felt like 4-4.5 grams of cubensis to me.  These were by far the best visuals on mushrooms I’ve ever had.  Also, the euphoria was quite intense, and giggle sessions were uncontrollable.  All in all, I love pan cyans and they’ll likely be my go to. I’ll likely still grow cubensis for microdosing as well as less potency for sharing with others."

"Experienced people do sometimes doubt ones sanity trying to explain just how deep Estero gets on what some call a "micro dose" the pan experience for me is the most rewarding substance I've ever ingested and half reduced my dose and frequency of use to fine tune the benefits, plus stopped using synthetic drugs completely and have been experiencing recovery i didn't really know I need but pretty sure i do."

"I didn't really expect how good the differences were from Cube to estero. The visuals weren't comparable at all and the euphoria was so wonderful. My 2g trip was literally the best substance experience of my life next to marriage and kids. 10 hours of pure bliss." [Gordo note: 2g is too much for most people, be cautious]

"Funny because I went to an Ayahuasca ceremony in May and the Shaman told me to start growing pans... he said, “Cubes are for the people. Pans are for the elevated.”

"First experience last night with Estero pan cyan. Truly mystical, amazing, and the most beautiful and gentle psychedelic experience to date. Truly a gift."

"There's something about Pan Cyan that induces something special that no cube could ever bring, it isn't that it's a clean feeling either - it's something that must deal with happiness in general - so whether it stimulates serotonin production or a mixture of neurochemicals for the best experience, I have had consistently positive experiences with each trip both physiologically and psychologically. I wonder if it has to do with other alkaloids or absence of alkaloids vs cubensis"

One of this years funniest/best psychedelic reveals was the guy who actually came up with Penis Envy (the best selling cubensis cultivar of all time), when interviewed by Hamilton Morris essentially said (my paraphrase) 'Eh, it's still just a cube, and cubes don't do it for me. I find the Cyanescens far superior (they have entities)!' Haha. So the guy who created the most popular cubensis cultivar in the world doesn't even like cubensis. 

Eventually I think most in the grower community will come to prefer other species.  I would still like to see some reputable published research comparing user experience by species (this is challenging to do but worth a try).  As an aside, if you listen to that Hamilton interview, the PE guy says a lot of "out there" things that deserve to be challenged, every so called claim of "supernatural powers" has always failed rigorous testing and he is no exception. The psychedelic community has a long history of nonsense associated with it, and as far as I'm concerned, its time to do things differently, and I will always call out the nonsense.  I have plenty more to say about Casteneda, astral projection, and more, but don't want to get side tracked.

Love life, stay strong, and be well.

[Notes on sample preparation and procedure for the above shown TLC]

100mg of carefully weighed, blended/homogenized mushroom powder from each sample was added to a small beaker, 5ml of methanol was added over top while also washing down the sides of the beaker.  The beakers were covered then transferred to an ultrasonic bath in hot tap water (120F), sonicated for 8 minutes, 5 minute rest, followed by another 8 minute sonication.  Samples were allowed to settle for 10 minutes but no filtration, decanting, or centrifuging was done.  A calibrated micro pipettor (5µl) was used to transfer 10µl of each sample to the chromatography sheet.  Sheet was developed in a sealed glass chamber saturated with eluent consisting of methanol and ammonia (100:1.5 mixing ratio).  After development the sheet was allowed to dry while undergoing ultraviolet examination, then freshly mixed Ehrlich's reagent was applied by spray bottle until the sheet was saturated, followed by drying with a heat gun.  Sheet was periodically photographed every 5 minutes until colors reached full development (maximum brightness).


Edited by tregar (07/18/23 11:29 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28408105 - 07/25/23 03:48 PM (6 months, 4 hours ago)

Video on panaeolus cyanescens:


Crown Jewel of mushrooms.

How to make THH, post #13: https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

Give even just 100mg of THH a try if you decide to use in combo. These pan cyan are truly magical, love! love! no nausea, extremely visual and euphoric, and you can still sleep at night 6 hours later. People are killing it at home with low tech setups, see my very first trip report on post #1.

I do recommend getting a flow hood (best investment you will ever make) for 1) transfer of grown out grain to brake up by hand and mix with pre-pasteurized substrate in cake pan and 2) when adding 1/4" sterile casing layer to mycelium grown out substrate cake pan.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28408922 - 07/26/23 08:43 AM (5 months, 30 days ago)

Quote:

tregar said:
Video on panaeolus cyanescens:


Crown Jewel of mushrooms.

How to make THH, post #13: https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

Give even just 100mg of THH a try if you decide to use in combo. These pan cyan are truly magical, love! love! no nausea, extremely visual and euphoric, and you can still sleep at night 6 hours later. People are killing it at home with low tech setups, see my very first trip report on post #1.

I do recommend getting a flow hood (best investment you will ever make) for 1) transfer of grown out grain to brake up by hand and mix with pre-pasteurized substrate in cake pan and 2) when adding 1/4" sterile casing layer to mycelium grown out substrate cake pan.




Those are two things that you definitely don't need a flow hood to do. Open air is fine for spawning jars and applying casing.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: bambus]
    #28409037 - 07/26/23 11:24 AM (5 months, 30 days ago)

bambus said:
Quote:

Those are two things that you definitely don't need a flow hood to do. Open air is fine for spawning jars and applying casing.


I agree it can be done, but if you use a flow hood you can get more than 2 flushes, up to 4 or more as it contaminates at a much slower rate, according to what is said in video, and I agree.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar] * 1
    #28409213 - 07/26/23 03:16 PM (5 months, 30 days ago)

There is not much information about tetrahydroharmine pharmacology. If it is just an SSRI, imo it may be not worth the effort of extraction of harmaline and reducing it with zinc route. Considering tregar trip reports it may be not only SSRI, maybe something like more phenyletylamine-mescaline type dopaminergic molecule.

I am thinking to make peganum harmala acetic acid tea, and reducing it with zinc. This probably result a harmine+thh solution as harmine is not reduced to harmaline acording to some studies. This solution then may be precipated with base like naoh, 7 ph to harmine and 9 ph to thh.

Is anybody tried thh alone like 300 mg is it really like mescaline, is it worth the effort ?


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: barisk22]
    #28410220 - 07/27/23 11:13 AM (5 months, 29 days ago)

Note: Important info on why I don't use man-made HPBCD anymore (see --> below) but use FRESH aloe vera gel from fresh aloe vera leaf clipping you can buy for two dollars in the Asian section of your supermarket or on-line:

barisk22 said:
Quote:

There is not much information about tetrahydroharmine pharmacology. If it is just an SSRI, imo it may be not worth the effort of extraction of harmaline and reducing it with zinc route. Considering tregar trip reports it may be not only SSRI, maybe something like more phenyletylamine-mescaline type dopaminergic molecule.

I am thinking to make peganum harmala acetic acid tea, and reducing it with zinc. This probably result a harmine+thh solution as harmine is not reduced to harmaline acording to some studies. This solution then may be precipated with base like naoh, 7 ph to harmine and 9 ph to thh.

Is anybody tried thh alone like 300 mg is it really like mescaline, is it worth the effort ?



Yes barisk22, you will find no papers on tetrahydroharmine, it's the best kept secret in the psychedelic world. I would not subject a crude rue seed alkaloids to the zinc reduction process, only because the harmaline will reduce just fine to thh, but the leftover harmine in the tea when subjected to the zinc reduction will still remain harmine, but it still undergoes an unknown minor chemical change I have discovered, in that the harmine comes out "smelly" and causes nausea after being subjected orally, I would recommend only reducing as close to pure harmaline as you can to THH.

Reduction means hydrogen addition in chemistry for those unfamiliar with the chemical term. I'm done experiments twice subjecting pure harmine to the zinc reduction just to see what would happen, and the resultling harmine is no longer any good, even though it's still harmine, it gives off a "forever stinky smell" and does result in nausea, whereas harmaline when reduced results in pure THH, void of any smell, zero nausea. I've worked with THH for many years and taken over 200 times total.

12 reasons tetrahydroharmine or THH rocks on post #1 a few paragraphs down, try 150 to 200mg harmine in a capsule with 90mg dmt freebase.....then a week later try 150 to 200mg harmine + 200mg pure THH + 90mg dmt freebase in a capsule, the difference is night and day, absolutely no comparison.

In my personal opinion THH does have downstream effects as a dopamine agonist as you suspect. It is very potent at all 3 adrenal receptors, just like our beloved mescaline. THH + DMT is incredibly beautiful, neon colorful, shimmering visuals, potent music enhancement, strong euphoria, and actual Ayahuasca visions and an afterglow that lasts for days.

There is a reason it is found in 150mg (1 cup caapi based Ayahuasca) to 300mg (2 cups if drank for the evening) at the vegetal ceremonies, all this expalined on post #1. 

--> Instead of mashing your dmt freebase into the man-made HPBCD, (which I have abandoned recently due to discovering it is ototoxic to the ears, thankfully less than 1% is absorbed orally by the intestines, so it is still very safe if you use it orally, just don't use it sublingually for sure) you can just buy some aloe vera leaf at the Asian section of your local grocery store for two dollars, squeeze out some of the fresh aloe vera gel onto a spoon, add your dmt freebase, and mash it all together for 2 minutes, then add it to a capsule with your 150 to 200mg harmine + 100 to 200mg tetrahydroharmine, this works as well as HPBCD to increase it's oral absorption into the intestines by a factor of twice normal.

Any leftover aloe vera gel from the fresh leaf you can freeze in a jar and it will remain potent forever, just defrost when you need some more. Aloe vera gel just like HPBCD has been shown to enhance the absorption of oral vitamins by 3 to 3.5 times normal.

This is similar to how actual Hawaiian Psychotria leaf enhances the absorption of dmt in it's leaf into the intestines, by over a factor of twice normal, as it contains polysaccharides (I have extracted them from the leaf before) that do this...this is why it is so potent and all encompassing, actual jungle Ayahuasca is leagues above normal dmt extraction absorption due to this reason.

But you can simulate actual jungle Ayahuasca by mashing your dmt into FRESH aloe vera gel from the leaf and adding it to a capsule, take the dmt/aloe vera gel + 150mg harmine + 150mg THH all at the EXACT SAME time in a capsule, just as the Shamans do for the fastest and most potent experience, do not stagger any of the ingredients by 10 to 15 minutes, take all at once.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28418300 - 08/03/23 07:13 AM (5 months, 22 days ago)

I've since used only 100mg pure tetrahydroharmine or THH in combination with 1g ground up pan cyan (2 x 00 capsules full, as each cap has 500mg or 1/2 gram): insanely good trips! 12 reasons THH rocks on post #1 several paragraphs down.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar] * 1
    #28423252 - 08/06/23 03:29 PM (5 months, 19 days ago)

Nice big collection of information. Thank you


Edited by Antares12 (08/06/23 03:29 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: Antares12]
    #28432131 - 08/13/23 10:13 AM (5 months, 12 days ago)

Tregar's super easy pan cyan or panaeolus cyanescens or copelandia cyanescens grow log, crown jewel of mushrooms:

When I get time, will post pics taken from a diary run from past:

Step 1: First wipe the black inoculation port on jar lid with alcohol pad and inoculate each of your 24 oz 5 grain jars with around 6cc from estero pan cyan spore syringe for instance.

I'm lazy so I already had bought super cheap pre-sterilized jars of rye berries with 4 other grains mixed in, came pre-sterilized at 15 psi for 120 minutes. When inoculate, spray 2 mm down the middle, then spin jar 1/4 turn as you inoculate around 1 cc each 1/4 turn towards the sides of jar so liquid drips down from top to bottom.

I did not even need to flame the syringe with mini butane torch as the spore syringes already come with a sterile syringe in sterile packing, you just screw on the sterile syringe and inject, no flaming of needle needed. I do all this in front of a laminar flow hood, although you don't need one.

In only 2 days, notice one of the jars in middle already showing mycelium growth. In around 5 days all of the jars will show signs of growth.



Other topics: Alchemy chemistry fun:

How to extract 2.4g dmt from 170g bark using a 2 Liter erlenmeyer flask (heat and break resistant), post #15:
https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

Tetrahydroharmine or THH and how to make her, Caapi visionary feminine teaching spirit:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28423951/page/1

Zero nausea HPBCD or aloe vera enhanced penetration Ayahuasca capsules:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28189371/page/1

Cactus tea before waterpark to beat the heat:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28411312/page/4



How to make LSI or Lysergic Acid Isovaleraldemide (Greek Eleusis ancient LSD) at home from morning glory seeds (the priests used non poisonous claviceps paspali which grows on paspalum grass adjacent to Eleusis present day in the famous Rarian plane, same alkaloid profile as the sacred Mesoamerican morning glory):
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27850299/page/2

On my very first pan cyan mushroom trip, where I went to a house music club tripping with friends, I viewed laser light patterns on the floor of the club, where the women danced, I believe the mushrooms showed me how to form never before seen patterns, as went I went home, over the next several months, I built my own 6 channel audio generator that when these combined frequencies (3 on x channel and 3 on y channel) were sent to a laser x and y galvanometer, were able to produce brand new laser patterns such as collapsing circles and spinning lines 360 degrees which looked beyond belief in the fog as 3-d, I then went on to market these laser scanners to clubs on the strip, and they were a huge success...I owe this creative invention to the mushrooms which sparked new creative energies, way beyond thought, from a higher source where the mushrooms tap into. My love for house music stems back to those days of visiting many clubs as an entertainment laser lighting fixture creator and programmer and making friends with the many DJ's. Over the summer myself and friends were lifeguards at the local water park. But on the weekends we went to parties or house music clubs.

https://www.friskyradio.com/
https://jaytechmusic.podbean.com/


Edited by tregar (08/13/23 04:28 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28439404 - 08/19/23 02:49 PM (5 months, 6 days ago)

Gordotek once said:
Quote:

With the pan cyans the visuals were outstanding and the body high was wonderful, that's all I'll say.


