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wazmo
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Experimenting with pulsed high voltage 3
#27934021 - 09/04/22 05:23 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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I'm a new grower (with only one successful grow so far). I'm trying to improve my technique. But I'm also a nerd who has somehow come across and read a number of academic papers about using pulsed high voltage to speed fruiting and increase fruit yield in a variety of edible species.
So I'm trying an experiment with a shoebox P. cubensis grow, in which I am applying high voltage (~15kV) pulses to half of the shoebox to see whether one side will grow differently from the other, and whether the yield is any different.
The equipment is simple, consisting of a cheap 20kV electrostatic high voltage generator, a couple of 8kV 47nF capacitors in series, and a spark gap made from a couple of spark plugs. This results in a 15kV pulse every seven seconds or so.
I will be doing a more thorough write-up (with references of course), as well as publishing my data and construction details so that others can repeat my experiment.

I'm starting the pulses just as I'm starting to see pinning. We'll see what happens.
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CowsPoopShrooms
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: wazmo]
#27934060 - 09/04/22 05:49 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Edited by CowsPoopShrooms (10/14/22 07:24 PM)
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Rusty2096
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: wazmo]
#27934061 - 09/04/22 05:50 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Are you not worried that high voltage will travel across the whole tub? I know water isn't a good conductor but still is one. Maybe electricity could also use the myc itself to travel?
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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wazmo
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: Rusty2096] 1
#27934134 - 09/04/22 06:26 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Because I set up the electrode grid at 30 mm spacing for the half of the tub that is being subjected to high voltage pulses, I know where the high voltage is going to go. It goes out one lead into half the electrode grid, across the mycelia and back via the other half of the electrode grid.
Initially, I thought that I might want to separate the halves by the use of a barrier in the middle, but I’m not doing that right now. We’ll see what happens.
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Rusty2096
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: wazmo]
#27934141 - 09/04/22 06:31 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Fair enough. Will be waiting for results
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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Jacubey
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: Rusty2096]
#27934313 - 09/04/22 08:09 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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DERRAYLD
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: Jacubey]
#27934605 - 09/05/22 12:45 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Why only apply voltage to half the tub? You do realize that the entire tub is conductive so you won't get any kind of real separation.
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schpat
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: DERRAYLD]
#27934661 - 09/05/22 02:14 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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I know you've already started and have your sub colonised, but if you are open to input you may want to try separate boxes for you test and control. Even better for experimental purposed would be 5 test boxes and 5 control boxes.
Go nerds!!!
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DERRAYLD
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: schpat]
#27934763 - 09/05/22 03:28 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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In a side note, as a new grower you may not know the variables and what it takes to produce consistent flushes so how will you gage the effectiveness of the grow with or without electrical stimulus?
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wazmo
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: DERRAYLD] 1
#27934998 - 09/05/22 08:39 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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The current is only being applied to half the tub, through electrodes that are a bed of stainless steel pins. The rows of pins are connected to opposing leads of the high voltage pulse generator. The other half of the tub doesn't have the pins, so it won't see any current. I did wonder whether the connected mycelia would communicate between the half with the electrodes and the other half, but I didn't do anything to separate them. Depending on the results from this trial, I could try putting a divider in the middle or using separate shoeboxes for the next run.
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wazmo
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: DERRAYLD] 1
#27935002 - 09/05/22 08:40 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
DERRAYLD said: In a side note, as a new grower you may not know the variables and what it takes to produce consistent flushes so how will you gage the effectiveness of the grow with or without electrical stimulus?
That's why I am only applying current to half the box. I'm going to compare the results in each half.
Edited by wazmo (09/05/22 08:41 AM)
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wazmo
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: schpat] 1
#27935006 - 09/05/22 08:43 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
schpat said: I know you've already started and have your sub colonised, but if you are open to input you may want to try separate boxes for you test and control. Even better for experimental purposed would be 5 test boxes and 5 control boxes.
Go nerds!!!
I hope to get to the point where I can make shoeboxes that are consistent. This box was made from six shredded BRF cakes and coco coir; my attempts with grain and liquid culture have resulted in heavily bacterial boxes that never fruit (though they do produce trichoderma pretty well).
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rumfor69
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: wazmo]
#27935225 - 09/05/22 11:34 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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cozmyc
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: rumfor69]
#27935518 - 09/05/22 02:45 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Is this made from cloned material? It will be hard to tell the effects unless you have the culture narrowed down to produce consistent flushes first. Then I would do separate boxes with exact same ratios.
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wazmo
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Interesting electrical characteristics [Re: wazmo] 1
#27935880 - 09/05/22 06:16 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Using an oscilloscope to monitor the current applied to the fungi, I discovered that the pulses were under 100ns long, and had a peak magnitude of around 20,000A (!). This was quite surprising, as the widely spaced electrodes shouldn't have resulted in a DC resistance of less than 1Ω (15,000V / 20,000A = 0.75Ω). I tried to measure the DC resistance of the tub, but discovered that it was highly capacitive. Of course, the capacitance explained the high pulse currents! Obviously, 100ns/7s is a very small duty cycle; averaging the 20kA current over the entire 7s period results in an equivalent average current of 285µA and an average voltage of only 214µV.
I then measured the half-tub's impedance (both as an R/C series model and an R/C parallel model) with a Rohde & Schwarz HM8118 LCR meter. The equivalent series capacitance was still about 4µF (!) at 1kHz test frequency. Here's the graph of both the series and parallel model. It looks like the actual DC resistance is about 234Ω, so the pulses are only charging the mycelial capacitance.
Here's my LCR meter readings:
Edited by wazmo (09/05/22 06:21 PM)
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wazmo
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: cozmyc]
#27935882 - 09/05/22 06:18 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
cozmyc said: Is this made from cloned material? It will be hard to tell the effects unless you have the culture narrowed down to produce consistent flushes first. Then I would do separate boxes with exact same ratios. 
This was inoculated from a liquid culture from a Shroomery vendor. Being able to compare both halves of the box should compensate for differences in strains.
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Rotnpins
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: wazmo]
#27938300 - 09/07/22 08:04 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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wazmo
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First fruits [Re: wazmo] 1
#27940899 - 09/08/22 06:00 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Well, they're coming in, but not as evenly as I'd hoped. Any suggestions on how to harvest these, when some are considerably earlier than others, but all are joined at the base? Should I cut off the ones that have opened already and wait for the rest, or what? Sorry if this is a noob question...
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schpat
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Re: First fruits [Re: wazmo]
#27941339 - 09/09/22 12:50 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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AS you only have a small tub and want as many shrooms as possible you could just carefully cut out the mature ones and wait a could days for the rest to catch up.
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wazmo
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Initial results [Re: wazmo] 1
#27946571 - 09/12/22 09:32 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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I've finished harvesting the first flush. Because of the clustering and low sample size (N=1), I don't think there's any firm conclusions possible without more experimentation. The non-electric side took a couple of days longer to mature; I harvested the individual fruits at about the same level of maturity using a scalpel to cut them off at the base, then cut the bases of the clusters off when no fruits remained. I dried everything.
After the first flush harvest, I dunked the block for three hours and am zapping the box for a couple of hours (about 1000 zaps) per day; we'll see what the second flush looks like.
The first flush didn't get zapped until I started to see pinning; I am curious as to whether we'll see any electric effects upon time to pin.
The first flush results for those who are curious:
Wet weight: 137g electric vs. 101g non-electric (36% higher in the electric section)
Dry weight: 12.76g electric vs. 8.82g non-electric (45% higher in the electric section)
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SymPlayTon
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Re: Initial results [Re: wazmo]
#27946767 - 09/12/22 12:01 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Definitly an interesting test! It appears to provide an increase in yield, but I wonder if that only pushed yield in first flush and subsequent flushes will result in a balance.
I think scaling up is the next logical progression. A full bin of electrical vs non.
I think a way to measure the total KW usage over the grow period would be beneficial as well.
To allow a cost comparison of the electricity to the growth media. Maybe test different voltages and pulse cycles.
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Rusty2096
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Re: Initial results [Re: wazmo]
#27947275 - 09/12/22 06:35 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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I'd love to see those results from 2 tubs, 1 with power and 1 without.
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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wazmo
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I do want to scale up, but that's got to wait until I can do reliable grows. My experimental technique (zapping only half the shoebox) is reasonable IMO, as it provides its own control that experiences the same lighting, temperature, and humidity.
The energy usage is minimal. Using my Kill-a-Watt, I measure 3W while running. Let's do some back-of-envelope math:
3W * 2hr * 5 days = 30 Wh = 0.03 kWh
I pay around $0.11/kWh for electricity. So that's approximately $0.03 for a 5 day treatment. Or approximately 3¢ per grow.
The cost of equipment amortization over the unit's lifetime would be a much higher figure. I spent about $30 in parts (including an estimated $6 for the 12V power supply I already had on hand). And another 2+ hours of assembly and testing. Figuring $50/hr for my time, that comes to maybe $150 for the unit. Assuming it'd live for 5 years, that's $30/year.
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DERRAYLD
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Re: Initial results [Re: wazmo] 3
#27950647 - 09/15/22 12:55 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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I want to comment here but I just feel my opinion will be seen as overly negative. This was not a controlled experiment in anyway and the results should ultimately taken for a grain of salt.
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fahtster
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Re: Initial results [Re: DERRAYLD] 4
#27950657 - 09/15/22 01:19 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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I’m all about experimenting because it’s fun and gives us stuff to do and sometimes cool stuff comes out of it but the thought of you scaling up sounds expensive and unnecessary
0 electricity through this tub

