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YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains * 81
    #28052502 -

Below is a chart I put together for low prep methods for various grains. To me, soaking, boiling, draining and drying are all a waste of time. For the most part, I measure my grains, add water, then lid/foil and into the PC. For a lot of these grains, it is that simple, for others, a little extra care is needed. These #s are what work for me, you might need small adjustments for your materials. I will also add, smaller jars are more carefree than larger. Edit: when you bring your PC to temperature,  use a medium+ heat, this may help reduce burst grains The values below are grain:water.

Grain        1/4 Pint                Quart              Lb

Millet        2Tbsp:1Tbsp      1 1/3C:158ml
   
Milo/Sorghum  2Tbsp:21ml.      1 1/3C:210ml

Oats          2Tbsp:17ml      1 1/3C:175ml

Pearled barley 25g:15ml                        1lb:270ml

Rye            2Tbsp:22ml      1 1/3C:230ml

RGS            2Tbsp:13ml      1 1/3C:150ml

Wheat          2Tbsp:22ml      1 1/3C:240ml

WBR            25g:17ml                          1lb:275ml

WBS            2Tbsp:16ml      1 1/3C:165ml

Quinoa, from ReverendMyc's post.

"I like 1 to 1 by weight which in this test was 100 grams (about 1/2 cup) grain to 100 ml water in pint jars"


Millet: a great choice for no prep, cheap and easy to work with. It is 2:1 seed:water by volume.

Milo: Kind of a pain to work with but seems to be good for spawn and great for drying later.

Oats: Many love or hate these grains. They are easy to work with, a good price and work really well for hearty spawn.

Pearled barley: I added this one mostly for edible mycelium TEKs, should be done in bags.

Rye: Another great choice, it is easy to work with,  just grain + water.

RGS: Surprisingly easy to work with, measure  it is 2:1 seed:water ratio by volume. I use RGS for high spawn rate with low nutrition.

Wheat: Another classic, a little sticky and hard to shake though. Not the best for big jars but great in bags.

Whole Brown Rice (WBR): Another grain I use mostly for edible mycelium TEK. Should use bags for this one.

Wild Bird Seed (WBS): I've warmed up to WBS alot lately. Give it a whack on the lid to get the grain puck loose then a good shake.

Rinsing:  For grains that need rinsing, you  need cold water, a scale and a strainer. For single jars, add your grains to the jar, place jar on scale and rezero your scale. Keep the scale "awake" while you rinse your grains. Put your jar back on the rezeroed scale and add your water (1ml=1g).

You could also find the weight of your grains + jar and add water weight. Rinse with cold water to your heart's content, drain, don't worry about drying. I have a small mesh strainer the fits inside the jars mouth to drain with. Reweigh your jar and top with water til you reach your right weight (jar + dried grain weight + water weight). As an example, if your jar and dry grains weigh 550g and you are adding 200ml water (200g), your jar should weigh 750g after rinsing/draining then topping off.  If you normally make multiple jars, consider with the first round weighing them all and taking the average. Just use that average for this and the next runs.



Some final thoughts, no prep will save you tons of time and effort. The grains will not come out evenly hydrated, some will be drier, a few will have burst, some even leave a film in the jar,  it is all fine. Of the grains tested, millet, oats, rye and RGS were the easiest to work with then WBS, milo and wheat. Also, maybe anecdotal but grain mixes, seem to work better, two I use a lot are:

I start most of my agar on this grain mix, in  a quarter pint jar, add

1 Tbsp oats
1 Tbsp rye
19ml water

PC 90min @15psi

Here it was dumped on MS Starry Night agar



I G2G the quarter pints to these pints then use them to bulk or you could G2G to quarts.

In a pint
2 Tbsp oats
2 Tbsp rye
2 Tbsp millet
2 Tbsp RGS
66ml water

PC 90 min @ 15 psi



With MS Starry Night



I hope you will try a jar of no prep your next PC cycle and let me know how it works out.

Cheers!

Some conversions

1 1/3 C = 315.45ml
2 Tbsp = 29.57 ml
1 lb = 454.59 g

Some pics:

Millet

1/4 Pt

(photo coming)

Pt w/Fp+



Qt w/PExAPEU



Milo

1/4 Pt w Fp+



W/MS Starry Night



Pt w/Bell capped subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU unfortunately I started to shake the jar right before the pic.



Oats

1/4 Pt w MS Starry Night



Oats dumped on Natalensis agar



Pt w/Alutacea



Qt w/Subtropicalis



Pearled barley

Lb w/ Subtropicalis



Rye

1/4 Pt w/Fp+



Pt w/Yellow subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU



RGS

1/4 Pt w/Pan bisporus



1/2 Pt w/Pan 'Trop Aus'



Pt w/MS Starry Night



Qt w/Pan bisporus



Wheat

1/4 Pt w/MS Starry Night



W/Yellow subaeruginosa



W/Natalensis



Pt w/Gymnopilus purpuratus



Qt w/PExAPEU



WBR

Lb w/Subtropicalis



WBS
1/4 Pt w/PExAPEU



W/Yellow subaeruginosa



W/Subtropicalis


Pt w/W/Yellow subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU


Edited by YoshiTrainer (01/26/25 08:00 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28052505 -

Way to go yoshi! Great write up!
:raisemyglass:


--------------------
I am not crazy, I prefer the term mentally hillarious.

Agar - The way to go!
Clean spawn checklist
Proper Surface Moisture
Recognizing and dealing with contamination
πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Shrimps] * 1
    #28052526 -

Great write up! :mushroom2:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: fungusul] * 1
    #28052577 -

Very nice


--------------------
Asante’s woodlover patch
Moricz cellar
D3’s agar tek
A woodlover genetic theory
holofracatl's Woodlover grows
Tweeq's woodlover grow
Liloldme's grow

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Land Trout] * 1
    #28052590 -

good stuff Yoshi :rockon:

Will give some of this a try for sure on the next grain order, always been shy to do no prep but you convinced me to give it a go now

:cheers:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: SingularFusion] * 1
    #28053312 -

Thank you guys, hopefully it helps!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 7
    #28053327 -

Yeah i think grain prep is a wast of time also, i use this for wheat,and rye


Nobody does it like me
1 cup wheat
1 cup water
1cup vermiculite

Cook in mushroom grow bags for an hour and a half 15 psi ,let cool and inoculate in front of flowhood
After bags are fully colonized i put in greenhouse
enjoy mushrooms

No grain prep no soaking no extra steps other than what I’ve said

Close bags up like this before you cook and leave them like this to colonize


My martha set up
Light on 24/7
80Β°
Humidity on for 15 minutes off for 1/2 hour



Some of my all wheat grows















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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: 99.99] * 2
    #28053712 -

That is cool 99.99 and some sweet pics!

You could probably get away with using milo or oats too w/out any changes to your recipe.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 4
    #28053777 -

Great write up!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: fahtster]
    #28054211 -

Thank you Faht!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28054264 -

Great write-up indeed Yoshi.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: DERRAYLD]
    #28054909 -

Thank you Derrayld!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28055120 -

Awesome info. Glad to see such a great resource for the "no prep" gang.

:freewilly:


--------------------

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: thumbsy] * 1
    #28055168 -

Quite an excellent contribution, many thanks! :takingnotes:


--------------------
So anyway, uh...

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: So Anyway] * 1
    #28055614 -

:rockon:


--------------------

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: labbar]
    #28055843 -

Thank you guys!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28055875 -

just in case anyone else here uses alpiste ive been running no-prep experiments and the best ratio seems to be 400g seed to 130g water


--------------------
Confused? Well now you can!
HHG - cheapest way to start - how i roll

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28056056 -

Cool write up Yoshi, I've got some millet I'm itching to try with some LC that is looking really nice.

For the pint jars is PC 90min @15psi good or should it maybe go 2 hours?

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bajazly]
    #28056230 -

Thank you guys, I'm hopeful to hear some reports come in about how it works for others.

@Bajazly, I do up to quart size jars for 90 min @15 psi with no problems.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28056288 -

YoshiTrainer said:
Thank you guys, I'm hopeful to hear some reports come in about how it works for others.

@Bajazly, I do up to quart size jars for 90 min @15 psi with no problems.


Sounds good. I need to test the LC on some agar and I'll report back in a week or two.

Thanks for the quick reply.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28057293 -

What a gem, like tht barley is there been using pot barley with good success

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: zmicroinquisitor] * 1
    #28057352 -

Nice write up I hope this will save 1/2 the total 4 hours a day I spend making 15x bags/~1850 gr of soaked/rinsed (hot tap)/drained/laid out/box fan dried of whole oats.  I'll get back with ya on it with same grains/bag, same LC shot into them side by side in production scale.  Worst case scenario is I waste 15 bags, 25 bucks in grain, a few hours figuring out how to do something faster, better, and more efficient... or not  :smile:  TY for the test idea!

UPDATE - Mon Nov 21 17:30:16 MST 2022:  Test #1 (6x bags, in Presto 23 qt PC) of 1800 gr (1040/760 grams of whole oat/hot tap, 26:19) per bag (5 lb capacity, .2 micron) is now unloaded, cooling.  PC'ed for 2.5 hours @ 15 psi, 8600 elev.  Not many, if any, busted hulls, not much mush, grains a bit darker than I'm accustomed with SOP grains after 24 hours in PC cooling.  Grains did 'dry a bit' after completely cooling, maybe absorbed into hulls. A tiny bit of 'mush' on the bottom of the bags, might need to dial back %H2O by 1% or so.  Grain bags went in at exactly 1800 grams, and came out plus or minus 1 gram.  Trials bags look dirty compared to SOP bags.  Also handling hot was new to me, had to be gentle and was concerned about stretching/ripping them apart.  Light handling was used.  Production % up 20% (could fit easily 6 bags into the PC, vs 5 with presoaked), time reduced by 1.5 hours of work.  I can now schedule in a long day with this 'same day' process, 4 cycles over 13 hours.  This means 2 days to do the work that often would take 1 week.  72 bags each day, 144 bags in 2 long days, and take the rest of the week off.

Next up...  side-by-side inoc of these bags with SOP bags, along with long term storage/viability trials of these trial bags (I've had SOP bags stored for 6-12 months without contam, used, and gone to production).  The key points are immediate use, short and long term production use, as well as viability to customers over time stored, shipped, etc.  So far the no soak/no rinse has saved me 1.5 hours a production cycle.  Keep fingers crossed it all works through production/fruiting/storage and sales.  I pray this works.



I also found these videos useful:

 


UPDATE: Mon Nov 28 10:31:50 MST 2022

I've done trials this past week on no soak, and I'm not happy with the quality, and higher risk of contam/etc.Β  Going to stick with what I have been doing, the 24 hr cold soak/strain and 5x *HOT* water rinse/1 hour layout and air dry/bag 1800 gr into 6mm thick, .2 micron/PC for 2.5 hour @ 15 psi/24 hour cooling, unpack, seal/shoot and tape, etc.Β  Better looking bag, less handling of 'hot' materials, and doesn't require me to do this with hood/sterile room procedures.Β  Just easier, simpler.Β  Tumbling by hand of very hot bags is not of interest to me long or short term.  Yes, this is most costly on time, no question, but the end result is what I'm after and there is a significant visual differences, and very likely increased risks involved (I'm not going to fruit test to verify my considerations on this topic, so buyer beware on speculation here).

If I value my time at 25 per hour, which is pretty low even for a hobby 'business', my per grain spawn (uninoculated) bag production costs are $7.73 per bag.Β  So, it would make sense in the Spring or next Fall for me to hire it out instead, and likely will.  Found someone that does this exact process mentioned above for 8 per bag at ~4 lb per bag like mine.  So now with 200+ bags and set for the Winter months, I'll likely change over to purchasing 1600 USD worth of bags instead of making my own.

This has been a good learning experience, and I really appreciate the thread of discussion, helping me realize doing everything myself is not necessarily in my own best interests or to the hobby either.  If I value my time in other aspect of the hobby, or free time, its time to turn this over to someone else with what I consider to be (at least using bags) a better and cleaner, more sterile procedure.

Edited by SDO (11/28/22 10:39 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: SDO]
    #28057448 -

Thank you guys!

SDO, that'd be awesome to cut back your workload like that!  On the occasions I've done large bags of grain, it seems like they used a little less water than jars. Plus if you use heavy amounts of LC, maybe cut back your hydration water just a few ml?