Could not have said it better myself.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28440802 - 08/20/23 04:07 PM (5 months, 5 days ago)

Tregar do you still like to take 1-acetaldehyde LSD via the sherry wine method?  I don't have any cactus at the moment to combine it with but I am wanting to give it a go versus normal LSD, how long is the mixture good for if stored?


Edited by Timestop413 (08/20/23 04:40 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: Timestop413]
    #28440971 - 08/20/23 06:44 PM (5 months, 5 days ago)
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Timestop said:
Quote:

Tregar do you still like to take 1-acetaldehyde LSD via the sherry wine method?  I don't have any cactus at the moment to combine it with but I am wanting to give it a go versus normal LSD, how long is the mixture good for if stored?



Good to hear from you my friend Timestop, was just thinking about you! Yes, it's the only way I take LSD, 1-acetaldehyde LSD is no different than ALD-52, same exact effects. Just drop your LSD hits into a shot glass with 1/2 shot of cold sherry wine, put it in fridge and just stir it with a straw every so often around once an hour for 3 hours, the acetaldehyde in the wine will adduct onto the bottom NH group, as aldehydes are easily attracted to NH like a magnet, and bond well under acidic conditions, drink as such. You will love the effects, flowing visuals, no choppy visuals like normal LSD, way more colorful, look up ALD-52 on the net, same exact effects as ALD-52, people preferred ALD-52 over LSD as it was without anxiety, you could take much higher doses with no confusion, more colorful with flowing visuals...Albert Hofman himself invented ALD-52. The "electricity" of LSD is replaced with a more natural feeling. The man-made feeling of LSD vanishes and becomes more nature like.

You can leave the shot glass with wine and LSD hits in fridge and it will keep for weeks, or freeze and it will keep forever, then just defrost an hour before in the fridge, as it's wine it will defrost fast, then drink it. Always keep cold as acetaldehyde boils off around room temp or 70 degree F.

Another thing you must try is then take around 100mg of pure THH or tetrahydroharmine at the same time as you take the 1-acetaldehyde LSD, she (thh) has numerous similarities to mescaline, and the combination of the two is absolutely incredible, it will feel as though you took a dose of mescaline with your LSD, THH + 1-acetaldehyde LSD is the only way I ever take LSD, I've done this for years...it's so bad ass and super cheap combo.

You can find studies for the bonding of the acetaldehyde to the NH group if you go to this link and read the 9th paper on post #1, Tryptophan analogues form adducts by cooperative reaction with aldehydes and alcohols or with aldehydes alone, 1992 Austin.pdf  780.97KB: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27850299

I've also attached the study here for convenience.

Not only will acetaldehyde bond to the bottom NH on the indole of LSD, but it can bond to the H on the amide of LSA, forming LSH, more than 5 studies all prove this happens, even the 1960 study by Arcamone, all papers in link above.

From post #19: https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Part 15: How to theoretically form 1-acetaldehyde LSD (similar to ALD-52 or 1-acetyl LSD, Orange Sunshine) from LSD hits
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1-acetaldehyde LSD (nearly identical to ALD-52) will theoretically form when you drop hits of LSD into 1 shot of fridge cold just opened sherry wine, stir once an hour for 3 hours, keep in fridge at all times, as acetaldehyde boils off at room temp or 69 degree F, then consume...all explained below:

Sherry wine is high in acetaldehyde (10mg per 30ml or shot glass). This serves as an advantage...why is this important?

Page 8441:
   
Quote:

Reaction of Indole with Acetaldehyde: A 0.2% solution of indole in equal amounts of water, ethanol, and acetaldehyde formed a product with 60% yield after 1 hour of reaction at ambient temperature. Omitting the ethanol (50% acetaldehyde in water mixture) had no effect.
   
    Decreasing the concentration of acetaldehyde to 0.1% increased the reaction rate and percent yield of product.




See pic of the researcher's indole + acetaldehyde adduct product formed before (page 8439) and after (page 8441).

The researchers achieved a new product with or without the use of ethanol, it made no difference, you only need water acidified to around ph=4 and around a 0.1% acetaldehyde solution, and around a 3 hour soak time for 100% conversion.

Sherry wine fits the bill perfectly with it's high acetaldehyde content, and low ph, which is already at ph=4, just like the study calls for. The researchers stated "the lower the PH, the faster the reaction (indole adduct formation at the NH group)." It contains the perfect amount of acetaldehyde as well, in an alcoholic medium no less.

It is quite possible that 1-acetaldehyde LSH and 1-acetaldehyde penniclavine produce stronger visual trips with zero anxiety. This has been my experience with the seed solution and also my experience when converting 3 x 100ug blotters of LSD to 1-acetaldehyde LSD (have done this over 10 times already spaced at least two weeks apart during the past two years), also confirmed recently by Namaste at the Shroomery to work for him as well, now his preferred method of consuming LSD as well.

Once you know your morning glory seeds are potent, you could also throw in a blotter or more of LSD into the sherry wine/morning glory seed solution soaking in the fridge for 3 hours, not only will this convert the LSD to the more visual, colorful and anxiety free 1-acetaldehyde LSD but it can result in a trip way beyond normal LSD. Example below:

Dragonrider:
   
Quote:

I have also experimented with morning glory seeds a lot. A couple of times the seeds came very close to LSD. I have combined morning glory seeds with other psychedelics. On a few occasions, they boosted the effects of psychedelics enormously and very few seeds where actually needed to create this effect.
   
    Once a mere 30 seeds were enough to cause an overwhelming OBE on LSD, paired with the most insane visuals and a defragmentation of the mind like i have never experienced ever since. I am convinced that there is a substance in fresh morning glories, and maybe it is LSH or penniclavine, that modulates receptors that are being activated by psychedelics in such a way that it can boost the effects of other psychedelics.




How 1-acetaldehyde LSD is different from LSD:

1) You know how acid has that sudden drop off then you are back to sobriety? Instead, this lasts longer than acid and has a warm gentle transition back over a longer period. The come up is also gradual and smooth similar to cactus.

2) 1-acetaldehyde LSD is way more colorful than acid, similar to mescaline.

3) 1-acetaldehyde LSD does not have the "visual choppiness" of acid, but is flowing in the visuals.

4) LSD produces tracers with multiples of shadows of the hand, this produces not only tracers, but colored fractals and mosaics inside the tracers.

5) LSD produces "colored specs that flow in front of everything", this produces instead "fine colored rainbow reflections" that surround everything.

6) Music sounds good on acid, but music sounds great on this, like a whole nother world, similar to mescaline.

7) With 1-acetaldehyde LSD, everything seems alive and magical. Patterns & neon colors form everywhere, the shifting of textures is magical. You can lose yourself easily as the visuals seem to drag your focus in without any effort. As a result, ego death is basically spontaneous.

8] Sometimes LSD causes wandering thoughts & can seem abrasively analytical but with 1-acetaldehyde LSD there is no wandering thoughts, no tenseness or anxiety like with acid, this is deep mentally, a real gem, pure psychedelic bliss. LSD feels man-made, this feels very primitive, archaic and natural.

9) 300ug of 1-aceteldehyde LSD taken with 400g of fresh boiled thick bridgesii cactus pieces (no core, approximately 200mg mescaline) feel instead closer to the effects of 400mg + of mescaline, when also combined with 100mg to 300mg of pure THH or tetrahydroharmine (100mg is plenty !). Always take the cactus 1st, then take the THH 1 hour later --> only in that order so that the SRI which is THH does not clash with the trace maoi's in cactus.

I think this has to do with the possibility that 1-acetaldehyde LSD shifts the receptorome or radioligand binding of receptors "slightly away from 5-ht2a" and stronger towards the adrenal A2A, A2B, and A2C spectrum instead. This adrenal spectrum (A2A-A2C) is also the stronger dominance or habitat as well for mescaline & dmt & psilocin when compared to 5-ht2a, which is only midway on the spectrum, with the adrenal spectrum (associated with beauty & aesthetic enhancement) being more dominant with all these natural entheogens.

10) It is not a sacrilege to convert LSD to 1-acetaldehyde LSD cause Albert Hofmann also discovered ALD-52 at Sandoz labs. This is different from ALD-52 cause it has one extra hydrogen on the acetaldehyde adduct at the bottom indole NH group nitrogen.

12) LSD is more "analytical" and not as aesthetic, this feels more natural and is extremely aesthetic (beauty enhancing) like with mescaline.

Sample ALD-52 trip report:

hxxps://www.reddit.com/r/LSD/comments/4ynu/highly_underestimated_ald52/

   
Quote:

Yes, I realize it's not technically LSD but really, it might as well be. I took 300ug thinking it would be mild if anything. Granted it wasn't as intense mentally as LSD can sometimes be, but conceptually and aesthetically it is beautiful beyond anything I ever anticipated. I feel perfect. At one. Better than I've felt in so long. I thought I could never trip again on anything but this is honestly paradigm changing for me. ALD-52 should be considered just as powerful as LSD-25 although it's a lot more relaxed and somewhat forgiving. As it is probably apparent I'm still very deep into this experience and I hope this to be an open discussion to anyone who would like to be involved.
   
    My god, I just went through multiple ego death experiences beyond anything I've ever experienced from LSD before. There are no words. I mean there are plenty of "words" but none of them mean a single thing compared to any of THAT. Dear GOD. I never expected anything like this, but I sure as hell needed it. Even if I'm the only one here to express it to, as that's realistically the truth of nature anyhow. However, anyone who felt compelled to actually read through all this insanity, I just want you to know you're beautiful and you are everything. All things are right and they always will be.
   
    Anyway, as far as the ALD-52, I took 300ug as I said. It was amazing and stronger than I expected, however I don't think 100ug would be very eventful to be perfectly honest. If you're concerned about it being too strong 200 might be worth it but 300 was really a great amount if you ask me. Even if you haven't taken any lysergamides before ALD-52 is rather calm compared to LSD or even mushrooms for the most part. Visually though, at least for me, it was absolutely breathtaking. Colors and textures were shifting like crazy.
   
    Everything was alive and magical. Patterns were forming everywhere. I could lose myself so easily as the visuals seemed to drag my focus in without any effort. As a result, ego death was basically automatic and I reached that point multiple times. The first time I ever experienced ego death on LSD it left me with this beautiful feeling, like a deep inner glow that lasted for months afterwards. It eventually faded and I hadn't felt anything quite like it in years, but ALD-52 brought it back, and I feel like I've awakened from a spiritual coma.
   
    Another thing is LSD sometimes causes my mind to wander uncontrollably unless I take my own initiative to focus, especially during the come up which can also sometimes fill me with restless confusion. Once I peak everything usually evens out, but ALD-52 put me in a state of perfect clarity from beginning to end. The come up was so smooth and comfortable.
   
    I didn't notice the come down because I actually went to sleep when I felt like it was time to do so, which was an interesting surprise. Every time I've taken LSD I've had to let it run its entire course before even attempting to sleep. Often I would have to stay up for the entire day after which is obviously physically and mentally exhausting. But once I felt like the ALD-52 had made its point I went to sleep just like any other day, and woke up the next morning fully rested and mentally clear.
   
    Overall, it felt very natural and I never had a single moment of uncomfortability or confusion. Just pure psychedelic bliss. I mean, I've had some amazing and extremely important experiences on LSD but honestly after the other night, think I prefer ALD-52. It felt like tripping for the first time again.



   
Random comments found on reddit to back up my dozen experiences with 1-acetaldehyde LSD (nearly identical to ALD-52) over two years:

1) Pandemoon said:

   
Quote:

I dosed ALD52 like 100+ times throughout the last 4 or 5 years, in doses between 25ug and 350ug.
   
    While ALD52 is very similar to LSD25, I think I can still see a slight difference. To me the visuals are different, especially the tracers. I can clearly see a difference there.
   
    With 200ug+ of ALD52, when I move my hand it shows some very colorfull spirals and fractals in the tracer /smearing.
   
    While with LSD25 it is just a mirroring effect that shows several of my hands. Not nearly as colorfull, just a non colored shadow (or several) of the real hand.
   
    With ALD52 it's much more colorfull and intense, like painting the air with rainbow colors.
   
    100ug or even 150ug don't really show a difference at all to LSD25, but with 300ug and above (my highest dose was 350ug) the differences are even more intense.
   
    With 350ug I can hardly see reality anymore due to all those colorfull reflections of anything I look at.
   
    I think the higher the dose the clearer the differences.



Quote:
Quote:

2) ALD-52 is probably most similar to LSD relative to the other analogues (of which I have only tried ALD-52). The headspace is markedly psychedelic, it lasts 12 hours and the visuals are prominent enough. They seemed to take on a more flowing characteristic than LSD, to where I'd see objects form within the patterns.

3) I find it has a more mellow vibe than LSD, I'm more content to sit back and relax whereas 1p is supposedly closer to the electricity of LSD.

4) For what it's worth, I found the come down of ALD-52 to be better than LSD... it just felt more refreshing, like a warm hug and it tapers off gently whereas LSD is more of a sudden drop off into sobriety, but the actual peak of LSD feels more... alive to me. like my consciousness is oscillating at a super high vibration.

5) ALD-52 is more euphoric than LSD-25 or 1p, and I find it's also less prone to creating anxiety. Because of this, I feel like I can take much higher doses and go much deeper. I took 5 tabs and experienced absolutely no anxiety at all. I don't think I would have been able to to do the same with 25 or 1p.

6) Hmmm. I seem to get much more euphoria from ALD-52 over 1p. But yes, the anxiety levels are consistently low with this chemical. ALD-52 is an absolute gem.