You just need to find good genetics and provide correct ratios and growing conditions with clean spawn and the sub will give the best performance without gimmicks
When I started growing, gimmicks were a dime a dozen because we hadn’t really figured out that we just need the things listed above. Hell, I was the first one to use wax paper
I just don’t see any kind of proof the electricity even works.. the myc in that area could have grown those fruits there anyway or you could’ve had an even better flush without the electricity
I don’t want to be negative either.. I promise it’s tough love tho. I wanna see you kill it
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SymPlayTon
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Re: Initial results [Re: DERRAYLD]
#27952152 - 09/15/22 10:17 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
DERRAYLD said: I want to comment here but I just feel my opinion will be seen as overly negative. This was not a controlled experiment in anyway and the results should ultimately taken for a grain of salt.
I agree. That is why I am curious about the "more" of it. The scientific method requires it to be repeatable results by other people. If the OP could get repeat results, I would be willing to invest in validating by repeating.
That would either prove your point, or validate his experiment. Big picture I agree that it may not matter, but fun "for science"
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Screwdriver
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This is fascinating, could you link any of the academic papers mentioned in the OP if there's some that stand out?
Would be neat to see this done with 2 tubes for better control. Nice meter btw
-------------------- Trading 2x used 12"x24" HEPA filters -Trade List Websites break, domains expire, data gets lost. Consider archiving [1] [2] [3] content you find useful.
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wazmo
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wazmo
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Second Flush pinning [Re: wazmo] 1
#27952689 - 09/16/22 11:10 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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After harvesting the first flush on 12-Sep, I did a 3 hour dunk and began HV stimulation for about 2 hours per day (about 1000 pulses) again.
After four days of stimulation, I'm seeing a number of pins, with significantly more on the electric side (see photo). It should be interesting to see what develops.