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28058223 -

Thanks for the chart! Inspired me to give no prep a shot, gona run a batch of wheat jars today :rockon:


--------------------
Check your vector

Gummies by milkboy
Milkboys Public Display of Affection
I'm a Semp


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28058246 -

You got me excited, but then lost me when you listed a volume of oats. I don’t know how much that is! Can you clarify with weights for oats? Thanks for the effort you put into this!
YoshiTrainer said:
Below is a chart I put together for no or low prep methods for various grains. To me, soaking, boiling, draining and drying are all a waste of time. For the most part, I measure my grains, add water, then lid/foil and into the PC. For a lot of these grains, it is that simple, for others, a little extra care is needed. With some grains, a pinch of gypsum seems to help, some need rinsing, a few need to be shaken while still hot. These #s are what work for me, you might need small adjustments for your materials. I will also add, smaller jars are more carefree than larger. The values below are grain:water.

Grain        1/4 Pint                Pint              Lb

Millet        2Tbsp:1Tbsp      1 1/3C:160ml
   
Milo          2Tbsp:20ml      1 1/3C:200ml

Oats          2Tbsp:20ml      1 1/3C:200ml

Pearled barley 25g:15ml                                1lb:270ml

Rye            2Tbsp:20ml      1 1/3C:200ml

RGS            2Tbsp:13ml      1 1/3C:150ml

Wheat          2Tbsp:20ml      1 1/3C:200ml

WBR            25g:17ml                                1lb:275ml

WBS            2Tbsp:20ml      1 1/3C:190ml

Millet: a great choice for no prep, cheap and easy to work with. It is 2:1 seed:water by volume, you can let it cool completely in the PC before using.

Milo: Kind of a pain to work with but seems to be good for spawn. Milo benefits from 1tsp of gyp per Qt and a shaking the jar while still hot, after the PC cycle.

Oats: Many love or hate these grains. They are a great price and work really well for hearty spawn. Fairly easy to work with, a warm shake is helpful but not necessary.

Pearled barley: I added this one mostly for edible mycelium TEKs, should be done in bags.

Rye: Another great choice, it is easy to work with,  just grain + water, allow to cool in PC.

RGS: Surprisingly easy to work with, measure  it is a heavy 2 to a light 1 seed:water ratio by volume. I use RGS for high spawn rate with low nutrition.

Wheat: Another classic, fairly easy to work with, it does benefit from a warm shake after PC.

Whole Brown Rice (WBR): Another grain I use mostly for edible mycelium TEK. Should use bags for this one.

Wild Bird Seed (WBS): This tends to be dirty and needs rinsing, especially if it has cracked corn in it. It also takes 1tsp gypsum per Qt and must be shaken while hot.

Rinsing:  For grains that need rinsing, like WBS, you  need cold water, a scale and a strainer. For single jars, add your grains to the jar and weigh it (jar + dried grain). To that # add the weight of the water you will be adding (1ml=1g). The sum will be the final weight of your jar.  Rinse with cold water to your heart's content, drain, don't worry about drying. I have a small mesh strainer the fits inside the jars mouth to drain with. Reweigh your jar and top with water til you reach your right weight (jar + dried grain weight + water weight). As an example, if your jar and dry grains weigh 550g and you are adding 200ml water (200g), your jar should weigh 750g after rinsing/draining then topping off.  If you normally make multiple jars, consider with the first round weighing them all and taking the average. Just use that average for this and the next runs.



Some final thoughts, no prep will save you tons of time and effort. The grains will not come out evenly hydrated, some will be drier, a few will have burst, some even leave a film in the jar,  it is all fine. Of the grains tested, millet, rye and RGS were the easiest to work with then oats, wheat, milo and WBS. Also, maybe anecdotal but grain mixes, seem to work better, two I use a lot are:

I start most of my agar on this grain mix, in  a quarter pint jar, add

1 Tbsp oats
1 Tbsp rye
20ml water

PC 90min @15psi

Here it was dumped on MS Starry Night agar



I G2G the quarter pints to these pints then use them to bulk or you could G2G to quarts.

In a pint
2 Tbsp oats
2 Tbsp rye
2 Tbsp millet
2 Tbsp RGS
66ml water

PC 90 min @ 15 psi



With MS Starry Night



I hope you will try a jar of no prep your next PC cycle and let me know how it works out.

Cheers!

Some conversions

1 1/3 C = 236.59 ml
2 Tbsp = 29.57 ml
1 lb = 454.59 g

Some pics:

Millet

1/4 Pt

(photo coming)

Pt w/Fp+



Qt w/PExAPEU



Milo

1/4 Pt w Fp+



W/MS Starry Night



Pt w/Bell capped subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU unfortunately I started to shake the jar right before the pic.



Oats

1/4 Pt w MS Starry Night



Oats dumped on Natalensis agar



Pt w/Alutacea



Qt w/Subtropicalis



Pearled barley

Lb w/ Subtropicalis



Rye

1/4 Pt w/Fp+



Pt w/Yellow subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU



RGS

1/4 Pt w/Pan bisporus



1/2 Pt w/Pan 'Trop Aus'



Pt w/MS Starry Night



Qt w/Pan bisporus



Wheat

1/4 Pt w/MS Starry Night



W/Yellow subaeruginosa



W/Natalensis



Pt w/Gymnopilus purpuratus



Qt w/PExAPEU



WBR

Lb w/Subtropicalis



WBS
1/4 Pt w/PExAPEU



W/Yellow subaeruginosa



W/Subtropicalis


Pt w/W/Yellow subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU




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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Suckatshrooms] * 5
    #28058397 -

wat possessed you to quote the entire OP for that comment :shrug:


--------------------
Confused? Well now you can!
HHG - cheapest way to start - how i roll

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: bakedbeings]
    #28058713 -

Good luck Milkboy, shake them hot if you can, it makes life MUCH easier!

Suckatshrooms, I did volume measurements because they are much faster, especially if you are doing multiple jars. Near the bottom of the post, before all the pictures, I put metric conversions for volume. Good luck!

Some conversions

1 1/3 C = 236.59 ml
2 Tbsp = 29.57 ml
1 lb = 454.59 g


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28058735 -

Will do! Did 3 no prep, and 3 with a pre wash. In the PC now...


--------------------
Check your vector

Gummies by milkboy
Milkboys Public Display of Affection
I'm a Semp


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy]
    #28059076 -

Think I may have used to much water... bottom 1/4 inch of all my jars are burst grain cakes that dont wana break up :shrug:


--------------------
Check your vector

Gummies by milkboy
Milkboys Public Display of Affection
I'm a Semp


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy]
    #28059110 -

I'm sorry to hear that Milkboy, I do get some burst grains but not a solid layer of them. Maybe cut back 5ml of water for your materials? If the wheat was really dirty, you could try rinsing it first. Hopefully your jars will colonize fine and you wont be disuaded from trying no-prep again.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28059453 -

Well half of them I did rinse so I dont think it was that, no worries will try again in a few days.


--------------------
Check your vector

Gummies by milkboy
Milkboys Public Display of Affection
I'm a Semp


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy] * 1
    #28059503 -

Hey Sry guys maybe im dumb xD

How much Water did i need for how much Rye grain in a how big jar?

how big does my glass have to be?
How much rye must go in there then? Half full or 3/4 or completely full?
And then how much water per how much rye?

From the table above I can not figure out
Sorry I am not a native english speaker

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: BirkenSaft] * 1
    #28059742 -

Hello BirkenSaft,

Pint jar = 473ml
Quart jar = 946ml

For a pint jar add 2/3C rye = 160ml and 100ml water

For  quart jar add 1 1/3C rye = 320ml and 200ml water.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
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Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy] * 1
    #28059752 -

milkboy said:
Well half of them I did rinse so I dont think it was that, no worries will try again in a few days.


I wonder if heating of the PC makes a difference? I usually put mine a little over medium to bring to boil. I used to get cracked jars on occasion and this was my remedy. Maybe a slower rate to boil might allow the grains to absorb water better, kind of like a mini boil? Did you use gypsum?

Thank you again for your input Milkboy, your data will help get the kinks out!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28059785 -

Interesting idea, I do run my stove cranked all the way up through venting and building of pressure so maybe your on to something...

To be clear I used 1 and 1/3 cup of wheat and 200g (ml) water for my qt jars, Ill snap a pic of the jars later if I remember

Edit.


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Edited by milkboy (11/19/22 10:09 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy]
    #28059834 -

Hmmmm interesting, maybe it is the heating? None of the grains I've run ended like that.

Edit: I used red and it looks like you used white wheat but I don't think that makes a difference.

Edit#2: With wheat, id guess you wouldnt need to rinse, unless you noticed a lot of chaff or other debris with your last batch.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
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Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
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Edited by YoshiTrainer (11/19/22 11:33 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28060061 -

Im pretty sure its red wheat actually (not that I think it matters), the light is just deceptive. Yea I agree rinse isnt necessary water is always clear, just a habbit I had from using oats for so long.

Interested to see if the heat change helps makes sense that it could. Only other thing is maybe my measurements were way off (outside the margin of error maybe?), 1 and 1/3 cups of wheat weighed out to about 270g in each jar with a margin of 10-20grams.


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy] * 1
    #28060243 -

Did a few Qts of no prep with WBR last night, turned out just fine and saved a lot of time. Just a little clumping on the bottom. :thumbup:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: WellDuYaPunk]
    #28060449 -

Thank you for the report WellDuYa, I'm glad it worked out for you!


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28062313 -

Well... it happened again. Used medium heat and same result. Ran a 2nd jar with 175ml water, same shit just slightly less thick of a layer, so Im thinking its just to much water. Im blaming the wheat though


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy] * 1
    #28062405 -

Well poop, I'm sorry to hear that Milkboy! I made some wheat pints for tonight, in solidarity with you. I also made a couple oat jars for nostalgia. I'll get pics later, I'll also grab a pic of my wheat for comparison.

Thank you for trying again.


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28062489 -

This is awesome yoshi! Thanks for sharing.

Have you had success with these ratios with bigger grain bags?


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: mind.at.large]
    #28063058 -

Hello Mind.at.large, so far I've only done up to 3 pound bags. They seem do fine but use slightly less water.

Milkboy, I tell you hwhat. You might not know this but sometimes I am a complete dumbass! Did you try hot shaking your wheat jars? Your first jars were the right ratio just needed a thorough shake. I made some pints and allowed them to completely cool in the PC w/out shaking. Though smaller jars are easier, I still had some solid pucks of grain in the bottom of the jars like you. You made it right the first time! :smile:

To be honest I hadn't taken pictures of the bottoms of my jars but they do look like yours. I was able to break up the cold grains with shaking but it did take effort. There was a mix of hydration levels with the grains and a film on the inside of the jar but that is all fine. I G2G from 1/4 pints and shook again. I did 3 jars of wheat and 2 of oats. BTW, Oats were much easier to shake.

WHEAT











OATS











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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28063066 -

I shook them all once the pressure equals out and I can open my PC, so hot i used oven mitts lol. Shook em till I broke a sweat, no cigar. Dumped the first batch and honestly it was alot of effot to even just spoon those grains out. Maybe its just my wheat, ima run a 3rd and final test with 150ml of water and see what happens...


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy]
    #28063106 -

Thank you for trying Milkboy, I really appreciate your effort!!! Maybe just try 1 jar so you dont waste anymore time or materials. I don't think 150ml is going to work any better but I hope I am wrong, good luck! I don't think it is a difference in grains either. Here are some wheat pics, BTW 1 1/3C of wheat weighed 268g.





Before the PC

Wheat



Oats



It is weird they did not break up when you gave them the hot shake. I wonder if a tsp of gypsum would help, it does wonders for WBS. I'm no Hulk but I did manage to break up the pucks of cold grains with some effort.

Thank you again!

I may have to run a couple wheat quarts next!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28063305 -

This post has confirmed my measurements are right, fuck me I have no idea. I dont have gypsum so if thats what it needs Ima just go back to prepping lol.


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy]
    #28063461 -

Thank you again for trying Milkboy, i do appreciate your efforts!

I smack them on the lids to get the grain puck off the bottom of the jar before I try ye ol' shake and break. Maybe?

If not, I'm at a loss and this will haunt me til my dying day.....