7) Agree. I feel like it's a subtle power, not as forceful as 1p. But there's genuine depth to it.
I'll be the first to admit it may be placebo, but I also favor ALD-52 for this reason.

8] I am very fond of ALD-52 as well! For me, the headspace was very much like LSD#25; however, I felt like the former of the two had potential for a really crazy headspace. ALD-52 also had me seeing three different colors that I'd never seen in my life. I saw red-greens, orange-blues, and of course the fucking purple-yellows.

9) NoticesMemesOwO:
ALD is MUCH calmer than 1P in every way. 1P tends to have a shitload of anxiety on the come up and tachycardia for me and my group of friends. Its very visual but also very scary at times. especially at high doses. ALD is the best IMO. I prefer it over the real thing honestly. At high doses it was very tame, had a great visual set, and no anxiety at all. very welcoming in the way it gets you. I would pick ALD all day long, and i could take or leave 1P in all honesty.

10) Doubledog said:
My friends had some ALD52 blotters few years ago and described it as slightly more visual, and not so stimulating, and as upgraded version of LSD, but with just small difference.




11) Namaste from Shroomery (has many years experience with LSD) said:
   
Quote:

Tregar, I think you're on to something here. The 1-acetaldehyde LSD I made following your instructions dropping 3 hits or 300ug in 1 shot of sherry wine in the fridge with stirring once per hour was extremely chill. Soft around the edges. When I started coming down, it felt like 10 years of therapy.
   
    I remembered good times, felt compassion. Listened to music I haven't listened to in years. Thought about friends, was at peace in a way that I haven't felt before.
   
    The stars formed into animated constellations. My Bodhi statue began to juggle. I saw the Perseidies meteors not just out of the corner of my eyes but right over my face while lying in a hammock. Saw the entire movement from start to finish. They looked like giant arrows.
   
    Stayed awake all day, went out to visit friends. It was very happy nostalgia. Sometimes larger doses make me totally black out. Not this time, I was awake and aware. No primal fear or paranoia.
   
    Felt like I was still peaking seven hours after dropping. Sometimes I get a cracked out, confused feeling, not this time.
   
    Haven't seen neon colors like that since the one and only time I was puddled.
   
    Sunday's are generally filled with dread and depression for the following week. Experienced none of that. Just a long lasting afterglow. Still in a great mood now. I did get a pretty severe headache but I also drink like it's my job, and I am on a SSRI.
   
    Been thinking about Ephesus and Pergamon, not sure if thats subliminal or coincidence.
   
    Going to wait 3-4 months and repeat.
   
    Give this a go!




---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Part 4: Tetrahydroharmine receptorome similarities to mescaline; potentiates cactus & safety note
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A little off topic, but I think tetrahydroharmine is a pretty special compound. I've used 250mg of it to potentiate cactus to very strong levels, it makes a 12" medium san pedro cactus tea which may contain around 250mg mescaline feel like an X-large 12" thick san pedro cactus containing around 400mg mescaline. It makes a 12" thick bridgesii cactus feel closer to a tea made with a 12" bridgesii cactus along with an extra 6" piece.

In the data I've seen for THH, it strongly blocks serotonin just like cactus, but also agonizes the adrenal A2A thru A2C receptors (the receptors associated with aesthetics & beauty), just like mescaline has been shown to do receptorome wise, explaining perhaps why they "overlap" so well. THH being able to make mescaline in cactus feel much stronger than it really is. Anyone who has ever taken cactus or high dose THH knows the appreciation for beauty experienced is "over the top".

But you have to stagger the THH from the cactus by taking the tetrahydroharmine around an hour after the cactus is taken, that way any minor maoi's or rima's in the cactus won't interact with the SRI which is THH, which can result in a faster heartbeat for a few hours which has happened to me before...so long as you take it later, it potentiates the cactus quite incredibly...it feels like I've taken 400mg of mescaline containing cactus tea when it's really only 250mg mescaline containing cactus, and they both lasts around 6 hours with super strong activity, so they wind down at around the same time. I have around 7 months experience combining the two, giving myself around 2 weeks apart from journeys.

It works so well, I won't take cactus any other way from now on. I get much more mileage from cactus this way. Visuals and visions are insane, music is so good sounding, you would think you were an alien experiencing sound and music for the very first time, every instrument stands out on it's own, like hearing a track for the very first time.

Always take the san pedro, bridgesii or torch cactus first (they all contain trace maoi like actives)...then take the THH one hour later, in that order, then the journey is pure bliss and no negative interactions. Beautiful combo beyond belief, just like the combo of THH + LSD or THH + mushrooms.

Other topics: Alchemy chemistry fun:

How to extract 2.4g dmt from 170g bark using a 2 Liter erlenmeyer flask (heat and break resistant), post #15:
https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/

Tetrahydroharmine or THH and how to make her, Caapi visionary feminine teaching spirit:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28423951/page/1

Zero nausea HPBCD or aloe vera enhanced penetration Ayahuasca capsules:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28189371/page/1

Cactus tea before waterpark to beat the heat:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28411312/page/4



How to make LSI or Lysergic Acid Isovaleraldemide (Greek Eleusis ancient LSD) at home from morning glory seeds (the priests used non poisonous claviceps paspali which grows on paspalum grass adjacent to Eleusis present day in the famous Rarian plane, same alkaloid profile as the sacred Mesoamerican morning glory):
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27850299/page/2

Make your own 1-acetaldehyde LSD at home from LSD, very similar to ALD-52 or the real orange sunshine:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28441105

LSD high dose trip: 20 minute visionary visit from a dead Aztec Shaman:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28451382

On my very first pan cyan mushroom trip, where I went to a house music club tripping with friends, I viewed laser light patterns on the floor of the club, where the women danced, I believe the mushrooms showed me how to form never before seen patterns, as went I went home, over the next several months, I built my own 6 channel audio generator that when these combined frequencies (3 on x channel and 3 on y channel) were sent to a laser x and y galvanometer, were able to produce brand new laser patterns such as collapsing circles and spinning lines 360 degrees which looked beyond belief in the fog as 3-d, I then went on to market these laser scanners to clubs on the strip, and they were a huge success...I owe this creative invention to the mushrooms which sparked new creative energies, way beyond thought, from a higher source where the mushrooms tap into. My love for house music stems back to those days of visiting many clubs as an entertainment laser lighting fixture creator and programmer and making friends with the many DJ's. Over the summer myself and friends were lifeguards at the local water park. But on the weekends we went to parties or house music clubs.

https://soundcloud.com/discover
https://www.friskyradio.com/
https://jaytechmusic.podbean.com/


Edited by tregar (08/29/23 07:25 PM)


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OfflineTimestop413
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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28441127 - 08/20/23 09:45 PM (5 months, 4 days ago)

Awesome, thank you Tregar

Is the peppermint extract no longer needed along with the sherry, didn't see you mention it which is why I ask.

I am in the process of acquiring what I need to make THH because that is another one that peaks my interest, along with combining them with pans.

Thanks again for all your posts, I always enjoy reading them and find the info fascinating.  Best wishes to you!


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Offlinetregar
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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: Timestop413]
    #28442520 - 08/22/23 08:24 AM (5 months, 3 days ago)

Gordotek pan cyan video:

Timestop413 said (concerning 1-acetaldehdyde LSD which is just like ALD-52):
Quote:

Awesome, thank you Tregar

Is the peppermint extract no longer needed along with the sherry, didn't see you mention it which is why I ask.

I am in the process of acquiring what I need to make THH because that is another one that peaks my interest, along with combining them with pans.

Thanks again for all your posts, I always enjoy reading them and find the info fascinating.  Best wishes to you!




Hi Timestop413 No, you don't need to add peppermint oil drops to the sherry if you are just making 1-acetaldehyde LSD. You will absolutely love the 100mg THH + pan cyan combo! just like an organic LSD with added mescaline qualities from the THH, in a league of her own, no mental confusion but crystal clear clarity, so diamondlike shimmering beautiful, the euphoria, tropical colored visuals, music-enhancement and healing is divine!

Tregar's super easy pan cyan or panaeolus cyanescens or copelandia cyanescens grow log, crown jewel of mushrooms:

8-8-2023

Step 1: First wipe the black inoculation port on jar lid with alcohol pad and inoculate each of your 24 oz 5 grain jars with around 6cc from estero pan cyan spore syringe for instance.

I'm lazy so I already had bought super cheap pre-sterilized jars of rye berries with 4 other grains mixed in, came pre-sterilized at 15 psi for 120 minutes. When inoculate, spray 2 mm down the middle, then spin jar 1/4 turn as you inoculate around 1 cc each 1/4 turn towards the sides of jar so liquid drips down from top to bottom.

I did not even need to flame the syringe with mini butane torch as the spore syringes already come with a sterile syringe in sterile packing, you just screw on the sterile syringe and inject, no flaming of needle needed. I do all this in front of a laminar flow hood, although you don't need one.

In only 2 days, notice one of the jars in middle already showing mycelium growth. In around 5 days all of the jars SHOULD show signs of growth.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
8-21-23

Step 2, so after 14 days, only the one jar in the middle showed vigorous estero pan cyan mycelium growth...I even tried inoculating more spore water and even entire print spores into the non responding 5 other jars, but still no response after 2 weeks...As you can see growth may not be smooth, and with this grow log I want to show problems encountered...

...next time I start from scratch, I will use only spore water syringes or spore print spores directly to AGAR PLATE, cut agar wedge and then transfer wedge to grain jars...I will never start from spores dropped into jars or spore syringe water shot into each jar again (as it only worked for 1 of the 6 jars).

So what I did is at day 15, I did a grain to grain (g2g) transfer of all the fast growing estero mycelium from the 1 jar with major growth into each of the other 5 jars, and it took off like wildfire....I did this in front of a flow hood, I simply dipped a clean spoon into a small glass full of 91% isopropyl alcohol to sanitize, held spoon in front of flow hood to dry off, then opened the one jar with 40% growth, grabbed 2 tablespoons of mycelium covered grain, and added this to each of the other 5 jars...it worked!

Pic1: In just one day all of the other 5 jars have taken off very fast and even the main jar with growth now shows growth all over the jar after shaking it to break it all up before the g2g transfer. I shook each of the 5 jars after adding the 2 tablespoons, and it worked very well.

Pic2: Flow hood is nearly 14" wide so that even a $2 dollar cake pan (with clear lid added later) will fit in front of it (followed Gordotek) when transferring the grain spawn in step 3 coming up later to the substrate in cake pan, and mixing all together.

Super easy Gordotek that was followed: https://www.patreon.com/posts/new-simple-tek-44645256?l=es


Edited by tregar (08/22/23 09:13 AM)


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Offlinebarisk22
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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28442799 - 08/22/23 12:26 PM (5 months, 3 days ago)

I grinded 50 gr peganum harmala seeds and make acetic acid tea of it and add 2 gr zinc to solution and magnetic stir it for 12 hours. At the end of 12 hours I still see the green flourescence of harmine and harmaline under UV light, so I waited for 12 hours more and at the end all flourescence disappered. I decanted unreacted zinc and filtered the solution. I think this solution gives me harmine, thh and other reducted alkoloids of harmala like vascine also some zinc acetate. But I am not sure about harmine because there is no bright green floresence in solution. I reduced the solution about 500 ml and drink about 50 ml which is probably about 150 mg thh and 50 mg harmine and 100 mg zinc acetate. Taste is not good or bad.

Then I take 8 gr of dried cubes with 2 spoon of aloe vera gel which taste really horrible.

The effects are very intensified like 16 gr shroom and come up was harsh, which is probably because of aloe vera and harmine thh. I am not sure about that I really manage to make thh because there is no obvius blue fluroescence. Aloe vera taste horrible is there anyway to make it better ?

I also consider to get rid of zinc acetate and look also dmtnexus threads which says it is too hard to remove it, because behaves like alkoloid, some say manske it some say using naoh some say ammonium. Some say use magnesium instead of zinc. Because of possible contamination of zinc dust with more toxic heavy metals like cadminium is another problem. What is the most efficent and safest way to reduce harmaline to thh ?

Thanks,


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Offlinetregar
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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: barisk22]
    #28446684 - 08/25/23 05:44 PM (5 months, 2 hours ago)

abandoning BS scrapping all projects in order to take care of sick loved one. God Bless


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28446706 - 08/25/23 06:14 PM (5 months, 2 hours ago)

Barisk22 said:

Quote:

I grinded 50 gr peganum harmala seeds and make acetic acid tea of it and add 2 gr zinc to solution and magnetic stir it for 12 hours. At the end of 12 hours I still see the green flourescence of harmine and harmaline under UV light, so I waited for 12 hours more and at the end all flourescence disappered. I decanted unreacted zinc and filtered the solution. I think this solution gives me harmine, thh and other reducted alkoloids of harmala like vascine also some zinc acetate. But I am not sure about harmine because there is no bright green floresence in solution. I reduced the solution about 500 ml and drink about 50 ml which is probably about 150 mg thh and 50 mg harmine and 100 mg zinc acetate. Taste is not good or bad.

Then I take 8 gr of dried cubes with 2 spoon of aloe vera gel which taste really horrible.

The effects are very intensified like 16 gr shroom and come up was harsh, which is probably because of aloe vera and harmine thh. I am not sure about that I really manage to make thh because there is no obvius blue fluroescence. Aloe vera taste horrible is there anyway to make it better ?

I also consider to get rid of zinc acetate and look also dmtnexus threads which says it is too hard to remove it, because behaves like alkoloid, some say manske it some say using naoh some say ammonium. Some say use magnesium instead of zinc. Because of possible contamination of zinc dust with more toxic heavy metals like cadminium is another problem. What is the most efficent and safest way to reduce harmaline to thh ?


