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OfflineNorthernsoul
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Question about Buddhism
    #2809234 - 06/19/04 07:08 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Am I right when try to explain Buddhism to others, that it is pretty much just the study of the human mind, and by studying it, bringing releif to all of the most common psycological setbacks alot of us face?

If someone here knows a decent amount about this subject, please answer:)

Thanks


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: Northernsoul]
    #2809263 - 06/19/04 07:19 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

oversimplifying it this way can help
but
the right approach is to review the the noble eightfold path.

coming at it like you have done leaves it in an academic exposure, and there is more to this "study" than intellection.

eventually you get at there being just 3 things that go wrong at any moment (hatred greed and delusion) and if you can find a knwoledgeable source Abhidhamma or the high dharma, which is all about mental states and mind moments.

so you are right but the only thing that can be approached suddenly is satori or the study of the 8fold path.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: Northernsoul]
    #2809282 - 06/19/04 07:24 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Why would you try to explain something to others that you do not really understand?


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OfflineNorthernsoul
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: redgreenvines]
    #2809283 - 06/19/04 07:25 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

So just go with the formula, or, way that is proven to work, and dont try to intelectualise it or it will be subject to academic scrutiny?


Here is something Ive written that goes more into how I understand it all....
4 nobel truths:

In laymens terms:"1. There is Suffering, 2) There is a Cause of suffering, 3) Theres an end to suffering, 4)Theres a way to end suffering.....so, 1) We inevitably reach a point in our lives where we'll say "Life Sucks", Why?, From 2) craving after things, or clinging to thaughts, which never truly satisfy born from unrealistic images of life....life being imperminent, and interconected, yet we try to make it out that it isnt. Nevertheless, 3) every human being can free themselves from continual dissatifaction. How?? By recognising the truth we resist facing, and to actualize that truth." In my words: If you learn that life is truely difficult, it can become less dificult. And if you practice Buddhism, some people can get to absolute happiness within a year, some within 5 years. It took the origional Buddha 4-6 years...so...But when you get to that point, you could just sit around being completely happy, but your expected to share your knowledge with others, so they can get there....Im not there yet, but I still share what I know to you and to others becuase that part of it...


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: Northernsoul]
    #2809322 - 06/19/04 07:48 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

you should definitely share
I meant to say that the first statement was towards the intellectual and missed the body of buddhism which is in the 8fold path.
I have found huge gems in abhidhamma (intellectually) and in practice of vipassana - (experientially).
but it is not about achieving *happiness* or about finally *accomplishing* something both of which might be objects of craving.
It is about a personal path and awaking to ongoing discovery.
The jewels are just milestones or mines depending on your position.


Edited by redgreenvines (06/19/04 07:49 PM)


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OfflineNorthernsoul
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: redgreenvines]
    #2811347 - 06/20/04 04:23 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Ok, I'll go from there.

Sounds like you you have been practicing quite a bit, no?

Have you read the book Buddhism: Plain and Simple by Steve Hagen?
I found it to be pretty good.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: Northernsoul]
    #2811387 - 06/20/04 05:05 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I do like to practice.
I used to read a lot of related books.
In the last few years I like anything by Joko Beck - who connects it very well to modern mentality - cross all ages and genders and classes - very clever, but I adore some older ones too, Heart of Buddhist Meditation (by naponika thera - maybe the wrong book I am thinking now), and of course stuff about abhidhamma with graphic fold outs was good in the 70's - also used to like evans wentz for Tibetan Yoga.
mostly I read blogs now, science fiction and magazines.
Life is its own oracle.


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OfflineNorthernsoul
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: redgreenvines]
    #2811390 - 06/20/04 05:08 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Guess Ill pm you if i have any more questions. Thanks


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: Northernsoul]
    #2813431 - 06/21/04 10:40 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Three major schools of Buddhism exist today:
Mahayana (Great Vehicle)
Theravada (The remaining one of 12 schools that were collectively the Hinayana or Small Vehicle)
Vajrayana (Diamond [or Thunderbolt] Vehicle)

The Mahayana claims the largest number of adherents, and over time has taken on some theistic-like elements wherein Buddha has been deified and is sometimes prayed to. Mahayana still holds to basic tenets like the Eightfold Path and Four Noble Truths.