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28063498 -

Im offended you lack faith in my shaking abilities, :lol: But as Im sitting here boiling grains I realized its probably because Im running 18 psi on my PC :facepalm3: I believe thats the only thing Im doing differently.


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy]
    #28063775 -

I know nothing of your shaking abilities. Though he has good technique, I don't think this guy could break up the grains. πŸ˜€

:prettyflyforawhiteguy:

Do you have a magnet or coins on your PC rocker? Next run for me will be another quart of wheat!


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy] * 2
    #28063779 -

Thanks yoshi I’ll try out some no prep bags when I’m back home and report back!

Milkboy, have you ever thought of throwing some vermiculite into the jars before hand? Just a thought but it might help with the clumps. You might have to adjust water ratio though


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: mind.at.large]
    #28063793 -

milkboy do you roll and shake your jars before PCing?


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: bakedbeings]
    #28063814 -

YoshiTrainer said:
I know nothing of your shaking abilities. Though he has good technique, I don't think this guy could break up the grains. πŸ˜€

:prettyflyforawhiteguy:

Do you have a magnet or coins on your PC rocker? Next run for me will be another quart of wheat!


Yes 50 cents, ill do a trial without my upgrade and see if thats the culprit..

mind.at.large said:
Thanks yoshi I’ll try out some no prep bags when I’m back home and report back!

Milkboy, have you ever thought of throwing some vermiculite into the jars before hand? Just a thought but it might help with the clumps. You might have to adjust water ratio though


Naw I dont have verm



bakedbeings said:
milkboy do you roll and shake your jars before PCing?


I did to some of them to see if I needed to, they all clumped.


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy] * 1
    #28063882 -

Love it! Thanks πŸ’œ


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: WellDuYaPunk]
    #28063981 -

WellDuYaPunk said:
Did a few Qts of no prep with WBR last night, turned out just fine and saved a lot of time. Just a little clumping on the bottom. :thumbup:


Did you do jars or bags?  I know this tek says to use bags but I have a lot of jars and no bags lol

Edited by SunGuy (11/21/22 08:49 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: cozmyc]
    #28063988 -

If one dislikes devils advocates... skip this post.

I love the thoroughness of this post. Thanks for all the work.

I do however need to note... zero TC's have commented here. Might I take a stab at why....

Larger grains need to be thoroughly hydrated to get sterilized properly. The grains at the top of these jars do not get the hydration the grains at the bottom do... leaving under-hydrated starches in the kernels. Dry starch has a hard time getting sterile in a PC.

It needs to be noted that half the images you post here are of very unhealthy colonization, which speaks very poorly to your position that standard grain prep can be avoided.

I have gone down your road.... thinking why do all these folks do these things that seem like extra work. Well... they arrived there after decades of trial and error.

Two threads that might be of interest to folks regarding creating excellent spawn:

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27382275

and

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27187543

These threads changed my world. I'd still be growing mold if not for them.

I learned some things from all of the effort in this post... and I loooove being cutting corners, but nothing here has pulled me from hydrating my grains pre-PC'ing. All my success has come from properly doing grain prep.


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: SunGuy]
    #28064151 -

SunGuy said:
WellDuYaPunk said:
Did a few Qts of no prep with WBR last night, turned out just fine and saved a lot of time. Just a little clumping on the bottom. :thumbup:


Did you do jars or bags?  I know this tek says to use bags but I have a lot of jars and no bags lol


SunGuy, I've done WBR and pearled barley in jars up to pint size. Because their is no husk to the grains, they want to stick, shake while hot if you can.

Thank you for your input Tedoro. I'd agree not all of the grains are properly hydrated but after the shake it doesn't seem to matter. I'd invite you to give a jar of no-prep a try, there is even a ratio for WBS.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
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Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28066031 -

Thank you for updating your post SDO and doing the extra tests too.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28057352#28057352

I'm really curious about the longterm storage of the PCed bags. I run some long term mycelium bags and have been lucky so far but that is different.

Since you are using bags, I don't think you need to crumble them while hot.

If your grains are really dirty you could probably do a bulk rinse with cold water. Since you know the final weight of your bags with grain and water, if you found the volume of your dried grain it'd seem to be easy. Let's say for example the weight of your oats equaled 3C by volume. You could pour your measured (by weight) amount of grains for all your bags into your sink or strainer. Rinse all you'd like, drain and scoop by volume into the bags. Then just top them with water til you hit the right weight.

Hopefully they perform well as is and you may save even more time w/out rinsing.

I can't wait to see the results!


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 3
    #28066038 -

Milkboy, I ran a QT of wheat last night and let it cool completely in the PC. My dial read 17-18 psi for 90min. I'll takes more pics tonight.



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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28067555 -

M-F/N jar of wheat cracked, ran another today, stay tuned!


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28067591 -

:rofl: the struggle is real


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28068658 -

Thank you thank you thank you so much for all your hard work and knowledge you're sharing this is awesome

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: nobeer]
    #28068704 -

Thank you for your kind words Nobeer, I hope it works as well for you and others as it does for me!

Good luck!


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28068781 -

Here is a quart of wheat, 1 1/3C grain to 200ml water, PC 90min, the gauge was 17-18psi and allowed to cool completely in the PC. Thankfully the jar didn't crack because I'm almost out of wheat. It was a piece of cake to break it up, only took like 3 whacks...... πŸ˜€

Wheat definitely needs to be added to the hot shake list with milo and WBS. It took me about 3 minutes of work and some cursing but I got it. Did I mention oats are easier? πŸ˜€

This is not directed at anyone specific, only added for information purposes.

Straight from the cold PC







A few whacks on the lid while rotating the jar gets the grain puck loose.



A combination of whacking the bottom sides and the top while rotating, gets the grain puck on it's side. Then it is on!



The grains stuck to the jar a bit.



After the G2G and another shake. Not bad for a cold jar and when the myc expands, I'll shake again.



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Edited by YoshiTrainer (11/25/22 12:43 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28068788 -

So I can follow directions, but Im just weak af :lol:  Thanks for the test yoshi but Ima stick to boiling my grains...


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: milkboy] * 2
    #28068795 -

Selfie



Thank you again Milkboy for all your efforts, I really appreciate it! If you ever go back to oats, give it a try!


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28075341 -

Thank you for your second update SDO,

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28057352#28057352

I appreciate your input. I'm glad you found a way to cut even more time from your work day. I'd like to add that oats do not need a hot shake in jars or crumble in a bag. For bags, because of their pliability, you could get away with letting any of the grains listed above cool completely in your PC. Good luck!

Wheat pint jars G2G on 11/20, (L-R) sus looking Fp+, MS Starry Night, Subtropicalis



Oat pint jars G2G on 11/20 both Fp+



Wheat quart from 11/24, Caerulescens 'CN" (from dried grain)





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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28076899 -

Well, now, that definitely changes things a bit.  When the PCs (3x with 6 bags of ~1800 gr each) are at or below 1 psi, they are cooled and pulling some atmosphere into the containers, but still very hot ...  I open, immediately pull and seal bags.  Shaking the bags over and over a period of time (1-2 mins initial for each, maybe 3-4 times over 30 mins) is very time consuming and tedious.  So I'll trial overnight cool (as I do in other process) in the PCs, and trial side-by-side with soak/hotrinse/etc.  TY for the suggestion.

Edited by SDO (11/30/22 07:45 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: SDO]
    #28077291 -

You are welcome SDO, I hope it works the way you need! This evening, I'm running small bags of rye and oats to set aside without adding mycelium. You have me curious about long-term storage vs contamination.

I'm also running a pint of wheat to test if slightly more water would make cold shaking easier.


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28081167 -

Here are a couple bags of no-prep grains for longterm storage, without inoculation. Top to bottom, WBS, oats, rye. The grain prep was designed for immediate usage so this has me curious, thank you SDO.



A little more water to the wheat prep seemed to make it easier to cold shake. I'll do another run with just a touch more to see what happens.



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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28081438 -

Finally got around to freeing up some time to try this out today.

So, you say Millet  1 1/3C:160ml water for a pint but when I put the millet in the jars they are 3/4 plus full. How much will millet expand? Seems like there is going to be little room for a shake later.

All I have is pint jars right now and I'm pretty sure you weren't referring to do this in quart jars, right?

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bajazly] * 1
    #28081456 -

been doing no prep for a long while, much better than prepping..i believe it's called "forced hydration".  the water turns to steam at such high temps and have nowhere to go but inside the grain.   

for rye, i add exactly 75% of water by weight.  works in bags and jars.  perfect everytime. for quart jars of rye, i'll add 8 ounces of dry rye grain and 6 ounces of water.  you also won't be extracting your nutrients and pouring them down the drain.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: trippleblack]
    #28081508 -

Bajazly said:
Finally got around to freeing up some time to try this out today.

So, you say Millet  1 1/3C:160ml water for a pint but when I put the millet in the jars they are 3/4 plus full. How much will millet expand? Seems like there is going to be little room for a shake later.

All I have is pint jars right now and I'm pretty sure you weren't referring to do this in quart jars, right?


The 1 1/3C:160ml is for quart jars, for pints 2/3C:80ml. Good luck!

trippleblack said:
been doing no prep for a long while, much better than prepping..i believe it's called "forced hydration".  the water turns to steam at such high temps and have nowhere to go but inside the grain.   

for rye, i add exactly 75% of water by weight.  works in bags and jars.  perfect everytime. for quart jars of rye, i'll add 8 ounces of dry rye grain and 6 ounces of water.  you also won't be extracting your nutrients and pouring them down the drain.


Thank you for your input Trippleblack. Rye is such a great all around grain, especially for no-prepping. I agree with your other points too, people making grain water agar certainly emphasizes your last sentence.


--------------------
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Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28081526 -

Gotcha. I'll adjust and into the PC in a couple hours. I have a couple plate pins I grew out I'm going to throw in 4 jars and see how they come out.

Thanks and I'll post up when something is happening.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bajazly] * 1
    #28083535 -

This worked out pretty stellar but in each jar there is a large marble size chunk that won't break up. I let them cool overnight in the PC, would giving them a hot shake help with the clumps next time? or a little more water?

Don't think the myc will care but time will tell I guess.


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bajazly] * 1
    #28083609 -

Great write up Yoshi and photos of different grain options! I will be trying this when the time comes :-)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Cub3d]
    #28083748 -

Those look great Bajazly, nicely done! For the "large marbles", hot shakes are a pain in the backside and I try to avoid them if possible. The marbles seem to happen when most of the grain is broken up and providing padding for the "marbles". Sometimes if too big, I can shake them to top of the loose grains then hard shake. If they are not large, dont worry, the mycelium will colonize them with no trouble. Then when you do your next shake, they will most likely break up. Maybe a pinch of gypsum or tiny amount of water might help too?

I can't wait to see what you do with them next!

Thank you Cub3d, I hope it goes smoothly for you!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
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Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
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Edited by YoshiTrainer (12/04/22 06:35 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28083922 -

Thanks Yoshi. The padding from the other grains is a pain and I shook the ever loving shit out of them too. Tomorrow some agar wedges of a couple plate pins go in them. I'll hope for the break up on the next shake but if they colonize all will be good.

I'll post up some results in the near future. This was so easy to do and it will be the go to going forward.

Thanks again

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bajazly] * 1
    #28094422 -

The quart of 'CN' caerulescens on wheat from here

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28068781#28068781

is looking ready for bulk. I gave it one shake midway.



--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28094738 -

YoshiTrainer said:
The quart of 'CN' caerulescens on wheat from here

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28068781#28068781

is looking ready for bulk. I gave it one shake midway.




Yoshi,

Have you considered posting a photo of this jar in this forum for critique?

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27187543

I think you may find the responses from TC's very informative.


--------------------
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Deep pour soft agar plates-->bags of WBS-->Low Profile Monos
Clean spawn thread | Put a thermometer on your PC

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: tedoro] * 1
    #28095070 -

Hello Tedoro, the purpose of this thread is how no-prep grains work for me and hopefully others. People are welcome to try the ratios I have offered and report back here with their personal experiences, whether positive or negative. Though it did not work how he liked, I really appreciate Milkboy for the time and effort he took to try the prep before offering his personal experience. It has inspired me to fine tune the wheat prep.

As for the quart of Psilocybe caerulescens 'Chicon Nindo' on no-prep wheat, since the mycelium has a different appearance than cube myc, it might be more appropriate to post here

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24834839

Or here

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25874536

If you'd like to try any of the grain prep methods above and report back here with your first-hand experience, I welcome it.