I have ordered some 10nF 30kV ceramic capacitors; this will allow me to go up to 20kV (from 15kV) and have higher-energy pulses (right now, my 23nF 15kV pulses have an energy of 2.6 joules; 30nF @ 20kV would be 6 joules).
Thanks for all the encouragment and interest! I would love to see others repeat my experiment (and I will be scaling up to multiple containers in the near future; I've just done my first A2G transfer to some WBS jars).
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wazmo
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: wazmo] 1
#27957131 - 09/19/22 09:46 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Three more days of stimulation, and I have a couple of big fruits ready to pick.
The one on the non-electric side weighed in at 50.5g (a record for my grows)!.
The electric side has a lot more fruits than the non-electric side; I'll post my results after harvesting the rest.
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psilocybebonsai
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: wazmo]
#27958272 - 09/19/22 09:57 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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maybe this has been asked and answered but how were the original BRF cakes inoculated?
From what i know the tub will become a uniform mass of mycelium and it should fruit the same gene set over the whole tub, but i've seen many tubs (and have had many) that don't fruit consistently - perhaps thats exactly what the gene set is doing, or perhaps its a mix if genetics trying to fruit and some not fruiting (the bald spots in the tub)..
so, i wonder if this experiment would be better done after you've stabilized a set of genes and have grown them out several times with very consistent flushes, then also having what others have mentioned: several control tubs and several test tubs.
i know nothing, but those are my thoughts
-------------------- My small photo collection here My smaller grow log here Some tips for taking photos of your progress when seeking help here
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halo
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cool thread, good luck with the project. Eagerly awaiting further results
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rumfor69
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Quote:
psilocybebonsai said: mix if genetics trying to fruit
Always this
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wazmo
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The BRF cakes were inoculated using a LC from a Shroomery vendor. So presumably single genetics and not a mix.
Whether this gene set has a tendency to fruit unevenly, I don't know, as it's my first successful tub. (I'd had contaminated grain spawn in a few prior ones, and have since switched to WBS, which looks like it's working better).
When I'm finished with this flush, I'm considering dunking again and moving the high voltage fixture to the other end of the tub to see if it makes that end pin sooner and denser (which is what happened with this flush).
I'm getting some PE LC that I'll be trying in the future. I agree about scaling up to multiple tubs, but that will require building more HV generators (I can modify this generator to get to 20kV with 6J pulses, which should be usable with two tubs in series).
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wazmo
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: wazmo] 1
#27962217 - 09/22/22 09:40 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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OK, second flush results are in.
Electric side: 111.3g wet, 9.38g dry. Non-electric side: 63.1g wet, 5.14g dry.
The electric side resulted in 82% greater dry weight than the non-electric side.
This is an even greater difference than the first flush, which showed 45% greater dry weight on the electric side.
I did a three hour soak on the block, then moved the high-voltage electrodes to the other side of the block to see what the effect will be on the third flush.
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: wazmo]
#27962257 - 09/22/22 10:16 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Good idea. If after switching side the electrode side still has greater yield, that'll be very interesting.
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
Edited by Rusty2096 (09/22/22 11:59 AM)
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cooleko
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: Rusty2096] 2
#27962320 - 09/22/22 11:22 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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I think the opposite is true. If you switch now you have no way of establishing with any credibility that the total biomass efficiency was changed under electrical stimulus.
Right now you presumably have a tub that is evenly distributed with nutrition to water. If providing electric stimuli increases the efficiency of one side while draining the other side, the tubs performance as a whole will still be the expected for the tub, for example. If you expected 80% BE for the strain, and your tub produced 80% BE overall, then you would know that electricity just makes the fruit more bodied and doesn't improve the output of the tub. However, if you produced 90% BE overall, then you could postulate that the stimuli actually improved expected performance. You really do need to take a more clinical trial based approach, though. Same bag of spawn inoculated via a stable clone across 20 different bottles/tubs. 10 electrified, 10 not. Use the control to establish average BE for that clone and the electrified to establish whether there was an improvement in performance or not.
You could find that there is no improvement in performance on a BE basis, but instead there are fewer flushes of more dense mushrooms.
Despite the rant, that is so cool that electricity may promote more bodied mushrooms. I know people water their pumpkins with buttermilk and other crazy things to win halloween contests, perhaps they should be shocking them!
*Opps, went on a tangent and didn't finish my original thought. By switching sides now, you can't establish that you aren't just using up the same nutrition faster for the electrified side. If it stalls out you are going to wonder, "is it because I didn't electrocute it or did it run out of nutrition?"
Edited by cooleko (09/22/22 11:25 AM)
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wazmo
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: cooleko] 1
#27964026 - 09/23/22 08:43 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
cooleko said: By switching sides now, you can't establish that you aren't just using up the same nutrition faster for the electrified side. If it stalls out you are going to wonder, "is it because I didn't electrocute it or did it run out of nutrition?"
Good point. I'd originally thought to use a divider in the box between the two sections; that would have made the difference clearer.
Anyway, it'll be interesting to see what happens on the third flush.
Thanks for the interest! It's an interesting idea, and I'll be pursuing it with a scaled-up experiment with better controls.
Assuming, of course, that my WBS grain spawn is clean enough to fruit...
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wazmo
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: wazmo] 1
#27968171 - 09/25/22 09:05 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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OK, the third flush is coming in, albeit unevenly.
I'd switched the electrode grid over to the other side (which had under-performed previously), and now I'm getting more fruits on the (newly) electrified side.
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wazmo
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Plans for next HV experiment [Re: wazmo] 2
#27968176 - 09/25/22 09:12 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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I have three WBS quart jars nearly fully colonized, and intend to mix two of them with two quarts of coco coir, distribute evenly among 12x 1-quart plastic containers, case with more coir, and electrify half of them (wiring them in series). I figure I can put all 12 of them in a single SGFC or water tub (making sure that they're not in the water, of course) with no lids in order to say humidified.
Does this sound like a better-controlled experiment?
Here's the planned containers and electric grids:
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: wazmo]
#27968178 - 09/25/22 09:13 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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If you can replicate the results in a stable manner, and get similar result using 2 tubs (one with and one without the electrodes) - of course all this under control conditions with a good iso/pheno, you may need to patent some tubs soon
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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fahtster
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Re: Second Flush pinning [Re: Rusty2096] 5
#27968206 - 09/25/22 09:42 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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There’s just no way to know if that myc would have grown those fruits anyway or if the electricity maybe even hindered a better flush
Just like there’s not way to tell if a lightning strike made more mushrooms grow in that area or if there was going to be mushrooms there anyway or even more than that would’ve grown without the lightning.
You usually won’t get fruits in an area that fruited already the previous flush. So, to me, it makes sense that the other side isn’t flushing because it already flushed heavy on that side. I want to see the experiment produce results that improve fruiting but it all seems like confirmation bias at this point and I’m not sure how to get past that problem because you can’t repeat the same grow twice and there’s a decent amount of variation of growth even within an isolated culture
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wazmo
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Third flush results [Re: fahtster] 1
#27973534 - 09/29/22 08:05 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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After moving the electric grid to the previously non-electrified side, the third flush fruited more on the (newly) electric than on the non-electric side.
Electric side: wet 77.3g, dry 6g Non-electric side: wet 31.9g, dry 2.6g
So the electric side resulted in 131% higher yield than the non-electric side.
As @Fahtster and @cooleko pointed out, I need to use separate containers in order to have a good control condition.
So the upcoming experiment will use 12x 1-quart containers for 2 myco-quarts of colonized WBS + 4 quarts of coir, with half of the containers being electrified and the other half not.
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Rusty2096
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Re: Third flush results [Re: wazmo]
#27973542 - 09/29/22 08:08 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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DERRAYLD
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Re: Third flush results [Re: Rusty2096] 1
#27973665 - 09/29/22 09:34 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Confirmation bias unfortunately, you're just not understanding what we're saying.
Be very careful of taking the results so literally because there are so many variables at play here.
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Rusty2096
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Re: Third flush results [Re: DERRAYLD]
#27973672 - 09/29/22 09:37 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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He literally just said he was trying again with 12 shoeboxes, 6 with and 6 without electrodes
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DERRAYLD
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Re: Third flush results [Re: Rusty2096]
#27973681 - 09/29/22 09:40 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Good for him, I'm not arguing or trying to diminish his effort
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Rusty2096
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Re: Third flush results [Re: wazmo]
#27973714 - 09/29/22 09:57 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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cozmyc
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Re: Third flush results [Re: Rusty2096]
#27974358 - 09/29/22 06:04 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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cool, Did you snap pic of latest flush?
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wazmo
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Re: Third flush results [Re: cozmyc] 1
#27976343 - 10/01/22 08:50 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
cozmyc said: cool, Did you snap pic of latest flush?
Yes, though this may have been after removing one early fruit from the electric side.
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wazmo
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Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo] 1
#27978093 - 10/02/22 02:08 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I'd finished assembling the second experiment electrode grids: six acrylic plates, each with a 4x4 grid of stainless-steel jewelry pins connected together by a piece of 12AWG solid copper wire threaded through their eyes. These were then connected together by pieces of 18AWG high-voltage wire.
After the assembly and soldering, I then sealed the copper wires down the acrylic by applying silicone sealant to the underside.
When I looked at the results this morning, I remembered that I should have thought for a second before applying the silicone: I'd used acetoxy -cure silicone, which produces acetic acid upon curing. This had, of course, corroded the copper wire, making the already poor connection between the copper and the stainless steel even worse.
So I threw that assembly away, and am preparing to make a new one in which I use neutral cure silicone (GE RTV 2) instead.
Meanwhile I have three heavily-colonized jars of grain spawn ready to go.
Is there any problem with waiting a day or two to introduce these to the coir?
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27978110 - 10/02/22 02:20 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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No problem waiting.
Your jars are bacterial
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: Rusty2096] 1
#27978129 - 10/02/22 02:32 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Rusty2096 said: No problem waiting.
Your jars are bacterial 
I was wondering about that. Is it just the condensation at the top that makes you say that? Is my grow doomed? I was hoping to have results from this experiment by Nov. 1 because I wanted to show them to some folks at a conference.
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fahtster
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27978135 - 10/02/22 02:35 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Condensation and long tendrils of ropey myc are a good indication. Not necessarily doomed but if they are bacterial, that’s a definite factor that’s going to skew your results.
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: fahtster] 1
#27978197 - 10/02/22 03:27 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
fahtster said: Condensation and long tendrils of ropey myc are a good indication. Not necessarily doomed but if they are bacterial, that’s a definite factor that’s going to skew your results.
Thanks. As long as I can get some fruiting, I can get comparable results that can show whether the electricity has any useful benefits (now that I have an adequate control with separate containers).
I'm going to have six 1-quart containers with electricity, six without, and a separate shoebox, all in the same SGFC to keep the humidity and temperature the same across all the containers.
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27978202 - 10/02/22 03:31 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Sadly, unclean spawn can reflect on the results. For example, you may have tubs having a harder time with the contaminants than others.
You would need clean spawn, ideally from an isolate for proper comparison.
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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rumfor69
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: Rusty2096]
#27978209 - 10/02/22 03:34 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Maybe the electricity will kill the contams!
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: rumfor69]
#27978211 - 10/02/22 03:35 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
rumfor69 said: Maybe the electricity will kill the contams!
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: Rusty2096] 1
#27978232 - 10/02/22 03:49 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Rusty2096 said: Sadly, unclean spawn can reflect on the results. For example, you may have tubs having a harder time with the contaminants than others.
You would need clean spawn, ideally from an isolate for proper comparison.
I'd intended to mix all the spawn and coir in a large bowl, trying for the most uniform mix possible. And I will weigh the mix that goes into each container and pack each to the same level.
I'd inoculated from agar wedges from plates that looked clean, but there is probably still a mix of genetics (I was in more of a hurry that I should have been and skipped an agar-to-agar transfer to isolate).
As for the bacterial problem, I'm not sure where the issue is. I've kept the WBS jars non-inoculated for a week or so and haven't seen any signs of bacteria in them, but that's probably not a good control. If I had more PC capacity (I only have a 9L PC) I could do more than 3 jars at once.
I've been using a SAB to do the transfers, and my agar plates haven't shown any signs of contamination (even the ones where I'd done agar-to-agar transfers).
Actually, I think I've figured it out... I'd assumed that the first red line meant 10psi and the second was 15psi, but according to this info I just found on my PC:

the second line was only 12.8psi max, so I've been under-sterilizing this whole time
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27978361 - 10/02/22 05:07 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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That's a bummer. Good news is you figured it out at least.
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: Rusty2096] 1
#27978471 - 10/02/22 06:30 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Rusty2096 said: That's a bummer. Good news is you figured it out at least.
Just got back from the hardware store with a new Presto 23qt pressure canner.
I'll be re-sterilizing the latest WBS jars, perhaps while canning some hot pepper jam I just made.
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27978488 - 10/02/22 06:37 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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cooleko
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: Rusty2096]
#27978536 - 10/02/22 07:05 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I believe we must levy a hot pepper jam tax to continue following your progress here. Pics please!
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: cooleko] 1
#27979083 - 10/03/22 07:12 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
cooleko said: I believe we must levy a hot pepper jam tax to continue following your progress here. Pics please!
I learned that all that's needed for jam is 10 minutes in a boiling water bath...
Paying my taxes:
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cooleko
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27980536 - 10/04/22 01:22 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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That looks great, enjoy!
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SymPlayTon
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27982322 - 10/05/22 06:47 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
wazmo said:
Quote:
cooleko said: I believe we must levy a hot pepper jam tax to continue following your progress here. Pics please!
I learned that all that's needed for jam is 10 minutes in a boiling water bath...
Paying my taxes:

Recipe or it didn't happen.
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: SymPlayTon] 1
#27982480 - 10/05/22 08:59 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
SymPlayTon said: Recipe or it didn't happen.
From memory and not-so-great notes:
Hot Pepper Jam - [ ] 12 oz. sweet mini peppers, seeded - [ ] 8 oz. jalapeño peppers, seeded - [ ] 0.5 tsp salt - [ ] 1 tsp black pepper - [ ] 2 cloves of garlic, minced or crushed - [ ] 5 oz white wine vinegar - [ ] 30 oz. (4.25 cups?) white sugar - [ ] 1.75 oz. (one box) powdered pectin (add 50% more for thicker set)
- [ ] 8x 8-oz canning jars and lids, pre-washed and heated in 200ºF oven - [ ] water bath canner with enough hot water to cover jars plus 2 inches - [ ] jar lifter - [ ] thick towel or cooling rack
* chop peppers and garlic finely in food processor * put in deep saucepan with salt, vinegar, and black pepper * bring to boil * add pectin and mix * add sugar and mix, bring back to boil * continue to heat and boil, stirring until 217º-220ºF * ladle into hot jars, cleaning rims, leaving 1/4" to 1/2" of headspace * add lids to jars and screw on bands * using a jar lifter, put jars into hot water in water bath canner * add hot water if necessary to go 1-2 inches above tops of jars * bring canner to a boil * boil for 5-10 minutes * using jar lifter, remove jars from canner and set on a thick towel or cooling rack * let cool for 24 hours * check lids for proper seal
Future mods: * fresno or habanero peppers instead of jalapeño * apple cider vinegar instead of white wine vinegar * somewhat more vinegar
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SymPlayTon
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27982505 - 10/05/22 09:13 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Awesome! Ty! I grow peppers every year, and usually make hot sauce, pickled peppers and pepper pastes.
I love me some pepper jam on biscuits.
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: SymPlayTon]
#27982507 - 10/05/22 09:14 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
SymPlayTon said: Awesome! Ty! I grow peppers every year, and usually make hot sauce, pickled peppers and pepper pastes.
I love me some pepper jam on biscuits.
Pics or it didn't happen
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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mykophil
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: Rusty2096] 1
#27994624 - 10/12/22 02:10 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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who was this guy.. he was experimenting with electricity as well.. he was on insta.. his handle there was a play of words with some... ohm? or something... he disappeared instantly sometime..
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo] 1
#27997088 - 10/13/22 04:04 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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OK, finally got the second experiment together. I was only able to fit six one-quart containers into my SGFC, so I set it up with three electrified and three non-electrified ones. The other two myco-quarts I put into shoeboxes.
I mixed the grain spawn 1:1 with coco coir in a big bowl, then weighed out equal amounts of the mixture into each one-quart container.
I'll start zapping them as soon as they get fully colonized (or maybe before if I feel impatient).
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27997166 - 10/13/22 04:54 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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rumfor69
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: Rusty2096]
#27997171 - 10/13/22 05:00 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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this stuff is neat no matter what happens
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cooleko
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: rumfor69]
#27997236 - 10/13/22 05:48 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I like the staggering, I'll be impatient the next few weeks for your next update!
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cozmyc
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: rumfor69]
#27997240 - 10/13/22 05:49 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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 Careful
-------------------- You're conscious population 2 stardust ---------------------- and that's valuable
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: cozmyc] 1
#27998427 - 10/14/22 10:42 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
cozmyc said: Careful