The Theravadin school is located for the most part in southeast Asia - Thailand, Cambodia, Viet Nam. This form is still a monastic form of Buddhism with pretty much original attitudes about working out one's own liberation - no relying on heavenly intervention, grace, celestial beings, etc.

Vajrayana is Tibetan Buddhism in four schools: Kargyutpa [Kagyu or Red Cap], Gelugpa [Yellow Cap], Nyingmapa, and Sakya. I am more familiar with the Kargyutpa of which Lama Anagarika Govinda was perhaps the most meticulous writer of the 20th century [we corresponded over my Doctoral dissertation which was based on his Foundations book]. The Vajrayana elaborates the different 'levels' of consciousness that the universe is constructed of, and details the psychic centers through which we humans are ourselves made through these psychocosmic 'nodes' or interfaces with the universe. This form of Buddhism, and Lama Govinda's works in particular have been the most helpful in the understanding of my Psychedelic Experiences over 30 years. And, Govinda wrote the preface to Leary et als. book 'The Psychedelic Experience.' Of books on Vajrayana I recommend two of Lama Govinda's: (1) Foundations of Tibetan Mysticism and (2) Psychological Attitudes To Early Buddhist Philosophy. Neither are easy and require true study. The 'Lama' title exceeds the 'Geshe' title which is like a Ph.D. But, the Ascending and Descending movements before-during-after Enlightenment, and the Vajrayana treatment of psychic centers (chakras) are two of the most important teachings that have transformed my understanding of psychospiritual development in ANY tradition.

The complexities of the Vajrayana usually appeal to those interested in paranormal and occult phenomena and psychology. On the other end of the continuum, and not regarded as in the same way as the above three forms of Buddhism is Zen. Zen, the Japanese form of the earlier Chinese Ch'an, which was influenced by Taoism, is non-esoteric, non-intellectual, pristinely simple, but decidedly Japanese in flavor. Buddhism was introduce to China by Bodhidharma, who who Japanese refer to as Daruma. Tibet, located between India and China, draws on the static symbols of the Indian Yoga and upon the fluidic circulation of 'Chi' [Prana] from Taoist Yoga and Alchemy, to form a unique Yoga. My bias is evident here, but I hope this brief synopsis helps. (BTW, I do not consider Nichirin Soshu to be Buddhists any more than I consider Branch Davidians to be Christians, but both cults would disagree with me). Peace.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #2813457 - 06/21/04 10:55 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

True thanks for the memory jog Foundations of Tibetan Mysticism was by Anagarika Govinda is terrific - highly reccommended.
thanks marktheagnostic good call!
also agree with this (BTW, I do not consider Nichirin Soshu to be Buddhists any more than I consider Branch Davidians to be Christians, but both cults would disagree with me).


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: redgreenvines]
    #2814554 - 06/21/04 05:44 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

"marktheagnostic" - projective Freudian slip?
gnostic - one who knows
agnostic - one who does not know


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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OfflineOddish
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #2814577 - 06/21/04 05:51 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
"marktheagnostic" - projective Freudian slip?
gnostic    -  one who knows
agnostic  -  one who does not know





CAUGHT!  :tongue:


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: redgreenvines]
    #2814763 - 06/21/04 07:14 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

redgreen: If you mention the practice of 'vipassana', you should add the practice of 'samatha', too. They go hand in hand and are the essentials of buddhism meditation, if I may add my humble notification :smile:
northern: It's about silencing the human mind for afterwards clear recognizing different 'themes' more neutrally.

As far as I understood, buddhism is almost everytime about 'affection' and its overcome, if this, in its condensed meaning, is not too much simplyfied.


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
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"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Question about Buddhism [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #2814801 - 06/21/04 07:31 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

you are 100% right, but the first 20 minutes of any vipassana practice is samatha anyway whether you drive with your indicator on or not. they do call it as samatha-vipassana.
I was being short.


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