If you'd like to post your caerulescens grows, the thread linked to above is a wonderful place.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28096004 -

Awesome, I absolutely love the chart, it's going to be very helpful! Thank you one more time!  :thumbup:


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Milonaire Mycology]
    #28096053 -

Thank you Milo, good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28108978 -

These are the 4 jars I did up 2 1/2 weeks ago. This is a little under 3 days after the second shake and they seem to be doing pretty well I think. Most of the bigger clumps seem to have broken up fairly well too. Think I'm gonna do 1:3 on these to see how they go, the 1:2 I've been doing hasn't worked out quite as good as I hoped so guess I'll find out.

2 are from 1 plate pin and 2 are from another plate pin I grew out on agar so I'm hoping for a decent canopy in the two SBs.



I have 2 other jars I no prepped of red millet I threw a whole plate pin in each and those are looking good too, so far I'm really liking this grain prep method. Super quick and easy working very well so far.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bajazly]
    #28109301 -

Thank you for the update, I'm glad things are moving smoothly for you Bajazly! Good luck with the bulk runs!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28224619 -

Hi Yoshi, I have used this method with success, thank you for posting it. The jars colonize and I haven't had any contamination, but there is one issue, the rye grains get very sticky and clump up, the only way to get them out of the jar when fully colonized is to cut up the mycelium with a knife. Any tips on how to stop it from being sticky? I do shake them after PCing, when they cooled down enough that I can touch them. But they still clump up strongly in the end and won't release easily from shaking. I don't want to bash the glass jars too hard because they might break. Later I will get millet as I heard they are better for this method, but for now I have tons of rye to work through.

Edited by sara98 (03/11/23 02:10 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: sara98]
    #28224923 -

Hello Sara98, thank you for giving this method a try! I revised some of the volumes for water slightly, including for rye. Plus, rye shouldnt need a warm shake and make sure youre using wide mouth jars. You do need to whack you jars a bit to get the grains and eventually mycelium to break up. Please do be careful though! Plus give your jars a quick look for any cracks. I initially whack the lid to get the grain mass off the bottom of the jars. Then the bottom corners, where the two bottom and side edges meet is pretty solid. A few more whacks and some shaking should take care of the rest.

Millet is also very good but rye should work just fine for you while you have it.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28224928 -

Here is and update on the bags of grain I PCed on 12/2 and sealed w/out inoculation.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28081167#28081167.

Other than the cracked corn getting a little squishy in the WBS, they all look good.



--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28226907 -

Cleaned up your chart a little. If you use code blocks, it'll use a monospace font and things will line up:

Code:

Grain              1/4 Pint        Pint              Lb

Millet             2Tbsp:1Tbsp     1 1/3C:160ml
   
Milo               2Tbsp:20ml      1 1/3C:200ml

Oats               2Tbsp:17ml      1 1/3C:175ml

Pearled barley     25g:15ml                          1lb:270ml

Rye                2Tbsp:21ml      1 1/3C:210ml

RGS                2Tbsp:13ml      1 1/3C:150ml

Wheat              2Tbsp:22ml      1 1/3C:220ml

WBR                25g:17ml                          1lb:275ml

WBS                2Tbsp:16ml      1 1/3C:165ml


Might try this to use up the oats I have left. I would be doing them for 2.5 hours because it seems they're always bacterial. For quart jars: 0.75 quarts / 1.333 cups = 2.25, so I assume I'd add 175 * 2.25 = 393 mL water?


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πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό  πŸ„² πŸ…„ πŸ… πŸ„Έ πŸ„Ύ πŸ…„ πŸ…‚

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: dowodenum]
    #28227075 -

Thank you so much for taking the time to do that Dowodenum!

Are you doing quart jars of oats? If so, I do 1 1/3C dry oats then add 175ml water to the jar. Doing this amount leaves me room to spawn with g2g and still shake. If you use LC, you can push it up to 1 1/2C oats and about 190-195ml, depending how heavy you like to go w/LC.

Usually I do quarts for 1.5hrs but have done 2hrs no problem when I've run them along with subs in the PC too. Make sure you vent your PC well before adding the weight. I let my jars cool completely in the PC and shake them before and after inoculations. With your initial shake, start by smacking the lid a few times to get the grain puck off the bottom before giving it a solid shake.

As a test, I did a jar of wheat where I popped the grain puck off the bottom but left it solid. It colonized fine but took a bit of effort to get it to break up and come out of the jar. (Oats are easier!) So if your grains aren't completely broken up, don't worry.

Thank you again and good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28227119 -

Thought 1 β…“ cup was for pint jars? Oh, room for G2G sorry, misread. I mainly do A2G right now.

Thanks!


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πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό  πŸ„² πŸ…„ πŸ… πŸ„Έ πŸ„Ύ πŸ…„ πŸ…‚

Edited by dowodenum (03/12/23 11:56 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: dowodenum]
    #28227608 -

No, 1 1/3 is for quarts with room for me to g2g. A2g you could increase to 1 1/2C if you'd like.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28270567 -

Quote:
Some conversions

1 1/3 C = 236.59 ml
2 Tbsp = 29.57 ml
1 lb = 454.59 g



Yoshi, I was reading this, with "1/3 C", you mean one third of a cup right. Around 80ml? Or maybe I'm not understanding :crazy:

Edit: 1+1/3 would be 315ml. I misunderstood..

I never tried no prep, although I have to say I really like spitballs rye prep.. but let me give this a try. Who knows maybe I'll like it, will try today :rockon:

Edited by 0t0lerance (04/10/23 12:40 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: 0t0lerance] * 1
    #28270651 -

Yes, 1 + 1/3C grain. I used a conversion calculator from the web so I hope it is correct! Thank you for trying it, I hope it goes smoothly! For rye you don't need to hot shake. When cooled, make sure you smack the lid a few times to move the grain puck from the bottom of the jar.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Edited by YoshiTrainer (04/10/23 02:43 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28324747 -

I updated the original post a little.

Here is Pan cyan 'Peace River' on pints of low prep oats, rye and WBS. The rye and WBS have a 3 day start on the oats.



--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28347388 -

What do you recommend for quarts of wbr? Would the lb recipe work?
Thanks

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: thespacecadet]
    #28348170 -

thespacecadet said:
What do you recommend for quarts of wbr? Would the lb recipe work?
Thanks


Hello SpaceCadet, shaking low-prep WBR in quart jars is going to be tough. The grains really want to stick together! I'd personally recommend using small bags, it makes crumbling a breeze. If you'd still like to try quart jars, it should be around 1 1/3C (9.7g) of grain to about 168ml water. You may have to make slight adjustments depending on your WBR.

Good luck and please let me know how it goes.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28350139 -

Thanks for the reply, I was going to go with wbr but ended up getting millet for about 1/2 the cost. So I will be using your method just with a different substrate.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: thespacecadet]
    #28350298 -

Good luck, millet is much easier to shake!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28355844 -

Something to look out for, because low-prep conserves all the grain's nutrition, mycelium growth can be thicker, more robust. If you are used to other prep methods, it may take a couple jars to get used to the appearance.

Bags of low-prep grain that were PCed but not inoculated, just past the 6 month mark.



Year old Natalensis on low-prep WBR and pearled barley



--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28356197 -

this all i do.. but i run rye and only rye, have used this method for several years. 

75% water content for rye grain bags with a 4 hour 15+ psi cook

that half hour makes a difference, used to use 3.5 hours.  glass jars, 75% water content too, cooked at 15psi for two hours.  or 8 pounds rye, 6 pounds water. 

anymore water than 75% for rye grain will turn to mush at the bottom.  if you notice some of the grain uncolonized, or uncolonized parts pushed against the glass or at the top of bag, -you may want to increase cook time.

Edited by trippleblack (06/11/23 08:32 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28356317 -

Very helpful! Much appreciated!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: mycolojay] * 1
    #28376010 -

Alright, went for it with oats. Ball 450ml jars.
Noticed 1 1/3c was way too much.. so went for 1cup. Which was also a bit too much, but I'm going agar to grain, so decided to try anyway.

The jars are 245gr.. 1 cup of oats up to 398gr.. with 131ml of water total weight 524gr. I did all jars exactly the same. PC for 1,5h. The grains on top look under hydrated, the grains at the bottom mush.


As the jars are too full to shake, I decided to keep them upside down, I hope some moisture will gets absorbed by the dry top grains. Ofcourse I couldn't fit jars on their side.. forgot and tried anyway.. heard water trickling and noticed my mistake. So 5 jars have been sitting overnight and are partially hydrated.. I gave them a good shake and processing them now. Curious to do a side by side and see if the grains come out the same or not.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: 0t0lerance]
    #28376023 -

I do this with oats in 1 quart jars, I fill the jar about half way with dry grain, add boiling water, and let them sit from 20 minutes to 12 hours, shaking them up after adding water and before putting into PC. I usually have enough room to shake up the grain after the PC or do that shaking twisting motion with your wrist to get all the grains even. after a day the moisture all balances out great.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Glomus]
    #28376674 -

Thank you so much Ot0 for trying this method, I'm sorry it didn't work quite like you wanted. Oats may be my favorite because they are easy to low-prep, usually. I'm surprised 1 1/3C dry oats was too much for a quart jar.  Forgive me for asking any dumb or redundant questions.

They are regular whole oats? They look like they are.

1 US quart jar is = to 946.353 ml, is your jar big enough?

175ml water per jar?

I'm really confused by this one, oats usually cooperate better. The less hydrated grains towards the top is normal. If you could have shaken, it'd be better, obviously but the grains should still work ok. I don't like that you can't shake and may consider dumping some grain right before adding the agar wedge?


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28377300 -

I think the confusion is that the column in your original post is labeled pint, not quart.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Imatryin]
    #28377336 -

Yeah although on page 3 you, Yoshi, use a quart, I did read every page and thought I would try 1/3 less.. but it should have been 3/4 cup for agar wedges instead of 1 cup.. so I don't have any room to shake at the moment.. but it's ok, I have reishi on it.. and that stuff grows fast. They are whole oats yes. The ratio should be the same.. 240/320 * 175 = 131ml for 1 cup oats. I did that...

Now I think about it, maybe the oats were more hydrated that they should be.. I recall some rain dripped on the bag in the past, so that could have messed it up. Also the oats hydrated overnight in the jars and shaken were more burst than the non-hydrated grains.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: 0t0lerance]
    #28377767 -

Thank you Imatryin, I've reread the original post many times yet somehow didn't notice that!

Thank you Ot0, it still has me scratching my head, I've been running a lot of oats and WBS lately and the oats come out just fine. It really has me curious what could be different. I would guess if your grains in the bag had been rained on they might mold or sprout?

0t0lerance said:
Alright, went for it with oats. Ball 450ml jars.


Dang it Ot0, I just went back and reread your post. In the second sentence, it looks like I screwed you up by having my column mislabeled! For that size of jar, it should be 2/3C grain to 87.5ml water. These are the size of jars I run for spawn too. If you are up for it, please give it one more try. Leaving them to sit in you PC before of after you run them, shouldn't be a problem either.

Reishi will definitely munch through that last batch!

L-R MexA & bisporus recovering from shake, Claketi and MexA after G2G, all oats.



--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28386225 -

I want to give this a shot.  It’s hot and I’d rather only one heating cycle in the kitchen

Question on oats - is 1.5 cups a dry measuring cup or a liquid measuring cup?

I use SSLC, so if I understand correctly, it’s 1.5 cups oats and 190ml of water?

Thanks - I hope this works!


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πŸ…ƒπŸ„΄πŸ„°πŸ„Ό  πŸ„²πŸ„»πŸ„ΈπŸ„½πŸ„ΆπŸ…†πŸ…πŸ„°πŸ„Ώ

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bobgas] * 1
    #28386484 -

Thanks for giving it a try Bobgas! Use dry measuring cups for the grains.

Bloomcounty!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28386659 -

Very interesting and saves a lot of time, and the kitchen don't need to be sealed off for the rest of the family!
Thank you, will try this next time πŸ„


--------------------
Understanding is enlightening, always be open to fresh input and diversity! Be a better man respect others as you would like to be respected.