For sure. I've worked around HV for years, but still managed to discharge the HV capacitor through my hand the other day while not being sufficiently careful. It was quite painful.
And now I'm going to be quadrupling the amount of energy stored in that capacitor by raising the voltage from 15 to 20kV and increasing the capacitance. So there will be 10 joules of energy in each zap.
I would not like to get that across my heart.
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SymPlayTon
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo] 1
#27998486 - 10/14/22 11:26 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Good luck and be safe!
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cozmyc
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#27998488 - 10/14/22 11:27 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah man, electricity killed my brother. I don't Wana see the that happen to anyone else.
-------------------- You're conscious population 2 stardust ---------------------- and that's valuable
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: cozmyc] 1
#27998856 - 10/14/22 03:01 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
cozmyc said: Yeah man, electricity killed my brother. I don't Wana see the that happen to anyone else.
oof sry to hear that
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: cozmyc] 1
#28000183 - 10/15/22 10:35 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
cozmyc said: Yeah man, electricity killed my brother. I don't Wana see the that happen to anyone else.
Sorry you lost him that way. 
When I write up descriptions of my experiments and the HV generator I will be sure to add warnings about the dangers of electricity. I would hate to have someone injured or killed because they were trying to copy what I'd done.
I don't know the best way to scare away the people who don't know what they don't know. Hearing the recent news about people dying because they were using neon sign transformers to burn wood (copying videos on YouTube or TikTok) makes me realize that lots of folks have no idea about the dangers of electricity.
When I was a young teenager I built a pirate radio transmitter using vacuum tubes. It had a 450V 1A power supply, easily lethal if applied across the heart. One day I was making some measurements and somehow got it across my body. I couldn't release my hands or arms because my muscles were clenched tightly, but was able to knock it off the bench and out of my grasp. I was lucky I survived.
Ever since then I've been careful to follow the "one hand" rule (keeping the other hand in my back pocket), or use insulated gloves. And I'm always conscious of power line voltage and whether or not I'm grounded. When I work on line-powered electronics like power supplies, I use a medical grade isolation transformer.
I suspect that not everyone who might try to build such a device is as careful as I have learned to be.
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SymPlayTon
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: Rusty2096] 1
#28000197 - 10/15/22 10:50 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Rusty2096 said:
Quote:
SymPlayTon said: Awesome! Ty! I grow peppers every year, and usually make hot sauce, pickled peppers and pepper pastes.
I love me some pepper jam on biscuits.
Pics or it didn't happen 

Here is a jar of pickled saranos, and a saran habanero paste. The hot sauce never lasts long.
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wazmo
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo] 1
#28000318 - 10/15/22 12:26 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Just finished putting in the new 30kV capacitor bank (5x 2nF caps) and testing it. Charged up to 20kV, one big spark ... and nothing more. Caps failed shorted.

