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InvisibleMoonshoe
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the crack in the cosmic egg
    #2808408 - 06/19/04 09:26 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

has anyone read the book "a crack in the cosmic egg'? i picked this one up a while ago and enjoyed it alot, although it was sometimes a tough read.

Basically the guy's assertion is that our world is governed by a personal paradigm and a consensual/social paradigm, both of which are sort of beyond our control.

His belief is that our society imprints us from birth with the cultural description of reality, until we are able to maintain that description within ourselves. He says this 'description' is just that, one way of describing or looking at reality, and no more valid than the millions of other possible descriptions.

For example, a child born into a tribe of australian aborigines inherits a reality description based on animistic, spiritual 'dream time ' principles. around that childs twelfth year, he/she will be capable of maintaining that reality with or without the presence of the social group that originally created it. That child will live his entire life in a world where spirits, omens etc are as real as the nose on his face.

Those of us in the western world, However, who are imprinted with an "empirical/logical" paradigm or even a "monotheistic/dogmatic" one, will see and live in a totally different reality. Neither reality is more 'real', but they do have different benefits or draw backs.

the western paradigm has given birth to amazing medicines, airplanes, allowed us to put men on the moon. It has also given birth to generations of unmotivated (or money motivated) , apathetic, ignorant, obese people , not to mention the nucleur bomb and all kinds of other bullshit.

The aborigine reality doesnt give them a framework to develop airplanes, but it does allow them to do all kinds of other things not possible in our reality, not to mention a social structure that gives them a much more real sense of connection to their history and their world than ours usually does.

The author also makes another point: The consensual reality is limiting us. That is, just as our own personal paradigm, largely inherited without our consent, prevents us from certain perceptions, so does the cultural reality prevent us from certain things.

ok that was not well put... let me try again.

The author believes that reality is an evolving process, a two way process that occurs when the observed and the observer interact. "as above so below"... his claim is that not all aspects or possibilities of reality that we have discoverd were always there, rather they were created when they were concieved of.

Lets return to the airplane... at one point, in fact for most of history, the airplane, or mechanistic flight in general, was considerd an impossibility. Then one day, someone concieved of a new physical law that might make aircraft possible. If that idea occurs at a favourable time, then maybe, just maybe, it will be realized.

What he is saying though is that the man who invented aircraft (i know it wasnt just one) didnt actually DISCOVER a physical law, but actually CREATED it by the act of his mental conception.

This is heavy stuff, and coming from me it may sound silly, but he supports it with numerous sources and examples. Some of the stuff is totally mind blowing, and i know some of you on this board would get alot out of it.

Ever read Carlos Castaneda? remember when he talks about the TONAl and the NAGUAL, using stuff on a table as an illustration? every single thing that carlos is able to name falls in the realm of the tonal, because the tonal is the cosmic egg, the personal/cultural paradigm, and anything that he can percieve therefore falls within that egg's realm. However, it is possible to crack that egg, and let a little piece of the nagual, the unknowable infinity, seep in to our tiny little egg and expand it just a little.

The implications are inconcievable...

Has anyone else read this book, the original or the reprint? what did you think of it?

Peace
:mushroom2:


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Moonshoe]
    #2808464 - 06/19/04 10:46 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

he is right to a point.

the mind is equipped with so much plasticity.

what is mystifying is that we change so little
even those of us who use entheogens rarely
take advantage of the additional plasticiy of mind.

relying on conditioning and consensual reality forms
is a very strong habit, and social structures are
redeemingly habit forming.

where it acts most strongly is in setting up social rejection of criminality - murder stealing and the like.

I am sure a small percentage of aircraft engineers can emerge from aboriginal societies given an adequate population. Those who can do it are rare in any society


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: redgreenvines]
    #2808479 - 06/19/04 11:03 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

"I am sure a small percentage of aircraft engineers can emerge from aboriginal societies given an adequate population. Those who can do it are rare in any society "

of course i didnt mean to say that aboriginals are somehow incapable of doing mathematics, engineering or quantum physics for that matter, simply that their cultural reality structure does not push them that way, as they are raised to focus on hunting, gathering, and various spiritual aspects of life, and therefore there is little "raw material" for them to sculpt into something like an airplane or chemistry,

just as it is possible for a westerner to achieve satori, enlightenment etc, its just that our culture provides us with so little raw material or information that we could divert to that end.

just to make sure no one thinks im racist or summat


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Moonshoe]
    #2808560 - 06/19/04 12:23 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

there are real crimes
then there are the "hurtful walls" created by behaviour of self and others; but the plasticity of mind is so beyond becoming truly victimized by the latter.
the former needs attention by a vigilant society, so you end up with rigidity here and there.
hard to keep it all in perspective all the time.