"The greatest journey of exploration is to understand our own minds. #Exploration #Understanding #Mind

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Shromolo]
    #28386901 -

Good luck Shromolo, it is a huge time saver,  I hope it goes smoothly for you!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28387659 -

Awesome, thanks!  Just have to find the window of time to make it happening.  I’ll let you know how it goes…


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πŸ…ƒπŸ„΄πŸ„°πŸ„Ό  πŸ„²πŸ„»πŸ„ΈπŸ„½πŸ„ΆπŸ…†πŸ…πŸ„°πŸ„Ώ

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bobgas]
    #28387853 -

Would love to do this for soy beans.. prepped them yesterday. Soaked 7h, pc for 10min for max hydration, air dried. Then PC for 1,5h.. but the bains shrunk and the moisture collected on the bottom the jar .. the beans also turned a brown color..:confused: not sure if I can use it now for cordyceps.. probably messed something up there.. maybe I'll first soak them for 7h.. then quick boil, evap and and then pc them, I don't know. Ah well.. quick update on the oats.. reishi is gradually working it's way down.. but it's slow:

Edited by 0t0lerance (07/07/23 01:54 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: 0t0lerance]
    #28388292 -

Reishi is tough!

Sorry, no low-prep for beans or corn, maybe someday?


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28389561 -

Just finished running 16 qt jars of oats for 2.5 hours.  I plan to let them sit until the morning in the PC - can’t wait to see how they look.


--------------------
πŸ…ƒπŸ„΄πŸ„°πŸ„Ό  πŸ„²πŸ„»πŸ„ΈπŸ„½πŸ„ΆπŸ…†πŸ…πŸ„°πŸ„Ώ

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bobgas]
    #28399439 -

I'm considering trying this with rye.
Does rye need rinsing generally?

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: CorteX_]
    #28399503 -

Rye should not need rinsing, good luck Coetex!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28399579 -

Thanks! They're in the PC now, will update later :smile:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: CorteX_] * 1
    #28400227 -

I tried rye. And they came out well, thx Yoshi. This is a game changer.
What I did was measure as well as I could 158ml of oats and checked the weight.. same for water measured exactly 116ml.. apparently my scale was off as 116ml was not 116gr.. so I went with what every weight I ended up with.. e.g.
jar empty = 266gr + grain = 394gr + water = 524gr.. and did that for all jars. Worked great :strokebeard:

Edited by 0t0lerance (07/19/23 01:16 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: 0t0lerance] * 1
    #28400267 -


Not the most aesthetically pleasing, but that's some happy looking grain!
I shook them up while still hot to redistribute the grains and moisture like I always do when doing no prep millet.
Will nocc these tonight. Looking good so far.

Edited by CorteX_ (07/19/23 02:56 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: CorteX_] * 1
    #28400413 -

just ran a few quarts of oats last night following your tek Yoshi
200g oats : 175g water
90min at 15+ psi

Nice writeup :mushroom2:

I'll update with pics this evening, but they came out great

:chugbeer:


--------------------
All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I’m fine.
Whatever you decide won’t really impact our survival
Close your eyes, and do the best that you can

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Camera93]
    #28400596 -

Thank you for the updates, I'm glad it is working out for you guys!

If it makes it easier for you CorteX, you shouldn't need a hot shake.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28400771 -

Great stuff man.  Question tho, is it 230ml or 200ml water per 1-1/3 cups rye?  Saw both, figured I'd ask.


-Kingboomer


--------------------


I'm just a clown dancing to the sins of mankind.

-Captain Spaulding

Kamino project
Stasis Experiment
AIO recipe - work in progress

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: kingboomer]
    #28400814 -

Sorry Kingboomer, there has been some modifications with time. I try to keep the original post on the first page up to date with any changes.

For a quart jar of rye it is 1 1/3C grain plus 230ml(g) water.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28400819 -



--------------------
All I need are some tasty waves, a cool buzz, and I’m fine.
Whatever you decide won’t really impact our survival
Close your eyes, and do the best that you can

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28400873 -

YoshiTrainer said:
Sorry Kingboomer, there has been some modifications with time. I try to keep the original post on the first page up to date with any changes.

For a quart jar of rye it is 1 1/3C grain plus 230ml(g) water.

Good luck!




Perfect, many thanks!


-Kingboomer


--------------------


I'm just a clown dancing to the sins of mankind.

-Captain Spaulding

Kamino project
Stasis Experiment
AIO recipe - work in progress

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: kingboomer]
    #28400890 -

Looks great Camera!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28401461 -

Oh forgot to add this, 1 1/3 cup is not 236ml. 1 cup is about 236ml, whereas 1.33 cups is about 315ml. May wanna correct that.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: CorteX_]
    #28401589 -

Thanks Cortex, i changed it! Sometimes my head gets wedged in it's warm, dark, protective spot!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Edited by YoshiTrainer (07/20/23 09:13 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28408871 -


Great success!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: CorteX_]
    #28408893 -

Awesome Cortex, congratulations!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28424320 -

I gave this a go last night. I didn't have any gypsum to try but with taking the jars out with a towel and shaking when hot the oats mixed well.

I had one jar touching the side of the pressure cooker I noticed after; the grains were a lot wetter throughout the jar and what I can only describe as caramel-like.


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: cunningfox]
    #28424407 -

Thank you Cunningfox for giving it a try! You don't need gypsum or to shake while hot, especially for oats. I let mine cool completely in the PC and shake right before inoculating.

I can't see your pic on my phone but usually try to avoid the jars touching the sides of the PC to avoid the extra heat. It should be fine though.

Please let me know how it goes for you.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28424426 -

Ah don't think pic loaded... would the extra hot one have absorbed steam from the pressure cooker? I'll weigh them later as i'm sure there must be a weight difference.

I'm excited to see how the jars work




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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: cunningfox]
    #28424439 -

That one in the middle of the top and in the bottom pic does seem wet.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28424522 -

@Cunningfox, I was thinking about that jar, did it crack along where the side and bottom meet? That is the only time I can think of when my jars look like the wet one.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28424701 -

Thanks, it doesn't seem to have.. the only thing odd about it is a tiny thin piece of metal like wire at the lid thread... as I said, it was the only one touching the side. It still looks really wet though, I might just dump it as it seems too wet, all the others look good!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: cunningfox]
    #28424820 -

Smart to dump it, good luck with the rest!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: cunningfox]
    #28424822 -

Im trying this next time I do grains. Everything is easy but drying them is such a P.I.T.A!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: fatpup]
    #28424859 -

Good luck Fatpup!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28424884 -

Thanks, I looked at the jar again and you were right, there's a small crack at the base I must have missed. That must have been how the extra water got in, it's a fine crack at the moment but under pressure it must have been enough. I'll watch for those in future.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: cunningfox] * 1
    #28443763 -

Would this be possible with popcorn as well? If no one have tried I'll do a test 😊


--------------------
Understanding is enlightening, always be open to fresh input and diversity! Be a better man respect others as you would like to be respected.


"The greatest journey of exploration is to understand our own minds. #Exploration #Understanding #Mind

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Shromolo]
    #28443807 -

Hello Shromolo, I have not tried it with popcorn but I'd guess it should be possible? Please give it a try and report back. Maybe use smaller jars to allow you more variation in your prep ratios. If you have success with smaller jars, scale it up from there. Popcorn seems to expand alot when hydrated so I probably wouldn't fill my jars more than 1/4-1/3 full with dry grain.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Shromolo] * 1
    #28443809 -

Shromolo said:
Would this be possible with popcorn as well? If no one have tried I'll do a test 😊


I had them explode on me, popcorn takes a relatively long time to hydrate properly compared to other grains. This method is often called "no soak" if trying to search. In the book, "the mushroom cultivator" from 1984 Stamets used this method, this book is often called TMC if searching. Many people had poor results with exploded grains and a mush.

One method I used to do was heat a while, maybe even get to pressure and turn it off and leave it. After the lid can be removed I would take out jars and shake them, put them back in the warm PC, and then leave to cool overnight during which time they would usually absorb all the water. Then shake again the next day and PC.

I do most grains with equal weight grain, equal weight water. I did popcorn recently bringing to the boil and leaving sit for hours in water, I was only doing 100g. I put them in a jar with water in the fridge for a few days, strained and weighed to confirm they were now 200g, having absorbed 100g water.

Smaller jars are typically recommended to have more water.

In this old thread I discuss recommended water amounts from books and vendors (back when they would give recipes)
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/4371401

Edited by blackout (08/23/23 12:48 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: blackout]
    #28444208 -

Maybe just pour boiling water over rhem and close rhe jar. Make 2 - 1 with 75% water by weight and 1 with 85% water by weight.
And leave to set over night as #blackout mentioned :smile:
So I'll do rhe poure tonight and see what's happenings with the corn. I'll put the bars in PC medicinal waste bags just in case.

Just an idea, would it help to PC the glass laying down?


--------------------
Understanding is enlightening, always be open to fresh input and diversity! Be a better man respect others as you would like to be respected.


"The greatest journey of exploration is to understand our own minds. #Exploration #Understanding #Mind

Edited by Shromolo (08/23/23 05:54 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Shromolo]
    #28444453 -

PCing with jars on the side tends to push the water out of the jar rather than into the grains. Obviously I haven't tried it w/popcorn but I'd predict similar results.

Blackout has some very good suggestions!

Maybe you could put jars in PC, bring to boil, let sit overnight then PC in morn?

Sounds like some fun experiments!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28444622 -

Okay, so 2 glasses filled
100 grams of corn and 75 grams water.
100 grams of corn and 80 grams water.

I'll let them sit for 12 to 24 hours and see how they look.



--------------------
Understanding is enlightening, always be open to fresh input and diversity! Be a better man respect others as you would like to be respected.


"The greatest journey of exploration is to understand our own minds. #Exploration #Understanding #Mind

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Shromolo]
    #28446919 -

Shromolo said:
Okay, so 2 glasses filled
100 grams of corn and 75 grams water.
100 grams of corn and 80 grams water.

I'll let them sit for 12 to 24 hours and see how they look.


If everything was perfectly identical then I would expect the 80g water one to have absorbed a tiny bit more, due to the tiny amount of added pressure from the head height of water. (the difference should be miniscule, it is more a theoretical point)

I did wonder about pressurising containers with a significant pressure before to aid the hydration.

I did some tests on absorption without boiling years ago.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/4209009

this is another old one which may be of interest
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22076763

Edited by blackout (08/25/23 11:11 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: blackout] * 1
    #28447012 -

So rhis is the result so far.
Filled the glasses with boiling water.
Soaked for 20 hours, and shaked.
PC for 90 minutes.

75% water broke fairly easy.
80% I didn't manage to shake completly after cooking.

I'm gonna check the corn kernel a little later today to see if it was suffident with water, or if they need more pre boiling.

75 and 80% seen from the side


80% bottom :


First test, a fail!


--------------------
Understanding is enlightening, always be open to fresh input and diversity! Be a better man respect others as you would like to be respected.


"The greatest journey of exploration is to understand our own minds. #Exploration #Understanding #Mind

Edited by Shromolo (08/26/23 07:37 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Shromolo]
    #28447450 -

Shromolo said:
First test, a fail!


that is unfortunate, but glad to see you showing it, many will just not report stuff like this to save face. People need to see what is not advisable.

I saw similar results with mine. As I said it is harder to hydrate, so when it is cooking I picture a good layer of water in the bottom boiling away and the grains not absorbing it, so the bottom layer gets very hydrated and easily explodes. I see this with most of by grains, others reported it too, but all the more with popcorn. Those jars do not need to be totally dumped by the way, I had similar ones and colonised them, ignoring the bottom and was able to scoop out the good top section and leave the bottom area behind to be dumped.

Any failed jars can like this can also be taken out and rinsed off and heat treated again, a simple steaming will do if they were in a PC. This opens the possibility of lots of things, you can PC grains in a small PC in a small jar, then put those into lots of small container and steam in a very large pot.

The grain I think is most resistant to "exploding" is grass seed, and next would be brown rice but it also can explode.

If you are using LC to inoculate you can afford to purposely leave grains a little dry, and calculate water content and add in lots of LC. If grains are left drier than normal on purpose I would advise to heat treat for a longer time. By leaving grains dry I have added lots of LC and had really fast colonisation before.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28447974 -

I have a confession to make.

I used your ratios for rye but put 8 jars worth into the IP, then jarred and pced.  Here's the results:












Turned out perfect




-Kingboomer


--------------------


I'm just a clown dancing to the sins of mankind.