I would say you need to go bac to the basics of rue extraction, and make sure of at least 95% separation between alkaloids...you only want to reduce harmaline. To Post #13 and re-read https://mycotopia.net/topic/111610-hpbcd-dmt-sublingually-active-under-tongue/ ...I applaud your efforts, and 99% is perspiration Barisk22 and 1% genius. /Its the only way Ive ever survived as a scientist. It's people like you Barrisk22 that will be the leaders of tomorrow. Keep up the good work.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28447115 - 08/26/23 08:03 AM (4 months, 30 days ago)

--> 3 days after g2g (grain to grain) transfer from a single jar, all 6 jars showing very fast growth, zero contamination, each jar is enough to mix into a single 13" x 9" x 2" substrate full cake pan, 3 jars or 3 cake pans are even enough to produce a life time supply of level 5 trips for many people.



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28453290 - 08/31/23 08:14 AM (4 months, 25 days ago)

4 days later, g2g transfer worked well.



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28475097 - 09/19/23 02:47 PM (4 months, 6 days ago)

1. Around 1 week later all the grain was colonized

2. Each of 6 cake pans (13 x 9 x 2) had 6 x 1/8" holes drilled, then placed a round sticky Air Filter Vent 0.22 Micron with 3m Backing. This is a small circular filter used for facilitating gas exchange (these come in packs of 50 for around ten dollars).

3. In front of flow hood: Into each cake pan (pre-cleaned with 91% alcohol in front of flow hood and allowed to dry) was placed substrate and all the mycelium grain from a single jar, hands were cleaned beforehand and rinsed & rubbed with 91% isopropyl alcohol, all the substrate and grain was mixed together by hand in the cake hand in front of flow hood, the lid placed onto cake pan, did same for remaining 5 cake pans.

4. Leave these 6 cake pans out on table for around a week or so for substrate to be colonized by the grain mycelium spawn. I like to keep a ceiling fan running on low.

Note: Manure/grass bulk Substrate is made from sun-dried horse manure, extra chopped straw, coir/vermiculite and ph buffers. Then is pasteurized for 2.5 hours in hot water bath. This kills bad bacteria but allows good bacteria to live. You can find precise recipes for this in Gordotek's tek writings.



Edited by tregar (09/23/23 01:41 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28479406 - 09/23/23 02:02 AM (4 months, 2 days ago)

Unbelievable, after only a few days, a thick layer of pure white mycelium like snow can be observed thru the tops of each tray, eating thru the substrate in record time. Zero contamination.



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28490735 - 10/03/23 08:21 AM (3 months, 23 days ago)

The temperature during the day was 76 degrees F and at night 71 degrees F, and this is how it appears days later with those temps, very good growth...however, decided to speed the growth up now by placing a heat mat under each of the 3 trays (2 heat mats) and set them to 25 degrees C (78 degrees F), this way at night, the growth will continue to be very fast...using this method, expect to see the trays finish in just a few more days...still zero contamination, all pure white mycelium like snow, ceiling fan above always runs on low.



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28491079 - 10/03/23 03:05 PM (3 months, 23 days ago)

The temperature during the day was 76 degrees F and at night 71 degrees F, and this is how it appears days later with those temps, very good growth...however, decided to speed the growth up now by placing a heat mat under each of the 3 trays (2 heat mats) and set them to 25 degrees C (78 degrees F), this way at night, the growth will continue to be very fast...using this method, expect to see the trays finish in just a few more days...still zero contamination, all pure white mycelium like snow, ceiling fan above always runs on low.



If his (Gordotek) method works, I'll end up with a lifetimes worth of panaeolus +5 level trips on just a single grow. We shall see.

As a long time chemist, my method of making tetrahydroharmine (see post #1 link) using zinc dust or granules is completely different from his method which uses magnesium which I would never follow. However, as far as I can tell, we are the only 2 people who have posted totally different methods on how to make pure THH.

I also do not smoke or vape dmt as he does in another video he has, as I prefer the oral only method of traditional Ayahuasca, combining it with at least 100mg of pure THH. I've used oral Ayahuasca capsules at least 90 plus times over many years. I march to the beat of my own drum. I don't make videos and don't like Patreon as you have to pay money to join, so there are indeed many things I do very differently.

I can see why he posted his video on Patreon however, as You tube banned it. You can't even get Caapi on ebay anymore, much less psychotria. "The man" has taken over media and auction monopoly. But you can still buy material items like Caapi necklaces, materialism still rules the Western world.

If you like LSD like I do, combine panaeolus with at least 100mg of the pure betacarboline THH, it's quite incredible, like a long lasting natural version of LSD. I give experiences from others who have tried the same combination in the link in post #1.


Edited by tregar (10/03/23 03:13 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28496310 - 10/08/23 09:29 AM (3 months, 18 days ago)

Gordotek said:
Quote:

The "Estero" strain was the best strain that I tested until finding TTBVI which is even better (just as aggressive and easy to grow but even more potent and it prints better). They are extremely vigorous, potent, and produce high yields.  There was some doubt at one point that the Estero strain was even pan cyan, some thought it might be pan cambo because it was almost too easy to grow.  However thin layer chromatography clearly shows it is not pan cambo, it has the alkaloid potency in the HIGH end of reported ranges for pan cyan. 

Comparison of Estero (Pan cyan) and Albino Penis Envy (Cubensis) mushrooms via Thin Layer Chromatography: https://www.patreon.com/posts/67621105

I will create a video explaining how to do this type of analysis, but for now I just wanted to show everyone a comparison between these species.  Albino Penis Envy (APE) is widely considered to be one of the most potent cubensis cultivars, it was heavily represented in the latest psilocybin cup (if you want to see my comments/critique of the cup, click the link and scroll down to the bottom where comments are shown, to see comments on a phone you may have to tap settings (in chrome for example)->desktop view).

So how does APE stack up against Estero (pan cyan)?

Each dot in the picture above represents a chemical compound (these are labeled on the left). They are in two vertical columns, so the left side from top to bottom is all Estero, right side is APE.  Starting with the two most important, look at the psilocybin and psilocin content - quantification is not precise, but you can estimate based on spot size and darkness.

The Estero cultivar is approximately three times as potent as APE (and it would have easily blown all other entries out of the water had it been submitted to the psilocybin cup).  This should be a reminder to all to dose appropriately (pan cyan holds the record for most potent mushroom species in the world as per published research).

If you normally take 3 grams of cubensis, try 1g of Estero.  It is always better to start with a lower dose and see how you respond before trying anything higher (you may want to start with just 0.5g).  There is NO PRIZE for taking the highest dose, in fact there is no documented benefit of any dose beyond about 35mg psilocybin equivalent, just more fear & anxiety for most people.

But there's more to it than just triple the psilocybin and psilocin, Estero also contains baeocystin (hard to see, but its there), urea (quite a bit), and serotonin.  None of these compounds can be seen at all in APE.  Could these be partly responsible for the difference in anecdotes from user experiences on Estero?

Here are some comments people have sent on this subject:
 
    "I strongly agree with starting with one-half gram dry.  It was a much better experience than any cubes I've tried even at higher doses."
 
    "Cubes gave me mild nausea and made me feel 'shakey'.  Not at all so with Pan cyans"
 
    "Penis Envy is and has been overrated. I think any other well sourced Cube is just the same. It’s that cultural conditioning at play."
 
    "lol who needs cubes when you can have Cyanescens!  I’ve blessed a few people with them and they are now believers lol."
 
    "When Estero kicked in, I wasn’t disappointed.  At one point I forgot I ate Cyanescens and thought I was on a DMT ride!  As often happens to me on DMT I was 'connected' to some kind of power cord or machine umbilical that was coming from my wall straight towards me and plugged into my third eye!  And I felt the presence of a cosmic nurse at my side. Like she had her hand in my shoulder reassuring me all was ok!  Then I was like “f*** I ate mushrooms this ain’t a DMT trip” :wink:
 
    "I've taken enough cubes to know Estero is different... 2 grams. Most amazing experience of my life. 10 hours. And another two hours of happiness watching TV and talking about my experience with my wife. In the end I just want to thank you. No comparison."
 
    "OMG, OMG, O. M. G. Had my first deeply religious experience on 2g [estero] yesterday. I have never felt anything like it in my life. It was truly incredible."
 
    "I ended up taking a 1 gram of Estero since I’m used to taking 3-4 grams of cubensis. Man…you were not kidding about the potency of these. 1 gram easily felt like 4-4.5 grams of cubensis to me.  These were by far the best visuals on mushrooms I’ve ever had.  Also, the euphoria was quite intense, and giggle sessions were uncontrollable.  All in all, I love pan cyans and they’ll likely be my go to. I’ll likely still grow cubensis for microdosing as well as less potency for sharing with others."
 
    "Experienced people do sometimes doubt ones sanity trying to explain just how deep Estero gets on what some call a "micro dose" the pan experience for me is the most rewarding substance I've ever ingested and half reduced my dose and frequency of use to fine tune the benefits, plus stopped using synthetic drugs completely and have been experiencing recovery i didn't really know I need but pretty sure i do."
 
    "I didn't really expect how good the differences were from Cube to estero. The visuals weren't comparable at all and the euphoria was so wonderful. My 2g trip was literally the best substance experience of my life next to marriage and kids. 10 hours of pure bliss." [Gordo note: 2g is too much for most people, be cautious]
 
    "Funny because I went to an Ayahuasca ceremony in May and the Shaman told me to start growing pans... he said, “Cubes are for the people. Pans are for the elevated.”
 
    "First experience last night with Estero pan cyan. Truly mystical, amazing, and the most beautiful and gentle psychedelic experience to date. Truly a gift."
 
    "There's something about Pan Cyan that induces something special that no cube could ever bring, it isn't that it's a clean feeling either - it's something that must deal with happiness in general - so whether it stimulates serotonin production or a mixture of neurochemicals for the best experience, I have had consistently positive experiences with each trip both physiologically and psychologically. I wonder if it has to do with other alkaloids or absence of alkaloids vs cubensis"

One of this years funniest/best psychedelic reveals was the guy who actually came up with Penis Envy (the best selling cubensis cultivar of all time), when interviewed by Hamilton Morris essentially said (my paraphrase) 'Eh, it's still just a cube, and cubes don't do it for me. I find the Cyanescens far superior (they have entities)!'

Haha. So the guy who created the most popular cubensis cultivar in the world doesn't even like cubensis.  Eventually I think most in the grower community will come to prefer other species.  I would still like to see some reputable published research comparing user experience by species (this is challenging to do but worth a try).  As an aside, if you listen to that Hamilton interview, the PE guy says a lot of "out there" things that deserve to be challenged, every so called claim of "supernatural powers" has always failed rigorous testing and he is no exception.




Since the temp at night was 70 degree F, the heating mat did the trick, after 3 days each of the 6 cake pans had completed snow white mycelium coverings, kept each heating mat at around 76 to 78 degrees F. It has auto-shutoff once temp goes above 77 degree in room. These programmable heat mats even come in packs of 4 for dirt cheap combo.

The Estero variety panaeolus (native to Florida) seems to prefer a constant 77 degree F. Temps between 70 to 85 degrees F work well.

1. This is how each of the 6 cake pans looked before I took the cover off in front of flow hood. Notice the tiny indoor humidity and temperature monitor placed on edge on top of each heat mat to monitor the programmed temperature, to make sure it was working.


2. Even though I used 2 mycobags full of casing dry mix, turns out I only needed one bag's worth in order to cover each of the 6 cake pans with a 1/4" layer. The casing dry mix is a proprietary blend of peat moss, vermiculite, gypsum calcium phosphate that was bought dirt cheap. The exact recipe is given in Gordotek's writings: https://www.patreon.com/posts/44645256


3. A 23 qt presto pressure canner was used to sterilize the soil at 15 psi for 45 minutes. It's very easy to use a canner, all you need to know comes with the instructions with the canner.

1. When you get your canner, just screw on the dial pressure gauge that comes with it by hand, put tray into canner that sits around 1/2" above the bottom, add 3 quarts of hot water to the pressure canner, put your mycobags full of soil into canner (make sure you have a couple clothespins holding it flapped over shut), put lid on canner and rotate it to closed, heat up canner on "8" or so stove setting. Watch air steam vent out of the open vent pipe for 10 minutes. Then put the pressure regulator on the vent pipe, the pressure regulator may begin to rock before pressure builds. Watch as pressure builds in canner, once the dial indicates you have between 10 to 15 psi, turn down the heat to "6" or medium or so, and allow canner to PC cook for 45 minutes. The bags can withstand the temperature no problem. They will not melt. Do not remove the pressure regulator from the vent pipe until the pressure has gone back down to zero.



4. Cooker was removed from burner and allowed to cool overnight. Lid was removed from cooker. This is how the 2 casing bags looked the next day inside the cooker.


5. The lid was removed from each cake pan in front of the flow hood.


6. This is a closeup of one of the cake pans.


7. With clean hands (pre rinsed with 91% isopropyl alcohol, and hands allowed to dry quickly in front of flow hood, the mycobag was held over the cake pan, easily eye'd an amount of casing out over the cake pan so that a 1/4" layer was spread out in a smooth even layer. I lightly tapped the layer down and sprayed it heavily with distilled water after it was in place.


8. This is pic of all 6 cake pans after casing layer was placed. Optionally I put the top back on each cake pan (the inside of the lids were pre-wiped with 91% isopropyl alcohol and allowed to quickly dry).

The lids are being put on just for 24 hours, the mycelia needs to poke through the casing just a bit before pins will form and keeping the top on seems to speed the initial move up, probably because it keeps the casing layer warmer. This may be helpful especially if your grow area is colder than 70F.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28496594 - 10/08/23 02:08 PM (3 months, 18 days ago)

Maybe there is some confusion, I only use the 91% isopropyl alcohol to rinse my hands and let dry quickly in front of flow hood before pouring casing over cake pans, patting down casing, etc.

