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OfflineMylz
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Registered: 04/12/04
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The effects of a light cycle on fruiting..
    #2787714 - 06/12/04 02:23 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Strange... I may have to do some testing of this... I've read a lot about the wavelength of light affecting pinning and growth, and how many hours a day of light affect pinning and growth, but never until a couple days ago had I considered the possible effects of darkness on growth.  I have a bulk project going at the moment in a large plastic sterlite bin.  About a week ago I began fruiting with strong mycelial growth through the casing layer, near perfect humidity, near perfect temperature, and more then enough light.  After 4 days, however, there was still very little signs of pinning growth. Frustrated, I moved the bin from the room where it received nearly constant light, to a dark closet for about 36 hours.  To my astonishment, when I opened the closet the day and a half later, it was pinning like MAD! So now I'm sitting here wondering if a light cycle similar to that of a normal day, causes increased growth for some reason or another. :shiftyeyes:


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I'm an antidisestablishmentarianist, are you? :wink:


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OfflineIamthewalrus
every evening Idied and everynight I wasreborn
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: Mylz]
    #2787730 - 06/12/04 02:34 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

its also possible that it would have pinned like mad during that time frame had you not moved it as well....that said I have found you do not need any special lighting for pinning...plus if your using a rubbermaid/sterlite bin some light is getting through the sides wheather you open it or not... if you close the lid but leave just a crack open and take a look inside you will notice the sides of the tub are illuminated and that these bins are not 100% light proof... you could try having 1 bin in your closet next time and 1 out....and see which pins first...this is not a sure test either but it could give you an idea


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InvisibleOlgualion
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: Mylz]
    #2787731 - 06/12/04 02:36 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

I have taken colonized trays, and put them in the fridge to cold shock. When they come out, there were mushrooms forming. The fact is that the initiation had begun, but it just wasn't instantaneous. The cold, or in your case, the dark, wans't going to stop the myceliums momentum.

Or, i could be wrong...


--------------------
Study the past...
See the future...


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OfflineMylz
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Registered: 04/12/04
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: Olgualion]
    #2787740 - 06/12/04 02:45 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Iamthewalrus: It is possible that pinning was about to start just before I put it into the closet, which is why I only talked about light cycles affecting growth as a possibility. Next grow I plan on doing two bulk; giving one constant light, and the other a light cycle very similar to day/night. I'm also aware that light gets through the sides of sterlite containers. Light going through a closet door, however... :wink:

Olgualion: I didn't mean that the light/dark necessarily delayed the momentum of pinning or growth, but rather that the introduction of a light cycle that includes darkness would better simulate the reaching of the casing layer in a natural habitat and possibly further promote growth. Hm, hope that made sense..


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I'm an antidisestablishmentarianist, are you? :wink:


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Offlineacidblue
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: Mylz]
    #3409465 - 11/25/04 09:36 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I've given constant light, and had difficulting getting those casings to fruit. Light cycles have seemed to work the best for me.


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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: acidblue]
    #3409559 - 11/25/04 09:58 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I have never taken the light thing seriously. I am sure it has it's points and it's believers. A proof tha it works

Me, I get pins no matter what I do. Any light the MYC gets no matter how small or how long or short. I get shrooms.


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What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.


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OfflineIGnosticAbhorI
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #3409607 - 11/25/04 10:10 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I've already tested this myself and I found that my Creep pinned and fruited best without constant lighting. It seemed better to have a nature kind of lighting. I gave it between 7 hours and 12 hours every day , kind of 12on/12off. Well i'd like to hear about your results anyways! Gl


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Offlinecall_me_kido
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
    #3411547 - 11/26/04 11:01 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

To my dismay and for your information when I used to use PmPs I had 20 watt flouros mounted to the lid. I would give casings direct lighting for 12-18 hours per day.

Those same casings didnt pin until I put them in a martha that had normal room lighting for normal daily hours.

Most of the time more is not better.

Kido


--------------------
"If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it?"
- Albert Einstein (1875-1955)

"A is A" -Aristotle


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Invisibleandjor
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: call_me_kido]
    #3411792 - 11/26/04 12:15 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Is it the introduction of light or a certain intensity of light that triggers pinning?


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OfflineMadHatR
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Registered: 10/13/03
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: call_me_kido]
    #3411906 - 11/26/04 12:53 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I to have been doing tests over the years trying to find just the right lighting timing. I have gotten good results out of cycling the lighting, but from what I have seen it depends on several factors. By changing up the cycling from things like 2 hours on, then 4 hours off repeated over and over again I have shown real results. I have found that by altering the cycle you can change how many pins form with each flush. The problem I have run in to though is at times I will create so many pins that the myc can not support it causing to many aborts. If I used the same method over and over again I am sure the correct numbers for that method and volume to produce the maximum number of pins to myc could be figured out. The problem is that I am always trying new things so it is hard to set a standard. If there is some one out there that is set in their ways I am sure the correct equation could be figured out. If this was done then the figure could be applied to any method. Maybe one day when I have the time and space for a controlled study I can do this, but until then I am hoping someone else can pick up the ball and run with it. The theory behind this is that whale the myc reaches the surface it is looking for a sign to pin, as we know this consists of a drop in the CO2 levels, drop in temp and light. While light is not needed for growing like in plants, it does trigger something in the myc to tell it to pin. The key then is to time it just right to tell the maximum amount of myc to pin without causing so much to pin that it eats away needed nutrients and base myc from the other pinning shrooms. In time the perfect number could be achieved that would account for volume of myc to nutrients minus fillers like vermiculite and PH balacers that are in place to add needed air space, buffers and moister. This would tell the correct amount to pin so that you could get the maximum out of each flush, not only in weight of each shroom but also in the overall number of shrooms. This would also allow for a exact mathematical equation for it opposed to the hit and miss methodology that we currently use. Like I said though, I currently have to many irons in the fire to pursue it. Just can't pass up tossing coffee in every other thing right now among other projects I am working on like this weeks project involving the effects of vibrations on growth. Sorry if I could not be any more help, but you are on the right path by at least trying other options.