-Captain Spaulding

Kamino project
Stasis Experiment
AIO recipe - work in progress

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: kingboomer]
    #28448213 -

He'll yeah, thanks for reporting back and good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28448273 -

The tek works great for oats. Besides user error of filling up the jar too much they seem to work great!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: cunningfox]
    #28452986 -

I've stuck with trying this method as a backup for when I don't have a ton of time.  I've only really had fails so far; but, one of them was because I didn't wash my WBS at all, and it dirtied the jar... It was gross... So I went with rinsing the second time but I wasn't measuring weight (I didn't see the note to do that)

I keep getting clumps; but, I did the best I've done this time around, and I used the weighing method.

I did a pre-wash of my Wild Bird seed. Weighed the jar (Ball Quart Wide Mouth, no lid or ring) + Dry Grain and it totaled 702.2g. Target number is 867.2g when I add the water in.

Did that, PC'd and here's the result:



I had to shake it quite a bit to get this bottom clump broken up. And even then I'll probably have some clumps to deal with once it cools off.

1) Is this an expected result?
2) Should I scale back on water?
3) I am not planning on using this grain for the next few weeks. I'm doing the upside down metal lid tek. My thought process was that if it's finger tight (or looser) it would dry out the grain, so I wanted to keep it tight; but, I'm told that I just need to keep finger tight (and I can back up 1/8th a turn if I want).  What's the problem keeping fully tight if the water is sterile? Does it rot grain?

Thanks!

Edited by stakesalad (08/30/23 11:04 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: stakesalad]
    #28452998 -

Hello Stakesalad, thank you for giving this a try! By the #s it looks like you've done it right! The clump at the bottom is a pain to break up, sometimes worse than others. I blame the cracked corn and milo in the bird mix I use. There will be clumps but they colonize fine, break up in subsequent shakes and are crumbled during S->B. I've made jars and left the clump of grains on the bottom, they colonize fine but take a few extra days.

A couple tips you might already know, rinsing helps, after the jars are filled to the right combined weight (water+grain) give them a gentle swirl to mix and redistribute the sunflower seeds, they are your friends! After the PC and the jars have cooled, smack the lid while rotating the jar to get the grain puck free from the bottom. Then treat it like it owes you $!

Good luck with your grow and please report back.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28453002 -

I didn't do the swirl, so I'll give that a try. I thought of it after I had the PC boiling. Whoops.

Will do. I'll do this method on the next batch, because I feel like I'm "successful enough" at this method now.  The puck did break up; but, I had to really give it the business. Let's just say that I was kinda tired after the first jar, lol.

Why are the sunflowers my friends here? Some say those tend to carry contam more than other seeds, so I strained it out when I was using the overnight soak tek on my other jars

I edited my post above.  Would you mind taking a peek at the #3 question I added?

Thx!

Edited by stakesalad (08/30/23 11:11 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: stakesalad]
    #28453009 -

Swirling the sunflower seeds back into the mix helps with the shake later. Bigger, easy to shake sunflower seeds in the grain puck helps out alot. As for sunflower seeds harboring contaminates, that has not been my experience, sterile grain should be sterile. I have noticed the sunflower seeds tend to be the first to recover after S->B and shakes.

I'm not sure I fully understand #3? I've only let me PCed grains sit, in the PC, for a couple days before using them. I'm not a fan of the idea of storing PCed jars for extended periods. Some people do with no problem, it just worries me. For the most part, with low-prep, you shouldn't need to keep jars around for extended periods. With low-prep you can have jars of grains, ready for the PCed in just a few minutes.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28453401 -

I've been trying out this no-prep and really like it. All of my attempts have been with WBS, and it definitely needs to be rinsed or else it gets nasty.

First attempts were with pint jars and they came out dry (466g total weight). The jars had a ton of condensation, and even gained 20g (assumed to be more water) during the cycle, but the grains didn't seem to absorb it. I put some agar in them 11 days ago and there's still no growth.

Then I tried quart jars with a little bit longer cycle and it's been great.  My weight total came to about 880g, gained nothing during the cook, and seemed to be a little wet at the end. There are some burst grains and the volume increased more than I expected (1 1/3 cups -> 3 cups).  The puck on the bottom was relatively easy to break apart.  I put some agar to these 2 days ago and it's already jumping to the grains.


--------------------
The most important step a man can take. It's not the first one, is it?
It's the next one. Always the next step, Dalinar.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: NotFromGeorgia]
    #28453429 -

Thank you NFG, I'm not sure what went wrong with the first batch of pints but you could probablytoss them at this point. The extra water weight would have to come from the PC during the cycle. I'd guess the lids didn't have foil or possibly cracks in the jars?

The quarts look great! If you go back to pints, do what you did with the quarts, just cut in 1/2. πŸ˜€

From 1/4 pint to quart size, you should only need to run your PC cycle 90min.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28453456 -

You're correct, the pint lids had SFD's and no foil so the steam got right in then condensed. Quarts were the same lids but with foil.

I'm using an IP until the budget is available for an actual pressure cooker. Pints were cooked for 150 mins, quarts for 180. The quarts are a tight fit. A tea towel on the bottom keeps them from touching the metal pot and cracking. Balancing the water level has been weird and varies a lot depending on the pre-steam timing so still figuring that out.

My attempts with a soak/boil/dry then sterilize process all ended up with a mushy mess. Thanks a bunch for putting this no prep idea out there.


--------------------
The most important step a man can take. It's not the first one, is it?
It's the next one. Always the next step, Dalinar.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28453466 -

Yoshi, I hear you on the "I don't like to store the grains for an extended period of time."

I also should probably just leave them in the PC until I'm ready to use them.

One note about my puck - I just learned I shouldn't re-PC grains. I had a very small amount left over from before (hydrated and sterilized using a soak method), and I added that small amount to my Yoshi no prep tek jar. That may have contributed to creating my puck.  Even if it did, I managed to get it broken up with a lot of shaking.  I feel a lot better using this tek now.

To echo what NFG said, you almost 100% have to rinse WBS. My first and second round yoshi jars made my jars NASTY. Second attempt I rinsed; but, I didn't weigh and it was clump city due to the excess water (I just threw in another 165mL because I didn't read your note below)

Could you maybe edit that original post you made and add some notes to the WBS measuring part?

Maybe
Quote:
WBS            2Tbsp:16ml      1 1/3C:165ml - SEE IMPORTANT NOTES BELOW

Wild Bird Seed (WBS): It's highly recommended that you RINSE this seed (few drops of dish soap recommended) before and use the weighing method described below, because it is starchy and dirty. This will reduce the chances of dirty, cloudy walls of the jar and clumping. Once the water is added in and weighed to spec, make sure you distribute the sunflower seeds by swirling. Some teks will say to remove the sunflower seeds; but, I would recommend leaving them in for two reasons. 1) The sunflower seeds help break up the puck. 2) In my experience, sunflower seeds don't harbor contam like people say. I've warmed up to WBS a lot lately. Give it a whack on the lid to get the grain puck loose then a good shake.


This would've saved a n00b like myself from 2 fails πŸ˜‚

Just copy+paste that over. If you want to add a note for anyone wanting to remove the sunflower seeds, I've found it's easiest to get a 5 gallon bucket, load it in the sink, add the seed, fill the water directly into the bucket while stirring it with your hand (consider using a few drops of dish soap; just make sure to wash the soap off). Just keep filling and mixing until the water gets nice and dirty. Sunflower seeds float, so strain'em out with the strainer and dump the bucket water through your sink strainer (easy to do since the remaining WBS will sink). Doing that this time around made it so freaking easy working with WBS. Maybe do this twice, because both rounds for me had dirty water. A third time only helps, and if you used soap, make sure nothing indicates you still have soapy grains.

Edited by stakesalad (09/04/23 05:53 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28474424 -

I like the no prep but...
I used 1 1/3 cup of oats and 175ml of water. My quart jars were only half full after the PC cycle. What did I do wrong? :confused:
They looked good
Well hydrated
Very few burst grains


--------------------
"Let yourself be silently drawn by the strange pull of what you really love. It will not lead you astray." – Divan-e-Shams

How to upload Photos

The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery

Fruiting Cubes


Golden Teachers

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Proposition 122]
    #28474672 -

Thank for giving it a try Prop122! Those measurements for oats leaves room to G2G. You could try 1 1/2C grain and about 197ml water for LC work.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28474738 -

YoshiTrainer said:
Thank for giving it a try Prop122! Those measurements for oats leaves room to G2G. You could try 1 1/2C grain and about 197ml water for LC work.

Good luck!


Thanks Yoshi. I was trying to upscale the measurements and came up with 210ml of water. I will go with your 197 recommendation as a I am doing the grain prep this morning.

BTW I am prepping the oats for inoculation with agar/myc.


--------------------
"Let yourself be silently drawn by the strange pull of what you really love. It will not lead you astray." – Divan-e-Shams

How to upload Photos

The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery

Fruiting Cubes


Golden Teachers

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Proposition 122]
    #28474740 -

Good luck Prop 122, please let me know how it works for you!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28474960 -



Hi Yoshi, I think I have messed up with the water ratio... And maybe extended the PC time too much.

Do we agree that's this jar is to wet and can't be used?


--------------------
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BeefSupremeJr Hitchhikers Guide to the Shroomery

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28474973 -

YoshiTrainer said:
Good luck Prop 122, please let me know how it works for you!


Hi Yoshi
1 1/2C oats but still not a myco quart. I am going to up the next one to 1 3/4 cup of oats.
Your recommendation of 197 was spot on for hydration. :thumbup:


--------------------
"Let yourself be silently drawn by the strange pull of what you really love. It will not lead you astray." – Divan-e-Shams

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Proposition 122]
    #28475081 -

You are right Traveled, that jar is forked! Either too much water to start or possibly a crack in the jar? If it'd help you, you can do the water by weight, 1ml water = 1 g. Hopefully it'll be better next time!

Dang it Prop122, sorry about that. Hopefully 1 3/4C will work the way you want and still leave room to shake. For 1 3/4C it should be about 230ml water.

Aren't oats so easy, thanks for the update!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28475116 -

Been doing no prep millet with no issues except burst grains, so I'll lower the heat next time.

Back to oats til I get more millet :l

I'll try some of these recent measurements. Do you rinse the oats first? Mine are a bit dusty, how dusty were yours? Are there any other considerations required for dusty oats?

Also, for oats in quart jars do you do 2 hours? Or 90 mins?  How long do you vent for?


--------------------
I call them Huskies cause they Mush!


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Huskies]
    #28475153 -

Unless they are really bad, you shouldn't need to rinse the oats. If you do rinse, weigh your jars w/grains then rinse and drain in the jar. Then just top off with water until you reach the right weight.

For up to quart jars, 90 min @ 15psi is enough. I use a Presto and vent for around 10 min, usually until the "plunger" on the back of the lid starts to steam.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28476793 -

:whathesaid:


--------------------
"Let yourself be silently drawn by the strange pull of what you really love. It will not lead you astray." – Divan-e-Shams

How to upload Photos

The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery

Fruiting Cubes


Golden Teachers

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Proposition 122]
    #28479848 -

This works brilliantly. I just tested it for WBS using 165 mL and 150 mL with and without rinsing. I vastly preferred the 150 mL with rinsing. 165 looks like too much for me, and had quite a few broken grains. 150 looked perfect.


--------------------


If you have used a Miraculix Psilocybin QTest, could you please share your results?

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Tiamo]
    #28480145 -

That is great to hear Tiamo, I'm glad it went smoothly! I'll have to give the 150ml a try, so far for me, using the red bag of bird seed (Wagners?) 165ml has been good.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28480161 -

YoshiTrainer said:
That is great to hear Tiamo, I'm glad it went smoothly! I'll have to give the 150ml a try, so far for me, using the red bag of bird seed (Wagners?) 165ml has been good.


Yea, every WBS is different of course so I encourage the reader to find their specific sweet spot.

My seemingly unbranded WBS contains: wheat, corn, milo, millet and sunflower seeds. It is listed as 123.31 grams of moisture and 878.68 grams of dry goods per kilogram.



--------------------


If you have used a Miraculix Psilocybin QTest, could you please share your results?