Phase II:

There is little chance of contamination once the casing layer is on as Gordotek states. After 24 hours, I will remove the lids, and start the humidifier timer cycle.

1) Gather materials: Spray water bottle, monsoon humidifier with stretchable hose, a few humidity/temp monitors, mechanical timer.


2) Instructions for adding water to humidifier:


3) Program timer to turn humidifier on every 1/2 hour for 1/2 hour by first lifting every black button, then pressing down every other button.


4) All cake pans can be put into an empty kiddy swimming pool in a room to create a "sink/catch" for the fog or into a spare bathtub, we want to make a makeshift "tub/pool". First put down the programmable heat mats, set temp to around 76 degree F, place a humidity/temp monitor on each mat, then put cake trays on the mats, pre-spray the tub with lysol, clean well in advance.


Since my spouse will be using the mushrooms at threshold doses to treat her migraines (hopefully they will eliminate her migraines for weeks at a time, as she now gets them daily or every few days due to an ear infection back in June that finally went away months later but left here with this current head condition), she let me use a spare bath tub. 

Gordotek said
Quote:

If outside temps are 70F to 85F you can open a window. Some growers like to have additional fans running for more circulation but I found this to be unnecessary, the humidifier itself creates nice air currents that stream over the surface of the blocks and this is all you need. I did not use electric light, just natural indirect sunlight from the windows in the room, but if your room has no light, you can use 12 hour on, 12 hour off lighting. You could put the light on a time but since you will be adding water to a humidifier once a day, it's probably just as easy to turn the light on and add the water every morning when you wake up and turn the light off when you go to bed.

Set the humidifier at the top edge of your "pool/tub" elevated, so it throws mist out and forward into your tub. It should NOT be on the highest setting, a mid range setting may be fine, you want it to be throwing out some serious fog but not filling the entire room with fog. If you use a hygrometer near your tub, it's going to go up to about 95% RH (don't leave your hygrometer there too long or it will likely fail).  Plug the humidifier into a timer so that it goes on for 30 minutes then off for 30 minutes, around the clock (so it will be on for 12 hours a day total, every day).

At this point, you just need to monitor it a little bit for the first day to make sure you don't have the humidity setting too high or too low, Ideal humidity is 95%. You don't want pools of water forming, just a nice fog/mist overy your cake pans. If you get one of the high capacity humidifiers I recommend, you will only need to add water once a day. From that point on, it should be "set it and forget it". You should see pins form in 5 to 7 days. If substrate looks dry, you can mist with water. Pick the mushrooms as they mature, dry them in a food dehydrator and enjoy!

this species tend to go into almost "continuous fruiting mode" with wave after wave of mushrooms. You should get pretty thick carpets of mushrooms using this TEK, some flushes will be thicker than others.

With flush after flush, a single grow could produce a lifetime supply for some people.  A good strain can produce a crop that is strong enough to hold up a cell phone.

These can be harvested by cutting at the base with a sharp knife OR by gently twisting and pulling them out but there will usually be pins for the next crop all over the surface so try to avoid damaging those (I prefer using a long sharp knife). 

After a harvest pour 1 cup of water as evenly as possible over the entire surface of the pan. It’s going to look like an excessive amount of water, but it’s not.  At any given time, if it looked a little dry I would also spray the surface with a spray bottle of tap water (dollar store spray bottle is fine). The rumors that spraying water directly onto pins will kill them or cause them to abort have been debunked (by me). I have sprayed around, and even directly on pins just to see what would happen, and it didn't cause any problems, I have also directly sprayed the mushroom fruit bodies to see what would happen, it didn't make any difference. Remember how much this species loves rain.  That said, I would try to avoid directly watering the mature mushrooms, excessive humidity can cause the caps to turn dark, as can low grow room temperatures.

Dry in a dehydrator, homogenize by blending, and pack into 00 capsules using a capsule maker tool as shown in my bulk mushroom grow video.  Store in a sealed glass jar, at room temp, in a dark place preferable with oxygen absorbers. These are typically 3 times as potent as cubensis, so take 1/3 less. A single capsule (0.5g) is a good starter/test dose to get a feel for the species. A sensitive person might have 2 hours of closed eye visuals on such a dose. One gram (two capsules) is considered a normal dose similar to a 3 gram trip with cubensis and 1.5g (3-4 capsules) is a high dose.  2-3 grams could be very unpleasant for many people - you have been warned!  Use moderation, homogenize your dose, and only increment in small (half gram) steps after trying a lower dose first.





Edited by tregar (10/08/23 02:13 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28496745 - 10/08/23 04:26 PM (3 months, 18 days ago)

5) In operation: Humidifier quickly achieved a 98% humidity set to "high range" so turned it down to "low range" via it's dial, timed to be on every 1/2 hour for 1/2 hour, 1/2 hour off. It's cool to view the fog flow all around the tub above the cakes, hovering and moving in a counterclockwise direction across the whole tub.

Placed a drape across the front of bath tub using a thumbtack on either side, and left one far side open an inch to allow air flow, and kept the overhead bathroom vent on all the time, although this does not probably matter, on or off probably no difference. A/C vent in ceiling provides fresh air all day long, and keep the bathroom door closed or cracked an inch, you decide.



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28500615 - 10/11/23 07:14 PM (3 months, 15 days ago)

Totally agree with you treefrog....if I were to do this over again, I would have definitely used mycobags and an impulse sealer (well worth the cost) to mix the grain with the substrate...then when it's all grown out, simply break open the bag and crumble it into a fresh clean tray in front of flow hood and add the 1/4" sterile casing. So what if it takes an extra week to colonize...

...as I lost a container due to contamination...this would not have happened with the mycobags mix.

I cut around the contamination outside which was centered in one area, and broke up the rest and put it in an outdoor garden container with a 1/2" left over sterile substrate to fend for itself, luckily the humidity is perfect 95% degres outside after a rain, and 76 degrees F. So who knows....


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28506865 - 10/16/23 01:03 PM (3 months, 10 days ago)

For the tray I threw out due to contamination a week ago, I cut away all the good substrate from around the contamination and first put a layer of wet perlite into a garden container outside, then crumbled the good substrate on top the wet perlite, and added a 1/4" layer of left over sterile casing soil on top...this is all growing outside, I water it daily lightly with a watering can, and the temps and humidity are actually perfect outside except for night when it can dip. This I learned how to do for an outdoor grow from the 1st paragraph of this link: https://www.shroomery.org/8421/Panaeolus-cyanescens-FAQ





1st pic above several days after moving into humidified bathtub (1/2 hour on, 1/2 hour off) the mycelium can be seen tunneling it's way to the top of the casing.

2nd pic pinheads are forming all over the place, closeup of a few of them.

Soon, will be moving the trays into a Martha tent ecosphere that was given to me by a dear friend who is moving to another state into a smaller place, what a surprise, as this will come in real handy, this way the bathroom can be freed up, and the tent will be able to maintain a constant 77 degrees to 80 degrees, however I set it, due to it having a bulb on the bottom which is a regular old infrared, heat emitting bulb for reptiles. It screws into the power source, and sit's under a tray full of lava rocks. A programmable thermostat regulates the bulb for the perfect set temp.

Even currently with a heater in the bathroom set to go off to maintain 80 degrees F, I just can't get the temp to go over 73 degrees F most of the time near the trays, except for the afternoon when it's 76 degrees, at night the temp can fall low to 70 degrees (and the heater is turned off so no fire hazard) and the heating pads I'm getting rid of too.

The martha tent with the reptile lamp at bottom is definitely an innovative alternative to a ceramic/coil space heater which almost always gets too hot and throws a stream of heat, where as with this the lava rocks diffuse it. That is the main function of the lava rocks, kinda like perlite with it's wicking properties.

The monsoon humidifier I have will be put to good use to throw out humidity from the top downwards, still going on every 1/2 hour for 1/2 hour then shutting off for 1/2 hour and repeat like this all day...and there is a 5" fan at bottom to push air, and large holes covered with replaceable large peel and stick micron filter patches to allow air exchange in several places all over tent. A drip tray that sits under the martha collects any excess water running down the tent. A problem noticed with the bathtub is that water likes to collect in tiny pools here and there.

Evaporation is taking place every 1/2 hour when the humidifier is off for 1/2 hour, and this is important as Jakeoncid419 saids below, as it's just not the temp but the evaporation that makes the difference in how good your pin set will be.

Jakeoncid49: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26235096/fpart/1/vc/1

Mary Fairchild: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25248773

Jakeoncid419 said:
Quote:

I like high 70s low 80s you can take it up higher though but the warmer your take it the more likely you are to contaminate however they do move faster peeking out in the upper 90s where are you will start hurting your fruits I like 82 Fahrenheit.

Evaporation is what is going to induce pin formation evaporation takes place more at warmer temperatures I found they do best 80 to 82°F but it’s not just the temperature it’s the evaporation that makes the difference in how good your pin set will be.



As mentioned earlier, one mistake I made was not mixing my grown out grain into the substrate in mycobags in front of flow hood, sealing them, and letting them grow out 100% in a sterile environment like the mycobag...I noticed that when I put the trays into the fruiting chamber, they were maybe only about 75% colonized, which is why it's taking so long for the pins to form...as the mycelium needs to first colonize the substrate fully, that way it's not still doing it when you case the trays, as the pins are only going to form once the substrate is fully colonized.

Here's a pic of how I should have poured my shook up grain into the substrate loaded into mycobags: https://www.shroomery.org/8695/Making-Panaeolus-Substrate-Pictorial Then should have sealed it with an impulse sealer in front of flow hood, let it grow out 100%, and then cut open the bag after it's colonized (in about 7 days) and crumble the substrate into the trays (all in front of flow hood), and then allow another week for the substrate to recolonize or recover, then case the trays with 1/4" sterile casing in front of flow hood, spray down casing heavily, put lids which have the 6 x 1/8" breathing holes on tray for 24 hours, then remove lid and move all trays to fruiting chamber.

Spent a good day reading thru all the teks I posted here on post #1 from all the other experienced pan growers to learn all I could: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28108398/page/1


Edited by tregar (10/16/23 01:19 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar] * 1
    #28509515 - 10/18/23 01:29 PM (3 months, 8 days ago)

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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: soppos] * 1
    #28511397 - 10/20/23 06:40 AM (3 months, 6 days ago)

I ended up tossing the rest of the trays this morning as the contamination spread in the fruiting chamber, this is what happens when u don't grow ur substrate out in mycobags and when u don't let the substrate mycelium grow out 100 percent.

I'm starting all over again, gordotek has some obvious flaws to his method. Look forward to using the Martha ecosphere, have it now, and will begin with agar this time. Will put the tent to use by letting the grain jars incubate at optimum temp in the tent.

I will document it all if it works out this time.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28517456 - 10/25/23 08:03 AM (3 months, 1 day ago)
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Moonyham said:
Quote:

Sorry I didn't have time to read everything but why the particular mushroom strain? Would this not also work with cubes, subs or other more available mushrooms?



Hi moonyham, this is with the pan cyan grass/dung lovers strain, long considered the crown jewel of mushrooms, slightly harder than cubensis to grow, and the trips are way more visual, very euphoric, very intricate fractal and geometric visuals like acid with saturated tropical colors. Several of my indoor containers contaminated as I did not use mycobags to grow out the substrate...I followed a tek where they were not used, now I know better next time to use them.

More on this variety with 50 trip reports: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28108398/fpart/1/vc/1

Modern research has determined that the pan cyan strain of mushrooms with their HIGH BAEOCYSTIN and related analogues content hit the adrenal receptors with as much force as MESCALINE or DMT, see chart below. Notice how just plain psilocin alone hits the 3 adrenal receptors (responsible for enhanced colors, euphoria, beauty and music enhancement) with lighter activity.



Attached: Structure–Activity Relationships for Psilocybin, Baeocystin, Aeruginascin, and Related Analogues to Produce Pharmacological Effects in Mice, ACS Pharmacol. Transl. Sci. 2022, 5, 11, 1181–1196:

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acsptsci.2c00177

by Grant C. Glatfelter*, Eline Pottie, John S. Partilla, Alexander M. Sherwood, Kristi Kaylo, Duyen N. K. Pham, Marilyn Naeem, Grant C. Glatfelter*, Eline Pottie, John S. Partilla, Alexander M. Sherwood, Kristi Kaylo, Duyen N. K. Pham, Marilyn Naeem, Vamshikrishna Reddy Sammeta Vamshikrishna Reddy Sammeta, Stacie DeBoer, James A. Golen, Elliott B. Hulley, Christophe P. Stove, Andrew R. Chadeayne, David R. Manke, and Michael H. Baumann.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Outdoor panaeolus cyanescens strain estero grow looks promising:

Of the 5 trays in the indoor grow bathtub, 2 of the containers did not contaminate, so 5 days ago, I took the two good containers outside, used a clean fork to scrape off the top layer of casing, and crumbled up the good substrate into two outdoor garden containers, I threw out what was in the outdoor container before, cleaned the inside of containers out well with a garden hose...

...and then added a 3" layer of wet perlite (for constant humidity) to the very bottom (as I did not have enough before) then crumbled in the good substrate with clean sanitized spoon, added a 1/4" layer of sterile casing to the top, and gave it a good watering with a watering can to soak the contents of the entire container, each day in morning I lightly water the container's top casing layer for around 1 second with a nearby watering can...if it ever gets super dry I'll give it a longer soak.

...to my surprise 5 days later there is pure white mycelium growing thru the casing layer! It's looks as if I was able salvage two of the containers as they are now growing well in the outdoor containers...the weather is perfect, between 73 and 85 during day, kept in shaded area, it rained yesterday with perfect 76 degree weather all day, and humidity varies between medium to high daily. 

So it appears as if all is not lost...