--------------------
Following the rules is for dealers, knowing why the rules work is for innovators.

"Knowing is half the battle." - G.I. Joe

Never Judge a man until you walk a mile in his shoes, because then you are a mile away and you have his shoes.


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OfflineIGnosticAbhorI
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: MadHatR]
    #3411925 - 11/26/04 12:58 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Hey madhatr's right. You just need something to trigger it. In my case, X-tra light helped, but hey trying different things will help you get better results in the future, Gl man
later


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Invisibleandjor
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
    #3411961 - 11/26/04 01:14 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

If you are growing invitro, is light enough to trigger pinning? or do you also have to lower the temp?


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OfflineMadHatR
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Registered: 10/13/03
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
    #3411998 - 11/26/04 01:25 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I hate to sound like some kinda math dork, heck I never really even paid attention in class back when I was in school, but it seems like you do end up using the stuff later on in life (damn those teachers for being right). I do think though one day a overall equation can be done that will cover however you are growing, be it cakes, casings or bulk layering. It is not like growing weed where the amount of light really matters, shrooms are known for growing in the dark. Light is only a triggering mechanism. Often times once they see the light at the right time the work is done, even if you can't actually see visible pinning. You just have to think like a shroom. It's like giving your old playboys to your younger brother, to early and they wont know what to do with it, to late and they end up a middle aged man with no kids that do nothing but look at playboys, sorry bro... :smile:


--------------------
Following the rules is for dealers, knowing why the rules work is for innovators.

"Knowing is half the battle." - G.I. Joe

Never Judge a man until you walk a mile in his shoes, because then you are a mile away and you have his shoes.


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Invisibleandjor
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: MadHatR]
    #3412019 - 11/26/04 01:32 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I guess I'm wondering whether exposing them to a really bright light for a short time is the same as exposing them to a low leve light for a long time.


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OfflineMadHatR
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: andjor]
    #3412182 - 11/26/04 02:13 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

It is not as much the brightness of the light but the wavelength of it that really matters more. It is mainly reacting with the color spectrum. The brightness refers more to the luminance of the light. This the shrooms do not really care about. People usually use less intense lights because they do not burn as hot. The reason that the spectrum of light may be important is that some of the rays of light could be harmful to the shrooms (often times the UV rays are singled out as a problem), while these rays do not usually kill the shrooms or spores they may hinder it's growth. As a side note places like hospitals do use certain lights that emit a UV that actually kills bacteria and some spores. Normal light may not kill the shrooms, but may cause them to spend more time healing themselves than needed. In most of my sett-ups I only use "Grow Lights". They are said to give off mostly light from the blue spectrum which is less harm-full. Do not confuse these with lights that are painted blue, the filters in "Grow lights" are made to correctly only allow the spectrum out that is needed. Is is just like how a microwave can have a glass window in it. Microwaves would normally pass through it, but in a microwave holes are placed in the glass in such a way that the wave given off will not pass through but light will.


--------------------
Following the rules is for dealers, knowing why the rules work is for innovators.

"Knowing is half the battle." - G.I. Joe

Never Judge a man until you walk a mile in his shoes, because then you are a mile away and you have his shoes.


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: MadHatR]
    #3413214 - 11/26/04 07:32 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I didnt read alot of this but I've grown a number of pounds of mushrooms and used different lighting. I've found that 12/12 for pinning is best..more light or less light resulting in less pins. It also helps to have a 3-5 degree temp drop during this time. Then once they start growing, give them as little light as possible..growth is slower in the dark but it will get you bigger thicker mushrooms. Just give them enough to grow upwords.

But thats just me


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"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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OfflineMadHatR
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Registered: 10/13/03
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Re: The effects of a light cycle on fruiting.. [Re: scatmanrav]
    #3414970 - 11/27/04 04:10 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Yep, like I was saying, it is a balancing act. The dark is best to grow a bigger, thicker shroom, but light is good to get new growth started. So the key is to time it just right so that you have light to get the most new growths started while darkness for bigger and better shrooms. If you have to much light though then you have more pins than needed that do not have the nutrients needed because during the darkness the other shrooms that started long before take it all. This causes a number of aborts that eat away at needed nutrients and myc from the other shrooms.


--------------------
Following the rules is for dealers, knowing why the rules work is for innovators.

"Knowing is half the battle." - G.I. Joe

Never Judge a man until you walk a mile in his shoes, because then you are a mile away and you have his shoes.


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