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Tiamo] * 1
    #28482053 -

For reference, this is a macro photo I took about 24 hours after inoculation with 1 mL PE LC. If you zoom in you will notice some dust on the glass (outside), some starchy residu on the inside and some grains that looks wet pressed against the glass. This is the side where the LC was injected against the glass, without shaking.



--------------------


If you have used a Miraculix Psilocybin QTest, could you please share your results?

Shipping free Ps. natalensis spore prints to any address in The Netherlands, just :pm:

:mushroom2: Mush love :mushroom2:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Tiamo]
    #28482142 -

That was the 150ml jar? Looks good from here!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28482188 -

Indeed, looks good. Apart from the literal stick that is in there on the top left.


--------------------


If you have used a Miraculix Psilocybin QTest, could you please share your results?

Shipping free Ps. natalensis spore prints to any address in The Netherlands, just :pm:

:mushroom2: Mush love :mushroom2:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Tiamo]
    #28482260 -

I bet the mycelium eats the stick too! πŸ˜€


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28483741 -

It better! Cause I did not rinse my oats!

The good ones from g2g Jar A look like this.



The Jar B ones are sketching me out but idk exactly. Cobweb? Just weird myc?



I don't think it's the prep cause the other jars look great.

Thanks for doing the required SNIENCE (tm) and breaking away from dogma!


--------------------
I call them Huskies cause they Mush!


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Huskies]
    #28483788 -

Maybe the jar B master had some funk hiding? Especia if all your G2Ged from Jar B looked similar.

Fingers crossed for the Jar A crew!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28484658 -

I'll try this out with oats and 1 quart jars.
Actually I'd appreciate knowing how much grain is needed in weight.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin] * 1
    #28486737 -

Hello Theodore, I believe 1 1/3C of oats is around 200g. Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28486753 -

YoshiTrainer said:
Hello Theodore, I believe 1 1/3C of oats is around 200g. Good luck!


Thank you!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin]
    #28492832 -

I tried it by calculating a ratio of 1.15, in other words multiplying the weight of grains by 1.15 to get the water weight. Pc'd 4 1.7 quart jars, all of them are mushy on the bottom, but fine on the upper half. Did not manage to shake the mushy part up. Also I added half of the jar volume worth of grains and it was a tad too much as they expanded almost to the full volume of the jar. I'll try much less grains and a ratio of 1 to 1 next time

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin]
    #28492837 -

For me the ratio is more in the neighborhood of 0,7. 225 grams of WBS and 150 grams of water.


--------------------


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Shipping free Ps. natalensis spore prints to any address in The Netherlands, just :pm:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Tiamo]
    #28492882 -

Tiamo said:
For me the ratio is more in the neighborhood of 0,7. 225 grams of WBS and 150 grams of water.


Is it the same for oats?

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin] * 1
    #28492897 -

It appears to be around 75% for rye according to this comment: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28356197#28356197

And for corn too: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28447012#28447012

No idea how you would arrive at 100%, seems way too much.

Also no idea why you wouldn't just follow the volume ratios as listed in the OP. If you just do that once you would immediately have the ratios in weight.


--------------------


If you have used a Miraculix Psilocybin QTest, could you please share your results?

Shipping free Ps. natalensis spore prints to any address in The Netherlands, just :pm:

:mushroom2: Mush love :mushroom2:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Tiamo]
    #28492910 -

Tiamo said:
It appears to be around 75% for rye according to this comment: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28356197#28356197

And for corn too: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28447012#28447012

No idea how you would arrive at 100%, seems way too much.

Also no idea why you wouldn't just follow the volume ratios as listed in the OP. If you just do that once you would immediately have the ratios in weight.


Ah I fucked up. It's 200 grams of oats to 175 ml water. Damn.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin]
    #28492990 -

Another tip for you theodor, 1ml of water weighs 1 gram.
May help with your ratios. :laugh:


--------------------
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Tiamo] * 1
    #28493213 -

Tiamo said:
Also no idea why you wouldn't just follow the volume ratios as listed in the OP. If you just do that once you would immediately have the ratios in weight.


weight based recipes will typically be more repeatable. Even if you are using the exact same packet of grains the container shape can make a difference. Usually the larger the grain size the more pronounced it is.

e.g. pull the plunger out of a 10ml syringe and fill it with uncooked popcorn kernels to the 10ml line, now get a 1000ml syringe and do the same. 100 times the volume but the 1000ml will have more than 100 times the weight of the small one.

This is of course and extreme example to make it obvious, but I recall posts where people did test in pretty common shaped jars and the difference was notable. In weight based recipes you would see differences like 100g of grain to 105g water, and they noticed a difference if using 110g of water.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: blackout]
    #28493240 -

Sure, I prefer a weight based ratio too. But OP did not give us one. Thus I recommend Theodor to follow the ratio listed in the OP once, note down those weights and experiment from there. I can only share my own experience for WBS.


--------------------


If you have used a Miraculix Psilocybin QTest, could you please share your results?

Shipping free Ps. natalensis spore prints to any address in The Netherlands, just :pm:

:mushroom2: Mush love :mushroom2:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Tiamo]
    #28493275 -

Tiamo said:
Sure, I prefer a weight based ratio too. But OP did not give us one. Thus I recommend Theodor to follow the ratio listed in the OP once, note down those weights and experiment from there. I can only share my own experience for WBS.


OK, I have no problem with that, and also recommend testing and recording all results, but you said you have "no idea", so I was simply giving one reason/"idea" why people would be against it (and warning to be careful). I expect many others have not considered the issue of container shape either, it is not very obvious until you consider extreme cases. But other people have confirmed it is a significant enough difference, even with no so differently shaped containers.

Edited by blackout (10/05/23 03:56 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: blackout]
    #28493321 -

Weight based is definitely better as far as accuracy and exact repeatability goes. Volume on the other hand is much faster.  I do notice a difference, sometimes significant, in my volume measurements, especially when doing 1/4 pint jars. I use standard scoop measuring cups and spoons, the main difference is user error on my part. I'll scoop, give a light shake to settle the grains then slide the side of my finger over the top. Not the most accurate! πŸ˜€

Thankfully there seems to be a range for the hydration of grains that is acceptable to the mycelium of various mushroom species.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28493391 -

So I royally fucked up my attempt at Yoshi Tek the other week. They came out too wet, so I did something wrong.

For example, Rinsed WBS in Quart Jars...

Steps for weighing:
-Measure the jar
-Measure the jar + dry grain (filled up with 1 1/3 cups)
-Rinse the grains
-'Target weight' is supposed to be the jar + dry weight + 165mL of water
-Add the rinsed grain back into jars with.... 1 1/3 cup of wet grains?  Then...
-So when I add water, I am only supposed to add enough water to get me to the 'Target Weight' calculated above, right?

Did I get my procedure here correct?

Idk how I messed up.  I nailed it the previous time.

Edited by stakesalad (10/05/23 05:36 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: stakesalad]
    #28493399 -

take the following with a big ol grain of salt because my jars haven't been great yet. could be the agar cultures or the grain prep, jury is still out

For WBS I measure out 4 cups and split it between 3 jars. The weight after rinsing comes out to around 700g-720g per jar (including glass). Then I pour in water to hit 840g-860g

It's not a mycoquart level of grain before the PC cycle, here are before & after the PC


--------------------
The most important step a man can take. It's not the first one, is it?
It's the next one. Always the next step, Dalinar.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: NotFromGeorgia]
    #28493416 -

NotFromGeorgia said:
take the following with a big ol grain of salt because my jars haven't been great yet. could be the agar cultures or the grain prep, jury is still out

For WBS I measure out 4 cups and split it between 3 jars. The weight after rinsing comes out to around 700g-720g per jar (including glass). Then I pour in water to hit 840g-860g

It's not a mycoquart level of grain before the PC cycle, here are before & after the PC



I'm sorry, you're 100% right. I was going off memory, and I need to edit my post.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: stakesalad]
    #28493462 -

no need to be sorry bud, your process sounds right otherwise, shoot for the precalculated (glass + dry grains + 165ml) total. i'm too lazy to do the fill/weigh/empty dance before rinsing


--------------------
The most important step a man can take. It's not the first one, is it?
It's the next one. Always the next step, Dalinar.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: NotFromGeorgia]
    #28493544 -

Have been slow at learning to get the right hydration method with rye. When I did the boil and air dry I think I was letting them air dry too long.

Anyway ran Yoshi’s method and showed me what the grains are supposed to look like. Worked great. For me 1.33 cups of rye filled the jar to ~85% when done, which I wanted a little more room for shaking, so trying now with one cup rye- keeping the water ratio the same!

Thanks a bunch Yoshi!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: NotFromGeorgia]
    #28493547 -

Depending how many jars you are prepping at once, it is even easier to just rinse in the jar. Pour your dried grains in the jar, put on scale and zero, then rinse and drain, put jar back on scale (make sure it didn't turn off) and add water until proper weight/volume.

Good luck!

Thank you Whiterabbit, glad it is working for you!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28493589 -

YoshiTrainer said:
Depending how many jars you are prepping at once, it is even easier to just rinse in the jar. Pour your dried grains in the jar, put on scale and zero, then rinse and drain, put jar back on scale (make sure it didn't turn off) and add water until proper weight/volume.



I'm thankful for people that are smarter than me, because this is way better than how I was doing it.

Edited by stakesalad (10/05/23 07:04 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: stakesalad]
    #28493607 -

edit: how happy are you with your millet ratio? does it leave room for g2g?

Edited by Huskies (10/05/23 07:24 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28493908 -

Could you elaborate or do you have a link to a guide on edible mycelium TEK using brown rice?

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: deepestroots]
    #28494043 -

Here you go DeepestRoots

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26303098#26303098


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28495442 -

Thanks Yoshi, I've been looking for data on myceliated grain.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: deepestroots]
    #28495586 -

Here is another for you Deepestroots.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28478167#28478167


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28497336 -

Another 4 jars on the way, this time using about 75% water

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin] * 1
    #28497513 -

Looking nice. Maybe some very slight mushiness at the very bottom. Going to test how it colonizes, might test 70-73% next time for oats

Thank you YoshiTrainer.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin] * 1
    #28497598 -

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28504338 -

Hi Yoshi.  Just finished up a very successful grow on oats using your tek.  Very few burst grains and only 1 jar with a bit of mush at the bottom that actually colonized and top fruited just fine… lol. The rest went to shoeboxes and did great through 4 flushes.  Thank you!

I have moved to Rye and have 3 questions.  I read the thread, and am sorry I missed it if these were answered…

1. Qt jars that I plan to a2g (no g2g expansion).  What is the correct ratio of grain to water?
2. Do I need to clean them first?
3. Do they require a rough shake after pc’ing?


--------------------
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Edited by Bobgas (10/14/23 12:51 PM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bobgas]
    #28504840 -

Hello Bobgas, I'm glad everything is working smoothly for you. 

1. Rye expands a little more than oats do. You might try a batch of 1 1/3C grain to 230ml. If I remember, 1 1/2C dried grain made it pretty full and possibly hard to shake. If you do go with 1 1/2C dried grain, the water should be 258ml.

2. Rye is usually pretty clean, most likely you won't need to rinse it.

3. You can let rye cool completely in you PC and shake it when you are ready to use it or even after inoculation. It is a little harder to break up than oats but just slightly.

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28505837 -

Awesome, thanks!  I’ll post up how it goes.  I just can’t believe how much time and energy was saved with the oats - no boil, no dry, just load and go!  The Ghost I ran loved the oats.


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πŸ…ƒπŸ„΄πŸ„°πŸ„Ό  πŸ„²πŸ„»πŸ„ΈπŸ„½πŸ„ΆπŸ…†πŸ…πŸ„°πŸ„Ώ

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Bobgas]
    #28507861 -

Gonna try your millet ratios soon, been doing 1 cup/ 1/2 with Crack's, which has always been a bit empty on the jar side.

Is 1 1/3 of millet the upper ratio to still have g2g space?


--------------------
I call them Huskies cause they Mush!


The Official Wild Cubensis Thread
Instant Pot Agar
Gnocchi Water Agar
Let's Talk Cowtek

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Huskies]
    #28507988 -

I haven't run straight millet in a bit, it is $$ for me to get here. Looking back at pictures, it looks like 1 1/3C dry grain should fill your quart jar about 2/3-3/4 full after PC, definitely room for G2G. I need to go back and reread Crack's prep to see the differences. Crack can grow some mush!