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Invisiblevampirism
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Moonshoe]
    #2808573 - 06/19/04 12:32 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

hmm interesting

"... his claim is that not all aspects or possibilities of reality that we have discoverd were always there, rather they were created when they were concieved of."

i had recently been pondering this, but i didn't get it from any source like him or his book.. IMO its related to the concept in quantum physics where in some cases one photon is emitted but splits, and the first to be observed becomes the "real" one, and the other disappears.. Read that in a science article a year or two back


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OfflineMixomatosis
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Moonshoe]
    #2808582 - 06/19/04 12:38 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

but actually CREATED it by the act of his mental conception.

Well, it's pretty clear that the author wants to make this concept he's explaining sound more amazing than it actually is..

But I know what he's saying. Take qi gong.. like the microcosmic orbit. The microcosmic orbit is the energy circuit that goes up the back over the top of the head, down the front to the groin and then back up the back. The "truth" is that there is an energetic tendency in this direction, but there is no individual "thread" of energy that goes up and down in a well-defined line. Through meditation the qi gong practitioner "creates" this energy circuit, and once it has been created uses it as part of a method to further health, intent, martial arts, or whatever.

Same with the meridians of the body. There are different accupuncture theories that use 12 meridians, or 8. This doesn't mean that one is wrong and the other right, but one theory may use the 12 meridian system because with it the healer is able to accomplish a certain treatment with it and not the other.

In my own practice of martial arts and qi gong, everyday I'm practicing a qi gong aimed at developing the dan tian (1.5 inches below the belly button) which is the centre of the movement of the body as well as an important energetic area in Chinese medicine (and various other disciplines). By using awareness to "create" this ball of energy in my belly, then I'm able to more and more integrate this area into my martial arts and use it as a nexus between all my limbs to develop full body power.

So there ya go.. the way I'm seeing martial arts is the same way your author is seeing things. I'm using my mind to create a system within which I can gain superior control over my body, and it works!

When I tell people to get a method and practice it till they die this is what I'm talking about.


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Offlineexclusive58
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Mixomatosis]
    #2808694 - 06/19/04 01:47 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

finding a method is harder than practicing it...i doubt that you just told yourself one day, "hey maaannn, karate looks way coool, ima start practicing some until the day i die".


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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: exclusive58]
    #2808739 - 06/19/04 02:27 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Mixamatosis: i think thats pretty fuckin amazing man. What he's saying is that anything can work. All those energy lines and meridians that your talking about using to get effective results didnt always exist, they were invented, and made real. Thats amazing, and the possibilities are unlimited. We define our own limits.

and someone above mentioned quantum physics. This is a large part of the evidence he uses to back his theories, but i dont know shit about quantum physics so i left out that part.

Amazing book for real


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Moonshoe]
    #2808765 - 06/19/04 02:44 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

We define our own limits.

Meaning what? Jump off a high-enough cliff and you will get killed just like men did in pre-history. Gravity has not changed one iota. Yes, you can strap on a hang-glider, but that is about understanding aerodynamics, not about redefining anything.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinepattern
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Moonshoe]
    #2808787 - 06/19/04 03:03 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

What he is saying though is that the man who invented aircraft (i know it wasnt just one) didnt actually DISCOVER a physical law, but actually CREATED it by the act of his mental conception.




Hmmm... where's the proof of this?

If it's true, then why cant I make up a new physical law just by mentally conceiving it?


--------------------
man = monkey + mushroom


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: pattern]
    #2808794 - 06/19/04 03:05 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

some reverse syllogisms
i.e.
not good thinking


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OfflineGrav
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Moonshoe]
    #2809066 - 06/19/04 05:55 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Is that the same guy that wrote about the Dangers of 'cracking the cosmic egg' ?

About how if you break out of your social reality you will be greeted not by limitless euphoria, but by an infinite void of nothingness that stretches on forever in which you lose all perception of your personal self... in other words, by breaking your ego's chains you destroy everything you ever knew and loved.

Who is the author anyways?


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OfflineMixomatosis
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: Moonshoe]
    #2809949 - 06/20/04 12:29 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

All those energy lines and meridians that your talking about using to get effective results didnt always exist, they were invented, and made real.
well... no they weren't made, they were made a part of my reality. The inventor of sailing didn't create wind.. he created an internal reality within which he could conceive the invention of the sail.


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OfflineMixomatosis
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Re: the crack in the cosmic egg [Re: exclusive58]
    #2809955 - 06/20/04 12:31 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

finding a method is harder than practicing it
Well, they don't just fall out of the sky, you may have to go looking.


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