I think that the multi-layer ceramic capacitors just aren't up to the high pulse currents in this application.
I'll be going back to the mylar film capacitors I had been using at 15kV and ordering 9nF worth of new big 30kV film capacitors. These I can run at 20-22kV and should survive the pulse currents.
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wazmo
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Second experiment: tubs too dry? [Re: wazmo] 1
#28004258 - 10/18/22 07:12 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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I'm noticing that the one quart tubs in the SGFC are looking dry, and aren't colonizing as fast as the closed shoeboxes that I made with the same spawn ratio.
I've misted them almost daily, but think I may need to close them up more to colonize.
Their lids fit very tightly, so I just set the lids on top of the tubs for now until I figure out what to do. Of course, I have to cut slits in the edge of the electric tubs to pass the wires through.
Would it be better to punch holes in the lids and cover the holes with micropore tape (or stuff with fiberfill), then snap them down to retain the moisture?
Would it help to pour a measured amount of water into each?
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Rusty2096
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Re: Second experiment: tubs too dry? [Re: wazmo]
#28004272 - 10/18/22 07:26 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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If you have propre surface conditions, u don't usually need to mist if you spawned to sub that was at field capacity.
You can flip the lids if you need more FAE, and close em tight if there is too much evaporation (ie: you need to mist daily) .
Don't over think this. Let em do their thing
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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ellomello
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Re: Second experiment: tubs too dry? [Re: Rusty2096]
#28004451 - 10/18/22 09:47 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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there are many articles on lightning helping mushrooms grow. https://physicsworld.com/a/artificial-lightning-strikes-encourage-growth-of-shiitake-mushrooms/ https://phys.org/news/2010-04-lightning-mushrooms.html
i've also heard it could be the nitrites?nitrates produced in the air when lightning strikes.. since experimenting it might be worth a try to have a box with high voltage sparks in the air, but not touching the box at all, and of course have to have a control box which has no sparks.
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wazmo
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Loc: PNW, USA
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Re: Second experiment: tubs too dry? [Re: Rusty2096]
#28008986 - 10/21/22 08:56 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Rusty2096 said: If you have propre surface conditions, u don't usually need to mist if you spawned to sub that was at field capacity.
You can flip the lids if you need more FAE, and close em tight if there is too much evaporation (ie: you need to mist daily) .
Don't over think this. Let em do their thing 
Good advice. They are doing their thing; they've all started pinning and are about even right now. I'll begin zapping them to see if it makes a difference.
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Rusty2096
rah rah raw in Lady gaga



Registered: 08/23/22
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Re: Second experiment: tubs too dry? [Re: wazmo]
#28009331 - 10/21/22 01:44 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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Suckatshrooms
Seriously, don’t listen to me.


Registered: 09/26/22
Posts: 157
Loc: Tamaulipas, Mexico
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: wazmo]
#28009881 - 10/21/22 07:47 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Can always spot someone from the north when they keep calling chiles “pepper”. What do you call your pepper?😜
The wifey & I have an elaborate chile garden out back and grow super hots like reapers. We also grow the super mild chiles like jalapeños because we love the sharp & sweet flavor. Habaneros are too fruity tasting for us.
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rumfor69
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: Suckatshrooms]
#28009916 - 10/21/22 08:11 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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So you have a pepper garden?
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Rusty2096
rah rah raw in Lady gaga



Registered: 08/23/22
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: Suckatshrooms]
#28009917 - 10/21/22 08:12 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Suckatshrooms said: Can always spot someone from the north when they keep calling chiles “pepper”. What do you call your pepper?😜
The wifey & I have an elaborate chile garden out back and grow super hots like reapers. We also grow the super mild chiles like jalapeños because we love the sharp & sweet flavor. Habaneros are too fruity tasting for us.
Sweet peppers or bell peppers
-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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mykophil
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: Rusty2096]
#28012083 - 10/23/22 07:58 AM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Suckatshrooms
Seriously, don’t listen to me.


Registered: 09/26/22
Posts: 157
Loc: Tamaulipas, Mexico
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Re: Experimenting with pulsed high voltage [Re: Rusty2096]
#28012494 - 10/23/22 01:12 PM (1 year, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
rumfor69 said: So you have a pepper garden?
Quote:
Rusty2096 said:
Sweet peppers or bell peppers
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wazmo
Learning



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Second experiment: no difference between electric and non-electric [Re: wazmo]
#28025794 - 10/31/22 09:16 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
wazmo said: Good advice. They are doing their thing; they've all started pinning and are about even right now. I'll begin zapping them to see if it makes a difference.
Well, after the first flush (which kinda took me by surprise) there's no statistically significant difference in the yield of the electric vs. non-electric side. This difference from the shoebox experiment may be because the shoebox took longer to colonize and got more zaps while doing so.
So clearly I have to repeat this at the shoebox scale (now that I've got shoebox growing happening more reliably). I will try to do this in mid-November and post the results.
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Rusty2096
rah rah raw in Lady gaga



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Re: Second experiment: no difference between electric and non-electric [Re: wazmo]
#28025856 - 10/31/22 10:02 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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-------------------- Currently looking for nothing. You guys who sent me stuff are straight up awesome!. We don't own things - things own us. Semi-solid liquid culture (SSLC)
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PsillySeeEms
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Re: Second experiment: no difference between electric and non-electric [Re: Rusty2096]
#28051905 - 11/14/22 11:32 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Wouldn't you experience some kind of electrolysis in the moist substrate, and start forming HHO Brown's gas as a result? As in, the splitting of the water back into hydrogen and pure oxygen gas near the electrodes might bubble its way up to the surface?
AFAIK, using pulsed frequencies might even increase the efficiency of electrolizer cells.. Haven't looked into it in awhile.
I know what I came to shroomery to do, and that is study electro culture and mycology.
Mad experiments like this are right up my alley! 
Edited by PsillySeeEms (11/14/22 11:43 PM)
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ichnoguy
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Re: Second experiment: no difference between electric and non-electric [Re: wazmo]
#28052047 - 11/15/22 02:52 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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wow very cool experiment, I think it can be a good idea to maybe use a gradient, so have a tube with several nsulated compartments, so you can see if there is a sweet spot maybe it's a grow signal or fries viruses so you might want to do another test with contamination present and see how the current effect the competition between the diferent taxa. maybe it wrecks bacteria I bunny but I think things with sell wall and networks can handle pulse better than bacteria and yeasts? maybe similar to like how varying temperature can select for diferent things when you heat up and or freeze, kind of like how the immune system uses a fever to get rid of a bacterial or viral infection. What do fungi do? when do we find good mushrooms in the wild? In the eastern parts of south Africa people say there is more of the big edible one after a thunderstorm. so maybe it's a signal so one zap is enough to signal good fruiting conditions.
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wazmo
Learning