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Huskies] * 1
    #28508023 -

Huskies said:
Gonna try your millet ratios soon, been doing 1 cup/ 1/2 with Crack's, which has always been a bit empty on the jar side.

Is 1 1/3 of millet the upper ratio to still have g2g space?


Pics: 
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28416904#28416904

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28508027 -

I have been doing 2/3 cup millet in wide mouth pints, so half recipe. They turn out beautifully right at 3/4 full.

So just enough room for g2g.


--------------------
Stoned Gummys | BRF Pucks | Primo Reusable Plates | Easy LI 4 Preserv & Propo
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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: ReverendMyc]
    #28508037 -

Thank you guys, your jars look great!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28518771 -

For fun, a couple 1/2 gallon jars with SC Tampanensis recovering after G2G. One is low-prep oats, the other LP RGS. I accidentally made the RGS too wet but should be fine



--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28520794 -

60% water to oats has worked the best so far in terms of not needing to shake the living thing out of jars to get the mushy part to dislodge. I'll try 50 or 55% next time as some shaking was still required. Also i'm now painfully aware of how hard is for the myc to colonize the mushy compressed bottom, even oyster is having trouble


--------------------
The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin]
    #28520958 -

You need to make sure to shake them. It breaks up the grain puck at the bottom and helps to even out the moisture content.

Good luck w/your experiments!

Edit: You don't need to hot shake, you can let them cool completely in your PC. Then just shake when ready to use or after inoculation.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Edited by YoshiTrainer (10/28/23 09:31 AM)

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28521008 -

YoshiTrainer said:
You need to make sure to shake them. It breaks up the grain puck at the bottom and helps to even out the moisture content.

Good luck w/your experiments!

Edit: You don't need to hot shake, you can let them cool completely in your PC. Then just shake when ready to use or after inoculation.


Thanks. Good to know :smile:


--------------------
The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin] * 1
    #28540097 -

Giving this a go with a few jars of WBS because I didn't prep enough grain. I'll let you know how it goes.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: JW123] * 1
    #28540147 -

Good luck JW123! After adding water to your jars, if you give them a swirl and mix the sunflower seeds back into the mix, it'll make the shake easier later on.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28540219 -

I think I settled on 60% water for oats. Little to no mush or burst grains.


--------------------
The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin]
    #28540289 -

Gotta love oats, glad you found your sweet spot.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28540343 -

YoshiTrainer said:
Gotta love oats, glad you found your sweet spot.


:smile:


--------------------
The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Blueberry Muffin] * 2
    #28542941 -

I like how they turned out. I was eating dinner with my in-laws so they sat in the pressure cooker longer than I would have liked. I also suck at following directions so I didn't weigh anything before I rinsed. The bottom grains were a little bit of a puck, but I got it broken up. I am going to say it was mostly operator error. Here is one of the jars. I will update with how colonization goes.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: JW123]
    #28543019 -

Good job JW123! I'm surprised how little millet is in your WBS compared to mine.

Please report back if you have time.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to low-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28543036 -

Thank you! Great documentation!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28543083 -

Oh yeah, it is the deluxe brand from a small chain called Rural King. Same price as Pennington, but less millet and seems cleaner.

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: JW123] * 1
    #28543106 -

Pros: this tek kicks ass! Love the chart you made and all the calculations you put into it!

Cons: makes my bulk grain dryer I literally just made obsolete πŸ₯² might have to play around with this and then turn my grain dryer into a fruit dehydrator or something lol.

Appreciate this man

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: PhenoDreamers]
    #28543336 -

Thank you Supa! With all the time you'll save, you'll have more time to dehydrate fruit or mushrooms! πŸ˜€


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28551331 -

Gonna give this a shot in a couple of hours Yoshi! I really hope it'll work out because it'll save me so so so much time now that I'm scaling up. I use a 50/50 mix of rye and oats for my grains so I'll be guesstimating the amount of water I'll use. I'll also add a teaspoon of gypsum for good measure. I expect the initial tryout to be pretty wack because I'm kind of testing the water content. But I mean if it doesn't end up as a puck at the bottom I call it a massive win. :smirk:

I'll keep y'all updated! :stoned:


--------------------
How I grow mushrooms πŸ„
How I do agar 🦠

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Throwaway] * 1
    #28551375 -

That is awesome Throwaway, good luck!

For a quart jar
2/3C oats to 87.5 ml/g water
2/3C rye to 115 ml/g water


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28551656 -



Went pretty well I'd say! Used one and a half cup (my cup size isn't standard) and 200ml of water for a single quart. I'd say it's kind of on the dry side but you know how it is - we'll see tomorrow when it's cooled down if that's actually the case. There's some gunk on the bottom that's pretty stuck but I mean hey it's probably sterile and nutritious as hell. :stoned:

I've also added a single teaspoon of coffee to go with the teaspoon of gypsum because I'm a "I soak and simmer my grains in coffee and gypsum because I grow stones and stonesun told me so in his original guide which I've never been able to let go"-guy. Don't @ me :mad2:

All-in-all I call it a win.

Thanks Yoshi! :heart:

:chefskiss:


--------------------
How I grow mushrooms πŸ„
How I do agar 🦠

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Throwaway] * 1
    #28551695 -

Nice job Throwaway! You can let them cool completely in your PC then shake if you'd like. If you do need to pull them hot, let them cool in front of your FFU or in SAB if you can. I'm superstitious and worry about stuff getting sucked into the jars as they cool.

FWIW, you don't need gypsum or coffee but StoneSun had some incredible grows with them so obviously is doesn't hurt!

Good luck!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28551712 -

Here are 1/2 gallon jars with the SC tampanensis from Sir P. On the left low prep RGS, on the right LP oats, both G2G on 10/23.



--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28551730 -

YoshiTrainer said:
If you do need to pull them hot, let them cool in front of your FFU or in SAB if you can. I'm superstitious and worry about stuff getting sucked into the jars as they cool.



Lol I have the exact exact same so I'm already kind of sketched out with this jar. :crazy: Good call on letting it cool in the SAB. I'll probably let it cool down in the PC for the next run if you say they'll do fine!

YoshiTrainer said:
FWIW, you don't need gypsum or coffee but StoneSun had some incredible grows with them so obviously is doesn't hurt!



Yeah I know but I just can't help myself. I'm having consistently great results with my current coffee and gypsum method so removing it just feels wrong. Call it another superstition :tongue2:

Thanks again my man!

:noargument:


--------------------
How I grow mushrooms πŸ„
How I do agar 🦠

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Throwaway]
    #28600632 -

So, I’m almost ready to try this with my first ever grow. I’m planning to use WBS and an Instant Pot. If I’m understanding correctly, you keep the lid slightly loose and covered in foil while PC, right?
Also, since the Instant Pot can’t quite make it to the required pressure, it would be advisable to let it go a little longer I think?  I’m thinking 2.5 to 3 hours.


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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: Fezzgig] * 2
    #28600739 -

Hello Fezzgig, thank you for giving it a try! I use modified lids that have a hole drilled in them that gets stuffed w/Polyfil. I've not used solid lids and am not sure how well they'll work during colonization? I would definitely tighten the lids then back them off like a 1/4 turn.

I've also not used an instapot so I can't give you first hand advice but people do use them for making grain by running it longer. I think there is an instapot thread that might have the specific information you need?

BTW, WBS especially in bigger jars can be a pain to shake. If you can, after adding your water, before the instapot, give your jars a gentle swirl, trying to mix the sunflower seeds back into the mix. Also, after the grains cool, you'll need to smack the lid a few times to get the grain puck off the bottom of your jar before shaking. Do the best you can to break up the grains but don't worry if it is not perfect, the mycelium will colonize it.

Good luck and please report back how it goes!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28602702 -

An update on these guys, 3 bags of low-prep grains left without inoculation and stored for a year. All look fine, no contam, the cracked corn in the WBS is a little mushy though.

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/editpost.php?Cat=0&Board=2&Number=28081167&page=0&what=showflat&vc=1



--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28606533 -

Man this tek is fantastic! I’ve been trying to get my oats right. Soaking them, boiling them, jars, bags, and they never seemed right coming out of the PC. I thought surely some smart person on Shroomery knew a grain to water ratio that you could just mix in the jars. And sure enough. Here it is. I tried out both bags and jars with whole oats using this tek in the PC today. For the jars, I’m using the plastic Walmart lids and stick on PTFE filters. For the bags, I just scaled up four times. The equivalent of four jars. They all look great. The grains seem like they’re hydrated but are nice and loose too. I finally feel comfortable enough to inoculate these grains. Thanks for the write up!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: HazMatt]
    #28606564 -

That is awesome HazMatt, I'm glad it went so smoothly! Gotta love oats!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28612391 -

New question! I just made some bags to inject with a syringe. I scaled up the recommendations here. In one bag, I'd add 5-1/3 cups of whole oats and 700ml of water. I then sealed the bags with my bag sealer and then pressure cooked for two hours. I see a lot of people seal the bags after. Am I missing something with the bags? They look great honestly. I suppose people would leave them unsealed if inoculating with agar. Thoughts?

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: HazMatt]
    #28612422 -

I think you have it right HazMatt, for agar, G2B or even LC, people don't seal their bags before PC. Also, if you don't squeeze most the air out, before PCing, there is the possibility of the bag bursting during the PC cycle. Sounds like you've got it nailed though, keep up the good work!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28612439 -

YoshiTrainer said:
I think you have it right HazMatt, for agar, G2B or even LC, people don't seal their bags before PC. Also, if you don't squeeze most the air out, before PCing, there is the possibility of the bag bursting during the PC cycle. Sounds like you've got it nailed though, keep up the good work!


"or even LC" If injecting with a MS or LC syringe, I see no difference, technique wise. Maybe I'm missing something.

I just did my first no prep grains of 9 qt jars and they came out great. No going back. Will be doing some bags in the near future. Great timely information!!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: MoJim]
    #28612458 -

I'm glad everything worked so well for you MoJim, congratulations!

MoJim said:
"or even LC" If injecting with a MS or LC syringe, I see no difference, technique wise. Maybe I'm missing something.


Some people here actually pour their LCs instead of injecting. I've not tried it myself, I prefer more control with syringes. I probably wouldn't inject MS, best to go agar or PF tek with that.

Good luck with your grows!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28612781 -

Yoshi  A few questions on no-prep bags. Do you seal your bags when injecting? I've seen posts using Tyvek and unsealed methods, but I'm always worried about contams getting in while removing the Tyvek when opening the bag in my SAB. Also, since there's a large pool of water on top of the grains, it would be more like loading water balloons, maybe a little more difficult especially if unsealed. I'm leaning towards pre-sealing. Any tips?

I was originally going to do my bags the old slow way, until seeing Hazmatts post. Regardless, I'm moving forward with no-prep bags using syringe LC Tamps to oats. Should be fun!

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: MoJim]
    #28612858 -

I don't use LC that often, typically I'll go G2B. I don't think I've ever presealed my bags and I don't use Tyvek. The bags come out of the PC lightly compressed and go straight from PC to FFU. I still wipe the mouth of the bag before G2B though. They are a little water balloon like when loading. Typically I'll roll the top of the bag around the body of the bag and tape in place, you can also accordion fold the top down and tape in place. If you are going to seal your bags, try to squeeze out as much air as you can before sealing. The bags will puff a little during cooking so don't pack you PC real tight. Maybe @HazMatt might be able to offer more specifics?

Good luck, let me know how it goes!


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28612859 -

:popcorn:

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Re: YoshiTrainer's guide to no-prep grains [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 1
    #28613339 -

YoshiTrainer said:
I don't use LC that often, typically I'll go G2B. I don't think I've ever presealed my bags and I don't use Tyvek. The bags come out of the PC lightly compressed and go straight from PC to FFU. I still wipe the mouth of the bag before G2B though. They are a little water balloon like when loading. Typically I'll roll the top of the bag around the body of the bag and tape in place, you can also accordion fold the top down and tape in place. If you are going to seal your bags, try to squeeze out as much air as you can before sealing. The bags will puff a little during cooking so don't pack you PC real tight. Maybe @HazMatt might be able to offer more specifics?

Good luck, let me know how it goes!


Since I only have a SAB, it has been recommended not to go G2B. Risk of contams too high. My 23qt PC will hold a few bags so I'll try sealed and unsealed for fun. Just bought 50# bag of race horse oats, so why not:smirk:  I'll take some pics and post them.

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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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