What's even more amazing is that when I remember crumbling the substrate into the outdoor containers, only about 50% of the substrate was even grown out before, so somehow, outdoors the rest of the substrate was able to fully colonize in just 5 days, otherwise it would not be currently growing out or "tunneling thru" the casing layer, as this does not normally happen unless the substrate is fully colonized below. 

I have lots of outdoor containers of the same color, it's very rewarding to be able to grow outside, and since I live in a state where these naturally grow outside, I will continue to grow like this, it's just plain fun.



Edited by tregar (10/25/23 12:47 PM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar] * 1
    #28519902 - 10/27/23 08:47 AM (2 months, 30 days ago)

I'm not sure the reasoning why but I have had varied success following a similar method to Gordotek where I mix colonized grain spawn with pasteurized substrate.  Despite grain spawn jars looking and smelling clean, when things have contaminated, they've either contaminated after casing (trichoderma) or prior to casing (when I would go to case, I could smell bacteria which I assume is set to fail eventually If I smell that).  I don't know where the vector of contamination is. 

Other times I've been perfectly fine it seems without using the myco bag method(instead I did what you did here and just spawned colonized grain to prepared substrate in front of flow hood) which makes me think its either my grain spawn or possibly substrate not being pasteurized properly when things contaminated but I dont know.

I built a pasteurizer using an 50 quart cooler and I try to get the center of my substrate to around 160 for 2 hours. I let them cool and sit for 2-3 days before I use it usually.

I'm experimenting further around the subject of trays going bacterial.  I'm wondering if It may be due to not enough air during colonization period once I mix spawn with substrate.  The reason I'm wondering this, is some of my trays that have had very little room left in them between the sub surface and the lid once filled, have mostly gone bacterial so I wonder if it's anaerobic in these particular situations.  I've put a few small holes on the lids with a layer of micropore or I've also used the "takeout" trays with no holes and tried to leave the lid loose but I don't think it allows air to flow. So I filled some trays less and tried not to pack the substrate down very much.

I see you have plenty of room between sub surface and your lid tops with air filters on them.

I will try colonizing in mycobags.  I've been really perplexed why some trays have contaminated despite the spawn smelling and looking normal, it is disappointing when it happens.


Edited by Timestop413 (10/27/23 08:50 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: Timestop413]
    #28523087 - 10/30/23 07:13 AM (2 months, 27 days ago)

Timestop413 said:
Quote:

I'm not sure the reasoning why but I have had varied success following a similar method to Gordotek where I mix colonized grain spawn with pasteurized substrate.  Despite grain spawn jars looking and smelling clean, when things have contaminated, they've either contaminated after casing (trichoderma) or prior to casing (when I would go to case, I could smell bacteria which I assume is set to fail eventually If I smell that).  I don't know where the vector of contamination is.

Other times I've been perfectly fine it seems without using the myco bag method(instead I did what you did here and just spawned colonized grain to prepared substrate in front of flow hood) which makes me think its either my grain spawn or possibly substrate not being pasteurized properly when things contaminated but I dont know.

I built a pasteurizer using an 50 quart cooler and I try to get the center of my substrate to around 160 for 2 hours. I let them cool and sit for 2-3 days before I use it usually.

I'm experimenting further around the subject of trays going bacterial.  I'm wondering if It may be due to not enough air during colonization period once I mix spawn with substrate.  The reason I'm wondering this, is some of my trays that have had very little room left in them between the sub surface and the lid once filled, have mostly gone bacterial so I wonder if it's anaerobic in these particular situations.  I've put a few small holes on the lids with a layer of micropore or I've also used the "takeout" trays with no holes and tried to leave the lid loose but I don't think it allows air to flow. So I filled some trays less and tried not to pack the substrate down very much.

I see you have plenty of room between sub surface and your lid tops with air filters on them.

I will try colonizing in mycobags.  I've been really perplexed why some trays have contaminated despite the spawn smelling and looking normal, it is disappointing when it happens.



So good to hear from you my dear friend Timestop413, your comments are much appreciated! I picked up a 50 pack of the good unicorn spawn bags with filter patch. I believe that one of the sources of my contamination was early on when I was mixing the grain with the bulk substrate, I remember NOT cleaning the grain jar with rubbing alchohol on outside, and I had touched the outer surface of the jar many times at the same time I mixed the grain with the substrate, introducing a whole load of contaminants into the bulk substrate, a big no no. Like you I look forward to colonizing in mycobags this time, thanks for sharing your grow story, so cool to see you giving this a shot as well.



Started over, doing this the right way, 2nd time is a charm.

1. Under flow hood, for 1/2 half the agar plates, shot 1 cc of estero pan cyan into each plate, visible spores all thru plate, sealed with parafilm. For the other 5 plates, scraped spores from estero spore print into dish using a disposable, sterile scalpels (10 for cheap), all done in front of flow hood.

2. The mushroom ecosphere greenhouse took only 2 hours to assemble, complete dream come true, set the temp you want for inside the greenhouse, and the martha tent does the rest, notice heat source at bottom with lava rocks to diffuse the heat, and fan next to it to act as a convection oven, fresh warm air being sent upwards, fresh air flow is key. Notice polyfil filter discs attached 4" above each shelf, centered on tent, 4 on each side, and 1 on front, 1 on back of tent.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28527551 - 11/03/23 07:27 AM (2 months, 23 days ago)

5 days later: The 5 agar plates that had spores scraped into them from off an estero pan cyan spore print using a sterile scalpel to scrape them off in front of a flow hood all show wonderful growth, around a 1/2" or more growth of mycelium in a circle surrounds all the spore deposit spots.

The lava rock heater works great without any water put into the rock bin. I found when water is put in it just creates humidity in the tent, not necessary during the agar or grain grow. It can be 50 degrees outside and 65 to 70 degree F in house, and yet the temp controller can be set to 77 degrees F, and the 77 degree F heating is maintained all day and night.

When the agar plates are completely grown out several days from now, will cut several wedges from each plate using sterile disposable scalpel and drop them into a sterile grain jar by removing lid in front of flow hood, and allow the grain to grow out. Have 6 sterile grain jars ready to accept wedges when ready.

Asura said:
Quote:

Pan cyans like temps in the 76-80°F range. If I could lock in a temp perfectly, I would have it exactly 77°F at all times. A little fluctuation doesn't seem to hurt, but if temps drop too low, especially before the first flush, it can ruin the entire grow. Drops can even happen in the middle of summer in Texas. This is why I have a heater in my grow room year around.



https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25987049


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28533914 - 11/08/23 08:04 AM (2 months, 18 days ago)

(1) I dropped 3 agar wedges into each of the 6 grain jars, and the mycelium 3 days later hopped off the agar and onto the grain, pure white mycelium now growing on the grain. This will be a separate grow along side a grow identical to Asura's below:

(2) I decided to follow Asura's "cultivating panaeolus cyanescens" word for word for the main 2nd grow consisting of two large unicorn mycobags full of substrate/supplemental grain.

I want to compare the two grows side by side. In case one fails, hopefully the other will make it to the end, but I'm hoping both will make it.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25987049

I'm starting with an LC prepared from a single estero pan cyan spore syringe. There are pre-sterilized LC kits all over the web that make this super easy, just inject your syringe into the medium. In just a few days, it is ready to inject into your substrate/grain medium.

I have the following: dried horse manure, millet, vermiculite, straw, spring water, 50 pack of the 0.2 micron spawn bags (specifically Unicorn 3T 8"X5"X19"), and two of the 3 quart pyrex trays.

Asura said:
Quote:

This recipe makes about 7 quarts of substrate and is enough to fill two trays. I like 3 quart Pyrex trays. I will fill each tray almost to the top, leaving a little room for casing and I don't care having a little sub left over.

Horse manure 675g
Milo (rye or millet) 250g - not prepped in any way
Vermiculite 100g
Straw 75g
Water 1600g




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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28564675 - 12/02/23 02:13 AM (1 month, 25 days ago)

I could not be happier with the new grow.

I decided not to go the LC or liquid culture route.

1 month ago, I used a disposable sterile scalpel to scrape spores from off a pan cyan estero print onto 5 different agar plates in front of flow hood, worked terrific, I don't recommend starting from a spore syringe, I tried and it was no where near as fast as just flicking spores off a print into the agar.

Another easy way to do this is as follows from waylitjim: https://mycotopia.net/topic/3295-waylits-pan-cyan-tek-plastic-jars/

Quote:

3- inoculate with spores, liquid culture, agar wedge or slurry
I like to shoot these containers with 6 cc of mycelium water. This way
the containers are completely colonized within 15 days and ready to fruit.

For mycelium water, shoot 6 ccs of sterile water onto an agar plate, mix up
the mycelium and water using the needle tip, and draw back into the syringe.
No need to dig into the agar layer, just wipe the myc. off the surface of the agar.
(Note, when starting with spores, try adding more BRF to the recipe.)



When each grain jar had lid opened, and an agar wedge inserted in front of flow hood, the growth took off in just a couple of days. In 15 days all 5 jars were completely grown out with mycelium, I shook the jars every 5 days and this really speeded things up.

I already had several 3 lb bags of pre-pasteurized mix of horse manure, vermic, water, coir, wheat straw which I cut open and emptied each 3lb bag into 1 mycobag in front of flow hood.

I then sterilized both 3 lb bags in the pc for 1 hour at 15 psi. I added 3 quarts of water to canner.

I let cool overnight, then put mycobag in front of flow hood, removed the clothespins from bag, opened up bag in front of flow hood, and poured one whole jar of mycelium grown out grain into each of 2 bags. This was sealed immediately after with a 25.00 impulse sealer inside the flow hood, worked like a charm.

Kept at a constant 77 degree F with the myco tent with lava rock heater, to my disbelief, the bag already showed signs of pure white growth all over the place in the bag 1 day later, and 3 days later I could not believe how great they looked, over-run with mycelium, at this rate 7 more days and they will be ready to be crumbled up and put into 4.5 quart pyrex trays for 1 week to recover, I'll place foil over the pyrex and poke a few holes for gas exchange. Then each pyrex tray will be ready for the casing and fruiting.





Edited by tregar (12/02/23 02:13 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28566387 - 12/03/23 07:56 AM (1 month, 24 days ago)

Found for less than price of a discounted movie ticket: 3lb bags of pre-pasteurized manure base casing mix, these can be found all over the net from all different places in various sizes. These bags come pre-pasteurized for two plus hours. They have horse manure, coir, shredded wheat straw, minerals, hydrated lime, ph buffers like gypsum, and correct amount of spring water to bring to field capacity. 

Had simply cut open the bag and poured it into one 8 x 5 x 19 large unicorn 0.2 micron filter bag, then sterilized it for 1 hour at 15 psi, this way to sterilize not only the unicorn bag but it's contents, asura and blue helix and waylitjim all sterlized their substrates, I'm not taking any chances.

These are two better photos on day 4 after pouring 1 grain spawn jar into each substrate bag, the original fan broke that was with tent, so the normal all day temp dropped from 77 to 74, replacing with a better pc fan on the way here soon. The fan acts like a convection oven, blowing warm air from the lava rock heater below upwards to all the martha tent. With a good fan, the tent maintains a constant 77 degree F all over tent when set with electronic thermostat.

The reason you still see clothespins on the bag is because after I impulse sealed the bags in front of flow hood using a twenty five dollar impulse sealer with 4,000 good reviews, I put the clips back on just to keep the top of bag upright (front falling over) as it lays against the side of martha tent.

Asura mentioned here https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25987049 to allow 10 days for the bags to grow out completely, and to break up the bag and gently mix things up again on day 5 which will be tomorrow for me to do.



Asura:
Quote:

Colonization

I let the bags colonize for ~10 days (at about 72°F) in a dark closet. I don't know if it's the lack of light, the still air in the closet or a combination of both, but my bags grow out better this way. Prior to doing this, I used to just keep the bags on a rack in the kitchen. I would see a lot of metabolite expression. Since moving to the closet, my growth is stronger and the bags are mostly metabolite free.

12 hours or so after inoculation, I gently mix up the substrate for the first time. At day 5, I will also break up the bag and gently mix things up again. By day 10, the bags should be ready to be laid to trays. If it is not,I will toss it.




Edited by tregar (12/03/23 11:23 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28588040 - 12/18/23 08:04 AM (1 month, 9 days ago)

18 days later the 3 bags are completely colonized, they were shaken once every 7 days, will allow around a week for it to continue to sit, blue helix recommended letting it sit a week (after it's colonized) before going to next stage...

...where the bags are cut open, broken up, and laid in a pyrex tray around 2" deep or so with foil put on top, and several toothpick holes poked to allow for air exchange, this next stage will be the reconsolidation stage for 5 days before the mm thick casing soil is put on top.

I noticed that when it was below 50 degrees outside, the temp in the tent would not go above 72 degrees at night or early morning, so modified the original heater by removing middle board, scooting it to the end, installing a second 150 watt ceramic reptile heater lamp in parallel wiring with the 1st heat lamp, installed a larger baking pan on top, filled with lava rocks....this took around 1/2 hour for the modifications using a drill and screw driver and cutter for the wires.

....and installed a variable speed pc fan to blow the warm air upwards from the two ceramic heater lamps....works wonderfully! Now even though the mornings are below 40 degree F, and around 67 in the house at night, the temp still stays at a steady 77 degree F all day anywhere in the tent, morning, and night, the 2nd heat lamp made all the difference.  



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28594911 - 12/23/23 07:09 AM (1 month, 4 days ago)

1st pic, after cutting open completely colonized bag in front of flow hood and crumbling and laying it out to a 4.8 quart pyrex tray, leveled with clean gloves pre-rinsed in 70% alcohol, covered with foil, poked some gas vent holes with tooth pic, and covered the holes with 0.22 micron 3m adhesive gas exchange tiny stickies. 