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Re: Second experiment: no difference between electric and non-electric [Re: PsillySeeEms]
#28052892 - 11/15/22 03:00 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
PsillySeeEms said: Wouldn't you experience some kind of electrolysis in the moist substrate, and start forming HHO Brown's gas as a result? As in, the splitting of the water back into hydrogen and pure oxygen gas near the electrodes might bubble its way up to the surface?
AFAIK, using pulsed frequencies might even increase the efficiency of electrolizer cells.. Haven't looked into it in awhile.
I doubt that there's much gas creation, as both the energy and duty cycle is very very low. According to Wikipedia, a typically efficient (that is: intentionally engineered) electrolysis requires 180MJ/kg of H2. My pulses are currently 2.7J every ~10 seconds. So that would put an upper bound of 15µg of H2 every pulse, and there's not that much water available in the substrate anyway.
So I don't think that's a significant phenomenon in my case.
The current theory is that the electrostatic (mechanical) force breaks hypheae, which encourages fruiting.
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PsillySeeEms
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Re: Second experiment: no difference between electric and non-electric [Re: wazmo]
#28053156 - 11/15/22 04:57 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Ya I wouldn't think it would create much either, but I can only imagine there would be some output of gas, even if just a minuscule amount..
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mykophil
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Re: Second experiment: no difference between electric and non-electric [Re: PsillySeeEms]
#28088283 - 12/08/22 07:43 AM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
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saw some HPLC testing of cubensis that were exposed to electricity, reminded me of this thread here
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YouDontKnowMe
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Re: Initial results [Re: wazmo]
#28119690 - 01/01/23 06:54 AM (1 year, 26 days ago) |
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Have you ever tried using variable amounts of electricity in different voltages/amplitudes etc in order to get some sort fo response from the mycelium? I know electricity would be running through the mycelium but the voltage may be too low to detect. If you could nail things down enough you could essentially control how the mycelium produces fruit bodies and possibly even alter it in a way to produce extraordinarily massive mushrooms or different forms/shapes etc which could bring a whole new branch of mycology. I've always had thoughts of using electricity or even magnetic fields in order in influence growth but I've always thought of it in very small voltages to match the native electricity of the mycelium. If a strong enough magnet is introduced it itself would induce a very small current within the mycelium which could effect the different cells of hyphae and could possibly lead to a type of mushroom type cancer where a group of cells break off into their own dielectric network separate from the host being. But it could also be so weak it has no effect but we will see! once i get my tek down and my living situation a bit more stable i will definitely be doing some of these tests and look forward to sharing my research with the people of this site
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YouDontKnowMe
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Re: Second experiment preparation [Re: wazmo]
#28119694 - 01/01/23 07:01 AM (1 year, 26 days ago) |
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Dont you think such large pulses would simply kill the mycelium? Its good to test both extremes of course but i also recommend you try increasingly lower voltages swell just so you can get a More comprehensive data base
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PsillySeeEms
Stranger


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https://www.amazon.com/TENS-7000-Digital-Unit-Accessories/dp/B00NCRE4GO/ref=asc_df_B00NCRE4GO?tag=bngsmtphsnus-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=80882941400145&hvnetw=s&hvqmt=e&hvbmt=be&hvdev=c&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=&hvtargid=pla-4584482468557469&psc=1
I want to experiment too, but have to many other projects going to devote too much time into building the unit from scratch.
Would one of these TENS units I linked off amazon work? 30-40 bucks, and basically ready to go. If it can make your muscles violently twitch, it should be good enough to test with right? Easy to dial it in with the knobs i'm sure, depending on how much power I need too.
I was wanting to see the effects of pulsed electricity delivered to mycelium on agar mostly.
Thinking about it, I remember they always rubbed some kind of vaseline before attaching the probes, for better contact. I wonder if there is an additive I could mix right in.. I wonder how I could make a probe with the best contact, especially inside an agar dish. Some kind of mesh screen or something?
Anyways, I'm also looking at those blue tooth music playing tesla coils on amazon too, for around 80 or so bucks. I wanna try sticking probes or even light bulbs right into the colonized susbtrate\fruiting mushroom bodies, and try zapping them with the coil too.
If I don't unlock the secret to creating mutant genetics with a million pins on the first flush, or some other crazy tek, at least i can zap my back pain away, and play with lightning bolts, for pretty cheap..
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PsillySeeEms
Stranger


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Loc: PNW
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One more thing.. talking about electrolysis again. If OP were to separate the tub in half, with electrodes on both sides..
One side would produce some amount of pure hydrogen, and the other side pure oxygen. It is when they mix that browns gas is created, but some cell configurations split the output of the gasses, just like a tub of wet substrate divided in half would too, if you separated the electrodes far enough apart.
Oh yeah, and wouldn't the type of water have the most effects on how good it works? Distilled water isn't conductive, but maybe it is once mixed into the substrates. The question is, would using electrolytes in the water to help the flow of current be the key to getting the best results?
Just something to think about!
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