To show that these pan cyan mushrooms can even be easily fruited from 1 pint wide mouth mason jars...

I had 2.5 to 3 lbs of leftover substrate (pre-pasteurized manure/coir/wheat straw mix), so I added several scoops to each of ten 1 pint mason jars from *arget or *almart and also found a dozen wide mouth lids with injection port and micron filters for cheap on-line, scooped the substrate into each jar, screwed micron filter lid onto each, covered with foil and pc sterilized all ten jars in pressure cooker for 1 hour at 15psi with 3 quarts water added to canner, let jars cool overnight, opened canner...

...and in front of flow hood, poured around 1" to 1.5" worth of grown out mycelium grain into each 1 pint jar, put lid back on, shook and swirled the jars to mix the grain with the horse manure substrate...

....put into martha tent between (temp controller set to 77 and 78 degrees F), and to my amazement, after only 1 day and night in tent, each of the ten jars shows super fast mycelium white snow like growth all over the jar...will shake the jars after 5 days, allow to grow out another 5 days, then will fruit easily just by adding a mm layer of sterile casing to ear jar, saturate casing with spray water, and place into fruiting chamber along with the pyrex trays which will be cased and fruited at same time.

It's freezing outside and lower than 65 degrees F at night, yet the martha tent with dual 150 watt ceramic reptile heater lamps and variable speed pc fan that blows the warm air up like a convection oven easily keeps the temp between 77 and 79 degrees F, where I set it, no problem keeping it very warm all day and night.



Edited by tregar (12/23/23 07:13 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28596129 - 12/24/23 06:28 AM (1 month, 3 days ago)

Really impressed with the 1 pint wide mouth jars full of substrate (several 1/2 cup scoops), day 2 shows the ten jars almost 1/3rd grown out after adding only 1 to 1.25" inch of grown out pan cyan estero mycelium grown out grain, and shaking well. You can tell the mycelium really loves the pre-pasteurized mix of horse dung, coir, wheat straw, minerals, spring water mix that was sterilized for 1 hour at 15 psi in the 10 jars.

There is already puffy white snow like mycelium covering the surface of the inside of the jars. After 3 more days of growth, will shake the jars well, and allow to recuperate, consolidate and grow out another 5 days. Then will be ready to case with a few mm of sterile casing, saturate casing with spray water bottle, and fruit within the martha tent in no time.

The wide mouth filter disk lids with 0.2 micron filter are really useful.



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28599644 - 12/27/23 09:48 AM (1 month, 9 hours ago)

Day 5 since adding grains to the 10 pint jars full of substrate, turns out the jars will not need any shaking, nearly fully colonized...will allow 5 more days for 100% colonization, then will add a few mm sterile casing (that I sterilized today for 45 min at 15 psi, added 1 quart water to casing so that only a few drops of water fall out when fist of it made, will allow to cool overnight) to the 4.8 quart pyrex trays and jars a few days from now.

Pic 1: day 5, all of 10 jars nearly fully colonized
pic 2: side of one of the 4.8 quart pyrex dishes
pic 3: bottom of one of the 4.8 quart pyrex dishes



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28600557 - 12/28/23 07:10 AM (30 days, 12 hours ago)

Next day, after the casing had cooled down in the pc overnight, poured around a 1/4" sterile casing onto top of trays in front of flow hood, used a fork that had been cleaned with 70% isopropyl alcohol to smooth out...then sprayed the casing layer down heavily with distilled water after it was in place, then (optional) put a foil cover over tray just for 24 hours as the mycelia needs to poke through the casing just a bit before pins will form and keeping the top on seems to speed that initial move up, probably because it keeps the casing layer warmer, and put back into martha tent with temp controller set to normal 77 to 78 degree F.

The 10 pint jars will be ready to case in around 4 more days. They sit at bottom of tent waiting their turn soon.



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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28602099 - 12/29/23 10:54 AM (29 days, 8 hours ago)

Asura said: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25987049
Quote:


Fruiting (Part 1)

Successful fruiting of pan cyans requires the understanding of these factors: humidity, evaporation, temperature, and fresh air exchange (FAE).

Temperature

Pan cyans like temps in the 76-80°F range. If I could lock in a temp perfectly, I would have it exactly 77°F at all times. A little fluctuation doesn't seem to hurt, but if temps drop too low, especially before the first flush, it can ruin the entire grow. Drops can even happen in the middle of summer in Texas. This is why I have a heater in my grow room year around.

FAE
This is the easy part. FAE is always on. Sometimes that air is mixed with fog and sometimes it's just air. But there is always some amount of air going into the FC.

Some growers handle FAE using a repeat cycle timer that simultaneously pulls in fresh air while exhausting the old air. I prefer the always on model. It's just one less thing to think about.

Humidity & Evaporation

Pan cyans thrive a high humidity environment. However, evaporation is a major pinning trigger (by all observations). And evaporation cannot occur efficiently if your FC is always near 100% relative humidity (RH).

With this in mind, it's best to think of fruiting in two stages: pre-pin and post-pin.

During pre-pin, it's best to cycle humidity. I will set my humidity controller to a range around 90-98%. This means the fog will kick on at 90% and will shut off when it hits 98%. While on, moisture is being added and humidity will increase.

While off, humidity drops and evaporation will increase. This on/off cycle takes some amount of time, which is why some cultivators use a repeat cycle timer in lieu of a controller. Both can work well.

I don't want the environment to be too wet or too dry, so I do regularly adjust the range on my controller based on what I am seeing. Having an empty tray in the FC can really help with this dialing in. If my tray is bone dry when the cycle hits 90%, I know I can increase the range to something like 92-98%. If my tray is too wet at the high end, I might adjust the range to something like 90-97% or 90-96%. I will make whatever adjustments necessary based on what I am seeing with the empty tray.

In my current grow, for instance, I have the range set to 92-97%. These adjustments were made over the
course of the first three days of fruiting.

Post-pin is easier to manage. Once, pinning has occurred the substrate will continue to put out flush after flush. I don't worry about the humidity cycling once the initial pinning has occurred. After the pins start coming in I usually set my controller to a tight range like 94-95% to keep the environment mostly humid. Even with the humidity on, some evaporation will still occur.

RogerRabbit said:
You can have 100% humidity right at the substrate surface, while having +/-95% humidity within the air of the fruiting chamber itself.
Even at 99% humidity, if you're getting good fresh air exchange, evaporation from the substrate will occur.



After 24 hours removed the foil cover from trays which had several toothpick sized air holes in it...filled humidifier with water, set humidity on humidity controller to TURN ON at 90 to 92 degrees humidity, and TURN OFF at 97 degrees humidity. Set variable PC fan blowing warm air up from the dual 150 watt ceramic lamp reptile lava rock heater to 2.5, low speed very quiet with still plenty of fresh air all thru the tent.

pic 1: trays look like this after removing the foil, substrate 100% colonized by the mycelium
pic 2: monsoon humidifier blows a rolling humidity over the trays (and jars when cased in a few days)
pic 3: humidity controller set to TURN ON at 90 to 92 degrees humidity, TURN OFF at 97 degrees humidity
pic 4: variable pc fan set to around 2.5 speed (low)
pic 5: monsoon humidifier set to around 3 setting (low)
pic 6: day 7 after adding grown out mycelium grain (1 to 1.25") to each of 10 jars with substrate and shaking, will case all jars in around 3 more days.



Edited by tregar (12/29/23 10:59 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28604230 - 12/31/23 07:03 AM (27 days, 12 hours ago)

Ran across a problem with the Chinese made humidity controller I was originally using, it had no calibration feature, so even though the sensor was several points off, I was not able to calibrate to the actual real humidity in the tent, as I have 3 different humidity meters, all very accurate, while the Chinese made monitor was way off...

...so found a much better INKBIRD humidity monitor controller with built in up and down CALIBRATION buttons, so was able to calibrate the new humidity controller to the actual real humidity based on the other meters in the tent, I was able to set the target high humidity to 97 and the "turn on differential" to 90 degrees humidity, so it was able to turn on humidity when it fell below 90 and turn it off when it reached 97. This new one worked incredibly well compared to the Chinese model.

....also place a large rim plastic cup way underneath the monsoon humidity hose on one of the racks, as every so often built up drips of water at the end of the monsoon hose would fall into the cup placed below the output tube, so the water would not just get dumped into the bottom of the tent as it fell...this keeps it much cleaner inside, so no drips of water would fall into bottom of tent or any of the mushroom trays.

pic 1: this inkbird humidity monitor controller works very well all day and night to keep humidity at a set TURN ON AT 90, TURN OFF AT 97, easy to calibrate too.

pic 2...it's also important to keep the monsoon humidifier with it's long expandable hose higher than the actual spot where the hose enters the tent, this way the built up water in the hose will exit the hose into cup far below in the tent as it drips out, otherwise the water can get built up in hose and will cause humidity to stop output. I used 2 x 5 gallon buckets on top a wooden stool to raise the monsoon humidifier high enough.

pic 3: the variable pc fan had to be turned back up to normal "8" mid-high setting in order to keep blowing the warm air up and thru all the tent, this made it easy to keep temp anywhere I set it, normally at 77 to 78 degrees F, the fan speed cannot be turned on low, or the temp will not go above 75 degrees when it is freezing outside and below 65 in house. The mid high "8" setting works very well, no matter how cold it is, it's able to keep a constant 77 to 79 degrees F in all the racks of the tent.



Edited by tregar (12/31/23 07:33 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28607427 - 01/02/24 05:03 PM (25 days, 2 hours ago)

Additional comments collected from the archives:

Pan cyan vs P. cubensis

"They [Pan cyans] are so much cleaner! The trip is shorter but more intense. The visuals are just incredible. You feel very light compared to cubensis and the headspace is more manageable (at least at lower doses).

"Most intense, euphoric, neon colorful trip that introduced me to pan cyan, most unlike any cubes I have ever had. Way preferred these over cubes. So deeply euphoric and extremely visual with saturated tropical neon colors. From then on I was hooked."

"I didn't really expect how good the differences were from Cube to [Pan cyan] estero. The visuals weren't comparable at all and the euphoria was so wonderful. My 2g trip was literally the best substance experience of my life next to marriage and kids. 10 hours of pure bliss."

"I strongly agree with starting with one-half gram dry. It was a much better experience than any cubes I've tried even at higher doses."

"Cubes gave me mild nausea and made me feel 'shakey'. Not at all so with Pan cyans."

"Less cartoony than cubes. More crisp neon geometric patterns. The trip also feels less tiring."

"Copelandia [Panaeolus] cyanescens are far stronger than cubes and have a distinctly different feel."

"I've eaten pan cyans around the 1g dose - to me it was like 3g of cubies in strength with a different quality to it."

"IMO they [Pan cyans] are a lot better than cubes. No body noise and very intense and clear. More like LSD just a lot shorter. I don't cultivate many actives on a regular basis anymore, but out off all I have experienced to date, these are my favorite."

"Pan Cyan (and Trops) are very much worth the effort!!! I have never eaten any Cubes that were as VISUAL as these are. Not to mention a little goes a LONG ways. Gram and a half of these little fellers will blister your brain!"

"In my humble opinion, I think 1 gram of wet Panaeolus is even better than 1 gram of dry Cubensis, making them 10X more potent [?!?], in addition to the more positive and smooth experience, easier consumption due to amount and taste, and much less nausea."

"My first experience [with Pan cyans] was wonderful! I definitely noticed a big difference in potency and the mood of the trip. I still remember how clean, visual and surreal everything felt. I felt absolutely no body noise or anxiety. They felt very natural to experience, nothing felt wrong if that makes sense."

"Ok, so it's given that [Pan cyan] it's much stronger than cubensis. But I've noticed that there is a difference in the high. Why is that?"

"There's something about Pan Cyan that induces something special that no cube could ever bring, it isn't that it's a clean feeling either - it's something that must deal with happiness in general - so whether it stimulates serotonin production or a mixture of neurochemicals for the best experience, I have had consistently positive experiences with each trip both physiologically and psychologically. I wonder if it has to do with other alkaloids or absence of alkaloids vs cubensis."

"It is my personal view that Hawaiian Copelandia [Panaeolus] cyanescens offers the entheogen user a more enjoyable experience than the more easily cultivated Psilocybe cubensis. In fact I would place it in the premier cru of psychedelic plants, alongside the indigenous Liberty Cap (Psilocybe semilanceata) and the various DMT containing plants."

General comments

"They are the cleanest, smoothest, most peaceful mushroom vibe of all the species I have tried. Panaeolus cyanescens and tropicalis rank #1 in my book."

"They are far and above the cleanest clearest and most potent mushrooms I have ever encountered, tread lightly with these guys."

"SWIM has only consumed the Copelandia cyans (Hawaiian), and reputes them to be the best mushroom experience by far. Very clean trip, zero body load, clear head space."

"The highs real clean. It reminds me of the Felix the cat acid from the 80s. Just smooth. With little body noise and extreme visuals. A calm lucidity that is like a slice of heaven."

"First experience last night with Estero pan cyan. Truly mystical, amazing, and the most beautiful and gentle psychedelic experience to date. Truly a gift."

"I also noticed that cyans have a very smooth comedown and longer duration. What could be the reason for this?"

"Pans are no joke. Anyone who says LSD is more powerful than mushrooms has never done pans."


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28613742 - 01/08/24 07:16 AM (19 days, 12 hours ago)

Don't make the same mistake I did, so after 1.5 weeks, not a single pin, and the humidity controller became a major pain in the ass, as it's calibration would fluctuate and it drove me a little bit mad having to watch and tend to it often...

...so I wen't back to what Gordotek recommended, and just put the monsoon humidifier on a timer, 1/2 hour on, then 1/2 hour off, all day and night long...

...also rolled up around 2" of the tent from the bottom and secured it with clothespins, put the ceiling fan on LOW in the room, and cracked a window around the width of a clothespin, this made a major difference, also cracked the door to the grow room around 2" all the time, and now the inside of the martha tent is no longer like a 24 hour rainforest.:lol:

...The FAE or fresh air exchange is perfect now...for 1/2 hour the humidity climbs from 80 to a perfect 97 degrees fairly quickly when ON, maintains the 97, inches up to 98 during the last 5 minutes of the 30 min ON cycle, then drops down to an ending 80 during the last 5 min of the 30 min OFF cycle very slowly when OFF, now I'm finally seeing evaporation from the surface of the casing during OFF and good moisture of the casing when ON.

As I've read in a dozen other martha tent topics on this forum, all the variables of a tent can be tricky, and why so many only use monotubs, but these are pans and would require a slightly different monotub design from your normal cubensis (babayaga covers this, see post #1 link)..but this at least solved the problem for me. Hope to see pins within days or a week now.

The temp is still at a perfect 77 degrees all day and night, as the 77 temp still maintains easily even with the cracked window (40 degrees outside and 65 inside at night) and even with the rolled up portion of tent, this is due to the double lamp reptile heater.

An empty saucer next to the grow during the humidity cycling shows hardly any condensation when the timer is OFF and then it shows some moisture but not wetness like you want when ON.

For the first time I've seen tiny pools of water (that were forming during the day) at the bottom of the tent floor on the stand finally evaporate, now it's dry, I was lacking any kind of FAE or evaporation before, and evaporation is a pinning trigger.

New optimal Settings:
(1) variable speed pc fan at bottom of tent set to 2.5 (lowest setting, reduced from previous too high of 7)
(2) monsoon humidifier set to "2"
(3) ceiling fan in room set to "low"

In other words, just about everything set to "2" from the 2 inches of tent brought up, to the 2 on humidifier and 2 on pc fan.

Pic 1: rolled up the bottom of tent a tiny bit to allow FAE
Pic 2: cracked a nearby window slightly all the time
Pic 3: timer, push in every other button so that you get 1/2 hour ON and 1/2 hour OFF of the humidifier just like the gordotek grow.


Edited by tregar (01/08/24 10:23 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28616743 - 01/10/24 06:40 PM (17 days, 36 minutes ago)

the elasticaltiger said:
Quote:

Any fruits yet?


Yes! finally today I came home and there are pins finally all over the trays!

mwj12977 said:
Quote:

Biggest issue I had with pans was the temperature difference between cubes. I was trying to colonize cubes and pans in the same space. Cube myc was taking off and the pans were not. Once I figured that out it was all good. It also colonized much slower than I was used to with cubes. I’m no expert and could be completely wrong here but raising the temps made them respond and gave me the desired results. As far as fruiting everything was in the same Martha and it all worked out well. Glad you posted this thread! I got some good info and insight from the community. I thank you for that and everyone for their thoughts.


Thanks mwj12977, the temp is at a constant 77 to 79 degrees in the tent even with the fan at the bottom of the tent on super low (2.5 lowest level) even though it's 40 degrees outside.

Yes, I'm super excited now, thanks for watching and tips elasticaltiger and mwj12977.

Got rid of the 24 hour rainforest conditions that got me no where for 1.5 week, did the following 2 days ago:

1. Cracking the window made all the difference for FAE, I lowered the crack in the window from 1" down to just 1/4" crack, and it allows in plenty of fresh air yet no noise from outside, and the crack is hidden well behind the blinds, yet loads of fresh air can now enter the room! I can even feel the wind coming in from the crack.

2. lowered the fresh air gap at the bottom of the tent from 2" down to just 1/2" opening, this allows around 3 plus or so fresh air exchanges per hour, which is great for pans, the 2" opening was overkill.

3. Installed one of those super bright LED strings from a reel and put it on a 12 hour time ON from 7am till 8pm.

I came home today after just 2 days of the above changes, and see pins all over the place, even on the sides of the pyrex, they all point upwards towards the light. I so happy to see pins as I've never seen a mushroom pin in all my life.

Super excited as I was loosing faith, this has been a long months long project with lots of learning curves.

Pic 1: Tent is rolled up 1/2" at bottom to allow FAE in, and CO2 to exit.
Pic 2: A reel of LED lights was suspended above the trays, super bright, no more having to open any curtains, as the light coming into room was just not enough anyways.
Pic 3:  A window near the martha tent is cracked 1/4" at all times to allow FAE into the room



For those who experience anxiety on shrooms...If you take shrooms along with 70mg of pure thh or tetrahydroharmine, not only does it eliminate anxiety, add crystal clear clarity, increased euphoria, but the shroom trip is extended by hours, done it countless times myself, absolutely incredible gorgeous experience. Thh is a psychedelic sri not maoi found in cappi. Damn near perfect psychedelic combo....other than that mescaline is all ready the perfect psychedelic, drank cactus tea over 150 times over many years. I love that it lasts incredibly long allready.


Edited by tregar (01/13/24 01:44 AM)


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28628508 - 01/20/24 12:18 PM (7 days, 6 hours ago)

The tent for me at least has been a complete disaster, too many variable to contend with, nothing but aborts and no fruiting what so ever, side pins, even with a timer on a humidifier that goes up to 97% for 1/2 hour ON then down to 82% for 1/2 hour OFF has still not worked, and these are supposed to be optimum conditions for pan cyan. Variables that drive me crazy: how fast should fan run at bottom for FAE ?, how much of an opening on tent bottom ?, too moist ? too dry ? who knows..

I've switched to simplicity below, the tent can always be used to hold and grow grain jars, agar petri dishes, etc. at optimum temps.

Uses simply a sterile 54 quart (22.5 x 16 x 12.75") or a sterile 32 quart (18.5 x 14 7/8 x 11 1/8") tub

Sterilite 54 or 32 Quart Clear Gasket Box with Blue Latches & Gasket

--> Bod's Unmodified Monotub TEK:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22337800/fpart/1/vc/1

Bod said "This tub fruiting method is extremely low maintenance. No fanning is required, mist if needed, which will be infrequently. The lid is NOT latched down, EVER."

--> Baba Yaga Panaeolus in monotubs:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27637997/vc/1

Baba Yaga said "Member kirkeng convinced me with his well performing unmodified tubs to give unmodded a try and I have to say that these are my new favorites. With those I fruit right at spawn and run subs without a casing. The lid goes on upside down."

Just grow pan cyans in unmodified sterlite 54 or 32 quart tubs, the lid does on upside down.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28630769 - 01/22/24 08:29 AM (5 days, 10 hours ago)

Elasticaltiger said:
Quote:

Tregar, you went into this with so much confidence. What was your experience with growing mushrooms before? I wish you had reached out to the community for help with the issues you were encountering.

How did you select your cultures for the grow? Is there anything salvageable? It sounds like you just needed help dialing in the martha. The TCs tend to really try and dissuade new growers from automated setups for the reasons you've mentioned. They can be notoriously difficult to dial in.

I hope the tubs work out for you.



Elasticaltiger...I've always been a good chemist, but really suck at growing all things, it's always been like that, give me something to extract, no problem, but I can't grow a darn thing.

I need help. I turned off the fan at the bottom of the martha tent, and turned on the ceiling fan to MEDIUM setting in the room, and changed tent bottom opening from 1.5" to 2.5".

This might be helping? the humidity goes up to 97 quickly while on 1/2 humidifier ON then down to 90 when OFF, perhaps it was drying out too quickly before, as humidity was dropping to 75 or 80 before. Now at least, it stays at 90 while off even when cold outside, this is more like the humidity parameters Asura used.

I will see how this works.

The window is still cracked 1/4" to allow fresh air into room also (depending on temp outside).

I don't know if the unmodified tubs will work during the winter as it get's down to 60 degrees in room at night, at least the tent stays warm.

Fresh air easily enters the tent from the bottom part that is rolled up due to ceiling fan running on MED, it's more of a slower air exchange which is what I think I needed, as things were drying up too quickly before.

I'll open up another colonized mycobag, put into tent and case 1/2 of it with just a few mm casing, other 1/2 of it uncased to see how it goes.

The fully colonized jars received only a few mm of casing and have also not reponding with pins or fruits at all, I'm hoping this modification with FAE helps.

It really sucks that I had clean grains, spawn and 100% still clean and colonized substrate in not only dishes (which I have since moved into aluminum cake pans) but jars as well. I did the hard part fine, people say fruiting is supposed to be easy, but just the opposite for me, may give up for good, to see no results. Work long weeks, work out twice a week as life long bodybuilder, little free time, just loosing faith in all this down the drain work. I've drank cactus tea over 150 times over many years, if this doesn't work, gonna stick with my cactus, just thought it might be possible to have an alternative as my rare cactus only provides so many limited opportunities for tripping, which have all exceeded my expectations anyways. The zero nausea Ayahausca capsules always work great, so either way I can just go back to what I'm used to....just took on more that I can handle.


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Re: Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD [Re: tregar]
    #28635846 - 01/26/24 04:31 PM (1 day, 2 hours ago)

This is my thread on 50 pan cyan trip reports and combo with 70mg THH or pure tetrahydroharmine:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28108398/fpart/1/vc/1

Sterilite 54 or 32 Quart Clear Gasket Box with Blue Latches & Gasket

--> Bod's Unmodified Monotub TEK:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22337800/fpart/1/vc/1

Bod said "This tub fruiting method is extremely low maintenance. No fanning is required, mist if needed, which will be infrequently. The lid is NOT latched down, EVER."

--> Baba Yaga Panaeolus in monotubs:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27637997/vc/1

Baba Yaga said "Member kirkeng convinced me with his well performing unmodified tubs to give unmodded a try and I have to say that these are my new favorites. With those I fruit right at spawn and run subs without a casing. The lid goes on upside down."
------------------------------------------------------------
Great news!

I ditched the martha tent (only use it to grow out grains, jars, or mycobags, love both). As I had to throw out the cake pan from the attempted fruit in martha tent due to it just not fruiting, lack of pins. Too many variables to adjust and trial and error for a martha at least for this beginner.

And put the estero pan cyan substrate cakes which I birthed and 2 new estero pan cyan completely colonized substrate from the mycobags into 2 cake pans, this is what they look like only 3 days later, almost reconsolidated back together as pure white snow all over the top.

And bought 2 of the 54 quart sterilite clear gasket tubs, put the birthed cakes into it, along with the 2 cake pans.

I put programmable seedling heat mats under the tub but separated by can lids, so not touching, set thermostat to keep it at 80 degrees below, and the tubs stay at 76 degrees even when it's 55 degrees outside and around 70 degrees F inside the house at night. The air outside is humid due to lots of rain outside recently.

Punched holes in a piece of box cardboard to run the LED string light that comes on a reel, and plugged it into the timer that turns it on from 7am till 7pm.

The lid is of course put on upside down as per Bod's tek in first link below, ceiling fan off but I do keep the window cracked 1/4" behind the blinds which lets in a bit of fresh air from outside.

I misted only once the 1st day, and already see baby mushrooms all over the 7 jar cakes, the 2 cake pans should finish substrate reconsolidation after being moved from 100% colonized mycobag to the cake pans in about 3 more days, the mycelium is moving super fast to make it like snow all over the top.

Here is an estero pan cyan mushroom I picked from one of the cakes already.

I did not have any pins or mushrooms what so ever using expensive humidifiers and dual reptile heater at bottom with adjustable fan, while using the martha tent for almost over a month now...and all the sudden after moving into the Bod's tubs I have mushrooms in just 2 days!

The humidity stays between 94 to 99% all the time in the tub and the temp at 76 degrees F as I have electronic temp/humidity gauges in each tub.

I am so excited as the martha tent did not work for me, but the tubs rule at least in my case, so happy! I see baby mushrooms popping up all over the cakes just since yesterday!

Thank you Bod and Baba Yaga !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Pic 1: I'm growing in two of the 54 quart sterlite tubs, and it's working !!!
Pic 2: Inside of one of the two tubs, the 7 birthed cakes the very first day they were put into tub, no mushrooms 1st day, but by next day, I have baby mushrooms all over the cakes, will take another pic when full grown.
Pic 3: I have a Vivo Home seedling heat mat 10" x 20.75" under each tub with can lids as spacers, and they fit perfectly and keep it perfect temp inside even with it being 55 degrees outside.
Pic 4: This estero pan cyan mushroom was picked already.
Pic 5: Piece of cardboard with punched holes on each end from large box with LED strip light reel is the lighting fixture.
Pic 6: Timer to keep lights on for 12 hours
Pic 7: LED strip light reel for price of a movie ticket.
Pic 8: Programmable seedling heat mat set to 80 degrees F underneath jar lids keeps it 76 degrees inside tubs during this January winter, even when it dips down to 50 degrees outside and 68 degrees in the house at night. Temp sensor probe for mats is stuffed underneath the heat mat itself as seen in 1st and 5th photos.
Pic 9: My pan cyan substrate broken up and added from mycobag seen fully reconsolidated in the cake pans or pyrex dish after 6 days.
Pic 10: Even adding a bit of grown out mycelium grain to jars full of sterilized horse poo/straw/vermiculite substrate become colonized in record time. I simply bought pre-packaged and pre-pasteurized 2.5 lbs bags of horse poo mixture substrate on line, added 2 cups or so to each pint jar, put lids on, sterilized at 15 psi for 1 hour, then in front of flow hood, poured some mycelium grain in, shook up, and it colonizes in a week.
Pic 11: The wide mouth jar cultivation lids with injection port and 0.2 micron filter can be bought on line for super cheap
Pic 12 and 13: The grain I started with, added wedges from Florida estero pan cyan agar plates to grain in front of flow hood. 

 


Edited by tregar (01/27/24 07:07 AM)


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